User talk:Guerillero/Archives/2013/January

Return
I have returned to the internet. Please give me a few days to get to everything -- Guerillero &#124;  My Talk  04:19, 1 January 2013 (UTC)

That was a close call.
Phew, you dodged a bullet there: you almost got elected. :-) I'm sure that – if you haven't regained your senses by then – next year's election will punish you with a seat.  Congratulation on a very good showing.  &mdash; Coren (talk) 22:13, 18 December 2012 (UTC)

It were those 408 who didn't vote and even if 300 of them had casted their vote, I'm sure you would have got it through. It was really close. I supported you mate and was really hoping that you'll pass. Better luck next time, if you run. Cheers!  TheSpecialUser TSU 02:25, 19 December 2012 (UTC)
 * Thank you both. I am not sure what my plans are for the next election. -- Guerillero &#124;  My Talk  22:54, 1 January 2013 (UTC)

The Signpost: 31 December 2012

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Your promised explanation? I'm still waiting!
Guerillero, I remind you of your undertaking back in October:

"'I will post a statement in the morning explaining what I did and didn't do. (It is a Saturday night and I am a college student.)-- Guerillero &#124; My Talk  01:37, 21 October 2012 (UTC)'"

(See this archived section of my talkpage.)

Quite an old post. Now, I accept that you were a drunk college student on a Saturday night. I understand, because I can remember such times myself, decades ago. But really – two months? You will note that I have posted nothing since then, except to vote in the ArbCom elections.

I was tempted to write a comment in the otherwise blank election-discussion section about you, to be read by voters. But I thought: "No, I am involved. And though I think this is important about Guerillero as a candidate for high office in Wikipedia, it would be fair for me to stay silent. Just wait." And wait I did. I underline the word fair for a reason. Bear with me.

From your userpage I see that you are studying philosophy. Intriguing. I know the domain rather well, having spent years teaching philosophy up to very senior levels. Even now, my closest university colleagues and some of my clients are distinguished academic philosophers. (That background might help you understand where I stand. I rarely mention my real-world activities; but you were candid about your dissipated Saturday night, so I felt like being candid in return.)

Have you learned yet about the veil of ignorance, a rather obvious but extremely useful device elaborated by John Rawls (great theorist of the nature of justice)? From the article:

"It is a method of determining the morality of a certain issue (e.g., slavery) based upon the following thought experiment: parties to the original position know nothing about their particular abilities, tastes, and position within the social order of society. The veil of ignorance blocks off this knowledge, such that one does not know what burdens and benefits of social cooperation might fall to him/her once the veil is lifted. With this knowledge blocked, parties to the original position must decide on principles for the distribution of rights, positions and resources in their society. As Rawls put it, '... no one knows his place in society, his class position or social status; nor does he know his fortune in the distribution of natural assets and abilities, his intelligence and strength, and the like'. The idea then, is to render moot those personal considerations that are morally irrelevant to the justice or injustice of principles meant to allocate the benefits of social cooperation."

Powerful idea, right? And so relevant, in so many situations. For example, imagine yourself not knowing which persons filled these roles (and I modify the technique a little, away from the prescription in the article):

"Person 1: an acknowledged expert on style and a professional editor in real life, donating time and expertise to assist the consensual development of the major style resource to be found on the web: Wikipedia's manual of style Person 2: an old hand on Wikipedia, an admin, miffed to find that a cherished but vague principle that she had inserted in MOS years ago had been replaced, and determined to get it restored even though it had been superseded, and ready to use quick and dirty methods that flout established due process Person 3: a young college student, an admin, who is subtly manipulated into ill-considered treatment of person 1 by person 2, against all due process and without proper notification of discussion, when person 1 had stated that he was distracted by urgent matters in real life (not involving getting drunk, to be clear)"

Trying to put yourself in the place of each person is a fascinating and instructive exercise. I have tried it; I commend it to you also, even if you are now beginning your vacation. The moral lessons we can learn from philosophy do not end when school is out.

Sorry to say it, but I am glad you did not get elected to ArbCom. You are nowhere near ready. Not yet! As it happens, the makeup of the Committee has been much improved by the outcome. It could easily not have been. Some of us are breathing a sigh of relief.

Happy vacation. I will watch your admin actions with great interest from now on. One request: recuse yourself from any action concerning me, ever, in any capacity. Fair enough?

♥

N oetica Tea? 11:40, 19 December 2012 (UTC)


 * I read Rawls's veil in my introduction to philosophy class but I never thought much of it. I went through the thought experiment you outlined and it was interesting. I then went back and looked at the emails that two individuals sent me. Putting myself in each place I see why my actions were not optimal. I will honor your wishes and consider myself involved in all future matters. -- Guerillero &#124;  My Talk  06:08, 3 January 2013 (UTC)


 * A well-considered and fair response Guerillero, and I thank you for it. I have now formed a higher estimation of you.
 * All best wishes,
 * N oetica Tea? 06:40, 3 January 2013 (UTC)

Merry Christmas!


TheGeneralUser (talk)  is wishing you a Merry Christmas! This greeting (and season) promotes WikiLove and hopefully this note has made your day a little better. Spread the WikiLove by wishing another user a Merry Christmas, whether it be someone you have had disagreements with in the past, a good friend, or just some random person. Happy New Year!

Spread the cheer by adding {{subst:Xmas2}} to their talk page with a friendly message. Hello Guerillero! Wishing you a very Happy Merry Christmas :) TheGeneralUser (talk)  00:00, 26 December 2012 (UTC)
 * I hope you had a good one -- Guerillero &#124;  My Talk  06:15, 3 January 2013 (UTC)

Merry Christmas


cyber power is wishing you a Merry Christmas! This greeting (and season) promotes WikiLove and hopefully this note has made your day a little better. Spread the WikiLove by wishing another user a Merry Christmas, whether it be someone you have had disagreements with in the past, a good friend, or just some random person. Happy New Year!

Spread the cheer by adding {{subst:Xmas2}} to their talk page with a friendly message. As one of my wikifriends, I would like to wish you a Merry Christmas. I hope you had a great one.— cyber power Online Merry Christmas 01:44, 26 December 2012 (UTC)
 * I hope yours was great cyberpower -- Guerillero &#124;  My Talk  06:16, 3 January 2013 (UTC)

Happy New Year, Guerillero
 Freikorp (talk) — is wishing you a  Happy New Year ! Welcome the  2024 . This greeting (and season) promotes WikiLove and hopefully this note has made your day a little better. Spread the WikiLove by wishing another user a Happy New Year, whether it be someone you have had disagreements with in the past, a good friend, or just some random person. Happy New Year! May the 2024 goes well for you.

Spread the New Year cheer by adding to their talk page with a Happy New Year message.


 * I have not seen you in ages Freikorp. I hope your 2012 was great and your 2013 will be better. -- Guerillero &#124;  My Talk  06:17, 3 January 2013 (UTC)

blocked since 2011
Hello. I have been blocked since Dec 2011. I have contributed 18,000 edits in three years to auto articles. I will abide all policies and rules on Wikipedia in the future. thanks. Barnstarbob. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.191.188.68 (talk) 00:53, 2 January 2013 (UTC)
 * Due to the socking issues, I suggest you contact the Ban appeals section of arbcom or post a unblock template on barnstarbob's talk page with the account of the same name -- Guerillero &#124;  My Talk  06:19, 3 January 2013 (UTC)

My recent editing of Pixmania that you have undone.
Dear Guerillero,

My recent un-constructive editing of the Pixmania wiki page ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pixmania ) was a deliberate attempt to get that company to stop pitching themselves as the most wonderous e-commerce site ever. My sisters family's Christmas was ruined and her little girl, who is of an age that she will not believe in Santa Claus after this Christmas was left in tears on Christmas morning as Pixmania, despite their assurances and promises, did not deliver the goods my sister ordered. And now, on January 3rd THEY STILL HAVEN'T shown up.

I accept that my editing was wilfully unhelpful and was a deliberate attempt to sully their online description of their capabilities, however it was to be for a few days only and I would've undone the edits myself in a couple days.

It's ironic when the small guy like myself goes to take on a giant corporation...who paint themselves as glowingly wonderful when there's more than ample evidence to the contrary...in defense of a little girl who's Christmas has been ruined, YOU, the great Wikipedia, goes to the defense of the corporate giant.

Irony - I'd look it up in Wikipedia but god knows what it would actually mean.

David Wilkins Ireland. Dpwilkins (talk) 12:21, 3 January 2013 (UTC)
 * Wikipedia is not the place to conduct activism. We only tell the information that can be backed up by reliable sources. The best way to receive the recourse you would like is to contact the company, media, or your nation's form of the Better Business Bureau. -- Guerillero &#124;  My Talk  19:40, 3 January 2013 (UTC)

Wikidata weekly summary #39
Here's your quick overview of what has been happening around Wikidata over the last week. Read the full report &middot; Unsubscribe &middot; Global message delivery 21:37, 4 January 2013 (UTC)
 * Development
 * Updates for selenium testenvironments (browsers, ruby, selenium-tools)
 * Extended tests for statements user interface
 * Refactored snakview user interface to handle other property-snak types than PropertyValueSnak
 * Layout improvements in the user interface
 * Several minor bugfixes in the user interface
 * Updated Vagrant for Wikidata
 * More work on AbuseFilter
 * Deployed new version of Wikibase and MediaWiki core to wikidata.org and test2.wikipedia (bugfixes - all Wikibase changes here)
 * Fix for bug 43595 which was seen on Wednesday during attempted deployment of the wmf7 version of MediaWiki core. Thanks Marius!
 * Discussions/Press
 * Created prototypes for parsing coordinates and time in Wikidata that need feedback
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 * We’ve reached item ID 2.000.000
 * You can now enable the SitelinkCheck gadget in your preferences that makes it easier to check if a certain link is already in use in an existing item
 * Open Tasks for You
 * Give feedback on prototypes for parsing time and coordinates
 * Help translate the client extension (especially to Hungarian in light of the upcoming deployment)
 * Hack on one of these

Confirmation
Hi I'm a member of Student Robotics and wish to edit it's page Cannot upload images currently (Foremost our logo)

Thank you.

Andy — Preceding unsigned comment added by UltimationEE (talk • contribs) 19:09, 5 January 2013 (UTC)

TeeTylerToe
You mentioned that TeeTylerToe approached you on IRC to unarchive the ANI thread. Was it after I posted this comment? I made the comment immediately after we finished talking. I'm a little concerned that he's forum shopping for opinions he likes on IRC, because I told him exactly what to do to get unblocked but I could tell from the way he was responding to me that he didn't like what I was saying, then he left the channel abruptly. --(ʞɿɐʇ) ɐuɐʞsǝp 13:05, 6 January 2013 (UTC)
 * Come to think of it, it was after you posted that message. He asked in general if there was an admin around in #wikipedia-en, I replied that I would be willing to deal with an issue, and then PMed me his request about his unblock -- Guerillero &#124;  My Talk  21:32, 6 January 2013 (UTC)

Disambiguation link notification for January 7
Hi. Thank you for your recent edits. Wikipedia appreciates your help. We noticed though that when you edited Toil, you added a link pointing to the disambiguation page Black Thorn (check to confirm | fix with Dab solver). Such links are almost always unintended, since a disambiguation page is merely a list of "Did you mean..." article titles. Read the FAQ* Join us at the DPL WikiProject.

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Newsletter
Do you think we could/should publish the second issue? Also, happy new year! benzband ( talk ) 16:44, 2 January 2013 (UTC)
 * I will make a few minor fixes. After that, I would be willing to push it out for you at any time this month -- Guerillero &#124;  My Talk  06:20, 3 January 2013 (UTC)
 * Ok whenever you're ready will be grand. Thanks :) benzband  ( talk ) 16:55, 3 January 2013 (UTC)

PS. You have new messages at my talkpage. benzband ( talk ) 16:53, 7 January 2013 (UTC)

Junkyard69
Thanks a lot for your message on my talk page. I have answered there. JamesBWatson (talk) 21:00, 7 January 2013 (UTC)

Welcome to the 2013 WikiCup!
Hello, Guerillero, and welcome to the 2013 WikiCup! Your submissions' page is here. The competition begins at midnight UTC. The first round will last until the end of February, at which point the top 64 scorers will advance to the second round. We will be in touch at the end of every month, and signups are going to remain open until the end of January; if you know of anyone else who may like to take part, please let them know! A few reminders:
 * The rules can be found here. There have been a few changes from last year, which are listed on that page.
 * Anything you submit must have been nominated and promoted in 2013, and you need to have completed significant work upon it in 2013. (The articles you review at good article reviews does not need to have been nominated in 2013, but you do need to have started the review in 2013.) We will be checking.
 * If you feel that another competitor is breaking the rules or abusing the competition in some way, please let a judge know. Please do not remove entries from the submissions' pages of others yourself.
 * Don't worry about calculating precisely how many points everything is worth. The bot will do that. The bot may occasionally get something wrong- let a judge know, or post on the WikiCup talk page if that happens.
 * Please try to be prompt in updating submissions' pages so that they can be double-checked.

Overall, however, don't worry, and have fun. It doesn't matter if you make the odd mistake; these things happen. Questions can be asked on the WikiCup talk page. Good luck! J Milburn and The ed17 23:20, 7 January 2013 (UTC)

The Underground: Issue 2 (January 2013)


Delivered by In actu (Guerillero) on behalf of WikiProject Punk. You are receiving this because your user name is listed in Category:WikiProject Punk music members or on our participants list. If you would like to stop these sorts of updates please remove the userbox from your profile, remove the category from your profile, and/or move your name down to the Inactive/former members section of the participants list. Thanks.

Cheers,

benzband ( talk ) &  Guerillero  &#124;  My Talk  22:08, 8 January 2013 (UTC)

The Signpost: 07 January 2013

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 * EdwardsBot (talk) 11:56, 9 January 2013 (UTC)

My statement
Is my statement at RFAR too long? I checked and the original statement is 499 words (coincidentally, I wasn't aware of the limit), but I added two clarifications and I don't know how those count into it. Ryan Vesey 21:33, 9 January 2013 (UTC)
 * I don't think so. Your original statement is under 500 words and your clarifications are short and to the point. While the policies don't talk about replies or clarifications, the existing prescient allows for them if they are short. -- Guerillero &#124;  My Talk  21:52, 9 January 2013 (UTC)
 * Okay, thanks. By the way, is there a page somewhere that explains how the actual case works? Ryan Vesey 21:54, 9 January 2013 (UTC)
 * The guide to arbitration should have all the information, and more, that you are looking for. If something is unclear or isn't included, just ask any clerk -- Guerillero &#124;  My Talk  22:01, 9 January 2013 (UTC)
 * Another interesting guide to the process is SBHB's pocket guide to Arbitration. While I have found that his observation about arbs not reading the workshop and evidence pages to be incorrect as well as a few other points, he is correct that you must be succinct, on task, and highly civil when participating in a case. Walls of text, attitude issues and personal attacks during the proceedings do not normally bode well for a participant. -- Guerillero &#124;  My Talk  22:19, 9 January 2013 (UTC)
 * Thank you much, I'll be sure to check through them. Ryan Vesey 22:48, 9 January 2013 (UTC)

Lock on BSA article
Although I am ambivalent about the change that 1 or 2 people are trying to war in, I am not about the lock. To "out of the blue" fully lock such a large diverse article on such a large & diverse topic, with no discussion of such, and with an expiration of 11 days over such a small and narrow dispute is, IMHO, overreaction. Triply so with the disputed change included in the locked version. Sincerely, North8000 (talk) 02:25, 10 January 2013 (UTC)
 * Leaving edit summaries such as "take it to the talk page" while edit warring only makes things worse. It shows that people know that they should be discussing but instead keep on EWing. A discussion was opened but both "sides" seemed to want to continue reverting instead of discussing. The article is full protected to force people to discuss or go through DR. If an agreement can be made before the 10 day release date, I will remove the protection. -- Guerillero &#124;  My Talk  02:34, 10 January 2013 (UTC)
 * I was not defending any particular behavior in my post, just saying that it was all small potatoes in proportion to to overall article. Also, there were no more reverts or even edits to the article once the discussion was started.   Sincerely, North8000 (talk) 02:41, 10 January 2013 (UTC)

This Month in GLAM: December 2012
Unsubscribe · Global message delivery 11:42, 10 January 2013 (UTC)

Your block of M-40
appears very harsh, if it is all based on his one revert to the Boy Scouts page. As ordinary users we do voluntarily work here - M-40 has done so since 2008 - and should be allowed to make a mistake now and then without harsh sanctions. That´s about showing respect for the users who contribute here for free. I did something similar to M-40 yesterday, when I made one revert to the article about Austrians where an edit war was going on as well. As I understand blocking is not supposed to be punitive, but should only be used when it is absolutely necessary to avoid harm to Wikipedia. Could you explain to me why you felt assure that going in dialogue with M-40 would not be enough to stop him from unconstructive edits (of which he appears to have had just one)? (I avoid using the full username, so this discussions won´t turn up in a search for his name). With regards, Iselilja (talk) 10:01, 10 January 2013 (UTC)


 * You have an edit(IP), revert (B), reinstate (IP), rollback, reinstate (AA), revert (M), reinstate (AA), Revert (B), reinstate (AA).


 * Nine edits in all that are adding or removing the same content. As an outsider to this dispute I saw an IP making a change, a named user standing up for that change, and a pair of editors working together to keep the old version of the page in place, see this report. I merged the two editors edits together and got three. Marauder40 had a clean block log and got only a 24 hour block, Belchfire who is a chronic edit warrior got another week block and AmherstApple who has a clean block log got 24 hours. -- Guerillero &#124;  My Talk  19:03, 10 January 2013 (UTC)


 * Why were the blocked editors not given a warning first, especially the editors with clean block logs? --108.45.72.196 (talk) 19:30, 10 January 2013 (UTC)


 * A block for someone with a clean block log is a big hit/decision. North8000 (talk) 19:47, 10 January 2013 (UTC)
 * The IP adding the information is clearly the same user as AmherstApple. Horrible blocks all around since no warning was given to Belchfire or M40 and AA didn't change anything after being warned.
 * Why wasn't the IP blocked? Why block if you're going to lock the page? --Onorem♠Dil 22:14, 10 January 2013 (UTC)
 * I am not sure how clearly the IP and AA were the same person. I have seen a similar pattern of edits in other places where an IP was reverted and a named user steps in. My block of Marauder40 was poor but I disagree that there two others were. Three reverts is not an entitlement and Belchfire, most of all should know the edit warring rules. Locking the page forces conversation and it pops up on watchlists as an independent item that dose not get overwritten like an edit summary. In most cases, it brings in new editors then the disputants and makes some sort of rough agreement happen on the talk page that is good for the article. -- Guerillero &#124;  My Talk  23:07, 10 January 2013 (UTC)
 * Given that M-40 is "highly considering permanent retirement from this site", do you really think your block can be adequately categorized as simply "poor"? Try ill-considered and demoralizing, and one might be getting somewhere. You should be apologizing to M-40 for your block. Gimmetoo (talk) 23:18, 10 January 2013 (UTC)
 * I'm not going to file a SPI...but given the IP added the info twice, was reverted twice, and then the AA account just happened to be created shortly after and continued to war over it minutes after creation, I'm not going to lose any sleep over my not AGFing about the situation...but whatever. In any case, since you also locked the page, your blocks all appear punitive. I understand entirely that 3 reverts aren't an entitlement, but I still think it was a horrible block...but whatever. Have a good weekend. --Onorem♠Dil 00:51, 11 January 2013 (UTC)
 * From what I've seen, some editors take having a clean block log very seriously. What Wikipedia needs is a procedure for expunging an editor's block log of blocks made in error or blocks just plain unjustified.  Don't the U.S. court systems have methods of expunging the record of someone who has been exonerated?  Why can't Wikipedia develop something similar?  Yes, it would probably require the blocking admin to admit making "an error", but is that unreasonable?  A bad block in one's block log should not just sit there forever as a permanent badge of shame.  --108.45.72.196 (talk) 02:23, 11 January 2013 (UTC)

ArbCom procedural question
I am involved in a proposed ArbCom case, and wish to ask one of the named parties in that case to refactor a comment they made about me outside arbitration. Am I allowed to post to their talk page, or is there somewhere else I should post the request? Thundersnow 13:53, 10 January 2013 (UTC)


 * Never mind, found the clerks board. Thundersnow  19:32, 10 January 2013 (UTC)

.Marauder40
You have blocked this editor (admittedly only for 24 hours) for edit warring. I do not see it. One reversion on one page and two on a different, albeit related, page do not seem to me to qualify as a blockable offence. Would you care to take another look?--Anthony Bradbury</b><sup style="color:black;">"talk" 15:58, 10 January 2013 (UTC)
 * Agree with Anthony Bradbury. And even those reverts were to the longstanding version. North8000 (talk) 16:15, 10 January 2013 (UTC)
 * It looked like tag teaming at the time. Looking again, I will give User:Marauder40 the benefit of the doubt. -- Guerillero &#124;  My Talk  17:43, 10 January 2013 (UTC)
 * As AmherstApple has been tagged as a sock of a defacto banned editor and indeffed. You may want to reconsider your other administrative actions in this case in light of that. Monty  <sub style="color:#A3BFBF;">845  17:52, 10 January 2013 (UTC)

Wikidata weekly summary #40
<div style="margin-top:10px; padding-left:5px; font-family:Georgia, Palatino, Palatino Linotype, Times, Times New Roman, serif;">Here's your quick overview of what has been happening around Wikidata over the last week. <div style="margin-top:10px; font-size:90%; padding-left:5px; font-family:Georgia, Palatino, Palatino Linotype, Times, Times New Roman, serif;">Read the full report &middot; Unsubscribe &middot; Global message delivery 16:22, 11 January 2013 (UTC)
 * Development
 * Bene* developed a new tool to show existing or missing items for a given Wikipedia category
 * Selenium test-groups for (non)experimental features (43828)
 * Notification for IP edits that IP will be logged (42954)
 * Verified fix & added Selenium tests for broken error-reporting on label/description uniqueness constraint (43301)
 * Label-edit-button links to Special:SetLabel when JavaScript disabled (43814)
 * Updated PHP, MySQL, Ruby, Selenium, etc.. on internal test server and enabled APC + memcached
 * Work on AbuseFilter to make it work with Wikidata content (42064)
 * Implemented length constraint for labels, descriptions and aliases (configurable with a default of 2500 UTF8 characters)
 * Implementing a new mechanism for dispatching change notifications to client wikis
 * Worked more on how Wikidata changes are handled in the client watchlist (43124)
 * Some work went into using Solr for the search. Still very simple
 * Prepared improvements to our puppet files on labs
 * Worked on statements UI (snaktypes/references)
 * Fixed bugs in UI event handling of widgets
 * Put EntityId parsing code into a dedicated class
 * Finished EntityDiff cleanup
 * Discussions/Press
 * Reworked inclusion syntax completely 1 2
 * Updates to time and space model
 * Is there a need for bureaucrats?
 * Planned improvement to the search field
 * Other Noteworthy Stuff
 * Deployment on the Hungarian Wikipedia is still planned for Monday (Jan 14th)
 * Jens writes a bit about Wikidata’s mascots
 * Open Tasks for You
 * Give feedback on inclusion syntax draft version 3, the updated time and space model and the plans for improving the search field
 * Hack on one of these

Update on block at BSA article
So, as this has played out (going by wp:duck on the IP) One "side" of the dispute is/was one blocked user working through socks inserting the same thing 5 times, the other "side" was three folks reverting that edit to the last stable version. And with the socks gone, (including the sock account indeffed) now everybody else is having a routine editing discussion while the version put in by the now-blocked sock is sitting locked in the article. I don't see any dispute in progress. North8000 (talk) 19:00, 11 January 2013 (UTC)
 * ✅ -- Guerillero &#124;  My Talk  21:16, 11 January 2013 (UTC)

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BelchFire
Your block of BelchFire is unjustified. Did you even review the situation? You have one editor clearly violating WP:CRYSTAL and you end up blocking several other editors as well for trying to uphold WP guidelines? What kind of message is that sending to editors in general? You have abused your power. Arzel (talk) 18:18, 11 January 2013 (UTC)
 * Reviewing his edits, I still feel that the block is justified. The only policies that make edits exempt to the edit warring guidelines are the copyright and BLP guidelines. Keeping the old version around is not an exemption. He has two reverts on the Boy Scouts of America as part of a larger(/) and various issues on Sexuality in Star Trek (//), (/). While he cites copyvio concerns in the final two diffs, the block quotes are not long enough to cause issues. Blocks are made to "deter the continuation of present, disruptive behavior." You can not edit war into a discussion. -- Guerillero &#124;  My Talk  21:45, 11 January 2013 (UTC)
 * Please review WP:NOT3RR - reverts of sockpuppets i.e. are exempt. NE Ent 23:00, 11 January 2013 (UTC)
 * ... sockpuppets of banned or indefinitely blocked users, when they are tagged as such. This distinction isn't an accident, it's to prevent editors using "X was clearly a sock of Y" as an excuse to continue reverting against consensus.  &mdash; Coren (talk) 00:21, 12 January 2013 (UTC)
 * ? emphasized phrase does not appear in the linked paragraph. NE Ent 00:52, 12 January 2013 (UTC)
 * "3. Reverting actions performed by banned users, their sockpuppets and by tagged sockpuppets of indefinitely blocked accounts." [emph. mine] Still there.  &mdash; Coren (talk) 01:56, 12 January 2013 (UTC)
 * The sock exemption to the edit warring guideline only work for after a sock is tagged not before. -- Guerillero &#124;  My Talk  00:54, 12 January 2013 (UTC)
 * Sorry, but that is one of the most asinine explanations I have ever heard. You are basically saying since he was blocked before the Sock was confirmed the prior action cannont be reviewed.  This is the kind of logical response for which Admins are not needed.  Admin action, like what you have taken here, could just as easily be done by a BOT because you have not taken into account any additional information.  Additionally, he did not violate 3RR on the BSoA article.  Furthermore, what do the other articles have to do with this article?  Frankly, it appears you are trying to after-the-fact validate your block rather than just admit you made a mistake. Arzel (talk) 14:31, 13 January 2013 (UTC)
 * The block was for edit warring not for the three revert rule. The edit warring guideline states: The three-revert rule is a convenient limit for occasions when an edit war is happening fairly quickly, but it is not a definition of what "edit warring" means, and it is perfectly possible to edit war without breaking the three-revert rule, or even coming close to doing so. and the notice at the top of ANEW states Edit warring is a behavior, typically exemplified by the use of confrontational edits to win a content dispute. It is different than a bold, revert, discuss (BRD) cycle. [...] content disputes, even egregious point of view edits and other good-faith changes do not constitute vandalism. I have discussed this as length and I feel that I have justified my decision to the extent that community mores state that I should. I have relooked over the relevant page histories and diffs many time and I have come to the same conclusion; I am not reversing my decision. If you would like to discuss this further you can ask the active administrators or appeal my block to arbcom via email. -- Guerillero &#124;  My Talk  20:20, 13 January 2013 (UTC)
 * " The only policies that make edits exempt to the edit warring guidelines are the copyright and BLP guidelines" NE Ent 00:56, 12 January 2013 (UTC)
 * Which guideline is that which applies to the 2 reverts? The invisible 1RR guideline on an article that is not 1RR? Or is being one of three editors that reverted the same edit done 5 times by the socks to the stable form "tag teaming"? This is admittedly using after-the-fact info, so the situation was less clear at the time. Back then it was just "greater caution should have been applied".   North8000 (talk) 15:30, 13 January 2013 (UTC)
 * The stable version of an article is not given any extra protections by the edit waring guidelines and the block was for edit warring not for the three revert rule. The edit warring guideline states: The three-revert rule is a convenient limit for occasions when an edit war is happening fairly quickly, but it is not a definition of what "edit warring" means, and it is perfectly possible to edit war without breaking the three-revert rule, or even coming close to doing so. and the notice at the top of ANEW states Edit warring is a behavior, typically exemplified by the use of confrontational edits to win a content dispute. It is different than a bold, revert, discuss (BRD) cycle. [...] content disputes, even egregious point of view edits and other good-faith changes do not constitute vandalism. There were two active ANEW reports at the time of my block and I saw the other report at the time of my block. I feel that I have justified my actions to community standards. If you would like to dispute my block further, you can ask the active administrators or appeal my block to arbcom via email. -- Guerillero  &#124;  My Talk  20:20, 13 January 2013 (UTC)
 * I was actually much more upset about what (unwarranted) happened to Marauder40 in that same batch, plus this points out the randomness (arising from vagueness) of the policy/guideline, which is a bad thing. North8000 (talk) 12:06, 14 January 2013 (UTC)

Wikipedia Ambassadors update
Hi! You're getting this message because you are or have been a Wikipedia Ambassador. A new term is beginning for the United States and Canada Education Programs, and I wanted to give you an update on some important new information if you're interested in continuing your work this term as a Wikipedia Ambassador.

You may have heard a reference to a transition the education program is going through. This is the last term that the Wikimedia Foundation will directly run the U.S. and Canada programs; beginning in June, a proposed thematic organization is likely to take over organizing the program. You can read more about the proposal here.

Another major change in the program will take effect immediately. Beginning this term, a new MediaWiki education extension will replace all course pages and Ambassador lists. (See Course pages and Help:Education Program extension for more details.) Included in the extension are online volunteer and campus volunteer user rights, which let you create and edit course pages and sign up as an ambassador for a particular course.

If you would like to continue serving as a Wikipedia Ambassador — even if you do not support a class this term — you must create an ambassador profile. If you're no longer interested in being a Wikipedia Ambassador, you don't need to do anything.

First, you need the relevant user rights for Online and/or Campus Ambassadors. (If you are an admin, you can grant the rights yourself, for you as well as other ambassadors.) Just post your rights request here, and we'll get you set up as quickly as possible.
 * Please do these steps as soon as possible

Once you've got the ambassador rights, please set up at a Campus and/or Online Ambassador profile. You can do so at:
 * Special:CampusAmbassadorProfile
 * Special:OnlineAmbassadorProfile

Going forward, the lists of Ambassadors at Special:CampusAmbassadors and Special:OnlineAmbassadors will be the official roster of who is an active Ambassador. If you would like to be an Ambassador but not ready to serve this term, you can un-check the option in your profile to publicly list it (which will remove your profile from the list).

After that, you can sign on to support courses. The list of courses will be at Special:Courses. (By default, this lists "Current" courses, but you can change the Status filter to "Planned" to see courses for this term that haven't reached their listed start date yet.)

As this is the first term we have used the extension, we know there will be some bugs, and we know the feature set is not as rich as it could be. (A big wave of improvements is already in the pipeline. And if you know MediaWiki and could help with code review, we'd love to have your help!) Please reach out to me (Sage Ross) with any complaints, bug reports, and feature suggestions. The basic features of the extension are documented at Course pages, and you can see a tutorial for setting up and using them here.

In the past, the Education Program has had a pretty fragmented set of communication channels. We're trying to fix that. These are the recommended places to discuss and stay up-to-date on the education program:
 * Communication and keeping up to date
 * 1) The education noticeboard has become the main on-wiki location for discussion of the Education Program. You can post there about broad education program issues as well as issues with individual courses.
 * 2) The Ambassadors Announce email list is a very low-traffic announcements list of important information all Ambassadors need to be aware of. We encourage all Ambassadors (and other interested Wikipedians) to subscribe to the list; follow the instructions on the link to add your email address.
 * 3) If you use IRC regularly, or need to try to reach someone immediately, the  IRC channel is the place to find me and fellow Ambassadors.

We now have an online training for Ambassadors, which is intended to be both an orientation about the Wikipedia Ambassador role for newcomers and the manual for how to do the role. (There are parallel trainings for students and for educators as well.)
 * Ambassador training and resources

Please go through the training if you feel like you need a refresher on how a typical class is supposed to go and where the Ambassadors fit in, or if you want to review and help improve it. If there's something you'd like to see added, or other suggestions you have for it, feel free to edit the training and/or leave feedback. A primer on setting up and using course pages is included in the educators' training.

The Resources page of the training is the main place for Ambassador-related resources. If there's something you think is important as a resource that's not on there, please add it.

Finally, whether or not you work with any classes this term, I encourage you to post entries to the Trophy Case whenever you see excellent work from students or if you have great examples from past semesters. And, as always, let students (and other editors!) know when they do things well; a little WikiLove goes a long way!

--Sage Ross (WMF) (talk) 20:42, 14 January 2013 (UTC)

Java
How do you put up with it? It's complete nonsense.--v/r - TP 14:35, 15 January 2013 (UTC)

This Month in Education: January 2013
<div style="margin-top:10px; font-size:90%; padding-left:5px; font-family:Georgia, Palatino, Palatino Linotype, Times, Times New Roman, serif;"> If this message is not on your home wiki's talk page, update your subscription &middot; Distributed via Global message delivery, 21:15, 15 January 2013 (UTC)

Margaret McKenna DYK
Hi Guerillero. Your attention is requested at Template:Did you know nominations/Margaret McKenna. Thank you for starting her article by the way. <font face="DejaVu Sans" color="333300">Gobōnobō + c 00:25, 16 January 2013 (UTC)
 * Thanks for the quick follow up. I had another question on one of the alts, but the other looked great. Let me know if you revise the first one. Cheers, <font face="DejaVu Sans" color="333300">Gobōnobō + c 04:52, 16 January 2013 (UTC)

That 1RR template: expired now
Hi Guerillero. Time to remove Template:Editnotices/Page/Wikipedia_talk:Manual_of_Style, yes? It has expired. I have already adjusted the notice at the top of the talkpage itself.

N oetica Tea? 03:16, 16 January 2013 (UTC)
 * It has been removed -- Guerillero &#124;  My Talk  03:26, 16 January 2013 (UTC)

The Signpost: 14 January 2013
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Hello
Hello,

I see that you commented on the page User talk:TheOriginalSoni/Rolling Ball. Might I ask if you would be interested to join the project, and to leave your feedback on how we can better it? TheOriginalSoni (talk) 09:04, 18 January 2013 (UTC)

Wikidata weekly summary #41
<div style="margin-top:10px; padding-left:5px; font-family:Georgia, Palatino, Palatino Linotype, Times, Times New Roman, serif;">Here's your quick overview of what has been happening around Wikidata over the last week. <div style="margin-top:10px; font-size:90%; padding-left:5px; font-family:Georgia, Palatino, Palatino Linotype, Times, Times New Roman, serif;">Read the full report &middot; Unsubscribe &middot; Global message delivery 15:52, 18 January 2013 (UTC)
 * Development
 * We are live on the Hungarian Wikipedia \o/
 * We have an intern for a week, Marius aka User:Hoo man. He’ll be working on the wizard for linking a new Wikipedia article to an existing item or creating a new item for it if none exists yet. (the first two stories here)
 * Refactored sites code to improve design
 * Changed item datatype to use entityid as datavalue rather than string
 * Added lots of new Selenium tests
 * Changed AbuseFilter so Wikibase can hook into it
 * Implemented new change dispatcher script
 * ~=[,,_,,]:3
 * Working on combining successive changes to avoid watchlist clutter
 * Claims error handling (i.e. they now show error messages when needed)
 * Implemented initial version of Solr-based search for Wikidata in extension WikibaseSolr
 * Started investigating use of Lua/Scribunto for the Wikibase client
 * Updated the Wikidata Vagrant development machine
 * Improved the setup via puppet on Labs
 * Discussions/Press
 * Latest updates on time and coordinate datatypes
 * Schedule for the reconfirmation of the first round of admins
 * RFC on en:wp about the transition to language links from Wikidata
 * Signpost, among others, covers the deployment on the Hungarian Wikipedia
 * Other Noteworthy Stuff
 * Congrats to our sister Wikivoyage on their official launch
 * There’s now a manual for using the Pywikipediabot on Wikidata
 * Deployed new code on wikidata.org
 * Community Portal got a rework
 * Tried to drop www from Wikidata URLs but that was more difficult than expected. Sorry for the issues it caused. We're working on resolving the remaining ones.
 * Open Tasks for You
 * d:Wikidata:Press coverage needs some love and attention
 * Hack on one of these

DYK for Toil
— Crisco 1492 (talk) 16:03, 18 January 2013 (UTC)

Rolling Ball
Hello, The page is up and running. We also have a Rolling Ball/Hang Out Zone for everyone to discuss whatever they want. You are also requested to watchlist/keep and eye on the Hangout page so you can keep track of whatever everyone's talking about. Cheers, TheOriginalSoni (talk) 13:01, 19 January 2013 (UTC)

Edit warring diffs
You have Charles M. Robinson in there twice; what was the second one supposed to be? -- SarekOfVulcan (talk) 03:58, 20 January 2013 (UTC)
 * I will fix that. and  were what I was trying to get at -- Guerillero  &#124;  My Talk  04:21, 20 January 2013 (UTC)

Quick question on your Arbcom principles stuff...
Particularly the "using affiliations as as an ad hominem" piece - that item does not seem to come from NPA directly, and you have it tagged as adapted from another ArbCom case. So what is the status of that principle in relation to the community at large? Is it enforceable as part of general policy, or is it only in ArbCom's sphere? MSJapan (talk) 17:10, 20 January 2013 (UTC)
 * After watching my fair share of cases, principles give the essence of policy and are not direct quotes from policy pages. -- Guerillero &#124;  My Talk  23:41, 20 January 2013 (UTC)

DYK for Margaret McKenna
Graeme Bartlett (talk) 00:33, 21 January 2013 (UTC)

WP:NPOV
Guerillero, on 1/19/2013 on my WP:NPOV Administrator's noticeboard discussion you posted: "I agree that a block is needed here. I suggest that it be an indef one. I see lots of POV pushing here."  The WP Administrator's noticeboard indicates: "Before posting a grievance about a user here, please discuss the issue with them on their user talk page." WP:CONS indicates: "This page documents an English Wikipedia "policy."  Therefore, WP is clear & unambiguous re WP:CONS being a "policy."  WP:NPOV indicates:  "The principles upon which this policy is based cannot be superseded by other "policies" or guidelines, or "by editors' consensus." Therefore, WP is clear & unambiguous that WP:NPOV is "not" "coequal" with WP:CONS, but "supreme" to it, & that WP:NPOV "cannot" be superseded  "by editors' consensus." . Yet volunteer & Admin editors are attempting to do just that. There would be no reason for WP:NPOV to state "by editors' consensus" if this "policy" did "not" supersede WP:CONS. Therefore, please advise if you disagree with WP:NPOV since you arbitrarily blocked my editor grievance. Otherwise, I will post my grievance re you enabling editors refusing to comply with WP:NPOV: "Editing from a neutral point of view (NPOV) means representing fairly, proportionately, and as far as possible without bias, all significant views that have been published by reliable sources," on the Administrator's noticeboard. Thank you very much. Didymus Judas Thomas (talk) 23:07, 20 January 2013 (UTC)Didymus Judas Thomas 1/20/2013
 * You can't wikilawyer your way out of this. For example: The WP Administrator's noticeboard indicates: "Before posting a grievance about a user here, please discuss the issue with them on their user talk page." That applies to the person bringing objections not the people replying to threads. Therefore, please advise if you disagree with WP:NPOV since you arbitrarily blocked my editor grievance. Otherwise, I will post my grievance re you enabling editors refusing to comply with WP:NPOV. I suggest you read my favorite summary of NPOV.

The problem with your analogy is that on a sports team the two ides are equal, in that both take the field with the same opportunities to advance, score, and win. Here, the two sides are not equal. We have a word that is widely used to describe a particular prejudicial belief, and we have a tiny handful of people off to one side who don't like it. WP:NPOV doesn't mean "everyone gets a seat at the table", it means "everyone of significance gets a seat at the table". If you're so fond of analogies...we're at the main Thanksgiving table in the dining room, while you're at the kids' fold-out table next to the kitchen.
 * You can post to your heart's desire but that doesn't change that you hold a minority opinion and are trying to make it seem equal to the majority opinion. -- Guerillero &#124;  My Talk  23:33, 20 January 2013 (UTC)


 * I thought I was on Guerillero's user page, not Tarc's page. But anyhow, you can't WP:LAW your way out of this by getting on a WP:SOAP soapbox.  WP:DR indicates:  "This policy describes what to do when you have a dispute with another editor. "  Guerillero's user page indicates:  "My editing style..."  "I change what I am focusing on editing..."    Therefore, it looks like Guerillero is an administrator/editor,  & I have a dispute with him as an editor.  WP:DR indicates:  "This page is for posting information and issues that affect administrators."  "Assistance in resolving disputes → dispute resolution."  WP:ANI indicates:  "This page is for reporting and discussing incidents on the English Wikipedia that require the intervention of administrators and experienced editors."  "Before posting a grievance about a user here, please discuss the issue with them on their user talk page."  Guerillero is a "user".  Tarc, I do not see a cite for:  "That applies to the person bringing objections not the people replying to threads."  Your "favorite summary of NPOV" reminds me of the Thanksgiving turkey:    "Turkeys are highly vocal, and 'social tension' within the group can be monitored by the birds’ vocalisations."  Tarc, I do not see:  "...doesn't mean "everyone gets a seat at the table", it means "everyone of significance gets a seat at the table" on WP:NPOV.  Exactly where are those quotes from on WP?  Because I did a search on WP & did not find either one.  However, I do find:  "1 Explanation of the neutral point of view.  This page in a nutshell: Articles mustn't take sides, but should explain the sides, fairly and without bias. This applies to both what you say and how you say it."  "Editors, while naturally having their own points of view, should strive in good faith to provide complete information, and not to promote one particular point of view over another. As such, the neutral point of view does not mean exclusion of certain points of view, but including all notable and verifiable points of view."  Guerillero, please cite the support for your statement:  "[Y]ou hold a minority opinion and are trying to make it seem equal to the majority opinion."  Because I do not see anywhere where I have not been open to WP:DR "This page in a nutshell: Resolve disputes calmly, through civil discussion and consensus-building on relevant discussion pages."  If administrators are unwilling to comply with WP:NPOV, I will be happy to proceed to:  WP:DR. "There are several available options to request opinions from editors outside the dispute: other dispute resolution mechanisms include requests for comments, mediation or, after all other methods have been tried, arbitration."   Thank you very much. Didymus Judas Thomas (talk) 21:43, 21 January 2013 (UTC)Didymus Judas Thomas 1/21/2013

The Signpost: 21 January 2013
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Wikidata weekly summary #42
<div style="margin-top:10px; padding-left:5px; font-family:Georgia, Palatino, Palatino Linotype, Times, Times New Roman, serif;">Here's your quick overview of what has been happening around Wikidata over the last week. <div style="margin-top:10px; font-size:90%; padding-left:5px; font-family:Georgia, Palatino, Palatino Linotype, Times, Times New Roman, serif;">Read the full report &middot; Unsubscribe &middot; Global message delivery 14:53, 25 January 2013 (UTC)
 * Development
 * Updated demo system
 * Improved design of sites code in core
 * Fixed SQLite compatibility
 * Worked on implementing references handling in statements user interface
 * Useful error messages will be shown in statements user interface in case of data value mismatches
 * Switched the demo system to Labs’ puppet
 * Selenium tests for length constraint, claim edit-conflicts
 * Setting up dispatcher script on internal test machine
 * More work on wikibase.getEntities function for Scribunto/Lua-Templates
 * AbuseFilter is now working with Wikibase
 * The change dispatcher script is now ready for use on the WMF cluster
 * Initial implementation of parser function for the client
 * Created a widget for the client to connect a page to a Wikidata item and add interwiki language links to a page
 * Preparing a page to list unconnected pages on the clients
 * Discussions/Press
 * VIAF
 * Events
 * InfoLunch at Hasso-Plattner-Institut
 * Deutscher Sprachtechnologietag
 * upcoming: FOSDEM
 * upcoming: talk about MediaWiki groups
 * Other Noteworthy Stuff
 * Reconfirmation of temporary admins
 * Next deployment (Hebrew and Italian Wikipedia) still scheduled for 30th of January as planned
 * Planning for Wikimania in Hong Kong
 * Wikimedia data center move went rather smoothly
 * Request from the Bosnian Wikipedia community to be among the next to use Wikidata
 * Project about paid editing that might also become relevant for Wikidata at some point
 * Open Tasks for You
 * Hack on one of these

Email

 * Reading -- Guerillero &#124;  My Talk  19:47, 27 January 2013 (UTC)
 * Replied -- Guerillero &#124;  My Talk  20:01, 27 January 2013 (UTC)

Discussion on the AFT5 Request for Comment
Hey - this is to notify you that there is a discussion starting on the Article Feedback RfC talkpage that has ramifications for the RfC itself. Your input is much appreciated :). Thanks! and apologies if I've missed anyone Okeyes (WMF) (talk) 16:41, 28 January 2013 (UTC)

The Signpost: 28 January 2013
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Please update list
Hello Guerillero. I noticed your username listed at Did you know/Non-admin participants. Please update your level of participation as an administrator either [//en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Wikipedia:Did_you_know/Admins&action=edit&section=T-1 actively involved] or [//en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Wikipedia:Did_you_know/Admins&action=edit&section=T-2 willing to help]. Thank you.&mdash;My <font color="#ff4500;">76 Strat *talk*email* [ purge] 14:41, 31 January 2013 (UTC)