User talk:DukhanSmoke

Single purpose account
I'd like to inform you that your edit history makes it pretty clear that the account is single-purpose. You may want to read this- WP:SPA Shaad lko (talk) 09:35, 11 February 2012 (UTC)

Peace, Shaad Iko, thank you for referring the page, in a nutshell I understand the principle of Wikipedia is to represent the facts without creating or encouraging conflicts. I agree at the moment my edits seem to be focused on a subject as this is also one of the ways to understand the Wikipedia environment and I can assure you that this focus will be wide spread.

"New editors should be aware that while courtesy and a warm greeting will usually be extended, they may be subject to more scrutiny in the early stages of their editing as other editors attempt to assess how well they adhere to Wikipedia standards."

More scrutiny would only mean Wikipedia's article to be of highest standards. And I fully endeavor and endorse this. Peace (DukhanSmoke (talk) 13:46, 12 February 2012 (UTC))

19 in the Qur'an - improved references, please
Please see the Talk-file for "Sura" ... where we have asked you to please improve your reference system. Regards,DLMcN (talk) 19:29, 12 February 2012 (UTC)
 * We will probably have to cut down that section quite drastically - unless you can rework it in an acceptable manner. It is probably better if you can do it. --DLMcN (talk) 05:02, 20 February 2012 (UTC)

Peace, fully understand your concern, request for 24 hours please. Peace (DukhanSmoke (talk) 17:13, 20 February 2012 (UTC))

Peace, have updated some of the references, will be adding more God Willing to improve further. Peace (DukhanSmoke (talk) 14:13, 21 February 2012 (UTC))


 * We have been discussing this, and it seems that you are at least making progress - Well Done, and Thank You for your efforts ! ... [I have been nominated, incidentally, only to act as your immediate contact, but I do not necessarily make the final decisions]... Your reference 6 in the list in the Talk-File - [i.e., "The Miracle of the Quran", by Dãr Al-'Ilm Lil-Malãyîn] looks acceptable. - Will that be enough for you? However, the other references (as you present them) do not really conform to Wikipedia requirements.... In addition, I have a question regarding your references 7,8,9, 11, 14, 15, 16 and 17 on the main "Sura" page: > Which book exactly does each of those references come from? I ask because that is not at all clear - owing to the fact that you cite more than one text by Rashid Khalifa. --DLMcN (talk) 21:21, 22 February 2012 (UTC)

Peace, thank you for those encouraging words, I will God Willing strive to do better. All these references are from the same book as mentioned in reference 6, Quran: Visual Presentation of the Miracle, Rashad Khalifa Ph.D, ISBN 0-964894-30-2,1982. I only wished to keep the reference section tidy by not including the same references for each item, that is why the phrase in the brackets "(for all Facts herein as referenced)" if you feel appropriate I can include the book reference against each item. Have few more things to discuss God Willing, we can do that on the talk page of the article a little later. Peace (DukhanSmoke (talk) 04:51, 23 February 2012 (UTC))


 * OK then, go ahead and add a short item confirming that Ahmed Deedat discussed the subject, but please qualify that with the fact that Deedat subsequently withdrew his support. I remember that the Gulf News in Dubai published a fairly detailed summary of Deedat's endorsement of Rashad Khalifa, so I might be able to add a reference to that. And, as stated above, you may include your number 6 in the list which you gave in the Talk-File - [i.e., "The Miracle of the Quran", by Dãr Al-'Ilm Lil-Malãyîn] - and you may also mention in passing the fact that the "19 phenomenon" is part of a syllabus taught at Calicut University ... However, I should emphasize that, at this stage, these points just represent my own personal assessment on this issue, so please be prepared for a senior administrator to come in and make further suggestions (and maybe even to overrule me!) --DLMcN (talk) 16:23, 24 February 2012 (UTC)--DLMcN (talk) 16:27, 24 February 2012 (UTC)


 * Dukhan Smoke ... As mentioned, I have been asked by one of the Senior Administrators to look closely at your contribution regarding the number 19 in the Qur'an. Some editors seem concerned [justifiably] that the space it occupies, is out of proportion to its importance. In any event, some of the phenomena you mention do not really seem to be all that "impressive", and can probably be removed.

> For example, this point: "4. The total of the 29 sura numbers where the Quranic Initials occur is 2 + 3 + 7 +...+ 50 + 68 = 822, and 822 + 14 (14 sets of initials]) equals 836, or 19 × 44.[11]" does seem rather 'convoluted' and contrived - such that sceptics could easily remain unconvinced by it ...

... and similarly the next one, namely: "5. 14 different Arabic letters, form 14 different sets of Quranic Initials (such as A.L.M. of 2:1), and prefix 29 suras. These numbers add up to 14 + 14 + 29 = 57 = 19 × 3.[12]".

I am inclined to suggest that it might be better, instead, to focus on points numbers 4 to 9 in your first set of comments in the Talk-File, namely:

... 4. Sura 96, first in the chronological sequence, consists of 19 verses.http://www.masjidtucson.org/publications/books/vp/fact05.PDF

... 5. Sura 96 consists of 304 Arabic letters, and 304 equals 19 x 16.http://www.masjidtucson.org/quran/miracle/simplefacts_tables_sura96.html

... 6. The famous first revelation (96:1-5) consists of 19 words.http://www.masjidtucson.org/publications/books/vp/fact03.PDF

... 7. This 19-worded first revelation consists of 76 letters 19 x 4.http://www.masjidtucson.org/publications/books/vp/fact04.PDF

... 8. The last revelation (Sura 110) consists of 19 words.http://www.masjidtucson.org/publications/books/vp/fact08.PDF

... 9. The first verse of the last revelation (110:1) consists of 19 letters.http://www.masjidtucson.org/publications/books/vp/fact09.PDF

Do you have an e-mail address where we could correspond privately? Mine is DLMcN@yahoo.com --DLMcN (talk) 07:42, 28 February 2012 (UTC)

Peace, understand the concerns, if that is the case let us have the one that Wikipedia administrators are comfortable with, and those where God willing I could add more later which I hope will impress them. My email is *******. Peace (DukhanSmoke (talk) 14:41, 28 February 2012 (UTC))

Suggestions
OK then, I would like to recommend that you replace your present points 4 to 8 by some or all of the following points:

4. Sura 96, first in the chronological sequence, consists of 19 verses.http://www.masjidtucson.org/publications/books/vp/fact05.PDF

5. Sura 96 consists of 304 Arabic letters, and 304 equals 19 x 16.http://www.masjidtucson.org/quran/miracle/simplefacts_tables_sura96.html

6. The famous first revelation (96:1-5) consists of 19 words.http://www.masjidtucson.org/publications/books/vp/fact03.PDF

7. This 19-worded first revelation consists of 76 letters 19 x 4.http://www.masjidtucson.org/publications/books/vp/fact04.PDF

8. The last revelation (Sura 110) consists of 19 words.http://www.masjidtucson.org/publications/books/vp/fact08.PDF

9. The first verse of the last revelation (110:1) consists of 19 letters.http://www.masjidtucson.org/publications/books/vp/fact09.PDF ....

They^ should of course be accompanied by references either to "Rashad Khalifa 1982" (similar to the way in which I referred to his book when I revised the text recently) - or else to other books which may be regarded as reliable sources.

In fact, many of those^ points listed above are presently included in the item which you are now calling "Point Number 8".

Actually, those^ points which (here, above^) are numbered 4 to 7 should be placed first in your list, I believe - because they are the most impressive ones, i.e., the most clear-cut examples. Your presently listed points 1 to 3 would then get pushed down to the bottom of the list - or they could even be left out entirely.

It is probably best if you carry out those changes? - unless you have a very strong preference that I should do it...

Regards, --DLMcN (talk) 17:56, 28 February 2012 (UTC)

Peace, please go ahead, I would rather prefer you do the changes and let me know if I could be of any assistance. To seek your suggestions I will be God Willing sending a mail to your personal email ID. Peace (DukhanSmoke (talk) 15:19, 29 February 2012 (UTC))