User talk:Dirtlawyer1/Archives/2011/May

Andrew Sledd
I see you're still making tweaks to Andrew Sledd -- are you planning to take it to FA? I think you should; it's a fine article. Or are you still obtaining sources? Mike Christie (talk - contribs - library) 16:36, 15 May 2011 (UTC)


 * Yes, sir, I am still planning to submit the article for FA review, and soon. I'm still sorting through 100+ digitized newspaper articles from the 1910s that I downloaded from an American universities shared database (not available to the public) at Emory University several weeks ago, and also still waiting on some promised materials from the Randolph-Macon College historian and the Phi Delta Phi national fraternity office.  I'm afraid it's become a bit of an obsession, and at least three groups are interested in expanded and tailored versions of the material for their alumni magazinesthe University of Florida, Randolph-Macon and Phi Delta Phi.  After I've beaten the online Wikipedia version into final form, I may offer tailored versions to the Emory, Birmingham-Southern, Harvard and Yale alumni associations, too.  What makes this a lot of fun is that no one from any of the various organizations in which he was historically significant seems to have ever put all of the different details of Sledd's life together in one place.  Each group knows little of why he was significant to the others.  Sledd played a significant role in the history of three very different American universities (two major, one minor), was a memorably outstanding student and scholar at three others, was an influential theologian and scholar in the American Methodist church, and was involved in interesting and historically notable controversies in the American states of Georgia and Florida.


 * I haven't had this much fun doing research in years. Dirtlawyer1 (talk) 17:07, 15 May 2011 (UTC)


 * That's great to hear! Wikipedia is a good place for dedicated editors to assemble material on moderately obscure topics in a way that hasn't been done before, but I don't see it happen as often as I'd like to.  Please let me know when you get those alumni magazine articles out; if they're online I'd be interested in seeing them.  I haven't forgotten about Tigert, by the way; I have a few other projects going on, but will try to get to it by summer at the latest. Mike Christie (talk - contribs -  library) 17:29, 15 May 2011 (UTC)

SEC National Titles
Short talk section. I noticed your edit on the SEC Team Page. Realistically, we should only be counting titles won from the NCAA circuit. However, if we do count non-NCAA sanctioned titles, it will require a more in-depth history of the conference, as there are likely to be more titles won before the NCAA became involved in the distribution of Title IX sports. It opens up a new proverbial can of worms.

Rmphan (talk) 05:49, 16 May 2011 (UTC)


 * Rmphan, there is no "can of worms," and there are no other university-sanctioned national championships to be found by an "in-depth" search. I suggest you do some homework on the AIAW; it was the "NCAA" for women's college sports from 1972 to 1982.  The eleven years of AIAW chmpions have already been compiled in the linked Wikipedia article.  Two SEC institutions won a total of three AIAW championships: Florida (swimming in 1979, gymnastics in 1982) and Tennessee (track in 1981).  Both schools were early leaders in women's sports, and devoted scholarship money and real resources to their women's sports teams when most other SEC members had to be dragged kicking and screaming into Title IX compliance.  These three AIAW championships are already included in Florida's 22 and Tennessee's 17 "NCAA" championships listed in the SEC Championships article.  Two SEC programs were also the AIAW basketball tournament runners-up: Tennessee (1980, 1981) and LSU (1977).  Florida was the runner-up in the 1973 AIAW swimming tournament.  Not surprisingly, Florida, Tennessee and LSU have continued to be the SEC's leaders in women's sports.


 * The AIAW championships awarded were all on-the-field tournament championships against major university competition (even referred to as "Division I" within the AIAW), unlike the bogus football "poll" championships claimed by several SEC members. Several SEC members even claim poll championships for seasons when their team wasn't selected by either of the "major" polls (i.e. AP or UP/UPI/Coaches), or didn't even receive a majority (i.e. "consensus") of all polls (Tennessee 1938, 1940, 1950, and 1967; Georgia 1942; Kentucky 1950; Ole Miss 1959, 1960 and 1962).  Alabama, of course, claims retroactive poll football championships in 1925, 1926, 1930 and 1934 (these "poll championships" were "awarded" by ratings services several years after the fact).  Unlike these bogus retroactive and/or minority football championships listed above, the AIAW championships aren't "claimed championships."  The AIAW championships were won on the field, in a tournament format, sanctioned by the only national governing body for women's college sports at the time.


 * FYI, LSU's total of 42 NCAA championships cited in the article includes the 1949 NCAA boxing team title. That title should also be listed.  Dirtlawyer1 (talk) 10:29, 16 May 2011 (UTC)


 * Thanks for the retrospective, however, for the purposes of that Wikipedia section, we are only counting NCAA Titles. You are welcome to create a new section for AIAW championships (Which I noticed you linked to the Southeastern Conference page), however, they are not currently recognized by the NCAA and thus, are not considered contemporary NCAA-Recognized National Championships. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Rmphan (talk • contribs) 17:58, 17 May 2011 (UTC)


 * There is no need to create a "separate section" for the AIAW titles; I have already edited the language of all three sections to clarify the sponsoring body for the those three championships. Two of the three AIAW titles were inaccurately glossed over as NCAA titles before I ever touched these sections.  I added the third AIAW title, clarified the introductory language of the three national championship sections, and added parentheticals noting them as AIAW-sponsored.  As for your comment "we are only counting NCAA Titles," you may want to get a consensus on the talk page as to what to include because I see no "we" here.


 * FYI, please see my note about the dispute you and the IP user have been having over the number of NCAA titles won by Arkansas Razorbacks and LSU Tigers teams. For the record, the Razorbacks have won 41, not 42, NCAA titles.  The total of 42 includes the Razorbacks' 1964 MNC in football&mdash;not NCAA-sponsored. Thanks for your contributions. Dirtlawyer1 (talk) 18:20, 17 May 2011 (UTC)

Thanks for further clarification, that IP-address has vandalized various Arkansas pages in the past, so I had failed to noticed what exactly he/she/it was editing. I stand corrected on the National Titles. However, regarding your comment that "there is no we" and I "need to get a concensus on the talk page"; That particular section, being "NCAA-Sponsored Titles" is for NCAA-Sponsored titles only. If you're referring to the "National Championships" section, I suppose any number of things could be considered national titles, including defunct organizations like the AIAW or various other titles attributable to polls, such as those Alabama claims. (Though I have not seen any edits to further Alabama's titles count to as high as 26 football titles on that page, as some Alabama fans cite.) Hopefully that clears everything up. Rmphan (talk) 18:40, 17 May 2011 (UTC)

Template:Infobox swimmer
I've reverted Magioladitis changes for now as they are not working as intended. Mainly because Infobox sportsperson does not support the module option. -- WOSlinker (talk) 23:27, 22 May 2011 (UTC)