User talk:Frickeg/Archive 4

Dittmer
How can File:Felix_Dittmer.jpg be public domain if it was taken in 1958? Rebecca (talk) 01:13, 3 February 2010 (UTC)


 * Alas, no. Courtesy of the Howard-era copyright changes, nothing more has entered in the public domain since 2005, so everything post 1 January 1955 is out. I'm afraid that takes out a few of the images you uploaded today. :( Rebecca (talk) 03:51, 3 February 2010 (UTC)


 * Actually, I take that back - I'm not sure. I've never heard of us arguing the government-owned images one before - which might just affect just about every image we actually use on Wikipedia from this period. I think it might be an idea to get a discussion going at WP:AWNB and clarify this one. Rebecca (talk) 03:55, 3 February 2010 (UTC)

Sorry to have falsely corrected you then! It's a good thing to know, at any rate - evidently there's a whole lot more images in the public domain than we assumed there was. Rebecca (talk) 06:02, 4 February 2010 (UTC)

Family Team
Where did you read that it was affiliated to the federal party? The Jaensch book has them listed separately? Rebecca (talk) 15:18, 3 February 2010 (UTC)


 * Ah, fair enough. I'm not sure - happy to leave it to your call. Rebecca (talk) 23:38, 3 February 2010 (UTC)


 * The National Library has a list of members for the House of Assembly. I had it, and had it all digitised on my computer, but was being anal about tracing by-elections and common names and didn't upload it - and lost it in a computer crash. Not my brightest moment! I will be back in Canberra for a while in a couple of months, might have to get it again. I'm pretty sure from memory as regards these guys that Cains elected a running mate at least once. Rebecca (talk) 23:42, 3 February 2010 (UTC)

Barresi
Good editing. You obviously are aware that the alleged relationship between ex Whitehorse Peter Allan and Jacinta is false. It has been appearing numerous times on Andrew Landeryou's Vexnews and a comment appears that the relationship is false soon after it appears. Seems someone has a vendetta against both Jacinta Allan and her cousin Lyle, and they are repeatedly being told they should disown their relative, who is not in fact a relative at all but merely has the same surname. To make matters more confusing another Peter Allan is Jacinta's father, and it is quite poor form to link him with the Peter Allan from Whitehorse. It is doubtful that they have ever met. Thank you for removing this nonsense from Wikipedia.

121.214.89.63 (talk) 22:41, 19 February 2010 (UTC)

pre-2010 election pendulum
at no stage have I said that the pre-election pendulum should not include the complete redistribution. I fully support this for the pre-election pendulum. thanks. - sorry if i sounded short there. not in a good frame of mind at the moment. Timeshift (talk) 23:23, 19 February 2010 (UTC)

Maughan
Not sure, but he's referred to as "Ryott-Maughan, W. J." or "Ryott-Maughan, W." throughout 1899-1912 in Hughes & Graham, and I've only ever seen his name as "William Ryott Maughan" or "William Ryott-Maughan" in any of the books I've been reading about early Queensland politics (Google confirms that it turns up a lot in academic or sample works too.) Orderinchaos 04:43, 24 February 2010 (UTC)

Wannabe Polly & cyclist?
Looking to reference a new article, I wonder if Glenn Druery the cyclist is also Glenn Druery the preference harvester? This shows how he almost got a NSW senate seat, and this article mentions that he rides to Parliament. This talks about his preference deals, but nothing absolutely links the two people. Any info? The-Pope (talk) 14:20, 3 March 2010 (UTC)

Many thanks
Many thanks. I will try to start some stubs on the C19th early C20th elections as the next project. Porturology (talk) 23:02, 3 March 2010 (UTC)

Frickeg - I have reversed you notes abgain, please read my reply, and note that I have added the first source to the two member pages in note. It does not work to read present ideas back in time, the phrase 'unaligned' makes no sense in the 1860-1880s, political parties as we know then did not exist before gradually unwards from the 1890s and really not before into the the 20 century. We need full names on people otherwise you cannot later make a proper link to biography either here on wiki or in the ADB where several are already biographed - with full name that is - helsned 9 Mar 2010 —Preceding unsigned comment added by Helsned (talk • contribs) 01:44, 9 March 2010 (UTC)

Hi Frickeg, I am slowly making List of New South Wales state by-elections but I have run into a technical difficult changing from 8 columns to 6 for the pre-party section. Do you know how it is done?- Any help is greatly appreciated. Thanks Porturology (talk) 03:47, 14 March 2010 (UTC)

Many Thanks - I think it will look Ok Porturology (talk) 05:07, 14 March 2010 (UTC)

Your opinion please
As I'm more familiar with the requirements of WP:ATHLETE than WP:POLLY or WP:LAWYER... what's your opinion on George Williams (lawyer). I've removed the "is seeking preselection" section once, but Mr IP put it back. To me, if it was a company, we'd delete it on the spot as advertising. How do we counter referenced Pollyspin?The-Pope (talk) 13:55, 6 April 2010 (UTC)

On red-legged pademelons
When visiting Australia, we saw a group of female Red-legged Pademelons in the grass. Our guide -- the owner of the property -- told us, that the females stay put, while "the boys" appear, when any of "the girls" come into heat. We have plenty of pictures from that visit, but, unfortunately, all of them are close-ups... I did not expect to have to prove, that these animals do congregate in groups -- at least, sometimes...

Somebody else out there, also describes encountering a group "of wallabies known as red-legged pademelons".

Perhaps, Peter Menkhorst, whom you mentioned to me in 2007, was not entirely correct about these creatures being solitary. Maybe, it is only true about males of the species...

Yours, пан Бостон-Київський (talk) 15:56, 23 April 2010 (UTC)


 * I think, Menkhorst was describing the males' behavior. That same guide said, pretty much, the same thing -- that the boys live solitary and only show up, when a female is in heat. But the females live in a group on the same territory... No, I don't have a book-reference to back this up -- only this verbal account along with my own observation.пан Бостон-Київський (talk) 20:59, 26 April 2010 (UTC)

Results tables
Was it you who said how much you loved doing these? I don't suppose you happen to feel the inspiration to do seat results for the South Australian state election, 2010? :) Timeshift (talk) 05:35, 27 April 2010 (UTC)


 * I love your enthusiasm! Thanks! Timeshift (talk) 05:40, 27 April 2010 (UTC)

Just a query regarding the 2010 SA tables, did you calculate swings from the pre-distribution or post-redistribution, use wikipedia or ECSA 2006 results for the calculation, and did you do a straight subtract (eg 50.5 - 8.3 = 42.2) or did you use the vote tallies to calculate precise swings? When I say precise swings, the outcome of a double decimal point % calculation can very well be different compared to using single decimal point % calculation. Thanks again! Timeshift (talk) 15:52, 30 April 2010 (UTC)

Party information
I created Save the RAH, Fair Land Tax - Tax Party and Free Australia Party but Save the RAH just got noteability tagged. There's not much information available for minor parties in South Australia. There's a couple of articles on The Advertiser (AdelaideNow/News Ltd) and the ABC where they get a mention, but that's pretty much it. And no colours used as far as I know. Timeshift (talk) 09:42, 29 April 2010 (UTC)
 * Any reason you're choosing what appears to be arbitrary colours for microparties? Timeshift (talk) 23:25, 29 April 2010 (UTC)
 * Wouldn't grey be best... otherwise isn't it WP:OR? Timeshift (talk) 23:33, 29 April 2010 (UTC)

Yeah I saw the Chaffey result. I had a look at a lot of seats after the election. The whole election was bizarre, not just Chaffey :P As for Tasmania, ewww.... good luck with MMP! Timeshift (talk) 03:15, 30 April 2010 (UTC)

Barnstar
With the amount of work you do, it's hard not to go unnoticed! Who would have thought a few years ago that we'd have a page for every federal MP who ever existed, and a picture uploaded where available. And results for all 150 electorates. And that's just the start of your work. When I first joined four years ago, Premier and Prime Minister pages were still in their infancy (in rare cases still yet to be created) with barely any content and barely any images. Election pages apart from the latest one didn't exist. I and others got stuck in to them (i'll blow my own horn and say I reckon I contributed the most, maybe with the exception of Adam Carr who sadly is no longer on wikipedia), but you've taken it from very good to completely comprehensive. Back then, I was hoping someone might come along, see what had been done so far, see the potential, and take it to a whole new level. You sir, did that :) I must say though, wikipedia was far more fun when I was creating election articles and expanding leader articles and uploading images. These days, for me, it's not so much about creation but more about small improvements, updates as time progresses, and keeping the vandals away. I love seeing new content! Thanks again so much for your efforts, especially the SA seats... I don't know how much more can be done for the 2010 SA election now, and it's only a week and 10 days after the election! Great stuff! Maybe I could expand the campaign and the rest of the article and aim for an FA to give the 2006 SA election a twin... :) Timeshift (talk) 13:27, 30 April 2010 (UTC)


 * Ideally I would like to get SA 2010 up to FA, but it does take quite a lot of time and effort to achieve. I do admit I was more enthusiastic about the project back then than I am now, even though the quality and quantity we have for OzPol today is far better than it has ever been. I might do it when I don't have much happening and get a bit bored. Mammals? Haha! Well at least it brought you on to the only true wiki path - OzPol :) State MPs? The thought of all SA state MPs actually stopped being an unreachable fantasy when I saw how well the federal OzPol stuff came together to the point of being unbeatable as a source of comprehensive reference. But there's far far fewer sources on state compared to federal as you're no doubt aware, not to mention different and sometimes strange electoral systems, and the whole issue of an extra half century in the form of the second half of the 1800s where records are spotty at best... but all the luck to you if you end up going down that path. Timeshift (talk) 02:18, 1 May 2010 (UTC)

One Nation
All OzPol articles should be semi'd lol. Umm, perhaps. If you take the 30th out of the revisions, there's barely any vandalism at all. Today we've only had one. Maybe see how it goes over the next few days. But I can see how a semi would be appropriate and justified. Timeshift (talk) 10:03, 1 May 2010 (UTC)
 * Naturally I will monitor it, as I do any other page for a party, leader, election, etc. I have 2300 items on my watchlist, with anywhere from a dozen to several dozen edit alerts a day. My watchlist is my staple on wikipedia, it's the first and last place I go and I almost always review ones I reckon are sus. I won't be very attentive to wikipedia over the next 24 hours though. Timeshift (talk) 10:08, 1 May 2010 (UTC)
 * It was a bit of a boast, not defence. I didn't mean to imply what you're suggesting. :) Timeshift (talk) 11:13, 1 May 2010 (UTC)

Another 2010 SA curiousity...
You won't need to think hard to wonder why the informal vote in the seat of Croyden went from 3.6 to 5.1 :P Timeshift (talk) 02:56, 6 May 2010 (UTC)

Donald Norman Cameron
Yeah, I'm thinking about moving the article. I was using the National Library's Newspapers Australia service to research the 1904 Wilmot by-election in which Cameron was the winning candidate, and noticed that most of the newspapers referred to him as "Norman Cameron, son of Donald Cameron". Just want to check a few more references that that was the name he was known by, and I'll move it. Yeah, it was confusing me due to the several generations of Donald Camerons! --Canley (talk) 05:47, 28 May 2010 (UTC)

Edit warring on Patricia Petersen by IP
I'm filing a report at WP:ANEW. Just thought I'd let you know. -- Lear's Fool (talk &#124; contribs) 03:58, 6 June 2010 (UTC)
 * Hey, thanks for letting me know. I left another note on the IP's talk page, but I'm rather suspecting a bit of a COI here. Which is a pity, since if they'd produced that BBC source I might have changed my own vote on the AfD. I rather suspect it's either cruft or made up, though. Frickeg (talk) 04:00, 6 June 2010 (UTC)
 * Same here. I've made the report here.   -- Lear's Fool (talk &#124; contribs) 04:06, 6 June 2010 (UTC)

Lang labor
Yes I have wondered that too and made the change to Phillip as a little experiment - I have left the others alone. It is a difficult one because as you have said all the state members were Langists and the federal candidates were lucky to get 10%. It is also difficult for the different manifestations of Lang labor, ALP (NSW) (this does not seem to have a separate colour on wikipedia and I used the Lang Labor colour), ALP (non-communist) and finally "Lang Labor" in federal parliament. However, the ALP (NSW) party was not formed by a move from Lang but by the expulsion of the NSW executive from the Australian Labor Party by the Federal executive and it came to an end when Lang's NSW executive was again recognized by the Federal executive (Brian McKinlay, A Documentary History of the Australian Labor Movement 1850-1975 p119-20) Hawker's History of the NSW Parliament 1856-1965 isn't very good but lists the members from 1931-1936 as Lang Labor. On the other hand Antony Green's summary of the appropriate elections has them as ALP or Labor Party e.g. http://www.parliament.nsw.gov.au/resources/nswelectionsanalysis/1935/Totals.htm. I haven't got immediate access to contemporary Hansard or the Electoral Commission documents but I suspect that they would not be helpful as parties were not given official recognition on ballot papers etc. until much later. Finally I have looked at the SMH report of the election results in 1932 and 1935 when they are called variously Lang Labour or State Labour. I suspect the Labor Daily may have used different titles but its readership was not great and I do not have easy access to it. http://newspapers.nla.gov.au/ndp/del/article/16899980/1156286?zoomLevel=3 http://newspapers.nla.gov.au/ndp/del/article/17157285/1116568?zoomLevel=3

I am inclined to call the members ALP (NSW) but perhaps this should be put up for discussion and I won't change any more till then. (BTW is the number of editors interested in Australian politics diminishing - I keep seeing the same 3 or 4 names? and 2 of them seem to be in semi-retirement?)

Cheers Porturology (talk) 06:08, 14 June 2010 (UTC)

I have put it on the page and let the usual suspects (Timeshift, Rebecca, Orderinchaos) know. Lets see what happens Porturology (talk) 06:44, 14 June 2010 (UTC)

You are now a Reviewer
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Thanks
Thanks for the words of encouragement - I am aiming to fill in the NSW gaps between 1950 and the present before the state election Porturology (talk) 03:53, 17 June 2010 (UTC) Hi Frickeg - just thinking that if you do have time to contribute to NSW - I was thinking of going from 1950 forward - rather than us both accidently doing the same thing - would you be happy to go from 1988 back. Just a thought Porturology (talk) 05:56, 18 June 2010 (UTC) Yes, I guess if we keep an eye on each others contribution pages it shouldn't be a problem. Legislative Council Prior to indirect election and life appointment: in one of Jack Lang's books he wrote that he did not know how many MLCs he had to appoint to the suicide squad because no one had a list of how many had been appointed over the years and if they were still alive. He gave the example of someone who had been appointed in the 1890s and was assumed to be a labor supporter but he had not been seen in 15 years. I guess this is what happens when you don't pay politicians My impression is that the era of direct election was only a little better - 1 famously took 12 years to make her maiden speech but certainly the volumes of Hansard have lists at the front. Antony Green, about 6/12 ago, on his ABC blog said he was being employed by parliament to make up a web page on LC members and elections. I asked him where and when and didn't get a reply. Needless to say its not on parliament's site at the moment but maybe soonPorturology (talk) 06:52, 18 June 2010 (UTC)
 * Hey Frickeg,

Great work on the early 80's NSW parliament. I think there are only 29 bios to go to cover back to 1950. Rebecca and I have just about caught each other. I have an interest in McGirr and McKell so I mighht start going backwards from 1950 if that is OK. P.S. Do you want any help on the Federal results - you are doing such a good job I imagine you would like to make it your major piece but I am happy to help? Porturology (talk) 02:35, 28 June 2010 (UTC)
 * Sounds good but I think Victoria may be some time away when you consider the NSWLA had 145 members in 1901! ;)Porturology (talk) 03:26, 28 June 2010 (UTC)

Tom Armstrong
Hi Frickeg, Unfortunately there are 2 Tom Armstrongs who were members of the New South Wales parliament - 1 was an indirectly elected MLC so he is unlikely to get a wp page soon but they both came from Newcastle and the parliamentary web site doesn't give either a middle name. The MLC was a liberal, the MLA a independent Labor. I am not sure what the naming convention is in this situation - ?thoughts - what abour the post-nominals of MLA/MLC?Porturology (talk) 05:52, 17 June 2010 (UTC)


 * For what it's worth, having run into this problem with these two, I went straight to years of birth and death. It seems to be the go-to disambiguation when all else fails, and MLA/MLC seems a bit awkward - haven't seen it used anywhere else. Rebecca (talk) 06:00, 17 June 2010 (UTC)

Anonymous conspiracy theorists
Ah, the conspiracy theorists. I've dealt with some wacky ones on here over the years, but that one's pretty special. I've got it watchlisted, anyway, so if the anon insists on reverting I'll whack it.

It's certainly odd that the anon seems to know about where you edit from - I wonder if you accidentally edited while logged out or such. I didn't know you were Canberra based, anyway - were you at any of the meetups there? I have the most terrible memory for people. Rebecca (talk) 09:45, 17 June 2010 (UTC)

I wouldn't worry about him knowing where you've edited from. I highly doubt he would have been neferious in his actions, the fact the only thing he knows is where you've editted from would indicate the knowledge is IP based, so he must have seen one of your edits when you happened to be accidentally logged out. He doesn't know any more so I wouldn't worry about it. Timeshift (talk) 10:05, 17 June 2010 (UTC)


 * Oh tell me about it. The whole Stravin/Watchover thing has turned in to a pretty big racket, user accounts keep getting discovered and banned, and it may also be more than one person participating in it. Admins are monitoring and working on the situation. The big alarm bells are newbies who have instant knowledge, with a particular interest in oz politics, especially NSW. Sometimes non-politics edits are thrown in to attempt to throw people off the scent, or they'll start their edit history with non-political edits. They are quite creative in attempting to differentiate from one account to the next, especially what they put on their userpage! I wondered when this would start to happen... wikipedia came about during federal Labor opposition, and like news article comments and blogs, it tends to be those who support the opposition who tend to whinge more and be more activist. Since Dec 2006, Labor has been polling astronomically, with little comparable room for criticism. We've now had a term of a federal Labor government and the polls are back to their usual ~50-50, with criticism from incumbency abound. I have no doubt that there'll start to be more and more conflict and underhandedness on wikipedia as time goes on. Timeshift (talk) 10:15, 17 June 2010 (UTC)

Antony Green
Yes. I don't know how much he gets paid (or if he has to pay) but he has a great job which he does magnificently - he is always good to read Porturology (talk) 23:54, 19 June 2010 (UTC)
 * BTW, whenever there is NOT an election on, I often see him around my 'hood. Jherschel (talk) 14:17, 29 July 2010 (UTC)

Talkback
Bidgee (talk) 11:25, 26 June 2010 (UTC)

Parties
Thanks for running around and fixing all the party changes in the electorate articles - I should've done that ages ago! Rebecca (talk) 09:00, 3 July 2010 (UTC)


 * I don't have any more than you do, I'm afraid - that was on my list of "I'd like to have more sources before I write this," though I haven't checked Factiva yet - maybe something there?


 * Though while I'm here, can you leave Albert Sloss for me? He's a character that could do with a thorough article, and I'm working on it at the moment. Rebecca (talk) 02:56, 4 July 2010 (UTC)


 * Just checked Factiva re: Harrold, and I've got one article that sheds more light on Harrold - can either send it to you or update it myself a bit later. Rebecca (talk) 03:21, 4 July 2010 (UTC)

I'm pretty sure he's still at least alive - there's no hit for his full name in Hansard, and the name anyone who has died basically always shows up a condolence motion as a formality. Rebecca (talk) 06:04, 4 July 2010 (UTC)


 * I did find Purdue's condolence motion eventually - - unfortunately it doesn't make clear whether he died in late 1985 or early 1986. Rebecca (talk) 07:31, 4 July 2010 (UTC)

Incredible!
It looks like NSW is up to date to 1947 - a truly amazing effort ! Porturology (talk) 09:29, 4 July 2010 (UTC)


 * Yes its quite an achievement. Wouldn't it be grand if we could get it back to 1856? Porturology (talk) 22:00, 4 July 2010 (UTC)

'Biographical Register of the NSW Parliament 1901 - 1970', by Heather Radi, Peter Spearritt and Elizabeth Hinton, Canberra, A.N.U. Press, 1979) which are in a few libraries, unfortunately not at Deakin University where I have borrowing rights, once I get my draft finished I will see if I can get an inter-library loan but you may have better access. Are you happy if I do the elections from 1956 -1971? Porturology (talk) 22:09, 4 July 2010 (UTC)
 * MLCs! - it was said to be the best club in Sydney - but most of them seem to have sunk without trace. I noticed that the online hansard has lists but they only go back to the era you have already done. There were also two books of biographies printed in the 1970s, (Biographical Register of the NSW Parliament 1856 - 1901', by C.N. Connolly, Canberra, A.N.U. Press, 1983

If you're interested in doing the MLC lists, you should (I think) have enough information to do them up from the big PDF on the parliamentary website. It's what I was working from until the multiple elections prior to 1978 started to do my head in with who was elected where - picking up where I left off would just require keeping track of all the terms. Rebecca (talk) 03:19, 5 July 2010 (UTC)


 * That would be fantastic if you could put those together - I'd love to be able to work on the MLCs, but doing those pre-1978 lists just broke my brain when I tried. As for common names - I've generally found these by hunting around Google Books, Google, and other sources (i.e. NLA Newspapers, Factiva) if necessary. Google Books is especially useful nowadays, as Federation Press, which put out a lot of great stuff on Australian political history, have put most of their recent work up there. Rebecca (talk) 03:55, 7 July 2010 (UTC)


 * I'm not sure, but I think you may be reading it wrong. By my reading, everyone who was elected at that time was elected on 12 March 1970, and they were then sworn in on April 23. Am I wrong? This is why this stuff broke my brain. Rebecca (talk) 05:57, 8 July 2010 (UTC)

Scheduled elections?
Well, that makes no sense, does it?

We now have a category for scheduled elections, in which we have one that hasn't yet been scheduled. And it's in that category because a robot moved the category. How? Why? What to do about it?

HiLo48 (talk) 23:30, 7 July 2010 (UTC)

Henry Bate
Ha Ha!

Liberal Democratic Party
Hi Frickeg Yes I think the NSW project could well outdo the other states. I used the SMH files at the NLA newspaper site for the Democratic and Commonwealth Party. The commonwealth had a grand total of 3 references in the SMH. I found the book by Rodney Smith at Google:Books but it had only 3 lines. I agree that most sources call it the Liberal Democratic Party and there are quite a few references in the SMH, I haven't looked at Smith's book yet - it was basically founded by a businessman called White who I can find nothing on except he wasn't a Belltrees' White. The Herald was very negative about it - claiming they were much more interested in disrupting the conservatives than fighting Labor and (correctly as it proved) got far more media attention than their support deserved - there are also a series of minor mentions about the tortuous course of the negotiations to bring them into the Democratic Party. I was going to ask you about shifting the article to Liberal Democratic but I noted the current micro party has the LDP (Australia) tag and I think your suggestion of LDP (NSW) is the best solution. I am finishing off the 1944 election at the moment and if you are happy I will do a redirect and put in what I have (including Smiths book) tomorrow. I am not sure how the redirect will affect the party colour - but I have finally worked out how to edit colors - if I run into trouble I will let you know.

I wondered about the protocol of the tags - Grahamec seems to do an enormous number of them and I felt one should probably add them to one's article and leave the grading for someone else- I will add them from now on.Thanks

Cheers Porturology (talk) 13:00, 11 July 2010 (UTC)


 * This is the interesting thing, just to make it interesting, Eric K White was the Liberal's first PR director http://archives.smh.com.au/Default/Scripting/ArticleWin.asp?From=Search&Key=SMH/1989/11/23/5/Ar00504.xml&CollName=SMH_1986_1990&DOCID=2543283&PageLabelPrint=&Skin=Master&enter=true&AppName=2&AW=1278910008494&sPublication=SMH&sScopeID=UDR3&sSorting=Score,desc&sQuery=%22Eric%20White%22&rEntityType=&sDateFrom=%2530%2531%252f%2530%2531%252f%2531%2539%2538%2531&sDateTo=%2533%2531%252f%2531%2532%252f%2531%2539%2539%2535&ViewMode=HTML but the guy who founded the LDP was Sir Ernest K White who spent the next 10 years trying to disrupt the Liberals but when everyone else was dead claimed to be their 'real father' of the party. http://archives.smh.com.au/Default/Scripting/ArticleWin.asp?From=Search&Key=SMH/1981/08/01/37/Ar03700.xml&CollName=SMH_1981_1985&DOCID=153642&PageLabelPrint=&Skin=Master&enter=true&AppName=2&AW=1278910008494&sPublication=SMH&sScopeID=UDR3&sSorting=Score,desc&sQuery=SIR%20ERNEST%20WHITE&rEntityType=&sDateFrom=%2530%2531%252f%2530%2531%252f%2531%2539%2538%2531&sDateTo=%2533%2531%252f%2531%2532%252f%2531%2539%2539%2535&ViewMode=HTML

The most interesting thing in the second article is that E K White (Eric) was the secretary of the LDP while E K White (Ernest) was the chairman and founder. I hope those faifax archive links come through Cheers Porturology (talk) 04:54, 12 July 2010 (UTC)


 * A "Macarthur-Onslow" as a candidate - I think that would be worth at least 5% and probably more of the vote in southern NSW. They sound an interesting lot, particularly White, the Fairfax article has him, at age 89, and the reporter drinking Minchinbury champagne in his office at 10 am while he bags Menzies. -There is also an article at NLA newspapers where their rising star, a certain W C Wentworth, resigns in high dudgeon because he claims White, who was a timber merchant and owned a massive part of Cremorne, was channeling the Free Trade Party. Porturology (talk) 05:28, 12 July 2010 (UTC)


 * Sorry I thought I had saved to my userpage rather than main space. I have added the rest of the story that I am aware of and incorporated your copyeds. Well done on the LC lists - if you are taking them from the parliamentary web site document - it looks like a very arduous process! Porturology (talk) 07:34, 13 July 2010 (UTC)


 * I was beginning to get that impression! The SMH's editorial prior to the 1944 election is interesting -as you know they have only once supported the Labor party in a NSW election. The 1944 editorial admits that the conservatives are in a complete mess but they are still better than McKell because McKell was once associated with Lang! Porturology (talk) 07:38, 13 July 2010 (UTC)

Boothby
Thank you for such a useful answer. Cheers, Pdfpdf (talk) 14:11, 25 July 2010 (UTC)
 * And thank you also for the cleanup. Pdfpdf (talk) 14:54, 25 July 2010 (UTC)

The Climate Sceptics
Done! Rebecca (talk) 13:03, 26 July 2010 (UTC)


 * Good luck with that. I tried hard to find info on them, and came up with one paragraph of about three lines. Amazing considering they've been registered at state level for two or three years. Rebecca (talk) 13:14, 26 July 2010 (UTC)

Zaya Toma
Hi. Thanks for the note about the prod @ Zaya Toma. The page was created as a result of a redlink reduction patrol of Aus politics articles. To be honest, it's been a while since I edited anything Australian. I left a note on the article talk page not long after it was started when notability was questioned. I'm not going to fight for it to be saved - the red links and a smattering of articles suggested he might have been notable (and so the article was created) but I can appreciate arguements to the contrary. Thanks for keeping me up to date. Stalwart111 (talk) 10:38, 27 July 2010 (UTC)

Blair
From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia Jump to: navigation, search [edit] Division of Blair

I noticed that it has nine borders from the map of the electorate. The wiki pg for Blair has a link to it. And with Blair being a bellwether, Id say it is based on defintion of bellwether. I think its fair to state it as being a bellwether as long as it isnt refferred to as being one of the main, most well know bellwethers. I.E the main bellwethers being Eden Monaro, Leichardt, Makin, Lindsay.--60.225.52.199 (talk) 11:24, 29 July 2010 (UTC)

Senate candidates
Any Senate tables you want me to work on? I was going to do some but I don't want to overlap if you're doing the same ones. --Canley (talk) 11:43, 30 July 2010 (UTC)
 * Wouldn't mind doing Victoria if you're not doing that one. --Canley (talk) 11:44, 30 July 2010 (UTC)
 * Thanks, I'll do Victoria, quite a big one so probably the only one I'll get done tonight. --Canley (talk) 11:45, 30 July 2010 (UTC)
 * Yep, and I left out... the Secular Party by the looks of it! CCC is fixed, replaced with Building Australia (still a redlink). It is fun! --Canley (talk) 12:53, 30 July 2010 (UTC)

Speaking of errors, according to the AEC site, Ronnie Fleay, the mayor of Exmouth is an incumbent Senator. Eh? --Canley (talk) 13:13, 30 July 2010 (UTC)
 * OK, finished WA, mind having a look and seeing if you can spot any grievous errors? --Canley (talk) 13:36, 30 July 2010 (UTC)
 * Well done! You were on the money with Senator Kerry O'Brien. Jherschel (talk) 15:20, 30 July 2010 (UTC)
 * Ok. Got it. Yes. And the absence of FFP candidates in NSW & Tas is interesting. Yet running in every seat in SA, Vic and Qld. And just about all in WA. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Jherschel (talk • contribs) 15:58, 30 July 2010 (UTC)
 * Hey, want to check out Cheryl Kernot and give me some feedback? I've done a significant revision and would appreciate your comments. Cheers Jherschel (talk) 09:24, 31 July 2010 (UTC)
 * Fanks. Points notes. Yes, it still has a anti-Kernot POV. Some improved sources are needed. I'm now working on Senator Gary Humphries. Jherschel (talk) 10:11, 31 July 2010 (UTC)

Building Australia Party
I finally worked out what the deal is with these guys. Their name is literal - they're a front group for the building industry. Practically every candidate has an email address linked to a building company. Rebecca (talk) 13:50, 30 July 2010 (UTC)

ACT elections and electorates
Howdy. I've just finished off the ACT electorates and working my way through the election results and candidates. How do you suggest the results be shown? Any best practice examples? —Preceding unsigned comment added by Jherschel (talk • contribs) 10:38, 1 August 2010 (UTC)
 * Thanks for the feedback, once again. I'm getting used to it and appreciate your suggestions. This time, signed Jherschel (talk) 11:19, 2 August 2010 (UTC)
 * BTW, what's your thoughts on the bias here? Jherschel (talk) 12:52, 2 August 2010 (UTC)
 * Must be just me, then. What Are you working on? Jherschel (talk) 13:05, 2 August 2010 (UTC)
 * Thanks for that. Who would think I couldn't spell pollie! Jherschel (talk) 09:27, 4 August 2010 (UTC)

Thanks. And added Harold Hird. I recall him being 'dismissed' from the Libs, but at this stage can't find any reliable source. Jherschel (talk) 10:35, 4 August 2010 (UTC)
 * No hassles re Kep Enderby. BTW, I ran into Tom Uren at a lunch function on Wednesday. He was looking good for a WWII veteran and 89yo. Check out Tony De Domenico. I seem to recall that there was some scandal that sent his bags packing - something to do with a lady lover and the Kingston Foreshore Authority. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Jherschel (talk • contribs) 13:27, 6 August 2010 (UTC)
 * All the elected Members are done - stubs in most cases. I'm working my way through the following ACT general elections: 1989, 1992, and 1995. To follow are 1998 and 2001; plus a revision of 2004. I need to go back and do writ/polling information. It was interesting to look at some of the candidates, including Annette Ellis and Steve Whan that had a run at ACT before hitting Federal and State politics, respectively. And Harold Hird must get the award for running more times (unsucessfully) than any other candidate! Jherschel (talk) 15:31, 7 August 2010 (UTC)
 * Thanks re tables for 1989 and 1992. I knew Fiona Patten was stiring something inside me; now I know.... Night Jherschel (talk) 16:13, 7 August 2010 (UTC)
 * Do you have any suggestions...I'm looking for best practice examples of writing up text for both the results and overview sections of each of the following:     Jherschel (talk) 12:49, 8 August 2010 (UTC)
 * * Australian Capital Territory general election, 1989
 * * Australian Capital Territory general election, 1992
 * * Australian Capital Territory general election, 1995
 * * Australian Capital Territory general election, 1998
 * * Australian Capital Territory general election, 2001
 * * Australian Capital Territory general election, 2004
 * * Australian Capital Territory general election, 2008

Me? Set the standard? I'm only a newbie here... I'm learning from you pros! Night Jherschel (talk) 13:32, 8 August 2010 (UTC)
 * Thanks for the corrections on both Michael Moore and Bernard Collaery. I must have been tired, with the latter. Does the article now constitute a stub? I'm tackling Residents Rally next. Moore's article appears initially written by himself, and the articles on Hunter, Bresnan, Rattenbury and Le Couteur written by someone close to the ACT Greens, as they were essentially carbon copies of the same article, with sight differences. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Jherschel (talk • contribs) 07:46, 15 August 2010 (UTC)
 * Gotcha. Yeah, I noticed you did a partial re-write a while ago on the Greens. I was interested to read in Hunter that her mother was a Liberal Member of the ACT Advisory Council. What was/is the ACT Advisory Council? And thanks for the tips. Jherschel (talk) 08:58, 15 August 2010 (UTC)
 * Thanks for the corrections. This is taking forever. Without any info from the time (esp 2001 election), I can only work off the result and not the run of events. Only three to complete now, 1992, 1995, & 1998. Cheers Jherschel (talk) 09:27, 5 September 2010 (UTC)

Links
Hi Frickeg: I'd like to add my appreciation for the amount of work you've obviously committed to this entry. However just one issue: my understanding is that wikipedia encourages internal links. Moreover, and I could be wrong here, I don't think there are any wikipedia policies or guidelines that would indicate a link ought to be limited to someone who is a sitting politician. I note that you reversed the link the "Paul Stevenson". Just wondering if you might reconsider this? Jamessmithpage (talk) 23:28, 2 August 2010 (UTC)

FYI?
Cheers, Pdfpdf (talk) 12:08, 4 August 2010 (UTC)

Legislative Council members
I noticed you removed the MLC title from the Robert Brokenshire page. Are you suggesting it should be analogously removed from Gail Gago? MileyFan1990 (talk) 16:47, 5 August 2010 (UTC)

NSW state elections
Thanks Yes I am not sure where to go with the re-distributions etc. Askin was notorious (at least among the ALP) for trying to set up a Playmander and the redistribution 10 months after his election was certainly a winner. Any suggestions on representing the redistribution or the change of representation of seats (seeing so many were replaced, abolished or created) are welcome. However, this is low priority compared to the work you and Rebecca are doing on the Federal election ( I am just so appalled by the lack of interest in issues at the moment that I can't get any enthusiasm for it). Cheers Porturology (talk) 13:29, 6 August 2010 (UTC)
 * Good point - it is a busy article at the moment and the redistribution is already effectively seen in the seats changing hands table- I tried the table for the 1966 redistribution when I re-read my efforts describing the redistribution at New South Wales state election, 1962 - it was a smaller re-distribution but the prose was just so boring. I will play with the prose a little. Good luck with the federal scene - for a change I think it is even more boring than state politics! Porturology (talk) 01:31, 7 August 2010 (UTC)


 * It is something I have thought about for a little while and was experimenting with (I am not quite sure how to do that in the sandpit). I guess there question here is what the MPs meant when they called themselves Independent X and I think they did this for a few reasons. 1) When the party was a shambles and there was no central body eg. urban conservatives in 1943, 2) Expulsion from the party and the MP remained in parliament and still considered themselves to be part of that party - the best example of this is Arthur Hill Griffith who always said he had not left the Labor Party, the Party had left him. 3) Loss of pre-selection and the MP still wins the seat -often winning the seat depended on the Independent X designation 4) on the coalition side the rules against running 3 cornered contests could be overcome by being an "independent" Country and then joining caucus as soon as parliament met. Each of these categories is different to being an 'independent' and the designation the candidate took deliberately emphasised this difference. My argument is that the term Independent X should not be hyperlinked - so it does not and never can lead to a party article or indicate that there was a formal organization. However, giving the candidate a suitably toned colour indicates that they had aligned themselves with a party without being a formal member and were therefore not really independents but more like "fellow travelers". (I also like colouring in the little boxes in the summaries of votes!). I guess it has been convention for a long time to give them the grey colour and I will reverse Darby. I would like to suggest discussion on the wp:Australian politics page but our last efforts with 1934 Lang labor did not elicit much response and with the current election on it would be unlikely to produce any sort of consensus. Porturology (talk) 04:31, 7 August 2010 (UTC)

So many DOBs...
I can't begin to imagine how many women you've offended by giving away their age. Some are rather vicious about it... what's the bet there'll be a few reverts and counter reverts of people who don't want their DOB up? Funny stuff :D Timeshift (talk) 23:17, 6 August 2010 (UTC)

Deakin
hi new user and all not sure how all this works yet, i noticed you changed my edit for Deakin, what for i mean i understand doing it when its just random nonsense but when its factual and relevant what is the motivation behinds its removal then? —Preceding unsigned comment added by Wal0013a (talk • contribs) 16:35, 7 August 2010 (UTC)

D'oh!
Good pickup! I knew it, I dunno why I wrote SA LC... bah! Thanks. Timeshift (talk) 05:53, 8 August 2010 (UTC)
 * Yes that should be fine. Check out my last edit btw... Timeshift (talk) 05:59, 8 August 2010 (UTC)

Some pages to keep an eye on
Patricia Petersen (oh it's galling to have to maintain a page one proposed for deletion! The Petersen brigade appears to be making forays), Neil Zabel (prodded), Shayne Neumann, Ed Husic (the latter needs a big cleanup if anyone's got time, otherwise I'll tackle it tomorrow). Frickeg (talk) 13:59, 8 August 2010 (UTC)
 * Ed Husic is done. Jherschel (talk) 02:43, 9 August 2010 (UTC)
 * That must be fun; de-linking in non-notables! Jherschel (talk) 12:36, 10 August 2010 (UTC)

It's begun..........
Batten down the hatches!!! :) Timeshift (talk) 07:22, 21 August 2010 (UTC)

New MPs
I would like to see some greater specificity around this position. It is my understanding that no result is official until the Divisional Returning Officer declares the poll. Regards, WWGB (talk) 01:47, 22 August 2010 (UTC)
 * What you up to? Anything you want me to work on? Jherschel (talk) 06:02, 22 August 2010 (UTC)

Tony Crook WA Nats
Hi, I noticed in your edit summary for the Division of O'Connor you wrote that "I think we agree to list the WA Nats separately". I know that some editors previously, particularly an editor in South Australia, try and are usually successfull in making it look as if there is a division between the eastern states Nationals and WA as well as SA Nationals federally, however when looking at the party registration and division returns for the next member for O'Connor, Crook is listed as 'National Party of Australia' and on the ballott paper as a candidate for 'The Nationals' exactly the same as say Hartsuyker in the Division of Cowper in NSW. The Nationals federal website listed Crook as their candidate So what would your intentions here be? Cheers, Романов (talk) 14:24, 22 August 2010 (UTC)

Julia Gillard
Re your edit to [[Julia Gillard], I don't want to spark an edit war. I draw your attention to my comment at Talk:Julia Gillard. According to the ABC, Labor has 72 seats and there are 4 in doubt, so it is possible (though unlikely) that they could win 76 seats outright. Can you see your way to reverting this, or feel free to add your reasoning on that talk page? Cheers. —sroc (talk) 14:07, 23 August 2010 (UTC)

election
So what's the story, here? I've just left a note about this on the Ryan page; did he win the vote or not? And he's listed as an Independent on the candidate page; is that correct or not? You reverted my change with the edit summary "Dickson notionally Labor, and we don't count defections" doesn't come over as NPOV; do you have any grounds for this, or are you just fudging the result for the world at large? Moonraker12 (talk) 14:19, 23 August 2010 (UTC)


 * I wasn't "objecting", I was trying to make sense of it. I was following some links to fathom out this Coalition thing, and these looked like they were wrong. I can't say I'm any the wiser, but I certainly don't want to get stuck in an argument over politics, particularly if it's somebody else's elections :) Moonraker12 (talk) 14:32, 23 August 2010 (UTC)


 * Thanks; for now, why is Dickson notionally Labor? The link you gave (which is useful; thanks for that!) says Dutton was the LNP candidate, and the previous member; and McNamara doesn't seem to have collected enough votes to change that.Moonraker12 (talk) 14:48, 23 August 2010 (UTC)


 * OK, makes sense...
 * The coalition question (and I can’t find where I saw it, now) listed CLP and LNP as members of the Coalition at Federal level. The CLP page mentions one member but the LNP page doesn’t have any. So I was just wanting to find out who they were. But I'm assuming they are separate parties to Liberal and National; is that the actually the case?
 * The other thought was about the Independent MPs; but I can check their individual pages for that.Moonraker12 (talk) 15:06, 23 August 2010 (UTC)


 * Thanks for that (and for taking the trouble to answer my questions!). It's getting clearer... Good luck with what you are doing! Moonraker12 (talk) 14:06, 25 August 2010 (UTC)

Reply
Bidgee (talk) 07:58, 24 August 2010 (UTC)

Na na na na na na an na Batman!
Howdy, in the seat movements section of Australian federal election, 2010, you placed Batman in there, I see where your comming from, but when reading the results on the AEC website, the ALP has 53.14% of the primary vote, so it is impossible for it to change hands or in this case be a 'seat movement'. So why must it be included? Cheers Романов (talk) 10:09, 24 August 2010 (UTC)
 * Oh, no problem, I would say they may have forgotten about it or just thought because it was the safest ALP seat in the previous parliament that it should be calculated last. Cheers, Романов (talk) 11:20, 24 August 2010 (UTC)

Your thoughts?
Given your interest and expertise elsewhere, I thought you might like to have a look at the RFC going on over at Talk:Hindmarsh Island bridge controversy. There's one particular editor who is pushing for a disclaimer to be included in the article to account for the "secret womens' business" aspects of the content, despite WP:NDA. I've argued for the continuation of the WP guidelines, even in this instance. Any thoughts? Thanks, Stalwart111 (talk) 06:28, 27 August 2010 (UTC).

Post-election pendulum for the Australian federal election, 2010
I've gotta run, would you mind going over the pendulum? I'm sure i've got some names there of MPs who've retired but I didn't update... thanks. Timeshift (talk) 07:34, 27 August 2010 (UTC)
 * Agreed, I was hoping you'd know the templates! Timeshift (talk) 07:45, 27 August 2010 (UTC)
 * I'm not too fussed really. Timeshift (talk) 09:44, 27 August 2010 (UTC)

Talk:Revenue Tariff Party
Should have discussed first. A reliable source though. Grant |  Talk  07:37, 12 September 2010 (UTC)

Replied there. Grant |  Talk  08:36, 12 September 2010 (UTC)

And again. Grant |  Talk  03:55, 13 September 2010 (UTC)