User talk:Dmadeo/Archive 1

Sacks spiral
A tag has been placed on Sacks spiral, requesting that it be speedily deleted from Wikipedia. This has been done because the article appears to be a repost of material that was previously deleted following a. If you can indicate how Sacks spiral is different from the previously posted material, or if you can indicate why this article should not be deleted, I advise you to place the template hangon underneath the other template on the article, and also put a note on Talk:Sacks spiral saying why this article should stay. An admin should check for such edits before deleting the article. Feel free to leave a note on my talk page if you have any questions about this. Please read our criteria for speedy deletion, particularly item 4 under General criteria. Please do not remove the speedy deletion tag yourself. We welcome your help in trying to improve Wikipedia, and we request you to follow these instructions. —David Eppstein 04:52, 9 May 2007 (UTC)

RHPs vs. Landmarks
This is the official NPS NY NHL list if you need a reference to check. Daniel Case 02:29, 5 June 2007 (UTC)

Thanks! dm 02:35, 5 June 2007 (UTC)


 * Good for you. Let me know if and when you've got those ones I mentioned to ShankBone ... I think as NHLs that they should get some priority. (I've already got a contemporary one of Dyckman House at the other end of Manhattan). I envy you working down there ... so many of those locations are within walking distance of each other. I see you're uploading to the Commons ... good. You should probably put them into Category:Registered Historic Places in Manhattan when you do (I've done it for the Barbizon pic for you, and then went on a sudden Commons categorization and category creation binge). Daniel Case 05:05, 9 July 2007 (UTC)

Moves
Well, the name "43 West St" wasn't even in accord with how we name places known by address. I think we should follow the naming conventions used by the NPS when they make most of their NHL designations. 463 West Street was NHL'ed for Bell's involvement with the building. New York has many buildings popularly known by a past use. Only real estate people generally refer to buildings by their street address unless they've made that part of the building's brand name.

We should discuss this on the NRHP talk page. It is my position that articles should only be named after a building's street address if that's how they're listed in the register (as in "House At ..."). I see your point, but let's get consensus either way. Daniel Case 00:31, 23 July 2007 (UTC)

That discussion you added to was more about state-by-state disambiguation (i.e., to what extent do we follow the conventions of other projects in naming articles about something where there may be more than one entry by that name in different states, or even in the same state?). What we need to discuss is the issue you raised ... in a place like New York City where a building may be better known locally by its street address, do we use that instead of whatever name the NPS has given it? I'd like to say we should defer to it at all times, but as you probably realize as much as anyone else who's done these articles is how sloppy the NPS can be sometimes. So we have to clean it up.Daniel Case 05:24, 23 July 2007 (UTC)

Players
Thanks for getting involved. The page looks quite handsome now -- JohnClarknew 21:37, 11 July 2007 (UTC)

hamilton custom house
glad to see that you added that picture. such an amazing building. Tfine80 14:53, 23 July 2007 (UTC)

NY NHLs progress
I saw ... you're being a big help. For my part, I have gotten the state NHL list up to include all or almost all of what's on the NPS list. Thanks to what you're doing down in the city we have blue links for almost all the Manhattan NHLs.

And you're sort of reminding me, by doing this, to get up to Poughkeepsie before the summer ends (maybe even this weekend) and get pics of the ones up there. I got up to Hurley a couple of weeks ago and took pictures; creating the article will have to wait until I get to it (thanks to good summer weather, I've gotten tons of images of local NRHPs in Orange, Ulster and Dutchess counties, and other pics we need. A lot of them require that articles be created around them). I've pulled out a separate article on Historic Track as a way of improving all the Goshen articles.

I have some ideas for what we can do with the NY NHL list that I'll probaby put on the talk page. Daniel Case 13:28, 1 August 2007 (UTC)

Congratulations on finishing out Manhattan's NHLs. Daniel Case 04:39, 7 August 2007 (UTC)

Almost didn't notice (but did you get them with the ones you did today?).

BTW, I renamed two of them ... Founder's Hall to go by proper naming conventions, and Duke Ellington House because everyone uses his nickname and that would thus be how it's commonly known. Daniel Case 04:47, 9 August 2007 (UTC)

Hi...Thanks for your suggestion about presenting additional NHL / NRHP info within references. I just tried that in editing the Carnegie Hall article just now. Any further comments would be welcome.doncram 16:32, 10 September 2007 (UTC)

Somehow it doesn't show who added the comment, but was it you who asked on my talkpage: "Also, are you removing references like on purpose? If so, why? I noticed you did it on Central Synagogue as well as one other entry. Thanks"? Well, yes, i see that I did that on the Central Synagogue article. By the placement of the reference, it seemed to be documenting only that the refnum was the correct refnum, which seems to me unnecessary to document separately. The refnum can be verified in reference 5, the link to the NHL summary on Central Synagogue, so it is not without documentation generally, and I don't think it is a fact that readers of the article would question. Note i did at the same time add a reference to the field just above, the date the site was added to NRHP, which struck me as a mildly more important fact to document, and one not included in the NHL summary on Central Synagogue. Relatedly, I also have been deliberately replacing some similar references to the PDF list of New York National Historic Landmarks at the National Park Service, which seemed to serve only the purpose of documenting the date of NHL addition of a site, replacing that with a link to the NHL summary for the particular site that I believe is more informative for a reader to access. I guess I think these changes are beneficial. I do wonder if a more general discussion of what references to include on the NYS NHL articles, and how to present them, would be helpful, on the WP:NRHP talkpage. For example, I wonder if there is a suitable place on each article, perhaps under a "See Also" heading, for a link to other NHLs in the area, as in the reference you questioned my removing.doncram 00:25, 11 September 2007 (UTC)

Morris-Jumel Mansion: I saw it was on a list to be evaluated, visited and made some changes. I added some comments to its talk page. Thought i was writing to the original creator of the article, but then see it was you who put it up for evaluation, so I thought I would let you know. doncram 01:37, 14 September 2007 (UTC)

Florence Mills House: Nice work on that article. I added stuff, and took a bit tougher line on the fact that the landmark site was the wrong address. Am corresponding with Bill Egan, who says he will provide more definitive documentation, citable, that the landmarked address was incorrect. doncram 01:37, 14 September 2007 (UTC)

Biltmore Theatre
Hello! Did you design the template for the NRHP infobox? If so, it needs a line that allows images to be reduced to a size in keeping with the article. Right now the picture of the Biltmore Theatre overwhelms the article, but I can't figure out how to make it smaller. Other infoboxes have a line labeled "image_size=" and you can add "150px" or "200px" or whatever is reasonable. Also, this article is too short to be broken up into three different sections. Please try to make the picture smaller, it really is overpowering the text. Thank you. ConoscoTutto 16:14, 23 August 2007 (UTC)

Times Square
Hi. I am wondering why you keeping removing TimesSquare.com. We are located in Times Square, 300 W 43, write about it's history, and cover current events there such as theater, movie premieres, restaurants, product launches, etc. We are not non-profit but neither is most of Times Square. We are a legitimate, modern publication living in and covering contemporary Times Square. We are a resource to Times Square today. Look at our pictures covering the opening of Ripley's Odditorium or the Hard Rock. Please explain why you keep removing this link. It is not spam. -- Brooks Williams —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Special:Contributions/ (talk)
 * I'd reply on your talk page, but you dont have one, instead you keep showing up as an anonymous editor using different ip addresses. The only thing you ever do is put in a link to your site.  Your site seems perfectly fine, except it has nothing to do with an encyclopedic article about Times Square.    I suggest you read WP:EL carefully, as I believe it will answer your question of why I (and others) keep removing non-useful links.   If you have further questions, let's take it to the talk page on times square...   dm 00:08, 24 August 2007 (UTC)


 * Thanks for answering back. I am not trying to be anonymous (I signed my name), but I had not intended to be a regular Wiki contributor. I will look into setting up my own talk page and read over the [[WP:EL] and see if TimesSquare.com does not qualify as a useful link.

TfD nomination of Template:Visitor attractions in New York City
Template:Visitor attractions in New York City has been nominated for deletion. You are invited to comment on the discussion at the template's entry on the Templates for Deletion page. Thank you. Wl219 20:54, 30 August 2007 (UTC)

Thayer Hotel
There's a good reason you couldn't find a listing for it ... contrary to what the hotel says on its website, it isn't on the National Register in its own right, merely (I suppose) as a contributing property to the USMA NHL. It probably should be, but it isn't.

So, in the meantime, I changed the infobox to Infobox Modern building and added it to my newly-created, where I could use a few buildings and structures that aren't on the Register. Daniel Case 02:55, 31 August 2007 (UTC)

St. George's Church: Photo?
This NYS NHL in Manhattan lacks a photo. You created the article, did u have a photo but forget to upload it? It's the only Manhattan one that i have come across lacking a photo, have been marching through them all slowly, editing in NRHP materials. Regards, doncram 05:09, 21 September 2007 (UTC)
 * Thanks for adding that. Now, the Triangle Shirtwaist Factory fire building lacks a photo... seems like it had one or two but following discussion on commons they were dropped, see talk page for the site.  Can you get that one?  On Washington Place in Manhattan. doncram 13:34, 22 September 2007 (UTC)

thanks for cleaning up NJ landmarks
I was obviously typing too fast :) dm 05:43, 25 September 2007 (UTC)
 * Why type if you can cut and paste? Thank's for creating the article. Alansohn 05:46, 25 September 2007 (UTC)

Chester A. Arthur House/Home merger needed
Someone pointed out there was already a Chester A. Arthur Home article corresponding to the Chester A. Arthur House article. They need to be merged. I think your and my material in the House version ought to be edited into the Home version, so the Home version's slightly longer history of edits will be preserved. I am not sure what to do about there being similar photos at the two. Yours is nice, and is closer up than the one that is in the infobox of the Home version. I kinda like the yellow cabs in the foreground of the Home version though, and that it shows the building from bottom to top, though from farther away. The narrow black and white photo in the Home version is good too, perhaps could be put on left side of article lower down. Do you want to effect the merger, or should I? I don't want to be deleting use of your photo without checking with you. About my stuff, I just want the NHL designation date in the infobox and the NRHP text and photo links in references transfered over. doncram 22:40, 28 September 2007 (UTC)

African Burial Ground NM
Hi,

I've been told, that African Burial Ground NM will be dedicated this Friday. May I ask you to take a picture or two of the memorial when you find the opportunity? Would you please be so kind to link a good one at de:African_Burial_Ground once it is uploaded to the commons? Just exchange the name of the old one (the site in construction) with the new name in the infobox, I'll write new captions once I see your edit on my watch list. TIA --h-stt !?  11:19, 3 October 2007 (UTC)
 * I just saw a U.S. national TV news story on the dedication, so visited the article. Someone has updated it somewhat. It may be in news stories over next day or two. doncram 01:53, 6 October 2007 (UTC)
 * I saw it on CNN this afternoon. I'll be back down there tomorrow, so will get another picture...dm 01:54, 6 October 2007 (UTC)
 * I drafted a wikinews article about it, and an editor cleaned it up, added a photo from the artist's plan for the monument, and published the article as African burial ground in New York City dedicated as National Monument. Indeed, it would be great if you would add a photo of real thing to the wikipedia article.  Honestly, I am not sure what is etiquette for editing the wikinews article once it is "published" but I expect it is fine and good to add a new photo and hence extend the news coverage.  Notice, the article includes mention that there are 110 National Historic Landmarks in New York City.  I worked that it and it survived the editing, I figure because the editor could see from List of National Historic Landmarks in New York City that the 110 number was a true fact.  Thanks for your work in making that possible to say. doncram 19:09, 6 October 2007 (UTC)

President (steamboat)
You might find this link useful: [http://www.steamboats.org/steamboat-pictures/president.html Str. President] --  ALLSTAR    ECHO  18:27, 18 October 2007 (UTC)

NYS NHLs
Hi Dmadeo (cc Daniel Case). Please note improvements to List of National Historic Landmarks in New York. For one thing, it now sorts properly. Second, it is now complete (I found the missing NHL, St. Peter's Episcopal Church (Albany, New York). Take a look at checklist to reach Featured List status that I just drafted in its talk page.  In general, our NYS and NYC list of NHL articles are the only ones that have had extensive involvement by more than one person.  I have been browsing around all the state-specific list of NHLs articles, contributing in places and developing some of them on my own, but the NYS and NYC lists remain the best in some ways and I would like to help consolidate what we have done.

Would you be on board for pushing to get Featured List status? Personally I would like to go for FL for NYS, then later go for FL for List of NHLs in NYC after learning from the process. My first consideration for going for NYS first is that NYS NHL list has what i feel is nice integration with the State historic sites (and each article for an NHL which is also a SHS has appropriate indications), while NYC NHL list does not yet have nice integration with NYC Landmarks (and there is no good list of NYC landmarks available AFAIK). A second consideration is that achieving FL status for NYS first would be a bigger deal in some ways, it is covering a bigger number. A third consideration is that it would be more differentiated from the prior achievement of FL status by List of Chicago Landmarks which is the most similar Featured List. (BTW, I have issues with that article, think ours can be and is better in various ways.) Would you be on board, and what do you think is needed to get FL status? Please add to discussion in "Towards Featured List" new section of the Talk on NYS NHLs list article, where I drafted a checklist. (P.S. if you want to bring NYC article along also or instead, please invite me, let's work via Talk page for it). Cheers, doncram 22:22, 30 October 2007 (UTC)


 * Would you mind rating Adams Power Plant Transformer House, per request WP:NRHPA? BTW, I just followed up on your request for Morris-Jumel Mansion rating on that page.  See also "Quality rating for NHL articles" new topic in Talk page of WP:NHRP. doncram 03:16, 1 November 2007 (UTC)


 * Awesome work in adding geo coordinates for the NYS NHLs. I'll be on vacation from wikipedia for a while, including while visiting central NY.  I am happy to be able to use your work to map my possible route to an NHL or two to take pics, if I have time.  :)  P.S.  Morrill not Morril Hall needs typo correction in its coordinate listing;  Old Blenheim Bridge shows but not its label for me, in Google maps right now.  Anyhow, really great work!  doncram (talk) 21:05, 21 November 2007 (UTC)


 * Another push now, perhaps, to bring up the quality of the NYS NHL articles? I wonder if you can help with writing in the list descriptions and the articles.  Some articles have shorter text than their descriptions in the NHL list, unfortunately, tho most now have pics (new or HABS) and most have NRHP text documents linked as high quality potential sources.  You've done wonderful work bringing NYC NHL list along, too, it makes me think they should both be proposed for FL status together (and brought up through peer review and anything else together on the way). doncram (talk) 06:39, 22 January 2008 (UTC)


 * I've gone ahead and asked for peer review on the NYS NHL list, including the NYC NHL list as a subarticle (hopefully to be considered by the peer reviewers as well). Peer review comment area should be opened up soon, then I will separately invite several people to participate, too. doncram (talk) 21:39, 8 February 2008 (UTC)

The photos
The Bronson House is in the middle of a prison? Must be a Columbia County facility ... there are no state facilities around Hudson as far as I know. Perhaps we should ask the sheriff's department for permission.

I don't think all the archeological districts will be impossible to photograph ... we can reasonably guess where a place like Schuyler Flatts is, although Fort Massapeag would be hard (but there are some tantalizing clues in that article from the Times). I also think we should get in touch with some dive shops in Lake George and see if anyone they know has pictures of the Land Tortoise.

Thanks, BTW, for some of the recent photo additions. You must have been busy ... getting all the way up to Rochester over Thanksgiving! And then getting some of those other Hudson Valley ones. We still need some other ones but I'll see what I can do; however I'd rather wait till warm weather again. I like the one for Boston Post Road Historic District, although my personal preference is for HDs to be represented by an image of more than one building, but I wasn't there so I don't know if that would have been possible.

And also, good work in northern Ulster County, too. I have some more coming from the south, so we may be able to make a huge dent. I'm not sure that Opus 40 can be the subject of a free image, though, as freedom of panorama in the US doesn't apply to public artworks still under copyright (and it was built in 1940, so it's still under copyright). You might want to reupload here under Non-free 3D art and a fair use rationale. Daniel Case (talk) 07:44, 7 December 2007 (UTC)


 * You have been busy! Awesome work, in adding 5 photos just now to the NYS NHL list covering some Long Island sites including 2 ships and the Old House. And awesome also for your adding 5 or more pics for Brooklyn and Staten Island such as Voorlezer's House in the NYC NHL list last month.  You have been doing great work, both in terms of quantity and quality.  I appreciate it all.  Currently it encourages me to plod along with HABS photo uploading in the NYS NHL list, as we are really getting somewhere!  Cheers, doncram (talk) 14:50, 13 January 2008 (UTC)


 * Saw your new pic for Susan B. Anthony House and new pic for Ganondagan State Historic Site. Those are great.  The new Ganondagan one looks better when small, than did the old pic, also yours, though the old pic is really nice when enlarged, and then interesting to see it includes the same lodge-type building far away.  Maybe i will try adding that back to the article now, if you don't mind?  I already added back the old pic for Susan B. Anthony, too, as I think it  adds by contrast to new one.  I think having multiple pics is great for articles, like Elihu Root House and St. Peter's Episcopal Church (Albany, New York), even though the pics might currently outbalance the text.  The solution for the imbalance is that the text should be expanded eventually.  Thanks for pitching in with the peer review! doncram (talk) 21:24, 9 February 2008 (UTC)

Barnstar

 * Hear, hear! doncram (talk) 06:33, 22 January 2008 (UTC)

NJ NHLs
At WP:NRHP, you've listed several new articles on sites in List of National Historic Landmarks in New Jersey, but FYI you neglected to add them to WP:NRHP on their talk pages. I added some stuff to some of them, including a model link to the relevant NRHP text/photos documents with blanks left to fill in. Hopefully this is helpful. doncram (talk) 06:08, 4 February 2008 (UTC)

Nice meeting you Sunday. I see you've created articles on most of the NJ NHLs. Just letting you know that tomorrow I may be in a position to take some pictures of Craftsman Farms and Thomas Nast Home. Daniel Case (talk) 22:32, 22 March 2008 (UTC)

Update: Those pictures have been added to the articles and the state list. Daniel Case (talk) 15:09, 29 May 2008 (UTC)

List article on HRS artists & 2007 Talk archive
Thanks for pitching in and creating the superb new List article on Hudson River School artists. Your work was very much needed and represents an outstanding contribution to the main HRS article. The new List article is the perfect place to list every HRS artist, both the major figures and the far more numerous minor ones, allowing the main article to deal as it should with only the more academically accepted and recognized artists of the HRS. As you know, the discussions attempting to sort out that "Selected" list of major HRS artists are still ongoing. While archiving older Talk page discussions are certainly a good idea, I hope you will agree that it would be helpful to WP readers to find this year's discussions on this year's Talk page. For that reason, I would like to reinstate all 2008 discussions (those dating from January 2008) to the current Talk page, so that they will not be misfiled under the newly created archive titled "Archive through 2007." Please accept the thanks of all WP readers interested in the art and artists of the HRS for your fine work thus far. Best regards, Jack Bethune (talk) 16:40, 5 February 2008 (UTC)

Flatiron Building external link
Point taken. Ed Fitzgerald (unfutz)  (talk / cont)  03:28, 11 February 2008 (UTC)
 * Except you went too far. What have you got against linking to good photographs? Ed Fitzgerald (unfutz)  (talk / cont)  03:35, 11 February 2008 (UTC)
 * I don't want any more pics in the article, it has plenty, but there's no reason to deny people access to other photos, especially good ones. Because of copyright and other issues, not every graphic image is able to be uploaded to the Commons, but I have no objection if any you find that can be uploaded there are. Ed Fitzgerald (unfutz)  (talk / cont)  05:39, 11 February 2008 (UTC)

NYC meetup
I'll be there (as long as things go according to plan). Daniel Case (talk) 20:24, 15 March 2008 (UTC)
 * Good to meet you yesterday. Keep up the excellent work with the historic locations, and give a shout if you need anything.  -- David  Shankbone  17:07, 17 March 2008 (UTC)

Stub templates
Howdy! I see that you have been industrious in creating stub articles for National Registered Historic Places. Would you mind in the future using state-specific templates instead of NRHP-stub? If you go to, you will see the template format for each of the fifty states. As each template gains 60 articles, it will get its own category. Using the state templates will save us stub-sorters a whole lotta work. Thanks for considering it! Her Pegship  (tis herself) 19:21, 20 March 2008 (UTC)

Wikipedia Takes Manhattan postponed to Friday April 4th
All other details remain the same. Thanks.--Pharos (talk) 18:39, 27 March 2008 (UTC)


 * I added some 5 or 6 pic requests for some NYC NHLs to the Wikipedia Takes Manhattan/Goals. I included some that might be hard to get, like Quarters A, Brooklyn Navy Yard.  If that is unfair to ask for, from afar, or otherwise should not be on the list, feel free to remove.  Please feel free to review all my additions there.  For each one added, I made sure to add reqphoto to the article's talk page. doncram (talk) 22:09, 27 March 2008 (UTC)

WikiProject Museums invite
This complements NRHP so well ... how many of our entries, after all, are historic house museums? Oh, and the project page points to the NYC RHP lists as a good source of articles waiting to be created. Daniel Case (talk) 05:54, 2 April 2008 (UTC)

Decker Building DYK
As Appraiser said, we need to get it to 1,500 (with spaces) characters of pure text. It isn't difficult ... I just got Farmer's and Manufacturer's Bank above the limit by really squeezing its NRHP nom. Have you looked at OPRHP's site to see if it has one? Daniel Case (talk) 14:20, 8 April 2008 (UTC)


 * ...that the Decker building (pictured), an 1892 Moorish-influenced design, is where Andy Warhol had his Factory from 1967 to 1973, and was shot in 1968?

21 Astor Place
Hi -- There's a notability tag on 21 Astor Place, and it's on a list of articles for possible deletion. I wonder if it might be a contributing building in a historic district or otherwise defended from attack, such as by adding a photo and/or other info. I checked your List of RHPs in New York City and do not see it separately listed there, however. doncram (talk) 00:55, 10 April 2008 (UTC)

Re:Edward M. Cotter (fireboat)
It shouldn't be a problem to get a photo. The boat is docked where I can get some shots of at least one side. I'll drop you a note when I upload them.Shinerunner (talk) 11:14, 1 May 2008 (UTC)

NYC nhl pics
Hey, congrats for rounding up a Quarters A, Brooklyn Navy Yard pic! I see that the List of NHLs in NYC is now completely illustrated, except for Wards Point. If you could email me separately (i have email link on my user page), i could provide some info about that not-supposed-to-be-publicly-disclosed location, by the way. doncram (talk) 22:32, 17 May 2008 (UTC)

NYC Meetup: June 1, 2008
In the afternoon, we will hold a session dedicated to meta:Wikimedia New York City activities, elect a board of directors, and hold salon-style group discussions on Wikipedia and the other Wikimedia projects (see the last meeting's minutes).

We'll also review our recent Wikipedia Takes Manhattan event, and make preparations for our exciting successor Wiki Week bonanza, being planned with Columbia University students for September or October.

In the evening, we'll share dinner and chat at a local restaurant, and (weather permitting) hold a late-night astronomy event at Columbia's telescopes.

You can add or remove your name from the New York City Meetups invite list at Meetup/NYC/Invite list.

Also, check out our regional US Wikimedia chapters blog Wiki Northeast (and we're open to guest posts). This has been an automated delivery by BrownBot (talk) 23:38, 19 May 2008 (UTC)

to nominate NY NHLs for FL
With completion by Lvklock's recent descriptions editing for the List of NHLs in NY, i want to put it up for FL now. Let me know if there's anything you'd like to take care of first, or if you will be very unavailable during the upcoming period of the review. I trust this meets with your approval. Cheers, doncram (talk) 21:34, 30 May 2008 (UTC)

Edward M. Cotter (fireboat)
I finally got the pictures and I've added them as a photo gallery until you decide how they look best.Shinerunner (talk) 23:20, 2 June 2008 (UTC)

fourth of July, or bust....
Hi -- Hey, you did good work bringing List of NHLs in NJ up to a higher standard. I assume you've noticed my wt:NRHP proposal towards completing the start, at least, of all the NHL articles nation-wide by June 29 or so. I wonder if you'd be willing to address some List of NHLs in NJ issues, about creating separate articles for the NHLs, and about including infoboxes and NHL designation dates and the NHL summary webpage source. Lvklock is marching through the state lists, evaluating and identifying shortcomings. About NJ, to work a bit ahead of her, i think there is some cleaning up to do yet. I think there needs to be NHL info, or a split of the NHL-related info out of, Lawrenceville School for example. And other visits to add NHL date and source to all the NJ NHL pages. Can you help? The idea is to celebrate with a nation-wide NHL list DYK to appear on Independence Day (United States). Let me know, cheers, doncram (talk) 06:46, 20 June 2008 (UTC)


 * Thanks! Your photo of Albert Einstein House and others are great, and the descriptions in the list-article are looking up. :)  Thanks for separating out the Lawrenceville School NHL.  I added the NRHP doc to that article, and using that was able to begin to distinguish better between it and the rest of the school, like to state that it is only a portion of the school.  There's much more available in the NRHP doc and photo set which could be used, say to list the included buildings and to describe the Tiffany windows.  Anyhow, thanks! doncram (talk) 18:22, 23 June 2008 (UTC)


 * Hi, I just finished my quick review of NJ. What a pleasure!  I added some NHL designation dates and NHL summary references.  Other than that, Lucy the Elephant is tagged for citations, which I'm not worried about at the moment, and the Sandy Hook Light needs an NRHP infobox, IMHO.  If you had a chance to do that, it would be great.  Your hard work made this a fun state to look at! Lvklock (talk) 04:19, 24 June 2008 (UTC)


 * Whew, and Lvklock is a tough checker, too! good :) doncram (talk) 02:14, 25 June 2008 (UTC)

NYC NHLs
Congratuations, great work, about getting the last NYC NHL pic. I noticed you adding it to the list yesterday, and took the liberty of mentioning it already at wt:NRHP... in thread titled "List of fully illustrated NRHP lists" or something like that. doncram (talk) 02:14, 25 June 2008 (UTC)

NPS NHL photo contest
Hi Dmadeo -- See Wikipedia talk:WikiProject National Register of Historic Places. I didn't know about this contest before. You should submit a couple pics! Ten percent of submissions last year (12 / 125) were winners.... doncram (talk) 20:20, 28 June 2008 (UTC)


 * About the sandbox partial list of NHLs needing pics, i don't think that is exactly working, and/or it overlaps too much with other tracking tools to be useful, also. Although there is no State, identified, because state does not appear as a column in a state-specific list, of course i can tell which is which state.  It made me look though, and I realize i have taken pics of 4 NHLs but did not upload them.  So a list of "places needing pics" does serve a dramatic purpose.  But, it is redundant of course to the NHL list-tables themselves, and to the Reqphoto system.  Hmm, i wonder if it would work better as a Category: NHLs needing pics.  The Reqphoto that i put in routinely into new NHL articles generates a Category: Photos requested in New Mexico  or wherever.  It could possibly be helpful to have a Category: Photos of NHLs requested.  Again, not sure if it is worth it, as in general the Reqphoto system is not believed to be very effective at all in rounding up photographers.  However, at a minimum it would be helpful to visit all the Talk pages of the NHLs needing pics, and ensure that a proper reqphoto is added.  I have been adding it only recently to new articles.  Hope this is helpful.


 * Relatedly, i am wondering about putting in a nomination of WP:NRHP as meriting a special award in the NPS NHL photo contest. They don't have any suitable category, but it is phenomenal that we have created almost all the NHL articles now and produced over 1500 pics, in fact probably over 2/3 the total of NHLs.  I thot i might just make a submission, see if they choose to recognize us.  To do this, I would really like to get a new tally of the number of pics we have, by state, and how many of each several types.  The types relevant would be, at a minimum, historic / black&white pics, vs. color pics.  Or, in more detail:  historic HABS pics, NRHP nomination pics, NHL summary webpage pics (there are a few in PA i know of), new by WP:NRHP members, new other pics.


 * Is there any chance you would be willing to tally any or all of those, in WikiProject National Register of Historic Places/ProgressOnNHLsByState. Currently there is just one photo-related column, the "w/ pic" column, which needs updating.  I would really appreciate it if you could help, esp. because i am hitting the June 30 deadline and the 4th of July cleanup drive deadline!  cheers, doncram (talk) 01:28, 29 June 2008 (UTC)


 * I got enthused and created WikiProject National Register of Historic Places/PhotoCreditsForNHLsByState to tally photos by state by NRHP member, and other photo info. Would you mind visiting and filling in the info about your photos, at least?  I identified my own contributions in NYS for example.  I wonder if this is workable, and if we/i could tally this up really quickly.  doncram (talk) 03:14, 29 June 2008 (UTC)


 * Thank you! for filling out your photo credits info. I am amazed how many NHL pics you have, by the way.  I have gone back and forth yesterday and today about putting in a submission for our collective effort, to the NPS NHL photo contest.  In part because i was noticing how many NHL or other NPS website pics we have, and it would be weird to request credit from the NPS for our using their pics.  But with your info and what Appraiser added, i am seeing that i could document quite a large number of new wikipedia contributions.  To whatever extent you can help today/tonight in identifying any other wikipedian photo contributions, in other states, i would appreciate it.  Even if not, thanks so much for what you did already tallying there. doncram (talk) 23:54, 29 June 2008 (UTC)  p.s. the Alaska NHL list looks great, that has always been a pain because there are no wikipedians there, and i think it was just ipoellet and me that ever visited, virtually, before.

You didn't mention submitting to the contest or not. If you simply had no time, you have a second chance: per the NHL webpage posted within the thread at Wikipedia talk:WikiProject National Register of Historic Places the deadline has been extended to July 7. I just noticed, per the NPS webpage announcing the contest. Go for it? Cheers, doncram (talk) 07:26, 4 July 2008 (UTC)

can you double check something for me?
Re the Saipan beaches article, i just switched it from NRHP infobox to NRHP2. That works. NRHP2 is successful in suppressing map, if locmapin = blank. While NRHP tries to plot Saipan on a USA map, and blows up. Thanks for all you've done today! doncram (talk) 03:25, 30 June 2008 (UTC)

Fourth of July, or bust, Thanks!
Your persistence in completing the List of NHLs in NYC, then going on to List of NHLs in NJ, inspired me! And thank you so much for tackling, during the drive, List of NHLs in AK and List of NHLs in HI! I really get a kick out of your appreciating all that goes into really cleaning up one of these lists! It amazes me, too, how the NHLs are so inextricably intertwined with places, events, people, institutions in every state. Hope u get to visit AK! Cheers, doncram (talk) 17:29, 4 July 2008 (UTC)


 * You've taken many I wanted to take, as well. Don't worry :-). Speaking of which, I recently read a thing about the Bronson House in Hudson Valley. The Historic Hudson group (not Historic Hudson Valley, which runs some of Westchester's NHLs) seems to have some access. I will see if I can contact them about getting a picture. Daniel Case (talk) 17:47, 4 July 2008 (UTC)


 * Glad you guys don't live way up here in Central New York with me.....no competition for pics here, so far! Maybe I'll get some work done on my backlog of pics now.

Thanks for your work, esp. in AK and HI this last week. Sorting out those tangles is not my forte. Lvklock (talk) 18:20, 4 July 2008 (UTC)

Gateway Arch
Thanks for separating the Gateway Arch from the Jefferson National Memorial. I was toying with doing it for sometime but never quite had the heart. I was always surprised they stayed together as long as they did. Thanks again! Americasroof (talk) 13:10, 5 July 2008 (UTC)
 * It seemed pretty obvious to me that it needed to be done, for the nhl breakout if nothing else. The article still needs a lot of help, but it's better than it was. dm (talk) 13:19, 5 July 2008 (UTC)
 * Thanks again. I've always been surprised at how weak the articles are.  Amazingly there was virtually no history until I added it relatively recently.  I keep meaning to go back...Americasroof (talk) 02:44, 6 July 2008 (UTC)

Coloma, and NHL / NPS sources
Hi, i notice your edits reversing my recent decision to cover Coloma NHL as part of the state park article for the Sutter's Mill / gold discovery site. I don't know if you noticed that i had put in some effort to add references and to make that judgment just recently, splitting it out of the Coloma place article. I agree that it is a judgment call, but i went in the other direction. I wonder if you could expand on why your judgment is different.

Also, in the Coloma article and others, you are including references you call "NHL Writeup" and "NPS Red Book". As i think you know, I don't particularly like these references to start with. I must acknowledge that I have noticed you sometimes manage to find some key facts in them which are not covered in what I call the NHLsum reference, so they have some merit, especially for archeological sites where the NRHP text/photos document is not available. But I don't know what the Red Book is and where you get it. Where how could i get those? I also don't know where you get the "NHL Writeup", where could I get that? Although in the past I had figured out or conjectured that the NHL Writeup was sometimes extracts from the NRHP Inventory/Nomination documents which might have been used in a press release at the time of an NHL designation. As such, it would be preferable to use the actual NRHP Inventory/Nomination, which has a well-developed reference format including author, date, and other context.

Currently, I think what you term the NHL writeup should be avoided if an NHRP text document is included as a reference or is available to be added. I think you should first be trying to add the NRHP document, and only if that is not available, then using the writeup. If you actually have the NRHP document I don't think you would choose to use the writeup. Or, if you use the NHL writeup, make an effort to compare it to the NRHP text document, and analyse whether you could cite the NRHP text document instead.

And, at a minimum I think you need to develop a better, fuller reference format for these, which describes what they are. Some thoughts:
 * The name you use seems to be your own shorthand, meaningful to yourself but not to readers.
 * The title within the actual document you link, should be used, e.g. "COLOMA".
 * The publisher, presumably the National Park Service, is needed.
 * Date information should be provided, though I expect that date is not available. However, that should be explained explicitly, with something like:  "Date not available, however likely to have been released on 4 July 1961 when the site was designated a National Historic Landmark".
 * What these are needs to be described, perhaps term as: "Press release, undated, likely drawn from NRHP Inventory/Nomination document also cited".

Your thoughts? doncram (talk) 22:17, 5 July 2008 (UTC)


 * Sorry i didnt get back to you. I did appreciate your response, and do appreciate that you are following up on the NHLs in general, like your adding a number of descriptions to List of NHLs in CA that i noticed, and which i suspect may relate to edits to their articles, not on my watchlist, too.  On Coloma, i guess i was relieved, though i had expected it, for you to verify that you hadn't noticed i had just done those edits, otherwise it woulda been weird like an edit war to be being reverted effectively without discussion.  The situation there is still messy, my last thought was maybe the state park and the Coloma articles should be merged, but i also think it is fine now to leave it for someone really interested in the site who could add current pictures.  Like you said, someone willing to do more research and visit.  I believe it does now serve fine per the limited goals of the recent NHL cleanup drive, to provide a clear location for some info and for further development about the NHL.  More about the references maybe later, i was thinking about making a customized request for u, but really no hard feelings present.  On another matter, maybe you could take a look at wp:NHLs 2008?  Several pics needed, several articles to develop, that will likely be in the news soon as the nhl meeting is in July.  cheers, doncram (talk) 15:29, 11 July 2008 (UTC)

NHL dates
Thanks! I didn't shift focus from articles to lists when looking at references. If I had, I could have figured this out. duh! Lvklock (talk) 02:15, 6 July 2008 (UTC)

Richard Nixon Presidential Library and Museum
Hi, if ur working thru the CA NHLs, u r just about at this one. Well, actually, i think the Richard Nixon Birthplace needs to be split to a separate article. This NHL is just the cottage that was his birthplace and childhood home. It's all on one property, which was a lemon grove, but the modern library and museum dominate the property and dominate the article now. I was musing about this, in discussion over at Talk:Spiegel Grove about President Hayes' house and library. There, the NHL is the entire estate and specifically includes the library, which also is old, so one article may be best, but here for Nixon i think a sep. one for the NHL / cottage is needed, don't you? doncram (talk) 07:06, 13 July 2008 (UTC)

Proposed deletion of Gallons per minute
A proposed deletion template has been added to the article Gallons per minute, suggesting that it be deleted according to the proposed deletion process. All contributions are appreciated, but this article may not satisfy Wikipedia's criteria for inclusion, and the deletion notice should explain why (see also "What Wikipedia is not" and Wikipedia's deletion policy). You may prevent the proposed deletion by removing the  notice, but please explain why you disagree with the proposed deletion in your edit summary or on its talk page.

Please consider improving the article to address the issues raised because even though removing the deletion notice will prevent deletion through the proposed deletion process, the article may still be deleted if it matches any of the speedy deletion criteria or it can be sent to Articles for Deletion, where it may be deleted if consensus to delete is reached. - Icewedge (talk) 02:27, 21 July 2008 (UTC)

some usefulness of captions of photos in NHL lists
Nice work adding descriptions to more of the CA list.

I haven't reviewed all your edits, but i just noticed you removed captions of about 5 pics in one edit of the List of NHLs in CA with the edit summary "(removed captions from photos since they dont display)". But, they do display! Not obviously, but if you hover your cursor over the photo you get to see the caption. Also, they do kinda label the image, and they may have info which is not included in the photo description at Commons, which could be helpful. So I think the captions do provide value. About these captions in particular, maybe some of them were longish and not that great. But, i do keep captions and add captions for their subtle display value, so am somewhat alarmed about that. I acknowledge there are some disadvantages (article size-wise mainly) for keeping captions, so if you want to open a discussion about the pros and cons of keeping the captions, that could be discussed. Please feel free to do so at wt:NRHP. But otherwise i think they should be left in. doncram (talk) 08:15, 22 July 2008 (UTC)
 * I appreciated your response to my talk page, and I appreciate noticing that you edited down, rather than entirely removing some other wordy captions within the same list. Thanks! doncram (talk) 06:10, 28 July 2008 (UTC)

Barnstar

 * Hear, hear! I second that emotion!  I was just beginning to look for a suitable barnstar for exactly this.  I am so glad you persisted through this.  As you know i worked on some articles within the list, (as has Sanfranman59), and I really wanted this improved, but frankly it has been too overwhelming for me to ever really attack the list and finally take control, as you have done.  Thanks! doncram (talk) 06:07, 28 July 2008 (UTC)
 * I want to add my appreciation as well. This an important list, and your work on it is terrific. Cbl62 (talk) 14:52, 28 July 2008 (UTC)

New Jersey NRHP lists
Hi again ... I just noticed that we have a lot of duplication in the New Jersey NRHP lists. There's a state list at List of Registered Historic Places in New Jersey, but there are also separate lists for each county. The reason I'm posting a message here is because I see that you've done some work on these lists. Do you happen to know if both the state list and the individual county lists are up to date? It seems to me that we should get rid of the county lists in the state article and perhaps redirect that page to the Atlantic County list page (or one of the other county pages ... I suggested Atlantic because it's first alphabetically). What do you think? --Sanfranman59 (talk) 19:11, 31 July 2008 (UTC)

Thanks
Thanks for working on problem NHLs!--Appraiser (talk) 14:29, 4 August 2008 (UTC)

Empire Building
It probably could be given an article in its own right, but it would probably be better to add sections on each of the buildings to the Heaviest Corner on Earth article. I'd suggest that when an article is written about the NYC building, that the dablink point to the heaviest corner article. If you're at all interested, there's a more complete article on the Birmingham building (also on the NRHP) at Bhamwiki. (link). --Dystopos (talk) 14:12, 6 August 2008 (UTC)

Elizabeth Alice Austen House
Can you post me the reference under this name. You reverted but haven't shown any link to any reference, every document lists it as "Alice Austen House" from the NPS to the NAHS to the Friends of Alice Austen, even the official pdf from the NPS lists it as AA House or "Clear Comfort". --Richard Arthur Norton (1958- ) (talk) 06:40, 7 August 2008 (UTC)

No, I changed it to "Alice Austen House", you changed it back to "Elizabeth Alice Austen House", which is not supported by the document you posted. --Richard Arthur Norton (1958- ) (talk) 06:48, 7 August 2008 (UTC)

Here is the full list of artists studios and homes: Historic Artists' Homes and Studios --Richard Arthur Norton (1958- ) (talk) 06:50, 7 August 2008 (UTC)

NYC RHP lists
Ah, good, glad you noticed what i was up to. I would certainly like to avoid duplication. And, you see that I was endorsing your splitting of Manhattan into 4 sections, which I think is very helpful.

I see, yes, User:Dmadeo/nrhp-manhattan is the same 504 RHPs in a table, as i just pasted into List of Registered Historic Places in Manhattan below 14th Street, and I see your four parts are the lists moved out of the main one.

I was going to proceed to figure out if tables as defined by that 4-part segmentation (plus the islands to be left in the main page) would be of workable size or not, by simply proceeding and making those tables. In the List of Registered Historic Places in Manhattan below 14th Street article, i have pasted in the big table, and i was going to individually extract downtown rows into a separate table to grow above. Then move the reduced big table on to the midtown article, and do the same, etc.

Do you see any better way to do it? And/or do you want to proceed to do it, in your userspace, or feel free to do it in the new List of Registered Historic Places in Manhattan below 14th Street article. I'll try out the process of working in the below 14th street article, moving say 10 from the big to new table, and then pause. doncram (talk) 05:18, 13 August 2008 (UTC)


 * Okay, i "processed" about 6 or 7, all buildings, from big table into new downtown starter table, and moved down their entries from your list into a "processed" section to keep track. It is pretty straightforward to look up each one out of the big table, using your nice list.
 * About maintaining distinctions between districts, buildings, and boats, how about we do that by the color coding? We could mix them in alphabetically, but add a new "NRHPboat color" or "boat color" to the palette, along with "HD color" and "NRHP color".
 * Anyhow i am done for now. doncram (talk) 05:41, 13 August 2008 (UTC)
 * Okay, further, i have "table-ized" all NYS counties up to this one alphabetically now. Again, I do concur with your division of the 504 New York county RHPs into segments.  Please let me know if you have any objections, but i think it is right to continue to table-ize the Manhattan entries, per your own evident intentions. Best, doncram (talk) 22:22, 14 August 2008 (UTC)


 * Got your message about fixing up Manhattan entries "before" splitting into separate tables. Perhaps i should have paused longer to hear from you, before investing more.  However, I have yesterday and thereabouts proceeded pretty far along, within List of Registered Historic Places in Manhattan below 14th Street, in both splitting the big table and also in fixing up entries.  Currently, the big table has been split into three pieces: two in that article (the lower Manhattan table draft, and the big table of Manhattan from E on, and one now in the List of Registered Historic Places in Manhattan from 14th to 59th Streets.  The latter one is a 30kb or so chunk holdsing Manhattan-wide listings, through letter D, except all the lower Manhattan ones have been moved out.  I moved it out of the lower manhattan article to reduce its article size, to speed up editing.
 * It is hard and slow for me, with my perhaps slow computer and slow connection, to work with very large articles. So in general I would rather split and do fix-up, checking against the prior lists that already reflect disambiguation edits, in four separated articles.  But i did already spend effort in fixing up rows in the lower manhattan table, adding pics, doing disambiguation links etc., matching the info in the previous list of lower manhattan entries, and then deleting most of the previous entries.


 * I wasn't aware that you had invested in fixing up the table. Am I missing something, or is your table work entirely reflected in your user-space at User:Dmadeo/nrhp-manhattan?  As far as i can tell there, you pasted the big table in one edit on August 5, then you made changes in about 5 table rows in several more edits that day, shown in this diff.  I have now made far more changes within many more numerous rows to fix wikilinks to articles, to add photos, etc., as well as moved rows between the 3 working tables.  So I would now prefer to continue with the table version in mainspace (in its 3 working parts in two articles now).


 * fyi, i have just now gone back and added the pipelinks necessary in 2 sublists to re-implement those Aug 5 edits shown in the diff. doncram (talk) 18:33, 24 August 2008 (UTC)


 * It does seem that it would have been better for me to have started with your big table rather than a new paste-in, in order to capture the August 5 improvements you made, rather than start anew. However, I could now duplicate those specific edits and then we would have gotten to the same point.    If i did that, would you be okay with proceeding in using the 3-part table version in mainspace?  Or am i missing something more?


 * I would then be pretty indifferent about our fixing up its rows before or after splitting those parts further (except for some preference to get to smaller article sizes sooner). Let me know. doncram (talk) 17:43, 17 August 2008 (UTC)


 * Another thought is that if the table is divided into 4 separate articles, each with a Google map linked, then it will be pretty easy to identify any mistakes, by use of the maps. That's helped with other table divisions into multiple articles. doncram (talk) 21:01, 17 August 2008 (UTC)


 * Okay, i am done with List of Registered Historic Places in Manhattan below 14th Street. The Google map link works and should show all of the entries being in Manhattan below 14th (although it may take a few hours to refresh for the row i moved out, Film place above 14th).  I tried hard to incorporate all info from the disambig links, pipelinks, other info in the old list into the table entries pretty carefully.  It was rather a lot of work....  Hopefully you can go on and fix this up to a good standard.


 * I'll work on the other 4 chunks of Manhattan more, but i already did divide the big table into a table for each one that should now show, in the corresponding Google maps, only flags in the right places. Cheers, doncram (talk) 01:57, 24 August 2008 (UTC)


 * I removed the "underconstruction" tags from the other articles: 14-59, 59-110, 110+, after fixing up a lot of the wikilinks. But i am sure i left some bluelinks that are inaccurate.  And there remains info from the prior lists in the sections labelled "Temporary: Links and info to use in verifying disambiguation and fixing up table" which is not yet incorporated.  But there is so much checking to do in order to justify removing those sections, I am not sure I am up to doing it all.  I am about out of steam.  It sure is a lot of work to develop such big lists.  Anyhow, the division into 4 big chunks of Manhattan and the associated islands seems to work pretty well.  There's only one or two districts, such as one historic district for Riverside drive and park, that seem to run across a border, hence has to be listed in both chunks.  They're all yours now!  Cheers, doncram (talk) 01:32, 28 August 2008 (UTC)    P.S. See my note about the NYS NHL FL discussion below.

Second Annual WikiNYC Picnic
Greetings! You are invited to attend the second annual New York picnic on August 24! This year, it will be taking place in the Long Meadow of Prospect Park in Brooklyn. If you plan on coming, please sign up and be sure to bring something! Please be sure to come! You have received this automated delivery because your name was on the invite list. BrownBot (talk) 20:03, 13 August 2008 (UTC)

Duty to God Award DYK - please re-review
Hello! I removed the stub designation on the Duty to God Award article and I have no problems with the Alt Hook. Please re-review your DYK consideration of this entry. Thanks. Ecoleetage (talk) 12:56, 22 August 2008 (UTC)
 * PS Never mind, it has already been okayed. Thanks for pointing out the stub problem - it was not removed when the article was expanded. Ecoleetage (talk) 13:58, 22 August 2008 (UTC)

DYK North Baltimore Aquatic Club

 * ... that the North Baltimore Aquatic Club has produced seven Olympians, including Michael Phelps and Katie Hoff?

FL candidacy List of NHLs in NY
I nominated List of NHLs in NY for Featured List. Please watch, please feel free to add to discussion at Featured list candidates/List of National Historic Landmarks in New York. Cheers, doncram (talk) 23:52, 25 August 2008 (UTC)


 * The review seems to be going okay, thanks for chiming in. About the table of NHLs needing pics, I commented there that I do see some value to having it, but suggested stripping it down and moving it.  Stripping down might amount to just cancelling the description column, or opening that instead to comments about how to get to the place, other photography difficulties, why it is not pic'd yet.  Thinking about it more, it could be moved usefully either to the Talk page of the article, or to a new nation-wide page of NHLs needing pics, for which you could see all of the locations on a single Google map.  That would be helpful, say, for someone planning a car trip across the country, perhaps willing to zigzag to score an NHL or two on the way.  I recall you were developping something like this before which I wasn't too hot about, but now that i see the Google map working well for it I like it a lot more.  Wanna go ahead and create the wikiproject page for it?


 * And, I noticed just a short while ago that the Featured list candidates page displays the full review-in-progress of each candidate FL, which is probably why some review editors have been removing our sections (like so they don't show up in the TOC of the whole list). Anyhow, especially there the table of non-photo'd places looks rather out of place.  Would you mind moving it, or would you mind my moving it?  Cheers, doncram (talk) 01:22, 28 August 2008 (UTC)

DYK Rose Hill, Manhattan
Thank you for your assistance in the nomination! - Mailer Diablo 17:19, 27 August 2008 (UTC)
 * ... that Manhattan's Rose Hill neighborhood was the original site of Madison Square Garden, where millionaire Harry K. Thaw killed architect Stanford White over Evelyn Nesbit?

DYK Julie Coin

 * ... that tennis player Julie Coin, ranked 188th, defeated the #1 woman player Ana Ivanović in the second round of the 2008 US Open?

DAte audit, script-assisted; see mosnum | Delink common terms. See: wp:overlink
Thanks for your post, and your explanation of the misunderstanding. All is fine.

My problem is that it's well accepted that DA conceals valuable information from just the people who need it to manage choice and consistency in our use of dates. This is evidenced by the findings of the date-auditing program that you complain of. Date-mess (which is largely fixed by the applicaiton of the script and human oversight) is endemic—not so much in the top-end articles (FAs and FLs, and to a lesser extent GAs), but in articles more generally. What surprises me is that our most read articles (from Henryk's list of the thousand most visited) score poorly: about 60% have mixed US/international formats, sometimes in nationally sensitive and important topics such as the 9/11 clutch (British dates in the infoboxes, if you please), JF Kennedy, etc. Our readers put up with this, but the problem will continue as long as anything comes in between editors' and readers' displays. And the fact that date-format choice for third-party countries has not been thrashed out until now is further evidence of the blinkered situation.

Under these circumstances, can you see why people don't buy the argument "Let's stop for the time being, since we're trashing potentially valuable meta-information for the future"? That's meta-information we'd rather not have, since it might encourage programmers to write scripts to reimpose blinkers.

Now, I want to get to the bottom of why you believe it's such a key advantage to display month or day in preferenced order. No one else seems to care much, least of all our readers (as long as they're not exposed to messy inconsistency within articles). But I don't want to pester you: after your break. Tony  (talk)  08:43, 5 September 2008 (UTC)

"No consensus"
Thanks for your comments against such intense removal of autoformatted dates here. I left my concerns here. Daytrivia (talk) 01:03, 6 September 2008 (UTC)

DYK National Cartoon Museum
Thanks for the compliment and DYK nomination. Clarityfiend (talk) 18:38, 6 September 2008 (UTC)

....that the National Cartoon Museum wandered between four homes before its acquisition by Ohio State University?

--Daniel Case (talk) 14:38, 12 September 2008 (UTC)

dates
Yes, it personalises the issue, and centralises it on me, whereas I am one of many people who have and do run the script. Tell me why you're "starting to sympathise with their POV". I thought you were antagonistic towards the deprecation of DA in the first place. Tony  (talk)  04:30, 9 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Everything we want? Well, I think not: it's critical that we as editors see what our readers see. That's the only way we'll manage date formats well on WP. Did you see the pie graph? Tony   (talk)  04:49, 9 September 2008 (UTC)

Thank you for your comments on the RFC; they're the most relevant ones. Most others seem to think the RFC was an accusation that Tony1 was being uncivil or had to do with date autoformatting itself, neither of which is the case. I happen to like date autoformatting, even the links to dates (which I personally find very useful; I've never understood the problem with "overlinking" myself) but if the consensus is to eliminate date autoformatting as a feature then I think it should simply be turned off, rather than this back-door approach of manually unlinking all the dates. Once the unlinking stops, I think (hope) that the conversation can become more civil and perhaps a true consensus (drawing from all corners of the Wikipedia community) can be reached, and a sensible plan of action presented to the Wikipedia system administrators so that date autoformatting can either be disabled or fixed. Anyway, thanks again. --UC_Bill (talk) 20:49, 9 September 2008 (UTC)

No problem
I knew I was planning on heading towards Hunt Valley after visiting Harborplace. Then I discovered that NBAC was on the route. So it all worked out. --Coolcaesar (talk) 03:05, 14 September 2008 (UTC)

Notice on Taffeh
This is to let you know that a flickr image holder agreed to allow this first rate picture of the building to be placed on Commons for the Temple of Taffeh article, which you created. Apart from Dendur in NY and Debod in Spain, this was the only WP article in this category without any images. I hope it is acceptable. I find only some people are willing to change the license of an image that they took and uploaded on flickr. Regards, --Leoboudv (talk) 07:06, 15 September 2008 (UTC)
 * You're welcome. A picture says a thousand words sometimes. Regards, --Leoboudv (talk) 19:20, 15 September 2008 (UTC)

Historic House Trust
I love how you changed the format of this, I think it's a lot more user friendly. TravellingCari 02:10, 23 September 2008 (UTC)

Wikis Take Manhattan
WHAT Wikis Take Manhattan is a scavenger hunt and free content photography contest aimed at illustrating Wikipedia and StreetsWiki articles covering sites and street features in Manhattan and across the five boroughs of New York City. The event is based on last year's Wikipedia Takes Manhattan, and has evolved to include StreetsWiki this year as well.

LAST YEAR'S EVENT


 * Wikipedia Takes Manhattan/Spring 2008 (a description of the results, and the uploading party)
 * Commons:Wikipedia Takes Manhattan/Gallery (our cool gallery)

WINNINGS? Prizes include a dinner for three with Wikipedia creator Jimmy Wales at Pure Food & Wine, gift certificates to Bicycle Habitiat and the LimeWire Store, and more!

WHEN The hunt will take place Saturday, September 27th from 1:00pm to 6:30pm, followed by prizes and celebration.

WHO All Wikipedians and non-Wikipedians are invited to participate in team of up to three (no special knowledge is required at all, just a digital camera and a love of the city). Bring a friend (or two)!

REGISTER The proper place to register your team is here. It's also perfectly possible to register on the day of when you get there, but it will be slightly easier for us if you register beforehand.

WHERE Participants can begin the hunt from either of two locations: one at Columbia University (at the sundial on college walk) and one at The Open Planning Project's West Village office. Everyone will end at The Open Planning Project:


 * Wikis Take Manhattan page at The Open Planning Project


 * 349 W. 12th St. #3
 * Between Greenwich & Washington Streets
 * By the 14th St./8th Ave. ACE/L stop

FOR UPDATES

Check out:


 * Wikis Take Manhattan main website

This will have a posting if the event is delayed due to weather or other exigency.

Thanks,
 * Pharos

You can add or remove your name from the New York City Meetups invite list at Meetup/NYC/Invite list. This has been an automated delivery by BrownBot (talk) 00:00, 24 September 2008 (UTC)

new peer review for List of NHLs in NY
Perhaps you could comment and watch Peer review/List of National Historic Landmarks in New York/archive2, where i have asked for a new peer review of List of NHLs in NY. I am hoping that low-key discussion can help address issues raised in the FL review that failed, address other issues suggested but not detailed, and otherwise improve the article for FL renom. doncram (talk) 00:48, 25 September 2008 (UTC)

Wikis Take Manhattan rescheduled for October 4
Wikis Take Manhattan has been rescheduled for next Saturday, October 4, due to the rain predicted for this weekend.. I hope you can make it to the new time, and bring a friend (or two)!--Pharos (talk) 23:28, 25 September 2008 (UTC)

Sidewalk clocks of Manhattan
I think it must have been you who set up multiple pipelinks to red-link Sidewalk clocks of Manhattan from 4 NRHPs within List of Registered Historic Places in Manhattan from 14th to 59th Streets, and perhaps from other NRHPs. That's a good idea. It would help to create that article now. Would you like to? And/or I am curious whether i am surmising correctly. Cheers, doncram (talk) 02:06, 30 September 2008 (UTC)

List of National Monuments of the United States
Hi, you will see that I did a number of edits in the list, after I moved some of the images to Commons (and renamed some of them in the process). And I had to remove one image as it does not show Virgins Islands Coral Reef National Monument, but Reef Bay in the Virgin Islands National Park, right next door. Greetings. --h-stt !?  13:05, 30 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Found a new image of VICR. It's ugly as I had to blow it up, but it will du until one of us gets to the Virgin Islands to take a better image ourselves. How about a holiday in the Caribbean? --h-stt !?  15:45, 30 September 2008 (UTC)

Proposed deletion of 131 Charles Street
A proposed deletion template has been added to the article 131 Charles Street, suggesting that it be deleted according to the proposed deletion process. All contributions are appreciated, but this article may not satisfy Wikipedia's criteria for inclusion, and the deletion notice should explain why (see also "What Wikipedia is not" and Wikipedia's deletion policy). You may prevent the proposed deletion by removing the  notice, but please explain why you disagree with the proposed deletion in your edit summary or on its talk page.

Please consider improving the article to address the issues raised because, even though removing the deletion notice will prevent deletion through the proposed deletion process, the article may still be deleted if it matches any of the speedy deletion criteria or it can be sent to Articles for Deletion, where it may be deleted if consensus to delete is reached. -- BlastOButter42 See  Hear  Speak  21:38, 1 November 2008 (UTC)

DYK for Henry DeLand House
... that the Henry DeLand House has served as a private house, an inn, a speakeasy, a bar, a restaurant and most recently, a catering hall?

User:Ameliorate! (with the !) (talk) 02:21, 2 November 2008 (UTC)

NYC Meetup: You are invited!
In the afternoon, we will hold a session dedicated to meta:Wikimedia New York City activities, finalize and approve bylaws, interact with representatives from the Software Freedom Law Center, and hold salon-style group discussions on Wikipedia and the other Wikimedia projects (see the June meeting's minutes and the September meeting's minutes).

We'll also review our recent Wikis Take Manhattan event, and make preparations for our exciting successor Wikipedia Loves Art! bonanza, being planned with the Brooklyn Museum for February.

In the evening, we'll share dinner and chat at a local restaurant, and (weather permitting) hold a late-night astronomy event at Columbia's telescopes.

You can add or remove your name from the New York City Meetups invite list at Meetup/NYC/Invite list.

To keep up-to-date on local events, you can also join our mailing list. This has been an automated delivery by BrownBot (talk) 22:08, 7 November 2008 (UTC)

Beech-maple forest dyk
Hello! Your submission at the Did You Know nominations page has been reviewed. There still are some issues that may need to be clarified. Please review the comment(s) underneath and respond there as soon as possible. Thank you for contributing to Did You Know! &mdash;Politizer talk / contribs 08:16, 8 December 2008 (UTC)

DYK for Mianus River Gorge
BorgQueen (talk) 20:17, 13 December 2008 (UTC)

template vandalism
Report this at AN/I. My guess is there will be people there who can revert this sort of intricate template vandalism. Daniel Case (talk) 03:11, 14 December 2008 (UTC)

Templates
There is a built in lag in the system on pages where the template is used. So what you were seeing was after the system had regenerated a page to show the vandalism, but before it had regenerated it again to show your revert.  MBisanz  talk 03:34, 14 December 2008 (UTC)

PRODs
Yes, I have been working with and. I suppose that is rather bold, though I've been here a few months (since June) as a registered user; it's just that I haven't been doing all that much until (very) recently. Guess I dropped some of the warning notes.Quantumobserver (talk) 16:14, 26 December 2008 (UTC)

You're invited!
In the afternoon, we will hold a session dedicated to meta:Wikimedia New York City activities, look at our approval by the Chapters Committee, develop ideas for chapter projects at museums and libraries throughout our region, and hold salon-style group discussions on Wikipedia and the other Wikimedia projects (see the November meeting's minutes and the December mini-meetup's minutes).

We'll make preparations for our exciting museum photography Wikipedia Loves Art! February bonanza (on Flickr, on Facebook) with Shelley from the Brooklyn Museum and Alex from the Metropolitan Museum of Art.

We'll also be collecting folks to join our little Wikipedia Takes the Subway adventure which will be held the day after the meeting.

In the evening, we'll share dinner and chat at a local restaurant, and generally enjoy ourselves and kick back.

You can add or remove your name from the New York City Meetups invite list at Meetup/NYC/Invite list.

To keep up-to-date on local events, you can also join our mailing list. This has been an automated delivery by BrownBot (talk) 01:57, 12 January 2009 (UTC)

It is currently in use as a homeless shelter
Thanks for the notification — my Internet here is slow enough that it takes some while to download the pictures, so I didn't bother until after reading your note. I've added a reference for the shelter and improved the wording. Nyttend (talk) 22:40, 19 January 2009 (UTC)
 * Then take it to the NRHP talk page; I see your point. I restored it because the large majority of infoboxes such as this have both listed, and I don't see why we should have inconsistency; as the infobox generator that produces these boxes was designed by a member of WP:NRHP and is used by many of its members, I'm assuming that it's widely accepted.  However, since (as you note) it's rather trivial, I doubt that many people have thought about it a ton.  I myself don't have much of any opinion about it, except to think that (1) all infoboxes for unknown architect/no style listed properties should say both, or (2) all such infoboxes should leave both lines blank.  Nyttend (talk) 22:48, 19 January 2009 (UTC)

Thomas Paine House
Congrats and thanks for all your efforts on this article. I may have more edits later... --Orlady (talk) 03:15, 21 January 2009 (UTC)

NYC Meetup: You're invited!
Join us the evenings of Friday February 6 and Saturday February 7 around Wikipedia Loves Art! museum photography events at the Metropolitan Museum of Art and the Brooklyn Museum.

There will also be a special business meeting on Saturday dedicated to discussing Wikimedia New York City issues with guests from the Wikimedia Foundation.

You can add or remove your name from the New York City Meetups invite list at Meetup/NYC/Invite list.

To keep up-to-date on local events, you can also join our mailing list. This has been automated delivery by BrownBot (talk) 22:16, 31 January 2009 (UTC)

Re:Wrong photo for Pipestone National Monument
Thanks for letting me know! With so many monuments it can be easy to make a mistake. I hope to get it to FL status, so let me know of any other suggestions. Thanks, Reywas92 Talk  01:44, 3 February 2009 (UTC)

List of National Monuments of the United States
Hi! I don't know about you, but I'm really bad at writing prose. I would really appreciate it if you can help me write a good lead for this list. What I've used are National Monument (United States), Antiquities Act, and the ref I've added. Thanks! Reywas92 Talk 23:41, 5 February 2009 (UTC)

Wikipedia Loves Art museum photo weekend
Just wanted to remind you that our events at the Met Museum and the Brooklyn Museum are this weekend. Oh, and I'll be able to update you on our Flickr solution very soon. Thanks.--Pharos (talk) 14:25, 6 February 2009 (UTC)

Note on Egyptian temples
Since you created the article on the Temple of Taffeh, I'll just tell you about 5 articles on the same Egyptian temple subject I created. Many are obscure temples in Nubia but I managed to get permission from flickr owners to place photos for them. I am editing much less on Wikipedia today and may stop but I thought you might be interested in reading them. They are: I hope you like the articles and pictures. Regards, --Leoboudv (talk) 01:45, 10 February 2009 (UTC)
 * Temple_of_Maharraqa
 * Kiosk_of_Qertassi
 * Trajan's Kiosk
 * Temple of Derr
 * Gerf Hussein