User talk:Greenleaf88/sandbox/Poker Joe

Can we add/or change the very beginning of the Poker Joe page with below
Can we add to this the text I am adding "the name given to him at birth was Joe Hale." With the correct reference citation

He was of half French Canadian and Nez Percé descent and the name given to him at birth was Joe Hale.

Matthew Clevinger 06:02, 14 November 2019 (UTC)


 * Right on, Matt. I like that.  I added two new section--they're subsection, really.  I'll try to dig some info on them.  If any of you have read up on Big Hole, please feel free to contribute.Greenleaf88 (talk)  —Preceding undated comment added 06:50, 14 November 2019 (UTC)

Matthew Clevinger 16:29, 14 November 2019 (UTC) — Preceding unsigned comment added by MClevinger (talk • contribs)
 * Who is keeping track of the changes and additions to be made to the Poker Joe Wiki and who will actually be making the change to Poker Joe?
 * FYI...I made the addition above to the Poker Joe page. Matthew Clevinger 04:34, 15 November 2019 (UTC)

--CheyChristensen (talk) 04:58, 15 November 2019 (UTC)Hi guys- here is what I added already to sandbox for the Poker Joe heading "Most popularly known for his contribution to the Nez Perce people during the Nez Perce War of 1877 Poker Joe went by many names including Lean Elk, Little Tobacco, and Hototo. Poker joe was a small man with a mighty voice, half french and half Nez Perce, he gained his name Poker Joe through his obsession with gambling and poker <refhttps://www.fs.usda.gov/detail/npnht/learningcenter/history-culture/?cid=fsbdev3_055793.

--CheyChristensen (talk) 04:58, 15 November 2019 (UTC)Maybe we can combine my info with Poker Joes birth name like so " Most commonly known for his contribution to the Nez Percé people during the Nez Percé War of 1877, Poker Joe went by many names including Lean Elk, Little Tobacco, and Hototo. Born Joe Hale, Poker Joe was a small man with a mighty voice, half French Canadian and half Nez Percé, he earned his name Poker Joe through his obsession with gambling and poker <refhttps://www.fs.usda.gov/detail/npnht/learningcenter/history-culture/?cid=fsbdev3_055793
 * @CheyChristensen Those are great additions. I will work on adding and updating Poker Joe tomorrow after my morning class. Matthew Clevinger 05:58, 15 November 2019 (UTC) — Preceding unsigned comment added by MClevinger (talk • contribs)


 * Revised this section last night.Greenleaf88 (talk) —Preceding undated comment added 20:59, 16 November 2019 (UTC)

Death of Poker Joe
--CheyChristensen (talk) 02:52, 16 November 2019 (UTC)Hi All, I wanted to add something about how Poker Joe died. Do you think this is a good idea? I will add what I have here and then you guys can add whatever info you have about his death and we can combine. "Poker Joe was mistakingly killed during the Battle of Bear Paw in 1877 by Ockia--a member of the Nez Percè. The battle of Bear Paw took place about 40 miles from the Canadian border where the Nez Percè battled Colonel Nelson Miles and his troops. Poker Joe was mistaken for an enemy and killed by accident during the battle.


 * I like this. Sounds great. Matthew Clevinger 07:56, 16 November 2019 (UTC) — Preceding unsigned comment added by MClevinger (talk • contribs)


 * I added this section last night.Greenleaf88 (talk)

Change the beginning to the following by adding Joe Hale and Nez Perce Joe
I just added Joe Hale, and Nez Perce Joe to the line and the reference citation

Change to the following

Poker Joe (18?? - 1877) or Hototo,[1] also known as Joe Hale, Nez Perce Joe, Lean Elk or Little Tobacco was a warrior and subchief...

Citation:

Brown, Mark H. “Yellowstone Tourists and the Nez Perce.” Montana: The Magazine of Western History, vol. 16, no. 3, 1966, pp. 30–43. JSTOR, www.jstor.org/stable/4517068.

The reference citation for the article above references Joe Hale as being known as both Lean Elk and Poker Joe.

--Matthew Clevinger 16:51, 14 November 2019 (UTC) — Preceding unsigned comment added by MClevinger (talk • contribs)


 * Added this section yesterdayGreenleaf88 (talk)


 * Just letting everyone know I made the above changes to Poker Joes page — Preceding unsigned comment added by MClevinger (talk • contribs) 04:42, 15 November 2019 (UTC)


 * Hmm..the reference section has disappeared and the citations are just listed numerically now--Not that this is a priority. Just pointing it out before we go live.Greenleaf88 (talk) —Preceding undated comment added 23:27, 15 November 2019 (UTC)
 * Nevermind. I just added it. Quick fix.Greenleaf88 (talk)  —Preceding undated comment added 23:30, 15 November 2019 (UTC)

Replace or incorporate the Remove by Council text
@Greenleaf88 I appreciate the addition of the Removal by Council heading and your contribution to it. I would like to propose that we use what I have here because it puts more emphasis on Poker Joe. Maybe we can incorporate both into one. My suggestion is:

Poker Joe pushed the Nez Perce at a hurried pace trying to get them to safety in Canada. Many Nez Perce were growing weary and tired and thought they should slow the pace. After a special council was held, Nez Perce leader Looking Glass took over as leader and would continue the Nez Perce push to safety at a much slower pace. Poker Joe reluctantly relinquished his leadership role, fearing they would be caught and killed by the soldiers that were pursuing them.

The current source reference citation is correct and need not be altered. Matthew Clevinger 20:28, 14 November 2019 (UTC) — Preceding unsigned comment added by MClevinger (talk • contribs)


 * Matt, I like your addition to the Removal from Council section. Please incorporate it into what I've written as you see fit.  If I get to it first, then I have no qualms doing it.Greenleaf88 (talk)


 * --CheyChristensen (talk) 03:10, 16 November 2019 (UTC)Hi guys, I had added some info on this to sandbox a few days back, I will add it here so we can combine everything "Lean Elk/Poker Joe took over leadership of the Nez Percè Tribe in 1877 from the Nez Percè chief Looking Glass, after the battle of Big Hole left many Nez Percè injured or dead. Lean Elk had experience hunting in Montana and knew the routes the Nez Percè should take to reach the border to avoid another battle.[2] Lean Elk's leadership style was fast paced and pushed the Nez Percè caravan forward toward the Canadian Border. Lean Elk's traveling style left the Nez Percè caravan tired and weak, chief Looking Glass questioned Lean Elk's tactics and ultimately resumed his position as leadership before the Nez Percè reached the Canadian border

My source also says that he led the Nez Percè 500 miles from the battle of Big Hole to the Missouri River so I think we should incorporate that. Let me Know if you guys want to add anything else, I can combine it all if you want?


 * @CheyChristensen this is good. Matthew Clevinger 07:59, 16 November 2019 (UTC)


 * Incorporated this section last nightGreenleaf88 (talk)

Wikipedia already has a Battle of the Big Hole page
Wikipedia already has a page devoted to Battle of the Big Hole. I don't think there is much to add that is not already mentioned on the Wiki page. I suggest we create a short paraphrase of the wiki https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_the_Big_Hole and add the link to that wiki page as above.

Matthew Clevinger 21:41, 14 November 2019 (UTC) — Preceding unsigned comment added by MClevinger (talk • contribs)


 * Okay, let's just add a link to Battle of the Big Hole. I'll try to give the section a different identity since Poker Joe's leadership AND removal by the council revolves around it.  Does anyone have any information about his early days??Greenleaf88 (talk)


 * I think we can paraphrase from the Wiki Big Hole page and then make sure we have the link to the Big Hole Wiki. I will see what I come up with and let you know. — Preceding unsigned comment added by MClevinger (talk • contribs) 04:48, 15 November 2019 (UTC)
 * was added to redirect to the Battle of the Big Hole Wiki articleMatthew Clevinger 18:46, 15 November 2019 (UTC)


 * I believe we're supposed to add to the existing stub, so I'm going into the first section and incorporation Cheyenne's work with the stuff that's there now. I added The Death of Poker Joe to the end, took out the Battle of Big Hole, and am in the process of creating a new section for it.Greenleaf88 (talk)


 * I'll combine Big Hole with Leaning Elk becomes leader of Nez Perce Tribe. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Greenleaf88 (talk • contribs) 03:12, 16 November 2019 (UTC)


 * I've added a new section in the Sandbox called Initial Involvement in the Nez Perce War. Please feel free to add to/subtract from it.  I'm not done with it yet.  Just wanted to update the page as continue to work through it.  If I don't see any activity by the time I'm done tonight, I'll start combining some of the chunks we have floating around so that you all will (hopefully) have a nice framework to by in the morning.Greenleaf88 (talk)  —Preceding undated comment added 06:26, 16 November 2019 (UTC)
 * Awesome! Looks and sounds great. Matthew Clevinger 08:02, 16 November 2019 (UTC) — Preceding unsigned comment added by MClevinger (talk • contribs)


 * Okay y'all, we have five distinct sections now, though it's still debatable whether we should keep Removal of Leadership in there, or couple it with the preceding section. I'll let you all decide.  I just wanted to get a framework in place so the information is organized.  You see that I added a new section (as mentioned earlier) called Initial Involvement in the Nez Perce War.  Again, please feel free to add/delete/move stuff around as you please.  I hope we can expand on these sections at a quick pace over the next two days. Signing off for the evening!Greenleaf88 (talk)  —Preceding undated comment added 09:31, 16 November 2019 (UTC)


 * Just did another edit. You'll see that I rearranged some blocks of information you've all been put here, and in the Sandbox itself.  Please feel free to change things as you see fit.Greenleaf88 (talk)  —Preceding undated comment added 21:41, 16 November 2019 (UTC)

--CheyChristensen (talk) 05:55, 17 November 2019 (UTC)Everything is looking really good. I am loving seeing the changes to the sandbox. Thanks guy! I will keep an eye out for anymore information coming in and paraphrase where I can. I believe I am tapped out on resources, I am not finding anything new so I am more than likely done adding info..


 * I'm kind of in the same boat. I've exhausted all my leads.  I truly hope Brandon can come up with something here. Matt, you pull the plug on this thing when you're ready.Greenleaf88 (talk)  —Preceding undated comment added 19:47, 17 November 2019 (UTC)