User talk:Jayy008/Archive 3

Hey
Hey Jay, sorry didn't respond to your messages, Iv'e had a break from Wikipedia. I'm back so anything you need, just let me know....=D-- Peter Griffin  &bull;  Talk   13:07, 1 April 2010 (UTC)


 * Hey Jay, I have added sources to most of the certs on the page. Most of them link directly to the section and page, however like the BPI and RIAA sites, some don't let you link the searches as well only to the main home page.-- Peter Griffin  &bull;  Talk   01:19, 2 April 2010 (UTC)


 * Yup, well I'm pretty sure I can do it, i just haven't really got around to it..lol..Thanks allot though!:D-- Peter Griffin  &bull;  Talk   21:50, 2 April 2010 (UTC)


 * Sounds good! I'm sure you'll be pleased with her singles discography, I placed most of them and I can proudly say all the ones I placed or looked at are correct....:)...I'll also be adding more soon from a few book sources Max blurted out. Thing is those books are the only place we can find concrete New Zealand, Belgium, or Australia prior to 97 sources. So that's my next project....:D-- Peter Griffin   &bull;  Talk   22:02, 2 April 2010 (UTC)


 * Sure thing!XD-- Peter Griffin  &bull;  Talk   22:16, 2 April 2010 (UTC)

RE: Billboard Summary
Hi Jay. How are you? Right ok we've agreed on which charts are components and which are. They are show in the flow and condition tables. One of the two tables will be implemented. I'm going to add to WP:record charts. With regards to chart names.... we're going with the proposal of adding US to the front of every chart and renaming to how they're shown on billboard.com as opposed to they're current names (taken from .biz) so the Hot R&B/Hip-Hop Songs becomes US R&B/Hip-Hop Songs (chart), Hot Country Songs becomes US Country Songs (chart) and Hot 100 becomes US Hot 100 (chart). There is still several opposing opinions to it. but hopefully we can resolve it.Lil-unique1 (talk) 17:18, 1 April 2010 (UTC)


 * It would have been for disambiguation purposes. So although the country chart is called US Country Songs (chart)|US Country Songs but i've just realised i've shot myself in the foot. I've argued that in the past that AllMusic is a better source for US charts rather than billboard. But all music lists the charts as they appear on .biz so it looks like the argument is going to fall flat on its feet. :( Lil-unique1 (talk) 17:32, 1 April 2010 (UTC)
 * hmmm well i dont think we're gonna have to worry about it anymore. i think because of the Allmusic revelation we're going to have leave the charts as they are. Lil-unique1 (talk) 17:39, 1 April 2010 (UTC)
 * No the table will go ahead. just the renaming of the charts will be discarded. which do you prefer? the first one (conditions)? or the second one (with steps/flows)? Lil-unique1 (talk) 17:43, 1 April 2010 (UTC)
 * To be honest im in favour of the conditions and applicable. But the user who created the flows said he didnt mind and told me to add whichever i preferred so really its down us really since we supported the idea. over the next couple of weeks im gonna work on a single Billboard Genre Charts Page. *sighs*Lil-unique1 (talk) 17:51, 1 April 2010 (UTC)

Only one issue left now... where to put the chart table? there is no room at Billboard charts, Billboard (magazine) or WP:record charts. Lil-unique1 (talk) 18:09, 1 April 2010 (UTC)

New Billboard chart policy
As per consensus at WP:record charts there is a new guide to using Billboard Charts available at Billboard charts guide. Mainstream Top 40 (Pop Songs (formerly known just as Pop Songs) is no longer deemed a component chart - there is no evidence to support this motion. Lil-unique1 (talk) 19:27, 1 April 2010 (UTC)
 * We get to use Pop Songs now!!!!! :)) Candyo32 (talk) 22:55, 1 April 2010 (UTC)
 * Thank you very much. i couldnt have done it without all your help. by the way the policy has been moved to WP:record charts/Billboard charts guide and can also be accessed at shortcut WP:USCHART. im so proud of it. Lil-unique1 (talk) 23:19, 1 April 2010 (UTC)
 * I've been trying to campaign for it forever. Now hopefully, Rhythmic Top 40 can be approved so there will be one for each genre. Candyo32 (talk) 23:31, 1 April 2010 (UTC)
 * Nevertheless its only with community support that we can get things achieved. Everyone made a valid contribution and im so proud to be able to say we've influenced positive change. how we've managed without a proper consensus or guide for billboard i do not know. if anyone comes up with any tips for billboard or any important information etc. please add to the guide.Lil-unique1 (talk) 23:35, 1 April 2010 (UTC)


 * Yup. Next thing is im going to try and do a page for genre charts. Also i've added some guidance about sourcing billboard charts to WP:USCHART. phew! its hard work policy change. i'm glad some of the name changes went through. now back to general editing eh? have you any interesting or nagging/general developments? Lil-unique1 (talk) 23:51, 1 April 2010 (UTC)
 * I wasn't even aware of their existance.Lil-unique1 (talk) 23:58, 1 April 2010 (UTC)

May reply
There is actually a strong case of keeping Mainstream Top 40 (Pop Songs). Mainly because we've agreed that it is exempt from the components rule because it a genre chart. Displaying it like this helps new editors understand its the approved pop genre chart. The others e.g. the r&b chart is called R&B/Hip-Hop Songs and so its clear what each chart shows. (does that make sense?) Lil-unique1 (talk) 14:31, 1 May 2010 (UTC)

Charts
Hey I didn't the idea... but the in the consensus people stated that charts should be exactly how they're named in the print edition. it is referred to simply as Adult Contemporary. Billboard doesn't form part of the chart name, it's simple the provider. Lil-unique1 (talk) 23:14, 2 April 2010 (UTC)

GOODCHARTS
It's a transclude of WP:Record charts/sourcing guide. I thought about making it easier to figure out, but decided that one of the reasons it gets vandalized so rarely is that vandals can't figure out how to edit it.&mdash;Kww(talk) 20:33, 3 April 2010 (UTC)

90210 (season 2) and WP:COPYVIOs
Regarding your comments on my talk page for reverting copyright violations at 90210 (season 2). I have taken up your challenge ("if you can find a source that says the descriptions I wrote exactly as I wrote them"). Although I am not about to go through each summary for you on your talk page, I have randomly chosen one. This is for Episode #12, "Winter Wonderland". What I have done is listed your sentence, followed by the sentence at CWTV.com. I then bolded in your sentence the words which match CWTV.com.

Your words: Navid is convinced Jasper pushed him down the stairs and turns to Adrianna to help reveal the information, but she is reluctant.

CWTV.com: Navid (Michael Steger) is convinced Jasper (guest star Zach Sherman) pushed him down the stairs and turns to Adrianna (Jessica Lowndes) to help reveal the information.

Your words: Naomi and Silver decide to spend Christmas break in St. Barts, but they first make an appearance at the beach club for the winter dance.

CWTV.com: Naomi (AnnaLynne McCord) and Silver (Jessica Stroup) decide to spend Christmas break in St. Barts but first make an appearance at the beach club for the winter dance.

Your words: Teddy reveals his feelings for Silver, causing Dixon to be jealous, while Naomi and Liam attempt to forgive each other for what happened with Jen.

CWTV.com: Teddy (Trevor Donovan) reveals his feelings for Silver, causing Dixon (Tristan Wilds) to be jealous, while Naomi and Liam (Matt Lanter) attempt to forgive each other for what happened with Jen (Sara Foster, who does not appear in the episode).

Your words: Also, Debbie attempts to spend some quality time with Dixon by taking him miniature golfing.

CWTV.com: Debbie (Lori Loughlin) attempts to spend some quality time with Dixon by taking him to the arcade.

Your words: Annie attends the dance with Jasper where she is later '''confronted by her friends about Jasper’s drug dealing. But when Annie confronts Jasper about the news, he reveals his suspicions about her involvement in the hit and run.'''

CWTV.com: Annie (Shenae Grimes) is confronted by her friends about Jasper's drug dealing but when she confronts him about the news he reveals his suspicions about her involvement in the hit and run.

As you say "I watched the episodes and wrote the best bits in my own words". I find it hard to believe that you came up with the identical sentence structure on your own. --Logical Fuzz (talk) 03:20, 4 April 2010 (UTC)

Darn it, wouldn't you know I'd chose a summary that wasn't in that reversion. My apologies about that. I'll be back.--Logical Fuzz (talk) 03:44, 4 April 2010 (UTC)

Sorry about that. I'll start over:

Episode #15: “What’s Past is Prologue”
Your words: Silver and Teddy go on their first official date but Silver finds it difficult to deal with Teddy's past and asks for Naomi's help.

CWTV.com: Silver (Jessica Stroup) and Teddy (Trevor Donovan) go on their first official date but Silver finds it difficult to deal with Teddy's playboy past and enlists Naomi's (AnnaLynne McCord) help to track his whereabouts

Your words: Dixon's birthmother tries to develop a relationship with her son.

CWTV.com: Dixon's (Tristan Wilds) birthmother, Dana (guest star April Parker Jones, "Jericho") drops by for a surprise visit and tries to develop a relationship with her son.

Your words: Navid returns from his suspension and finds out that Naomi has started a gossip segment during Blaze News, which he adamantly opposes and stops.

CWTV.com: Navid (Michael Steger) returns from his suspension to find that Naomi has started a gossip segment during Blaze News, which he adamantly opposes.

Your words: Annie realizes that Jasper has started following her around town.

CWTV.com: Annie (Shenae Grimes) realizes that Jasper (Zach Sherman) has started following her around town.

Your words: Debbie confides in Kai, her yoga instructor, about the arrival of Dixon's birthmother.

CWTV.com: Debbie (Lori Loughlin) confides in Kai (guest star Greg Vaughan, "General Hospital"), her yoga instructor, about the arrival of Dixon's birthmother.

Sorry again for the mix-up with my original example. --Logical Fuzz (talk) 03:59, 4 April 2010 (UTC)

Episode: “A Trip to the Moon”
Your words: With Teddy's, Jackie surprises Silver with a half-birthday celebration that takes her back to her childhood birthday parties.

CWTV.com: With the help of Teddy (guest star Trevor Donovan), Jackie (guest star Ann Gillespie) surprises Silver (Jessica Stroup) with a half-birthday celebration that takes her back to her childhood birthday parties.

Your words: Navid witnesses Adrianna buying drugs from Jasper, forcing Navid to confront him about being a drug dealer.

CWTV.com: Navid (Michael Steger) witnesses Adrianna (Jessica Lowndes) buying drugs from Jasper (guest star Zach Sherman), forcing Navid to confront him about being a drug dealer.

Your words: Dixon is determined to confront Sasha about her miscarriage which forces his parents to reveal that Sasha lied about being pregnant.

CWTV.com: Dixon (Tristan Wilds) is determined to confront Sasha (Mekia Cox, who does not appear in the episode) about her miscarriage, forcing Debbie (Lori Loughlin) and Harry (Rob Estes) to reveal that Sasha lied about being pregnant.

Your words: Annie and Jasper profess / take their relationship to the next level.

CWTV.com: Annie (Shenae Grimes) and Jasper profess their love for each other and decide to take their relationship to the next level.

Your words: Liam, with the help of Dixon, Teddy and Ivy, devises a plan seek revenge on Jen.

CWTV.com: After getting into a fight on the beach, Liam (Matt Lanter), with the help of Dixon (Tristan Wilds), Teddy and Ivy (Gillian Zinser), devises a plan seek revenge on Jen (Sara Foster, who does not appear in the episode).

Episode: “Rats and Heroes”
Your words: Naomi returns from her vacation in St. Bart’s excited to spend time with Liam.

CWTV.com: Naomi (AnnaLynne McCord) returns from her vacation in St. Bart's excited to spend time with Liam (Matt Lanter), which leads to the two getting up close and personal in his newly built boat.

Your words: Adrianna and Gia bond during an AA meeting and establish a support system for each other which leads to the two sharing a kiss at the Beach Club.

CWTV.com: Adrianna (Jessica Lowndes) and Gia (Rumer Willis) bond during an AA meeting and establish a support system for each other which leads to the two sharing a kiss at the Beach Club.

Your words: Navid and Dixon devise a plan to stop Jasper seeing Annie, but never expected the outcome of a school drug search.

CWTV.com: Navid (Michael Steger) and Dixon (Tristan Wilds) devise a plan to eliminate Jasper (Zach Sherman) from Annie's (Shenae Grimes) life, but never anticipate the outcome of a school drug search.

Your words: Dixon attempts to get back with with Silver, while Silver hides her true feelings for Teddy.

CWTV.com: Dixon attempts to rekindle his relationship with Silver (Jessica Stroup), while Silver hides her true feelings for Teddy (Trevor Donovan).

--Logical Fuzz (talk) 04:27, 4 April 2010 (UTC)

TB, of a sort
Hi. I've run part of it through my mechanical detector and found a few issues. I've left details at my talk page. It would be best if I could review the rest after you've had another go, just to give it best odds of going back into mainspace. --Moonriddengirl (talk) 01:22, 5 April 2010 (UTC)

I'm puzzled
Hey Jayy, I'm puzzled by your edit summary at Telephone (song) article "Removed 'Billboard' from chart names. Record Charts consensus names should be specific, billboard is only the provider." But you left it saying 'Billboard Hot 100'? So you didn't remove them all. But then check the example tables at WP:CHARTS shows "Billboard"! Like this US Billboard Hot 100

US Billboard Hot Dance Club Songs

US Billboard Hot R&B/Hip Hop Songs—Iknow23 (talk) 02:34, 5 April 2010 (UTC)


 * Thanks, I left a query for Lil-unique1 about it.—Iknow23 (talk) 15:52, 5 April 2010 (UTC)
 * You can addin billboard back to the front of charts.Lil-unique1 (talk) 15:26, 6 April 2010 (UTC)

R&B Chart
I was thinking of keep my own archive of the R&B singles and R&B urban chart on my username homepage that way it will be available when required. Do you think its a good idea? Yeah it seemed a shame because 16 weeks at number 1 is a significant achievement. Lil-unique1 (talk) 18:10, 5 April 2010 (UTC)


 * That's what i mean. I'm gonna use WebCite to archive the page for albums and singles everyweek and keep a log of the citations on my user space. Lil-unique1 (talk) 18:20, 5 April 2010 (UTC)
 * This is what i meant.Lil-unique1 (talk) 18:26, 5 April 2010 (UTC)
 * I'll try and do it every monday. then at least we have something to work from. :) Lil-unique1 (talk) 18:34, 5 April 2010 (UTC)
 * That's sad! Now it's too late to archive when Baby was #2! Oops nevermind, I see that it says "down 2" which indicates it was #2. LoL! Candyo32 (talk) 23:19, 6 April 2010 (UTC)

UK chart / Angels Cry
Lil-unique1 (talk) 14:50, 13 April 2010 (UTC)
 * yeah but it says last week's position as above 75 that's why i placed it in the article.Lil-unique1 (talk) 18:41, 13 April 2010 (UTC)


 * Apologies. This version of the page shows that last week the song is 42 and this week its 28. When i try to access the regular singles archive for 2010 it immediately jumps to Rock/Metal Songs for some reason.Lil-unique1 (talk) 18:55, 13 April 2010 (UTC)
 * Again sorry for confusing you. What i mean was that i had managed to get it up on the website. It appeared to have charted in top 100 citing a position above 100 for the previous week. But now it wont let me access the uk top 100 singles archive. it just keeps jumping me to the metal/rock songs archive. Its my fault i should have started a new post. Lil-unique1 (talk) 22:54, 13 April 2010 (UTC)

April 2010
Welcome to Wikipedia. Everyone is welcome to contribute constructively to Wikipedia. However, please know that editors do not own articles and should respect the work of their fellow contributors. If you create or edit an article, know that others are free to change its content. Take a look at the welcome page to learn more about contributing to this encyclopedia. --Logical Fuzz (talk) 14:44, 6 April 2010 (UTC)

Memoirs
Hey Jay, just wondering what's your take on Mariah Daily Journal? that last piece of information you removed from Memoirs was sourced for MDJ. Then some user removed the source and replaced it with a fact tag which then an IP removed. Lil-unique1 (talk) 22:20, 6 April 2010 (UTC)


 * anniversary editioN? Lil-unique1 (talk) 23:12, 6 April 2010 (UTC)
 * Sorry i've only just realised what was written in the paragraph. the latter bit was completely fabricated. i've restored the portion of the paragraph which is sourced and added the MDJ source. sorry for the confusion.Lil-unique1 (talk) 23:20, 6 April 2010 (UTC)
 * Yup agreed. the first bit about singles still being released i've re-added and i've found the part of MDJ that confirms it so i've added back in. On a side note i'm slightly puzzled about "Nothin But Love". i know we dont say radio1.gr is credible source but usually the date it lists is for a cd release and likewise for digitalspy. however none of the shops online or physical appear to be selling it as a single (download or cd)? also larry jackson (A&R for J Records) said on twitter "Don't forget whitney's new single "Nothin But Love" out April 5".... Lil-unique1 (talk) 23:38, 6 April 2010 (UTC)

Re: UK Chart Achive
Thanks for the heads up. So i'm right in thinking that the page archive's an artist's UK chart history on the official top 75 of the uk singles? but still no archive of R&B chart :( Lil-unique1 (talk) 15:40, 7 April 2010 (UTC)


 * Sorry i've just realised that. Its so cool!!!!! :D just as a precaution i'm going to keep manually archiving the R&B chart from the BBC radio 1 website just for a month or so until we know the source is stable and the site is here to stay. :) Lil-unique1 (talk) 15:46, 7 April 2010 (UTC)

Re: Kelly Taylor
Hi. With regard to this, I altered it for a couple of reasons. Firstly, it appeared to have included a comma splice (referring to the title of the episode followed by "it is currently unknown. . ."). Secondly, per WP:V, it's best to avoid reporting things such as her being "mentioned in an episode" without an actual source. Doing so can encourage original research. Overall, it's good enough to simply state that it's unknown whether she'll be seen again. The article can be updated accordingly (with a source) when the season ends. Thanks. -- James26 (talk) 21:42, 7 April 2010 (UTC)

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Memoirs
I saw that too and wondered why the jump. However from what I know no live performances have been done on the U.S or the world. I haven't even heard an announcement of it either. I agree that it's a weird thing, but I really am puzzled.-- Peter Griffin  &bull;  Talk   17:55, 8 April 2010 (UTC)

Raymond somethingoranother Raymond
Hung Median and Billboard list it as "Raymond v Raymond". My understanding is that both databases are derived from the titles issued by the label.&mdash;Kww(talk) 18:58, 8 April 2010 (UTC)

Mariah Carey albums
hey, the ask billboard sources states merry christmas sold 4,993,000 in the US, thats the only source that was there and it still is. but thanks for clarifying about the official site. but i know about the certifications :) Mister sparky (talk) 22:10, 8 April 2010 (UTC)
 * the yahoo source has already been added back lol Mister sparky (talk) 00:10, 9 April 2010 (UTC)


 * Yes I Re-added the Yahoo source, I dug through the Merry Christmas page and dug it up....:)-- Peter Griffin  &bull;  Talk   03:23, 9 April 2010 (UTC)

Archiving
Hey Jamie...:)...I'm having difficulty archiving my page, I find it complicated...lol...Can I follow up on your offer for you to do it for me? The way you did it looks cool, with the little archiving box on the top of the talk page. If you can thanks, I appreciate it...:DDDD.-- Peter Griffin  &bull;  Talk   01:38, 12 April 2010 (UTC)


 * Also in case your wondering, I'd like the whole thing to be archived, everything since Iv'e started.-- Peter Griffin  &bull;  Talk   01:41, 12 April 2010 (UTC)


 * Thanks allot!!!It looks really nice...:)...hmmm, about the cover, the thing is we only have one official "Angels Cry" cover, so 'm not sure how we would be able to add any other.-- Peter Griffin  &bull;  Talk   19:09, 12 April 2010 (UTC)


 * You got me there Jamie, I'm not really sure, what do you think? Peter Griffin  &bull;  Talk   00:35, 13 April 2010 (UTC)

FA Status
Hi Jay how you doing? I was looking at the status of I Look to You and Memoirs and thinking maybe both of these could be good FA articles no? In the next few days im going to completely copyedit Memoirs and nominate that one first. Would you support this? Lil-unique1 (talk) 12:07, 12 April 2010 (UTC)

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Mariah Carey singles certifications
Hey Jamie, Iv'e been toiling over this problem. I'm trying to find books to source Australian certs prior to 1997 ans well as New Zealand. If you look here and here you'll see MariahDaily has listed the certs for what I'm looking for, however I need tofind the sources they used or others that are deemed reliable enough for certs.-- Peter Griffin  &bull;  Talk   22:28, 14 April 2010 (UTC)


 * I agree, MDJ has proven to be reliable and give the facts. Iv'e never caught them claiming something that wasn't true. And it all makes sense too. I don't know what to do....:(-- Peter Griffin  &bull;  Talk   23:11, 14 April 2010 (UTC)


 * I agree, I'll do that and explain the situation. I agree while Kww is always very helpful and responsive, he isn't an Admin (Yet!...:)) so I'll bring it up with Eric.-- Peter Griffin  &bull;  Talk   23:14, 14 April 2010 (UTC)


 * Hey Jamie, It's done. Iv'e already notified and explained to him our dilemma. Please comment below so he can reason knowing what the editors believe. Also notify Unique, so he cana s well. If you happen to think I missed anything out while explaining it to him, please feel free to add anything you'd like in your comment explaining it to him...:D-- Peter Griffin  &bull;  Talk   23:26, 14 April 2010 (UTC)
 * Excuse me, please, for butting in here, but why do you care about who's an admin? Kevin's not one yet, but if you think his opinion is more valuable or relevant, why not ask him? In fact, even if you feel compelled to ask Eric (for whatever reason), why not ask Kevin anyway? (Watching this page for any reply you care to give) &mdash; JohnFromPinckney (talk) 00:41, 15 April 2010 (UTC)
 * Jamie, thanks for your response. First of all, I'm sorry you thought I was rude; I certainly didn't mean to be. I'm just trying to find out what a user's adminship does for you. Unfortunately, I still don't get it. (Of course, it's late here, and I'm not getting any smarter in my old age.)
 * Now that I realize that MDJ is a fansite (and not a site from a magazine or periodical), I — still don't see the advantage. Can't anybody help you decide whether a source is usable, whether they've got admin powers or not? Sure, you want anybody with experience, and not just, say, me, but Kevin's that kind of guy, too, just like Eric. Admins don't decide what may be used as a reference (we all do that, together), they decide who gets blocked or unblocked and for how long and which pages get what protection.
 * If you see what I mean, now. Sincerely (and, I hope, not rudely), &mdash; JohnFromPinckney (talk) 01:42, 15 April 2010 (UTC)
 * Jamie, you wrote: "Yes I see what you mean, but it's not a decision, all we want to know is if it's possible, and an Admin can tell us."
 * Sure, most admins can tell you. So can non-admins. I'm a non-admin, and I'll tell you right now: it's possible. There! Of course, you should also discuss it with others in the WP community, but don't do it just with admins, they're not special for that reason. They're not decision-makers on reference acceptibility.
 * You also said, "...Because the rule is fansites aren't credible, but I want to know if there's even a point of bringing it up for discussion." You didn't say where that "rule" is, but possibly you meant the basic thrust of the WP:RS page. I don't see how some single user is going to be able to tell you whether to have or not have the discussion there at Wikipedia talk:Identifying reliable sources, enlightened in some magical, borderline mystical way due purely to possession of the admin bit. What Eric is going to have to go on when he gets his robe on and sits on the bench to tell you yea or nay is the evidence you present about how MDJ, fansite though it is, hasn't gone astray yet. But that's the same evidence that could be presented to the poor non-admin slobs who make up the bulk of the community, and it should be presented to them, because Eric (or any other admin) isn't the boss.
 * I hope I'm not coming across as too shrill here. I'm just trying to point out the admin/diety boundary you seem to be missing. Best regards, &mdash; JohnFromPinckney (talk) 02:23, 15 April 2010 (UTC)


 * When you put it that way John, it makes sense. Wikipedia isn't a classroom where students ask a teacher for permission, it's a community of editors who make rules and decisions together. I agree, however some editors Iv'e dealt with are stubborn and will not take that as an answer, which is why the word of an Admin is helpful, though I personally don't deem it necessary. Now in terms of knowledge, I can tell you Kevin probably has some of the most extensive knowledge and judgement on Wikipedia. He's never made a biased decision, and has always acted truthfully and good faith, and doesn't do things secretly. These are traits even most Admins DON'T have. Iv'e seen Admins do foolish things, things that could have costed them their position. This is why I always go to Kevin and will continue, I just would also appreciate the input of an Admin, not for the advice, but just for skin deep, to be able to say and Admin approved, for the more stubborn editors.-- Peter Griffin  &bull;  Talk   03:21, 15 April 2010 (UTC)

First, John is 100% right: the admin bit doesn't provide any special approval powers. Eric can't give you any more official of an opinion than anyone else. The only reason that Eric's opinion has weight is his experience, not his adminship.

As for treating this fansite as a reliable source: ouch. It's hard to see how it could ever be considered to meet the guidelines at WP:RS. Still, if you want to try, the key phrase has always been "... with a reputation for fact-checking and accuracy." To make your case, what you need to find is people that have used mariahjournal.com as a source. For example, Rap-Up is generally considered a reliable source (published magazine, editorial control, etc.), and this Rap-Up article quotes mariahjournal.com. This search is a great place to start for other references. Build your case, showing how mariahjournal.com is relied upon by people that everyone treats as reliable. Take it to WP:RSN, because that is the normal method for getting community input. With a good case and consensus at WP:RSN, there shouldn't be any problems. Don't get too discouraged by my initial pessimism. There was more reliance on it by news sources than I expected, so you may be able to build a good case looking over websites that link to it.&mdash;Kww(talk) 04:01, 15 April 2010 (UTC)


 * Hey Kevin, I already started looking for other sources that quote MDJ, and am finding some. Since I'm not so familiar to the whole building a case idea, I would appreciate if we could do it this way. Before we go and present it there, I'd like to have a very solid case if possible, so I'd like to build it on Jamie's or my talk page and have you look it over and tell us what we are missing or whats good. I'll let you know so you can review it step by step to make sure we have a good case. Thanks!-- Peter Griffin  &bull;  Talk   04:18, 15 April 2010 (UTC)


 * Iv'e so far found these 2 sources that quote MDJ, this and this sources seem pretty reliable, what do you think?-- Peter Griffin  &bull;  Talk   04:31, 15 April 2010 (UTC)
 * That's the right track, but it would be better to find more. That's basically one story that got legs and quoted in numerous places. There's 16,200 references to the site according to Google: I hope there's a few more good references. If you build a list, I'll help writing a persuasive argument for treating it as reliable.&mdash;Kww(talk) 05:57, 15 April 2010 (UTC)


 * Fine, I didn't know that Admin's couldn't make those decisions. However, if me and other editors choose to ask an Admin for advice, it's actually nothing to do with anyone else, who thinks they know better (JohnFromPinckney), I always go to EricOrbit for advice needed on issues, so why does anyone care. But still, thanks for all your help Kevin. Jayy008 (talk) 09:16, 15 April 2010 (UTC)
 * First of all, I've seen and do appreciate your new note at the top of your page. I knew I was interjecting myself into a discussion I wasn't involved in, which is why I asked to be excused for butting in. Maybe that's what you meant by "rude" in your first reply to me? This'll be my last intrusion here.
 * I'd like to close of my self-invited involvement here by denying that I think I know better. I asked my original question in the first place because I didn't get what an admin had to do special in the case you were discussing. After over a year here I still find things about WP that I don't understand, and I thought this might be one of them. There was recently something about a records table (or something; BADCHARTS?) that one user couldn't edit but which another user (Kww?) could. I never did figure that one out.
 * And I don't mean you shouldn't go to EricOrbit for advice. You should! I mean, if you want to. Kevin himself advised me to do just that a few weeks ago. I didn't mean you ought never ask an admin or an experienced non-admin user for help; I was just wondering why you had to have an admin.
 * I won't jump in on your Talk page anymore. I respect your preferences on that and I wish you happy editing (and good luck with the MDJ-sourcing thing). &mdash; JohnFromPinckney (talk) 10:25, 15 April 2010 (UTC)


 * Well I have found quite a few more sources that mention and quote MDJ as a reliable and reputable source.

Here they are. One, Two, Three, Four, Five, Six, Seven, (they are including the first 2 I presented).-- Peter Griffin  &bull;  Talk   17:00, 15 April 2010 (UTC)
 * MTV, VH1 and Rap-Up are all clearly reliable. A few more references from those three would help a lot. Next, let me understand exactly what you are trying to source: you want to use this site to source certifications that occurred before the start date of some of the certification archives?&mdash;Kww(talk) 22:49, 15 April 2010 (UTC)


 * Certifications, sales, factual information and charts that require Biz. Jayy008 (talk) 00:07, 16 April 2010 (UTC)


 * Basically I don't think it should be used when we have official sources present. However in this case such as Australia prior to 1997 and New Zealand and maybe a few more, we really have no way to source them. I have gone to Max for help, but he told me everything he knows and does not have the books in his possession. I have also searched for them for a while in various libraries, and have not been successful. So I would like to use it for Certifications on those cases, and well as those type of sale related problems in the future. I have specific examples listed in the top portion of the article.-- Peter Griffin  &bull;  Talk   06:32, 16 April 2010 (UTC)


 * I also found this BET source here.-- Peter Griffin  &bull;  Talk   07:16, 16 April 2010 (UTC)
 * Still that same story, but a good source.&mdash;Kww(talk) 14:45, 16 April 2010 (UTC)

As for where I am on this issue, I'm uncomfortable on going to RSN and asking for as wide of use as Jayy008 indicates. Asking for a consensus to use this site for specific applications, like "Australian Certifications prior to 1997" seems reasonable, and I could support that.&mdash;Kww(talk) 14:45, 16 April 2010 (UTC)


 * Well to be exact, at this moment I would like to use it on Australia prior to 1997 & New Zealand certifications, because New Zealand certs don't show up in the home page or in any official site. Being that we have this, I'm all ears Kevin, whats the next step? I mean we have a Yes from Myself, Jamie, Unique & and it sounds like you possibly as well. so what else do we do with this?-- Peter Griffin  &bull;  Talk   18:38, 16 April 2010 (UTC)


 * Give me a couple of days, and I'll get something posted on RSN, and leave a pointer to it here.&mdash;Kww(talk) 22:02, 16 April 2010 (UTC)


 * Sounds good, Thanks!-- Peter Griffin  &bull;  Talk   22:36, 16 April 2010 (UTC)


 * I know it was broad, but I feel bad going to EricOrbit for every single thing on .Biz, the chart positions and sales MDJ lists are only available on .Biz. Jayy008 (talk) 19:39, 17 April 2010 (UTC)

I've been trying to get this done, and keep not being able to. The main reason is that I just can't quite make myself believe in it, and if I don't believe in it, it's hard to write something convincing. Certifications from even obviously reliable sources get removed every day because they aren't listed at the official certifying agency. We don't treat any other fansite as reliable for anything, but here I am trying to convince people that we should allow certifications from this fansite. Why is this issue important enough to make such a major exception for? What's the harm in leaving New Zealand certifications off, the same way we don't list most Latin American chart positions?

On the Billboard chart side, I have a really bad feeling about using them. It seems to me that MDJ is reproducing material that it isn't licensed to print. Is there any indication that they are licensed to reproduce Billboard charts?&mdash;Kww(talk) 19:14, 20 April 2010 (UTC)


 * I don't know what to say Kevin. I'm not sure what to do, I mean this fansite has been around for 12 years and as I have proven has been quoted by many reliable sources. Don't even take it from me, I mean Jay and Unique, who are familiar with the site also agree with me and believe it to be reliable. If you don't feel comfortable with it or don't approve, I don't feel comfortable trying anyway. I'll agree to it only if you approve. If you need any other info on it let me know.-- Peter Griffin   &bull;  Talk   19:20, 20 April 2010 (UTC)

My World 2.0
I don't understand how the information about the album selling more than it did in its first week, and becoming the first act to do so since the Beatles is confusing. Also just to let you know the removal of the info left a broken sentence in the section. Candyo32 (talk) 19:47, 17 April 2010 (UTC)
 * OOPS! Never mind now I see what happened. I was confused haha. Sorry for the misconception!! Candyo32 (talk) 19:49, 17 April 2010 (UTC)
 * Well thanks for contributing to the articles! Good to know I'm not alone on them besides the obsessive fans and constant blatant vandalizers. Candyo32 (talk) 19:52, 17 April 2010 (UTC)
 * That is my biggest pet peeve! Fans coming on here and thinking they know everything and try to rule the articles. And so many people out there don't like Justin Bieber, with the his articles that aren't protected, its like a constant check for vandalism all the time! And sometimes the protected ones are even worse! Candyo32 (talk) 20:00, 17 April 2010 (UTC)

RE: Templates
Hi Jay. Hope your ok? Had a good weekend? I've added the template and its variation to your user page for you. :) Lil-unique1 (talk) 21:56, 17 April 2010 (UTC)
 * Hey no problem. Yeah i had a good weekend thanks. I went home from uni to see some m8s and had a good laugh. i'm feeling tired but i just found out my 9am is cancelled tomo so i can spend more time on wiki.... LOL (sarcastic smile).Lil-unique1 (talk) 16:01, 18 April 2010 (UTC)
 * Hey i'm in nottingham lol. i got to see her going in the arena (i live near-by). people didnt seem to impressed when they came out though... :(. have you been watching them on youtube?Lil-unique1 (talk) 16:07, 18 April 2010 (UTC)
 * Was it the AMAs where she performed "I Didnt Know My Own Strength"? (that was good)! Also her performance of "For the Lovers" on the Australian leg of the tour was really good too!.Lil-unique1 (talk) 16:11, 18 April 2010 (UTC)
 * Haha yeah i do. I used to be a big Waterlood Rd fan... i like eastenders and neighbours. wbu?Lil-unique1 (talk) 16:26, 18 April 2010 (UTC)
 * Yeah same. They look really good but i never get chance to watch. I either watch tv 24/7 or never at all lol. Lil-unique1 (talk) 16:52, 18 April 2010 (UTC)

Hello buddy
Hi Jamie, I apologize for not replying to your posts at my talk page. I have been on a hiatus due to health reasons and did not edit at all. Hope you did not mind. --Legolas ( talk 2 me ) 13:02, 19 April 2010 (UTC)

Airplay, Billboard & Digital Charts review
Hello, i was wondering if you could give your opinion of the following as part of the final review process for WP:USCHARTS before it is fully promoted to policy. |A.B.D Discussion. Thanks. Lil-unique1 (talk) 21:07, 19 April 2010 (UTC)
 * Oops, I don't know why I keep forgetting that the Single 100 is a component. Bare with me please. Lol! Sorry bout that. Candyo32 (talk) 22:04, 20 April 2010 (UTC)

Jennie Garth
Original Message : Hello, please don't make things up based on personal opinion as you did on 90210 (TV series). Just because Garth was in almost every episode doesn't make her part of the principle cast, or even reccurring. She was always credited as a special guest in every episode so I reverted your edit, please watch the series for proof if you so wish, if you make the edit again, it's likely you'll receive a vandalism warning. Jayy008 (talk) 16:15, 20 April 2010 (UTC)


 * HI, I apologize on my error in 90210 (TV series) I did not realize she has always been credited as a special guest.  I was trying to make the distinction that while the other original cast special guests were on for I would say at most 2 episodes, her character has been more reccuring.  I'm not sure if there is a way to make that distinction but if there is please let me know.  Also if you wouldn't mind, obviously I'm new to wikipedia and just learning the ropes, I would like your advice on something.  I'm currently writing a new page for a political candidate and there are not many sources that I can find besides his main webpage.  If the information on his early life is basically the same as he has on his website but I have gotten his permission to put it up is that ok since its basically just facts about where he went to college and where he grew up and I cited the website? I replied on my own page too before I realized your page said to reply here.  Thanks--Chrismarie118 (talk) 18:32, 23 April 2010 (UTC)
 * Thanks you for the clarification. I just moved the page to the mainspace so if you would like to take a look I would appreciate it. Thanks you can find it here  Ken Miller  I'm always on the hunt for more media coverage to use as external links and more citation, any suggestions would be great. Thanks again--Chrismarie118 (talk) 22:17, 23 April 2010 (UTC)

Rokstarr
It was an unclosed "small" tag in the preceding section.&mdash;Kww(talk) 21:23, 24 April 2010 (UTC)

Re: Whitney
Omg! i totally forgot. Wow i actually want to see her now but not so sure i could afford like £55 lol and i didnt have no one to go with. :( Anywayz yes review please.... :) Lil-unique1 (talk) 21:44, 25 April 2010 (UTC)


 * omg did you pay more than that? Yeah when she played in nottingham she had some tickets priced at £55 but most were £75 or £100. Alicia Keys was either £37.50 or £42.50 and leona lewis was £32.50 or £37.50Lil-unique1 (talk) 22:03, 25 April 2010 (UTC)


 * Wait did you see Whitney Houston Jamie? I want a review too!lol...How about you Unique, did you see Alicia Keys??-- Peter Griffin  &bull;  Talk   22:49, 25 April 2010 (UTC)

Cquote
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Template:Cquote

"NOTE: This template should not be used for block quotations in article text. For long quotations in the text, the Manual of Style recommends using the HTML element, such as through the use of the template." Fixer23 (talk) 23:22, 25 April 2010 (UTC)

Whitney Houston Concert
Hey Jamie, check this unfortunate article I found. It seems Whitney's London concert was torn to shreds by critics and fans alike. Were you at that show?-- Peter Griffin  &bull;  Talk   02:59, 27 April 2010 (UTC)

Hey Jamie thanks for the review. Sounds like a good concert on the whole. How did it compare to the one's you watched online? Hmmm... i have to agree it sounds good when she grows through "IDKMOS". I also love her husky vocals on "For the Lovers". As long as you had a good time thats the most important thing. Although media is reporting she walked off during "I Will Always Love You"? Lil-unique1 (talk) 23:55, 27 April 2010 (UTC)


 * Hey guys, thanks for the review Jamie, I guess she has her nights were she just doesn't have it. I used to be a huge fan, but after seeing her voice now and music, I really can't relate anymore. She is definitely one of the best though! MC, WH, CD....:)-- Peter Griffin  &bull;  Talk   17:39, 29 April 2010 (UTC)