User talk:GloryRoad66/Archive 3

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Garage Rock Article
Thank you for your kind words; I have a lot of good memories of putting those Wikipedia articles together. I might have to give you a Barnstar award for all of that great work on the garage rock article; it looks like there wasn't much there before you got hold of it. :-) I would encourage you to come up with a separate article on the recent garage rock revival; I think it is important enough to talk about on its own.  The 1980's revival generated a lot of wonderful music, but the 2000's revival finally got garage rock into the mainstream IMHO.  As for myself, I have always worked more on the margins rather than on major articles like garage rock.  For the last five or six years, I have mostly been writing articles on what I call "under appreciated rock bands" – bands and artists that don't yet have a Wikipedia article.  Bohemian Vendetta was one of my UARB's, and I am sure glad to see that you have written an article on that wonderful band.  Anyway, the UARB articles started out on my Facebook page, but I have been building a website for them more recently.  Check it out if you are interested:  https://sites.google.com/site/underappreciatedrockbands/home. Keep up the great writing! Shocking Blue (talk) 13:47, 11 September 2015 (UTC)


 * Thank you for those kind words and thank you for the wonderful articles you have written. And of course, the G.R. revival is a topic rich with opportunities. Garagepunk66 (talk) 01:56, 12 September 2015 (UTC)

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 * That's OK--the picture in that file is of the album cover artwork for the LP, not the CD--I had wanted the CD artwork for the article about the CD. I accidently downloaded the LP cover picture, but then switched to the correct image for the CD.  When the LP article  gets done later, we can then locate a new image for the  LP cover artwork.  So, you can go ahead and delete that now unused image.  Garagepunk66 (talk) 01:51, 26 September 2015 (UTC)

Garage comps, etc.
TheGracefulSlick, I know you mentioned articles for the Garage Beat 66 series. Well, perhaps I could do Vol. 1, 2, 5, &, 7, but I am open to any other ideas you might have about how to proceed with articles on the series. And, thanks as always. Garagepunk66 (talk) 22:50, 8 September 2015 (UTC)
 * That works well for me, I'll try and get started tomorrow. I have had a boatload of article ideas in the last day after searching for some rockabilly artists. In less than an hour, I found a dozen that are so deserving of articles. I never expected that so many of them have been neglected until now. If that is something you are also interested in doing, I can list a few you could write about.TheGracefulSlick (talk) 00:36, 9 September 2015 (UTC)


 * Cool beans! If you would like me to do some rockabilly cats, just recommend some names and I'll be glad to work on 'em.  I also plan to do some of those blues artists you recommended too--I have their names in the archive and if you have any more, I'll be glad include them as well.  You'll notice that I've been I've "whittling" away at the psychedelic garage section in my sandbox numero dos.  I'm "chiseling" away at it, in hopes that I can get it just right. I hope I'm not taking the sociological and philosophical dimension too far.  But, you are welcome to critique that section--if you have any thoughts to improve it.  And, I am glad you gave me some good ideas for diversifying citations in the GR article--I'm going to get to work on that too. Garagepunk66 (talk) 01:20, 9 September 2015 (UTC)
 * Well two guys that stood out for me were "Peanuts" Wilson and Dwight Pullen. I can give you more if you aren't into them or you finished them. I'll be happy to look at the section if you want. I still think you should also message Binksternet because he has a different perspective to the article. I could give him a message if you'd like, but I won't if you are against the idea.TheGracefulSlick (talk) 03:14, 9 September 2015 (UTC)


 * I'd be happy to do those musicians and look forward to listening to them--I know I will like them. As for the psychedelic section of the G.R. I wouldn't mind if you look over it my sandbox.  And then, later after I have entered that section into the article I could get Binksternet to provide some feedback about what it would take to get the article up to snuff to be uprated to whatever level.  I would love to try for FA like maybe in 6 months or so, but I know that I'd need to add things from certain sections of the country that are under-represented now--there is the difficulty in obtaining choice citations.  I realize that the big challenge in dealing with the topic of 60s garage is the lack of choice sources.  But, I believe that reviewers might take this into account and realize that the article just wouldn't be complete without mention of clusters of regional bands, even though none of those bands has had books written about them (gosh there aren't many books about the garage genre as a whole)--but I think that reviewers would understand that garage rock, by its very nature is a genre about a plethora of small-time grass roots bands and that the only way to do justice to the genre is to give a certain amount of them coverage.  But, I'd be the first to admit that the challenge of choice sources may rule-out FA.  If Binksternet thinks the best the article could achieve is GA or maybe A, I could adjust my sights accordingly--I'd make a point not to get heartbroken over that.  In the final analysis, I believe in doing what is best for the article and making it the best it can be, regardless of what reviewers not familiar with the genre may think.  I know people such as you and Ghmyrtle (and SabreBD, who has been on other projects for awile) will appreciate it, even if no one else cares, and quite frankly your three well-informed opinions mean the most to me. Garagepunk66 (talk) 22:23, 9 September 2015 (UTC)
 * I think that would be wise, Binksternet has gotten 21 articles to GA status, four to FA, and over 50 reviewed for GA so he knows more about it than I possibly could (he might even review it for you too). I think you are required to ask for GA review before you can go to FA. I looked at the requirements for FA and the first thing it mentions is "Article passed Good-Article review" so keep that in mind. I noticed you are working on my favorite volume of the Garage Beat series. Personally, my favorite track is the title track. I have everything possible on the Human Expression, they are among my favorite bands. I thought it was funny that a few of the bands I worked on are all in that one album. I guess the series "knew" which groups are my favorites and put it into that album.TheGracefulSlick (talk) 23:50, 9 September 2015 (UTC)


 * I can see that their marketing strategy worked! It's my favorite in the series too. I will come back and add some stuff from the liner notes for further enrichment, so right now it will look a little bare, but I can fix that soon, don't worry.  I went ahead and put a couple of things that are alluded to in the liner notes, so I can source that, when I fetch the liner notes.  As for the G.R., maybe I should go GA first, then FA later.  I could probably get GA relatively soon, once I enhance diversify some of the citations (as best as is possible with what is available, of course).  I'll get to doing that soon, but I'm on a tight time string right now, so I'll get to it once I can find time. Garagepunk66 (talk) 02:11, 10 September 2015 (UTC)
 * The only setback is, while I know you will obtain GA, just getting a review takes weeks, even months. For instance, I submitted Country Joe and the Fish for review two months ago and still no takers. So you'll have to be ridiculously patient even after months of work which is a little unfair.TheGracefulSlick (talk) 02:32, 10 September 2015 (UTC)


 * I wish I had more time on my hands right now to do reviewing. As you can imagine, I've  gotten busy with my work schedule and have a narrow window of Wiki-time--just finding an hour or two a night for writing articles is about all there is.  Nonetheless, I am confident that the Country Joe article will get a review soon and make GA, so good luck.  However, if no one reviews it by a certain time, I might be able to get to it on a holiday.  I know that that seems like a long time, but I'm sure you understand.  Garagepunk66 (talk) 00:37, 11 September 2015 (UTC)
 * P.S. Thanks for the touch-ups on the GB66 Vol. 5 article. Thanks for putting the minor words (prepositions & articles) in lower case.  I usually cut and paste the song titles from places like Discogs, etc., who always seem to capitalize minor words, so in the future, I need to remember to fix them (but I always forget).  So thanks for fixing that. Garagepunk66 (talk) 01:02, 11 September 2015 (UTC)


 * To TheGracefulSlick and Garagepunk66: The best source for garage and psych comp albums that I know of is on the Ugly Things website, called "Searchin' for Shakes"; it is amazing how many there are, and they are fully indexed by band name, song, dates, etc.  Apparently their database is down for now, for some reason, but here is a URL for an alternate version:  http://www.kiwi-us.com/~hitomi/searchin.htm . Shocking Blue (talk) 13:25, 11 September 2015 (UTC)

GP66 I was just using the Country Joe and the Fish article as an example. Unless you enjoy it, I don't want you thinking you have to review it. I'm willing to wait as long as it takes and I was also considering to offer the review to editors if there are still no takers. As for the Garage Beat article, it's no big deal that you forget, we're all human, and I always scope on those details because I make those same mistakes.TheGracefulSlick (talk) 18:56, 11 September 2015 (UTC)


 * I just noticed that you've got a reviewer for the County Joe, article. Please do not be mad at me for not getting to it myself.  I am so swamped with stuff from work, I haven't had much Wiki-hours, and this week I've become particularly occupied.  I been wanting to keep the small amount of time I have devoted to writing.  I'm sure you understand.  But, good luck on the Country Joe review.  I am confident it will go GA. Garagepunk66 (talk) 18:56, 12 September 2015 (UTC)


 * Why would I be mad? Your schedule does not revolve around me, I want you to do what you want to do. I'd much more prefer you create new articles and expand old ones than be bogged down by a review. I've actually been waiting for a long-overdue book so I can start editing the Jefferson Airplane articles I talked about. It's making me a little anxious, but there still is a lot of other tasks to complete. Just curious, other than the Garage Beat comps, what ideas did you have for articles you want to write?TheGracefulSlick (talk) 00:59, 13 September 2015 (UTC)


 * And, of course that is correct--it was just my way of recognizing how much the review means to you--I didn't want you to think I was taking that fact lightly or trying to give the review the "shrift." That's all.  By the way, you will notice I'm doing an article on the Lemon Fog from Houston.  So I know you're gonna dig the article! Garagepunk66 (talk) 01:21, 13 September 2015 (UTC)
 * PS: Thanks for removing that that awful "needs more references" template which that ActionHero (Rambo) inserted @ the top of the Lemon Fog article--I wanted to do it myself, but I didn't want to get taken away to the "block" detention cell by Wiki-police. However, I do want to find more references, but there weren't enough to be found.  I want to by their CD comp and see if the liner notes can shed more light on their membership roster post-1964--then I could make lists accordingly.  I don't yet have the album, but have enjoyed listening to their songs on the YouTube.  I especially love  "Summer" and "Echoes of Time," which I believe are majestic songs.  There is the officially released version of "Echoes of Time," but my favorite may well be the alternate mix (without the flanging effects), which strangely, I think even better captures the deeper substance and "soul" of the song [].  This song epitomizes so much of what I love about the 60s.  ...As for other articles, I would like to do some band articles, but I have to make a list.  I might try a couple of articles on blues singers--maybe some of the names you mentioned.  Oh, by the way, I really like the new article on the Basement Wall.  They were a great band from the "Red Stick" upriver. Garagepunk66 (talk) 23:58, 14 September 2015 (UTC)


 * It was no biggy, the user really should not have added that template since the references explained what you were trying to convey. Since you mentioned future band articles, the next one I was going to write is the Fallen Angels from Washington D.C. I really have to shorten this list on the rockabilly artists though. By the way, I am really limited on time to edit for the next few days, so I do not want you to think I'm ignoring you. I enjoy our conversations, but I just had to finish the Basement Wall article. I look forward to seeing what blues musician you choose first, if that is your next step, since there are so many deserving musicians that still need some recognition.TheGracefulSlick (talk) 02:36, 15 September 2015 (UTC)


 * Oh don't worry you're not the only busy one! Geez, I've been logging mid-quarter reports & grading tests, papers, planning, parent calling, etc., so I haven't had much Wiki-time either. But, I wish you the best with all the your tests, papers, etc.  By the way, I love the Fallen Angels!  When you finish their article, I've got some additional printed stuff I could add.  And, of course, I enjoyed reading the Basement Wall's piece.  GB66 is ready to enter a little "quickie" article on GB66 Vol. 1.  Enjoy! Garagepunk66 (talk) 02:46, 15 September 2015 (UTC)


 * That would be great, I'll make sure to tell you when the article is complete. I really enjoy the GB66 articles too, especially when the series is complete since it really jells the whole thing together. In other news, I'm happy to report the Country Joe and the Fish GA review is going well. All I had to do is make some easy rewording so I think the review will be speedy.TheGracefulSlick (talk) 03:17, 15 September 2015 (UTC)


 * I know you're gonna love the new article on the Painted Faces. And, I also did vol. 2 of Garage Beat '66.  Good luck with Country Joe...I know it will go GA!  By the way, you had mentioned the Back From the Grave series: I was thinking we could divvy it up into halves, just as with the other two series.  I could do all of the six CDs and two of the LP's (because I own all of the CD's)  and you could do eight of the LPs (because you have a turntable and I imagine that you have most of them on vinyl), but if you have any other ideas about how to do the series, just let me know. Garagepunk66 (talk) 19:49, 16 September 2015 (UTC)


 * I am not sure how involved I can be in the Back from the Grave series. I am trying to focus on bringing the Music Machine article to GA (needs a lot of work), work on the Jefferson Airplane article soon, and finish anything left from the Teenage Shutdown! series. By the way, is there anything I have missed since last messaging you? I mean any new articles you have worked on or big updates to other articles. I like reading anything new you create and I know I have missed quite a bit.TheGracefulSlick (talk) 02:21, 20 September 2015 (UTC)


 * Good luck with those projects. I did an article on the Painted Faces, which I know you'll like a lot.  I'm working on one for the Bojax, that I should have probably in the can tomorrow.  I'll do another BFTG soon too.  But, you don't need to worry about BFTG for the time being--no hurry.  I could get a bunch of the BFTG's in the next month or so, and you could do the others later.  I might focus on the CD's, since those are what I currently own.  Garagepunk66 (talk) 03:27, 20 September 2015 (UTC)


 * Yes I do like the Painted Faces article, you always achieve high-quality in your work. Thanks for understanding that I may not get to a lot of the BFTG series. It is not that I do not want to, it is just that I feel I have laid-off on a lot of my other projects for a little too long. By the way, since I haven't done this in awhile, I wanted to recommend the song "Dirty Ol' Man" by the Electras. I think you will really enjoy it and I hope I can write an article on the band sometime soon.TheGracefulSlick (talk) 16:32, 20 September 2015 (UTC)
 * Great song! I love the Electras.  They later changed their name (for awhile) to 'Twas Brillig (I think taken from Lewis Carol)--I think because they found out that there had been another earlier band called the Electras (one of whose members I think was Secreatry of State John Kerry).  As 'Twas Briilig, they did a great I war protest song called "This Week's Children." I was thinking about an doing an article on them too, but if you want to do it, that's fine--however, if you were to let me do it, it would free you up for some of your other projects--and I promise (solemnly swear) that I'd go the extra mile to make it really good.  Garagepunk66 (talk) 22:52, 20 September 2015 (UTC)
 * Well I was planning to write the article after the Fallen Angels one is complete today. I can't really stop you from writing about the Electras, but the band was going to be my next priority to write about. By the way, I was just informed that I reached GA for Country Joe and the Fish, so thanks for the encouragement you gave me through the whole process. I am extremely happy that such an important San Francisco band has an article that reflects on their impact to music history.TheGracefulSlick (talk) 23:26, 20 September 2015 (UTC)


 * Way to go with the GA on the Country Joe article. If you'd like to do the Electras article, that's fine with me--I didn't realize that you had prioritized it.  But, if you end up getting busy with other things and then want me to do it, just let me know--  I'd be available in that event--but only if you asked me to do so. Garagepunk66 (talk) 23:45, 20 September 2015 (UTC)

Well when I was looking through my list I saw them and actually forgot why I listed them. After I reheard the song I knew I had to start a project on them as soon as possible. I apologize if this upsets you a little. Oh and my friends were discussing this question I am sure you would like. It is: Out of all the singles from the 1960s that never became a national hit, which one do you most believe should have made the Top 40? (for me it was the Music Machine's "Double Yellow Line", in case you were wondering)TheGracefulSlick (talk) 01:39, 21 September 2015 (UTC)


 * As far as singles go, there must have been 1000 that could have become big hits nationally. "Double Yellow Line" is definitely one (and I love that song).  "It's a Cryin' Shame," by the Gentlemen could have made it.  The brisker alternate take of "No More", by the Moring Dew could have been big--the officially released version on the Fairyland single is good but not quite as good--I can never understand why their producer and label allowed a second-quality take to be released as the official single--that was a self-inflicted wound.  But then, neither Vandan or Fairyland really had enough money or promotion, nor the kind of merchandising ability to move mass inventory on the any real scale, to support a big national hit.  They would have had to sell the rights of the songs to the big labels (to promote and manufacture), or made a distribution-sharing deal with the biggies (as was sometimes done for songs deemed to have potential).  But, neither of the labels had the foresight or wherewithal or to do that.  The owner of Vandan went broke right after "It's a Cryin' Shame" was released.  The band members went to his house and found everything gone and a "For Sale" sign out if front!  I suppose that the little labels didn't have as much savvy as the biggies, but I still love 'em anyway and would take the little "mom and pop" family-owned operations any day over the corporations.  On that topic, I have  feeling that some of the little labels were Mafia-owned, but I can't prove that.  This thread is getting pretty long, so I'll start a new one below. Garagepunk66 (talk) 01:54, 26 September 2015 (UTC)

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Music, etc.
I created a new thread here to discuss music, etc. Garagepunk66 (talk) 08:35, 21 September 2015 (UTC)
 * Sorry for my unexpected absence, my computer is in need of repairs. I can only send this message before I, again, will be unable to contact you for a little bit. Since I can't do much I want you to know you can write the Electras article as it only seems fair. I'll try to get back to work as soon as my computer will allow. For now you will need to protect the music articles in case anyone gets some bad idea. Talk to you soon, friend.TheGracefulSlick (talk) 00:38, 28 September 2015 (UTC)


 * Don't worry, I insist on waiting and giving you the opportunity to do the Electras article--that is the only fair and right thing to do, because you were the one who first stated the intention to do so, and you made it clear you badly wanted to do that article--and I could now do nothing else but honor that request. One thing that I will never do is try "snatch" an article up from under you or anybody--I may discuss the topic of an article we both want to do, but, then, once we have an agreement about who will do it--then, I will make sure it goes to the agreed person--in this case it is you.  Obviously, if there was a situation where you (or I) had to be gone for a much longer time than this, then we could give the "OK" at that much later time.  I want you to have the peace of knowing that while your computer is down, your intended projects will be there safely waiting for you when you return.  You have always done that courtesy for me.  By the way, I know all-too-well the feeling frustration about not having a working computer (I've been there before).  I consider it a loss to all of us at Wikipedia when you cannot be here, so I wish for your speedy return.  I am confident that you will have the computer fixed soon!  And, thank you for everything. Garagepunk66 (talk) 02:48, 28 September 2015 (UTC)
 * P.S.: I'll keep an eye your articles to make sure the deltionists don't cause any trouble--I'll go to the noticeboards and yell if I have to!.Garagepunk66 (talk) 02:57, 28 September 2015 (UTC)
 * Well actually my computer seems stable for now. I'm surprised since it has been crazy for the last week. I'll get to the Electras (finally) tomorrow if everything stays well. Today was just kinda me trying to get back into the groove of things. Thanks for the kindness of allowing me to still write it. Afterwards I plan to write about the Sloths, who I found from reading the G. R. article so another thanks for that.TheGracefulSlick (talk) 03:56, 28 September 2015 (UTC)
 * You'll think this is crazy, but I got to see the Sloths play at the Ponderosa stomp in 2013. They played a killer set! Go ahead and do that article.  But, I probably should mention some articles I'd like to do in the near future (if sources yield): The Fantastic Dee Jays (would that be OK? I know you have the family/Quaker State acquaintance with them and the Swamp Rats--I think the Dee Jays need an article of their own, because they had a slightly different lineup/sound and cut a few singles of their own--I think "Get Away Girl" is a bona-fide classic), the Shags (Connecticut), the Shy Guys, the Purple Gang (LA band), Thee Sixpence (preceded Strawberry Alarm Clock), the Bees ("Voices Green & Purple" band --there was another LA band called the Bees), The Chob, Thursday's Children, the WordD, the Pastels (WA state), First Crow to the Moon, the Moppets, the Continental Co-ets, Mod 4, the Northwest Company, Ty Wagner, Denny Noie, and, of course, many others.  Although, I'd love to do the Alarm Clocks and the Velvet Illusions, I remember you mentioned 'em, so you could do the articles on those.  You mentioned the Bees, but I think you gave me the OK to do their write-up.  I realize that I may have mentioned some bands you have interest in, so I hope these mentions would be OK with you?  I was meaning to do a lot of these articles earlier, but I kinda got caught up in the whole G.R. thing, so I'm trying to make up for opportunities I missed during that time. Garagepunk66 (talk) 04:57, 28 September 2015 (UTC)
 * It's no problem, it's good we are getting this out of the way so there is no confusion over who will write these articles. The only thing I noticed is the Continental Co-ets have an article (unless there is another band with the name). Other than that, those bands are yours to create an article on. For me, I'd like to write about the Lyrics, Limey and the Yanks, the Electras, the Sloths, and Velvet Illusions if sources permit.TheGracefulSlick (talk) 09:14, 28 September 2015 (UTC)
 * You're right, the Co-ets have an article--when I looked them up a while back, I was rushing. But, when I just checked again, I noticed that their article does not have the word "The..." placed in the title, so it didn't come up on the search bar when I looked the first time (I should have checked on further).  I can now move article get a proper title, but first I'll bring it up on the talk page there as per protocol--I'm sure you feel the same way.  By the way, good luck on those articles you will be doing--a bunch of great bands, so I can't wait to read them when you're done! Garagepunk66 (talk) 20:42, 28 September 2015 (UTC)
 * P.S.: Check out the articles I started up on the Bojax and the Modds (Miami). I think you'll really like them a lot. Garagepunk66 (talk) 20:45, 28 September 2015 (UTC)

Excellent work on the band articles. I had not heard of the Bojax until this point so it is always more cool to learn something completely new. By the way, I should also add this group called The Angry to the list. Listen to "Walk in the Sun" by them if you have not already.TheGracefulSlick (talk) 21:57, 30 September 2015 (UTC)


 * Great song! One of my very favorites. Though the Turtles had done an earlier version, and I like to too, I prefer the Angry's version.  The Angry really nail it!Garagepunk66 (talk) 23:44, 30 September 2015 (UTC)
 * I agree, it seems like there are endless amounts of gems by these obscure groups. I went ahead and moved the Continental Co-ets page so it included "The" in the title. I remember editing the page when we had our first discussion ever, which focused on female garage bands. It kinda was like a blast from the past when you think about all the talks we had.TheGracefulSlick (talk) 23:56, 30 September 2015 (UTC)


 * Yes, I remember that discussion--that was right when I was preparing the section on the female bands in the G.R.--I intentionally did that section before all other additions because I felt that it needed to added right away. And, I remember mentioning the Co-ets in the article, so I guess I had momentary amnesia a few days ago (or was it that I afraid that deletionists had gone after the article--you know how they just love to go after garage and psychedelic band articles).  But yes, thanks for making the change to the title.  Garagepunk66 (talk) 00:13, 1 October 2015 (UTC)


 * Yes, I have great respect for the fact you think it was essential to add female bands into the article. Not many people realize that there were some female groups that were just as popular as any other male group. That is what I love about music though, it defies all types of discrimination or stereotypes because all that really mattered was if the musicians enjoyed what they were doing and created something that audiences can remember for years to come. I'm glad no one has deleted the Continental Co-ets article, it needs some more work, but that can always be amended.TheGracefulSlick (talk) 23:54, 1 October 2015 (UTC)


 * I'm really glad that you feel as strongly about this as I do. If 60s garage bands of whatever stripe have to suffer generalized neglect, then it is a shame that the all-female bands from that era have to get the worst end of it, even from garage fans who should know better--the female bands are so rarely included on compilations, which doesn't seem at all fair.  Most people don't realize what great innovators these women were--most people don't think that all-female rock bands existed before the Runaways and the Slits in the 1970s.  In actuality it was the 60s that was the golden age of the all-female rock group--there were hundreds of them and they made so much great music.  And, what a resplendent time it was, made all-the-more special by the fact that these female pioneers were garage rock.  I realize that garage rock is not usually associated with "feminist" sentiments (and I forgive that imperfection--I just love the music all the same)--and yet the great paradox is that it was in 60s garage rock where greatest outpouring of female bands occurred--and I consider that to be a great jewel in garage rock's largely unrecognized crown.  Here is where the true beginning of punk happened.  It is as if we have this magical lost city of Atlantis--the largest and grandest city ever built, that lies buried under the rubble of neglect.  And, its wondrous treasures are just waiting for people to discover that we are trying to open eyes to see! Garagepunk66 (talk) 01:17, 2 October 2015 (UTC)


 * I wish I knew of more female garage comp albums out there. if you could recommend anything, I'd appreciate it. Many people don't realize the feminist statement those early groups made. It is a shame there are very little sources to prompt more articles about them. Sad to say, but I've only made one female garage band article, which was one the Daughters of Eve. I actually have a single by them thanks to my grandfather who lived in Chicago in the 1960s. He probably has just about every recorded material from rock groups there, he absolutely loves it.TheGracefulSlick (talk) 23:44, 3 October 2015 (UTC)

Also, I had the idea to create an article on the song "Action Woman". I would give you details, but I know you know exactly why the song is important. I also thought it would be a good idea to rework the Litter's article sometime. I wish it was simplier to use photos of people/bands on wikipedia for those kind of articles, but the process is too confusing. Plus, admins give you a hard time if a mistake is made getting the photo so it just becomes a big hassle.TheGracefulSlick (talk) 00:59, 4 October 2015 (UTC)


 * Yes, I'd like to do some articles on some of the female garage bands, and of course many others. I love the song "Action Woman," by the Litter--it is such an incredible song.  I have the CD reissue if their first album.  They do a great version of Buffy Sainte-Marie's "Codine," also done by the Charlatans on there, and of course their version of Bo Diddley's "I'm a Man" is just phenomenal. Garagepunk66 (talk) 02:37, 4 October 2015 (UTC)


 * I also learned that the Electras recorded their own version, I admire their take on the song as well. I finished their article by the way (finally), so now I can get to "Action Woman" and an article on the Sloths. I'd love to find a reissue of the Litter's Distortions, but so far I've only found $100 Fine. I actually think the album is high-quality, but their first has always been my favorite.TheGracefulSlick (talk) 15:57, 4 October 2015 (UTC)


 * I love the Distortions album. I have an article of the Shags (of Connecticut), but I'm buried in a pile of work--I'll try to let it out later today, if I can find the time.  Garagepunk66 (talk) 17:00, 4 October 2015 (UTC)


 * I enjoyed the Electras' article. You noticed I made a few minor tweaks, but I was sure you'd like them--I'll admit that I was in a rush, so I messed up the conscription link--thank you for fixing it.  I'll try to get the Shaggs article out tonight (if I can step aside from this stack of papers I'm working on). Garagepunk66 (talk) 23:56, 4 October 2015 (UTC)


 * Of course I appreciate them, I'll admit that I rushed because I felt the article was long overdue. When I was looking through articles I noticed the Remains' article is lacking content so I will rewrite that while I create the Sloths article. I absolutely love the Remains' only album and I'm sure you will agree it's a classic. To be honest, I did not know much about the Shaggs until you started mentioning them so I'm eager for the article.TheGracefulSlick (talk) 01:07, 5 October 2015 (UTC)


 * You don't need to worry, I'm often in a rush too and make mistakes. I'd actually like to do more "touch-up" editing for other articles, if I just had fifteen minutes or half an hour more a-day.  Also, I do so many "touch-ups" in red ink on papers and assignments, that, quite frankly, I've had my fill with that kind of stuff before I get on Wiki.  Anyway, I finished the Shags article, but instead of entering right-off, I put it up for review.  Believe it or not I have never actually submitted a new article for review, but the draft was sitting in my sandbox numero uno, which has the "review" enter, so for a thrill, I went ahead and pressed it... Presto!  I'm probably way past the point of needing to submit new articles for review now, but I just wanted to see if there are any things I could still learn about the process.  I probably should have done this a long time ago.  It says that it could take up to a week.  I just hope they register me as the creator of the article. Garagepunk66 (talk) 05:00, 5 October 2015 (UTC)

I never tried a review before (I'm afraid I'll get someone uninformed on the topic) so tell me a little bit once it concludes. I created an article on The Remains (album) and I'm sure you'll like the classic. I had an idea to create an article on "A Public Execution" by Mouse and the Traps, which I'm sure you have heard. I've seen the progress you made on the Back from the Grave series and I'm glad to see your efforts have nearly completed it in its entirety.TheGracefulSlick (talk) 22:00, 7 October 2015 (UTC)


 * Yeah, crazy hua? I've had the same fear too--i.e. that a deletionist lizard might snap at an article like a fly.  It may be that I have hundred sandboxes (just as some people have a hundred addresses or criminals keep aliases) and that the #1 "address" rarely gets used--I finished the article there, and I then just looked at the little blue click-box sitting there and said to myself "Why not?"  Maybe I was unconsciously testing the waters.  Kinda like makin' a paper airplane to test the "aerodynamics" of the design.  So, then later (not too soon from now) I can roll out the big 747 jumbo jet (the G.R. article) from the hanger to take it for a crucial mission into the windy skies of "G.A. review" which I hope will smile upon it and christen it with a little "green wafer."  Right now I'm trying to find a few extra sources to AllMusic (as you recommended).  Do you think that after I add a few extra sources, the G.R. article will be a good G.A. candidate? Garagepunk66 (talk) 23:34, 7 October 2015 (UTC)


 * I think it is already a clear-cut candidate for GA, my recommendation was more for FA review where the reviewers are even more observant of the minor details. You said that you wanted to ultimately go for that status, so I thought that would be one less thing you would potentially need to address. The G.R. article's review will probably take the max amount of days allowed due to its shear size, but that is the only barrier I see from it obtaining GA.TheGracefulSlick (talk) 00:33, 8 October 2015 (UTC)


 * Binksternet recommended that I go G.A. first, then F.A. after that. So, I could submit the article for review in its present configuration soon for G.A.  I might add a few extra sources (in addition to AllMusic) for some of the bands.  Then, after that (before vying for FA) I could add the psychedelic garage and folk rock influence section (you had mentioned that I put in a folk thing and I still plan to make good on that promise--I could mention Mouse and the Traps there, 'cause of their Dylan influence).  Before vying for F.A., I would also have to go in and bolster up some of the under-represented regions: the South, the Plains States, Mountain States, other areas of the Midwest, islands and territories, etc.  I also need to create a section for the Pacific Northwest, which right now I reference to the Origins section.  From reading the requirements or F.A., it demands an all-comprehensiveness which the article has not quite yet attained, but I think it is now just comprehensive enough for G.A.  While the article will never be able to mention every one of the hundreds of thousands of wonderful bands, I hope that it can get to the point where it will reflect the full majesty of this genre. Garagepunk66 (talk) 01:16, 8 October 2015 (UTC)
 * I think you have included a generous amount of garage rock bands. While I agree no one could add every single one, I think your choices best reflected the overall sound that each group represented from their respective music scenes. Mouse and the Traps would be a good addition to the Texas music scene and the folk connection so I like the way you are thinking towards the future of the project. By the way, could I ask a favor? I noticed on the article Wimple Winch an IP has added unreferenced "facts" (I concluded are false) and messed up the article. Since I'm assuming you're using a computer, could you simply revert it before the IP's editing? I'd do it myself but my phone does not have such a feature and it would be needlessly time-consuming on my part. Any help is appreciated.TheGracefulSlick (talk) 02:55, 8 October 2015 (UTC)


 * I just reverted the article to its previous state. It know how hard it must be with your main computer not functioning--working on a smart-phone must be a real pain.  Hope you can get the real computer fixed soon! Garagepunk66 (talk) 03:09, 8 October 2015 (UTC)

Hey, I was just wonderin'... I know that the Saints are playing Philly this weekend. I don't know if you follow the NFL. Me...I just haven't had the time but, as you can imagine, I root for the Saints and enjoy watching a game whenever I can get a chance. I guess you you probably go for The Eagles (or would it be the Steelers, because you've said there are some Western Pennsylvania connections with the Swamp Rats and all). But, I was wondering: if you could choose any 60s garage anthem that you would like them to play at a game to get the crowd excited (for your favorite team), which one would to be? Garagepunk66 (talk) 16:54, 9 October 2015 (UTC)


 * I root for the Eagles all the way. I wish I could say "Dirty Water" but the reference to Boston kinda just defeats the whole point. Songs like "The Witch" by the Somics and "You're Gonna Miss Me" by the 13th Floor Elevators really pump me up for some reason, so they would be my best answers. What's your opinion on the subject?TheGracefulSlick (talk) 18:54, 9 October 2015 (UTC)
 * By the way, congrats on the admin "upgrading" your account so your articles no longer need a review. It really shows that you have made notable articles and people are taking notice. I also got the same message so maybe what we are doing here is getting other users' positive attention.TheGracefulSlick (talk) 18:57, 9 October 2015 (UTC)


 * That's great and Swarm has noticed the good work we're doing here. As for football, I'm dye-hard Saints all-the-way, but  realize that they're struggling this year, so the Eagles would be a safer bet if someone was putting money on the game.  So, what I need to do is call the team's programming director and make the recommendation that they start playing "Who Dat?" by the Jury as soon as possible!  The Jury wasn't from the Crescent City--they were from Winnepeg, Canada and recorded the immaculate fuzz-punk blaster in '66.  At that time the Saints had not yet started playing--they debuted for the '67 season, but they were awarded the franchise on All Saints' Day, Nov. 1, 1966 (hence the name "Saints").  It may be too late to do much good for this season, but maybe in a future (better) year, they could blast that song loud on the Superdome's P.A. system--say the next time we play the Eagles--as a special "welcome gift."  Don't get me wrong, I wish the Eagles well on any other occasion.  But, when they play the Saints, I'm 100% behind the black and gold! Garagepunk66 (talk) 00:37, 10 October 2015 (UTC)
 * P.S.: the song is on the Trash Box comp., but is scratchy and badly mastered there (but gosh what a great album in spite of the bad mastering--maybe my favorite comp. ever assembled--I just wish they'd re-master it). The best-mastered, best sounding place to hear the song is on Gravel, Volume 5 and it really blasts out of the speakers there--a great comp.--really hard-rocking stuff!!!).  I'm going to tell the programming director to get it from the Gravel comp.--assuming they can get the copyright stuff arranged, etc.--Eagles beware next time around! Garagepunk66 (talk) 03:04, 10 October 2015 (UTC)
 * I have some of the Gravel series, I'll be on the lookout for Vol 5. If you remember, I said I wanted to write about Limey and the Yanks because I absolutely love their song "Guarenteed Love". Unfortunately, the only real informative source I have on them is their garageband.com article. Typically, I'm willing to work with few references, but only if they are enriched in detail. If you had any comps or books that mention them, could you tell me? I really want to write about them and it's surprising to me that so few sources talk about the group.TheGracefulSlick (talk) 20:36, 10 October 2015 (UTC)

By the way, I listened to this album called Philsophy of the World by the Shaggs and I'm wondering why does this album have a cult status? I mean I know people sometimes say "it's so bad it's good", but I just think it was bad. I'm really not trying to be rude but that's the only way I can describe the album. It's described as being an equivalent to the Mothers of Invention, but, again, I am against that idea. The Mothers of Invention's work was amazingly creative and I don't think it can be copied. What are your thoughts on this, because maybe I'm just not seeing the whole picture.TheGracefulSlick (talk) 21:30, 10 October 2015 (UTC)


 * Yeah, I definitely concur. I've never thought those particular Shaggs could play well enough to carry a song, which kind of feeds into the unfair stereotype that people have about garage "Oh, none of those bands could play...," which of course is unfair to the many wonderful bands who did a great job and then there are the stereotypes about women in rock.  Luckily, there were so many genuinely talented female garage bands such as the Pleasure Seekers, the Luv'd Ones, the Mod 4 and so many others who could out-rock most guys.  I was thinking about mentioning the Shaggs in the G.R. article (when I did the female garage section), in light of the fact that the Shaggs have been often spoken of, but I chose not to, because I felt that it might scare people off of create bad and misleading stereotype about females and garage, etc.  I realize that there is a human story to their band (I can feel for them as human beings), and I know there was something about them in a movie, or so I've heard.  I suppose I'll have to add their mention at some point.  But, for now I think I'll wait just a little while longer. Garagepunk66 (talk) 23:33, 10 October 2015 (UTC)


 * I agree that they need to be added eventually, but it can wait. Hopefully people won't get the wrong idea about female garage bands, and judge by individual groups, instead of assuming they are like the Shaggs. From what I read so far today, the girls in the Shaggs were poor and formed the band because of the encouragement of their father. They actually were a popular live act so maybe the album doesn't do them justice. It's definitely a story worth checking out at least.TheGracefulSlick (talk) 00:39, 11 October 2015 (UTC)
 * They might have gotten better later on (I would hope). Hey, I have an article about The Purple Gang (L.A. band) on the way.  I love their version of Love's "Can't Explain"--it is my favorite version, though I enjoy Love's version too. Garagepunk66 (talk) 00:47, 11 October 2015 (UTC)
 * P.S.: I thought I'd start a new thread below--this one is turning into an epic. Garagepunk66 (talk) 00:48, 11 October 2015 (UTC)

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Musical topics, etc.
Here is a new thread about music. You are welcome to hare your thoughts. Garagepunk66 (talk) 00:52, 11 October 2015 (UTC)


 * I enjoy the connection between the Purple Gang and the Music Machine. Perhaps, if I find context, I could add the tidbit about the black gloves inspiring the purple one in the rewriting of the Music Machine article for GA I've been working towards. By the way, have you heard of the Guilloteens (awesome name) because I plan to write an article on them. They were from Memphis, which isn't exactly a place where I'd expect to find such a great garage band, but then again almost every city had its share of some quality act.TheGracefulSlick (talk) 04:30, 11 October 2015 (UTC)


 * I think you meant to say "the purple inspiring the black..." I found it interesting to learn that the drummer for the Purple Gang is credited for coining the term, "It's a gas!"  I never knew that.  As for the Guillotees, I've heard the name, but I've never heard their stuff.  Glad you mentioned them.  I'll have to check them out and give them a listen.  I know I'll dig them, because you have a good track record of recommending bands I'll like.  And, of course I know I'll like the article too. I've been meaning to add some things to the Fallen Angels article as you had wanted, but I've been really busy, so I want to get to that when I can get a little time. Garagepunk66 (talk) 05:18, 11 October 2015 (UTC)

Congrats to the Eagles! It's just not the Saint's year--part of the Saints trouble, I think, emanates from the whole question of ownership. Their owner is getting way up in his years and has fallen out with the granddaughter he had originally tapped to take the reigns, but now there is a big family lawsuit (does money buy happiness?)--so I think that situation has the whole team organization in a state of confusion until the matter gets resolved (I have a feeling it will go to her and she does not get along with the current staff). I have a feeling that the team will clean the deck at the end of this year. Which is kind of sad--in light of what this coaching regime has accomplished in past years, but I guess everything comes to an end--it happened to the Beatles, too, and of course Jim Morrison was pretty much over the whole thing by '71 (except that he and the band found a way to have a peak moment on L.A. Woman and go out with a bang before he departed for Paris, and the Beatles perked up one last time for Abbey Road in the summer of '69--then broke up). I wish that the whole sixties thing could have gone on forever, but I guess it would have been impossible to keep that up forever. But then, we can still imagine good things for the future (as sometimes wishes come true). Garagepunk66 (talk) 00:14, 12 October 2015 (UTC)


 * Well the Saints did have some bad breaks early in the season. I think Brees' injury is still lingering and effecting his play. I hope it's a turn around for the Eagles' offense, which has been surprisingly flat until this game. I'm not sure yet if it's the end for the Saints, but their past 10 years were impressive. I liked the connection to the bands too. Unfortunately even my most beloved groups like Jefferson Airplane and Country Joe and the Fish kinda did die with a whimper (though Jefferson Starship was ok for the first few years). The only artists that I can think of that didn't just burn out are as you mentioned the Doors and the Beatles, and also Janis Joplin in my opinion. As for the band I mentioned, the Guilloteens, they actually made a fan out of Elvis, which I find both humorous and an interesting inside on his musical taste. You probably heard of the group on the Where the Action Is! Los Angeles Nuggets comp, but that's just a guess.TheGracefulSlick (talk) 00:44, 12 October 2015 (UTC)


 * I have that collection--and yes, they're there--thanks for reminding me--that's where I heard of them! About ups and downs of artists: Joplin went out at her peak.  I guess that a solo artist can keep it at that level longer (or at least get it back at various points along the way in his or career) than bands, whose individual members tend to drift apart in musical tastes and interests (and often start to argue and disagree).  So, a band either comes to the point where they break up realizing that it's time (the Beatles) or continues on for perpetuity, but ceases to retain that once collectively-shared musical fire and passion (the Rolling Stones).  I love the Rolling Stones, and wish them the best, but they're not really passionate about their music anymore--its now more of a big glitzy show, whereas, certain solo artists such as Neil Young or Bob Dylan may go through ups and downs, but always manage to find peak moments and surprises, which makes them still worth following, because they are still on personal musical journeys and quests. Garagepunk66 (talk) 01:05, 12 October 2015 (UTC)
 * P.S.: I notice your adding some stuff about the Warehouse, where the Doors played their last gig. That was a hot venue in New Orleans in the 70s where a lot of acts played.  I believe that the last band to play there was the Clash in '83.  Garagepunk66 (talk) 05:00, 12 October 2015 (UTC)
 * Yes, I thought it would be best to improve the page when you consider that it was the last venue for the classic Doors lineup. I reworked the info to the L.A. Woman article about the final concerts. I didn't see the significance at the time with their other gig in Dallas, but I realized that that concert was just as important as their last one. I also hope to get to the "music" section to explain the songs and maybe send it to GA when all's said and done.TheGracefulSlick (talk) 10:01, 12 October 2015 (UTC)


 * There are some bits that I could find at a later time to put in the the L.A. Woman article, maybe after the GA thing is complete. I still want to track down that source I once read which mentioned how Jim Morrison's red-haired common-law wife Pamela Courson (along with Morrison's' other beloved "flame" L.A.) served as inspirations: "I see your hair is burnin', hills are filled with fire..."  In the song, I think Morrison is somehow equating the two in an overlapping metaphor; her red hair and the hill fires that are so common in the summer in L.A.  But, I think there is also an organic connection between the album and the song: 1) it is the theme song 2) Morrison and the Doors were the kind of people who thought programmatically about how they presented things 3) the cover is burgundy and yellow (burgundy could represent red hair and maybe wine? yellow could signify fire?).  I just need to find the right sources to back up this hunch, so no rush--I won't be premature.  If I could find the sources...just a thought. Garagepunk66 (talk) 01:13, 13 October 2015 (UTC)

I actually have a book called No One Here Gets Out Alive: A Biography of Jim Morrison that describes what you are saying. After I clear up some projects I will explain it in the "music" section I talked about earlier. I just really want one more solid book reference before I go at it because I know there are some great books on the Doors out there that would help with what I'm trying to do.TheGracefulSlick (talk) 01:16, 13 October 2015 (UTC)


 * I think that's the book--I don't know where I misplaced it--Danny Sugarman wrote it, if I remember. The burgundy might also foreshadow Paris (wine)...?  Who knows, I doubt we'd find any sources for that one, but it's fun to keep guessing.  Morrison's had everyone guessing for the last 44 years since his death--so he'll have us mystified for many more. Garagepunk66 (talk) 01:45, 13 October 2015 (UTC)


 * By the way, I was looking through bands to write about and I found two great ones. William Penn and His Pals (try "Far and Away") and the Fifth Order (try "Walkin' Away") were the groups. I think the first band had a future member of Santana in its ranks but I need to keep reading to learn more.TheGracefulSlick (talk) 10:22, 13 October 2015 (UTC)


 * Yes, fantastic bands--can't wait to read the articles.  By the way, it looks like today is your birthday.  Happy birthday!  I'm a Libran, too--mine was on September 23 (I think Springsteen and Ray Charles have that day).   Now that you'll be registering to vote, I was wondering if you have any thoughts about the upcoming presidential election.  Do you see any candidates of interest? Garagepunk66 (talk) 12:03, 13 October 2015 (UTC)


 * Ben Carson has been the most agreeable for me thus far, though I'm not crazy about his comments about Muslims. I'm neither a democrat not a republican, I just want to choose the best candidate. If I had to choose his democrat opposition it would be Bernie Sanders, even if there is some people who have a problem with him being a socialist. It can get a little overwhelming because I'm not too trusting of politicians so I constantly need to fact-check them and ignore news media opinions so I can form my own. One thing I'm sure of though is if Trump becomes president I am escaping to Canada! I understand why people find him likeable (his tell it as it is mentality), but his ideas are just too unrealistic and non-compromising.TheGracefulSlick (talk) 01:29, 14 October 2015 (UTC)


 * Gosh, I'm so with you there--I can't stand that S.O.B! If he gets elected--I'll swim across the ocean!  The good news is that he is just an inflated balloon of hot air who has peaked in the polls too soon, and will invariably fade in popularity when the real election season rolls around in January.  Come New Hampshire, he will have run out of "steam" as more serious candidates emerge.  I haven't made up my mind yet, but I dig Bernie Sanders--maybe we need a good old fashioned European-style socialist.  Don't get me wrong, I have no problem with free enterprise--its just that this country is turning into such a corporatocracy/oligarchy.  It is so unfortunate about the disparity of wealth at this present time.  There is an inherent cynicism in all of this--and I think that it is robbing us of our humanity.  The news programs now are like cartoons (for both the left and the right)--I lament the loss of real newspeople people like Cronkite.  You can see all of this greed it in the music industry and the way so many of the radio stations now are owned big conglomerates who play the same auto-programmed song lists over and over.  I makes me want to vomit!  But, I think I'm preachin' to the choir.  So, I know the you've enjoyed my little "screed" above and have been joyfully entertained by it--a fun birthday present that puts those other boring presents to shame! Garagepunk66 (talk) 02:27, 14 October 2015 (UTC)

I hope you're right, otherwise I will completely lose faith in the people's ability to make logical decisions. I wish there was just a type of society where the people work together in a community, not for one's self, but for the betterment of that community. This is more of a cultural thing, but I hate the fact that individuals are so distant from each other that they hardly even know their next-door-neighbors. Ironically, I think the technological advancements in the US are what caused it. San Francisco had the right idea for a brief period. The thing is, the community I envision was established in San Francisco and could have actually worked if it didn't get so inflated by everyone that journeyed their during the Summer of Love. That's just my thoughts, though yours were a little more entertaining.TheGracefulSlick (talk) 04:30, 14 October 2015 (UTC)


 * Those words are music to my ears (so therefore entertaining too). The San Fran scene was so beautiful--as you said mainly before all of the "hangers on" arrived--it was originally a small and a tight community of artists, musicians, poets, and groovy people, such as beats (Ferlightti, City Lights Book Store, etc.), the Merry Pranksters, and the original core musicians, such as Grace, the Grateful Dead, Janis, etc.  The drugs were only there for the purpose of expanding peoples' minds--not for addictions and abuse.  What the hangers on should have done is, rather than flock to San Francisco, they could have started up really beautiful and innovative scenes in their own home towns.  But, I realize that San Francisco had its allure, and that many parts of the country then (as now) were backward (here I go again), puritanical, and closed-minded.  It is hard to believe that there are still counties in certain parts of the rural South where one cannot even buy an ounce of beer.  I think that it is ridiculous that when people turn 18, (at least in most places right now in this country) they are not allowed to get a beer.  You go to European countries and England and it is so different--I mean completely different.  So, rather than celebrating your 18th with a good brew, you had to drink a Shirly Temple.  Doesn't that suck! Garagepunk66 (talk) 04:50, 14 October 2015 (UTC)


 * Personally, I never will touch alcohol, but I think it's ridiculous someone can join the military and die for their country at 18, but can't get a drink. I think after the San Francisco experiment failed people have become more and more close-minded. Sure there were other factors like the Manson murders, Robert Kennedy's assassination, and Vietnam that made people believe we couldn't come together in the same way San Francisco did. I still think it could work if there was a focus on more important things like art, music, and nature. As of right now though people are more concerned about taking "selfies" or something irrelevant, so they don't want to be bothered by such ideas.TheGracefulSlick (talk) 02:47, 15 October 2015 (UTC)


 * Of course I'd never advocate any kind of abuse--alcohol or otherwise--for me an occasional sip craft beer or wine will do, but never more than that, and I respect that you do not drink--that's a good thing. As for the ideal of people coming together, that can never fail if people apply themselves in apply in the correct ways in the right situations.  So, really the real people in San Francisco never failed--they just got overwhelmed with well-meaning outsiders who did not know what the whole thing was really supposed to be about--and of course no one is perfect.  But, I think we can all learn a lot of positive things from the San Francisco experiment--just apply in them in constructive ways today locally in our own communities.  I think it was beautiful how everyone came together in '69 for Woodstock and got along (despite lack of food, few toilets, all of the mud, etc.), however, extremely large gatherings can be a risky (as Altamont demonstrated)--maybe be-ins were best-intended to work in small local contexts--you know the old addage about "think globally, act locally"--I think that's true.  So, people can still have ideals, but be just practical about implementing them.  There is always hope.  Sometimes it is how we do good things it small ways that adds up in the end.  Garagepunk66 (talk) 04:00, 15 October 2015 (UTC)


 * Well, I took a little time off to watch the Saints play the Dirty Birds. See, unlike the Eagles, which are named after an honorable bird, the Atlanta Falcons (our chief rival) are the lowest form of life and need to be put in their place (and stomped into the ground accordingly), which is exactly what the Saints did tonight (Amen).  Finally we looked like the Super-Saints of yore--so I hope that this game can herald good tidings to come for the black and gold--we need a good turnaround--I hope this was it.  But, I wish the Eagles luck too (as long as they're not playing the Saints--they are an honorable team, unlike you-know-who).  Well, I was thinkin' I'd do an article on the Northwest Company.  I love their song, "Hard to Cry." It appears or Gravel, Vol. 4., so I'll bang out a few words on that deserving topic. Garagepunk66 (talk) 04:44, 16 October 2015 (UTC)


 * It's going to be difficult, hopefully the Eagles will help the Saints' cause by beating the Panthers next week. I'm glad you're writing about a Canadian band, they seem to be kinda under-appreciated. Canada offered a lot of great groups like 49th Parallel, the Ugly Ducklings, Terry Jacks' Chessmen, the Plastic Cloud, among others, but not many of them broke out nationally. I recall a band called the Poppy Family did well but their music is a little too pop-oriented for my tastes. There's this album series called History of Vancouver Rock N Roll if you're more interested about the obscure from the area.TheGracefulSlick (talk) 10:23, 16 October 2015 (UTC)


 * Definitely a reason to wish well for the Eagles! I'll have to check out that Vancouver comp.  I'm sure there is some great stuff on it.  Hey, I thought I might do some articles on the Palace Guard (Los Angeles), the Palace Guards (New Orleans), the Groupies, the Humane Society, and Harbinger Complex.  I know you'll enjoy them a lot. Garagepunk66 (talk) 23:20, 16 October 2015 (UTC)

I did some looking into, and I found that Vancouver comp is actually a whole series. Maybe something I could write about later. Other the past few days I've been scouting the Internet for some bands to listen to and writ about. Some cool ones I've found are the Grains of Sand, Mouse and the Boys (not sure if they are related to Mouse and the Traps), Michael Chain and the Knacks, and something else I think you'll find interesting. I was looking to see if there were covers of "Are You a Boy or Are You a Girl" and I saw this one by a band called Sloppy and the Ravens (or just the Ravens). Honestly, it isn't near the quality of the original, but it's definitely something intriguing. I think something went wrong during its recording because the vocals seem "foggy" or too far in the background. You'll see what I mean if you give it a listen.TheGracefulSlick (talk) 00:30, 17 October 2015 (UTC)


 * I gave it a listen and I like it a lot (but of course the Barbarians' version for me too is definitive). Part of the issue with the vocal may be that their singer has a smoother style and his voice does not cut through the mix as much, and there is a sax competing with his vocals.  His vocal part is placed slightly lower in the mix than is the case with the Barbarians' version, and they put a more echo on it, which can sometimes sound great, but is probably more than is needed here.  I Still like the song a lot--just such a great song matter who plays it. Garagepunk66 (talk) 00:55, 17 October 2015 (UTC)
 * P.S.: I hope you've been enjoying reading my descriptions of the album covers in the Back from the Grave series. I've  been having some fun, engaging in a little bit of "satirical language" in those statements.  Normally that would be a no-no, but I think in this particular case I can get away with it, because I am merely recounting the satire (I hope accurately!) which is already apparent in the cartoons--so my hope is that it can be fun but still encyclopedic at the same time.  I'm stretching the rules a bit, but hopefully not breaking them--so I hope I don't get carted off by the Wiki-police.  My favorites are the descriptions for the Vol. 5 & 6 LP's and Vol. 8 (CD & LP).  Did I hit them on the nail or what?! I don't own the LP's, so I'm looking at the fuzzy little pictures, assuming that the hot tub on the Vol. 5 is filled with a most dangerous substance called "hydroconformic" acid. Garagepunk66 (talk) 01:23, 17 October 2015 (UTC)
 * I personally liked your description of volume 6's cover, though they are all amusing to me. I think we all need a little humor here so I don't think anyone should mind. Also, thanks for explaining the Ravens' rendition of "Are You a Boy or Are You a Girl" for me and why the vocals seemed a little off. I didn't mean to give the band a bad rap for their version, I actually enjoyed it, but I guess after hearing it one way by the Barbarians for so long, I have such a high-standard for how the song should sound. I'm not like that with all songs though, "Hey Joe", for example, I find many versions that are equally impressive outside the first successful rendition by the Leaves. Some of my favorites are the Music Machine's, the Shadow of Knight's, the Byrds, among others.TheGracefulSlick (talk) 01:51, 17 October 2015 (UTC)


 * I'm glad I've received your "imprimatur" for the BFTG statements--I wanted to make sure that I wasn't committing any kind of "Wiki-heresy" (and get carted off either to Wiki-detention or Kangaroo Court). See, it's a tough balance: on one hand, I don't want the Wiki-police to come pursue me, but on the other, I don't want Tim Warren and his angry little mob of zombies to come after me, either, and drop me into their crocodile-infested pit (yes, even me, GP66 of all people!)--I'm afraid they'll find out I drive a Toyota--the ultimate heresy according to their "purity laws." Garagepunk66 (talk) 22:35, 17 October 2015 (UTC)


 * One thing I should mention, and please don't take offense, is to just be aware of some of your article choices. I have no issue what-so-ever with the band articles, but some of the song articles may come along as a tough sell for some people. I personally enjoy the articles, but, as you may guess, my opinion means little if a deletionist comes by and sees one of the articles. I'm not saying to stop writing about songs because it is personally one of my favorite subjects and I wouldn't want to deprive you of that, I just don't want your work to be attacked just because someone doesn't understand why it is notable. Anyways, I received this live album (and article topic) by the Shadows of Knight called Raw N' Alive at the Cellar which I think you'd enjoy, or at the very least be interested in its historic worth.TheGracefulSlick (talk) 00:02, 21 October 2015 (UTC)


 * I want to get the live album by the Shadows of Knight. As for the song articles: yes, I thought about that when I did them.  And, I was aware that thing Brigands' song could be vulnerable.  But, I reckoned that the song appears on the Nuggets Box set, which raises its visibility, and there were some well-known people involved with it, so I just went ahead and did it.  AllMusic and a couple of others I mentioned discusses the Brigands (as well as the Bees), which may help, but we could find more sources.  Keep in mind that I am so busy with work from my job right now, that I'm having to work in a constant rush, so I haven't really made it my business as of late to actually scout songs--these two articles came in the wake of articles about bands (as afterthoughts, I'll admit).  Of the two, I think "Voices Green and Purple" is in a stronger position to avoid problems--it is widely considered by garage enthusiasts to be a landmark song in the genre--I mentioned its high ranking in amongst a panel of writers, so I think that article will be safe.  I can still go back and find more sources for it too and hopefully build it up into a longer piece once those sources become available.  It will probably take a while for deletionsits even notice that these two articles exist, so we will hopefully have a "grace period" to "buy time" for awhile and add new sources and info, but I know that the clock is ticking.  So, I'll start making list of songs I'd like to do articles on and then scout them in the proper way--making them actual planned projects--I was actually intending to do that--I just haven't gotten around to it--I've been really busy.  I've had a wish list of bands lying around for awhile, but I just haven't prioritized songs. Garagepunk66 (talk) 04:17, 21 October 2015 (UTC)
 * Aside from that valid critique (of which I heartily agree and already considered, but that's OK), I ask this of you: please don't lose sight of the good things I've done at Wikipedia--you're the only person that has ever really expressed any true appreciation or gratitude for my work (or probably ever will). I've climbed some big mountains by this point (the whole G.R. thing alone has been like scaling Mt. Everest--and I have created numerous articles--a lot considering the time that had to go into the G.R.).  As you have always been aware from the beginning, my journey here at Wikipedia has been a dry walk, and at this point I am finally beginning to wonder if all it has been worth the effort.  I have no choice but to continue, because I believe in what I am doing, and I have to keep reminding myself that I am a good writer.  But, honestly, I feel utterly abandoned here (not from you, but from practically everybody else), and the more good things I accomplish, the worse this feeling gets. Garagepunk66 (talk) 09:11, 21 October 2015 (UTC)

I agree with you that the content is notable. I believe every song on the Nuggets album deserves an article, but I just hate seeing an article be taken away when someone like yourself made a quality piece. Nothing here can take away from your accomplishments, which are more than most people here can say they have. I understand that you feel under-appreciated, it comes with the topic we work on, but don't think your articles go unnoticed. Sometimes you just need to talk to other users, see if they want to collaborate, and take it from there. That's how we started working together and as you know connections here are important. Personally, I'm content with just knowing a few users, but I feel we all could bring the community aspect back to this project.TheGracefulSlick (talk) 10:12, 21 October 2015 (UTC)


 * And, believe me I don't mind your concern about the song articles which were perfectly valid--by all means you are welcome to critique any time. I get really busy with the responsibilities of my job, so I wish I had time to do more networking, but I'll try to do that more, but right now I want to get a lot of garage articles written, then broaden out to other areas (say in the next year or so).  But, regardless of what anyone else says or does, you have acknowledged my efforts, and that makes all the difference in the world.  You have let me know that my work here is not in vain--from time to time we all need a boost of acknowledgement.  And (looking back in retrospect), if ever some of my critiques in the past might have led you to think I was in any way disrespectful (I'm uber-critical about pretty much everything and with everybody to a fault but I don't mean it in a bad way), let me state here that I acknowledge your efforts to the utmost and think upon them so highly--of that you never need doubt. Garagepunk66 (talk) 22:29, 21 October 2015 (UTC)


 * On the contrary, your critques have been as reasonable and civil as Ghmyrtle's, even when my stubbornness was still wearing off from being a new user. It made GA so much easier and helped me understand what other garage rock enthusists are looking for in an article. I truly believe more acknowledgment will come to you from other users when you start a GA review. For instance, I received some kind messages from users for the Country Joe article, and had it nominated for a "Did You Know?" topic. Once someone sees the G.R. article I guarantee congrats will be in order from more people than just me and it will be considered for a DYK.TheGracefulSlick (talk) 00:06, 22 October 2015 (UTC)


 * That's so true. Let me ask you, do think the G.R. is ready to got through G.A. evaluation?  I know you and mentioned that it could have some other stuff besides AllMusic refs in certain places.  Would that be an obstacle to going G.A., or did you mean that in terms of it only being a hindrance according to F.A. criteria?  Garagepunk66 (talk) 01:35, 22 October 2015 (UTC)


 * The Allmusic refs would only be an issue for FA because they need to become extremely picky. Reviewers like to see variety in sources as it shows the topic is widely covered and talked about. GA has this to a lesser extreme and since you already began to address the concern a reviewer may mention it, but not stop them from approving GA. I think the article is ready for review, just be ready for a little lengthier process since the article is so large in comparison to most.TheGracefulSlick (talk) 02:09, 22 October 2015 (UTC)


 * Well, great, so maybe I could submit it in the next few days and while it is waiting for a reviewer, I could add some additional refs. Garagepunk66 (talk) 02:14, 22 October 2015 (UTC)


 * Hey, I noticed you did an article on the Fort Worth Teen Scene series--nice. I was wondering if it would be OK with you if I do article on volume 3--I have a copy at home (that is if sources allow).  You could do the other volumes--or if you would like--I could do two volumes--its up to you.  I also have a DVD about the Fort Worth Scene.  I could do an article on the video (provided sources permit).  I could also use information on the DVD as a reference--I'd imagine that it would be OK to use a DVD as a source, since these are low-traffic articles. Out of curiosity, is it permissible to use a DVD as a reference, say if it is a documentary containing biographical information, in a high-profile article? Garagepunk66 (talk) 03:10, 22 October 2015 (UTC)


 * P.S.: I noticed that there is not a separate article for the 1998 Nuggets box set, so I was thinking I'd like to do one on it. I could also do a lead-out article for the whole Nuggets series and then take the present article and turn it into an album-specific article for the original album--and maybe in time bring it up to G.A.--first start it where it is, then grow it.  I'd imagine that (come the time and provided sources are available) to get it to G.A., they'd want to see lest 40 references, with some books thrown in for good measure.  It's funny how I know a lot about doing a 300-400 ref. article and a lot about an 8-15 ref. article, but am a complete "dufus" when it comes to a 40-50 ref. piece (which I'll be the first to admit is a format you're more familiar with and really good at)--but, hey, it would be nice place to start.  I could re-organize the whole suite of Nuggets articles into something more coherent, revolving around a good lead-out (you know, with the "little logo" at the top, etc.).  But, I'd let GHmyrtle know first and make sure we have a consensus to allow that.  What do you think? Garagepunk66 (talk) 05:32, 22 October 2015 (UTC)

Rereleases, even with expanded content, are not allowed to really have a seperate article. It almost always is just mentioned in a sub-section of the main article because it makes content easier and more practical for users (at least that is what they say). You can ask Ghmrytle, but I'm almost positive he will say the same thing. Also do whatever you want to the Fort Worth Teen Scene article, the more content the better.TheGracefulSlick (talk) 10:01, 22 October 2015 (UTC)


 * Well if that is so, but the box set sure has a lot of expanded content. But, at least I could try eventually get the article, in its present format, up to G.A--with the text of the article focusing primarily on the original album.  I could also do a lead-out article to represent the whole series.  Then, for Fort Worth, in addition to Vol. 3, I could do an article on the DVD (and also perhaps use the DVD as a source in the CD articles).  I'd imagine that using a DVD as a source there would be no problem there, but in higher profile articles is a DVD OK as a source, say if you were having an article reviewed? Garagepunk66 (talk) 19:15, 22 October 2015 (UTC)
 * If you are refering to something like this: Nuggets (series), that too is covered (but needs work). I can't give you a 100% positive answer for the use of DVDs as a source. In my opinion, if it's quotes or summaries of a certain part it should be ok, but some may question whether it is a user's point-of-view or interpretation of how he/she sees the documentary.TheGracefulSlick (talk) 00:51, 23 October 2015 (UTC)


 * I'm glad that they have a lead-out for Nuggets, which makes things easier--I might could do some upgrades on that one. As for DVDs as sources, what you are saying is exactly what I was thinking, i.e. that a DVD be a factual documentary (and, like any source, not skewed from a biased perspective), that we consider helpful testimonies it might provide from band members, and that whatever narration referenced is factual and neutral. Garagepunk66 (talk) 01:01, 23 October 2015 (UTC)


 * Just a note, if you needed an additional book source for the G.R. article, I have a book called The Rolling Stone Illustrated History of Rock & Roll that has a detailed section on the genre. I admit, it gets a little too opinionated when the author writes about some of the bands (he calls the Chocolate Watchband the "compost-pile of the era", which is ridiculous), but the history is neutral and thoroughly complete.TheGracefulSlick (talk) 22:51, 24 October 2015 (UTC)


 * Yes, and I've been wanting to get a copy. I know that GHmyrtle has one too.  Hey I hope you aren't mad about any changes in the Bad Roads--I like the article a lot, I just did a few minor things (only building on the wonderful foundation you have put in place).  I changed the date for the Ponderosa Stomp.  I was at the Ponderosa Stomp on the second night in 2013, and the Bad Roads were not on the roster either night that year--but I had remembered reading that they had played there before the storm, so I found a source (for 2004).  I usually try to indicate the range of musically active years up in the heading and then discuss the year of formation at the beginning of history, so I changed the statement in the heading and the formation year down below.  But, I was tired and forgot to mention in the heading that the band has done reunions (I was really tired), so I should have said something like this "...were active from 1964-1967 and have made subsequent reunions..."  I am not sure if the band is active right at the present moment, but I'm guessing they are open to doing occasional shows--they have a Facebook account.  I was just tying to reflect the broader context of their activity in the heading, so I hope you didn't mind. Garagepunk66 (talk) 23:16, 24 October 2015 (UTC)

I was fine with the additions. However, the activity period in the intro is something I avoid for policy reasons. Here is my reasoning: A validation toward musical artist notability is being active (reunions don't count) for at least five years. The Bad Roads were around for three years so that would only hinder the effort to keep the article. I realize people don't want to believe the band is notable so I want to give them one less reason to.TheGracefulSlick (talk) 01:39, 25 October 2015 (UTC)


 * I'm glad you mentioned that: I didn't realize that stipulation. Maybe from now on I could say something vague or general like "active in the 1960s," etc.  Thank you for telling me.  Hey, I think I'm going to put the G.R. up for GA review tomorrow.  Garagepunk66 (talk) 01:56, 25 October 2015 (UTC)


 * P.S.: it looks like this thread is getting rather long, so I an start a new one below. Garagepunk66 (talk) 03:39, 25 October 2015 (UTC)

String Quartet No. 3 (Dvořák)
Thanks for your interest in the page for Dvořák's String Quartet No. 3. If you could bear to revisit it, I'd be glad for any further feedback you may have- and if you were minded to remove some or all of the 'multiple issues' box that would be great!Yadsalohcin (talk) 08:02, 25 October 2015 (UTC)


 * Thank you for creating the article on such a great composer. Anyone can remove a template once the concerns expressed therein have been adequately addressed (but not before then), and as long as that person states in comments why the template was removed and can justify the removal.  The templates  are only there as a helpful reminders for improvements an article needs--so an the article can develop more body of text and more references, or whatever else.  Keep in mind that by making those improvements, it protects the article from unfriendly editors who might try to have the article deleted at a later time.  So perhaps you could build it up a little--maybe try to find a some more goodies to add: historical background and context, point in Dvořák's career, issues in his life at time of composition, thematic, musical, stylistic, and/or programmatic features of the composition, musical styles of period (and composer's evolution), audience and critical reception etc.  Obviously, not all articles are able to garnish enough information to achieve a large body of text, but at least we can try to find ways to make additions to any new article.  I would expect that for a famous composer such as Dvořák, one could find a plethora of info. for any piece he penned, even an obscure one.  So, I wish you luck and I appreciate your contribution--just a few tidbits, so that the article can best achieve its potential. And, keep up your dedication to this great composer.  I know that you will have a lot to offer and I expect that you are one of Wiki's top "Dvořák-ologists."  Best wishes.  Garagepunk66 (talk) 00:00, 26 October 2015 (UTC)


 * I just removed part of the template--I see you have added some refs and sections. Make sure the refs are detailed (like a bibliography entry-each one). Try to expand the body of text, and of course make sure everything is well-sourced.  Good luck! Garagepunk66 (talk) 05:37, 26 October 2015 (UTC)

Your GA nomination of Garage rock
Hi there, I'm pleased to inform you that I've begun reviewing the article Garage rock you nominated for GA-status according to the criteria. This process may take up to 7 days. Feel free to contact me with any questions or comments you might have during this period. Message delivered by Legobot, on behalf of Binksternet -- Binksternet (talk) 21:20, 26 October 2015 (UTC)

Song article
Hey - sorry I haven't been able to check out the song article you wanted help with the infobox on. What article is it? Bonnie (talk) 01:20, 31 October 2015 (UTC)


 * The name of the song is "The World Ain't Round It's Square" (by the Savages. And, thanks as always.Garagepunk66 (talk) 01:32, 31 October 2015 (UTC)