User talk:EchidnaLives/Archive 7

Kanga (Performer) page
Hi mr. EchidnaLives,

You added a comment on my first Wikipedia Draft about KANGA (Performer), related to a redirect page KANGAKult (which I also created), and that I tried to convert to a Draft page instead. This was meant to add the information, that although KANGAKult is an existing name used by KANGA (the performer), the real promotional name is not KANGAKult but KANGA. Apparently (as I learned through your comment) my action did not convert the draft, but generated a new page in the mainspace. I had not noticed the error. I must reject your 'accusation' (more or less) telling me "You can't circumnavigate the system with this". This has never been the purpose, and I am sorry for the error. The page https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Redirect did not provide any working solution to edit it, then I found somewhere else that I could add "redirect=no", this worked, but I could not see the "Edit" button which was promised, there was a "Create" button, which I then interpreted as "replace the draft redirect by a new, real draft page".

Anyway, I also regret that, apparently because you assumed bad intent on my part, you rejected the KANGA (Performer) page, as the only indicted reason was about the redirect error in the other page. Again, I apologize for that mistake, and I can only say that I had no bad intent on my mind. And frankly, I think I'm going to give up this attempt to create a page about this great performer, in spite of the many hours I've spent on it already.

I have been reading all the pages linked in the first rejection info block, I cannot find serious problems, secondary sources are all ok in my opinion, and a plethora of other things. Take the "independent pages" rule: It seems obvious that reviews will be written by music lovers, not by scientists or philosophers. I have been a reader of Wikipedia for many years (and I do read a lot of scientific papers too), so I know about all the obvious criteria, but without at least some more concrete indications where the problem is, I fear that I will not be able to get through this. I also have a hard time understanding that one can publish an article about KangaROOS sneakers (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/KangaRoos) while it seems almost impossible to get an article published about Lillian Kanga Duchamp who has been hailed as a great talent by famous people in the music scene. My interest meanwhile was triggered by the 'philosophic' views of this young lady, which reminded me of other artists in the Underground scene - which has my interest because I try to understand the worldviews behind it.

Thanks for reading me (if you didn't give up halfway at least). Bernard.Libbrecht (talk) 10:07, 15 December 2022 (UTC)


 * @Bernard.Libbrecht Thank you for reaching out. Many new content creators give up after seeing that their draft has been declined, instead of asking the help desk or the people who reviewed their drafts.
 * First, let's go over the point of Articles for Creation. The main idea is simple. Accept articles that would survive a deletion discussion. Basically, if the reviewer feels like the article would be deleted at a venue like Articles for Deletion, that's when we decline. You have put lots of work into this draft. Because of this, I feel compelled to give you an in depth response to what you have brought up. However, I feel that at the moment it would be deleted. Keep in mind, every reviewer is different. It's possible that some could have accepted, some may of declined (like I did).
 * Now, I can assure you, I never assumed bad intent. I didn't consider the mainspace redirect at all while reviewing the article, and apologise that you felt like that.
 * Allow me to explain to you why I declined it.
 * First, let's go over the notability and referencing of the draft:
 * The referencing of the draft is mostly non-independent. Interviews and the like are considered non-reliable and non-independent as they contain the direct views of the subject, usually not what you want in citation.
 * https://www.musicianwave.com/what-is-underground-music/ - Not relevant to the article and can not contribute to notability.
 * https://post-punk.com/dark-electronic-music-artist-kanga-weaves-a-romantic-daydream-between-two-lovers-in-moscow/ - This review(?) is non neutral, as it includes phrases such as "The stunning video for Moscow, directed by MJ Bernier, is a gorgeously filmed romantic daydream of a time shared between two lovers" Note the bolded words. In this case, it is considered unreliable and can't contribute to notability.
 * https://www.plattentests.de/rezi.php?show=17600 - I cannot speak German, so must go off translations. This is also a review. However, it does appear to be neutral. I'm going to say that this is okay and can partially contribute to notability.
 * https://www.revolvermag.com/music/hear-kanga-new-album-you-and-i-will-never-die - This opinion on this source is going to be different depending on the person almost every time. On one hand, it appears to be an article from a reliable source that is mentioning the performer. On the other hand, it seems like it's main purpose is to promote the singer and their music, which is unsuitable as a reference. With respect to other opinions, I believe this is not appropriate as a source, but just barely.
 * https://soundcloud.com/coldwavessoundcheck/512-kanga - Soundcloud is self published, and can not contribute. Also, the same thing about interviews from above. However, the music sounds really good (i might have to check this artist out.)
 * https://www.neondystopia.com/cyberpunk-music/beneath-red-light-glitch-mode-decode-tour/ - While interesting, it appears to be written by someone associated with them, and can not contribute to notability.
 * Overall, this is 1 reliable, independent and in-depth reference. This probably needs 1 more source meeting all the criteria to be considered notable.
 * This isn't the only thing with the article. I will fix some things, and will tag some of the others once I have sent this reply like. This is to meet our Manual of Style guidelines and other guidelines/policies such as wp:Neutral point of view. I reccommend you fix some of these things before resubmitting the article.
 * Now, onto the other issue.
 * So, as it seems you are aware, we do not create redirects or pages linking to drafts from articles. This is circumnavigating the established processes we have here, and pages like these are often deleted. But, you have explained that this was a mistake. Therefore, there's not much to do here. I apologise for the inconvenience.
 * Hopefully this clears it all up. If you have any questions, feel free to ask me, or for a faster response, head to the Help Desk or ask at the IRC Help channel. Thanks, echidnaLives  -  talk  -  edits  11:35, 15 December 2022 (UTC).
 * Also, as I said, I listened to some of their music and wow is it good! I might have to start listening to some of this! Just so you know, it's getting late here in Australia so I'm going to be heading to bed soon. If you have any general questions within the next 8-10 hours, might be best to ask at the other places I mentioned. Thanks, echidnaLives  -  talk  -  edits  11:36, 15 December 2022 (UTC)
 * I wanted to thank you for your effort to explain what's missing in te new page (the insufficient quality of the references, etc). This sort of information is hard to retrieve from the referred Wikipedia pages to be honest - maybe it is there, but most WP info on editing/creation subjects must be found somewhere on miles-long pages containing a depressing amount of "over the top" information, which makes it a tough job. Anyway, your suggestions are helpful. A solution is probably not possible, given that there is no more info on the web, and only 1 single link had some real value as far as you could see. I'll see if I can go along with the additional hints. Thx. Bernard.Libbrecht (talk) 15:40, 17 December 2022 (UTC)

"Densiometer" listed at Redirects for discussion
An editor has identified a potential problem with the redirect Densiometer and has thus listed it for discussion. This discussion will occur at until a consensus is reached, and anyone, including you, is welcome to contribute to the discussion. Second Sender (talk) 17:34, 17 December 2022 (UTC)

I am trying to improve the draft Draft:Seven News Gold Coast by including information from the Seven News article
I am currently trying to improve the draft Draft:Seven News Gold Coast by including information from the Seven News article. Can you please review this draft in a week. From Bas. Bassie f (talk) 21:07, 17 December 2022 (UTC)


 * Hello. I'll have a look soon. Thanks, echidnaLives  -  talk  -  edits  23:38, 17 December 2022 (UTC).

Slave maker ant
I adequately explained the edit and i will continue to edit said article. Woke supremacist nonsense has no place in academia, the suggestion the name "slave maker" makes black people like myself less likely to study ants is absurd. 70.31.24.18 (talk) 03:46, 18 December 2022 (UTC)


 * Just saying it's "Woke supremacist nonsense" doesn't help anyone. You need to stop adding it back. That's called edit warring and isn't ok. You need to discuss on the talk page before continuing. Thank you, echidnaLives  -  talk  -  edits  03:51, 18 December 2022 (UTC).
 * It is woke supremacist nonsense, the sources posted were garbage and ridiculous. Im tired of white people telling me blacks arent emotionally intelligent enough to study something because of "language' stop it! Its demeaning, its belittling and its racist. 70.31.24.18 (talk) 03:55, 18 December 2022 (UTC)
 * You needed to explain that in the edit summary. Discuss it on the talk page. Stop making these accusations of people being "racist" or it could be considered a personal attack. echidnaLives  -  talk  -  edits  04:01, 18 December 2022 (UTC)

Move of SNY
Thank you for completing to the move of Sportsnet New York to SNY. Unfortunately you failed to move the Talk page. I can't because there is already an existing redirect. Esolo5002 (talk) 22:03, 18 December 2022 (UTC)


 * Thanks @Esolo5002 for letting me know, I've moved the talk page to Talk:SNY. Let me know if there's any further issues. echidnaLives  -  talk  -  edits  22:11, 18 December 2022 (UTC)

Roland Desainis
Would you want to upgrade the page from a WP:PROD to a WP:CSD? I believe that the page qualifies for speedy deletion. TheManInTheBlackHat  (Talk)  00:59, 19 December 2022 (UTC)


 * @TheManInTheBlackHat I did certainly think about it, but A7 should be used when they can't make a credible claim of significance. I think that having a "short stint with The Saints Band" (who have an article) might just be enough to get over this line. Although, I wouldn't object to speedy deletion. Thanks, echidnaLives  -  talk  -  edits  01:08, 19 December 2022 (UTC).

Speedy deletion nomination of Category:Hefty Records albums


A tag has been placed on Category:Hefty Records albums indicating that it is currently empty, and is not a disambiguation category, a category redirect, a featured topics category, under discussion at Categories for discussion, or a project category that by its nature may become empty on occasion. If it remains empty for seven days or more, it may be deleted under section C1 of the criteria for speedy deletion.

If you think this page should not be deleted for this reason you may contest the nomination by visiting the page and clicking the button labelled "Contest this speedy deletion". This will give you the opportunity to explain why you believe the page should not be deleted. Please do not remove the speedy deletion tag from the page yourself. Liz Read! Talk! 01:33, 19 December 2022 (UTC)