User talk:Eldumpo/Archive3

Football stubs
I agree that for the categories and templates the wording is not exactly 100% correct. If you can agree a set wording for the categories and templates, I will happily (though slowly) work my way through changing all the necessary categories/templates. The renaming of categories is a bit more difficult and probably needs to go through WP:SFD and would require deleting the existing category and creating a new one at the new name, again I would happily work my way slowly through these but some one else would have to do the deletions. Waacstats (talk) 20:39, 2 September 2010 (UTC)

Kristjan Gauti Emilsson
I see you removed my PROD for Kristjan Gauti Emilsson. I was under the impression from WikiProject Football/Fully professional leagues that the Icelandic league is not fully professional see this link and thus the player would not meet WP:ATH and I'm not sure i would agree with the assessment that an U-17 international meets WP:GNG either, given most of the press coverage is based around his move to Liverpool FC. Interestingly, despite the fact that Liverpool FC claim he's a Icelandic U-19 international, I have also failed to find any sources to back this claim (in English). Steve-Ho (talk) 20:36, 20 September 2010 (UTC)


 * Re your message WP:NSPORT is a guideline - I was just applying the professional league side to it. I've no idea why it comes up as Steve-Ho? - something to do with when I registered perhaps? - anyway, same person, and one account! Steve-Ho (talk) 20:15, 21 September 2010 (UTC)


 * Thanks for noticing this - was an option in preferences. 5+ years on wikipedia and still learning Zanoni (talk) 20:16, 21 September 2010 (UTC)

Tom Devlin
Hello. Just wondering what source you had to make you put questionmarks alongside so many infobox years? cheers, Struway2 (talk) 23:08, 27 September 2010 (UTC)
 * The Birmingham book does indeed go into that level of detail. I've added a couple more inline refs, and also commented out the Brooklyn stats from the infobox, which were added unsourced by an anon editor. cheers, Struway2 (talk) 09:31, 28 September 2010 (UTC)
 * No problem. cheers, Struway2 (talk) 21:26, 28 September 2010 (UTC)

List of Rochdale A.F.C. players
The references I used are already there. Soccerbase for Paul Butler and upthedale.com for the rest. J Mo 101 (talk) 10:08, 30 September 2010 (UTC)
 * I just checked the edits and the only players I added from that era were Wood, Birch, Arthur and Partridge, and their stats are listed on the site. The modern players I added are all from Soccerbase. I don't know of anywhere on the internet that has the information for players who played between 1946 and c.1990 unfortunately, so I don't know where Livesey's stats came from. J Mo 101 (talk) 18:12, 30 September 2010 (UTC)
 * I saw this thread - are you aware of the page on the Neil Brown website (http://www.neilbrown.newcastlefans.com/rochdale/rochdale.htm)? Daemonic Kangaroo (talk) 11:53, 2 October 2010 (UTC)

William Egan (footballer)
Hi - thanks for the message. I'll add what I can from the Welsh International Soccer Players book tomorrow. Cheers. Daemonic Kangaroo (talk) 17:39, 1 October 2010 (UTC)
 * Now done.  Daemonic Kangaroo (talk) 11:51, 2 October 2010 (UTC)

David Colville & Sons
Hi Eldumpo, a nice piece of work (the article stub). There is a published history: Payne, Peter L. (1979). Colvilles and the Scottish Steel Industry, Oxford: Clarendon Press. I managed to get hold of a copy a year or so ago because there was little or no information on wikipedia about the company, but I never got around to doing anything (other than reading the book). There is also a personal web site on Ravenscraig's steel industry, but that was copyrighted. Pyrotec (talk) 09:47, 3 October 2010 (UTC)

Template:Proposed British sports stadiums
The best place to see why is here. Remember that templates are non-article pages. Also templates and articles are both navigation tools, so once you are in the category, you see all of the articles available. If you got there by navigation, it is likely that the template was read at some point. Vegaswikian (talk) 17:57, 4 October 2010 (UTC)

Harry Howell
Unfortunately, as he never made a first-team appearance for Southampton, he is not listed in any of my reference books, so there's little more I can add. Daemonic Kangaroo (talk) 17:53, 27 October 2010 (UTC)

Ian Branfoot
I see you have "sanitised" this article; I can assure you that, to this day, he is still the most hated manager Southampton have ever had, with only Harry Redknapp coming anywhere near. This culminated in the notorious fanzine cover which showed a picture of Branfoot with the caption "We wish you were dead". Maybe one day, I'll expand this section (all properly cited of course). Cheers. Daemonic Kangaroo (talk) 09:15, 1 November 2010 (UTC)

Jim Steel (footballer)
Hi there,

Is it possible you could help me with something please? I have looked unsuccessfully in the help pages for info on how to add a template to a page to request editors direct their attention to a comment I propose to add on the talk page. Is it possible you could point me at such a template or command please?

Any help is much appreciated. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 188.65.183.52 (talk) 13:35, 23 November 2010 (UTC)

Hi there,

That isn't a bad idea at all. Many thanks for suggesting, this has been acted upon.

Cheers again. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 188.65.183.52 (talk) 14:10, 23 November 2010 (UTC)

Hiya El Dumpo,

Thanks again for your reply to which I again have responded on the talk page in question. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 188.65.183.52 (talk) 14:40, 23 November 2010 (UTC)

Lammie Robertson
Terry Frost, Bradford City A Complete Record 1903-1988 (Breedon Books Sport, 1988) ISBN 0907969380. I don't have a copy to hand can't give you a page number, sorry.GiantSnowman 13:57, 2 December 2010 (UTC)
 * Yeah, I'll double check when I next get hold of a copy. If a player hasn't declared their nationality, or represented a nation, then what is their nationality? GiantSnowman 14:40, 2 December 2010 (UTC)

Fred Hughes
Hi, can you confirm from your sources whether Fred Hughes (who I believe is the father of Emlyn Hughes) was a Great Britain intl' or not. Looking at various sources from Emlyn's obituary there is some confusion. I wonder if he only played internationally for Wales, went on the 1946 GB tour of Australia, but only played in non-test matches? See. Also, can you confirm whether Emlyn's brother and uncle were notable as rugby players. Is Eric Hughes his brother? Regards. Eldumpo (talk) 15:28, 16 December 2010 (UTC)
 * According to saints.org.uk, Emlyn Hughes' father was Emlyn Hughes, but the sources you identify that provide a name for Emlyn Hughes' father, state him as being named Fred Hughes, so I think saints.org.uk might be wrong, and that 'old' Emlyn Hughes, is actually Emlyn Hughes' uncle. The only Hughes to haved played for Great Britain (RL) in Test Matches is Eric Hughes, so if Fred was one of 'The Indomitables', he must have played in the tour matches against club, county, and states, and not the Test Matches. As yet, I can't find anything stating that Eric Hughes was Emlyn's brother. There are five Hughes' who have played for Wales (RL); Adam Hughes, E. Hughes, Frederick "Fred" Hughes, Gomer Hughes, and Stefan Hughes, I'm wondering whether E. Hughes might be 'old' Emlyn Hughes. I shall keep digging and let you know if I turn anything up. Cheers. DynamoDegsy (talk) 13:16, 17 December 2010 (UTC)
 * Thanks for your response, and I note you will look into it further. Did you pick up on the Times obit, which refers to his father as Fred "Ginger" Hughes - not sure that helps at all? Also, I noted that the link you posted to the 1946 tour is part of a general article on GB team. Has there been any discussion on making specific articles for indiv tours, which is done for Rugby Union? Eldumpo (talk) 13:31, 17 December 2010 (UTC)

Tommy Jones (footballer born 1909)
Thanks for the query. I have referenced the "Coaching career" section, which was exactly in line with the career summary in the Welsh Who's Who, although this says nothing about being caretaker manager. He was a trainer at Workington from 1953 (there's no departure date given, only that he joined Birmingham in August 1958) and it's quite likely that he would have stepped up when the manager left. I'll leave you to decide whether or not to add this into the article. Cheers. Daemonic Kangaroo (talk) 06:48, 18 December 2010 (UTC)

Joan Golobart
Hi there ELDUMPO, VASCO here,

your change in this player's article is not correct, RCD Espanyol was not known as such until 1995 (previously RCD Español), please leave stuff in box be. Also, the link#2 (archives from the club's website) is much more suited as a reference then link#1 (merely a site with stats), i duly swapped those.

Please check edit summaries for more details, keep up the good work, merry Xmas and happy beginning of the new decade, from Portugal - --Vasco Amaral (talk) 01:10, 26 December 2010 (UTC)


 * No worries. You don't agree with my approach, but you have argued politely and with logic, kudos to you. If you notice, however, i have not removed any references - don't known if you meant that, if not i apologize - i have replaced the one you had with the other available, leaving the other as LINK. Just a minor swap. Regards as well, from Portugal - --Vasco Amaral (talk) 18:00, 16 January 2011 (UTC)


 * Thanks man. Keep up the good work! All for one, one for (almost) all, kind regards - --Vasco Amaral (talk) 04:06, 22 January 2011 (UTC)

AutoWikiBrowser/Typos
An edit you made involved adding an extra line space between the categories and the stub, and your edit summary linked to the above page, but I could see no mention there of adding lines. Could you clarify your edit? Thanks. Eldumpo (talk) 11:13, 1 January 2011 (UTC)
 * Hi, in short I have no idea why AWB added those extra lines, perhaps it felt it was tidying up the whitespace. This edit was made almost one month ago using a previous build of AWB. 'Typo fixing' was the edit summary I had selected at the time hence why it appeared, this was based on the AWB documentation which suggested it was an appropriate edit summary when regex typo fixing is enabled. I have since refined my settings in AWB to skip only whitespace changes, and I have changed the edit summary to 'clean up'. I only use AWB to scan new pages to perform very general clean up's of articles, and for my work as a copy editor. I hope that has answered your question, if you disagree with the edit feel free to revert it. Pol430  talk to me 11:58, 1 January 2011 (UTC)
 * Thanks for your swift reply. I don't know much about AWB and other automated tools, but from your response it seems its perhap closer to being a fully automated process than a semi-automated one, as you say you have no idea why the programe added those lines. You say that there have been changes since the time of the edit that mean this type of edit won't be done in future? However, I note you also state that you have changed your AWB settings so that 'whitespace only' changes would be skipped, but a) does this mean that whitespace changes combined with other changes would still be done (i.e. as per the Pinehurst example when the orphan tag was also added), and b) if other AWB users do not apply your rule then they (via AWB) may continue to make whitespace-only edits? Sorry if my questions may be a bit basic - if there's an easy guide on AWB which may be of relevance to my query feel free to point me there. Regards. Eldumpo (talk) 12:15, 1 January 2011 (UTC)
 * AWB is a semi automated process, and ultimately I am responsible for any edits I made and accept responsibility accordingly. My AWB setup will still make whitespace changes, but only if other changes are made. Other users could make whitespace only changes if their settings dictate that. I didn't notice it added the orphan tag in that example, so yes my current AWB setup would make that same edit again (if I click save). It is possible to decline specific changes suggested by AWB by double clicking the relevant line in the diff preview. It is also possible to use custom edit summaries and change the edit summary for each edit. However, the purpose of AWB remains to make tedious tasks easier. If I do a new pages scan AWB will pick up 500 articles to check. Whilst I am careful that I do not allow AWB to make destructive changes, It is possible I may make edits that some users feel were not particularly needed. There is no easy guide to AWB but more information can be found at the project page WP:AWB. Whitespace changes by AWB users have been discussed before (I forget where, maybe AN/I). Best wishes Pol430  talk to me 13:05, 1 January 2011 (UTC)

I have had a chance to look through WP:AWB (not read through every word!) and had a quick search for ANI/whitespace issues. Having done this, I have a few minor follow-up points and then I was intending to make a post at AWB.

AutoWikiBrowser states that whitespace only edits should be avoided, and you say above that indeed your AWB settings have been tweaked to avoid this. I take it this means that AWB is not set-up so as to prevent whitespace-only edits (or indeed any other 'insignificant' edits), and that it is solely down to AWB users to follow the rules?

Anyway, that is a bit by-the-by. I have gone to the general fixes page of AWB and this sub-section is the only one I can see that might be dealing with why whitespaces may be being added to some articles. Do you know any more on this, or if not this will be the main question I will be asking at AWB. I would like to use the Pinehurst example above when I post, and I may link to this discussion for background info, if that's OK. Anyway, if you have any further points to make on this let me know, else I will ask a question at AWB and will post a link here when done as well. Regards. Eldumpo (talk) 12:02, 9 January 2011 (UTC)

Minor changes - bots etc
Hi, a while back you asked this question at WP:Stub querying why the guidance said that an extra blank line should be inserted after the categories and before the stub. I have read the ensuing discussion and it seemed like more editors agreed with you that there appeared to be limited justification for this, although the discussion did then get quite technical about asbox and CSS, and seemed to end with Rich Farmborough asking some 'asbox experts' about the ramifications. You chased things once but you do any further chasing beyond what's in the thread. You may be aware that the MoS has a link to your thread when justifying the use of the double line. Regards. Eldumpo (talk) 18:09, 13 January 2011 (UTC)


 * I made the change in Stub based on that old discussion. And removed the instruction and the link from Manual of Style (layout), since the discussion came to quite the opposite conclusion, as you rightfully mentioned. Debresser (talk) 08:08, 14 January 2011 (UTC)


 * Thanks for making this change. I have since posted a thread at AWB regarding minor changes made with AWB that you may find of interest. I do plan to respond to the last post made there, although you will see the thread has not had much comment and is slipping down the post list. Eldumpo (talk) 11:49, 25 January 2011 (UTC)

Hello again. Thanks for making a post at AWB, although unfortunately there has been no further follow-up. Like yourself it seems, I often get irritated by the number of bot and tool edits to articles on my watchlist, most of which are very minor and cosmetic, and some of which may have no basis to be made at all e.g. the double white space issue. Another issue came up for me today regarding a 'dash script' and I posted a thread at. You can see that my queries are raising wider questions on the use of bots and tools in a more integrated way, and you can see a response was made suggesting raising the issue at Village Pump. The recent responses on this I've made have tended to be at the technical bot users themselves rather than wider comment, so perhaps it would be useful to try and obtain further views. I was wondering if you'd sought any wider input on this before, and whether VP or something like RfC is the best start? Regards. Eldumpo (talk) 17:24, 28 January 2011 (UTC)


 * I just don't think it is worth the trouble. If any specific user would be making onlyy such edits, he'll get a slap on the wrist. Otherwise we all sometimes make such edits. Debresser (talk) 16:56, 29 January 2011 (UTC)