User talk:Editor at Large/Archives/December 2006/3

Have a good Holiday!
Hi. Just wanted to wish you a happy festive season, and Merry Christmas. I hope that you have an excellent new year. Thank you for all that you do in Wikipedia and Esperanza. You are a really generous and nice person. As for a gift, I thought a nebula would be appropriate. Best wishes and once again, happy holidays! Jam 01 09:16, 22 December 2006 (UTC)

Merry Christmas!
♥ Fr  ed  il  22:19, 22 December 2006 (UTC)
 * What a beautiful poem. Too bad he left... 69.158.54.163 21:45, 30 December 2006 (UTC)

Happy Holidays!
thumb|left|Haven't heard from you for some time, so have a present to spread some holiday cheer. [[User:Bibliomaniac15| bibliomaniac 1  5  22:52, 23 December 2006 (UTC)]]

Merry Christmas Day!
I'm surprised no-one has posted on your talk today (!). Anyway, I hope you're doing alright, and I give you and Kyoko, Elara, Peter, etc best wishes :) Will (Because you're filthy, ooh, and I'm gorgeous)Merry Christmas! 18:53, 25 December 2006 (UTC)

Think your finished opening presents?
Not yet! Check your email! ^_^  Cheers, ✎  Peter M Dodge  (  Talk to Me  &bull;  Neutrality Project  ) 22:19, 25 December 2006 (UTC)

why I chose to leave Esperanza
Hi Ayelie, I thought it best that I told you this myself rather than have you find out from some third party. Some parts of this message were previously used on my user page or on various talk pages.

I decided to leave Esperanza because of all of the discussions about how to overhaul it, as well as the numerous polls, and the general feeling that people would rather talk about bureaucratic details about how they should hypothetically offer help rather than provide any actual support. Reading and rereading the overhaul discussion is only depressing me more, making what is already a difficult time of the year for me even worse. Sometimes I even wonder if it was a mistake for me to leave the hospital. For sake of my own health, I've decided to abstain from any further discussions about how to remake Esperanza, and furthermore, to withdraw my membership.

I still think that there are many kind and decent people who are members of Esperanza, such as yourself, but I now feel that their compassionate nature is essentially unrelated to their membership in Esperanza. Several comments in the recent MfD made me realise that membership in the group is no guarantee of kindness and civility, and also I've found that these qualities are found among EA and non-EA Wikipedians alike.

Esperanza is supposed to promote hope, but for me, it only made me lose hope.

The previous form of Esperanza, with its barnstar brigade, its coffee lounge, and other programs, may not have been as integrated with the rest of Wikipedia as it could have been, but at least it didn't seem to harm anybody either. The recent MfD and the current attempts to overhaul Esperanza only added to my stress and made me want to avoid reading anything related to the organisation.

The current form of Esperanza feels as if it offers nothing more than bickering and straw polls, with no place for community, and no place for hope. I feel partially responsible for this, because I tried so hard to make Esperanza fit in better with Wikipedia as a whole, and now it feels as if Esperanza is neither encyclopedic, nor helpful to others. Knowing that I had some part in its transformation only makes me feel worse.

I still believe in Esperanza's ideals, or what I thought were its ideals. I might rejoin it, someday, if it can get its act together without so many discussions and polls, but it Esperanza wants to reform itself, it will have to do it without me.

I'm deeply sorry, and I feel very heartbroken about everything in my life right now. -- Kyoko 23:43, 25 December 2006 (UTC)


 * You stay strong hun, even if the organization has forgotten those ideals, they live on in the hearts and minds of people like you and I. Never forget that.  There is always hope.  ✎  Peter M Dodge  (  Talk to Me  &bull;  Neutrality Project  ) 23:58, 25 December 2006 (UTC)
 * Well said. Very well said. ♥ Fr  ed  il  00:03, 26 December 2006 (UTC)
 * Thanks Ayelie, for all your support. It gratifies me to no end to know that you aren't disappointed by my decision to leave Esperanza. I'm very sad that it has come to this, and I don't want to hurt the feelings of the many good people who belong to it, especially you, but it's gotten to the point where I find it painful to even look at the EA pages... and yet I feel compelled to read them all the same.


 * User:Ed mentioned on the Esperanza talk page had a message about EA members leaving, so I looked at the edit history of the Esperanza membership list, and I learned that such formerly prominent members as The Halo and Titoxd (both former members of the AC) have also left. Despite Ed's message about members leaving, nobody has said a thing. It's as if nobody even cares, and the people who would remake Esperanza would much rather debate charter details than stop and ask why people are leaving. It's all very sad.


 * I hope that you're doing better, and please tell me if you're not. I might not respond immediately, but I will respond. You're in my thoughts and prayers. Thanks again, and all my love, -- Kyoko 07:23, 26 December 2006 (UTC)
 * In response to these comments, I am also appalled at the poor actions of the Esperanza community. I, too, have left Esperanza today, leaving a message on WT:EA. In addition, as of January 1, 2006, Natalya will not be EA's Admin Gen. These are the exact words I left on Esperanza's talk page, shortly after Natalya left her message:

"Unfortunately, I will no longer be a member of Esperanza. I have been debating whether to leave since last night. This was a hard decision to make, but I feel that I could no longer be a part of this organization.

This organization was dedicated to the improvement of the Wikipedia community. Since the first day I added my name to the members' list, I have seen no overall effect on the rest of Wikipedia. Our efforts have only been centered on the members of Esperanza. In no way have I seen a successful organizational effort to reach out to the rest of the Wikipedian community.

During the MfD, as most of you know, there were many votes to "delete" Esperanza. I voted "keep", which I now realize was not the best vote to make. The delete voters were actually trying to help all of EA's members, seeing the faults with our community. We have remained blind to the cries of our fellow editors regarding the problems Esperanza's been having since the past few months.

Since the MfD, the overall community has weakened. In several different places were effors to revive Esperanza. Decisions have never been made. The AC has participated in Esperanza a little bit less than usual (which I understand to be due to numerous Wikibreaks). Less Esperanzians have been giving Happy Birthday wishes to its members. Face it, we have failed Esperanza. More than that, we have failed the Wikipedian community. (Note that I say "we", I feel that I am guilty of not carrying out EA's ideals).

Please do not misinterpret this long speech that I'm giving. I fully support the goals and ideals of Esperanza. There have been several exceptional non-Esperanza-affiliated editors I've seen that promote Wikilove in the best possible way. I have seen many respected members of Esperanza that fulfill the goals of Esperanza to their highest limits. Unfortunately, these respected members, noticing the flaws of this bureaucratical organization, have listened to those non-Esperanzians who supported the MfD, and left. Esperanza's best influential editors are leaving one by one, our actively participating members slowly decreasing. Our member population will get lower, and lower, and lower...

...until there were none
 * Above all else in this situation, I wish you a Happy Holidays!--Ed  ¿Cómo estás? Reviews? 17:34, 28 December 2006 (UTC)

I have left as well
Instead of spamming everyone's talk pages, I'll just leave a note here; I know anyone who would be interested will likely find it.

I decided to leave Esperanza as well. I had to distance myself from EA shortly after the MfD closed for personal reasons, and have not paid attention to anything that has occured since. The odd times I have dropped in have done nothing to boost my confidence in the organization. In Kyoko's departing statement she said "I now feel that their compassionate nature is essentially unrelated to their membership in Esperanza" ... this made me think about why I joined Esperanza to begin with. I happened upon the page by clicking someone's green e, and liked the idea of an organization devoted to helping people. It got me started in the community, but I do not think that belonging to Esperanza is serving a purpose any longer.

To all those who have left already, will leave in the future, or who are deciding to stay, I wish you all the best with your decision. I know that the ultimate ideals of Esperanza -- helping people and creating a sense of community -- can be upheld by us all without having to be done through an organisation.

— E ditor at  L arge  ( speak )  00:46, 29 December 2006 (UTC)