User talk:History amateur

James Joseph Patterson
It might be a better idea to get verifiable sources first before adding information. More important, you removed other information from the article that was cited to verifiable sources and removed one source entirely. That was unconstructive. I can assume good faith that Barbara McMartin married someone named Patterson. The New York Times does sometimes get things wrong, but Wikipedia rules clearly state that editors should not just delete properly sourced information they don't like. Most likely McMartin married someone else with the same name. The Patterson foundation web site also clearly says the foundation was founded by Dorothy Clarke. Also several sources say they were devout Catholic so divorce would be frowned upon at least. Anything is possible, but it would be hard to believe that the foundation and New York Times are in some conspiracy to keep this quiet. If his wedding when he was a mere cadet made the news, one as a major publishing executive should be quite easy to find in the press. The McMartin article needs sourcing too, and does not even mention this. W Nowicki (talk) 18:10, 21 December 2010 (UTC)
 * "You just excised Barbara McMartin again."

Sorry you got that impression. I did not excise. All I did was add back additional information from verifiable sources. If you think the New York Times and other sources given are not reliable, it sounds like a time for a third opinion. I searched and could only find sources that say she married Walter Alexander Reid in 1982 (also not mentioned in her article?) and had a first husband "Long". http://nl.newsbank.com/nl-search/we/Archives?p_product=SDGB and http://files.usgwarchives.org/ny/albany/obits/atu/2005/sep/atu28sep2005.txt If we have sources that disagree, the convention is to mention both and let readers decide which they want to believe.W Nowicki (talk) 22:16, 21 December 2010 (UTC)

Ah, thanks for the explanation that is starting to make sense. Reality is often more complicated than it first seems. A rich executive attracted to an expert on "One Relator Metabelian Groups"! Once you cited the off-line source, it was kept in the article. My suggestion would be to add any other sources you have, and be explicit as possible. Try to put yourself in the shoes of someone trying to do the verification, by adding all the details to the source that would make it easy to find. For example, articles from the Daily News would have article title, exact date, author if given, even page number if known. Agreed this takes time and work. The original article was slghtly misleading, since it implied the foundation was founded by McMartin (never explained the re-marriage). And I think McMartin was a math student at the time they were married, the hiking books came later. And of course all this should be added to her article with sources. For example, you dug up her dissertation and advisor, which should probably go in her article. Actually I was more interested in the Chicago part of the family, which why I wondered in this way. Sorry for any confusion and thanks for your patience. W Nowicki (talk) 23:06, 21 December 2010 (UTC)

My interest was slightly piqued since I once dabbled in math too. I did a little to her article, but now it sounds like the North Dakota site is not totally accurate. If you have a copy of the dissertation, then by all means cite that in her article. Hope they at least got the title right. W Nowicki (talk) 00:01, 22 December 2010 (UTC)