User talk:Indubitably/Archive 7

Warning: disruptive behavior in Presley article
LaraLove, recent unsigned posting was originally posted by user Onefortyone. Has a history of dubious and disruptive editing and discussion, especially relating to unfounded or tenuous homosexual claims. Cleverly, he makes occasional valid obsservations, and can cry fowl if his comments are summarily dismissed (as some editors, understandably angered, have done). Rikstar 08:57, 16 August 2007 (UTC)
 * Fantastic. I'm making a habit of inadvertently getting involved with articles trolled by vandals. Lara ♥Love 13:32, 16 August 2007 (UTC)
 * It's easily done. User Onefortyone is probably the main reason, apart from idiotic vandalism, that the article was partially locked. Great work today, thank you. Rikstar 16:26, 16 August 2007 (UTC)
 * Sorry, LaraLove, I simply forgot to sign in. This contribution to your talk page was a summary of some points which were insufficiently discussed on Talk:Elvis Presley. As everybody can see, my behavior was not disruptive. However, it seems that I have still some problems with some other users, as Rikstar's reaction shows, because I have a more critical view of Elvis, the Elvis cult and the world-wide Elvis industry than most other contributors to the Elvis article. See also and . I must admit that Rikstar, during the last few weeks, has improved the Elvis article and even included some of my suggestions, but the objections I have raised against the present state of the article are still valid and not minor. Onefortyone 20:42, 16 August 2007 (UTC)
 * Onefortone is not an innocent party. His past behavior has driven many good editors from the Elvis page. He has been the subject of numerous disputes involving his attempt to interject(Sic) allegations on bi-sexuality and homosexaulity into the Elvis article, Nick Adams, and other celebrities all supplied by dubious sourcing and outright falsification or misrepresentation of fact. I've stopped editing the Graceland page to concentrate on the main Elvis page for these reasons. I'll second Rikstar's observations here. --Northmeister 14:12, 17 August 2007 (UTC)
 * This is the typical kind of response you get from Elvis fans if you are raising some critical questions concerning the content of the Elvis article, as endless edit wars with Northmeister have shown. It should be noted in this connection that these fans (or sockpuppets of one or two users) even took me to arbitration simply because my contributions were not in line with their personal view of the singer. However, in the last case, the arbcom has confirmed that my "editing has substantially improved from that in the earlier arbitration cases. A sampling of edits shows reference to reliable sources without overstating of their content." Furthermore, the arbcom said that my opponent "has removed large blocks of sourced material from Elvis Presley" and that he "shows evidence of misunderstanding of Wikipedia:Neutral point of view." Therefore, he was "banned indefinitely from editing articles which concern Elvis Presley." See However, the sockpuppets still seem to be very active. See, for instance . Significantly, Northmeister did not respond to my valid questions concerning the content of the article.  Onefortyone 23:15, 17 August 2007 (UTC)

Crowded House
Hey Lara, how's it going? Someone's just passed Crowded House to GA with a very brief explanation, I was wondering if you agreed with the assessment. There are huge swathes of the article without citation which I think needs to be fixed before I would have passed it myself. I didn't want to put it up at WP:GA/R minutes after it'd been promoted, but I may have to. I'd be very interested in your opinion. Cheers! The Rambling Man 12:18, 15 August 2007 (UTC)
 * It is in need of some additional citation, though it's not too bad. However, there are some typos, an out of place --> in the text, dashes are misplaced, and the image gallery has to go. Fair use doesn't cover album covers for any article other than the article on that album. So that goes for the album cover above the gallery as well. The logo also needs an expanded fair use rationale. I'd bring the issues up on the talk page. It just got passed, so the custodians should be around. If they don't want to make the changes (which I doubt will be the case), then delist it. Lara ♥Love 13:53, 15 August 2007 (UTC)
 * Yeah, all good points, most them I brought up when asked for an informal review. Most worrying really is the fair use on the album covers.  I'll work with the main editor as he seems very keen and understands my reservations on its premature promotion.  Thanks for the once-over.  The Rambling Man 13:55, 15 August 2007 (UTC)
 * No problem. Lara ♥Love 13:57, 15 August 2007 (UTC)

Bobby Eaton GA Review
Hi, some days ago you started reviewing Bobby Eaton to see if it was GA worthy or not, the comments you've made have been acted upon and there's even been some copyediting done by someone not directly involved with the Bobby Eaton article so I was hoping you could give it another look since the GA review is still pending. Thanks in advance MPJ-DK 14:04, 15 August 2007 (UTC)
 * Oh. I apologize. I failed to add that to my list and I totally forgot about it. I am so sorry about that. It will be taken care of today. Lara ♥Love 14:07, 15 August 2007 (UTC)
 * I'll give a look Lara. The Rambling Man 14:57, 15 August 2007 (UTC)
 * Thank you. You're the best. Lara ♥Love 15:05, 15 August 2007 (UTC)
 * You are very welcome! The Rambling Man 15:16, 15 August 2007 (UTC)

May Pang Page
Okay, not for nothing, but someone just deleted half the criticism section at this page, which was perfectly sourced and relevant. Am I losing my mind, or is it odd that in the past three days, all of these people who claim to have extensive knowledge of the inner workings of the record industry (and Paul McCartney's personal life) cropped up out of nowhere? Whatever your opinion is on this is probably best. Layla12275 03:02, 16 August 2007 (UTC)
 * I do want to add, though, that the Goldman book is extremely, extremely controversial, and the fact that she was the one person who knew John Lennon who came out and endorsed it is immensely significant. Layla12275 03:12, 16 August 2007 (UTC)

I wouldn't rule out losing your mind, Not from the Pang page at least. Sixstring1965 03:17, 16 August 2007 (UTC)


 * You have been reported for putting back the same source that Lara told you was insufficient. Layla12275 03:19, 16 August 2007 (UTC)

AN/I disposition
I have closed the AN/I with another block on SixString for the behavior demonstrated above, among many other things. But I also want to remind you to act your age now that you're 25. You don't need to rub it in his face every time he does something wrong. Just report it. I think you may have needlessly aggravated him more than he already was. OK? Daniel Case 04:44, 18 August 2007 (UTC)
 * Where did I rub it in his face? Also, considering he's calling other users twats and disrespecting occupations of other editors, I don't think I needlessly aggravated him. Lara ♥Love 05:06, 18 August 2007 (UTC)


 * OK, maybe it was Layla making the big deal about "I'm reporting you!" But anyway ... When a user insults you like that, just give them a template warning if they're new or ask them to retract it and apologize. If it gets chronic enough to report to AN/I, tell him you're going to do it and then wait and see what he says. Give the other user every possible chance to de-escalate. Then report him. I certainly can understand that you took his insults personally, but civility is always a two-way street. You owe it to him even if it he wasn't giving it to you. See especially WP:CIV. Daniel Case 02:17, 19 August 2007 (UTC)

Happy birthday!
Have a wonderful day! um drums  05:15, 16 August 2007 (UTC)
 * Thank you, thank you! A quarter of a century old... my, my. I'm getting old. Haha. Lara ♥Love 05:18, 16 August 2007 (UTC)
 * Indeed, Happy Birthday! Wow, I remember 25... I think... They all start to run together for me after about 21... But enjoy your youth while you have it!  Not that I am THAT much older, but I am old enough to have to do that "roll your eyes back in you head and contemplate for a minute or two to remember" 25 thing... Anyways, I am rambling.  Happy 25th Birthday, and many more! --Jayron32| talk | contribs  05:31, 16 August 2007 (UTC)
 * Haha. You're a trip. Thanks, Jayron. I'm trying to enjoy my youth, but considering my 5½-year-old HELLION that is Laila and my 1½-year-old son that is on me all the time coupled with an exhausting job... I'm drained most of the time. Thankfully, I have Wikipedia! Lara ♥Love 05:38, 16 August 2007 (UTC)
 * Wow... goes to show that chronological age means nothing. You may be older than I even if you were born later (if that makes ANY sense...) For the record, I have a 1 1/2 year old myself....--Jayron32| talk | contribs  06:17, 16 August 2007 (UTC)
 * I am older and have no kids but I'm still exhausted. Pah.  Anyway, have yourself a very merry day!  The Rambling Man 07:24, 16 August 2007 (UTC)
 * Haha TRM, thank you! And Jayron, I totally understand what you're saying. I joined the USAF while still in high school. Left for boot camp the week after graduation. Got married and had a baby a couple years later. So I've been "older" than most of my peers for a while now. :) When's your baby's birthday? Jason was born March 2. <font color="6A5ACD">Lara <font color="FF1493">♥Love 13:30, 16 August 2007 (UTC)
 * Does that mean that you have a brat? Or are you out of the service now?Balloonman 15:30, 16 August 2007 (UTC)
 * Oh yea. She's a brat. But we're both out now. Well, I'm inactive reserve for one more year. But yea, she's a brat in all senses of the word. <font color="6A5ACD">Lara <font color="FF1493">♥Love 16:47, 16 August 2007 (UTC)
 * Jason. Good name.  VERY good name...  Andrew (my son) was born March 16... So almost exactly the same age.  Cool.  Yeah, I myself put off marriage until after Grad School... Probably would have put it off longer, but my mother-in-law called us on the phone one day and said "I booked the church for May 27th... You guys are getting married, right?"  I took the hint... Still managed to avoid kids for another 6 years  --Jayron32| talk | contribs  02:46, 18 August 2007 (UTC)
 * I take it your name is Jason. That would be my hubby's middle name. He was opposed to the Jr or II concept, so ours is Jason Gage, and I feel it's one of the most awesome names ever. Anyway, totally cool that they're so close together. Does your kid eat well? Mine refuses to eat most of the time... so frustrating. <font color="6A5ACD">Lara <font color="FF1493">♥Love 02:50, 18 August 2007 (UTC)
 * If by well, you mean: Hot Dogs, Chicken Nuggets, Peas, and Cheerios, then yes, he eats well. Anything else is an adventure... And Jason IS one of the most awesome names ever.  Interestingly, Gage was a nickname my parents had for me as a kid.  When I was young, I was unable to say "Jason"... It came out like "Gay-jie" which my parents changed to Gage... No joke... Hadn't thought about that for years, but Gage was an actual nickname of mine.  Weird, huh? --Jayron32| talk | contribs  03:30, 18 August 2007 (UTC)
 * Oh em gee, that's too cute! Haha. What are the chances? How he got his name is a slightly long, wholly amusing story. Sometime when you need a good laugh, ask me. Anyway, if I could get Jason to eat hotdogs and chicken nuggets, I'd be so happy. Breakfast isn't an issue... just everything else. I think part of the problem is that he still nurses, but I'm afraid to stop considering it's where most of his nutrition comes from... it's too risky for me. Mac and cheese usually does well, but he won't even eat PB&J without a fight... what the hell, right?! I don't get it. <font color="6A5ACD">Lara <font color="FF1493">♥Love 03:36, 18 August 2007 (UTC)


 * O Snap, I didn't know it was your special day! Teh Internets went down because 'someone' downloaded Chuck and Larry. With all of the filth that I have downloaded in the last year, how is it I get pinched for a movie about 2 dudes pretending to be gay? Anyway, did that guy in the thread above tell you to act your age and then link you to TWO civility guidelines? Haha. Pot/Kettle. Whatevers! the_undertow <font style="color:5bf8a9"> talk 02:47, 19 August 2007 (UTC)

Thank you for beating my wife
Er wait, that didn't come out right... ;-) thanks for your support on my RFA.Balloonman 15:29, 16 August 2007 (UTC)
 * Haha... Kick ass, take names. What's your wife's name?... no wait. Haha. Yea, no problem. <font color="6A5ACD">Lara <font color="FF1493">♥Love 15:31, 16 August 2007 (UTC)

RFA
thanks for opposing me. :( MMAfan2007 21:25, 16 August 2007 (UTC)
 * Hey, no problem. You're welcome... any time. <font color="6A5ACD">Lara <font color="FF1493">♥Love 03:28, 17 August 2007 (UTC)

Stability and current events
Hi Lara! I just wondered if you would mind giving a thought on this one. I'm really not sure how to interpret the comprehensiveness criterion for current and future avents, and I'd be delighted to hear you on this. — Preceding unsigned comment added by $yD! (talk • contribs) 12:52, August 17, 2007 (UTC)
 * Ugh. I've managed to avoid reviewing this article every time it's come through GA/R... but I'll do it. :) <font color="6A5ACD">Lara <font color="FF1493">♥Love 18:25, 17 August 2007 (UTC)
 * Thanks! I understand your stance.... Do you think we should try to include something like that at WIAGA? There seems to be more and more "current events" article (not that I approve of it, we're not wiinews), and this situation might get commonplace.--SidiLemine 11:58, 18 August 2007 (UTC)

Fall Out Boy
I apologize for stupidly attacking your qualifications to make a decision just because you're a Fall Out Boy fan. However, I would appreciate you to cite how Fall Out Boy is an alternative rock band. They may get play on so called alternative rock stations, but they do not have the qualities that make them an alternative rock band, ie their overt commercialism and the one dimensionality of their music. I suggest just placing "Rock" as their genre until the dispute regarding their actual genre (something like Pop punk/emo) is settled. And, I take exception that you're letting the band decide what their genre isn't. Bands are biased to avoid what they know could interrupt their image. — Preceding unsigned comment added by SpacePope (talk • contribs) 15:50, August 17, 2007 (UTC)

Yes, but again even the genres in dispute are not the sub-genres Wikipedia associates with Alternative rock. There really is no evidence to suggest calling them Alternative rock. Rock or Pop are much more accurate. SpacePope 20:12, 17 August 2007 (UTC)

Very reasonable; I just got into this little spat, and I already want it to end with a firm decision. Thanks for hearing me out. SpacePope 20:23, 17 August 2007 (UTC)

Virtual classroom discussion
I've restored the Virtual classroom's main discussion area. The previous one got chopped up into student coaching pages.

The current topic of discussion is Trends on Wikipedia and where we are heading. Please come and join us.

<font color="#880088">Th <font color="#0000FF">e Tr <font color="#449900">ans <font color="#DD9922">hu <font color="#DD4400">man <font color="#BB0000">ist   22:24, 17 August 2007 (UTC)

Check your holds
Doing some housecleaning at GAC and noticed that you have a few holds that have expired. Be sure to check them out... --Jayron32| talk | contribs 02:42, 18 August 2007 (UTC)
 * Thanks. I was planning on checking on Candice Michelle tonight, but I totally forgot about Bobby Eaton. The Rambling Man sort of took it over for me, but it's good now. Literally. :) <font color="6A5ACD">Lara <font color="FF1493">♥Love 03:09, 18 August 2007 (UTC)

Help copyediting an article...
Hey, could you lend a helping hand with a current FAC that I have? The article is History of American football and the FAC is at Featured article candidates/History of American football. I have done my best to meet requests as they come up; but it looks like there is a need for a set of fresh eyes to give it a general copyedit from top to bottom. Could you perhaps add it to your queue to take a look at it when you get a chance? Thanks! --Jayron32| talk | contribs 01:03, 19 August 2007 (UTC)

Darth Vadar GAR
Hey, what do you think about a GAR for Darth Vadar? Eh? IvoShandor 07:59, 19 August 2007 (UTC)
 * It doesn't look too bad to me. Some minor MOS issues. I corrected some. Prequel trilogy needs to be expanded to summarize the main article. The pop culture section needs to be worked into paragraphs. And the references need to be formatted. I would just leave a message on the talk page and tell them there needs to be some clean-up. I'm not an expert on the movie-related articles, but it seems well referenced for what it is. He's a well-known, fictional character, so there isn't a need for thorough referencing. I'll look over the rest later, but it looks fine to me. <font color="6A5ACD">Lara <font color="FF1493">♥Love 14:52, 19 August 2007 (UTC)

Email
Nope. Btw, you can add me on msn. It's the same one as my email. <font color="#0000FF">OhanaUnited Talk page  15:33, 19 August 2007 (UTC)
 * Oh, that one, yes I got it. I just thought you send me another reply after I reply to your email. <font color="#0000FF">OhanaUnited  Talk page  10:45, 20 August 2007 (UTC)
 * I replied already to the email you use to register Wikipedia. <font color="#0000FF">OhanaUnited  Talk page  13:48, 20 August 2007 (UTC)

Fall Out Boy
I'll look at the article more in depth later today, but I think the best thing to include would be the band's influences. It's sometimes difficult to describe an artist's sound in much more detail than a genre, and trying to analyze how many music critics think it's genre X ends up close to original research. But naming the artists that were influences for the band's work or to whom its work drew comparisons can better contextualize how it sounds. 17Drew 20:07, 19 August 2007 (UTC)

Tenacious D
Wow, thanks for your work there! The article looks a lot better (particularly on the edit tab, with the reference cleanup). Great job! Metao 04:08, 20 August 2007 (UTC)
 * No problem. It's what I do. :) <font color="6A5ACD">Lara <font color="FF1493">♥Love 04:09, 20 August 2007 (UTC)

Moving pages and the GFDL
Hello. Please remember that the history of articles needs to be maintained, even on the project pages, so when doing page merges, just keep a redirect on the old page. Also, if you're going to archive a page like you did for Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Good articles/Uncategorized Good articles task force, and that page is not going to be used again, you should use the move tab. Thanks. --- RockMFR 05:55, 20 August 2007 (UTC)
 * Ah, my bad. Thanks for pointing that out. I was going by the instructions on the merge guide and it didn't talk about talk pages. :/ Thanks for fixing it... and sorry to use up your time. <font color="6A5ACD">Lara <font color="FF1493">♥Love 06:04, 20 August 2007 (UTC)

Tireless contributer barnstar

 * Shiny? Shiny? It's RUSTED! :D Thanks anyway, though! <font color="6A5ACD">Lara <font color="FF1493">♥Love 13:44, 21 August 2007 (UTC)

Randy Orton
Hi LaraLove, before you ask I have read the thing about the GAC's at the top of the page, however, I was wondering whether you could review Randy Orton for us. It has been on the GAC page for two weeks and yet no ones reviewing it. I would be very greatful if you could review it for us - you have reviewed other professional wrestling articles before, thats why I have asked. Thanks. Davnel03 16:04, 21 August 2007 (UTC)
 * Yea, I'll do it. The message at the top also says "... it's of a topic you're for sure will be of interest to me (i.e. anything listed on my user page ...)" I like doing the pro wrestling articles because too many editors don't know what to look for or to consider WP:PW. <font color="6A5ACD">Lara <font color="FF1493">♥Love 16:55, 21 August 2007 (UTC)
 * Thanks. I asked because there's slowly becoming a backlog over at WP:GAC. Davnel03 17:01, 21 August 2007 (UTC)
 * Every time the backlog elimination drives end, it builds back up. Aren't enough reviewers. <font color="6A5ACD">Lara <font color="FF1493">♥Love 17:03, 21 August 2007 (UTC)
 * Are you going to be able to finish off the review? Davnel03 13:44, 23 August 2007 (UTC)

PMAnderson is a troll?
So what good faith was that comment meant in? You seem reasonable in most contexts, so I was very surprised to see this comment. Septentrionalis has a long and varied editing history, any attempt to reduce him to a sound byte or epithet seems doomed to fail. --nae'blis 15:58, 21 August 2007 (UTC) (not logged in at present)


 * According to WP:TROLL, Trolling refers to deliberate and intentional attempts to disrupt the usability of Wikipedia for its editors, administrators, developers, and other people who work to create content for and help run Wikipedia. Trolling is deliberate violation of the implicit rules of Internet social spaces.


 * He's a troll. It wasn't in good faith, it wasn't in bad faith. It was in reality. He has the RfA table on his user page, and (as best as I can tell) he only comments on those of editors for whom he dislikes for no other reason than their participation in GA. If that does not constitute one as a troll, I'm not sure what does. He's disruptive, unproductive, and disrespectful. A rogue editor. He ran long-time contributors away from the Good article project, some of which have yet to return and are sorely missed. His actions shamed the Mathematics project for which he represented, his fellow editors said as much. Bitter and ignorant are also words that come to mind. There's a reason he's been involved in multiple RfCs and the like. More than likely, it's only a fraction of such events that could have happened. His shenanigans at GA/R warranted it, but no one wanted to deal with it anymore. Not that any of them matter. He always talks his way out of them, obviously, because he should have been blocked months ago, on multiple occasions.


 * If you disagree, you apparently haven't had to deal with the PMAnderson we have. But I posted diffs as examples, if you want to ignore those or sugarcoat them or justify them, by all means, whatever makes you happy, but don't bring it on my talk page, because I DGAF. I have just as much of a right to inform others of what kind of editor PMAnderson is as he has to oppose editors because he doesn't like where they contribute. <font color="6A5ACD">Lara <font color="FF1493">♥Love 16:52, 21 August 2007 (UTC)
 * You're right, you and I have had very different interactions, so I appreciate the response, and we'll have to agree to disagree. -- nae'blis 01:56, 23 August 2007 (UTC)
 * Well, in the name of Jimbo Wales and all that is Holy, I hope you never have similar interactions with him. Good luck with that. <font color="6A5ACD">Lara <font color="FF1493">♥Love 02:12, 23 August 2007 (UTC)

Poor Ronnie!
Hi Lara, --> Only if you have free time <--

Poor Ronald Reagan is at FAC and is being nickle 'n dimed to death by a million reviewer requests. If you have a moment to spare for your copy editing magic...

Thanks either way.. --Ling.Nut 05:12, 22 August 2007 (UTC)

Signpost updated for August 20th, 2007.
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Ronald Reagan
Hi there. Would you consider registering a support on Ronald Reagan's FAC page here? Happyme22 06:43, 22 August 2007 (UTC)
 * Don't canvass. I'm copy-editing it. If I feel it's up to FA quality, I'll support it when I'm done. <font color="6A5ACD">Lara <font color="FF1493">♥Love 14:38, 22 August 2007 (UTC)

Red Auerbach
Hi there, I will vent some steam off the IMHO bogus GA retraction of Red Auerbach, in which you defend OhanaUnited. I speak with the authority of being the main author of 1 FA and 15 GAs. I find your currently enforced "snipe-first-ask-later" mode of targeting GAs highly problematic. OhanaUnited pointed out a problem at the Red Auerback talk page. But he This unilateral thing is highly disturbing, to say the least. Who gives you the authority to be judge, jury and executioner? Communication is what holds Wikipedia together, not some participation in some WikiProject. If he had contacted ME first, I would have been happy to fix this in 2 seconds, but no, he gave the maximum punishment, and still claimed "he did anything possible to make the errors known". Nonsense, see above. He was over-zealous and he acted in bad faith. I prefer a CONSTRUCTIVE way to deal with things, not DESTRUCTIVE. I have a problem with latter, and if this is the new GA ideology, I will not be a part of it. —Onomatopoeia 08:30, 23 August 2007 (UTC)
 * did not contact the main author of the page (me and User:Chensiyuan)
 * did not contact the WikiProject under which this page stands (WP:NBA)
 * did not list this page up and WP:GA/R


 * Here the exact quotes from the Red Auerbach talk page:
 * I'm expressing my concerns regarding this GA review. I felt that this article has passed the review even though it didn't meet the standards. First, notes and reference section should be merged. Reference #6 and #10 have no sources! Where did you obtain the information from? This article needs more varieties of references than the existing ones. I also found Image:RedMemshamrock.png lack of fair use rationales. Lead section should be summarized and shortened furthur. OhanaUnitedTalk page 15:54, 17 August 2007 (UTC)
 * And then four days later: As my concerns are not addressed, the article will now be delisted. OhanaUnitedTalk page 14:59, 21 August 2007 (UTC)
 * Was there ANY warning? This was just a general remark, and at BEST, a non-binding appeal for copyedit. It was NEVER clear that GA delisting was a topic. —Onomatopoeia 10:33, 23 August 2007 (UTC)

Alright, first thing. Like I said, it wasn't unilateral. That implies that it was a lone decision. He did it on my recommendation, so put that on me. Second, regarding the notification being solely on the talk page. That's appropriate. The recommendation to notify Wikiprojects has been suggested (by me, actually), but the idea was shot down as unnecessary as it is generally the case that custodians watchlist their articles. If 16 articles is too much for you to keep an eye on then, I'm sorry. I have almost 200 pages on my watchlist, and it's not a hassle to me, but everyone's different. It's been my intention to notify Wikiprojects for articles nominated at GA/R, but not all articles have to go through GA/R. The procedural recommendation found at WP:GA/R was followed to the letter by Ohana. Notification on the article talk page and enough time for the issues to be addressed. WP:GAC on hold periods are no less than two days. He waited four. The issue is with the reviewer that listed this article. He did not do an adequate job of reviewing it.

With that said, I apologize for your article being one that failed the GAC backlog elimination drive quality reviews. This was not your fault, but the fault of the reviewing editor. Hundreds of articles were reviewed and I personally reviewed over 100 between my reviews in the drive and my quality reviews after (which I still have more yet to do). This does not include articles I've reviewed for GA/R during this time, requested FA reviews and copy-edits for FA noms. So this is all on me. I'm consumed by article reviews right now and felt it more appropriate to delist articles that were inappropriately listed and have issues that are not being addressed rather than overload GA/R.

On a side note, how long was it from the time it was delisted and the time you realized it? <font color="6A5ACD">Lara <font color="FF1493">♥Love 14:54, 23 August 2007 (UTC)


 * I at least see the rationale, but I utterly disagree about the enforcement procedure. As an amendment, AT LEAST the WikiProject tied to the article and the main author(s) should be notified. Communication again, this is just common sense. BTW, I noticed the GA delisting when I looked at the WP:NBA portal page and suddenly found that Red Auerbach had been delisted, ~24h after retraction. The whole week, I was trying to make the Tim Duncan article an FA, funnelled 100% attention into it and was totally BLINDSIDED. In this period, the only pages that matter are the FA article, its FAC discussion page, and my talk page (YOU try making an article an FA, you very much lose focus on anything else but these 3 pages). If you can watchlist 200 articles, fine, but I cannot. In any case, I am still very much convinced that the GA retraction was the worst possible solution for everyone. —Onomatopoeia 16:23, 23 August 2007 (UTC)
 * The article probably should have been relisted at WP:GAC, but that's a personal opinion. As far as writing FAs, I do not create brilliant prose, so I don't think that's in my future, but I do copy-edit FA noms for friends. I also have all the articles I helped bring to GA (the ones I take credit for and the ones I don't) on my watch list and keep tabs on new edits, but I can appreciate that it isn't for everyone. As for notifying Wikiprojects, I agree! But not everyone does. We'll try, however, to keep up with the notifications, even if we can't get it into procedure. I have at least a couple editors on my side, and they've been notifying Wikiprojects the past couple days or so. <font color="6A5ACD">Lara <font color="FF1493">♥Love 16:38, 23 August 2007 (UTC)

Victoria Cross (Canada)
With regards to the Canadian VC, you seem to back me up that it was removed on a technicality.It was not delisted because of problems with the article. All i now want, is the reasons that it should not be GA. I accept that its promotion was a mess but that is hardly the fault of the contributors to the article. By delisting it without going through WP:GA/R there was a complete disregard for due-process, be that by OhanaUnited or by the project in general. (I understand the irony that it was promoted without due care to process). Woodym555 10:16, 23 August 2007 (UTC)
 * Woody still having so hard time understanding why it should be delisted. When the article is on hold, it is meant to allow others to improve the article, then the reviewer checks if the improvement are satisactory. It should be the same person, not another reviewer jumped into the article and approved it anyway. To conclude things, the promotion process in this article got side-tracked. <font color="#0000FF">OhanaUnited  Talk page  17:14, 23 August 2007 (UTC)
 * A renomination at WP:GAC would be most appropriate, but considering it's already at GA/R, we'll just deal with it there. More than likely it will be relisted after some improvements. I'll work on it a couple hours. <font color="6A5ACD">Lara <font color="FF1493">♥Love 17:47, 23 August 2007 (UTC)
 * First, thanks Lara for fixing some of the refs, i have now added in some more text, so you might want to check it.
 * Secondly, it was demoted because of a technicality, not a problem with the quality of the article itself. As Tarret said, there was no rule against it at the time, about going over someones head and promoting the article. That is a problem for the good article community as a whole to fix and not for the article writers to fix. The reason that i was having such a 'hard time' was because no-one (until i listed it at GA/R) could provide me with a reason related to the quality of the article. That was what i wanted. I really don't think that it should have been demoted simply because you disagreed with the manner of its promotion. Woodym555 22:01, 23 August 2007 (UTC)
 * The original editor put it on hold, so he, I assume, listed issues. And although there is no (perhaps there is now, but I've not seen a change) written rule against hijacking a review, it's common sense that it would be improper. But, as you noted, that's a project issue. Not your problem. Really, the article needs to be returned to on hold while issues are corrected. This situation is what GA/R is for, and we'll have the article taken care of and promoted soon. And the article will quite possibly be better for it, although that may be no consolation to you. I apologize for the inconvenience to you and others. Regards, <font color="6A5ACD">Lara <font color="FF1493">♥Love 23:28, 23 August 2007 (UTC)

Yup, that's yet another Barnstar
I just figured you might want to create a separate "decorations" page, and didn't have enough of these to fill it yet, so I give you...

To tell you the truth, I really didn't like the idea of GA/R in the beginning, and my guess is that I still wouldn't like it ("these people are unable to make GA's, so they pick on other people's articles" way of thinking) if you weren't there. What you and the GA WP are doing is definitely a good thing, specially if we can get all GAs to level while keeping their numbers rising. Keep it up and have a blast!--SidiLemine 12:48, 23 August 2007 (UTC)


 * Thanks. :) A lot of the participants do write GAs, though. Some write FAs. A lot of us also do peer reviews and FA reviews. Others started in GAC and ended up in GA/R. And a lot of us actively help custodians improve articles to satisfy the criteria, so, in that respect, even more write GAs, they just don't take credit for it. Also, I have an awards section on my userpage. Is that what you were talking about? Or a separate section for the special barnstars? <font color="6A5ACD">Lara <font color="FF1493">♥Love 14:32, 23 August 2007 (UTC)


 * Yes, I've come to realise that many, if not all, GAR people were active at GAC too, bringing some kind of balance to the Force. And GAR is beginning to be one of my favorite places to work on article that need and deserve it.... About the Barnstars, I saw the section, and was thinking you might want to split it to a separate page if it gets bigger! Boy, would I love to have that section on my page.--SidiLemine 15:26, 23 August 2007 (UTC)

Account on en wikibooks
Hi - someone just created an account on wikibooks using your name & with a link here. We have had imposters in the past & it doesn't "feel" like you!! Cheers (same on any person on any wiki mostly) -- Herby talk thyme 15:55, 23 August 2007 (UTC)
 * Yea, that wasn't me. Thanks for the heads up. <font color="6A5ACD">Lara <font color="FF1493">♥Love 16:03, 23 August 2007 (UTC)
 * Indef block (in a minute!) cheers -- Herby talk thyme 16:06, 23 August 2007 (UTC)
 * Is there some way that I can assume that account? <font color="6A5ACD">Lara <font color="FF1493">♥Love 16:14, 23 August 2007 (UTC)
 * See WP:USURP for information. It looks like a beurocrat can do so. --Jayron32| talk | contribs  01:13, 24 August 2007 (UTC)
 * A 'crat took care of it for me. The only thing is that he's renamed the talk page LaraLove IMPOSTER, which needs to be corrected. He may have already done it. I don't actually use Wikibooks, didn't even know it existed to be honest, but just to prevent this mess from happening again, it might be wise to create an account on all projects. Who knows, I might get into them at some point. <font color="6A5ACD">Lara <font color="FF1493">♥Love 01:17, 24 August 2007 (UTC)

Think it looks sorted now. I actually blocked them before I contacted you as they had a sandbox where they were practicing you sig - I felt you might not need to do that!!! Let me know if I can help tho - cheers -- Herby talk thyme 16:07, 24 August 2007 (UTC)
 * reset
 * What a moron. They obviously found me here, so why not just check the edit page of any page I'd signed and take the sig code from there? The stupidity of other people never ceases to amaze me. Thanks for your help. <font face="Verdana"><font color="6A5ACD">Lara <font color="FF1493"> ♥ Love 16:11, 24 August 2007 (UTC)
 * HA! This worked out great. I decided to register accounts on the other Wikis, just to prevent this from happening again, so I go to Wikinews and kind of start looking around. I save an article from deletion and take it to publication, then write a couple articles about bad things happening to little kids, then I write one about the iPhone's lock to the AT&T network being cracked by a teenager. Come home from work last night, play trivia for a while, check out Wikinews before I go to bed and HOT DAMN, my iPhone story is FEATURED on the MAIN PAGE! Ha! So it all worked out. If this dumbass hadn't tried to hijack my name, I wouldn't have registered an account on Wikinews, and I wouldn't have written a front page story. :D Awesome. <font face="Fantasy"><font color="6A5ACD">LARA <font color="FF1493">♥LOVE 16:27, 25 August 2007 (UTC)

Mother Teresa delist review
Since you weighed in last time, thought you may want to know that the Mother Teresa article was referred for review...again! Stubborn editors want another try. --Anietor 00:16, 24 August 2007 (UTC)
 * Yea, I know. I posted the previous GA/R links. Thanks for the notification, though! I'm amused that it's up again after only four days or whatever. Kind of ridiculous. Three times in one month. At first glance, however, the first vote seems to raise legitimate concerns, but I've got to read it again first and see what's changed. I think I'll also request page protection if it's not already been done. :) <font color="6A5ACD">Lara <font color="FF1493">♥Love 00:46, 24 August 2007 (UTC)

Adminship
Hello!! I am RS2007. I looked at your contributions and I think you have done a great job. Why don’t you request for adminship? I will support you. Thank you! RS2007 03:43, 24 August 2007 (UTC)
 * Not interested at this time. I refer you to my comments on my most recent editor review, for which there is a banner at the top of this page. Thank you for the offer, however. Maybe sometime in the future. :) <font face="Verdana"><font color="6A5ACD">Lara <font color="FF1493"> ♥ Love 04:02, 24 August 2007 (UTC)

Hey, you on like right now?
Are you? --Jayron32| talk | contribs 17:58, 24 August 2007 (UTC)
 * Yea. Well, I'm writing an article on Wikinews, but what's up? <font face="Fantasy"><font color="6A5ACD">LARA <font color="FF1493">♥LOVE 18:02, 24 August 2007 (UTC)
 * New font on the sig sucks, BTW. Hard to read. Any who... Do you play trivia games, like online at all? --Jayron32| talk | contribs  18:10, 24 August 2007 (UTC)
 * Not really, but I'm always open to try new things. Why?
 * And damn. I like it. Maybe it looks diff for me. What if I made it a little bigger? <font face="Fantasy"><font color="6A5ACD">LARA <font color="FF1493">♥LOVE 18:12, 24 August 2007 (UTC)
 * On my screen it looks like LanaLope... Oh well. No biggie I guess.  I know who you are... Well, we had a trivia game that died for lack of participation a few minutes ago.  I was hunting around for people to join to get it started up again.  Knew you were online as much as me, so I thought i'd give you a buzz... --Jayron32| talk | contribs  18:15, 24 August 2007 (UTC)
 * Link me. And what the hell? lol, LanaLope? How small is your browser font size? Hmm, well maybe that will keep the dumbasses off my case. <font face="Fantasy"><font color="6A5ACD">LARA <font color="FF1493">♥LOVE 18:19, 24 August 2007 (UTC)
 * You have a Yahoo account? Mine is Jayron32.  If you go to Yahoo Messenger, add me to your friends list... If a game gets going, I'll invite you... --Jayron32| talk | contribs  18:22, 24 August 2007 (UTC)

This thread needs less trivia and more cowbell! WoooHoooo! the_undertow <font style="color:5bf8a9"> talk 07:02, 26 August 2007 (UTC)

SNES "copyvio"
I was just reviewing some of my contribs and noticed I never mentioned my reversion of this edit to you (possibly because I was sitting in O'Hare International Airport at the time). If you look at the the site you mention on archive.org, there is no trace of the supposedly infringing content until 9 January 2006, and in fact the content on that website is an exact copy of the Wikipedia article as it was from 07:36 16 November 2005 until 12:59 10 December 2005. Thus, it is obvious that that site copied the Wikipedia article and not the other way around. Anomie 19:44, 26 August 2007 (UTC)
 * Thanks for the message. I'm not sure about all the details of copyrights, but there is no contact info on the site that I can find, so I don't know where to go from here as far as contacting the website. But, from seeing that, Wikipedia seems to be covered, so I suppose we just leave the article as it is. <font face="Fantasy"><font color="6A5ACD">LARA <font color="FF1493">♥LOVE 02:47, 27 August 2007 (UTC)

Could you...
Hey Lara. Baring in mind your exceptional copyediting skills, I'd really appreciate it if you could take a look at John Frusciante for me. It's currently a GA, but we have intentions of a future FAC, following the article's second PR. If you decide to review it, you could post it at the PR or the article's talk page. Regardless, thank you for considering! Best wishes, <font color="#000000">NSR <font color="#26466D ">77 <font color="#000000">T<font color="#26466D ">C  01:03, 27 August 2007 (UTC)

Orton GA
Are you going to finish off the Randy Orton GA review. It seems like you just haven't gone to the article to finish it off. Davnel03 15:06, 27 August 2007 (UTC)
 * All of the points you made have been completed by me and other users. Thanks for the review - I appreciate it. Davnel03 15:49, 30 August 2007 (UTC)
 * All of the other points you made have been done. Davnel03 08:39, 2 September 2007 (UTC)

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GA lesson
Nice progress on the lesson!

By the way, in the first sentence you mentioned "Good articles are those that have not reached the featured article standard or are unlikely to reach this high standard soon due to a variety of reasons".

What are some of the reasons an article might not be destined for FA status anytime soon?

<font color="#880088">Th <font color="#0000FF">e Tr <font color="#449900">ans <font color="#DD9922">hu <font color="#DD4400">man <font color="#BB0000">ist   20:22, 28 August 2007 (UTC)
 * I felt that a title of Good article review/overview was more appropriate. -- RHaworth 07:26, 29 August 2007 (UTC)
 * Well, considering it's a draft in progress, I didn't want it attached to the actual project page at this time. But I guess what's done is done. Thanks. <font face="Fantasy"><font color="6A5ACD">LARA <font color="FF1493">♥LOVE 14:24, 29 August 2007 (UTC)

VC student
I think Bart133 is ready for the mop. What do you think? <font color="#880088">Th <font color="#0000FF">e Tr <font color="#449900">ans <font color="#DD9922">hu <font color="#DD4400">man <font color="#BB0000">ist    23:01, 29 August 2007 (UTC)