User talk:Dramatic/Archive1

THis is an Archive of my talk page covering 2002 - November 2006.

Hello there, welcome to the 'pedia! I hope you like the place and decide to stay. If you need pointers on how we title pages visit Naming conventions or how to format them visit our manual of style. If you have any other questions about the project then check out Help or add a question to the Village pump. BTW, thanks for starting the Banks Peninsula article. Cheers! --maveric149

Re: No Border network: Go here for the copyright violation. -- Zoe

I changed the padding on the James I page. The image no longer overlaps the bullets on the printable version. -- Notheruser 22:30 Apr 12, 2003 (UTC)

Chch to NP, eh?

Thanks for the NZ towns contribution; and here are a couple of my compilations for you to reminisce over:
 * http://zeal.com/category/preview.jhtml?cid=10101750
 * http://zeal.com/category/preview.jhtml?cid=10116232

Kia ora
 * robinp 00:44, 26 Feb 2004 (UTC)

Good addition of "Havelock" :robinp 22:32, 25 Mar 2004 (UTC)

Spirula
I've updated the spirula page and created WikiProject Cephalopods. On Talk:Spirula you mention images of Spirula. Are you still pursuing this? - UtherSRG 15:37, 27 Apr 2004 (UTC)

Leapfrog
Howdy. I've speedy-deleted the leapfrog position article you listed on VfD. For stuff like it (i.e. meets the criteria on Candidates for speedy deletion) you can list it for speedy deletion on Speedy deletions, which cuts the paperwork. -- Finlay McWalter | Talk 01:56, 31 Jul 2004 (UTC)

response to Territorial Authorities template comments
Hey dramatic, thanks for your feedback on my template idea.

I've thought about it, and there's quite a lot of crossover between articles on 'towns' or 'cities' or 'regions', and those on the territorial authorities that cover their respective locations. For example, Southland is not only a geographical article, but also one that talks about the region and the district. Sure I wrote the article, but I've based that style based on others I've seen. Anyone (you, perhaps?) want to create separate articles for the territorial authorities from the geographical articles?

I'm not suggesting you don't, but it'll be quite a mess. What say ye?

If you're going to make changes, I'd appreciate knowing, so I don't cross over with you. :)

In any case, I'm off to sleep soon, so I'll stop my edits for now, while I await your response. :)

(PS: do I know you off GeoCities?)

Thanks, Jonathan Ah Kit 11:30, 8 Aug 2004 (UTC).

Wikipedia:New articles (Australia and New Zealand)
New articles (Australia and New Zealand) has just been created and may be worth the occasional visit if you need inspiration and/or to keep track of what you're adding for us in God's Own Country. Kind regards - Robin Patterson 08:12, 12 Aug 2004 (UTC) (yes, I was "robinp" above)

Hi Dramatic, thanks for expanding the Homer Tunnel article. Its been a while since I was down there, so I was mostly relying on webpages for the info. I used to live in Stratford, how do you like NP? Ppe42 08:49, Oct 6, 2004 (UTC)

Opera and CSS
I am just curious about where you found the percentage (98.7%) of CSS1 that Opera implemented before 2000. It would not surprise me in the least, but I've always had a hard time finding precise statistics on CSS support. More information on how much was (and is) supported by various browsers would be great to have in the CSS article, if you know of a reliable place to find it! -- Wapcaplet 21:53, 27 Oct 2004 (UTC)


 * Your question sent me tracking down the site - it Was Eric Meyer's webreview, no-longer online at http://style.webreview.com (which has been taken over by Dr Dobbs' Journal) but I found some pages via the archive.org wayback machine.

Looks as though I need to correct what I wrote in the article. The version of Opera which scored that rank was 5.0 which came out after MacIE5 (in Dec 2000). Opera 3.6 scored in the high 80's (compared to 38% for NN4 and 67% fir IE5)

Excellent. Yeah, I used Opera from somewhere around 3.0 to 5.0 before switching to Mozilla and Firefox. Opera's CSS support was always good. It'd be fun to see how modern browsers stack up... Hey, I wonder if it's possible to find enough data on CSS support to make a little timeline chart showing how much CSS each one supported through the years. That'd be a fantastic addition to the CSS article. Too bad the webreview data is several years out of date. Could you give me a link to the webreview percentages you found through wayback? I wasn't able to find them by browsing (though there is the compatibility chart, from which approximate data could be collected). -- Wapcaplet 17:26, 28 Oct 2004 (UTC)


 * sure (took me a bit of finding) its at 1.

There is some good "first support" data (also dated) at Brian Wilson's index.ot.css 2 - he's done similar for HTML 2. I have offered to build him a database backend when I have time so that it might be easier to update. Brian is another top CSS/HTML person working at Opera (along with Håkon Wium Lie and Ian Hickson

The Humungous Image Tagging Project
Hi. You've helped with the WikiProject Wiki Syntax, so I thought it worth alerting you to the latest and greatest of Wikipedia fixing project, User:Yann/Untagged Images, which is seeking to put copyright tags on all of the untagged images. There are probably, oh, thirty thousand or so to do (he said, reaching into the air for a large figure). But hey: they're images ... you'll get to see lots of random pretty pictures. That must be better than looking for at at and the the, non? You know you'll love it. best wishes --Tagishsimon (talk)


 * I've come across some of your images, like Image:Wombats in captivity.jpg, that don't have tags, it'd be a great help if you could tag these --nixie 07:41, 10 Dec 2004 (UTC)

Article Licensing
Hi, I've started a drive to get users to multi-license all of their contributions that they've made to either (1) all U.S. state, county, and city articles or (2) all articles, using the Creative Commons Attribution-Share Alike (CC-by-sa) v1.0 and v2.0 Licenses or into the public domain if they prefer. The CC-by-sa license is a true free documentation license that is similar to Wikipedia's license, the GFDL, but it allows other projects, such as WikiTravel, to use our articles. Since you are among the top 2000 Wikipedians by edits, I was wondering if you would be willing to multi-license all of your contributions or at minimum those on the geographic articles. Over 90% of people asked have agreed. For More Information:
 * Multi-Licensing FAQ - Lots of questions answered
 * Multi-Licensing Guide
 * Free the Rambot Articles Project

To allow us to track those users who muli-license their contributions, many users copy and paste the " " template into their user page, but there are other options at Template messages/User namespace. The following examples could also copied and pasted into your user page:


 * Option 1
 * I agree to multi-license all my contributions, with the exception of my user pages, as described below:

OR
 * Option 2
 * I agree to multi-license all my contributions to any U.S. state, county, or city article as described below:

Or if you wanted to place your work into the public domain, you could replace " " with "  ". If you only prefer using the GFDL, I would like to know that too. Please let me know what you think at my talk page. It's important to know either way so no one keeps asking. -- Ram-Man (comment| talk)

Picture Licensing
Hallo is a lovely picture. I've seen it has a tag because you uploaded it without specifically mentioning a license. Was your intention to keep it under the GFDL or to release it to the public domain? Thanks.--Erri4a 15:52, 2 Jan 2005 (UTC)

Shrigley Abduction
Good that you noticed that. It seems I retained the Newgate Calendar date thought my main source was the Jones&Ashby book (which I no longer have in my hands, I'm afraid) - Skysmith 10:01, 7 Mar 2005 (UTC)

New Zealand Places
> [snip] Why are you suddenly moving dozens of New Zealand towns articles when there has long been a concensus that non-ambiguous place names should not have the ", New Zealand" tacked on for ease of use. Can you point to some recent discussion where this was overturned? dramatic 18:01, 26 Apr 2005 (UTC)


 * (Replies interspersed and indented thus.)

"Moving dozens" is a bit of an exaggeration, just the stops along the North Island Main Trunk Railway, and the pages I persoanlly had added. But in principal I see where you are coming from.
 * Sorry for the overreaction, I didn't go beyond the first 50 entries (all in one day) of your user contributions page.

Thanks for contacting me before I did anymore "damage". Please point me to the discussion.
 * The most recent discussion is at New_Zealand_Wikipedians'_notice board, but it has been discussed somewhere before that page existed. (with some discussion pages having dozens of archived pages you need to know some faily exact search terms to find an old discussion).

The basic problem I have is that I have enough of a problem figuring out if the place name is truely unique in New Zealand, without having to check out all the place names in the pacific, never mind the rest of the world.


 * Google is your friend :-) Odds are that if the place name is maori it is unique (the exceptions are mostly like Rangiora which is both a place and a plant.
 * Also notice that Auckland and Christchurch do not have the ', New Zealand' because although there are other places with those names in the world, the New Zealand ones are by far the most significant.

Also I notice that all(?) of the towns in the US are suffixed with their state, even if the name is not ambiguous. eg. Catlettsburg


 * I think that's partly an american cultural thing, partly because the US is too big to expect many people to know the location of town x, and also because such a majority of place names are ambiguous that its easier to be consistent.

It seemed to me that it would be the courteous thing to do to suffix the NZ Town named with ", New Zealand" and if the name was indeed unambiguous leave a redirect to the fully qualified, which later could be turned into a disambiguous page is needed.

So based on this, where is the best place to discuss the issue and find consensus. If there is a democracy here of contributors, then I will argue my case, and volenteer to write the bot suffix all NZ place names with ",New Zealand"


 * so far, our practice has been the opposite: disambiguate only when necessary.
 * Yikes.... I found this out when I couldn't find things. Or when I had a list of names, eg the North Island Main Trunk railway and had to manually find each location, inspite of the list being unambiguous.  It is all rather unproductive.  I would suspect that the disambiguate only came about because the first handful of entries were added easily, and no-one dared rock the boat.

BTW: I have two other issues to discuss that can be discussed in a forum:
 * this there a New Zealand time line somewhere? So then I can put 1874, instead of 1874.


 * That sounds a brilliant idea for a series of articles. I'm not sure whether the format should be 1874, New Zealand or 1874 in New Zealand - Village_pump is a good place to ask such questions.dramatic 10:03, 27 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Taumarunui Kakahi
 * who should I chat to to get [Worldwind] [url]s accepted into wikipedia? eg in:

User:NevilleDNZ Wed Apr 27 08:35:55 SGT 2005
 * BTW, Usernames are case sensitive: NevilleDNZ is different from Nevillednz. Are you aware that the easiest way to sign on a talk page is to type for tildes ( ~ )
 * Nope, that was news to me. I'm still learning things. Let me test :-)
 * Nevillednz 10:39, 27 Apr 2005 (UTC)

User:NevilleDNZ Wed Apr 27 08:35:55 SGT 2005 Examples:
 * [worldwind://goto/world=Earth&lat=-38.93647&lon=175.38455&alt=4987&dir=-0.2 Kakahi Community Hall NASA Satellite Image]
 * [worldwind://goto/world=Earth&lat=-38.93659&lon=175.38451&alt=576&dir=147.8&tilt=78.7 Composite Satellite/Radar Image of Kakahi with Mountains: Ruahehu, Tongarero and Ngarahoe in background]

These images are great... created from a NASA radar imaging database, and can be rotated 360° to view the entire landscape!!!

NevilleDNZTALK? Wed Apr 27 17:50:46 SGT 2005


 * Okay, I've now looked at Worldwind, and you won't be able to link to the images because it is a non-standard protocol - I'm not sure if the mediawiki software knows how to present it. Also, browsers have to have the protocol support added: In Opera this is a simple edit in preferences once you have the software installed. IE is probably automatic, but other browsers unlikely, and worldwind is Windows-only. (Wikipedia has a stronger-than-usual *nix readership). I'm going to have to wait until I have a new hard drive before I can try it! I only have 2GB partitions and most of them are half full!
 * The reason they picked Windows is because the development time was less, and they funded a student to do the work for even less. Someone commented that it would be too tough for OpenGL on Unix... but I am not so sure. (Read: another task on mytodo/wishlist) Nevillednz 10:39, 27 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Suggested solution to one of Nevillednz's questions
Hi Dramatic - User:Nevillednz asked: ''is there a New Zealand time line somewhere? So then I can put 1874, instead of 1874.''


 * Sorry to butt in, but - until such a series of articles is made - why not link it to the main timeline like this 1874 ? You couldn't do it with individual years, because of the way the timeline is arranged, but you could at least link to the decade. Grutness|hello? [[Image:Grutness.jpg|25px|]] 00:41, 29 Apr 2005 (UTC)

2004 in New Zealand

 * Well, as I've only just discovered Neville and as James has already butted in, this seems to be a perfectly good place for me to comment on NZ timeline issues and possibilities:
 * We already have such a "series"; but at this moment it is less than 2 years long: "2004 in New Zealand" being the only complete year.
 * There's another such series, with more years but still far from "complete", on a sister "site" - see mi:2004 and work your way back (and add something while you are there, please!). That has the disadvantage of including material from outside NZ, but we could soon fix that if there was enough incentive!


 * Kia ora koutou. Robin Patterson 12:26, 6 May 2005 (UTC)

World timeline?
I proposed about 18months ago that there should be a world timeline with an article per day, at least for the 20th century onwards. Year articles are either too big or too generalised, and I think there's enough to report each day for a reasonable article. I didn't get much response though. Perhaps it needs to be a separate project: Wikichronology

In the meantime, why don't we create some stubs and work backwards for NZ timeline. SHould it include achievements by New Zealanders overseas (eg NZ military in WWII, sports results?) dramatic 02:22, 7 May 2005 (UTC)

2003 in New Zealand
Thanks for creating that (and so soon!). People have been adding to it. I hadn't noticed it until a few minutes ago. Some of what I wrote an hour ago may therefore be partly discounted. I'll check whether we might want more publicity for the series. Robin Patterson 04:36, 26 Jun 2005 (UTC)

Totara
It's part of a project to move at least some plants over entirely to scientific names; see Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Tree of Life. It helps a lot with indexing at Category:Podocarpaceae in that it groups all species in the genus together. Over 90% of the species in Podocarpaceae don't have any common name at all; to have a small handful indexed separately by common name looks odd. Also, outside of New Zealand, you'd be very hard put to find anyone who has the faintest clue what sort of a thing 'totara' is. The scientific name is more recognisable at least as a scientific name and shows what its congeners are and are not. - MPF 10:37, 28 May 2005 (UTC)

WikiProject Theatre
Hi! This is a note to let you know that I have just established WikiProject Theatre. Please come and join us in building up Wiipedia’s articles relating to theatre! Ganymead 17:35, 28 May 2005 (UTC)

Playing time (Cricket)
Hi Dramatic. I don't think the cut does make the section inaccurate -- in the Cricket article it is a general introduction to playing time and the complexities of slow play restrictions would better be placed in the Playing time (cricket) article, particularly as the Cricket article is already over Wikipedia's size warning limit. Additionally, your edit says that 'play [runs] past the scheduled six hours if that target is not met' which is no longer accurate (for Test matches at least) since the ICC changed the rules. --Ngb 10:25, 4 August 2005 (UTC)

Thanks
Thanks for cleaning up after me in my conversions at Transport in New Zealand. I had done at least one other one similar to that, so I double-checked and I'd gotten the 3,000 ft right there, but had 7,000 instead of 8,000! Gene Nygaard 19:26, 10 October 2005 (UTC)

Bastard!- backup your facts
Dramatic, My Editation of the claytons page regaurding now being sold in woolworths and coles in australia WAS NOT incorrect and was not to be deleted and called "semi-nonsence" the link was relevent as the item can be found (for evidence) on coles homeshopping website and listed as in stock.. if your taking it upon yourself to edit and distort all articles to do with australia and NZ.. please backup your facts or lack of before deleting peoples work.. which.. seems superior to your own
 * Dear anonymous coward. As you will now see on talk:Clayton's, I researched rather thoroughly before deleting your addition rather than fixing it, and found no evidence whatsoever of any beverage product called Clayton's existing since the beginning of the internet era. I look forward to seeing your URL to the product. But please try not to be so offensive when you post it. dramatic 05:22, 3 November 2005 (UTC)

Claytons
Hi, thanks for the updates and moving from Clayton's. My 1980's bottle, (acquired for research purposes!) is half empty so I think it may not be the best one to photograph, maybe I'll lash out sometime and buy a new one for the purpose. I've done some extra tweaks and added a few links too.--Melburnian 16:33, 11 November 2005 (UTC)

Lines under L2 headers
Hi, thanks for the advice. I was not actually serious about this, it’s to do with a dispute over on Wiktionary, where this is common practice. I want these extra lines removed, however Hippietrail said we should wait for comments from Eclecticology because he edits in the classic skin. I just wanted to see how people would react to a request to add them here just because someone wants to edit in the classic skin. You can see the discussion at wikt:Wiktionary:Beer parlour. Gerard Foley 19:40, 28 November 2005 (UTC)

Category:Wikipedians in New Zealand
Hi, You might want to consider adding User NZ res to the top of your user page, which will add you to this category automatically and also add a nice graphic. Onco_p53 00:28, 1 January 2006 (UTC)

Huh?
Not quite sure what you meant to write at New Zealand State Highway network, but you seem to have noted that SH39 is part of SH39. Grutness...wha?  00:54, 10 January 2006 (UTC)

Mt Taranaki
Uploaded to Commons as per your request ... Ppe42 09:28, 23 February 2006 (UTC)

NZ Chapter
Hi There! Welcome to the Wikimedia New Zealand chapter effort, thanks for been interested.

I saw your comment on the talk page of the Draft Constitution and have replied there, I agree wholeheartedly with the points you made.

What do you think of; of having a meeting on IRC one night ( channel #wikimedia-nz) and see who's interested, ideas and anything else we can think of:) ?. Brian | (Talk) 00:34, 18 April 2006 (UTC)

Wanaka Picture
Hello. I've added a picture of Wanaka, which covers a simiar area to one of yours which is currently in the article, but has different colour effects, and is larger when blown up. I don't want to just replace it, as that would be rude :) I've added a note to the Talk:Wanaka page, with two thumbnails for reference, comments there welcome. Regards, MartinRe 21:32, 25 May 2006 (UTC)

The great Theatre vs Theater debate
Some research on the prevalance of the spellings in US: Methodology: Sample from, search term "Theater" - 1600 entries out of 8500 checked. (A-C and N-P). Of these, 650 (40%) used the word theatre in one form or another. (Other entries used cinema, playhouse etc.)


 * There were two instances of "Theatr".
 * Even in large chains such as AMC, there are differences in spelling of individual theatres.
 * I ignored any duplicate listings for the same entity.

dramatic 10:59, 29 June 2006 (UTC)

Dramatic, please allow me take make just the briefest mention of the discussion you and I are engaged in related to the above that might be of interest to other readers who don't frequent that forum, but find your research of interest and would like to hear more. 210.197.240.31 20:38, 29 June 2006 (UTC)

Also, we should give the above some context. The discussion was about what spelling was appropriate as neutral Wikipedia article heading. And I think you've (unwittingly) answered your own question about that, not in the chart above, which is misleading in this regard, but rather in your methodology and what it reveals along the way. When you do a search on either spelling you get the same number of results--that is the same total entries.


 * That would be because the designers of that search function recognised that searchers would use either spelling and it was important to index all results under both spellings.


 * But that isn't the point. The point is that when it comes to category headings, they used the neutral -er spelling, regardless of what spelling the user entered for his search.W.C. 17:11, 10 July 2006 (UTC)

But, and this is the important part, the Verizon headings (for example "Live Theater", that's how Verizon spelled it, although I can see you decided to switch the spelling in your "personalized" chart), regardless of which spelling you entered for your search, are all unmistakably of the same, exact spelling in every single case.
 * It's my talk page so I'll spell the word the only way I have ever spelled it.
 * But it's Verizon's data, and they didn't spell the categroy headings that way--which is simply more evidence that the neutral spelling in the U.S. is -er. That's all I'm pointing out. You failed to point out you switch to the audience, so I felt it necessary to bring up.W.C. 17:11, 10 July 2006 (UTC)

Let there be no doubt about that. (And this is distinct from however the owners of a few thousand businesses or buildings personally wish spell their enterprises.) And the neutral spelling they chose was "theater". There is not even a single case of -re spelling among the neutral headings. See for yourself. They list a dozen different headings in all. None with your spelling.


 * Live Theater (in popular categories)
 * Theater Tickets
 * Live Theater (in Arts & Entertainment)
 * Theater Parties
 * Theater Information Services
 * Theater Tickets
 * Movie Theaters
 * Theater Industry
 * Dinner Theater Restaurants
 * Home Theaters & Entertainment Centers
 * Home Theaters Custom Installation
 * Home Theater Services


 * A directory is consistent and you're surprised? That's not evidence, it is only to be expected.


 * THE KEY POINT: BUILDING NAMES vs. NEUTRAL REFERENCE WORK HEADINGS


 * No surpirse. Just pointing out the prevelance of -er, in neutral headings, which was whole context of our discussions about choice of a heading for the Wikipedia article. Directories serve as a guide for this, better than the names of buildings (i.e., proper nouns) which is what the content of your data mostly draws from. Your conclusions about the tally for building names is useful if we were naming a building which we aren't. We were discussing the heading of a Wikipedia article--a neutral reference work. In that case, the Verizon headings, are much more useful. They show a clear preference for the "theater" as the spelling that shoud be used for a U.S. reference work. W.C. 17:11, 10 July 2006 (UTC)

That's all that really matters in terms of our discussion of the Wikipedia article heading.
 * You, sir, are a manipulator of data and amster builder of straw men. Relying on the fact that if you create enough references no one will go to the bother of checking them all. You have been caught out lying, and in academic circles that would discredit all your work. dramatic 11:08, 10 July 2006 (UTC)
 * Nobody's been caught out doing anything. The evidence is all there for readers to examine and decide for themselves, rather than naively accepting your unreliable charaterization of the discussion. People are more than welcome to check any or all of my references. If you have failed to do so, for even one, I'd suggest this is because you may have realized in advance the evidence cited simply proves you're wrong. W.C. 17:11, 10 July 2006 (UTC)

As for over-all usage, I think I've also discredited your theory that this might be "theatre". You have offered a few thousand instances here which are far outnumbered by the estimated half a billion per year that occur in American newspapers across the nation. W.C. 23:08, 9 July 2006 (UTC)

Dramatic, Please take a look at the Theatre Talk discussion page and the history for your archiving edit. The link to the archive is no longer there and you may have not successfully carried out that edit. Someone may have fixed this by the time you read this message, but I thought I should bring it to your attention for now. W.C. 18:21, 21 July 2006 (UTC)

Papakura
What is so wrong with my Papakura article?


 * (I took the liberty of snipping the entire article pasted in to my talk page - I will reply tonight when I have time) dramatic 03:46, 17 August 2006 (UTC)

William Southgate
Thank you for experimenting with Wikipedia by creating the page William Southgate. Your test worked, and has been or will soon be removed. Please use the sandbox for any other tests you want to do. Take a look at the welcome page if you would like to learn more about contributing to our encyclopedia. --pm_shef 02:39, 20 August 2006 (UTC)
 * Huh. Who'da thunk it. Sorry bout that, I've never seen an instruction like that (to save an empty article) before. No hard feelings. -- pm_shef 03:32, 20 August 2006 (UTC)

Presto and Opera
In article Presto (layout engine) you've added line that Opera 9 use version 4 of Presto engine. I've asked about that and other version relations on Opera forum and they (some of them are Opera developers) were very surprised that such statement is in wikipedia.. and it looks that Presto doesn't have any public versioning. See that forum thread mariuszn3 02:41, 21 September 2006 (UTC)