User talk:JarrahTree/Archive 23

Indonesia collaboration
Hi ! It's the last few days of the Garuda Indonesia collaboration. Please contribute!!!

Also, could you please vote for the next fortnight's collaboration? Please vote down the bottom of this page. The collab for the fortnight will be decided this Sunday 26th (or Monday at the latest). By the way, we could also chose Garuda Indonesia for another week.

So please visit and help choose the next article. Any questions/comments, please let me know. I'd love to hear from you particularly if you have any good suggestions! :-) --Merbabu 10:26, 24 November 2006 (UTC)
 * Hi again, ! This fortnight we've chosen: >>>Majapahit Kingdom<<<. Please help in referencing, check my newly added headings, improve prose, diagrams, but most importantly is RESEARCH so we can actually grow the article. Any other suggestions for improvement, please leave on the article's talk page. Yes, please discuss on talk page!
 * Also, can you please post suggestions for the following fortnight's collaboration. Please leave your suggestions at the bottom of this page. Hopefully i will remember to remind you to vote in about a week (someone else remind me!).--Merbabu 14:24, 27 November 2006 (UTC)

Hello
Good to see you back.-- Dakota 23:37, 24 November 2006 (UTC)

RfA thank you

 * Welcome back, hope you enjoyed the break Gnangarra 13:39, 30 November 2006 (UTC)


 * Welcome back from me, too, Satu. Nice to see you active again. :) Sarah Ewart 13:53, 30 November 2006 (UTC)


 * Welcome back! (haven't unpacked... must... edit... wikipedia...) :D Orderinchaos78 14:15, 30 November 2006 (UTC)

a state?
ha ha ha - cool post. Are you drunk? or another state? lol (feel free to remove this message if you consider it talk page pollution). nice to see yhe enthusiasm up. have you unpacked your bags yet? --Merbabu 13:52, 30 November 2006 (UTC)
 * Well, if Majapahit is not quite your thing have a look at Borobudur, Dutch military aggression II (we will have 3 articles when we should have 1), Battle of Surabaya - plenty going on. (check the talk pages). hmmm - teh botol, yum. I think it needs its own article - very notable. well, actually kopi jawa is more my thing - but I won't touch es cendol. --Merbabu 14:11, 30 November 2006 (UTC)

Majapahit
Re "the central javanese palace tendency to try to tie loose ends by claiming connections with majapahit" please contribute if you feel it is appropriate. --Merbabu 14:24, 30 November 2006 (UTC)

Flamethrower
Yeah but if you get the wind just right you gain another 2-3 meters 8), I thought my kids had cornered the market on absolutely pointless agruements, but there appears to be an over supply here at the moment. Gnangarra 14:02, 30 November 2006 (UTC)

Hi
Slowly improving - it's started to peel quite a bit, but I can walk fine now. I spent the week, amongst more real life pursuits, infoboxing every suburb in Melbourne. Oh and I see the old chestnut about Port Hedland being "largest" has reemerged thanks to an anon editor. I wish they'd stop doing that, because the censuses are so infrequent and three are around the same size "largest" is impossible to determine. Orderinchaos78 15:42, 30 November 2006 (UTC)
 * Sounds like an interesting life! Some of the beaches between Yanchep and Butler were amazing - I have NO idea how they're going to build a(nother failed) city centre up there, although I can already see some prime real estate for those with four-wheel-drives :| Personally I think they should declare the coastal area a park as Stephenson intended. BTW any idea how many pages one can have on a watchlist - is a big one a problem? I can foresee I'll ultimately have close to 2,000... Orderinchaos78 23:29, 30 November 2006 (UTC)

Welcome home
I've discovered that the trick to dealing with List of cities by surface area is to stop caring. People who come to Wikipedia looking for unverifiable and irrelevant factoids deserve what they get. Hesperian 00:32, 1 December 2006 (UTC)
 * That's what the disputed template is for. Hesperian 00:48, 1 December 2006 (UTC)

This diff amused me. Orderinchaos78 02:53, 1 December 2006 (UTC)
 * Yes I was rather impressed too! I'm getting to a stage with this infobox project where I'm almost finished and yet can't be bothered and am taking longer and longer breaks. Probably my body's way of telling me I should spend more time in reality :P Orderinchaos78 15:07, 1 December 2006 (UTC)
 * Haha... The good old infinite improbability drive! I sometimes wish I could leap into one of those at certain moments in my life. :) Meanwhile I think someone has been trying for the world record in the number of consecutive edits on one article. Orderinchaos78 15:15, 1 December 2006 (UTC)
 * Yeah, I was trying to be nice in my edit summary. As I'm more interested in (and involved with) the Perth project, I've been pretty light with a lot of the articles (although removing anything blatant or fixing manglish as it appears) in these Melb articles. Orderinchaos78 15:38, 1 December 2006 (UTC)

a light read
Just thought you may enjoy some of this piece of nonsense before it get deleted Gnangarra 15:46, 1 December 2006 (UTC)

Patrick Stewart
Thanks so protecting the page will useful for a couple days until someone else grabs the headlines Gnangarra 16:15, 1 December 2006 (UTC)

Respect
Hey, It's Friday afternoon here in Europe and I was quite bored with the job. The edit summary was humorous. So I was writing that edit summary while bowing to SBY's picture. So, let's say if somebody object about SBY's picture removal from the article, then I could say that I have asked the permission from SBY himself. Hahaha. Have a nice weekend! I don't have internet connection at home, so I'm off with Wikipedia for 2 days. &mdash; Indon ( reply ) &mdash; 16:20, 1 December 2006 (UTC)

Traditionalist Islam
Hi. This article is up for deletion. What do you know about this topic? I'm looking at it from an Indonesian point of view and it was something that I had a vague understanding that there was an important distinction between the traditionalists and the modernists. Maybe we should let it go though - the article in its current form has almost nothing to do with Islam in Indonesia and "keep" is probably a battle that can't be won. What do you think? Let it go and work on something Indonesian? Is Indonesian the only country to have such syncretic forms of Islam? --Merbabu 02:24, 2 December 2006 (UTC)
 * I almost walked away cos I don't have a lot of knowledge - ie, "I am sure it is correct and important" but can't really back it up. As long as my post at least gets heard and the objections are not ludicrous, it is not something I will fight too hard on. As for the rest of the points in your posts, I do not see how one group can say the conflicting beliefs of another (considerable) group cannot be reported on wikiepedia. Of course, these topics are inherently POV but that is fine as long as it is presented as POV and not as fact. it would be like Catholics saying that Protestantism must be removed cos it is simply POV (or vice versa)--Merbabu 02:57, 2 December 2006 (UTC)
 * Do you have any sources on the concept of Traditionalist vs Modernists in INdonesia? --Merbabu 02:57, 2 December 2006 (UTC)
 * yeah - we almost think the same: i get a little involved but not too involved in debates where I know almost nothing. Ie, I have now eased my out of that one cos I know nothing of the issue beyond Indonesia. Also, not only do I have no ablity (ie knowledge) to argue over Sunni and Shia differences of opinion is something I have also have absolutely no motivation!! lol. THe traditional vs. modernist concept for Indoensia should be developed though elsewhere. I've seen conflicting descriptions though of how these terms apply to Islam in Indonesia (and these are external sources - non-Islamic, non-Indonesian - which one would think would be a little more objective). It might be wise to stick to the the abangan, santri and priyayi groupings, although that moves in some ways further than religion. --Merbabu 03:41, 2 December 2006 (UTC)
 * Your comment on the muhhamidiyah triggers the need to perhaps clarify the terms traditionalist/modernist. I had alwys thought (picked up over time, rather than studied) that traditionalist meant the (typically Javanese) Muslim, or for that matter Christian too(!), who practises his religion mixed with traditional Indonesian (Javanese, or wherever) beliefs, that include animism, mysticism, and a strong emphasis on ceremony and ritual. Traditionalists have a longer history than the modernists - those who are practising more orthodox (Middle Eastern) Islam. Ie, traditionalist and modernis relative to the Indonesian perspective, rather than islamic perspective. Although the modernists do see themselves as modernisers they probably object to the "others" being called traditionalist as they see themselves (probably correctly) as being closer to traditional Islam. Thus, from the muhhamidiyah's perspective, they are certainly traditionalist (in terms of Islam) but the world-apart abangan practise a traditional Indonesian Islam. Does that make sense? Clear as mud? --Merbabu 04:10, 2 December 2006 (UTC)
 * Nope - nothing is clear cut. Pigeon-holing is bound to end up in tears. From a completly different world, I watched a similar mess over at the U2 talk page (and edit warring). Their musical genre labelling seems to have stabilised - for now. Now people argue over "U2 is" vs. "U2 are". But, so far the POV wars in Indonesian Islam have been insiginificant. We have been lucky, cos the articles themselves are flimsy and are therefore fertile ground for POV wars. --Merbabu 04:19, 2 December 2006 (UTC)

My Page
Thanks for posting on my page mate. I just thought I should mention that I've had an account on Wikipedia for a while but have been using it for a while before that. It was just that I only just got around to adding myself the the Wikiproject and I'm getting around to making a user page I've just been very busy lately. Also I almost always sign my comments with the occasional exception when I forget. Just thought I'd mention it.Spec ops commando 06:11, 2 December 2006 (UTC)

On psychological profiling...
hehehe... Yes, I'm sure there's a PhD in the making for some sociology student somewhere on the newbies of Wikipedia... I try to be nice to everyone, I myself was an IP editor for several months before I began editing under this nick in March-ish. At the time all Westnet customers in WA were on one proxy and even when I logged in under an account I kept getting blocked, so I got known to a whole heap of people by my persistent unblock requests :P Orderinchaos78 13:04, 2 December 2006 (UTC)
 * Re CBD list - seems like a reasonable idea to me (esp on Wiki where everything *else* is list-mad :)) Orderinchaos78 15:34, 3 December 2006 (UTC)
 * Also is it just my imagination or is WP:Perth a bit dead lately? This current discussion is the most active I've seen it for months, and most of its participants communicate via other forums Orderinchaos78 15:41, 3 December 2006 (UTC)

Spelling of fourty (sic) and forty
Four and forty are not -or/-our words like honor/honour. Therefore four and forty are correct for both English and American spellings. Mount Dundas- Zeehan Railway can be left as revised.

Tabletop 02:14, 3 December 2006 (UTC)

Holiday
Thanks - I enjoyed the holiday. If you're ever around Kalbarri go to Finley's Fish BBQ - the best fish I've ever tasted. Or maybe you already knew ... I hope I'll have fun with my (probably minuscule) 345 page watchlist ... looks like there's been a lot of activity at wikipedia talk:WikiProject Spam while I was away. The last time I took a break in January, two notorious trolls were banned and that caused a lot of controversy. Graham 87 04:35, 4 December 2006 (UTC)

Reversion of city street names
If this is going to be a problem, I don't want to be involved. I just urge you to take a look at every other article on every other road in Perth. Few contain the ,Perth suffix-- M  W  Johnson  08:58, 4 December 2006 (UTC)

WP:LOCAL
I'm sure you'll be interested in this proposed guideline Gnangarra 05:19, 5 December 2006 (UTC)
 * Yeah I saw that but had only just finished reading and commenting on local and thought maybe you like to know as well. Gnangarra
 * The train kinda makes sense, honestly unless some crazed wikipedian ran amuck on Ashfield train station its never going need an article. But thats a project specific guideline where as WP:LOCAL intends being all encompassing Gnangarra 13:36, 5 December 2006 (UTC)

Sheep
I had only just this minute gone back to Avondale and thought I gotta do something about the red links. I haven't got anything on hand its going to be a research trip to Battye, on a run and hide from the kids day 8) over the coming weeks. The one source I have here I'll go through in the next few days and see whats there. Gnangarra 13:32, 5 December 2006 (UTC)
 * following on you had a question or 2 about image uploads that you was going to email last night?. Gnangarra 12:57, 6 December 2006 (UTC)
 * so he didnt enjoy teeth getting pulled 8{
 * http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Commons:Tools/Commonist this was what you downloaded before you started sorting the shed, but you can get another copy from the link. Its best to do groups of like images as it easier with filling in the boxes. Gnangarra 13:11, 6 December 2006 (UTC)
 * Its best done while sleeping especially 50-60 images just setup and let it go. I started adding "_gnangarra" to file name of my commonist uploads that way I never have any file naming issues and can let it run while I'm elseware. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Gnangarra (talk • contribs) 13:29, 6 December 2006 (UTC). Gnangarra 13:30, 6 December 2006 (UTC)
 * Hey! I am usually am asleep at the wheel anyways - see my comments on L:ake P:edder and Rebeccas talk page :) SatuSuro 13:34, 6 December 2006 (UTC)

Progress
I've tried to make an effort to actually add to articles over the last month. It is all too easy to just clean up after vandals and get into long discussions on content. Indon has been particularly inspiring (envy making??). I still want to do a fair bit on the Economy section, and Culture is also pretty rotten. The current issues bit could do with some more work too. None of these sections need more size, rather better quality. But economics is on the way. Then i can do Current Issues. But culture is hard. I want to expand on the usual cliched descritptions of Gamelan, wayang and batik. lol. Anywway, what is culture??? Any thoughts for that section? Ie, not just your normal ponderous thought prevoking thoughts, but stuff that can be written in an article - lol. ;-) --Merbabu 14:21, 5 December 2006 (UTC)

Check out Borobudur. Indon's handy work again. I give him 6 weeks to have it FA. lol By the way - do you know of the book Borobudur Prayer in Stone? It is the most amazing book i have perhaps. Big heavy coffee table with some of the best photography i have ever seen of any where in the world - certainly the best Indonesian photography collection I've seen. The test is by Soekmono, Indonesia's foremost Borobudur expert, and is similar to his .pdf linked on the Borobudur page. --Merbabu 14:21, 5 December 2006 (UTC)

Some Fred
Thanks for encouraging comments and DYK nomination. But it is only just has pin feathers a semblance of flight. Hopefully others will help it become fully fledged. I will do more when I get full internet access, can only drop in and out. Went for nice ramble in Guildford heritage area, found bookshop I had forgotten about. Some australiana books as you probably know. Fred.e 22:46, 5 December 2006 (UTC)

Lake Pedder
I'm not familiar with the case at all. I have access to several articles about the flooding and the movement to drain the lake again though my unis subscriptions; I can email you them if you're interested. I read over your proposal on the talk page; I think both things can be covered in the one article and it is logical to do so, but there is a problem of clarity as is. Someone really needs to pry apart the two aspects of the locale. --Peta 03:38, 6 December 2006 (UTC)

Borobudur
I've seen one. Here: eo:Dosiero:Borobuduro1.jpg in eo wikipedia, but alas it has no source & license information. &mdash; Indon ( reply ) &mdash; 13:30, 6 December 2006 (UTC)


 * It's okay, you're not bother me at all. I agree, one source is not good at all. Actually there are good books in my univ's library, having my city is the best place to find Indonesian literature outside Indonesia, but I have to cycle out and it's winter now. So I will let the article like this first, while other good copyeditors improve the prose or maybe addings sources, then I can fill the gap later. Thanks. &mdash; Indon ( reply ) &mdash; 13:50, 6 December 2006 (UTC)

warning: it's not related &mdash; hahaha, kolam renangnya yang enak, apa yg berenangnya yg enak diliat? ;-) &mdash; Indon ( reply ) &mdash; 14:01, 6 December 2006 (UTC)


 * Ah, is that your article? So now it gets more attentions, hehehe. &mdash; Indon ( reply ) &mdash; 14:24, 6 December 2006 (UTC)

Hmmm
Expressions of interest in the maritime project is healthier than I thought it'd be, so good luck. No suggestions at this stage but I will start pondering. Cricket: yes, its very exciting for a tragic supporting the team on the ascendancy. As long as the Poms turn up, I'll be going a few times next week so may have a few hours off-line. That's one way to get off the air I suppose!

That article is such shite IMO. &mdash;Moondyne 14:37, 6 December 2006 (UTC)


 * Would it be protocol...? I don't see why that's necessary.  I'd planned on doing it myself sometime unless someone beats me.  I'll let you know. &mdash;Moondyne 00:05, 7 December 2006 (UTC) I Just read H's suggestion which would be a better outcome. &mdash;Moondyne 00:32, 7 December 2006 (UTC)


 * Copy it or move it, it doesn't make any difference. Either way its recoverable through the history. &mdash;Moondyne 00:50, 7 December 2006 (UTC)

Maritime

 * Where there is substantial crossover, I think maritime wise the maritime project takes precedence, and is the correct place to hammer things out. With regards to me putting my foot in it and going alone - don't worry. SauliH 02:45, 7 December 2006 (UTC)

Yamin
Absolutely. Interestingly, it seems to have been writen by a nephew of Yamin. (Caniago 13:03, 7 December 2006 (UTC))

Le Souef confusion
Hi. I've finished now. Hope it makes more sense. Smallweed 13:55, 7 December 2006 (UTC)

Categories
1. decide on the category name and what parent category its going to belong to. 2. edit your article and add your new category to it. 3. click on the category redlink and edit the category page by adding the parent category.

Beware, you can't rename categories, so make sure your spelling and capitalisation is correct. If you do make a mistake or change your mind, H or G or myself could do a speedy delete. Sing out if you need a hand. &mdash;Moondyne 06:59, 8 December 2006 (UTC)

Koombana
Do me a favour, and have a look at the two photos. Are they of the same ship? The sources imply they are but I'm unsure. &mdash;Moondyne 09:19, 8 December 2006 (UTC)


 * You've lost me. Which list? &mdash;Moondyne 14:11, 8 December 2006 (UTC)


 * yeah it did look a bit odd. I moved it to talk.  I'd love to see those pics.   Also, a press cutting of the sinking - any ideas? &mdash;Moondyne 14:18, 8 December 2006 (UTC)
 * It'd have to be next wednesday I think - I could get to Battye then - unlikely before then - the troops are on holiday and dads taxi service is at full rate SatuSuro 14:21, 8 December 2006 (UTC)


 * That'd be fantastic. &mdash;Moondyne 14:50, 8 December 2006 (UTC)

WPAMH
No worries; when it comes to me sticking my beak in, you usually don't need to invite me twice. This project has just achieved the amazing feat of getting me to do something unrelated to Banksia. Hesperian 13:58, 8 December 2006 (UTC)

Category
I think the correct nomenclature would be Category:Maritime history of Australia, as a sub-category Category:History of Australia &mdash;Moondyne 14:55, 8 December 2006 (UTC)
 * sound like a plan, I suggest that a D9 and dynamite might useful tools while gardening. Gnangarra 02:15, 9 December 2006 (UTC)

Decommissioned lighthouses
Include them. Arthur Head is there, and it has been demolished; Point Cloates Light is heritage listed ruins, yet is still a gazetted lighthouse! Hesperian 07:04, 9 December 2006 (UTC)
 * That makes sense; I'll kill off the Old York Road links. You don't need to be an admin to move pages. Simply click on the move tab up top. Hesperian 10:33, 9 December 2006 (UTC)
 * Thanks, but I'm not happy with it. It needs a lot of TLC, but I can't be bothered taking it any further.
 * Yes. I'm sure we can think of heaps of info about lighthouses that we can't put in a list.
 * Hesperian 12:33, 9 December 2006 (UTC)
 * Sure, why not! But why constrain it to convict-era? I would just call it "Historic sites". Hesperian 12:38, 9 December 2006 (UTC)

Girl's schools
I had noticed the same thing. Perhaps the boys are more IT literate. I dunno. See List of schools in Western Australia. MLC is probably the only one thats passable, and only just. Scotch, Trinity, Aquinas, Wesley and Hale have all come up very well IMO. &mdash;Moondyne 13:49, 9 December 2006 (UTC)
 * I could say something about liontaming herds of teenage female editors, but better not! (number one son has several of the species over here tonight for a party - I'm keeping low) &mdash;Moondyne 13:58, 9 December 2006 (UTC)