User talk:Jingiby/Archive 22

I found a very interesting article from 1858
I found a very interesting article from 1858. I have uploaded it and transcribed it on the macedonian wikisource. If you want to upload it to the bulgarian wikisource be my guest:. If not, I will do it when I have time. GStojanov (talk) 18:14, 16 May 2019 (UTC)
 * Hi, thank you for that invitation, but Im not active on the Wikisource and my knowledge for that project are very obscure. Jingiby (talk) 18:19, 16 May 2019 (UTC)


 * No problem. I did it: bg:s:%D0%9C%D0%B8%D1%81%D0%BB%D0%B8_%D0%B7%D0%B0_%D0%B1%D0%BE%D0%BB%D0%B3%D0%B0%D1%80%D1%81%D0%BA%D0%B8%D0%BE%D1%82_%D1%8F%D0%B7%D0%B8%D0%BA_-_%D0%9F%D0%B0%D1%80%D1%82%D0%B5%D0%BD%D0%B8%D1%8F_%D0%97%D0%BE%D0%B3%D1%80%D0%B0%D1%84%D1%81%D0%BA%D0%B8 GStojanov (talk) 20:37, 16 May 2019 (UTC)

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Edit notification for June 1
Hi, i'm APPM10. I saw your recent edits on Daskal kamche and i have to say that i've fixed all the shown biased details that were written by mistake. About the nationality you can simply deduce it from the birthplace of the person. And yes i also know that here on Wikipedia, you also need to write about facts not bulgarophile-biased edits. If you have something to say that we should talk over together feel free to contact me on talk. —Preceding undated comment added 14:49, 1 June 2019 (UTC)
 * Hi, Wikipedia is not place for POV. Please read Identifying reliable sources (history). Keep in mind that in many historical topics, scholarship is divided, so several scholarly positions should be relied upon. Some people masquerading as scholars actually present fringe views outside of the accepted practice, and these should not be used. To determine scholarly opinions about a historical topic, consult the following sources in order:


 * 1) Recent scholarly books and chapters on the historiography of the topic
 * 2) "Review Articles", or historiographical essays that explicitly discuss recent scholarship in an area.
 * 3) Similarly conference papers that were peer reviewed in full before publication that are field reviews or have as their central argument the historiography
 * 4) Journal articles or peer reviewed conference papers that open with a review of the historiography.
 * 5) Earlier scholarly books and chapters on the historiography of the topic, etc. Jingiby (talk) 18:03, 1 June 2019 (UTC)

Presian
Hi Jingiby. PMBZ cites Bozhilov's "Българите във Византийската империя", p. 251ff., Pirivatrich's "Самуиловата държава", the "Кой кой е в средновековна България" and Zlatarski as relevant literature. Do you have access to them? Constantine  ✍  11:45, 11 June 2019 (UTC)
 * Hi Cplakidas. I mentioned especially English language sources as for example: John Vladislav's son, Tsar Presian II, surrenders to the Constantinople emperor. in Dimitar Bechev Historical Dictionary of the Republic of Macedonia, Scarecrow Press, 2009, ISBN	0810862956, p. xx. or The last publication confirms Tkadličik's identification of the remains in the Michalovce grave with those of Prince Presian II. in Vasilka Tăpkova-Zaimova, Bulgarians by Birth: The Comitopuls, Emperor Samuel and their Successors According to Historical Sources and the Historiographic Tradition, BRILL, 2018, ISBN 9004352996, p. 19 or here in Anthony Kaldellis, Streams of Gold, Rivers of Blood: The Rise and Fall of Byzantium, 955 A.D. to the First Crusade, Oxford University Press, 2017, ISBN 0190253231, in the list of Bulgarian rulers as Presian II, etc. Jingiby (talk) 12:19, 11 June 2019 (UTC)
 * The problem is that I only see Bulgarian (or Macedonian) authors using the numbering, which is probably because said numbering arose in modern Bulgarian historiography (since numbering medieval rulers is a modern convention). The Byzantinist sources do not usually assign him a regnal number, as they do not consider him a ruler. Kaldellis is an exception, as far as I can tell. I note though that in the index of the same book, he is listed as "Presian (Prousianos) (son of Ivan Vladislav)", which corresponds to the article title I chose. So the name is clearly not universal, nor the most established one in the international literature; indeed the Google Books sources that use "Пресиян II" all appear to be relatively recent (1990s or later), and although this may not be representative, Zlatarski as far as I can see does not use it. Which is why I would like to know what the sources PMBZ recommends actually use, to try to establish the extent of the use of the name with the regnal number before making any definitive statements on it.
 * On the other hand, I see no reliable, specialist source calling him a Tsar, and indeed this is unsupported by the primary sources (Skylitzes). Even Pavlov calls him simply "knyaz", "prince". The Historical Dictionary of the Republic of Macedonia is not a source I would put too much credence on, not only given the problems in that country's historiography, but even more because this is a source that mentions him en passant. I always hesitate to use such generalist sources for corroboration, because even with the best intentions, they tend to make mistakes in the details. Constantine  ✍  13:23, 11 June 2019 (UTC)
 * Anthony Kaldellis included him under Presian II in the list of Bulgarian rulers. Jingiby (talk) 13:27, 11 June 2019 (UTC)
 * As I said, it is very much an exception. In the index, and in the actual text, the regnal number is omitted. And most sources do not mention him as a ruler. The Historical Dictionary of Bulgaria does not include him among the rulers, nor does the ODB, Tsvetkov in A history of the Balkans: a regional overview from a Bulgarian perspective mentions nothing of him being emperor, a specialist work on the Byzantine-Bulgarian wars likewise only mentions what is in the article. I could go on, but it is pointless. This omission is only natural, as indeed it does not emerge from Skylitzes that he claimed the imperial title or was seriously considered as such by anyone.
 * To be frank, I smell modern nationalist narratives behind the assigning of a regnal number to him and consider him a "tsar", or, in the best-case scenario, retroactive application of the hereditary principle on an 11th-century case, whereby the oldest son automatically becomes ruler on the father's death. However, as the PMBZ clearly states, we don't even know for sure that he was the oldest son; we only guess this, because he received a superior title than his two brothers, and is the only one mentioned in the manuscript of Skylitzes by name, instead of in a later annotation. Constantine  ✍  13:45, 11 June 2019 (UTC)
 * I agree that he was neither a Bulgarian ruler nor a tsar. In this case, the fact that he is titled the Second is rather a reminiscence of the interesting circumstance that Presian the First was namely the ruler, who annexed firstly Macedonia for the Bulgarian Empire, and Ivan Vladislav decided to name his firstborn son and a potential successor after himself. Jingiby (talk) 13:56, 11 June 2019 (UTC)
 * On that we agree. Constantine  ✍  13:58, 11 June 2019 (UTC)

Paleo-Balkan Languages
Hello there,

I would just like to ask how exactly my edit suggested POV bias. It is generally thought, within the linguistic community concerning these Balkan languages, that Albanian has evolved from either the Illyrian, Thracian or Dacian tongues (or perhaps a combination of 2 or all). This is still obviously not confirmed, so it is right to say that one cannot simply say it has descended from Illyrian, for example. I think, however, this was included in my edit (empathising ‘traditionally’ here). I have not stated, nor strongly inferred that Albanian IS a descendant of one of these, only that it is generally thought to be.

Hopefully you understand what I’m trying to get at here. ArbDardh (talk) 19:08, 21 June 2019 (UTC)
 * Hi, your text added into the article was: (traditionally thought to be a Thraco-Illyrian language). That is not correct statement. Your claim above now: Albanian has evolved from either the Illyrian, Thracian or Dacian tongues (or perhaps a combination of 2 or all) is much more reliable and I agree with such addition. Regards. Jingiby (talk) 19:16, 21 June 2019 (UTC)

Could you review this edit to a Bulgarian history topic for me?
Hi,

I found this edit to the page Medieval Bulgarian army which, changes a lot and might have some spurious information in it. Unfortunately, I don't know enough about the topic to be sure. Could you take a look at it for me?

Thanks,

WiJaMa (talk) 19:54, 22 June 2019 (UTC)
 * Hi, WiJaMa! What I an sure about is the IP has made this edit is a sock, mixing since long time reality with some nonsensic claims on that topic. Regards. Jingiby (talk) 12:13, 23 June 2019 (UTC)

Authority
Hello, I was just wondering who you are and how you decide what changes or not, or who even writes the articles to begin with and who decides what is correct. Onoufrios d (talk) 19:23, 23 June 2019 (UTC)
 * Hi, your claim "the area mentioned is the actual Macedonia" is obvious POV. Jingiby (talk) 03:31, 24 June 2019 (UTC)

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 * added a link pointing to Indo-European

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Editing
Talk page highlights: In the spirit of Wikipedia humor, this page is a repository for some of the strangest exchanges that occur between editors. Please add short quotes that:

Concern articles, lists, or policy discussions. Are relevant to the article subject. Arise from legitimate editorial discussion. Don't insult any particular person. Don't extend an edit war. (For examples of edit wars, see Wikipedia:Lamest edit wars.) Bosko Bazel (talk) 14:22, 9 July 2019 (UTC)
 * I don't understand your claims above. Please ensure you are familiar with Wikipedia's policies and guidelines, and do not continue to make edits that appear disruptive. Thanks. Jingiby (talk) 16:54, 9 July 2019 (UTC)

Editing vol.2
Hello there you are the one who is spending his entire day in order to regulate the nationality of individuals who have fought for the autonomy of another state and interfere in all things and personalities, revolutionaries, and people with all due respect Bosko Bazel (talk) 20:49, 9 July 2019 (UTC)

Vestnik Makedoniya from 1870
Hi Jingby, do you know if the newspaper Makedoniya is digitized and available for reading? GStojanov (talk) 12:56, 12 July 2019 (UTC)
 * No! Jingiby (talk) 13:14, 12 July 2019 (UTC)

Editing true facts
How am I suppose to improve Wikipedia's pages? I was told by you that I must discuss on talk-page before editing. But, there, no one discusses and presents thesis of their hypothesis. JonhDS (talk) 15:34, 12 July 2019 (UTC)
 * There are two versions of her origin presented in the article. The first one is the leading, that she was a Serbian and the second one possibility is, she was a Bulgarian. It is clear she was of Slavic origin and this is undisputed. Jingiby (talk)

July 2019
Hello, I'm Parabellus. I noticed that you made an edit concerning content related to a living (or recently deceased) person, but you didn't support your changes with a citation to a reliable source, so I removed it. Wikipedia has a very strict policy concerning how we write about living people, so please help us keep such articles accurate and clear. If you think I made a mistake, or if you have any questions, you can leave me a message on my talk page. Thank you! Parabellus (talk) 09:19, 21 July 2019 (UTC)

West Azarbaycan
Hello I belive you have a mistake in your west azarbaycan page because azarbaijanis with 76,2 percent make west azarbaycan people but you in your west azarbaycan page write something wrong please edit it again and write the truth.Thank you, AmirTabriz3831 (talk) 12:41, 25 July 2019 (UTC)
 * Hi, there is an official Iranian source about this number. Can you provide another reliable source supporting your opinion. Jingiby (talk) 15:30, 25 July 2019 (UTC)

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Cumano-Vlach
Vásáry, p. 41: Taking into consideration everything that has been said so far, the most plausible supposition seems to be that Asen and his family were of Cuman origin. They stood at the head of the liberation movement in Bulgaria, and their chief supporterswere their people, the Vlakhs. They must have spoken the language of their Vlakh subjects but preserved the knowledge of their Cuman predecessors' nomadic skills. Moreover, they must have been in close contact with their near relatives in Cumania. That is why they turned to their kinsfolk to help them in their fight against the Byzantine Empire. Rasovskij called the Asenids half-Cumans (polupolovcy), and he was right.

But the other half was Vlakh, so they may rightly be called Cumano-Vlakhs. In sum, the Asenids were a Cuman dynasty whose members became Vlakhs in the twelfth century and Bulgars in the thirteenth.

Failed verification? Srnec (talk) 18:54, 2 September 2019 (UTC)
 * Taking into consideration everything that has been said so far, the most plausible supposition seems to be that Asen and his family were of Cuman origin. That is the main agenda. Yes, they felt under the Vlach community's influence north of the Danube and were initially romanized and subsequently into Bulgarian sphere of influence south of Danube and were finally slavicized. Regards. Jingiby (talk) 04:08, 3 September 2019 (UTC)

Anastasia Karakasidou
Please respect international agreements especially when are recognised by the country whose name is in dispute. North Macedonia, or the republic of North Macedonia, and Greece signed on 12 June 2018 an agreement solving a long lasting name dispute. Based on the agreement, the constitutional name of the country is Republic of North Macedonia. Both countries, hundreds of others and many international organisations, recognise the country with this name. I see no reason why wikipedia should not be up-to-date and accurate. If you disagree with me and since I am not an experienced wikipedia editor, I would be grateful if you initiate a dispute resolution procedure. Thank you for your understanding Wikisabelotodo (talk) 16:47, 8 September 2019 (UTC)
 * Please respect Naming conventions (Macedonia). In historical contexts referring to events between 1992 and 2019, Wikipedia articles will continue to refer to the country by its then-current official name, i.e. "Republic of Macedonia". Jingiby (talk) 17:00, 8 September 2019 (UTC)
 * Please, adjectival references for historical topics should follow the same logic. Historical adjectival references to the state before 2019 should remain "Macedonia". Where the context isn't clearly historical, explanatory notes such as ("now North Macedonia") may be added.Jingiby (talk) 17:22, 8 September 2019 (UTC)
 * Although I do not agree with you, I am willing to compromise and follow your suggestion (i.e. "now North Macedonia"). I see no reason for change any more. Both articles Anastasia Karakasidou and Krste Misirkov are in accordance with your suggestion.
 * This is not my opinion, but the consensus reached on Wikipedia on that issue. Regards. Jingiby (talk) 17:35, 8 September 2019 (UTC)
 * More, before 1992 there was neither Republic of Macedonia nor North Macedonia, but SR Macedonia. I.e. your claims that the research of Dr. Karakasidou was conducted before 1992, has nothing to do with your attempt to impose the 2019 name back at that time. Jingiby (talk) 17:51, 8 September 2019 (UTC)
 * read WP:MOSMAC: Its says: In historical contexts referring to events between 1992 and 2019, Wikipedia articles will continue to refer to the country by its then-current official name, i.e. "(Republic of) Macedonia". Disruptive behavior is covered under WP:ARBMAC that entails sanctions.Resnjari (talk) 18:02, 8 September 2019 (UTC)

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Edit
Why did you revert my edit? I removed the people that were non-notable and irrelevant. Also many of the sources in the list are not reliable sources. 46.212.241.21 (talk) 07:14, 19 September 2019 (UTC)
 * Which edit exactly. You have removed info from several articles that I have restored. Please, stop your disruptive editing. Jingiby (talk) 07:47, 19 September 2019 (UTC)

Esma Redzepova 20 September 2019
Mate you gotta let the dead rest in peace. Enough with your bulgarian propaganda Show some respect if you are decent human being — Preceding unsigned comment added by Nik888 (talk • contribs) 12:26, 20 September 2019 (UTC)
 * Info backed by an academic publication is not a propaganda. Maybe pushing the name of non-existing in 1943 country as SR Macedonia is obvious propaganda. Jingiby (talk) 12:35, 20 September 2019 (UTC)
 * What info? Skopje is not Bulgarian. It might have been occupied by the Nazis via Bulgaria - but you seem to be omitting that it was a Bulgarian Takeover, like in other Wikipedia articles. Your vandalism of Macedonian pages is sickening - your intentions are evident:

https://www.reddit.com/r/WikiInAction/comments/axxxl0/longtime_wikipedia_user_jingiby_has_been/
 * Sorry, but though everyone is welcome to contribute constructively to the encyclopedia, we would like you to assume good faith while interacting with other editors. Take a look at the welcome page to learn more about contributing to this encyclopedia. Thank you. Jingiby (talk) 12:51, 20 September 2019 (UTC)
 * sorry but you are a Vandal. Whats up with this nickname of yours?:
 * https://imgur.com/0Kf08kt — Preceding unsigned comment added by Nik888 (talk • contribs) 12:57, 20 September 2019 (UTC)

September 2019
Welcome to Wikipedia. Although everyone is welcome to contribute constructively to the encyclopedia, we would like you to assume good faith while interacting with other editors. Take a look at the welcome page to learn more about contributing to this encyclopedia. ''Watch your reverts, too - you have been edit warring. '' Killer Chihuahua 14:03, 20 September 2019 (UTC)

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Unofficial motto Macedonia
Even though you clearly spread bulgarian propaganda, stop removing (North) Macedonia from the List of National mottos Page. On this list there are even provinces/ unofficial/ former mottos.

Besides a motto cannot be "unofficialy used by state" because then it would be an official motto. It was used unofficially by the people. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2A02:8388:2801:7C00:90F0:D8B1:50D9:1BA3 (talk) 21:00, 23 September 2019 (UTC)
 * 30% from the people in North Macedonia are not ethnic Macedonians. They are Albanians, Turks, Roma, etc. and they never used that motto. By this reason it can not be also an unofficial state's motto. If this is only an ethnic Macedonian unofficial slogan, what is also doubtful, please provide a reliable source for that and put it in the article about the ethnic Macedonians. Thank you. Jingiby (talk) 04:50, 24 September 2019 (UTC)
 * PS. Search engines as Google Books, nor Google Scholar, or Google News don't support such claim. Jingiby (talk) 06:07, 24 September 2019 (UTC)


 * It does not matter how many allegedly percent albanians, turks, roma are when the rest of the other half are not albanians, turks, roma. Just because a minority "is not using it" is not a valid reason.
 * People in Macedonia to this day still use the phrase as a motto of unity and ethnicity.


 * And what gives you the right to completely remove (North)Macedonia from the list of national mottos? You didn't even answer that question. Stop removing it, even though it has no official motto.
 * Please stop adding unsourced content. This violates Wikipedia's policy on verifiability. If you continue to do so, you may be blocked from editing Wikipedia. Thank you. Jingiby (talk) 14:27, 25 September 2019 (UTC)
 * Why are you removing North Macedonia? Answer that. The last change was without a motto. You still removed it, explain. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2A02:8388:2801:7C00:402A:325D:F2BB:4C84 (talk) 01:10, 27 September 2019 (UTC)

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Macedonia
Hi, you reverted something regarding Macedonia and you added "Greek Macedonia". Officially the only place on the planet that is called JUST Macedonia is the one in Greece. Please accept that and be objective. Onoufrios d (talk) 22:13, 19 November 2019 (UTC)
 * Hi, I absolutely disagree. Jingiby (talk) 04:27, 20 November 2019 (UTC)

Maximinus
Dear friend, as I've cited the citation it is written by one of the most prominent writers and historians of Roman era: Ammianus Marcellinus  in his work Roman Antiquities (Roman Antiquities, book XXVIII, Ammianus Marcellinus) Respectfully سیمون دانکرک (talk) 01:42, 25 November 2019 (UTC)

http://penelope.uchicago.edu/Thayer/E/Roman/Texts/Ammian/28*.html سیمون دانکرک (talk) 01:51, 25 November 2019 (UTC)


 * My apologies to Jingiby for intruding;
 * Do secondary source(s) support this claim made by Ammianus Marcellinus? --Kansas Bear (talk) 03:02, 25 November 2019 (UTC)
 * I'm sorry سیمون دانکرک, may you provide exact citations from the text above. It would be better to do this on article's talk-page. Thanks in advance. Jingiby (talk) 04:33, 25 November 2019 (UTC)

Edit war
If you don't want people to engage in edit wars, accept that you might be wrong and settle for a temporary revision.
 * That is exactly why I have pushed the tag about a lack of neutrality on the article on the Greek Macedonians where you have made 4 edits (one without to log on). Jingiby (talk) 12:29, 27 November 2019 (UTC)

Fair. Thanks. (Ronbb345)

When in doubt, resort to reporting.
I had respected your neutrality dispute and you went behind my back to report me and eventually have me blocked from editing because I reverted to a more historically accurate edit. I'm not really interested in debating this any further. Intelligent people will easily understand what's true and what's not. I just wanted to point out to you how meaningless and kind of disrespectful what you did was. -- Ronbb345 — Preceding unsigned comment added by Ronbb345 (talk • contribs) 09:54, 29 November 2019 (UTC)
 * Sorry, I have warned you twice about the 3RR, but you have continued to revert other editors on two different topics 5-6 times. Regards. Jingiby (talk) 11:55, 29 November 2019 (UTC)

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 * Jovan Dolgač ([//dispenser.info.tm/~dispenser/cgi-bin/dablinks.py/Jovan_Dolga%C4%8D check to confirm] | [//dispenser.info.tm/~dispenser/cgi-bin/dab_solver.py/Jovan_Dolga%C4%8D?client=notify fix with Dab solver])
 * added a link pointing to Renegade
 * Krsta Kovačević ([//dispenser.info.tm/~dispenser/cgi-bin/dablinks.py/Krsta_Kova%C4%8Devi%C4%87 check to confirm] | [//dispenser.info.tm/~dispenser/cgi-bin/dab_solver.py/Krsta_Kova%C4%8Devi%C4%87?client=notify fix with Dab solver])
 * added a link pointing to Renegade
 * Todor Krstić-Algunjski ([//dispenser.info.tm/~dispenser/cgi-bin/dablinks.py/Todor_Krsti%C4%87-Algunjski check to confirm] | [//dispenser.info.tm/~dispenser/cgi-bin/dab_solver.py/Todor_Krsti%C4%87-Algunjski?client=notify fix with Dab solver])
 * added a link pointing to Renegade

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Good job!
Good job fixing Grandfather Ivan! Could you have a look at the other pages created by User talk:Angel Angel 2? He/She seems to only translate articles from other Wikip. using machine translation (which means the articles in English are in broken English as has been noted here and here), never credits and pushes POV. I cannot check what he/she writes since I do not speak any Slavic language. Veverve (talk) 14:02, 26 December 2019 (UTC)
 * Hi Veverve. Thanks for your notification. As to Angel 2, I think, maybe he finds what he is looking for. Jingiby (talk) 14:43, 26 December 2019 (UTC)

Happy New Year 2020!
To every Wikipedian! Jingiby (talk) 07:17, 1 January 2020 (UTC)

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Speedy deletion nomination of North Macedonia (disambiguation)


A tag has been placed on North Macedonia (disambiguation) requesting that it be speedily deleted from Wikipedia. This has been done under section G14 of the criteria for speedy deletion, because it is an orphaned disambiguation page which either
 * disambiguates only one extant Wikipedia page and whose title ends in "(disambiguation)" (i.e., there is a primary topic);
 * disambiguates zero extant Wikipedia pages, regardless of its title; or
 * is a redirect with a title ending in "(disambiguation)" that does not target a disambiguation page or page that has a disambiguation-like function.

Under the criteria for speedy deletion, such pages may be deleted at any time. Please see the disambiguation page guidelines for more information.

If you think this page should not be deleted for this reason, you may contest the nomination by visiting the page and clicking the button labelled "Contest this speedy deletion". This will give you the opportunity to explain why you believe the page should not be deleted. However, be aware that once a page is tagged for speedy deletion, it may be deleted without delay. Please do not remove the speedy deletion tag from the page yourself, but do not hesitate to add information in line with Wikipedia's policies and guidelines. If the page is deleted, and you wish to retrieve the deleted material for future reference or improvement, then please contact the. Mcampany (talk) 20:21, 3 January 2020 (UTC)
 * Please feel free to recreate this page once you've created a page for either the region or the book. For now, since there's only one page titled "North Macedonia" there isn't a need for a disambiguation page. Thank you! Mcampany (talk) 20:22, 3 January 2020 (UTC)

He was Serbian, not Bulgarian!
He was Serbian, not Bulgarian! — Preceding unsigned comment added by 178.222.23.213 (talk) 09:34, 12 January 2020 (UTC)

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Regarding the history of the Ohird Archbishopric
Hi, I found that some of your contributions to the Ohrid Archbishopric article are exact sentences from the book "Brief History of the Ohrid Archbishopric" by Archbishop Jovan of Ohrid. You are not mentioning that in the references. Why? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 95.180.197.253 (talk) 08:27, 25 January 2020 (UTC)
 * Sorry, but I did not read this book and I do not remember to have used it ever. Jingiby (talk) 10:40, 25 January 2020 (UTC)
 * Could you please point out where these sentences that you wrote came from: "Towards the middle of the 16th century, the Ohrid Archbishopric lost the Diocese of Veria, however, at the beginning of the 17th century, it gained the Diocese of Durres from the Patriarchate of Constantinople. Since then and until its abolishment in 1767, the Archbishopric neither lost nor gained a diocese under its jurisdiction." Thanks. I'm doing a study on this topic currently. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 95.180.197.253 (talk) 14:44, 25 January 2020 (UTC)
 * I have checked the history of the article, but this edit was 8 years ago and my memory is not so sharp. Jingiby (talk) 16:42, 25 January 2020 (UTC)
 * Thank you, anyway. I added the reference to the book in the article. Grateful for your contributions on the subject. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 95.180.197.253 (talk) 18:57, 26 January 2020 (UTC)
 * No problems. Jingiby (talk) 05:01, 27 January 2020 (UTC)

RE: Comments on my profile
Er hi. I got a banner on a page saying I had a new message from you. Idk whwy you're accusing me of using mul;tiple accounts. I dont even have an account here. Also the edit I made was completely fair and I explained what I did. Its not vandalism. The page Balkan Wars incorrectly links to the page Yugoslav Wars, prefacing that with a commenta about it being in the 1890s. This is very obviously wwrong (the Yugoslav wars happenbed in the 1990s, a full hundred years later), and all I did was change one number. I thought the idea of wikipedia was that anyone could edit it so that minor errors like this dont go uncaught, but I guess i wownt bother if this is your attitude, even though I explained what I did. 2A00:23C5:DD04:6301:A09A:8C3E:8ADF:DBEC (talk) 10:54, 30 January 2020 (UTC)


 * Sorry but I have no edit history here, and I dont know what youre talking about with me having multiple accounts so I'm just going to do the same thing again. If you want to stop me from editing then so be it but thats downright unfair considering I literally have never edited wikipedia before today. I have experience with editing wikis, for sure, and the mediawiki software markdown, but not from Wikipedia itself (merely from other places that use mediawiki or have used it in the past). I really dont know why you're being like this, but I feel very unfairly targeted. I genuinely do not understand where you're getting this stuff about my edit history from because I dont have an edit history, and I've never had an account here. 2A00:23C5:DD04:6301:A09A:8C3E:8ADF:DBEC (talk) 11:06, 30 January 2020 (UTC)
 * Sorry, that was really my mistake. Jingiby (talk) 11:44, 30 January 2020 (UTC)

Regarding my edit on Macedonians.
The default version of the article by no means has a neutral point of view. It sides more with propaganda from North Macedonia. Similarly, the page for the ethnic Macedonians mentions them as native to the wider region despite them being Slavs and despite the term itself being a very modern invention. If you want me to appreciate a neutral point of view, make sure it actually is a neutral point of view. But then again, you can always rush with blocking me from editing and reporting me like you did last time. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Ronbb345 (talk • contribs) 16:16, 8 February 2020 (UTC)
 * Hundreds of thousands of Greeks originating from Asia Minor, North Thrace, North Epirus, Ukraine, Southern Russia, Egypt, etc. are living today in Greek Macedonia. They are not natine even to the territory of modern-day Greece. Jingiby (talk) 17:15, 8 February 2020 (UTC)

Ethnic Greeks in general are native to the entire region of Macedonia since ancient times. It's a referrence to ethnic origins, not a demonym. Plenty of Greeks who have had a historical presence all around the region throughout history until today. Slavic Macedonians aren't native to Macedonia but you have absolutely no problem saying that they are on their wiki page. They're Slavs. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Ronbb345 (talk • contribs) 17:47, 8 February 2020 (UTC)
 * , we had this discussion on the article talkpage last year where scholarship noted it is from a different origin (i.e 1923 from Anatolia) for most for the modern Greek population in the area, as opposed to an "unbroken link" to ancient Greek people of the region. Still going by your comments and edits, i see that your here more to WP:RIGHTGREATWRONGS than to work constructively and build an encyclopedia.Resnjari (talk) 19:48, 8 February 2020 (UTC)

The article is about ethnic Greeks, though, as noted in the first section after the introductory paragraph. It's not just referring to Greek (or not) citizens from the Greek region of Macedonia. By that logic I similarly pointed out to you that Slavic Macedonians is a term invented recently to refer to the citizens of North Macedonia. Yet there's an entire separate article about them in which they are described as native to the entire region of Macedonia when they absolutely are not. They're native to thr eastern part of Europe since they are Slavs just like Russians, Belarussians, Ukrainians, Georgians, Serbians, Bulgarians etc.

Ethnic Greeks have been present in Macedonia since ancient times. When Macedonia was a Roman province exceeding the boundaries of modern Greek Macedonia, reaching southern Serbia for example, there were Greeks living in it. And I want this to be emphasized in the introduction because saying that Greek Macedonians orginate solely from the Greek region of Macedonia and not the entire of Macedonia is like saying that they appeared very recently when Greece became the modern unified state that it is.

Greek Macedonians = term for all ethnic Greeks that lived and are living in the ENTIRE Macedonian region. Not just the Greek part.

You're not having a constructive encyclopedia. It's hugely biased, mate.

-- Ronbb345 Ronbb345 (talk) 20:54, 8 February 2020 (UTC)
 * , a Slavic population (going by ethonyms of Bulgarian and in modern times as Macedonian, due to various socio-political changes) has been native to the wider region for over 1000 years. The portion of Macedonia that Greece gained in 1912 had many areas that were compactly and only Slavic, not Greek. The Balkan Wars and especially the Greco-Turkish population exchange of 1923 changed all of that. And that's separate from the large Muslim population in the region who had been there for several centuries till 1923. What you're after is to have in the lede that all Greek speaking people in the area are from an unbroken line harking back to Alexander the Great and before. Problem is most come recently from Anatolia which makes the claim flawed at best and nationalistic at worst. If anything the article ought to emphasize that most of the Greek speaking population arrived during the 1923 population exchange, which is backed up by lots and lots of RS sources. As of now, the article only has a sentence or two on the topic, which really is not sufficient considering what it took to establish that current population, which in 1923 included people that had Turkish as a mother tongue like the Karamanlides.Resnjari (talk) 04:22, 9 February 2020 (UTC)

No, what I'm after is a fair description of my ancestors without the support of nationalist propaganda from North Macedonia. Ethnic Greeks have always existed around Macedonia since ancient times. There were Greeks in the region of Macedonia before and after the death of Alexander the Great, in Roman times, in Byzantine times, in Ottoman times and in modern times. They didn't just appear in the modern defined Greek part of it with the population exchange of 1923. They have always existed. This is mentioned in all the articles related to the demographic history of both Greece and Macedonia.

Slavs aren't native to Macedonia. They're native to the area of Europe they arrived from. That's like saying that since White Americans have existed for many centuries in the US, they're native to it. Additionally, there has never been a separate Macedonian ethnicity so that a Slavic nation could you use the term in such a way. Especially when the usage of the term is accompanied by nationalist, irredentist nonsense that revolves around the Ancient Macedonians being Slavic, speaking a Slavic language and all that.

-- Ronbb345 Ronbb345 (talk) 06:57, 9 February 2020 (UTC)
 * By this logic modern Greeks are also not native to Macedonia. They moved around 2000 years before presence. Moreover whether the Ancient Macedonians were originally a Greek tribe is also questionable. Full stop. Jingiby (talk) 07:14, 9 February 2020 (UTC)
 * @Ronbb345, a fair description in the lede is to note that the majority of the modern Greek population in the region came from Anatolia after the 1923 exchange, instead of the article burying it in a few scant sentences, like its some unfortunate sidenote or something that embarrasses national(ist) narratives of "continuity". That aside, following the arrival of the Slavs some 1,400 years ago, Greeks have been a minority community until 1923, mainly found compactly along villages on the coast and a larger compact cluster in the Grevena and Katerini areas -these areas are all within Greece, not outside of it. So your insistence on a wider regional presence from ancient times falls flat. The large expansion of the modern Greek element is because of 1923 and due to the (ongoing) hellenisation of part of the Slavonic population with pro-Greek sentiments, the Aromanians, the Arvanites and Orthodox Romani. By treating all Greeks in the area as the unbroken legacy of Alexander the Great is disingenuous. As per your views on ethnic Macedonia, there was a WP:MOSMAC process and the Wikipedia community decided that yes they do exist contrary to a minority who dissented.Resnjari (talk) 07:28, 9 February 2020 (UTC)

Greeks are literally mentioned as inhabitants of the region in every historical variation of the region on each separate article about the region on Wikipedia. Ancient Macedonia had Greeks, the Roman theme of Macedonia had Greeks, the Byzantine Macedonia had Greeks, the Ottoman Macedonia had Greeks and so does the modern. And I want this to be emphasized in the introductory paragraph. Restricting the term only for those inhabiting the current Greek region of Macedonia and saying that they are native solely to it makes it appear as if the only Greeks that have ever lived in Macedonia are the ones that arrived after the population exchange. Greeks have been both a minority and a majority all around Macedonia but they never ceased to exist in it throughout history. Also, there's absolutely no doubt that the Ancient Macedonians were Greek, since they spoke and wrote the Greek language, they worshipped the Olympian gods and, most importantly, they participated in the Olympic Games. Also, there's absolutely no doubt that there has never been a Macedonian ethnicity. Macedonian as a term has always been used throughout history to describe those living in the region, not their ethnicity. The only reason why there's a debate is due to modern Slavic propaganda. The Ancient Macedonians literally considered themselves Greek ethnically. I'm not claiming continuity from Alexander the Great. That's done by the Slavs you're obsessively supporting on this issue. I'm simply claiming historical presence of Greeks around Macedonia. Greeks who have been calling themselves or are described as Macedonian citizens. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Ronbb345 (talk • contribs) 22:18, 9 February 2020 (UTC)

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Tag
The content is not per Reliable sources. It is not rational that you would go with an undo and tell me to add some tag, which is not my obligation here. If a source is not provided in recent future - I shall delete the unsourced content.  Sadkσ  (talk is cheap)  13:43, 14 February 2020 (UTC)
 * No problem. Jingiby (talk) 14:18, 14 February 2020 (UTC)

The name Macedonia
Hi. I should really be posting this on the convoluted North Macedonia talk page but because this is just a simple message, I'll write here. In Bulgarian sources it is largely the same as the New York Times example, only Bulgarian sources MUST be specific for obvious reasons. Greece is not the only other country to have territory called Macedonia! :) Taken from NOVA, this source uses in noun and adjective form the "north" qualifier four times, and a further eight mentions of "Macedonia" by itself. I know nothing about the Albanian language so there is little point me doing quick research there, and to look for a plain mention of a sovereign Macedonia in a Greek current affairs source would be plain sardonic to say the least. On this note, do you feel that "South Slavic" would be a better choice of words than "former Yugoslavia"? I'll watch this space. --Edin balgarin (talk) 14:03, 17 February 2020 (UTC)
 * To drop all clarifications would be better. Regards. Jingiby (talk) 14:10, 17 February 2020 (UTC)
 * Fully agree. Thanks. --Edin balgarin (talk) 14:28, 17 February 2020 (UTC)

Taga za Yug
Hey User:Jingiby. I think you should also practice what you preach. Any info I have ever added to any article is something I EXPLICITLY read in the source, so I have never made anything up but only used the source. What's more, I think the one who has a very biased style of writing is you. Instead of reporting both sides of the story, you only report the Bulgarian side, and you purposefully omit words and sources that contradict your statements. And you making the connections yourself, i.e. adding things that can't be primarily found in the sources based on what you've read in a letter is ORIGINAL RESEARCH. That can be traced in all the articles you have ever made a contribution to. That's why I am here to improve all those articles and give them a more neutral point of view without making the conclusions myself. DD1997DD (talk) 18:34, 21 February 2020 (UTC)
 * Also stop synthesizing information please! This source does not say "Bulgarian arguments have much stronger support among the international academic circles" that Miladinov was Bulgarian. The author only used it to say that the international community agrees that the word "Bulgarian" used on the cover was not inserted by Bulgarian nationalists, not to say that the author saw himself as Bulgarian. Just stop making up information and phrasing it so that it supports Bulgarian arguments for the love of God. DD1997DD (talk) 19:01, 21 February 2020 (UTC)
 * DD1997DD, the international scientific community supports the Bulgarian view that the Macedonian researchers have falsifiaed the origianal editions of the works of the Miladinovs by deliberately deleting the word “Bulgarian” from them and that Macedonian authorities also refuse to display the originals of the Brothers in museums in North Macedonia. That is enough to be very clear whose position supports the international community. Jingiby (talk) 10:08, 22 February 2020 (UTC)

Edit request
Hello Jingiby, I saw you undid my edit. I made that edit while answering an edit request. I have reverted my response to the edit request. Would you mind answering that edit request for me please? Interstellarity (talk) 18:47, 1 March 2020 (UTC)
 * Hi Interstellarity!. Very sorry, but I really did not see the request on the talk-page before your question here. In my opinion I have not exactly undid your edit, but as compromise modified the sub-section. The word Balkan arrived on the Balkans through the Ottoman invasion, but really has either pure Persian origin, or combined one Persian-Turkic one. I am open to any ideas to change it. Regards. Jingiby (talk) 19:11, 1 March 2020 (UTC)
 * I wasn't sure if you saw it. Here is the link to the edit request I was talking about. Are you going to answer the request or are you going to let someone else do it? Interstellarity (talk) 19:21, 1 March 2020 (UTC)
 * You might want to add a link to your archive talk page discussions so people can easily access them. Interstellarity (talk) 19:22, 1 March 2020 (UTC)
 * OK. Jingiby (talk) 06:23, 2 March 2020 (UTC)

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Bulgarian Holocaust
What do you consider to be non-neutral? It is a fact that Bulgaria killed 1/6 of its Jews, this should be mentioned and not obscured by the claims of Bulgarian worthiness for choosing slave labour over execution. — Preceding unsigned comment added by GPinkerton (talk • contribs) 18:36, 6 March 2020 (UTC)


 * Bulgaria rescued all from its native Jews. Moreover all Jews who were exterminated, were killed outside Bulgaria and by non-Bulgarians. Jingiby (talk) 18:40, 6 March 2020 (UTC)


 * This is false. No fewer than 4,000 Jews were deported in September 1939. Please don't bring your non-neutral, unsourced claims to the page. Bulgarians may not have pulled the trigger, but Bulgarians and their government were responsible for their capture, transportation across Bulgaria, and the signing of the unique contract with the Nazis agreeing to supply Jews for the death camps (no other country did this). Bulgarians never lifted a finger to "rescue" these 12,000 victims of the Bulgarian Holocaust, and your use of the term rescue appears to be a peculiar one in which arrest, dispossession, internal deportation and forced labour constitutes "rescue". All this information is well-known, well cited throughout the article and elsewhere, and any attempt to deny or remove the facts can only stem from Bulgarian nationalism or Holocaust denial. Please desist. — Preceding unsigned comment added by GPinkerton (talk • contribs) 18:47, 6 March 2020 (UTC)

Disputed non-free use rationale for File:Falsificat Bulgarian Folk Songs.png
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Kostur dialect
Thank you for including the photo of the Kostur (Bogasko) Greek-Bulgarian dictionary on the Kostur dialect page. Drenowe (talk) 13:56, 18 March 2020 (UTC)drenowe

Saint Naum
Watching your topics on your user talk page it's cleary that you are the one who is biased, let alone me. I feel sorry for you. I edited at Saint Naum article as neutral as it could be. I wasn't pro Macedonian, neither anti Bulgarian. I can't be against at the Medieval Bulgarian state. I don't have to be against it.Dandarmkd (talk) 18:16, 21 March 2020 (UTC)
 * Hi, but better to check the sources after the text you have changed. They support deleted by you info. Jingiby (talk) 20:34, 21 March 2020 (UTC)

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