User talk:Flat Out/Archives/2013/June

Black Consciousness Movement
I'm interested in helping to work on this page! Maybe we could begin a rewrite in a separate sandbox page, then substitute wholesale when we have a satisfactory draft assembled. Are you working with any sources in particular? groupuscule (talk) 03:59, 27 May 2013 (UTC)
 * Hi groupuscule, I think a subpage would be a great idea and I am happy to work with you. I haven't started work on it as yet. ''' Flat Out   let's discuss it   04:52, 27 May 2013 (UTC)
 * Should be quite an interesting story to sort out, since BCM was (is?) definitely a Thing but not really an Institution. Steve Biko organizing with South African Students' Organisation seems to be a key starting point.
 * "SASO: The Ideology and Politics of Black Consciousness"
 * "1971: SASO Policy Manifesto sets out the Black Consciousness doctrine." (Student Politics: SASO till SANSCO)

SASO: "Black Students’ Manifesto"

"We, the black students of South Africa, believing that the black man can no longer allow definitions that have been imposed upon him by an arrogant white world concerning his being and his destiny and that the black student has a moral obligation to articulate the needs and aspirations of the black community hereby declare [...]"

"1. SASO is a black student organization working for the liberation of the black man first from psychologi— cal oppression by themselves through inferiority complex and, secondly, from the physical one accruing out of living in a white racist society."

"2. We define black people as those who are by law or tradition, politically, economically and socially discriminated against as a group in the South African society and identifying themselves as a unit in the struggle towards the realization of their aspirations."

and :

"b. SASO defines black consciousness as follows:

Black consciousness is an attitude of mind, a way life i. The basic tenet of black consciousness is that the black man must reject all value systems that seek to make him a foreigner in the country of his birth and reduce his basic human dignity.

ii. The black man must build up his own value systems, see himself as self—defined and not defined by others.

iii. The concept of black consciousness implies the awareness by the black people of power they wield as a group, both economically and politically and hence group cohesion and solidarity are important facets of black consciousness.

iv. Black consciousness will always be enhanced by the totality of involvement of the oppressed people, hence the message of black consciousness has to be spread to reach all sections of the black community.

c. SASO accepts the premise that before the black people should join the open society, they should first close their ranks, to form themselves into a solid group to oppose the definite racism that is meted out by the white society, to work out their direction clearly and bargain from a position of strength. SASO believes that a truly open society can only be achieved by blacks."

over 4 now, groupuscule (talk) 08:38, 1 June 2013 (UTC)

Errol Sawyer
Unfortunately, an editor has speedily deleted the page as a recreation of a page that was deleted before. (About 4 years ago!  AppleJack7  Dear Princess Celestia...   08:00, 1 June 2013 (UTC)
 * Hi AppleJack-7, the creator of the article came to the Teahouse asking for help and that's where I came in. I wasn't aware it was an attempt to recreate an article that had previously been deleted and wish I hadn't wasted time improving it. Thanks for the heads up though, I appreciate it. ''' Flat Out   let's discuss it   08:40, 1 June 2013 (UTC)

Substance or Form? What is wrong with creating an article that has been there before as it is good? You always study the past as you can learn form it, don't you? Can you follow the discussion about it? I am looking for an editor who can help me to improve the article as Errol Sawyer is an established artist and is more than qualified for a Wiki article. Fred Bokker (talk) 00:46, 3 June 2013 (UTC)
 * There is nothing wrong with creating an article if it meets Wikipedia guidelines/policy . The problem that I see is that you aren't learning from the feedback you have been given. Your draft article has many unreliable sources which will not be accepted. From what I can see there are not many reliable sources available for this subject and therefore it will not succeed. There is no point adding lots of references if they do not meet guidelines, this is a waste of your time. My advice is to leave the article as a draft and add reliable and verifiable sources when they become available in future. I have said this now on a number of occasions and I ask that you take the time to understand editing guidelines and policy before you spend any more time on the article. best wishes ''' Flat Out   let's discuss it   02:27, 3 June 2013 (UTC)

File:Les Paul Tribute 2010.jpg listed for deletion
A file that you uploaded or altered, File:Les Paul Tribute 2010.jpg, has been listed at Files for deletion. Please see the to see why this is (you may have to search for the title of the image to find its entry), if you are interested in it not being deleted. Thank you. ''' Flat Out   let's discuss it   10:51, 1 June 2013 (UTC)

Swag of Aussie Poetry
I've yet to make up my mind whether it is notable or not. I suspect that the quote has been taken from the liner notes on the CD - might have to check the copy at the State Library to confirm (which migh take a couple of days). Dan arndt (talk) 04:36, 6 June 2013 (UTC)
 * I've ended up going with a Keep on this one. Dan arndt (talk) 03:04, 7 June 2013 (UTC)
 * Thanks, I'll take another look at it. ''' Flat Out   let's discuss it   03:24, 7 June 2013 (UTC)

Referencing
Hi, I have updated the referencing for Mechanical amplifier. If you are happy with it, would you like to remove the two referencing warnings? Are there any suggestions you would like to add to help improve this article? Thank you. Michaelfaraday1791 (talk) 16:49, 6 June 2013 (UTC)
 * Hi Michaelfaraday1791. I have removed   from the top of the article. You can remove any tag as long as you are sure you have addressed the issues the tag highlighted, by simply removing from the top of the article. I use tags because it encourages article improvement on topics where I have no direct expertise and would find difficult to improve myself. You have done a great job on this article and I am happy to help you in any way that is useful to you. The other tag can be removed when un-referenced sections have been sourced. Best wishes, ''' Flat Out    let's discuss it   23:33, 6 June 2013 (UTC)

Wikipedia talk:Articles for creation/Cheah Cheng Hye
hello! thank you for your comment.....could you take a look at my submission? actually i didn't say anything about "notable" about my submission....that was submitted by someone else before....and sources i quote are Forbes, bloomberg, government etc....i quite can't understand why these are considered unreliable or non-independent sources... Tsuitsui (talk) 10:01, 7 June 2013 (UTC)


 * I gave you links at the Teahouse to read and they will help you, please read those and then ask if you don't understand. ''' Flat Out   let's discuss it   10:07, 7 June 2013 (UTC)

Semarang
Thanks for your message, although you left duplicate text. If you look back in the article history, the cited sentence on language was added separately to the rest of the para and it also seems reasonable that all that para would not be sourced from such a book. Hence I separated out the cite and deleted some of the now uncited para. Regards. Eldumpo (talk) 09:18, 8 June 2013 (UTC)
 * Yes I saw that just after I left the first message on your page. A complete balls-up on my part. ''' Flat Out   let's discuss it   09:21, 8 June 2013 (UTC)

Green day
hi I changed the picture only because it's newer and now the singer is not blonde like in the picture of 2010! However, as you prefer ....--Σπάρτακος (talk) 12:35, 8 June 2013 (UTC)
 * I like the picture you chose, however you need to explain your changes in the edit summary so others know what your reason is. You can reinstate your image bit be sure to describe why before you save the edit. Best wishes ''' Flat Out   let's discuss it   12:37, 8 June 2013 (UTC)
 * ok then I can put the photo and write for example "photo most recent"? anyway i love australia, my dog ​​comes from perth and  i have too a les paul 2010 --Σπάρτακος (talk) 18:41, 8 June 2013 (UTC)
 * Yes but if another editor disagrees with your choice you will need to discuss the matter on the article's Talk page. ''' Flat Out   let's discuss it   03:30, 9 June 2013 (UTC)

AC/DC
WOW, I never noticed! I always thought admins would think it wasn't serious enough to protect. Great work!! That's going to save us a fair bit of time, I reckon. Bretonbanquet (talk) 20:14, 13 May 2013 (UTC)

Reference for Phil Rudd´s Lithuanian last name of Radzevičius can be found here, and also on Wikipedia pages in other languages - Polish and Swedish for example. http://www.lastfm.pl/music/Phil+Rudd — Preceding unsigned comment added by 193.234.185.70 (talk) 13:15, 12 June 2013 (UTC)
 * Thanks 193.234.185.70. That source says "probably" Lithuanian name, so I'm not sure it's a good reference. Wikipedia is never a reliable source. ''' Flat Out   let's discuss it   13:34, 12 June 2013 (UTC)

Alex Jones article
How is Prison Planet's not a reliable source for the name of a producer? RocketLauncher2 (talk) 11:55, 10 June 2013 (UTC)
 * It's a primary source but because it's verifying appropriate information and not interpreting/analyzing it, it can be used and you should feel free to re-instate it. ''' Flat Out   let's discuss it   12:09, 10 June 2013 (UTC)

Miss Bono's talk page, and my pages
Hello Flat Out,

As it seems that OMS has chosen the path of trolling, vandalism and sockpuppetry. I am concerned about attacks on Miss Bono's page in the next ten hours. I am grateful for any attention you can offer, and I appreciate your help protecting my pages and hers. Thank you.  Cullen 328  Let's discuss it  03:53, 10 June 2013 (UTC)
 * Hi Jim, it seems you're not online right now. I've kept an eye out and so far all is quiet - mind you I stayed up on guard duty until 1.30 am this morning and there were many more disruptive edits after I went to bed. It's 11 pm here so I'll hang around a little longer then off to bed. ''' Flat Out   let's discuss it   12:58, 10 June 2013 (UTC)
 * It is 8:00 am here, and I appreciate your efforts. Thanks.  Cullen 328  Let's discuss it  14:57, 10 June 2013 (UTC)
 * Cullen, it looks like things have settled down, touch wood. On a lighter note, here's one of the more interesting talk page comments] I have seen since I started here a couple of months back: ''' Flat Out   let's discuss it   00:23, 14 June 2013 (UTC)
 * Well, I just rapped my knuckles against the wooden arm of my sofa. All seems quiet, from Perth to Melbourne to American Canyon to Havana. After reading your amusing link, I am tempted to run for adminship just so I can block someone, anyone, for blasphemy. That is a blockable offense, isn't it?  Cullen 328  Let's discuss it  00:32, 14 June 2013 (UTC)
 * It would be worth the ensuing report just to see it done once. Blocked for blasphemy and for not making his bed before school. ''' Flat Out   let's discuss it   00:44, 14 June 2013 (UTC)

IPA
Please don't be such a stickler for rules. That kind of behavior is very discouraging and very detrimental to Wikipedia because it alienates both new and very experienced fellow editors. As i pointed out in the revert summary "there are many pronunciations without IPA on Wikipedia (and i spend a lot of time adding IPA - you can add this one) but it's a very bad idea to remove pron. info simply because it's non-IPA". You simply ignored my comment and re-reverted as if i were some kind of vandal.

Your edit summary is also quite rude since i just told you i know a lot about IPA, so shoving "See WP:MOS-P" in my face is like saying "you don't know what you're doing".

In addition, your previous comment shows you don't understand how important rhythm is in music and why the extra syllable in the pronunciation is important information. Please add the important info back and please add IPA if you can't wait for someone else to do it. --Espoo (talk) 10:45, 15 June 2013 (UTC)
 * There is no doubt that the word is sung with 3 sounds, but I disagree with your interpretation of "shuffelin" and that's why phonetics and so unreliable. The word is shufflin' and the syllables are shuf-fl-in, or shu-ffl-in' By re-spelling the word you are adding interpretation. You are reading into my edit summary and deciding it is rude when i am simply poiting out that I believe your pronunciation is incorrect. As a musician I am quite certain I understand rhythm in music and your condescending tone isn't making you any friends here. Best wishes ''' Flat Out   let's discuss it   11:49, 15 June 2013 (UTC)

Recent edits
You are rude and frustrating.
 * I'm sure you're are frustrated since all your disruptive edits have all been reverted. ''' Flat Out   let's discuss it   10:39, 16 June 2013 (UTC)

I was blocked for uploading copyright images, of which I did not know the copyright status on. I now do, but am still blocked because sometimes people around here like their vision and their vision only for articles. It's always the same people, and for the same area of topics (Australia/New Zealand).
 * Probably because we edit in the same timezone. ''' Flat Out   let's discuss it   10:39, 16 June 2013 (UTC)

I have never engaged in vandalism and all I want to do is edit Wikipedia like everybody else. You take these rights away and I have already received several emails about what to do over your controlling behavior.
 * I haven't taken away your rights as I don't have the power to block. ''' Flat Out   let's discuss it   10:39, 16 June 2013 (UTC)

I'm sick of you reverting my edits on Melbourne architecture's page, because yours are wrong and mine are right. Well done for being an editor that keeps reverting back to an edit that features two images of the same building, in a "Gallery" that's suppose to exhibit different buildings, not repeat the same ones. That's the reason I am adding a new image. Can you comprehend that, or is it too difficult?
 * I don't care why you do what you do, I only care that you follow wikipedia guidelines on editing. ''' Flat Out   let's discuss it   10:39, 16 June 2013 (UTC)

You keep saying I'm block evading. I'm not even on an account, I'm editing on an IP which hasn't even been blocked. 58.166.224.181 (talk) 10:21, 16 June 2013 (UTC)
 * That is what block evasion is. You are blocked not just your username(s). I don't care what images are used as that's not an area of my interest, but I do care that you follow editing guidelines. You don't get to choose the images you like - you need to get consensus. ''' Flat Out   let's discuss it   10:39, 16 June 2013 (UTC)

I have edited articles relating to international topics and don't find the same rigid authoritative kind of behaviour there. They are lenient if images are updated or replaced. Do you mean I need to gain consensus on replacing an image that is repetitive? I will do so, but shouldn't it be obvious to you that there shouldn't be two identical images right next to each other? 58.166.224.181 (talk) 13:00, 16 June 2013 (UTC)
 * The fact that there were two images had nothing to do with me. If you had deleted one and given a clear reason why in the edit summary then I would have ignored it, but when I reviewed your edit it just showed that you had deleted a link to an image without giving a reason. What I believe you should do is ask on Talk page which one to keep but honestly I don't have an interest in what images are used. ''' Flat Out   let's discuss it   13:07, 16 June 2013 (UTC)

OR issue
Hi. The editor who previously misused a questionable source at ...And Justice for All (album) is at it again at another article. Could you encourage him to stop please? That is, if I'm wrong. Am I tho? Please comment here if it's not too much trouble. I'm sick of continuously reverting his OR and SYNTH additions. Dan56 (talk) 21:51, 16 June 2013 (UTC)
 * See their talk page. I have just gone through this with another editor and it took me a couple of weeks to get them sorted out (see the talk page of the song 'Legs" by zztop). Be patient and refer to wp policy as much as possible and eventually you'll get through and you'll avoid a warning for 3RR. Good luck! ''' Flat Out   let's discuss it   00:35, 17 June 2013 (UTC)

Recent edits
Is there a rational explanation for reverting all my edits? An ongoing dispute is for one article only, while for the rest of my edits - I've only reformatted the source-template. Bye.--Вик Ретлхед (talk) 08:16, 17 June 2013 (UTC)
 * I gave a reason in my edit summary. ''' Flat Out   let's discuss it   09:38, 17 June 2013 (UTC)

Do you known that what you did to Orion Music + More is pure vandalism?--Вик Ретлхед (talk) 08:41, 17 June 2013 (UTC)
 * It is not vandalism and if you accuse me of vandalism again, we are going to have a problem. I have tried to assist you but you don't listen to other editors and this is why you are having your edits reverted.''' Flat Out   let's discuss it   09:38, 17 June 2013 (UTC)
 * Please maintain the level of courtesy. Please refrain yourself from insults and threats. Thank you.--Вик Ретлхед (talk) 10:27, 17 June 2013 (UTC)
 * Falsely accusing an editor of vandalism constitutes a personal attack. Take some time to understand wikipedia editing guidelines, especially how to achieve consensus. You are having edits reverted by a number of editors because you are not taking time to understand the issues they are raising.''' Flat Out    let's discuss it   10:32, 17 June 2013 (UTC)
 * All you needed to do is remind me to repair the inappropriate edits, surely not reverting them. All you do is damaging the article.--Вик Ретлхед (talk) 10:37, 17 June 2013 (UTC)
 * It is your responsibility to get the edits right, not mine. Every time you make an incorrect edit, introduce an unreliable source, misattribute a source etc it means another editor has to take time to address the error. Think of that before you reintroduce disputed material or references. ''' Flat Out   let's discuss it   10:40, 17 June 2013 (UTC)

As for the "Orion" all material is the most reliable you can find. I replaced the "news" with "web" citations on those two pages. Just to get this clear, does an article published in, let's say USA Today needs to be addressed with "web" (because it's a newspaper).--Вик Ретлхед (talk) 11:16, 17 June 2013 (UTC)
 * USA Today is a newspaper so cite news. ''' Flat Out   let's discuss it   11:20, 17 June 2013 (UTC)
 * Do you have further notices on my past edits, or can I focus on discussing about Justice? If not, it's been nice collaborating with you.--Вик Ретлхед (talk) 11:23, 17 June 2013 (UTC)

Your request for rollback
Hi Flat Out. After reviewing your request for rollback, I have enabled rollback on your account. Keep in mind these things when going to use rollback: If you no longer want rollback, contact me and I'll remove it. Also, for some more information on how to use rollback, see New admin school/Rollback (even though you're not an admin). I'm sure you'll do great with rollback, but feel free to leave me a message on my talk page if you run into troubles or have any questions about appropriate/inappropriate use of rollback. Thank you for helping to reduce vandalism. Happy editing! INeverCry  15:48, 17 June 2013 (UTC)
 * Getting rollback is no more momentous than installing Twinkle.
 * Rollback should be used to revert clear cases of vandalism only, and not good faith edits.
 * Rollback should never be used to edit war.
 * If abused, rollback rights can be revoked.
 * Use common sense.

Leadcite
It does not matter buddy. Have a nice sleep. :D Jivesh 1205 (Talk) 04:46, 18 June 2013 (UTC)

human rights
Hello Flat Out, Thanks for your contribution. I reviewed the page and remove the biased words on Majid Rafizadeh. Can you check?Mediaoutlets (talk) 14:59, 18 June 2013 (UTC)
 * Mediaoutlets I am working to save this article. There is a lot written that is either unsourced or uses unreliable sources. I have removed a lot of of your work but this may help save the page from being deleted.

Hello Flat Out, thanks for your contribution. Here are few referiences for notability by others http://www.france24.com/en/20120831-syria-majid-rafizadeh-kidnap-family-targetted-civil-war-shabiha-opposition-bashar-assad

http://www.cnn.com/2013/05/08/world/meast/syria-shiitesMediaoutlets (talk) 01:09, 19 June 2013 (UTC)
 * Those references are included. The problem is that because you have written this article about yourself there is information you know, but that is not supported by independent reliable sources. ''' Flat Out   let's discuss it

Appreciate your efforts. I did not write it about myself: my apologies if other user has used the computer. I apologize, I will definitely tell anyone who used so that this action will definitely not be repeated. Thanks for your advice. Apologies. Mediaoutlets (talk) 02:52, 19 June 2013 (UTC)
 * You are obviously very close to the subject of the article and you ignored a conflict of interest. It has taken me hours to fix the article and you have placed it at risk of being deleted by being involved. I hope you relaise that your involvement was not helpful. Also, please do not insult me by claiming that User:Sandrkam is not you. Seeing as I have fixed up your mess the least you can do is be honest. ''' Flat Out   let's discuss it   02:56, 19 June 2013 (UTC)

Flat Out, I apologize. I appreciate you. I am just inexperienced. Sorry.Mediaoutlets (talk) 03:09, 19 June 2013 (UTC)

Flat Out, I am interested in people who fight human rights abuses and in academics. I was wondering where exactly you think additional citations is needed to address the issue you put. Mediaoutlets (talk) 03:12, 19 June 2013 (UTC)
 * Because Majid Rafizadeh is alive, this makes the article a biography of a living person and therefore every claim must be supported with an independent and reliable source. Have a look in the article for [citation needed] tags and see if you can find a source. if you can't these sentences will eventually be deleted. ''' Flat Out   let's discuss it   03:44, 19 June 2013 (UTC)

Flat Out, would you please reconsider the investigation you opened. This was not deliberate. Apologies. I am looking forward to assist you in any editing or help you or wikipedia need. Mediaoutlets (talk) 03:15, 19 June 2013 (UTC)
 * I will add a note that you have apologised. Do not make any further edits from the other account ''' Flat Out   let's discuss it   03:41, 19 June 2013 (UTC)

Flat Out, you are one of the most sincere people I have ever met in person or virtually. I hope I can assist you later. You taught me a lesson. Mediaoutlets (talk) 04:14, 19 June 2013 (UTC)
 * You are more than welcome. ''' Flat Out   let's discuss it   04:18, 19 June 2013 (UTC)

Flat Out, do you think there is anyway to remove that keep on the discussion. Mediaoutlets (talk) 04:16, 19 June 2013 (UTC)
 * Don't worry about it, the article isn't going to be deleted. ''' Flat Out   let's discuss it   04:18, 19 June 2013 (UTC)

Flat Out, thank, just the subject's reputation is really being hurt by this issue listed on the page. I did not mean to do this to him. Now every day that people search his name, they see this issue. Mediaoutlets (talk) 04:22, 19 June 2013 (UTC)

Hello Flat Out, I know you are busy. Sorry, can one citation refer to two sentences and can a citation be a book? The two citations that you were asking for are in this http://books.google.com/books?id=SbBR488VPPYC&pg=PT1&lpg=PP1&output=html_text Mediaoutlets (talk) 05:40, 19 June 2013 (UTC)
 * A reference can be used as many times as it is relevant. The first time we do a full citation and we give the reference a name. If you look at the article you will see that the "Remarkables" reference is used 3 times but is only in the reference list once (a, b, c). have a look at that. A book can be a reference, but I can't read that link because it's in arabic or similar language. Can you tell me what the relevant section says and how that supports the Majid Rafizadeh article.''' Flat Out    let's discuss it   05:57, 19 June 2013 (UTC)
 * Hi. The book is in Persian, I can read it but it's just a single page. It seems that it's no longer available?Farhikht (talk) 08:23, 19 June 2013 (UTC)
 * That's OK. If it contains anything that supports the article we can use it. ''' Flat Out   let's discuss it   12:24, 19 June 2013 (UTC)

Hello Flat Out, the book might be available in library. Can the pages be scanned and sent to you? By the way Flat Out, very important, the other editor plot spoiler who seems determined to keep adding issues, deleting the page, and harming the subject's life, job and reputation has just added that major contributor is close to the article and needs clean up. You basically rewritten the article and almost 90%. of the articles was deleted. It us like two years aho when it was piblished when there were no issues gor two years. Is there anyway, you can discuss this issue that he added with him/her? It says it needs clean up; you did almost all the clean up and biased and vandalized language. I listened to you and honestly have done nothing.Mediaoutlets (talk) 15:41, 19 June 2013 (UTC) You can delete any other part, without citation, and clean up, if you prefer. Mediaoutlets (talk) 16:13, 19 June 2013 (UTC)

Hello Flat Out, plot spoiler withdrew his nomination. What is the next step?Mediaoutlets (talk) 01:23, 20 June 2013 (UTC)

Flat Out, can you teach me? You did comprehensive clean up, and moved puffery http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Template:COI Mediaoutlets (talk) 01:42, 20 June 2013 (UTC) Sorry Flat Out, I know you are busy. Should the badges remain? Mediaoutlets (talk) 02:00, 20 June 2013 (UTC) I don not want to take mistake actions, that is why I am asking. Mediaoutlets (talk) 02:02, 20 June 2013 (UTC)
 * Hi User:Mediaoutlets there are a few things I need to explain. The first is that I live in Australia so I am not always going to be here when you need help. There is a clock on the top of this page that tells you what time it is here in Australia.

I hope this helps you understand better what is happening. I am going to put a message on your talk page that has links to policies and guidelines that can help you become a better editor. Best wishes ''' Flat Out   let's discuss it   02:27, 20 June 2013 (UTC)
 * 1) when you ask a question you need to give me time to answer. I have a busy job and it is hard to edit during the day. I am normally online at 8 pm my time.
 * 2) the reason there are notices on Majid Rafizadeh is to guide other editors who wish to improve the article. There are two notices now - the first is the one I put there about the need for more sources to support some of the sentences that are not referenced. When all claims in the article have a reliable source I will remove that notice.
 * 3) the COI tag there is to let other editors know they must watch out for biased editing. There have been 3 biased editors making changes to the article while I was asleep and those edits have all been reverted, and the editors blocked. That is why the COI notice is there and when the time is right I will remove it.
 * 4) the notice that the article has been nominated for deletion will be removed by an administrator now that Plot Spoiler has withdrawn their nomination. It just takes a little time for these things to get done, as everyone here is a volunteer.
 * 5) Majid Rafizadeh's reputation is important to you and I understand that, however we all must follow wikipedia guidelines to ensure that the best possible article is written about this person. You can't take changes or notices personally. If you are going to be upset when someone changes something or places a notice on the page then you really need to stay away from the article.
 * 6) because there are wikipedia policies and guidelines in place it means that anyone who is biased will have their edits reverted so you don't have to worry. All changes come up on my watchlist so I can address any biased editing or vandalism and so can other editors. Even if 20 editors vandalise a page it is easy restore a previous version so you never need to worry about the article. It can always be fixed.
 * 7) there are sockpuppets editing the article. sockpuppet means one editor is using several accounts and this is not allowed. It is very important that you do not do this because as you can see, 3 editors had their accounts blocked while I was asleep.

Hello Flat Out, should the issues remain on main page after the nomination withdrawal? They were some who were adding negative things about him also.... probably he does not care. Mediaoutlets (talk) 02:47, 20 June 2013 (UTC)
 * the nomination for deltion notice will be removed by admin. Give it time. The other must stay there until the issues are resolved and I will take them off as soon as the issues are resolved. ''' Flat Out   let's discuss it   02:53, 20 June 2013 (UTC)

Oops, sorry. I didn't see you response. Flat Out, You already responded. How can an administrator be told that nomination was withdrawn? In the nomination page says that any editor can remove it if the nomination is withdrawn.
 * admins get notified of the nomination being withdrawn and they will close the discussion. When that happens we can remove the notice if nthey have't already done so. ''' Flat Out   let's discuss it   03:41, 20 June 2013 (UTC)

About the COI, it says that if the page can be cleaned up, the badge should not be there. Plot Spoiler said that it is cleaned up and you comprehensively cleaned it up. Is there anyway, an administrator can be contacted. These look like shame for the subject and happiness for those who have been writing very unsourced negative things about him.Mediaoutlets (talk) 02:54, 20 June 2013 (UTC)
 * As I explaiend it has nothign to do with the subjkect and their reputation, it is there to warn other editors to watch out for COI. Even though it says the article must be cleaned up it is really their because of the 3 editors who vandalised the page overnight. Please be patient and I will take it down when it is appropriate.''' Flat Out   let's discuss it   03:41, 20 June 2013 (UTC)

In the section withdrawing nomination says someone else can close the template, http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Articles_for_deletion Is it possible to contact an administrator? Flat Out Mediaoutlets (talk) 03:06, 20 June 2013 (UTC)
 * As I stated above, wait for the admin to close the discussion The admins have a long list of jobs to complete and they will get to this one in due course. Be patient''' Flat Out   let's discuss it   03:41, 20 June 2013 (UTC)

It is all appreciated Flat Out, is there a place on Wikipedia or upper lever where I can send a strong compliment of the impartial works, efforts, and honest contributions that you have been doing. If you need any assistance let me know.
 * That's not necessary. I thought the article was worth saving so I did the work. ''' Flat Out   let's discuss it   05:02, 20 June 2013 (UTC)

By the way, it seems other person in good standing removed the the template since nomination withdrawn.
 * yes. As i predicted, the admin who closed the AfD discussion also removed the template. ''' Flat Out   let's discuss it   05:02, 20 June 2013 (UTC)

But one thing, you comprehensively, even according to the Plot Spoiler, professionally revawped and completly cleaned up the page, and wikipedia  policy suggests that if a page is cleaned up, there is no need for the template that is now on the top. Since you were the one who cleaned it up, is there anyway you can address that issue. Again apologies. I am not advocating for this page, but I don't want those who have been vandalizing, to be laughing that these issues are still on top even if Plot Spoiler himself said that it is cleaned up. Besides, the subject who is a public figure, obviously is getting a lot if searches everyday, and this probably is seriously hurting him and making the vandalizers happyMediaoutlets (talk) 04:50, 20 June 2013 (UTC)
 * I have answered this one already. The COI and BLP Sources notices are correct and they need to stay there for now. ''' Flat Out   let's discuss it   05:02, 20 June 2013 (UTC)

Hello Flat Out, I searched and could not find a link for the two citation needed in the place to remove the citation issue. They are in the Persian book above. You mentioned that these two citations needed to remove the citation issue above. since there is no link for thrse two citations, are you ok with deleting these two sentences so the issue will be removed?Mediaoutlets (talk) 04:19, 21 June 2013 (UTC)
 * OK thanks. That's enough discussion here at my talk page. If you have any suggested references please post them on the article's talk page. ''' Flat Out   let's discuss it   04:22, 21 June 2013 (UTC)

Talk page problems
Flat Out, just last question. For some reason I can not add more text to my talk page, it doesn't show up , do you know why? Is there word count limit.
 * I'll have a look after my work day is finished. ''' Flat Out   let's discuss it   04:33, 21 June 2013 (UTC)

And more importantly, I am afraid of legitimately edit the article and then some other editors comes and put issues such as " major contributor ...." What I am supposed to do. I swear I am not at all close to this subject. I have mor even met him. I just respect the activism and scholarship he is been doing. Mediaoutlets (talk) 04:29, 21 June 2013 (UTC)
 * Don't edit the article just yet, make suggested changes on the articles Talk page and see if you can achieve consensus. ''' Flat Out   let's discuss it   04:33, 21 June 2013 (UTC)

Ok Flat Out, I will try. If you can just remove the two sentences, then there would be no citation issue which you mentioned that need citation to remove the citation template issue.You listed the issue of citation for those two sentences. Can you remove those two sentences and resolve the template issue? Would be really appreciated and I promise this would be the last time disturb you. Mediaoutlets (talk) 04:43, 21 June 2013 (UTC)

Seriously
Try looking before you just revert. Thats what you should do. Ya know its the TOP ONE. Just saying. Black Dragon 03:28, 19 June 2013 (UTC)

I am not violating anything Black Dragon  03:28, 19 June 2013 (UTC)

You should have added that note on the bottom, not the middle... Reverted to add a source is um I dont know SIMPLER. Black Dragon 03:30, 19 June 2013 (UTC)
 * You twice added unsourced material about something that happened in 2012 in front of an existing reference from 2008. Then when you added the reference you performed another revert instead of simply editing the article. It may be simpler but its not correct. ''' Flat Out   let's discuss it

Not correct??? Yes it is. I undid your revert and added to it. Thats how it goes. I just "added it in front of a 2008 source" because they go together. Black Dragon 00:23, 20 June 2013 (UTC)

Dont cry just because I know more about Billie Joe. I remembered him tweeting it and ya know so it wasnt added so I um, added it. Black Dragon 00:24, 20 June 2013 (UTC)
 * If he tweeted it then that is a source that you can cite. Just saying "it happened and I saw it" is not enough. Cite the tweet, its not that hard. ''' Flat Out   let's discuss it   02:29, 20 June 2013 (UTC)

I did. Its not that hard Black Dragon  02:38, 20 June 2013 (UTC)
 * If it isn't hard why didn't you do it the first time instead of just inserting it in front of another reference? ''' Flat Out   let's discuss it   02:45, 20 June 2013 (UTC)

Because that's where it belongs. I can't put it behind it can I? In the 2008 race.[1] and 2012. Black Dragon 21:19, 20 June 2013 (UTC)
 * Yes that is exactly what you should have done. In the 2008 race [1] and the 2012 race[2]. ''' Flat Out    let's discuss it   03:23, 23 June 2013 (UTC)

Feedback
It's funny how you gave the feedback after I announced that I will not make edits. I made edits with comments, so you should pay more attention to the Talk page next time. Detrainman (talk) 17:34, 20 June 2013 (UTC)
 * You came up on the STiki screen for possible vandalism on Dayalbagh and a look at the diff showed that you had section blanked without using an edit summary. That's why I placed a caution on your talk page. I then checked your contributions and saw you had done the same at Dayalbagh Educational Institute, so you got a warning. It's great that you put a note on the talk page that said you wouldn't do it again but then caution and warning were for what you had already done. ''' Flat Out   let's discuss it   04:55, 21 June 2013 (UTC)

Also, you didn't notify AgraNewsObserver who undid my references and other stuff so that he/she could put their section back on. You should be more diligent when you audit an edit war. Detrainman (talk) 17:48, 20 June 2013 (UTC)
 * A cursory look at the edit history showed that AgraNewsObserver had reverted both your section blanking edits and that is perfectly reasonable. If that editor has previously reinstated material that is in dispute then you are within your rights to take it to the article's talk page for discussion and if you don't get a response; to the editor's talk page. If edit warring had come up on my screen I would have addressed that too. After receiving your messages here I had a look at both articles' Talk pages and it is clear that there is a significant content dispute that is not going to be resolved between the two of you. If you haven't already I suggest you ask an experienced editor to review the article and the Talk page discussion so they may give an independent view of the dispute. best wishes ''' Flat Out   let's discuss it   04:55, 21 June 2013 (UTC)

Rohmir
Dear Flat Out,

Thank you very much for looking at the article I wrote. I will keep working on it. Just now, I have deleted the category 'companies created in 1909', because the brand has only been existent for 6 years, that is what my sources state, I am quite sure of that. Lem-nic (talk) 14:58, 21 June 2013 (UTC)
 * Hi Lem-nic, I am happy to be of help. I have added your pop magazine reference back in, properly cited, so the sentence about Olga's education is now supported with a reliable source. The reason I worked hard on the article was to make sure it wasn't nominated for deletion. It should be safe now. ''' Flat Out   let's discuss it   15:02, 21 June 2013 (UTC)

Reviewer
Hello. Your account has been granted the "reviewer" userright, allowing you to review other users' edits on pages protected by pending changes. The list of articles awaiting review is located at Special:PendingChanges, while the list of articles that have pending changes protection turned on is located at Special:StablePages.

Being granted reviewer rights neither grants you status nor changes how you can edit articles. If you do not want this user right, you may ask any administrator to remove it for you at any time.

See also:
 * Reviewing, the guideline on reviewing
 * Pending changes, the summary of the use of pending changes
 * Protection policy, the policy determining which pages can be given pending changes protection by administrators.  INeverCry   19:07, 22 June 2013 (UTC)

question
Excuse me ...but is pissible do this [] i.e. blank the user page when i prefer? Thanx--5.95.202.39 (talk) 19:40, 27 June 2013 (UTC)
 * TreCoolGuy That is a Talk page of another editor. You must not edit another users Talk page. ''' Flat Out   let's discuss it   02:15, 28 June 2013 (UTC)
 * ok i can clean my talk page when i prefer.....thanks

--2.41.174.186 (talk) 09:40, 28 June 2013 (UTC)
 * How many Talk pages do you have? ''' Flat Out   let's discuss it   09:42, 28 June 2013 (UTC)
 * one...but for me isn't normal that the user can clean the talk page....if is write something that i don't like (as treecoolguy) — Preceding unsigned comment added by 176.247.26.15 (talk) 09:49, 28 June 2013 (UTC)
 * You have posted messages here as 5.95.202.39, 176.247.26.15 and User:2.41.174.186. This is hard to follow why don't you register an account? ''' Flat Out   let's discuss it   09:52, 28 June 2013 (UTC)

A barnstar for you!

 * Thank you. We are both learning as I only started in March. The learning curve is steep and you will be surprised how quickly you learn. Ask for help anytime. ''' Flat Out   let's discuss it   12:06, 28 June 2013 (UTC)

Thank you!
Thank you for the thank yous! I've hardly seen that before - it's nice! (I do appreciate that I'm sort-of invalidating the whole system by then using an old-school talk page message to comment but, whatthehell whatthehell, it's a one-off!) Cheers DBaK (talk) 13:37, 28 June 2013 (UTC)

June 2013

 * Hi ProtossPylon I am reverting vandalism and have reported the editor for vandalism afetr final warning. Note the final warning was reverted by that editor. ''' Flat Out   let's discuss it   04:21, 30 June 2013 (UTC)
 * As far as I can tell, his edits aren't vandalism - the sentence being fought over doesn't have any citation either way. This is a clear edit war. I highly suggest to you both to start a discussion on the talk page rather than pointing fingers at each other.  Protoss  Pylon  04:27, 30 June 2013 (UTC)
 * With respect you are only looking at one edit which I incorrectly reverted, once. Every other edit has been the addition and deletion of the same unsourced and disputed content, done dozens of times. Further, I did start a talk page discussion on the addition of the disputed list content and referred the disruptive editor to that talk page in this edit. ''' Flat Out   let's discuss it   04:31, 30 June 2013 (UTC)
 * In today's edits, the content you are reverting back to is also unsourced and disputable. Frankly, the majority of the section still needs citation and probably shouldn't be listed. Unfortunately, edit warring is still edit warring. My edit warring notice to the IP also encouraged him to use the talk page, but if he isn't going to talk then I suggest taking a look at some of your other options at WP:DRR.  Protoss  Pylon  04:43, 30 June 2013 (UTC)
 * I'm not interested in the content per se, only that disputed content is not replaced (i.e the long list of staff) after it is noted at the Talk page. As you will see this editor edits from a long list of I.P addresses (more than just on this particular article) and all attempts to discuss issues are reverted. There is a bigger picture.''' Flat Out   let's discuss it   04:47, 30 June 2013 (UTC)
 * I just took a further look at the edit history of KRXI-TV, and I guess there's more to this than I thought - you're probably right about this being vandalism. I did find it pretty weird that he keeps trying to obstruct your AIV report without addressing your comments. In this case, I'll just leave it to them to figure out what to do with him.  Protoss  Pylon  04:56, 30 June 2013 (UTC)
 * This editor has caused problems on a number of articles and all attempts to address them fail because they edit under so many I.P's and they get around warnings that way. I am going to leave this particular article to someone else as it's a waste of my time. If you could add anything to the report I'd appreciate it. I have also requested temporary page protection of that article. Thanks for taking the time to discuss this and I hope we cross paths again. ''' Flat Out   let's discuss it   05:01, 30 June 2013 (UTC)

The Second Coming quote
I'm new to wikipedia but have used other wikis. Appreciate the help and I'll work with whatever citation guidelines there are. Just want to make it better and more useful when I can. I remember the scene from watching it three times but that isn't an external source. Tried to find a copy of teh screenplay to give page number, but not available.

Sorry if I responded in the wrong place, but these chat/talkback pages are not very intuitive.

Thanks for the help.

MWRuger07:02, 30 June 2013 (UTC) — Preceding unsigned comment added by MWRuger (talk • contribs)
 * MWRuger, thanks for the message and no problem, I have answered your question at the Teahouse. ''' Flat Out   let's discuss it   07:04, 30 June 2013 (UTC)