User talk:Jclapham

Thank you for experimenting with Wikipedia. Your test worked, and it has been reverted or removed. Please use the sandbox for any other tests you may want to do. Take a look at the welcome page to learn more about contributing to our encyclopedia. A link to the edit I have reverted can be found here: link. If you believe this edit should not have been reverted, please contact me. Hu12 04:12, 27 November 2006 (UTC)

Hu12 - I dispute your decision to delete the page "ANZIIF". There is a similar page titled "FINSIA" who are an organisation much the same as us. As their page is fine, I copied EXACTLY their page and changed it where appropriate to ANZIIF. You then deleted our page but not theirs. Why? I also dispute that ANZIIF are a "non-notable group". ANZIIF has a 120+ year history as a professional organisation and has over 12,000 members in over 80 countries. Please explain why you keep deleting ANZIIF but not FINSIA. Jclapham 23:28, 28 November 2006 (UTC)

Please do not add nonsense to Wikipedia. It is considered vandalism. If you would like to experiment, use the sandbox. Thank you. A link to the edit I have reverted can be found here: link. If you believe this edit should not have been reverted, please contact me. Hu12 04:19, 27 November 2006 (UTC)

ANZIIF

 * You have recently re-created the article ANZIIF, which was deleted in accordance with Wikipedia's deletion policies. Please do not re-create the article. If you disagree with the article's deletion, you may ask for a deletion review. Danny Lilithborne 04:40, 27 November 2006 (UTC)

Hu12 - I dispute your decision to delete the page "ANZIIF". There is a similar page titled "FINSIA" who are an organisation much the same as us. As their page is fine, I copied EXACTLY their page and changed it where appropriate to ANZIIF. You then deleted our page but not theirs. Why?

I also dispute that ANZIIF are a "non-notable group". ANZIIF has a 120+ year history as a professional organisation and has over 12,000 members in over 80 countries.

Please explain why you keep deleting ANZIIF but not FINSIA. Jclapham 08:28, 29 November 2006 (UTC)

You have been temporarily blocked for violation of the three-revert rule. Please feel free to return after the block expires, but also please make an effort to discuss your changes further in the future. JoJan 15:29, 28 November 2006 (UTC)

Welcome to the hive!
Jclapham, I saw your exchange with Hu12. LegitimateAndEvenCompelling gave you some good insight as to why there my be inconsistency in the treatment of ANZIIF and FINSIA. The ants from our big anthill just hadn't sniffed the presence of FINSIA yet. Seriously, both critics and fans of the Wikipedia editing model sometimes use the phrase "hive mind" to describe the editing community.

Assaults on the hive
Some day when you have the time, you may want to take a 20 minute skim through several page lists of pages:
 * There are 3 levels of deletion; take a look at some of the current candidates to get a feel for what we're talking about; many are "vanity" articles that don't meet the conflict of interest and/or notability guidelines:
 * Speedy deletion ("CSD" or "Speedy"); see the list of spam pages at "Category:Spam pages for speedy deletion". These get deleted almost instantaneously, so that list stays short. These are open and shut cases.
 * Articles for deletion ("AfD") is the slowest and most deliberate process; it involves a community debate over whether articles should be kept; you may find some sample discussions enlightening. See "Category:AfD debates (Organisation, corporation, or product)".
 * Proposed deletion ("PROD") is an intermediate process: Articles that are uncontroversial deletion candidates but do not meet the narrow criteria for speedy deletion. Automatic deletion after five days — if no one objects. See the list at "Category:Proposed deletion".
 * The list of new articles most recently created -- about 100/hour today -- see "Special:Newpages". Many will get deleted.
 * A link from a Wikipedia article is given great weight by search engines, so spamdexers are always trying to stick in links and whole articles.
 * Give WikiProject Spam‎ a fast skim.
 * Finally, somewhat unrelated, is just the sheer vandalism:
 * See "WP:AIV". Serious vandals are reported several times a minute. The ones at WP:AIV are the "hard cases" -- the average vandal gets 5+ warnings and makes 25 vandalistic edits before they get temporarily blocked, so this is just the tip of the vandalism iceberg. Click on a "contribs" links for one of those vandals, then on the "diffs" links to several of their edits to see what we're talking about. This list is short since it's constantly getting updated every minute or so.
 * See "Special:Recentchanges" -- Wikipedia gets >100 edits/minute, some unhelpful.

Whether you talk about "encyclopedic integrity" or just "the hive", Wikipedia is under assault 24 hours a day from around the globe from editors at cross purposes to the goals of the project. Some spam and vandalism just isn't getting caught.

Back to ANZIIF
I've taken some liberties and created a user subpage at "User:Jclapham/draft article" for you to use in preparing a draft article for ANZIIF. Feel free to edit away and then, when you think you've got something that will satisfy the rules, I suggest inviting all the editors that have commented on or had a hand in deleting earlier versions to look at it. I'm sure all will give you a fair shake; I know Hu12 is certainly very fair and reasonable.

After that, look at following policies and guidelines:
 * "Notability (companies and corporations)" -- ANZIIF must clearly meet this using a "reliable source"
 * "Reliable sources" -- for instance, someone's blog is not reliable but the Financial Times is, as are much smaller, but professionally published sources such as the Hobart Mercury.
 * "[Wikipedia:What Wikipedia is not]]" -- just the sections "Wikipedia is not a soapbox" and "Wikipedia is not a publisher of original thought".
 * "Conflict of interest" -- read the whole thing. Especially note the section "Consequences of ignoring this guideline". Case in point: see "LegalMatch vs Casepost" section of the LegalMatch article, originally submitted as a PR/spam article without that material. Company employees have been trying to delete that embarrassing section for a long time.
 * skim "Neutral point of view" -- in a nutshell, write your article in a totally deadpan fashion, not as ANZIIF's PR department would write it.
 * finally, glance at "Copyrights" -- Wikipedia's legal obligations require it to instantly delete articles or sections of articles with text lifted from other places unless it explicitly states the material is in the public domain. Even text from the ANZIIF site will get the article deleted.

I hope this helps. Again, welcome to the hive. May all your buzzing about be happy and productive.

--A. B. 20:22, 2 December 2006 (UTC)


 * I'm no expert, and I never saw any page of yours yet. But I looked at FINSIA.  Looks legit to me, if those policies A.B. raised are satisfied.  Might this be similar as well:  Project Management Institute? --LegitimateAndEvenCompelling 05:49, 5 December 2006 (UTC)


 * If you can survive the somewhat dense prose, the Financial planner article lists a number of different organizations that might be somewhat analogous to ANZIIF. --A. B. 06:05, 5 December 2006 (UTC)


 * P.S. When I used the word "deadpan", I did not mean something quite as, well, dull as the Financial planner article. If nothing else, it could use a lot of internal links.

Thanks both fo you for your guidance, much appreciated. When I get a spare chunk of time I'll get cracking and get something decent together. Cheers. Jclapham 22:51, 5 December 2006 (UTC)


 * I see in your draft that you have a wikilink to an article not yet submitted on Joan Fitzpatrick. If you submit an article on her, you will need to prove her notability as well. My suggestion is that you just stick to ANZIIF for now. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by A. B. (talk • contribs) 12:05, 6 December 2006 (UTC).

Edit to FINSIA
This edit, also see the note on  FINSIA talk page by Ringbark. Bad-faith placing tags on articles that do not meet such criteria, is considered vandalism, Abuse of tags is a violation of Wikipedia policy. Hu12 01:17, 6 December 2006 (UTC)
 * Jclapham, the way I read things, you reversed your own accidental addition. I don't see any bad faith at all, unless I'm missing something.  Now Hu12 is well intended and often does a lot of spam fighting so I think his comment here is based solely on his seeing this type of thing done by real vandals, not by newbies like yourself, and based on his doing so much excellent work that sometimes he rushes a little.  So, once again, relax.  Do not be discouraged.  Keep at it.  Your knowledge of wiki policy, and your accidental edits, will grow and shrink, respectively.  --LegitimateAndEvenCompelling 01:32, 6 December 2006 (UTC)
 * Thanks for the kind words LegitimateAndEvenCompelling, however If you look forward in the history you'll note the tag was removed by Striver 3 days after it was inserted . It was in placed in Bad-faith and deliberate. Hu12 02:30, 6 December 2006 (UTC)
 * It escaped my attention. Actually, I saw it but I did not know what it was.  I see now it means deletion review.  Yes, then he was naughty.  But as a newbie, naughtiness and newbieness go hand in hand until people figure out the system better.  So I'd give him more leeway to learn.  I know I was a naughty newbie, but only because I didn't know better.  Now I belong to NNA, Naughty Newbies Anonymous.  I hereby invite the new naughty newbie to join. --LegitimateAndEvenCompelling 02:52, 6 December 2006 (UTC)

A page I contributed, with exactly the same format, was deleted, so I presumed that FINSIA too should be deleted. No bad faith intended - perhaps a little bit over-eager in ensuring consistency. Consider me rebuked. Jclapham 09:22, 6 December 2006 (UTC)

Speedy deletion nomination of File:Sml anziif full cmyk.jpg
A tag has been placed on File:Sml anziif full cmyk.jpg requesting that it be speedily deleted from Wikipedia. This has been done under section F1 of the criteria for speedy deletion, because the image is an unused redundant copy (all pixels the same or scaled down) of an image in the same file format, which is on Wikipedia (not on Commons), and all inward links have been updated.

If you think that this notice was placed here in error, you may contest the deletion by adding  to the top of the page that has been nominated for deletion (just below the existing speedy deletion or "db" tag - if no such tag exists then the page is no longer a speedy delete candidate and adding a hangon tag is unnecessary), coupled with adding a note on the talk page explaining your position, but be aware that once tagged for speedy deletion, if the page meets the criterion, it may be deleted without delay. Please do not remove the speedy deletion tag yourself, but don't hesitate to add information to the page that would render it more in conformance with Wikipedia's policies and guidelines. Tim 1357  talk  05:23, 22 May 2010 (UTC)

Proposed deletion of File:Copy of anziif full cmyk.jpg


The file File:Copy of anziif full cmyk.jpg has been proposed for deletion&#32;because of the following concern: "Unused logo with no article used, it's also can't move to commons because of an unused logo will be deleted as of out of project scope."

While all constructive contributions to Wikipedia are appreciated, pages may be deleted for any of several reasons.

You may prevent the proposed deletion by removing the notice, but please explain why in your edit summary or on the file's talk page.

Please consider addressing the issues raised. Removing will stop the proposed deletion process, but other deletion processes exist. In particular, the speedy deletion process can result in deletion without discussion, and files for discussion allows discussion to reach consensus for deletion. Willy1018 (talk) 12:58, 19 December 2018 (UTC)

Proposed deletion of File:Sml anziif full cmyk v2.jpg


The file File:Sml anziif full cmyk v2.jpg has been proposed for deletion&#32;because of the following concern: "Unused logo with no article used, it's also can't move to commons because of an unused logo will be deleted as of out of project scope."

While all constructive contributions to Wikipedia are appreciated, pages may be deleted for any of several reasons.

You may prevent the proposed deletion by removing the notice, but please explain why in your edit summary or on the file's talk page.

Please consider addressing the issues raised. Removing will stop the proposed deletion process, but other deletion processes exist. In particular, the speedy deletion process can result in deletion without discussion, and files for discussion allows discussion to reach consensus for deletion. Willy1018 (talk) 05:24, 22 December 2018 (UTC)