User talk:El cid, el campeador/Archive 5

New Page Review newsletter July-August 2019


Hello ,

More new features are being added to the feed, including the important red alert for previously deleted pages. This will only work if it is selected in your filters. Best is to 'select all'. Do take a moment to check out all the new features if you have not already done so. If anything is not working as it should, please let us know at NPR. There is now also a live queue of AfC submissions in the New Pages Feed. Feel free to review AfCs, but bear in mind that NPP is an official process and policy and is more important. Articles are still not always being checked thoroughly enough. If you are not sure what to do, leave the article for a more experienced reviewer. Please be on the alert for any incongruities in patrolling and help your colleagues where possible; report patrollers and autopatrolled article creators who are ostensibly undeclared paid editors. The displayed ORES alerts offer a greater 'at-a-glance' overview, but the new challenges in detecting unwanted new content and sub-standard reviewing do not necessarily make patrolling any easier, nevertheless the work may have a renewed interest factor of a different kind. A vibrant community of reviewers is always ready to help at NPR. The backlog is still far too high at between 7,000 and 8,000. Of around 700 user rights holders, 80% of the reviewing is being done by just TWO users. In the light of more and more subtle advertising and undeclared paid editing, New Page Reviewing is becoming more critical than ever. NPR is triage, it is not a clean up clinic. This move feature is not limited to bios so  you may have to slightly re-edit the text in the template before you save the move. Anything that is not fit for mainspace but which might have some promise can be draftified - particularly very poor English and machine and other low quality translations. Remember to use the message feature if you are just tagging an article for maintenance rather than deletion. Otherwise articles are likely to remain perma-tagged. Many creators are SPA and have no intention of returning to Wikipedia. Use the feature too for leaving a friendly note note for  the author of a first article you found well made or interesting. Many have told us they find such comments particularly welcoming and encouraging. Admins are now taking advantage of the new time-limited user rights feature. If you have recently been accorded NPR, do check your user rights to see if this affects you. Depending on your user account preferences, you may receive automated notifications of your rights changes. Requests for permissions are not mini-RfAs. Helpful comments are welcome if absolutely necessary, but the bot does a lot of the work and the final decision is reserved for admins who do thorough research anyway. School and academic holidays will begin soon in various places around the Western world. Be on the lookout for the usual increase in hoax, attack, and other junk pages.
 * WMF at work on NPP Improvements
 * QUALITY of REVIEWING
 * Backlog
 * Move to draft
 * Notifying users
 * PERM
 * Other news

Our next newsletter might be announcing details of a possible election for co-ordinators of NPR. If you think you have what it takes to micro manage NPR, take a look at New Page Review Coordinators - it's a job that requires a lot of time and dedication.

Stay up to date with even more news – subscribe to The Signpost. Go here to remove your name if you wish to opt-out of future mailings. MediaWiki message delivery (talk) 04:38, 30 June 2019 (UTC)

Re: Yoke lutes
Hi, the difference between the two pages is that one of them refers to a class of instrument ("yoke lutes", "lyre family instruments", or - commonly - "lyres"), and the other one refers to a single instrument ("lyre"). Of course the class is named after the instrument, but they are different concepts. You can see for example two different items on Wikidata: and.

Lyre is a specific Ancient Greek instrument that belong to yoke lutes class, so obviously lyre is a lyre family instrument. But there are several other different instruments, always belonging to the yoke lutes class, that aren't a lyre. --BohemianRhapsody (talk) 13:51, 3 July 2019 (UTC)

Please comment on Wikipedia:Village pump (proposals)
The feedback request service is asking for participation in this request for comment on Wikipedia:Village pump (proposals). Legobot (talk) 04:24, 16 July 2019 (UTC)

Please comment on Talk:Alt-right
The feedback request service is asking for participation in this request for comment on Talk:Alt-right. Legobot (talk) 04:25, 16 August 2019 (UTC)

Speedy deletion declined: La Yekthar
Hello El cid, el campeador. I am just letting you know that I declined the speedy deletion of La Yekthar, a page you tagged for speedy deletion, because of the following concern: created by notable person, consider merging to his article. Thank you. So Why  07:21, 30 August 2019 (UTC)

Community Insights Survey
Share your experience in this survey

Hi ,

The Wikimedia Foundation is asking for your feedback in a survey about your experience with and Wikimedia. The purpose of this survey is to learn how well the Foundation is supporting your work on wiki and how we can change or improve things in the future. The opinions you share will directly affect the current and future work of the Wikimedia Foundation.

Please take 15 to 25 minutes to give your feedback through this survey. It is available in various languages.

This survey is hosted by a third-party and governed by this privacy statement (in English).

Find more information about this project. [mailto:surveys@wikimedia.org Email us] if you have any questions, or if you don't want to receive future messages about taking this survey.

Sincerely, RMaung (WMF) 16:36, 10 September 2019 (UTC)

New Page Review newsletter September-October 2019
Hello ,

Instead of reaching a magic 300 as it once did last year, the backlog approaching 6,000 is still far too high. An effort is also needed to ensure that older unsuitable older pages at the back of the queue do not get automatically indexed for Google.
 * Backlog

A proposal is taking place here to confirm a nominated user as Coordinator of NPR.
 * Coordinator

Why I Hate Speedy Deleters, a 2008 essay by long since retired, is still as valid today. Those of us who patrol large numbers of new pages can be forgiven for  making  the occasional  mistake while  others can learn from  their 'beginner' errors. Worth reading.
 * This month's refresher course

Do bear in mind that articles in the feed showing the trash can icon (you will need to have 'Nominated for deletion' enabled for this in your filters) may have been tagged by inexperienced or non NPR rights holders using Twinkle. They require your further verification.
 * Deletion tags

Please be sure to look for the tell-tale signs of undisclosed paid editing. Contact the creator if appropriate, and submit the issue to WP:COIN if necessary. WMF policy requires paid editors to connect to their adverts.
 * Paid editing


 * Subject-specific notability guidelines' (SNG). Alternatives to deletion
 * Reviewers are requested to familiarise themselves once more with notability guidelines for organisations and companies.
 * Blank-and-Redirect is a solution anchored in policy. Please consider this alternative before PRODing or CSD. Note however, that users will often revert or usurp redirects to re-create deleted articles. Do regularly patrol the redirects in the feed.

Regular reviewers will appreciate the most recent  enhancements to  the New Pages Feed and  features in the Curation  tool, and there are still more to  come. Due to the wealth  of information  now displayed by  ORES, reviewers are strongly  encouraged to  use the system now rather than Twinkle; it  will  also  correctly  populate the logs.
 * Not English
 * A common issue: Pages not in English or poor, unattributed machine translations should not reside in main space even if they are stubs. Please ensure you are familiar with WP:NPPNE. Check in Google for the language and content, and if they do have potential, tag as required, then move to draft. Modify the text of the template as appropriate before sending it.
 * Tools

Stub sorting, by SD0001: A new script is available for adding/removing stub tags. See User:SD0001/StubSorter.js, It features a simple HotCat-style dynamic search field. Many of the reviewers who are using it are finding it an improvement upon other available tools.

Assessment: The script at User:Evad37/rater makes the addition of Wikiproject templates extremely easy. New page creators rarely do this. Reviewers are not obliged to make these edits but they only take a few seconds. They can use the Curation message system to let the creator know what they have done.

is now patrolling certain categories of uncontroversial redirects. Curious? Check out its patrol log.

Go here to remove your name if you wish to opt-out of future mailings. MediaWiki message delivery (talk) 22:15, 11 September 2019 (UTC)

Please comment on Talk:People's Mujahedin of Iran
The feedback request service is asking for participation in this request for comment on Talk:People's Mujahedin of Iran. Legobot (talk) 04:25, 15 September 2019 (UTC)

Reminder: Community Insights Survey
Share your experience in this survey

Hi ,

A couple of weeks ago, we invited you to take the Community Insights Survey. It is the Wikimedia Foundation’s annual survey of our global communities. We want to learn how well we support your work on wiki. We are 10% towards our goal for participation. If you have not already taken the survey, you can help us reach our goal! Your voice matters to us.

Please take 15 to 25 minutes to give your feedback through this survey. It is available in various languages.

This survey is hosted by a third-party and governed by this privacy statement (in English).

Find more information about this project. [mailto:surveys@wikimedia.org Email us] if you have any questions, or if you don't want to receive future messages about taking this survey.

Sincerely, RMaung (WMF) 15:38, 20 September 2019 (UTC)

A barnstar for you!

 * thank you! I very much appreciate it :-) ‡ Єl Cid of ᐺalencia  ᐐT₳LKᐬ  12:51, 30 September 2019 (UTC)

Reminder: Community Insights Survey
Share your experience in this survey

Hi ,

There are only a few weeks left to take the Community Insights Survey! We are 30% towards our goal for participation. If you have not already taken the survey, you can help us reach our goal! With this poll, the Wikimedia Foundation gathers feedback on how well we support your work on wiki. It only takes 15-25 minutes to complete, and it has a direct impact on the support we provide.

Please take 15 to 25 minutes to give your feedback through this survey. It is available in various languages.

This survey is hosted by a third-party and governed by this privacy statement (in English).

Find more information about this project. [mailto:surveys@wikimedia.org Email us] if you have any questions, or if you don't want to receive future messages about taking this survey.

Sincerely, RMaung (WMF) 20:39, 3 October 2019 (UTC)

Please comment on Talk:Right-wing populism
The feedback request service is asking for participation in this request for comment on Talk:Right-wing populism. Legobot (talk) 04:24, 16 October 2019 (UTC)

Reverting a redirect
Hello, El cid, el campeado. You had redirected this page Jethalal Gada a few days ago. I read the reason for why you did so, but can I complete the article and then I will tag you and if deemed fit to be redirected again, you may do so. Prat1212 (talk) 14:50, 21 October 2019 (UTC)

Orphaned non-free image File:Killing Commendatore by Haruki Murakami - Cover.png
Thanks for uploading File:Killing Commendatore by Haruki Murakami - Cover.png. The image description page currently specifies that the image is non-free and may only be used on Wikipedia under a claim of fair use. However, the image is currently not used in any articles on Wikipedia. If the image was previously in an article, please go to the article and see why it was removed. You may add it back if you think that that will be useful. However, please note that images for which a replacement could be created are not acceptable for use on Wikipedia (see our policy for non-free media).

Note that any non-free images not used in any articles will be deleted after seven days, as described in section F5 of the criteria for speedy deletion. Thank you. --B-bot (talk) 17:37, 28 October 2019 (UTC)

New Page Review newsletter November 2019
Hello ,

This newsletter comes a little earlier than usual because the backlog is rising again and the holidays are coming very soon. There are now holders of the New Page Reviewer flag! Most of you requested the user right to be able to do something about the huge backlog but it's still roughly less than 10% doing 90% of the work. Now it's time for action. Exactly one year ago there were 'only' 3,650 unreviewed articles, now we will soon be approaching 7,000 despite the growing number of requests for the NPR user right. If each reviewer soon does only 2 reviews a day over five days, the backlog will be down to zero and the daily input can then be processed by every reviewer doing only 1 review every 2 days - that's only a few minutes work on the bus on the way to the office or to class! Let's get this over and done with in time to relax for the holidays. Want to join? Consider adding the NPP Pledge userbox. Our next newsletter will announce the winners of some really cool awards. Admin has been officially invested as NPP/NPR coordinator by a unanimous consensus of the community. This is a complex role and he will need all the help he can get from other experienced reviewers. Paid editing is still causing headaches for even our most experienced reviewers: This official Wikipedia article will be an eye-opener to anyone who joined Wikipedia or obtained the NPR right since 2015. See The Hallmarks to know exactly what to look for and take time to examine all the sources. Would you like feedback on your reviews? Are you an experienced reviewer who can give feedback to other reviewers? If so there are two new feedback pilot programs. New Reviewer mentorship will match newer reviewers with an experienced reviewer with a new reviewer. The other program will be an occasional peer review cohort for moderate or experienced reviewers to give feedback to each other. The first cohort will launch November 13. The annual ArbCom election will be coming up soon. All eligible users will be invited to vote. While not directly concerned with NPR, Arbcom cases often lead back to notability and deletion issues and/or actions by holders of advanced user rights. There is to be no wish list for WMF encyclopedias this year. We thank Community Tech for their hard work addressing our long list of requirements which somewhat overwhelmed them last year, and we look forward to a successful completion. To opt-out of future mailings, you can remove yourself here MediaWiki message delivery (talk) 08:33, 3 November 2019 (UTC)
 * Getting the queue to 0
 * Coordinator
 * This month's refresher course
 * Tools
 * It is now possible to select new pages by date range. This was requested by reviewers who want to patrol from the middle of the list.
 * It is now also possible for accredited reviewers to put any article back into the New Pages Feed for re-review. The link is under 'Tools' in the side bar.
 * Reviewer Feedback
 * Second set of eyes
 * Not only are New Page Reviewers the guardians of quality of new articles, they are also in a position to ensure that pages are being correctly tagged for deletion and maintenance and that new authors are not being bitten. This is an important feature of your work, especially while some routine tagging for deletion can still be carried out by non NPR holders and inexperienced users. Read about it at the Monitoring the system section in the tutorial. If you come across such editors doing good work, don't hesitate to encourage them to apply for NPR.
 * Do be sure to have our talk page  on your watchlist. There are often items that require reviewers' special attention, such as to watch out for pages by known socks or disruptive editors, technical issues and new developments, and of course to provide advice for other reviewers.
 * Arbitration Committee
 * Community Wish list

Please comment on Talk:2019 Hong Kong protests
The feedback request service is asking for participation in this request for comment on Talk:2019 Hong Kong protests. Legobot (talk) 04:24, 15 November 2019 (UTC)

Please comment on Talk:Alcohol intoxication
The feedback request service is asking for participation in this request for comment on Talk:Alcohol intoxication. Legobot (talk) 04:24, 15 December 2019 (UTC)

New Page Review newsletter December 2019


This year's Reviewer of the Year is. Having gotten the reviewer PERM in August 2018, they have been a regular reviewer of articles and redirects, been an active participant in the NPP community, and has been the driving force for the emerging NPP Source Guide that will help reviewers better evaluate sourcing and notability in many countries for which it has historically been difficult.
 * Reviewer of the Year

Special commendation again goes to who ends the year as one of our most prolific reviewers for the second consecutive year. Thanks also to and  who have been in the top 5 for the last two years as well.

Several newer editors have done a lot of work with CAPTAIN MEDUSA and DannyS712 (who has also written bots which have patrolled thousands of redirects) being new reviewers since this time last year.

Thanks to them and to everyone reading this who has participated in New Page Patrol this year.

(The top 100 reviewers of the year can be found here)

A recent Request for Comment on creating a new redirect autopatrol pseduo-permission was closed early. New Page Reviewers are now able to nominate editors who have an established track record creating uncontroversial redirects. At the individual discretion of any administrator or after 24 hours and a consensus of at least 3 New Page Reviewers an editor may be added to a list of users whose redirects will be patrolled automatically by.
 * Redirect autopatrol

Set to launch early in the new year is our first New Page Patrol Source Guide discussion. These discussions are designed to solicit input on sources in places and topic areas that might otherwise be harder for reviewers to evaluate. The hope is that this will allow us to improve the accuracy of our patrols for articles using these sources (and/or give us places to perform a WP:BEFORE prior to nominating for deletion). Please watch the New Page Patrol talk page for more information.
 * Source Guide Discussion

While New Page Reviewers are an experienced set of editors, we all benefit from an occasional review. This month consider refreshing yourself on Notability (geographic features). Also consider how we can take the time for quality in this area. For instance, sources to verify human settlements, which are presumed notable, can often be found in seconds. This lets us avoid the (ugly) 'Needs more refs' tag. Delivered by MediaWiki message delivery (talk) at 16:10, 20 December 2019 (UTC)
 * This month's refresher course

New Page Reviewer newsletter February 2020
Hello ,

The first NPP source guide discussion is now underway. It covers a wide range of sources in Ghana with the goal of providing more guidance to reviewers about sources they might see when reviewing pages. Hopefully, new page reviewers will join others interested in reliable sources and those with expertise in these sources to make the discussion a success.
 * Source Guide Discussion

New to NPP? Looking to try something a little different? Consider patrolling some redirects. Redirects are relatively easy to review, can be found easily through the New Pages Feed. You can find more information about how to patrol redirects at WP:RPATROL.
 * Redirects


 * Discussions and Resources
 * There is an ongoing discussion around changing notifications for new editors who attempt to write articles.
 * A recent discussion of whether Michelin starred restraunts are notable was archived without closure.
 * A resource page with links pertinent for reviewers was created this month.
 * A proposal to increase the scope of G5 was withdrawn.

Geographic regions, areas and places generally do not need general notability guideline type sourcing. When evaluating whether an article meets this notability guideline please also consider whether it might actually be a form of WP:SPAM for a development project (e.g. PR for a large luxury residential development) and not actually covered by the guideline.
 * Refresher

Six Month Queue Data: Today – 7095 Low – 4991 High – 7095

To opt-out of future mailings, please remove yourself here 16:08, 13 February 2020 (UTC)

Thank you for reverting vandalism!
Thank you for reverting these three dubious edits (https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Hand_washing&diff=944202113&oldid=944185824, https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Hand_washing&diff=944202285&oldid=944202113, https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Hand_washing&diff=944202345&oldid=944202285) by "India bangladesh sri lanka pakistan". By doing so, you help make the wiki a more reliable resource. Victionarier (talk) 15:52, 15 March 2020 (UTC)
 * - thank you very much for the recognition. Cheers! ‡ Єl Cid of Valencia  talk  00:15, 16 March 2020 (UTC)

Please stop removing content from the Matty Groves article
Several of the groups you're removed are definitely notable, just mostly outside the US. I'm in the middle of working on some articles for several of them and it'd be easier to linkify them if you'd stop removing them en masse. Thanks for your help with this. Suppafly (talk) 15:08, 14 April 2020 (UTC)
 * - alright, I will take your word for it, I guess. But do you contend all the unlinked artists are notable, or just some of them? If not, can you please remove the unlinked artists you do not claim are notable? Thanks ‡ Єl Cid of Valencia  talk  15:13, 14 April 2020 (UTC)
 * Some definitely need removed, but your approach of removing any that aren't already articles makes the task harder. If you can agree to let it go for a week or two, I'll clean it up. If you've got nothing else to do, feel free to help, several of the groups are notable in that they have real albums you can listen to and buy and are published by real publishing companies, even if their fandom is mostly outside the US. Suppafly (talk) 15:21, 14 April 2020 (UTC)
 * I just made a post on the talk page addressing this issue. I understand your argument, but generally, a link or citation is required for inclusion in a list. I will let you address the issue, but again, I don't think my removals were in any way improper. It is not like this is a new article, the entries have been included for months and years. But no, I won't revert, as you have explained yourself now. Best ‡ Єl Cid of Valencia  talk  15:30, 14 April 2020 (UTC)

Feedback request: History and geography request for comment
Message delivered to you with love by Yapperbot :) Is this wrong? Contact my bot operator. Sent at 07:40, 16 June 2020 (UTC)

New Page Reviewer newsletter June 2020
Hello ,

NPP Sorting can be a great way to find pages needing new page patrolling that match your strengths and interests. Using ORES, it divides articles into topics such as Literature or Chemistry and on Geography. Take a look and see if you can find time to patrol a couple pages a day. With over 10,000 pages in the queue, the highest it's been since ACPERM, your help could really make a difference. In late February, Google added 5 new languages to Google Translate: Kinyarwanda, Odia (Oriya), Tatar, Turkmen and Uyghur. This expands our ability to find and evaluate sources in those languages.
 * Your help can make a difference
 * Google Adds New Languages to Google Translate
 * Discussions and Resources
 * A discussion on handling new article creation by paid editors is ongoing at the Village Pump.
 * Also at the Village Pump is a discussion about limiting participation at Articles for Deletion discussion.
 * A proposed new speedy deletion criteria for certain kinds of redirects ended with no consensus.
 * Also ending with no change was a proposal to change how we handle certain kinds of vector images.

Six Month Queue Data: Today – 10271 Low – 4991 High – 10271

To opt-out of future mailings, please remove yourself here MediaWiki message delivery (talk) 02:52, 18 June 2020 (UTC)

Feedback request: History and geography request for comment
Your feedback is requested &#32;at Talk:Dhola Post&#32; on a "History and geography" request for comment. Thank you for helping out! You were randomly selected to receive this invitation from the list of Feedback Request Service subscribers. If you'd like not to receive these messages any more, you can opt out at any time by removing your name. Message delivered to you with love by Yapperbot :) &#124; Is this wrong? Contact my bot operator. &#124; Sent at 19:32, 13 July 2020 (UTC)

I have unreviewed a page you curated
Hi, I'm John B123. I wanted to let you know that I saw the page you reviewed, Eisenschitz, and have marked it as unpatrolled. If you have any questions, please ask them on my talk page. Thank you.

(Message delivered via the Page Curation tool, on behalf of the reviewer.)

John B123 (talk) 17:27, 5 August 2020 (UTC)
 * - may I ask why? ‡ Єl Cid of Valencia  talk  17:29, 5 August 2020 (UTC)
 * Apologies, I must have done it in error. Regards --John B123 (talk) 17:34, 5 August 2020 (UTC)
 * No worries - relieved I didn't do anything wrong (this time) ‡ Єl Cid of Valencia  talk  17:35, 5 August 2020 (UTC)

sorry for my mistakes
hello, i saw a massage to my Talk page, that said i might be blocked next time if i use wikipedia for promoting, infact i am a new user. and I am learning through editing, i have no any intention to promote anything i am in here and i know every rule its just i am trying to learn more and i hope one day i am gonna be a good teacher to others. Thank you for reminding me but if there is any way u can improve my artical it wil be so cool please, f possible. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Molee4real (talk • contribs) 20:19, 7 August 2020 (UTC)
 * Thank you for the note - I will respond on your talk page ‡ Єl Cid of Valencia  talk  12:48, 10 August 2020 (UTC)

A favour for Santa?
I've been concerned for some time that a particular individual will try to use Wikipedia to besmirch my website, emailSanta.com, again. To try to prevent this (fingers crossed), I've decided to create a Wikipedia page for the website. I've respected your comments on the Santa page and would be honoured if you would review my draft before I submit it for approval. I've identified myself as having a COI and believe the site is Notable (e.g. innumerable articles from reputable newspapers around the world, such as New York Times [x3] etc.). I also recognize that, despite my best efforts, the article likely contains bias or other errors; this is my first article submission. The article is not intended as a marketing piece; just a straight-forward, fact-based encyclopedic entry. I have no doubt you will correct me if I stray from my goal :-). Thank you El Cid, el campeador & stay safe and healthy!  Kringle Claus (talk) 22:24, 18 August 2020 (UTC)

Ok, first error! The draft is at https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Draft:EmailSanta.com Kringle Claus (talk) 22:25, 18 August 2020 (UTC)
 * Thank you for reaching out. I am at work at the moment, but when I get the opportunity I can take a look, likely later today. ‡ Єl Cid of Valencia  talk  13:05, 19 August 2020 (UTC)
 * Thank you for editing and the comments/insights. Greatly appreciated!  There certainly is a reason "COI" articles are discouraged, even with best efforts and intents :-).  I'll remove the Rosie song as I no longer have anything I can use to support the comment (it was just a "fun fact").  Many of the best stories about the site and its impact were from the late 90's/early 2000's.  A lot of those links have disappeared.  I'll dig thru my files & news clippings and add some more support for the website being Notable, however, they likely won't have hyperlinkable references.  Hopefully that isn't a problem?  I'll let you know once I have them up. Thank you again! Kringle Claus (talk) 05:04, 22 August 2020 (UTC)


 * I've added several more references in the emailSanta article (in support of Notability); changed two sentences; and, added another sentence. One of the sentences I changed mentioned "personal information" which isn't quite factually correct.  I added a quote from a NYTimes article about the site that clarifies the information requested.  The second revised sentence had to do with postmasters sending kids to emailSanta.  I could add dozens more references but it seems what I have is perhaps already overkill.  Regardless, all revisions & comments are welcome.  Time for bed now -- very late/early here :-)  Thank you again for your help and Merry Christmas!Kringle Claus (talk) 08:38, 22 August 2020 (UTC)

Feedback request: History and geography request for comment
Your feedback is requested &#32;at Talk:Axis powers&#32; on a "History and geography" request for comment. Thank you for helping out! You were randomly selected to receive this invitation from the list of Feedback Request Service subscribers. If you'd like not to receive these messages any more, you can opt out at any time by removing your name. Message delivered to you with love by Yapperbot :) &#124; Is this wrong? Contact my bot operator. &#124; Sent at 00:30, 17 September 2020 (UTC)

Russia & Turkey are Both in Europe
The Republic of Turkey is a White European Nation with a Secular Constitution.

The Turkish Republic is a Member Of the UN United Nations, NATO North Atlantic Treaty Organization since ‘1952 (The 1st European Nation the Original Founding Members accepted, followed by Greece on the same day) (But Russia 85% in Asia and Asian Armenia have never been invited to join, even Germany joined years later and then Spain only join in 1982, 30 years later!) Continuing, Turkey is a member of the Council Of Europe since '1949 (Again the 1st European Nation the Founding Members accepted, followed by Greece on the same day) (But Russia was only let in, in 1996 and Armenia in 2001) Turkey has a European Latin Alphabet too and recognized as European by the UK British Government’s Official website www.gov.uk ...Also an EEC European Economic Community Associate Member since '1963 and EU European Union Joining Member in Accession, G20 Industrial Nations, WTO World Trade Organization, OECD, the Western Europe Branch of the WEOG Western European & Other Groups, also in the OSCE Organization for Security & Cooperation In Europe, EU Customs Union, EFTA European Free Trade Association, Black Sea Economic Cooperation Business Council with it’s Russian & Ukrainian neighbors, UEFA Union Of European Football Associations, Eurovision Song Contest & European Travel Insurance Listings, GPS Giant TomTom European Listing plus too many more to list here?

The Secular, Balkan & Black Sea European Republic Of Turkey is home to St. Paul the Turkish Born Inventor of Christianity.

Christian Teachings state that the Citizens of Turkey are descendants of Japheth: The Father of the European Race via Gomer. The Germans are also descendants of Gomer. German Historian Stefan Ihrig’s Book: “Aryan Ataturk In The Nazi Imagination” even documents that the Nazi Party’s Office Of Racial Policy classed Turks, Hungarians, Finns, Estonians, Moldovans as Aryans and part of the White European Race in 1936 because all 5 have the same bloodline & linguistic origins.

Wikipedia itself states the birthplace of the Turks is the Belukha Mountains in Siberia, Russia.

Turkey's West is in the Balkans 5-10% and Rest in Byzantine Anatolia Home Of The East Roman Empire that only reaches the European Caucuses of the Former USSR.

As for the people, the White European Citizens of Turkey are made up of many various White Europeans. The descendants of the Roman Empire, Byzantine Empire, Ottoman Empire including the Original Siberian Turks whose DNA has practically vanished plus Bosniaks, Albanians, Greeks, Armenians, Azeris, Georgians, Kazakhs, Circassians, Assyrians, Russians, Slavs & Turkified Anatolians. Rockwell the founder of the American Nazi Party also stated in his book & manifesto that Turks are part of the White European Race Ref: Hate Crimes Volume 3, Google has many references to the NSDAP’s & ANP’s facts. The United Kingdom’s Metropolitan Police Authority lists Southern Europeans: Portuguese, Spaniards, Italians, Sicilians, Sardinians, Greeks, Turks, Greek Cypriots & Turkish Cypriots all under their Identification Code: IC2. The Freemasons Grand Lodges of the World list it’s Istanbul, Turkey Lodge under it’s European Category with Russia and all other European nations. The DNA Ancestry Research Lab: “23 & Me” have both Turkey & it’s White European Citizens in their European DNA pool. According to American Journal of Physical Anthropology (2008), today's Turkish people are more closely related with Balkan populations than to the Central Eurasian populations East of Russia’s Ural Mountains,[136][137] and a study looking into allele frequencies suggested that there was a lack of genetic relationship between the White European Turks and their Siberian ancestors, despite the historical relationship of their languages (Both the Turks and Germans were equally distant to all three Siberian populations).[138] Multiple studies suggested an elite cultural dominance-driven linguistic replacement model to explain the adoption of Turkish language by the White Anatolian indigenous inhabitants.[130]k[›][134]

A study involving mitochondrial analysis of a Byzantine-era population, whose samples were gathered from excavations in the archaeological site of Sagalassos, found that the samples had close genetic affinity with modern Turkish and Balkan populations.[139]

Another studies found the Peoples of the Caucasus (Azeris, Armenians, Georgians, Chechens, Circassians) are closest to the Turkish population among sampled European (Italian, French) populations.[141][142][143][144][145][146]

The Secular Democracy founded in 1923 is a European & Western Nation with a European Penal code founded by the “Father of the Turks” their Blond Haired & Blue Eyed WW1 Hero Ataturk

> 1. The United Nations Official Website Page Titled "The Economic Commission > For Europe" lists Turkey, Cyprus & Russia in Europe http://www.un.org/Depts > /Cartographic/map/profile/ece.pdf > > 2. The Official Website for NATO states in Article 10 states that > membership is open to any “European State in a position to further the > principles of this Treaty and to contribute to the security of the North > Atlantic area” http://www.nato.int/cps/en/natohq/topics_52044.htm > > 3. The Official Website for The Council Of Europe includes Turkey in Europe > http://www.coe.int/en/web/about-us/our-member-states > > 4. The Official Website for the EU European Union states that Membership > criteria – Who can join? The Treaty on the European Union states that any > European country may apply for membership & Turkey is already in accession > negotiations http://ec.europa.eu/neighbourhood-enlargement/p > olicy/conditions-membership_en — Preceding unsigned comment added by Davewikifan2020 (talk • contribs) 09:07, 24 September 2020 (UTC)

Feedback request: History and geography request for comment
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