User talk:Elinruby/Archives/2020/December

Thanks
I just wanted to say thanks for contributing to Fatager Silverhorn68 (talk) 08:13, 16 December 2020 (UTC)

K. You are welcome Elinruby (talk) 08:16, 16 December 2020 (UTC)

Translation help
Regierung von Aschanti meaning government of the Ashanti Empire in German is a unique article on the German article lists. I want help in translating it into a new article government of the Ashanti Empire in English. The current English translation in the Regierung von Aschanti is just a redirect to Ashanti Empire. Please help translate it into a new article even if it is a stub, I'll continue the rest. Kwesi Yema (talk) 18:06, 21 December 2020 (UTC)

My German is pretty basic. But I would be interested in such an article. Are you running into problems starting the article because your account is new? Elinruby (talk) 04:38, 24 December 2020 (UTC)

Elinruby, I'm about to translate the article directly into English with the translation app. After, I'll correct all grammatical errors in the English translation. In case of any obstruction I'll let you know right away. Kwesi Yema (talk) 22:23, 24 December 2020 (UTC)

I will be happy to read it. Elinruby (talk) 02:00, 25 December 2020 (UTC)

Elinruby, I have translated and added some here in my user space, User:Kwesi Yema/Government of the Ashamti Empire. I want to move the page to Political systems of the Ashanti Empire or Political organization of the Ashanti Empire (which of the titles do you see fit?) However, I don't know much about translation and I don't know how to link the German article (Regieurung von Ashanti) with this one. Please help, if you could even move the page and link them both that will really really help. Kwesi Yema (talk) 18:04, 27 December 2020 (UTC)


 * I have done both in the past but it has been a bit and I am not sure it's available on the mobile version where I am right now. Let me start by reading it. Will do that now, came into Wikipedia looking for something to do .Elinruby (talk) 22:10, 27 December 2020 (UTC)


 * You should explain the part about the stool better. It isn't really explained and I only understood it because of other reading I have done. Also, I think you should say which Akan kingdoms. Still reading. Not editing yet. By the way, if this is mostly a translation you should put the translate template up; I don't remember the syntax offhand but googling "Wikipedia translate template syntax" should get you there. Elinruby (talk) 22:22, 27 December 2020 (UTC)

Thank you very much. In regards to the stools, I'm looking for more sources. The ones I have now are dominated by just the Golden Stool. With the translation, I saw the template and it states that I write "[Translated from|.....]" on the talk page. It also brings in some additional measures which I'm trying my best to understand at the moment. For now I'll just put in the translation tag and work on the stools. Kwesi Yema (talk) 00:16, 28 December 2020 (UTC)

Yes it is important to do that for copyright reasons. I am doing an edit now. Article is much better than I am used to working with, but if I'm going to create it I want it to be as good as you can get it. Are you hung up on the version number? If so I can help you with that. I have a few questions also. At one point you talk about "maternity leave", which is definitely not a way to come into office. I assume this means matrilineal? Elinruby (talk) 00:26, 28 December 2020 (UTC)


 * also, do me a favor and read the article through a couple of times; I am being quite careful but it's a lot of unfamiliar terminology and I do not want to introduce error. Other side comment, I have looked at it enough the feel personally satisfied that it follows the German, is needed, and is probably accurate. This doesn't get you much except my help, mind you, but yes, I think we should publish it. I have confirmed that I do not have a move command but that can be gotten around. I will either get it published or talk you through doing it yourself. Overall, it's a bit repetitive though and it's hard in places to follow. This can be helped by standardizing font style, ie italic, bold, quotes. Normally in translations I use the foreign word and italicize it, but so much of this text is titles and names that this would make the text really busy. There are also some fine points of capitalization I want to look up. But bottom line I agree, more references is *always* better. Elinruby (talk) 00:54, 28 December 2020 (UTC)


 * Yes, I believe the maternity leave is matrilineal, I'll correct that right away. In regards to the version number, I was able get it to thanks to the link you showed me. I also agree that the article needs clean up and definitely more sources. I'm really studying books and reeling out many sources I can get my hands on. However, if you agree it should get published, sure you can move the page to create a new one. The title could be Political systems of the Ashanti Empire because the German title translation will not make too much sense in English. Kwesi Yema (talk) 01:07, 28 December 2020 (UTC)

Works for me. Look at Golden Stool and see if it helps you Elinruby (talk) 01:11, 28 December 2020 (UTC)

I added something little for now that clarifies the Golden Stool in relation to the other stools. However, if you feel it should be moved to a better subsection, I agree. Also, with the maternal leave issue, I translated the German "Allgemeinen....vererbt" and it's something like "Generally inherited through maternal law." I take it that it might mean matrilineal succession. Either way I'm going through for revision. Kwesi Yema (talk) 02:01, 28 December 2020 (UTC)


 * ok. I am going to stop for a bit. One problem I ran into is that while I really do like the porcupine and was considering using the graphic, right now it's in a section about a council, whereas it seems to have represented a kingdom at one point. Btw, it is normal for translations to inherit the problems of the original text. But if you are revising, seems like something could be clearer there Elinruby (talk) 02:16, 28 December 2020 (UTC)


 * this source by Robert Edgerton talks about the Kotoko council being untouchable. He like other sources also explain that the Council was presided by the king and state chiefs as well as the queen. I remember reading somewhere that the Kotoko council arose to prominence because it served as a counter to the council of elders. Either way, what is available now is mostly the translation from the German article. I'm thinking of getting the creator of the article to cooperate by at least helping clarify some contents. Kwesi Yema (talk) 02:42, 28 December 2020 (UTC)


 * if you can, it might help. And ok, I hear you on the porcupine. It's just a little hard to understand. I was thinking a graphic might be good...basically there are multiple hierarchies, but it comes with a lot of vocabulary. For now I am italicizing all non-English words including titles, putting translations in parentheses, leaving place names and names of individuals in normal font. I may have to revise this later. In the meantime it makes it easier to tell the titles from the names, etc.  Elinruby (talk) 02:58, 28 December 2020 (UTC)


 * I'm also doing the same for the non-english words; putting them in Italics. Also, if you think you can make the porcupine section better why not? Go ahead. I tried to get into contact with the creator but he hasn't been active for 5 years now. I'm thinking of mailing him then. Kwesi Yema (talk) 21:26, 28 December 2020 (UTC)


 * OK. The thing is my topic knowledge is slight; mainly from working on political articles about other West African countries, esp DRC. So please do reread the article a few times as we are working on this. The words closely followed the German in the parts of the translation I checked, but these second and third passes help improve readability, assuming the person doing the passes understands them in the first place. Which I think I do. Anyway, I think it needs a little more copyediting, either from you or me, but I think your time is better spent on references, as I would have a fairly steep learning curse. Now. Articles are almost always challenged when first published. I am not seeing any problem with crossing the bar as to references, but literally the more the better. There is an image of the porcupine on Wikipedia Commons. You or I should add it, since it is totally on point and quite striking in appearance. I only have a few minutes more, so I am going to go find out about whether or not there is a move command in the mobile interface somewhere. If not I'll either break out the laptop or walk you through it I guess. Article also seems like it could be better organized but there is no reason this can't go live right now imho Elinruby (talk) 23:02, 28 December 2020 (UTC)

Ashanti translation discussion

 * Article uses various spellings: Ashanti, Asante, etc. Standardize. Preferably on something other articles are using.
 * consider a "list of" article for the holders of the stools. Maybe also of stools.
 * Going to go look at Wikipedia Commons Elinruby (talk) 23:49, 28 December 2020 (UTC)


 * With the standardized spellings, definitely my bad in part. It all descends from the translation. However, the official among the two is Ashanti. I'm going to root out and replace Asante with Ashanti. Also, in regards to the list, the German version of the article gives a list of some office holders in the subsections; "office of the Krontihene, office of the okyeame and office of the gyaasehene". Should I implement it in the English as well? I originally didn't add it because there aren't any inline citation for these lists. Speaking of citations wise I'm still hooked up on sources. I even have one soon to be added. Kwesi Yema (talk) 03:39, 29 December 2020 (UTC)