User talk:Joekramer5510

December 2016
Hello, I'm EricEnfermero. I noticed that you made a change to an article, Mike Trout, but you didn't provide a reliable source. It's been removed and archived in the page history for now, but if you'd like to include a citation and re-add it, please do so! If you need guidance on referencing, please see the referencing for beginners tutorial, or if you think I made a mistake, you can leave me a message on my talk page. Thank you. EricEnfermero (Talk) 03:50, 5 December 2016 (UTC)

January 2020
Please refrain from making unconstructive edits to Wikipedia, as you did at Joe DiMaggio. Your edits appear to constitute vandalism and have been reverted. If you would like to experiment, please use the sandbox. Repeated vandalism may result in the loss of editing privileges. Thank you. – Muboshgu (talk) 17:39, 26 January 2020 (UTC)

Joe DiMaggio began his career PROFESSIONALLY with the San Francisco Seals of the pacific coast league. During that time most of the coast league teams were unaffiliated with the majors and supported plenty of major league talent for decades. Joe Dimaggio and ted Williams were the two biggest stars to come out of the coast league. Had their time in the coast league not happened during the depression when many teams struggled financially as did major league teams, there’s legitimately a strong chance that if they kept those stars the league would’ve gone MAJOR instead of OPEN CLASSIFICATION which happened in the early 1950s just before the giants and dodgers moved out west. Part of Joe DiMaggios massive national appeal had to do in part they he spent the first four seasons of his incredible career in the highly competitive pacific coast league. He was inducted into the pcl hall of fame in 2003 and I believe that his time in San Francisco should not be forgotten and young kids learning about the national Pastime should have a small understanding of the different style that this high minor league operated at during that time. They should also know about the true longevity of Joe DiMaggios impressive career and get somewhat of an understanding of part of the reason why he was such a popular figure coast to coast. Because of these reasons, I will change his page back to include the beginning of his professional career with the San Francisco seals. I will be happy to take this up to the higher powers of Wikipedia, so be it, but next time you should actually look at my edits before immediately assuming that some random guy is VANDALIZING American history for all to see on Wikipedia. Thank you. Joekramer5510 (talk) 05:08, 27 January 2020 (UTC)

If you want to take away my editing privileges then do whatever you’re gonna do but I will continue to include joe DiMaggios west coast accomplishments on his page because it’s a part of history and it’s apart of his career and I’m a proud west coast man myself as well. Others should also see instantly that he spent an entire four years of his career in this highly competitive league. Joekramer5510 (talk) 05:21, 27 January 2020 (UTC)

You may be blocked from editing without further warning the next time you vandalize Wikipedia, as you did at Joe DiMaggio. – Muboshgu (talk) 05:22, 27 January 2020 (UTC)
 * The PCL was never a major league. He's a Hall of Famer in Cooperstown over the PCL. Look at Ernie Lomardi, Paul Waner, and everyone else who is a member of BOTH the PCL and Cooperstown HOFs. – Muboshgu (talk) 05:23, 27 January 2020 (UTC)

You obviously just have an east coast bias because look at guys like brooks holder and buz Arlett. You may be more of a pure historian than I am but I’m a bigger baseball historian. The league was professional, not major but professional. The only affiliated team in the league back in those days was the Los Angeles angels. Ichiro for example: his professional career began in Japan but ended in America. When the major leagues didn’t go farther west or south than saint Louis, it was still a major league but not regarded in the same light as today’s classification of what constitutes a major league. The pacific coast league was nearly just as competitive and viable as the majors. The level that they played at back then was probably comparable to what the NPB in Japan plays at today. East coast biases such as yourself I suppose, overlook this and simply regard it as a minor league of an earlier time however, this statement is really not entirely accurate. Like I said, he played FOUR years of his career in the pcl. That’s a substantial amount of time in a so called ‘minor league’. I’m today’s baseball world successful big leaguers rarely spend more than one or two seasons with a minor league team on their way to the majors. This is not the case with Joe Dimaggio, he spent a fair chunk of his career in the pcl, even compiling a remarkable 61 game hitting streak during his time there. Bob feller came up to the Cleveland Indians at 17, the same age that Dimaggio broke in with the seals at. Had Dimaggio been born in a different part of the country it’s highly likely that he would’ve foregoing the minors altogether like feller and other stars of that time did. However with with a deeper look into the microscope of history, this is not the case and Joe DiMaggios professional career began in 1932. I’ve considered doing this for other stars of the pcl as well such as Paul Waner, Tony lazzeri and ted Williams, however they didn’t have as large an impact on the league that Dimaggio and his brothers did. I won’t change it again unless I have your permission to out of respect. However I hope that you can read this message with ooopppen mind and be perhaps a little bit more reasonable with this change that I made. Thank you, I’m waiting for response now. Joekramer5510 (talk) 05:57, 27 January 2020 (UTC)
 * Why are you comparing Joe Dimaggio to Brooks Holder and Buzz Arlett when the real comparisons are Ernie Lombardi, Casey Stengel, Paul Waner, Tommy Lasorda, Earl Averill, and the other PCL Hall of Famers who are also in the National Baseball Hall of Fame. They're ALL like that because the infobox template can only house one HOF! And obviously Cooperstown outranks PCL Hall of Fame! Don't accuse me of bias. That personal attack can get you blocked from editing too. The PCL has never been recognized as a major league, and we don't list minor league teams in the infobox. This is my last warning to you not to edit war any more. Continue discussion. – Muboshgu (talk) 06:10, 27 January 2020 (UTC)

I compare joe to those guys because they’re both basically lifetime pcl players that easily could’ve done well in the big leagues too but chose to play in the pcl because the league actually paid better! Hall of famers to me are fall of famers no matter what level that Hof is, it’s still a very impressive accomplishment and those two names certainly shouldn’t be forgotten in baseball lore in my mind, although they have. The argument that I suppose that I’m really trying to make is that before 1957 the minor leagues, really just the Pacific Coast League though, were structured completely different than they are today and Wikipedia should achknowledge this by mentioning pcl time with Joe DiMaggio and the others that you mentioned too, Waner, lazzeri, Lombardi, manager Casey, etc. Like I said I won’t change it again without your permission but east coast bias is a real thing, many people are guilty of it to an extent and I beg you to approach this situation with a little more open mind ness, re read my arguments and seriously consider changing this because the pacific coast league was a very competitive league from about 1919 to 1957. The NPB isn’t considered a major league either but they are considered a high professional league and I believe that the league pre 1957 should be viewed in the same light that the NPB is viewed in now. Joekramer5510 (talk) 06:29, 27 January 2020 (UTC)

You have been blocked temporarily from editing for abuse of editing privileges, as you did at Joe DiMaggio. Once the block has expired, you are welcome to make useful contributions. If you think there are good reasons for being unblocked, please read the guide to appealing blocks, then add the following text below the block notice on your talk page:. – Muboshgu (talk) 20:56, 27 January 2020 (UTC)
 * You continued to edit war, and you did it while logged out so that it wouldn't be attached to this account. You are not listening about the PCL never being considered a major league, and only major leagues going in infoboxes. What you think about the PCL, NPB, or other leagues is irrelevant. Wikipedia runs on WP:CONSENSUS and the consensus is that minor league teams don't go in infoboxes (at least in the cases like DiMaggio, where they were major league players). – Muboshgu (talk) 20:58, 27 January 2020 (UTC)

If you had just mentioned the CONSENSUS thing originally, this conversation would have been very different and I would’ve been much more understanding of your perspective. That being said I was wondering if you could make some meaningful edits for me regarding the Seattle Mariners 40th anniversary team. Arod and juniors pages are locked but they’re both members of the mariners 40th anniversary team and it would be nice of you to add that in there since you do have some established Wikipedia credentials, thanks. https://www.mlb.com/mariners/video/mariners-40th-anniversary-team-c1348286483 Joekramer5510 (talk) 15:44, 12 February 2020 (UTC)