User talk:Guanaco/Archive/Oct 2006

Hi
Welcome back. — Natha  n  ( talk ) 06:57, 13 June 2006 (UTC)

A short Esperanzial update
As you may have gathered, discussions have been raging for about a week on the Esperanza talk page as to the future direction of Esperanza. Some of these are still ongoing and warrant more input (such as the idea to scrap the members list altogether). However, some decisions have been made and the charter has hence been amended. See what happened. Basically, the whole leadership has had a reshuffle, so please review the new, improved charter.

As a result, we are electing 4 people this month. They will replace JoanneB and Pschemp and form a new tranche A, serving until December. Elections will begin on 2006-07-02 and last until 2006-07-09. If you wish to run for a Council position, add your name to the list before 2006-07-02. For more details, see Esperanza/June 2006 elections.

Thanks and kind, Esperanzial regards, &mdash;Cel es tianpower háblame 16:00, 23 June 2006 (UTC)

A new userbox you might like
Hi Guanaco,

I couldn't resist making the following userbox after reading the attached link. After being insulted on numerous occasions by trolls I decided to fight back the best way I know how -- with a witty userbox! Feel free to remove this from your talk page if you don't appreciate the humour. = )

Cheers,

 Netsnipe  (Talk)  06:09, 11 July 2006 (UTC)

User:WritersCramp appears to be back
Greetings Guanaco, after reviewing this RfC about User:WritersCramp I thought you should be aware of this WP:ANI report concerning User:SirIsaacBrock and his new sockpuppet User:Porky Pig. Thanks. (→ Netscott ) 23:30, 12 July 2006 (UTC)

RE: Johnny Lee Clary - Please help
Hey there, my name is Nick, my username is Potters house and I have encountered a problem with trying to provide any information about Johnny Lee Clary. I have posted this post off to other staff members also. I am not sure if this is the best route to resolve this, but can think of no other way.

The article Johnny Lee Clary has been deleted. I have known Johnny through telephone conversations and email for a short time now (about 3-4 months). He recently came and shared his life story in for our church group for the first time just two weeks ago. Before I met Johnny I became interested in his story i.e. his conversion from the head of the KKK in the US, to being a Christian Minister who now teaches against race hate groups. I found the article Johnny Lee Clary as it still is today, deleted, except for some small talk. If you read the talk you see what I have said at the time (notice I have gotten no reply, probable my fault as I don’t know heaps about WIKI policy). From my understanding Johnny Lee Clary was posting as The KingOfDixie and looks like he tried to change a few things on Wiki concerning the KKK. While this is a controversial subject, Johnny being the former leader of the KKK would probably know a thing or two and be able to contibute, but that’s another story. He eventually made an article about himself i.e. Johnny Lee Clary. Johnny being quite new to Wiki and ignorant of rules of conduct found himself at odds with some admins and had his site deleted.

Whilst observing Johnny over the last 3-4 months I have noticed that he is very outspoken against race hate groups such as the Neo Nazis, Skinheads, KKK etc. This, more often than not, lands Johnny in the hot seat. He has experienced persecution from racist groups for his departure from the KKK and voiced opinions against these racist organizations on his webpage, www.xkkk.org. Johnny has also received multiple death threats.

Because of his bold stance against these racist groups Johnny has become accustomed to hatred directed at him by those same groups. Johnny concluded that perhaps the guy who deleted the page Johnny Lee Clary was a white supremist. I am hoping to clear this up. Before he told me this, I started to create J L Clary, after hearing nothing from posting in user talk on Johnny Lee Clary's article. I wasn't 10 minutes into the J L Clary article when it was issued a deletion notice, and then before I had time to reply (about 5 minutes) it was deleted! I was amazed. I told this to Johnny and he said the main reason he was told that he couldn't have an article was because he was not prominent enough.

Johnny has a very famous testimony and has been on multiple TV shows like Oprah, Donahue, Jerry Springer, etc, and even recently when he preached in our town he made front page news, a double spread on his life, and the local ABC interviewed him live, which is not bad for our town (LISMORE NSW Australia) See http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=John_Kerry&dir=prev&offset=20050327125109&limit=500&action=history.

When David Wilkerson came to our town hardly anyone knew or cared, yet David Wilkerson is allowed an article (and rightfully so), but more people know of Johnny. As to whether he is famous or not, just Google search him and see all the TV interviews and radio interviews he does. He hangs with some of the most prominent Christian leaders in Australia. Besides this, just being the former KKK leader should be enough for an article (he doesn't even get a mention in the KKK one, and would be deleted). He was also a Pro Wrestler. So he is prominent in Christian circles, he is prominent amongst race hate groups, and he is also prominent in the WWE wrestling.

Johnny asked me to test the waters for him to see if he was being persecuted by someone from a race hate group. So I created some sites, John Clary Wade Watts and Operation Colorblind - the name of Johnny's Ministry. These have been fine until yesterday. I cannot understand why these sites are just issued a deletion notice? Just because they mention JLC? I was hoping to discuss these things but they are just deleted. The one on Wade Watts is about a black gospel preacher who was one of the leaders in the civil rights movement in the US and was good friends with Martin Luther King. He took Johnny Clary under his wing and even ordained Johnny as a minister (to this day Johnny is the only white man ordained in the All Black Baptist Church). But his article is up for deletion because I mentioned Clary and had a link.

That is why I am writing to you to see if you can help. It seems to me that the person(s) deleting all articles which even mention Johnny Lee Clary has an agenda. I thought that wikipedia admins had to keep a neutral stance on every article. It seems like this guy has a vendetta against JLC. Why delete the Wade Watts article. That is guilt by association and could be proof that all deletions are because of racial discrimination! I hope this is not the case and would think that it is politically motivated, as Johnny is a strong supporter of George Bush and Antaeus Feldspar of Kerry.

See:

http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=John_Kerry&dir=prev&offset=20050327125109&limit=500&action=history This shows how Antaeus Feldspar supports Kerry, which is fine, but Johnny is a strong supporter of Bush.

My hope is that Johnny will be able to have an article like any other famous person, minister, former KKK leader, or pro wrestler, and that Johnny and anyone connected with him and his ministry will in future have certain rules set in place that do not allow the wholesale deletion of the articles associated with him, but that they will be at least discussed.

I thank you for reading this long winded post. I have only been using WIKI for about a year myself so I need your help, I don't really know what else to do. I hope you can help. I personally think that Johnny's story is one that is beneficial to the cause of reconciliation between races and to the3 unity of society as a whole. It would be a shame if WIKI became known for having covert racists. Of course I hope that this is a misunderstanding and that all will be cleared up soon.

Here are some links that might help.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wade_Watts

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:TheKingOfDixie

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Colorblind

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User:Threeafterthree

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:Potters_house

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Deletion_policy

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User:Antaeus_Feldspar

http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=John_Kerry&dir=prev&offset=20050327125109&limit=500&action=history This shows how Antaeus Feldspar supports Kerry, which is fine, but Johnny is a strong supporter of Bush. Perhaps the bias is political and not racial?

The link for page: John Clary has already been deleted!

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User:Alabamaboy

Please notice that his link was taken from the KKK site the same day:

http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Ku_Klux_Klan&diff=prev&oldid=65690238

then

http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Ku_Klux_Klan&diff=next&oldid=65690238

Also note his contributions: Featured articles: ·	African American literature -- My first featured article. Thanks to everyone who gave feedback. While I didn't start the article, I obsessed on it for an entire month and wrote most of the copy. ·	Ku Klux Klan -- I began work on this article after it became a featured article. Since then I've mediated several editorial disputes on the article (including one of which kept the article from being delisted as a FA) and made a large number of edit. Potters house 00:21, 27 July 2006 (UTC) Nick.

Hi
Guanaco, where've you been? I miss your presence. Surely it's not worth leaving Wikipedia. - GilliamJF 08:25, 30 July 2006 (UTC)

Your talk page has been vandalised
Hi,

User:Dan Palmer, vandalised your talk page. Here is the edit he made if you want to see it:vandalised talk page.--Scott3 19:21, 6 August 2006 (UTC)
 * Looks like he was Jhonny the Vandal--Scott3 19:29, 6 August 2006 (UTC)

Personal Attacks
Please do not make personal attack on wikipedia or on another site against a wikipedia administrator. Thank you. 63.23.23.155 03:17, 19 August 2006 (UTC)
 * That wasn't a personal attack... Please do not post irrelevant warning messages regarding comments that were made five months ago. Thank you. —Guanaco 03:27, 19 August 2006 (UTC)

Cleanup after yourself
Could you please go clean up the indexing sort keys in the articles you have moved without doing so. See Talk: Nāga, for example. Gene Nygaard 21:02, 19 September 2006 (UTC)

Transnistrian referendum, 2006
Thank you for accepting to mediate the Transnistrian referendum, 2006 article. I am the person who submitted the request for mediation. I am not familiar with this procedure, after the acceptance of mediation should we continue to discuss in article's talk page or in the RFM page? As you accepted to mediate, should I submit a more detailed statement in the RFM page?--MariusM 21:16, 10 October 2006 (UTC)
 * The case hasn't been assigned to a mediator yet. Before mediation can proceed, an individual member of the Committee will need to personally take it. Because of the backlog of cases and the shortage of mediators, this may take a while. —Guanaco 01:27, 11 October 2006 (UTC)

Mediation Committee
Hiya! I noticed the note you placed on Essjay's talkpage. Is there any chance you're working on getting MedCom back up and running again? I'm a coordinator (read:clerk) for MedCab and we've got a severe case backup, so the more mediation the merrier. Oh, and if any of the MedCom folks want to do a little informal mediation, they're plenty welcome to it as far as we're concerned! Thanks! :D ~Kylu ( u | t )  22:53, 10 October 2006 (UTC)


 * I'm here for the same reason. The MedCom needs a new chair to get the ball rolling again. Would you or another active member be interested? -Will Beback 23:51, 10 October 2006 (UTC)
 * I'm willing to do it. I'll ask the mediation-en-l list if anyone objects to me taking over as chair. —Guanaco 01:27, 11 October 2006 (UTC)


 * Guanaco, there's a discussion about what's happening with the MedCom here in case you're interested in weighing in. The problem is that the ArbCom sometimes likes to refer cases to mediation instead of accepting them, but there's currently nothing to refer them to. Anything you and Will can do to revitalize the committee would be much appreciated. Let me know if I can help in any way. SlimVirgin (talk) 00:03, 11 October 2006 (UTC)

While we're on the subject, congrats for kicking MedCom into gear! If there's anything I can do to help out (other than join medcom, since I'm already a medcab coordinator) please don't hesitate to ask! Not that I bet you'll need help. :D ~Kylu ( u | t )  03:34, 12 October 2006 (UTC)

Wikipedia:Requests for mediation/Shining Path
Hello Guanaco, I see that you are or represent the mediation comittee in Requests for mediation/Shining Path, and I see your "Accept". Does it mean that you accepted to be a mediator or that you decided in favor of something? Please explain.--AAAAA 11:08, 12 October 2006 (UTC)
 * I only passed the case through preliminary screening, and a mediator will need to personally agree to mediate the dispute. Requests for mediation/Guide to accepted cases explains all this in detail. —Guanaco 18:37, 12 October 2006 (UTC)

Telepathy
You volunteered to mediate a dispute on this article. Since you accepted, we haven't heard from you over there. One of the editors involved has made a lot of edits today; many of them have been good, but he's starting to make some that I disagree with. My recent experience with him is that it's difficult or impossible to discuss things with him.

In other words, some actual mediation appears to be required. KarlBunker 18:25, 12 October 2006 (UTC)
 * I didn't volunteer to mediate it. I only passed it through the initial screening, and a member of the committee will need to personally volunteer to mediate; unfortunately, I don't have time to personally handle all eleven cases I accepted. The process for accepted cases is explained in detail at Requests for mediation/Guide to accepted cases. —Guanaco 18:34, 12 October 2006 (UTC)


 * Ah; sorry, I misunderstood. KarlBunker 20:42, 12 October 2006 (UTC)


 * I don't know how to remove this item from the waiting-for-a-mediator queue, but you can do so. I've decided to stop editing or watching this article, so that resolves the dispute. KarlBunker 13:43, 14 October 2006 (UTC)
 * I'll close it. Thanks for letting me know. If you change your mind, you can always post a new request for mediation. —Guanaco 18:56, 14 October 2006 (UTC)

Thank you
for your perseverance in sticking around through all the muck that happened earlier this year. not many people do that, or at the very least, disappear for quite some time. regardless of your stance on policy and disputes, i am glad that you have chosen to remain and contribute. ... aa:talk 22:07, 14 October 2006 (UTC)

Coretta Scott King
The issue was not that anyone had celled her work "enlightenment.' The exact passage, and it does follow NPOV is thus:

--King, the widow of civil rights leader, Martin Luther King, was also a civil rights activist who, among her oppostition to apartheid and the death penalty, also worked tirelessly toward the enlightening of gay rights and the issues surrounding it. She clearly indicated her beliefs which linked gay rights to the civil rights movement, stating:

I still hear people say that I should not be talking about the rights of lesbian and gay people.... But I hasten to remind them that Martin Luther King Jr. said, 'Injustice anywhere is a threat to justice everywhere.' I appeal to everyone who believes in Martin Luther King Jr.’s dream to make room at the table of brotherhood and sisterhood for lesbian and gay people.

In her efforts she also pushed for a closer relation of the two ideas, even criticizing black pastors who wanted to deny homosexuals their rights.

In retaliation, members of the WBC along with their ringleader, Fred Phelps, planned a protest of King's funeral for February 7, 2006 at noon. Phelps quoted Leviticus 18:22 and indicated that Mrs. King had given God the "middle finger." --

The word "enlightening" is a shorter way of saying that she tried to instruct/educate others about gay rights, and nothing more.

But apparently that fact that user 132.241.246.111 will not get an account, has called edits to the page "horse shit," has erased references and pictures relating to the Sweden subsection, and is currently suspected of being at least the sockpuppet of two other accounts has no merit in deciding whether or not this person should be blocked from editting this page.

Typical wiki policy?

Gnrlotto 22:49, 14 October 2006 (UTC)
 * Unfortunately, I'm not an administrator, so I have no power to block the user. I agree that this person needs to be more civil, and I'll do what I can to maintain the article. If he persists in making destructive edits, I'll post to WP:AN/I. The issue with "to enlighten" in all its forms is the word's strong connotation of truth. —Guanaco 00:07, 15 October 2006 (UTC)

Excepting that how it is used here, it is only used in the true dictionary definition sense.Gnrlotto 01:56, 15 October 2006 (UTC)
 * I understand, but neutral connotations are preferred, so I reworded the section. —Guanaco 02:43, 15 October 2006 (UTC)

Can you tell me where "enlighten" has that connotation? Like the term in European history, "The Enlightenment," in no way specifies that people believed "lies" and now believed the "truth." It indicates that people started employuing new ways of thinking, startiung trying to see the whole forest oinstead of moving from treet to tree. And some trees they kept as part of their memetic experience, and some got excised, but in no way points toward them suddenly not believeing "lies" anymore.Gnrlotto 17:02, 15 October 2006 (UTC)

wikibooks:User:Darklama
On 15 October, you reverted several edits by wikibooks:User:Darklama, and most of those reverts were unnecessary, and there is some concern that they were not done in good faith. Since you have been relatively inactive at wikibooks since January, and because these reverts were performed without any kind of explanation, they are all the more suspect. If you wouldn't mind giving some kind of explanation about this, all of us at wikibooks would be most appreciative. -- Whiteknight (Wikibooks) 02:42, 17 October 2006 (UTC)

TfD nomination of Template:Disturbing
Template:Disturbing has been nominated for deletion. You are invited to comment on the discussion at the template's entry on the Templates for Deletion page. Thank you. riana_dzast a  16:28, 18 October 2006 (UTC)

Edits on Rudolf Steiner/Anthroposophy pages
While the mediation process is underway, we may need some reminders about the WP:Assume good faith and WP:Civil policy; see this edit from today, for example. Could some editor step in and reassert these policies? Hgilbert 20:18, 20 October 2006 (UTC)