User talk:Greenman/Archive2010-12-23

Move to delete articles about African language wikipedias (again)
You previously (around a month ago) took part in consensus about redirecting or deleting articles about African languages such as Amharic Wikipedia and Lingala Wikipedia. Did you know the same, er, gentlemen, are now once again moving to delete these articles from the English Wikipedia since they do not find African language wikipedias notable, and don't understand why anyone else should either. 141.152.28.7 (talk) 17:56, 23 June 2009 (UTC)

FORU Oceania Cup
Hi. I see you've edited the article on the FORU Oceania Cup to indicate that PNG and the Cook Islands are this year's joint winners. Thank you for updating the article, but there are two important comments I need to make. First, when adding new information, please remember to always specify the source of that information. Second, as I understand, the FORU Cup is split into Eastern and Western divisions, with the winners of the two meeting in the final. Therefore, PNG and the Cooks aren't joint winners; they should meet in a final to determine a single winner. Unless you have a source which says they're joint winners, I'll have to remove what you've added. Thanks. Aridd (talk) 16:10, 1 July 2009 (UTC)
 * See response. Greenman (talk) 17:48, 1 July 2009 (UTC)
 * A slash made it confusing, but I think it's all right with an "or". If you've got a source for the semi-final results, though, remember to add it. :) Aridd (talk) 18:14, 1 July 2009 (UTC)

Reverts on Currie Cup
Hi Greenman, Sorry if I didn't explain myself regarding the revert. The edits regarding the Griffons link and the event period are completely acceptable, but I disagree with you on the team names. Growing up in South Africa and being involved in rugby myself, the common names for the provincial teams during the Currie Cup season are Vodacom this and Xerox that. This is how they are published and spoken about in a professional level. I understand in casual conversation we refer to the teams by a shorter name, cause who wanted to say Vodacom Western Province, we just say WP, Bulls, Sharks or Lions, but for the content of the article I really do think that the proper names are necessary. (Jonathanburger (talk) 16:00, 27 July 2009 (UTC))

Thanks!
Hello, Greenman. I've just viewed the blog which belongs to you and finds some good news regarding Swahili Wikipedia. Yes, we made it, though most of the articles are stubs! Hope to see many report from you, brother. Cheers and thanks again and again.--'''Mwanaharakati(Longa) 06:43, 4 August 2009 (UTC)

h2h-za
hi -- reverted your good faith edit to South Africa. To clarify: Barnard did indeed perform the first human-to-human heart transplant, as implausible as the wording seems. Earlier experiments had been with animal hearts (pigs and such), and yes, animal-to-human. Seb az86556 (talk) 11:38, 4 August 2009 (UTC)

Pontypridd RFC
I would very much appreciate a re-classification of the Pontypridd RFC page. Lots of work has gone into upgrading and updating it recently, and as such, I feel strongly that we're pushing towards a B-class, at the very least. Mayn many thanks, --Monkeynuts2008 (talk) 10:54, 11 August 2009 (UTC)

Flagman/Vdiest
Springbok? there are, and never where any springbok in northern Limpopo. Perhaps you mean redbuck (rooibok)or bushbuck as more commen known. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Vdiest (talk • contribs) 09:09, 8 September 2009 (UTC) Springbok prefer a warmer near desert climate like the Kalahari. Even the Kruger park does not have any.

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Talkback
 The left orium  13:48, 12 September 2009 (UTC)

dupli.back
I see you reverted my addition of dupli.back to list of backup software, why did you do that? the page I am talking about is this.. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_backup_software

I do not understand why you did what you did and so I have since reverted your revert.
 * You need to add the article first - see WP:WTAF.Greenman (talk) 10:05, 15 February 2010 (UTC)

Spirulina
I reverted your reversion of of my addition of information per wp:preserve, if you do not like the wording then feel free to reword it, however sourced statements should not be removed. For your information I did read the source, however perhaps my assumption of conclusiveness was rash. --UltraMagnus (talk) 12:50, 15 September 2009 (UTC)

your opinion/input
...needed here Choyoołʼįįhí:Seb az86556 21:09, 19 September 2009 (UTC)

Rugby union - Any input?
Hi

Your revert has been reverted. There is a discussion here if you have anything to ad? Sahmejil (talk) 08:26, 23 September 2009 (UTC)

List of concentration and internment camps
The Sri Lankan camps are refugee camps. But terrorist sympathisers and foreign elements are publishing *allegations* of them being internment camps. As there is no concrete evidence, or court of law verdict in the matter, please consider removing your edit. ThanksKerr avon (talk) 00:50, 27 October 2009 (UTC)
 * This is absolutely uncalled for, calling fellow editors terrorist sympathizers and foreign elements as such. We are crearting an encylopedia, if a section is based on reliable sources then such information can be wriiten down not deleted and threaten fellow editors. Taprobanus (talk) 15:59, 27 October 2009 (UTC)

Christian Democratic Party edits
You changed the present tense items to past tense in http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Christian_Democratic_Party_(South_Africa)&diff=next&oldid=286064568 without giving any references to show that the information you changed is no longer true. Are you quite certain that none of the items that you changed, is still current? -- leuce (talk) 09:02, 8 November 2009 (UTC)
 * Response Greenman (talk) 15:24, 8 November 2009 (UTC)

your request
Hi Greenman,

regarding your usurp request on nlwiki, could you please make your request on nl:Wikipedia:Verzoek_voor_hernoeming_van_account ? Thanks! effeietsanders 13:20, 26 November 2009 (UTC)
 * Hi, I've renamed the local user on nl.wiki to Greenman (old). The user name Greenman on nl.wikipedia is now open for you to use on nl. Best regards, Niels? ennl 20:38, 30 November 2009 (UTC)

?
"is" and then "decend" ? - well, either "population" is singular or it is plural, you can't have it both ways. Choyoołʼįįhí:Seb az86556 01:29, 3 December 2009 (UTC)
 * Thanks, you are right :) Greenman (talk) 00:45, 4 December 2009 (UTC)

Kugluktuk, Nunavut
If you see any more like this can you either revert it as unsourced rather than vandalism. A temperature of +27 in December is so wrong that I'm surprised it hasn't be changed before. There are multiple places in Nunavut that have incorrect temperatures and it appears that is one of them. I've been corresponding with Environment Canada about them and they are going to be changing them in the new year. Enter CambridgeBayWeather, waits for audience applause, not a sausage 20:24, 9 December 2009 (UTC)

Caramel color and GMO
I do not understand the point of the GMO info in the caramel color article. Of course the sugar used to make caramel color can come from GMO or non-GMO sources. And of course PCR can't detect that since sugar contains no genetic material. That could be said of anything made with sugar. You could just as well say "Since the sweetener in ketchup/candy/cognac can be produced from maize, which may be grown in the <>, there is a possibility that it will contain < > material that cannot be detected by a Polymerase chain reaction." -- which would be equally true and, as far as I can tell, equally out of place in the article. --macrakis (talk) 07:05, 31 December 2009 (UTC)


 * I guess I didn't make my point very clearly. The property "containing GMO ingredients" can be predicated of all vegetable products, just as can be the property "being produced in Myanmar" or "grown on irrigated land" or "grown from Japanese seed".  Each of those properties could be of interest to a variety of people for a variety of reasons, and cannot in general be determined by biochemical analysis of the product (PCR or other), and is not necessarily indicated on the label.  Now we come to a product category like Caramel color (not a particular product made by a particular producer) and in that product category there may be some members which contain GMO ingredients or are produced in Myanmar or are grown on irrigated land or whatever.  What possible value is there to saying "Some of the members of this product category may have property X." when property X is something members of just about any product category could have? --macrakis (talk) 16:14, 31 December 2009 (UTC)


 * I'm still not being clear, I guess. Let's stick to GMO's in particular for a moment, since my examples of "grown in Myanmar" etc. seem to have confused the issue rather than clarified it. GMO corn is used for many things besides making sugars for caramel color. Are you saying that every article about every product that could potentially use GMO plant products should have a comment about GMO components? Should the articles on shirts (GMO cotton), gasoline (ethanol from GMO corn), and cooking oil (GMO soybeans) mention that they may (or may not) contain GMO plant products? (Which except for the cotton may not be detectable biochemically.)  How far does that go?  Should the article on potato chips mention that they are sometimes colored with caramel color which is sometimes made from sugars derived from GMO crops? Should the article on diabetes mention that insulin is often produced from GMO bacteria?


 * Now let's look at the other dimension of 'interesting' properties of ingredients. There are surely people out there who would like to boycott Myanmar because of its human rights record, or Japan because of WWII war crimes.  There are people are concerned about sustainability of desert-region irrigation.  Etc.  Surely we're not going to mention in every article about every product whether some versions of it are produced in Myanmar or Japan or produced with desert irrigation.


 * It seems to me that when there is a direct and strong connection between the topic of the article and some other topic, it is worth mentioning, e.g. GMO rapeseed in the canola article or GMO corn in high-fructose corn syrup. It is when the connection is indirect and weak that I don't think it's useful, especially since WP is nicely hyperlinked and it's easy to find out more about constituents of any particular product. --macrakis (talk) 21:44, 31 December 2009 (UTC)


 * Would you mind if I copied our discussion to the Talk page so other editors can give their opinion? --macrakis (talk) 20:40, 4 January 2010 (UTC)

Unreferenced BLPs
Hello Greenman! Thank you for your contributions. I am a bot alerting you that 6 of the articles that you created  are tagged as Unreferenced Biographies of Living Persons. The biographies of living persons policy requires that all personal or potentially controversial information be sourced. In addition, to insure verifiability, all biographies should be based on reliable sources. if you were to bring these articles up to standards, it would greatly help us with the current Category:All_unreferenced_BLPs article backlog. Once the articles are adequately referenced, please remove the unreferencedBLP tag. Here is the list:

Thanks!--DASHBot (talk) 19:31, 8 January 2010 (UTC)
 * 1) Mongane Wally Serote -
 * 2) Sarah Johnson (poet) -
 * 3) Tony Eprile -
 * 4) Joan Metelerkamp -
 * 5) Deon Meyer -
 * 6) Carel du Plessis -

Duplicate?
I see you reverted my deletion. I really had looked for the duplicate but didn't find it, so I reverted the deletion as sneaky vandalism, which is a common occurrence. One can't trust edit summaries from IPs. Where is the duplicate located? -- Brangifer (talk) 18:20, 23 January 2010 (UTC)

Advertising on Wiki
Hi Greenman, I refer you to your wiki / reply to me regarding some edits I did on behalf of my accounting and ERP software client - Pastel Accounting:

"Welcome to Wikipedia. Everyone is welcome to contribute constructively to the encyclopedia. However, please do not add promotional material to articles or other Wikipedia pages, as you did to Comparison of accounting software. Advertising and using Wikipedia as a "soapbox" is against Wikipedia policy and not permitted. Take a look at the welcome page to learn more about Wikipedia. Thank you. Greenman (talk) 14:04, 2 February 2010 (UTC)"

As much as I understand what you are saying in this post and note the rules of Wikipedia, I would like to understand how Pastel Accounting's competitors have their own pages - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Softline, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quickbooks to name a few. This seems a little hypocritical to me as the "comparison of accounting software page" - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Comparison_of_accounting_software ; is also used a "soapbox" to benefit the brands that are listed there.

Please will you clarify why these pages are up and how I can improve Pastel Accounting's copy in an unbiased fashion in order to have it hosted by Wikipedia, as I find this very unfair that my clients competitors are on Wikipedia "promoting" their brand, and we cannot.

CKNET (talk) 08:56, 10 March 2010 (UTC)CKNETCKNET (talk) 08:56, 10 March 2010 (UTC)


 * I recreated the page as a stub: the software is clearly notable: there are references to it in 3rd party dead-tree published sources (noting how commonly it's pirated, no less!) and courses are available from (for example) CPUT. --Slashme (talk) 09:01, 11 June 2010 (UTC)

Talk:Aspartame controversy
I've asked Immortale to remove or refactor the comment. It doesn't mention the external link in any way, correct? Could you explain how it meets WP:TALK and is relevant to the discussion on the external link? --Ronz (talk) 23:42, 27 April 2010 (UTC)
 * He's moved it to it's own section. It's disruptive, but at least he's no asserting it has anything to do with the external link discussion. --Ronz (talk) 15:52, 28 April 2010 (UTC)

Richard Goldstone
Thanks for the kind words. Do you think it might be possible to get some more South African Wikipedians to have a look at the article? I've posted a request to Wikipedia talk:WikiProject South Africa, but if you know other South African Wikipedians who might be able to provide advice that would be very useful. -- ChrisO (talk) 11:43, 16 May 2010 (UTC)
 * I'll sound a few people out and see if we can get some more people keeping an eye on the article. Greenman (talk) 21:43, 16 May 2010 (UTC)

Richard Goldstone - new version
You commented recently on some BLP issues concerning Richard Goldstone. I've written a considerably expanded and improved version of the article in my userspace at User:ChrisO/Goldstone. If you have any comments about this new version before it gets transferred into article space, please feel free to comment at Talk:Richard Goldstone. -- ChrisO (talk) 23:23, 24 May 2010 (UTC)

Notification: General sanctions and 1RR restriction on Richard Goldstone
'''You are receiving this message because of your involvement at the Richard Goldstone article. Please don't consider it an assumption of bad faith''' As a result of an arbitration case, the Arbitration Committee has acknowledged long-term and persistent problems in the editing of articles related to the Palestinian-Israeli conflict, broadly understood. As a result, the Committee has enacted broad editing restrictions, described here and below.


 * Any uninvolved administrator may, on his or her own discretion, impose sanctions on any editor working in the area of conflict if, despite being warned, that editor repeatedly or seriously fails to adhere to the purpose of Wikipedia, any expected standards of behavior, or any normal editorial process.
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These editing restrictions may be applied to any editor for cause, provided the editor has been previously informed of the case. This message is to so inform you. This message does not necessarily mean that your current editing has been deemed a problem; this is a template message crafted to make it easier to notify any user who has edited the topic of the existence of these sanctions.

Generally, the next step, if an administrator feels your conduct on pages in this topic area is disruptive, would be a warning, to be followed by the imposition of sanctions (although in cases of serious disruption, the warning may be omitted). Hopefully no such action will be necessary.

This notice is only effective if given by an administrator and logged here.
 * In relation to the above, you are informed that the Richard Goldstone article is under a blanket 1RR restriction and violations of this restriction will result in escalating blocks and/or topic/page bans. Thank you for your cooperation. HJ Mitchell  &#124;  Penny for your thoughts?   22:00, 26 May 2010 (UTC)

No permission for Chimurenga content?
What is the logic for tagging the various various Chimurenga images for deletion, such as Molotov cocktail.jpg? What further permission is required? Chimurenga have jumped through hoops to get everything acceptable, twice updating their licensing agreement (after the Creative Commons change), something they struggled to do with their technical skills. Now the images are up for deletion again after all this time?

Chimurenga staff were specially hired at that time as part of the WikiAfrica project (see Wikipedia:WikiAfrica /Chimurenga Library). They would be unable to yet again amend their licensing after all this time, and all that would happen is that more under-represented African content would be deleted. Why, when there's clearly no violation here? Greenman 08:39, 27 May 2010 (UTC)
 * Hi, I nominated the images because as I read the website, the website text itself is licensed under a free license but it is not clear whether the magazines can be used under a free license as well. The statement at the bottom of the page refers only to the library. Have the authors of the magazines allowed the free licensing under cc-by-sa-3.0 of their work? Hekerui (talk) 08:49, 27 May 2010 (UTC)

Comparison of issue-tracking systems
How can reverting one commercial tool be reasonable when there are many others on the page? It's also confusing when you only reverted the edit to the section at the top and not any of those that existed in the other parts of the article. --Walter Görlitz (talk) 21:06, 27 May 2010 (UTC)
 * Response Greenman (talk) 21:28, 27 May 2010 (UTC)
 * An article should be created. I placed a request on the user's talk page. It would be good for us to use a domain expert to create the article rather than threaten them. This product is a valuable, well-established tool in the world of software testing. The company is small and the editor may not realize that article that is being pointed to is a redirect. I would like to try to engage the editor to make Wikipedia a better place. If that doesn't work, I have no problems labelling the editor's actions as vandalism. --Walter Görlitz (talk) 21:36, 27 May 2010 (UTC)
 * To that end, I have removed the redirect and placed the basic information that I have on the product into the article. Hopefully the editor will improve the stub with valuable information. The last time I had a demo of the software was in 2000 so it is a fairly well-established product, albeit with a small company. --Walter Görlitz (talk) 21:51, 27 May 2010 (UTC)

Proposed deletion of Arora (browser)


The article Arora (browser) has been proposed for deletion&#32; because of the following concern:
 * Fails Notability

While all contributions to Wikipedia are appreciated, content or articles may be deleted for any of several reasons.

You may prevent the proposed deletion by removing the  notice, but please explain why in your edit summary or on the article's talk page.

Please consider improving the article to address the issues raised. Removing  will stop the proposed deletion process, but other deletion processes exist. The speedy deletion process can result in deletion without discussion, and articles for deletion allows discussion to reach consensus for deletion. 87.144.86.118 (talk) 09:27, 6 August 2010 (UTC)

CMS List and the poor state of wikipedia notability guidelines
Regarding the CMS List, I decided to remove my last Comments since I decided they were inappropriate. Nonetheless, I question why you removed ALL of my changes rather than just roll back the last one.

I made my changes in stages, rather than all at once. It was rather unfair for you to roll back every change and state one reason which did not cover every change. If you disagreed with a change-set, I had left particular comments stating exactly what was done.

Further, there were obvious minor corrections (which should have been made) for existing entries which you blindly rolled back and left existing entries which did not meet the same notability guidelines. As for N2 and Kooboo, they are two somewhat-viable alternatives some people turn to when DNN and Umbraco do not meet their needs. They are stable projects, and are far more notable in the industry than most of the PHP CMS list. I put them on the list because they deserve a spot and I don't have the time to create a page for them just to meet some obscure notability guideline that has no basis in reality.

To attempt to meet a notability guideline, I did try to create a page for Telerik. Whose tools (and CMS Sitefinity) are known in the industry (they were recently awarded Microsoft Partner of the Year: CMS Wire article). I created a simple starting page, figuring people more experienced would eventually contribute. Instead, the page was speedily deleted.

I did a lot of research on ASP.net CMSs (for my job) and figured the Wikipedia community should benefit, but I really see no point in contributing further.

Its obvious that Wikipedia is no longer about garnering inclusive knowledge. The irony is that wikis are supposed to be about lowering the barrier of entry to contributing knowledge, but all I see are walls. Rather than trying to enhance knowledge (and build upon foundations and starting points), this community seems intent on actively removing it. Its not surprising that the number of active contributors have dropped WSJ article.

I work in government, I deal with bureaucracy all day. I can see that decision here are being made more by bureaucracy than by knowledge. Maybe if things change, I'll reconsider my position, but I will no longer attempt to actively contribute to wikipedia. Dealing with this is really not worth my time and effort. If my knowledge isn't wanted, then I will go back to using it only when it benefits me and me alone. I wish Wikipedia well, but its obviously fallen from its roots.

Chimmy3 (talk) 13:19, 22 August 2010 (UTC)

Proposed deletion of Tenda Madima


The article Tenda Madima has been proposed for deletion&#32; because of the following concern:
 * No references. Google gives no evidence that the African Heritage Literature Award ever existed.

While all contributions to Wikipedia are appreciated, content or articles may be deleted for any of several reasons.

You may prevent the proposed deletion by removing the  notice, but please explain why in your edit summary or on the article's talk page.

Please consider improving the article to address the issues raised. Removing  will stop the proposed deletion process, but other deletion processes exist. The speedy deletion process can result in deletion without discussion, and articles for deletion allows discussion to reach consensus for deletion.  Blanchardb -Me•MyEars•MyMouth- timed 16:25, 1 September 2010 (UTC)

Nomination of Tenda Madima for deletion
A discussion has begun about whether the article Tenda Madima, which you created or to which you contributed, should be deleted. While contributions are welcome, an article may be deleted if it is inconsistent with Wikipedia policies and guidelines for inclusion, explained in the deletion policy.

The article will be discussed at Articles for deletion/Tenda Madima until a consensus is reached, and you are welcome to contribute to the discussion.

You may edit the article during the discussion, including to address concerns raised in the discussion. However, do not remove the article-for-deletion template from the top of the article. --  Blanchardb -Me•MyEars•MyMouth- timed 17:41, 14 September 2010 (UTC)

Please Help - advice on inserting accounting info on an existing page
Hi Greenman, i just want to say thank you for all your help on the Pastel accounting page. I have another favour to ask on behalf of my client..

The page: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Accounting_software - lists numerous brands in the bottom of the page in the refrences table, quickbooks, Peachtree accounting and so on are listed. Is there any way we can add pastel accounting to this list?

CKNET user CKNET (talk) 12:57, 27 September 2010 (UTC)PamCKNET (talk) 12:57, 27 September 2010 (UTC)

Hi Greenman, thank you for helping me with the request above, may i please ask that you change the Pastel accounting to: Softline Pastel Accounting?

My client thought it would be better if we used the full name, apologies for the up and down.

CKNET User CKNET (talk) 04:52, 30 September 2010 (UTC)Pam04:52, 30 September 2010 (UTC)
 * Response Greenman (talk) 08:56, 30 September 2010 (UTC)

Proposed deletion of Sarah Johnson (poet)


The article Sarah Johnson (poet) has been proposed for deletion&#32; because of the following concern:
 * This BLP has been unsourced since 2004. The subject has only published one work and I can find no independent mainstream reviews of the book nor significant coverage of the author to verify she meets notability criteria.

While all contributions to Wikipedia are appreciated, content or articles may be deleted for any of several reasons.

You may prevent the proposed deletion by removing the  notice, but please explain why in your edit summary or on the article's talk page.

Please consider improving the article to address the issues raised. Removing  will stop the proposed deletion process, but other deletion processes exist. The speedy deletion process can result in deletion without discussion, and articles for deletion allows discussion to reach consensus for deletion. Jezebel's Ponyo bons mots 18:58, 25 October 2010 (UTC)

Xubuntu
Thank you for removing the personal attack and warning the IP editor. He seems to be nothing more than a verbose vandal, so I would appreciate it you could assist my in watching the page. - Ahunt (talk) 11:14, 7 November 2010 (UTC)

Greenman
Greenman

I am surprised with your lack of knowledge of Africa specially African Politics.

I advise it that you should move to another subject.

Sincerely yours, etc...

Rui Gabirro —Preceding unsigned comment added by 90.222.115.238 (talk) 15:48, 23 December 2010 (UTC)