User talk:Jogers/Archive 2

Another confused contributor (who is now less confused)
"Recently, I've been using AutoWikiBrowser to fix some capitalization errors in band names and titles of films, books, albums and songs." Why? (Aren't there more useful things to do that will annoy less people?)

Also, you're not particularly consistent in your corrections. For example, on Romantic Guitars: Amour, you've changed Just The Way You Are to Just the Way You Are, and I Heard It Through The Grapevine to I Heard It Through the Grapevine,but you have NOT changed What A Fool Believes to What a Fool Believes. How do you decide which ones you'll change, which ones you won't change, and what you'll change them to?

By-the-way: If you look at the contents of the pages I Heard It Through the Grapevine and I Heard It Through the Grapevine (album), you'll find a variety of capitalizations have been used on those pages, including I Heard It through the Grapevine and I Heard it Through the Grapevine. Have you given any thought to correcting the content of those articles too? (Personally, I would have thought the "correct" capitalization would have been one of "I heard it through the grapevine", "I heard it through the Grapevine" or "I heard it through The Grapevine" ... )

Also: Can you try explaining (again) why what the artist/author chose to use for the capitalization is an error? I'm afraid I couldn't understand your explanation(s). I would have thought that whatever the author chose as the title was, by definition, the "correct" title. For reasons I don't understand, you don't agree.

Thanks for your patience in reading this. I look forward to your reply. Pdfpdf 15:23, 22 May 2007 (UTC)


 * I do this because we use standard English capitalization on Wikipedia. Please see Wikipedia:Naming conventions, Manual of Style (trademarks), WikiProject Music/MUSTARD and WikiProject Albums. These pages explain how titles and band names should be capitalized. I'm sorry if you are annoyed by my recent editing pattern.


 * I don't exactly decide which ones to fix. I use the software called AutoWikiBrowser which automatically makes changes from the set of regular expressions I created at User:Jogers/Capitalization.xml. After AWB apply the changes, I review the diff and save the page. I usually fix any other capitalization errors I spot before I save the page but I'm rather careful with changing links because sometimes the article may need to be moved first. That's the reason why I didn't change "What A Fool Believes" to "What a Fool Believes" in Romantic Guitars: Amour. I've noticed it though and I already have this page in my bookmarks so it is going to be fixed soon. Sometimes I may miss some titles altogether. Please excuse me if that happens.


 * The standard capitalization is "I Heard It Through the Grapevine". Relevant policies and guidelines I listed above explain why. I've been planning to go through all the pages I have in my list and fix capitalization in them for some time (I currently check only the pages that link to them). I promise that I'll do this soon.


 * Artists are generally inconsistent in the way they capitalize titles of their albums and songs (except for Japanese artists, perhaps). It has been discussed on several occasions and it's generally agreed that standardized capitalization should be used instead of what you can find on album cover or official website. This is what most secondary and tertiary sources do and what most style guides recommend.


 * I hope this clears the things up a little. Best regards, Jogers 19:57, 22 May 2007 (UTC)

Jogers, thanks for the reply. Yes, it did "clear things up a little". (A lot, actually.)

"I'm sorry if you are annoyed by my recent editing pattern." I'm not (and wasn't) annoyed. (However, looking at your talk page, it seems that there are plenty of others who are!) No, I'm just puzzled that anyone would actually want to spend many hours of their leasure time turning Capital Letters into lower case letters. It can't be very exciting. And, based on the contents of your talk page, it is not appreciated very much either. There must be many Wikipedia projects that are more interesting, more useful, and more appreciated. (E.g. The sort of stuff that people like Fisherjs and Engineer Bob do, which actually adds value to music pages.)

"I do this because we use standard English capitalization on Wikipedia." No you don't. There is no "standard English capitalisation", nor "standard American capitalization" either, for that matter. What you use is your interpretation of the Wikipedia Naming conventions and Manuals of Style. "These pages explain how titles and band names should be capitalized." No they don't. These pages state how titles and band names should be capitalized in Wikipedia - I can't find any explanation, nor justification, nor discussion, nor basis for the choice. Example: WikiProject Albums
 * ''In titles of songs or albums and band names, the standard rule in the English language is to capitalize words that:

Who's "standard rule in the English language"? Reference please! Note that in other situations, the Manual of Style implies or states rules which give quite different results. Why is there a separate and different rule for Albums? So, in summary, they are an arbitrarily chosen set of rules agreed by concenus of an arbitrary group of people, they contain ambiguities and conflicts/inconsistencies, and hence, they are open to interpretation. In my opinion, it would foster a more congenial environment if you were more flexible in your interpretation of them.
 * 1) Are the first or the last word in the title
 * 2) Are not conjunctions ("and", "but", "or", "nor"), prepositions ("to", "over", "in"), articles ("an", "a", "the"), or the "to" in infinitives.''

Changing topic: Thanks for explaining AWB to me. Most appreciated. And thanks for explaining and/or clarifying the other topics too - also appreciated.

Regards, Pdfpdf 13:21, 23 May 2007 (UTC)


 * You are right, fixing capitalization errors throughout Wikipedia isn't the most appreciable job you can imagine. It's not very exciting either but I believe that it makes the encyclopedia a little bit better by helping to maintain consistency. Despite what you may think it's not the only thing I do here.


 * The Manual of Style is not an arbitrary set of rules. It is largely based on authoritative style guides like The Chicago Manual of Style and Fowler’s Modern English Usage. The rules are the same for all titles. Albums, songs, films, books etc. are discussed separately just for convenience, I guess (some central guideline would be nice, though). Here are some references:     Could you point me to the ambiguities and inconsistencies you are referring to? Jogers 14:11, 23 May 2007 (UTC)

"I believe that it makes the encyclopedia a little bit better by helping to maintain consistency." Yes. However, there are some (e.g. 1) who think (believe?) it is vandalism, and then there are others (like me and many of those on your talk page) who don't think it's important enough to argue about. And then there are those who disagree with the MoS.

"Despite what you may think"- that's an interesting choice of words - "it's not the only thing I do here". I've read your user page. I know you do other things. I'm sorry if you are annoyed by my comments/observations; it has not been my intention to annoy you.

"The Manual of Style is not an arbitrary set of rules. It is largely based on authoritative style guides like The Chicago Manual of Style and Fowler’s Modern English Usage." That statement seems to support my observation that it is arbitrary! The contents of both the Chicago MoS and Fowlers are arbitrary. (Even if they were identical - which they're not - their content would still be arbitrary.) The decision on which manuals the Wikipedia MoS would be based on is arbitrary. The fact that the MoS is "largely based on", rather than "is a copy of" is also arbitrary. This doesn't mean the MoS is necessarily "bad" or "wrong" (both of which are arbitrary subjective opinions), but nevertheless, it is arbitrary.

"I guess some central guideline would be nice" Yes. A capital-S Standard would be even nicer, but you're not going to get one. English is a constantly evolving language. Any "Standard" would be out-of-date before the end of the month.

"The rules are the same ... Could you point me to the ambiguities and inconsistencies you are referring to?" Certainly, but not tonight. I have a project deadline approaching far too quickly. If it's OK with you, I'll get back to you after the deadline. (Thanks for the references.)

Regards, Pdfpdf (talk) 06:11, 24 May 2007 (UTC)

Postscript: I've just looked up the definition of "arbitrary", and see that there are several ways the word can be used - some of which are not what I'm trying to communicate. The meaning I intend is "based on or subject to individual discretion or preference". It seems that there are other uses of the word that, if applied when reading my comments, would make them offensive. (e.g. "impulse or caprice", "Uncertain; random; accidental") It is not my intention to be offensive. (talk) Pdfpdf 00:43, 25 May 2007 (UTC)


 * It is not vandalism and Jonomacdrones was a bit too fast to suggest that. I'm sure he doesn't think that way after I explained why I was doing this. I personally feel that replicating stylized typography and capitalization in articles about musical ensembles makes Wikipedia look more like a fansite than a professional publication but I left Matchbox Twenty and few other controversial names alone.


 * Your comments are welcome. I don't find them annoying or offensive but I'm wondering if you don't think it's important enough to argue about then why are you arguing about it?


 * I thought that you were suggesting that capitalization guidelines are agreed by an arbitrary group of Wikipedia editors. I was merely trying to point out that editorial staff of authoritative style guides may be slightly less arbitrary than that :-) Besides, I'm not sure if I would agree with the notion that their contents are "based on or subject to individual discretion or preference". 


 * When refer to "capitalization standard" I only mean the convention followed by most English language publishers described in the relevant Wikipedia guidelines. It doesn't seem to change that much.


 * I'm anxious to hear from you about the ambiguities and inconsistencies that you have mentioned.


 * By the way, if you would like the link to your talk page to be the part of your signature you can set that in your preferences. See Signatures. Jogers 09:32, 25 May 2007 (UTC)

"Your comments are welcome." Thank you! "I don't find them annoying or offensive" Good. "but I'm wondering if you don't think it's important enough to argue about then why are you arguing about it?" (Pause while he laughs out loud.) Fair comment! In that particular case, by argue I meant "fight verbally". Presumably you are interpreting argue as "discuss"? As you've probably already deduced, I love a good discussion, but I'm not too keen on verbal fights.

" ... I only mean the convention followed by most English language publishers ... " Good. So it seems that we're both on the same track here. The difference is that I don't think there is just one convention that most follow. I admit I haven't done an exhaustive study, so I'm not in a position to comment on "It doesn't seem to change that much.", but I have developed a different impression. I guess it's time to do some homework and turn my impression into an opinion supported by hard facts.

"I'm anxious to hear from you about the ambiguities and inconsistencies that you have mentioned." Yes, I know you are. I want to give you a thorough answer, and I don't currently have enough spare time to do that.

"By the way, ... " Well spotted! Thank you. As enjoyable as this is, I'm afraid I must get on with other things now. Regards Pdfpdf 11:57, 25 May 2007 (UTC)


 * I meant a polite discussion, of course. I'm not too keen on verbal fights neither. Actually, I agree with you that following a certain convention is not a must but consistency is a good thing, isn't it? Good luck with your project! Jogers (talk) 12:20, 25 May 2007 (UTC)

"but consistency is a good thing, isn't it?" Not always; it depends on the situation/circumstances. e.g. On one hand: "Variety is the spice of life". On the other hand, the world would be a very different place if the laws of Physics and Gravity were not consistent. "Good luck with your project!" Thanks. Pdfpdf 12:44, 25 May 2007 (UTC)

Film update
If you'd take a look at User:SkierRMH/List You'll see that it's down to 4 groups:
 * 1) Titles within titles.  I'm not sure of the way to go on these: Characters from The Incredibles is a good example, "The Incredibles" is the film title, which is included in the article title. Correct caps would seem to be 'the', since the film name isn't set off by quotation marks or following a colon.
 * 2) Carry On articles; I brought this up on the film talk page, and got one good reply. My instinct is to consider "Carry On" as the verb, and to keep both capped wherever they appear in the title.  The rest would follow normal capping norms.
 * 3) Contested... will just wait on the first; the second would get bumped up to category #1.
 * 4) I will double check these, but assume they've been completed.

That's it for that bunch... if you ever want to repeat the scan allowing for more false-positives, just dump it in the file & we'll get to work on it! Thanks. SkierRMH 23:37, 22 May 2007 (UTC)

Questionable punctuation?
Does the bot have the capability of picking up on questionable punctuation in a title, such as Yesterday, Today and Tomorrow. It's been moved from the apparently correct "Yesterday, Today, and Tomorrow" even though the Italian original is punctuated correctly. Just thought this might be parallel or part of the ongoing grammatically correct struggle :) SkierRMH 06:01, 26 May 2007 (UTC)

Bot help!
Hey mate, I have boh clue as to how to create a bot. I want to create something that looks at all pages that use Infobox music DVD and changes anything that uses the region codes differently to changes I've just made where all it needs is the region number and it links accordingly, but many pages that use the template use different things, like NTSC and other things (that aren't right or topical). Can you give me a hand in dong this? I'm pretty much thinking anything that isn't regions 0 - 8 or using the words "region {0-8}" to be cleared and anything that says "region #" is just replaced with the number in question. What do you think? Is it possible and is it plausible? --linca linca 08:04, 5 June 2007 (UTC)


 * Sounds reasonable. Using AutoWikiBrowser is probably the easiest way to run a bot if you don't have programming experience. It's a convenient tool that makes repetitive tasks much easier. In order to use it you need to be registered first but it's no big deal. The tool will allow you to make a list of pages that transclude Infobox music DVD, load them and automatically apply changes you specify in find and replace settings. You will only need to click "save" and the next page will load up automatically. You could also take advantage of regular expressions because using them makes find and replace settings very flexible. I found this page very helpful, there are also many tutorials about regexes online. Opening a separate account and requesting for approval will allow you to edit pages using AWB in automatic mode but I suggest that you try to make some edits manually first. If that sounds too complicated you can also request work to be done by a bot or just ask me to do this :-) Please don't hesitate to ask me if you have any questions. I'll be happy to help as much as I can. Regards, Jogers 12:08, 6 June 2007 (UTC)

Re: Strip unorthodox chronologies?
As I noted on your bot talk page, someone already reverted these. Thanks anyway! --PEJL 12:50, 6 June 2007 (UTC)


 * Sorry, I confused this with another issue. --PEJL 14:33, 6 June 2007 (UTC)

Re: Unorthodox extra chronologies
Topic moved from WT:ALBUM: "I removed all of them from pages that both transcluded Extra chronology 2 and linked to SST Records. I missed Crazy Backwards Alphabet somehow, though. Jogers 19:32, 11 June 2007 (UTC)"
 * Neat! How does one do something like that? I can see how that would be useful for certain things... --PEJL 19:40, 11 June 2007 (UTC)


 * It can easily by done with AutoWikiBrowser. It allows you to make lists of articles from various sources like categories, "what links here", user contributions etc. and find difference or intersection with another list. This is also what I use to make lists like List4 or List5. As you seem to be familiar with regular expressions I think you would greatly benefit from using this software. Jogers 19:54, 11 June 2007 (UTC)


 * See also my comments about AWB above. Jogers 19:58, 11 June 2007 (UTC)


 * AWB again, I see. I didn't know it could do intersections as well. I might just have to boot up Windows some time to try it out. Thanks for the info! --PEJL 20:13, 11 June 2007 (UTC)

Julian Dobrowolski
Concerning my new article, I do not understand the problem. It is well referenced and articles have been written about this man's activity in the Polish newspapers over the past couple of months, notably within the last week when he was connected to Krzysztof Rutkowski.

Please tell me what I need to add to make it more reliable. This is the first time I'm making a Wikipedia article, so I am vary inexperienced and don't exactly know what it lacks.

Thanks.Matti1003.


 * You mean by posting external links or is it just possible to reference newspaper articles, or authors for example? —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Matti1003 (talk • contribs).

I'm going to be posting newspaper references with online links wherever possible. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Matti1003 (talk • contribs).

vandal revert
Thanks for reverting vandalism (by the contributor above) on my user page! Cheers. -- Myke Cuthbert (talk) 13:13, 14 June 2007 (UTC)

WikiProject Nickel Creek
Just wondering if you wanted to join! If not, that's okay! Thamusemeantfan 06:01, 28 June 2007 (UTC)

Minor whitespace issue
Hey, Jogers. I notice your AWB changes like this remove the empty line between the artist navigation template and the categories. Is that intended? To me, it is clearer with an empty line there. --PEJL 14:58, 10 July 2007 (UTC)


 * It's a part of AWB's general fixes that are applied automatically in addition to the main changes. Most of them are quite useful (for example the link to Let It Bleed was fixed in the edit you mentioned). I don't know what is the intention of this particular whitespace tweak. You may wish to find out at Wikipedia talk:AutoWikiBrowser. I agree that it looks clearer with the empty line. Jogers (talk) 15:47, 10 July 2007 (UTC)


 * (No link to Let It Bleed there AFAICT) but I definitely agree that most of AWB's changes are good. I've opened a topic at WT:AWB. --PEJL 16:50, 10 July 2007 (UTC)

Disambiguation of albums
I just do not see any other way. How else is a person to know who created an album when clicking on it from a genre's category? It may be that it should never have been listed there in that way, but the practice is so widespread - because most people think of categorizing an album directly into a genre, not knowing that in fact you are supposed to place groups of artist albums in them. But that is not practical. It is really hard creating Category:John Coltrane hard bop albums over and over for new artists. Not to mention they might have only made one album in that specific form throughout their career. If we made Album name (Artist name) a standard then we wouldn't have to create categories like Category:John Coltrane hard bop albums; we could just list the album directly in the hard bop category. (Mind meal 21:30, 12 July 2007 (UTC))
 * You've provided no reason outside "being hard" for why it would not be a good idea. I'll do what I want to do. Nothing abnormal about discussing ongoing discussions privately with someone. No need to get touchy or tell me to stop talking to you, this is it. Just don't tell me what to do, I'm not your little boy. (Mind meal 22:01, 12 July 2007 (UTC))

possibility of "borrowing" bot - or a request for lists
I'd really like to use a bot to create several lists like you've made for albums, etc., but specifically for films. I've tried several other modes, but it seems like a bot would be the best for this. I don't have any experience in writing/using these, so I'm turning to you to see if one or two things would be possible. Listed in what I see as less work for you - to more... I'm open to other suggestions as well, but I think that this would greatly speed up some of the massively repetitive things I've been doing as of late!
 * 1) Getting your assistance in setting up a "parallel" bot that I'd run on my own
 * 2) Somehow piggybacking on your bot to create the lists
 * 3) Asking you to create the lists.

And, thanks much for the constant work with the Albums project! :) SkierRMH 04:09, 16 July 2007 (UTC)
 * Yup, I do use AWB - but have been stymied by the "filter" / how to get the "intersections". I've started with the basic "make list from category" - "category" is "All disputed non-free images" - no problem there.  Then click on "filter" which brings up the new window.  I see the "set operations" and the drop-down "find intersection", but get stuck there.  Am I supposed to do a second "category" is (i.e.) "Film poster images" first? and then filter?

The other lists are pretty self-explanatory, just never thought of using AWB with the regexes to filter out the titles... a job for this weekend! Thanks for any direction you can give me on the correct use of AWB to make those lists! SkierRMH 14:38, 16 July 2007 (UTC)


 * Single click updates - definitely interested! I think I've got the basics finally, but anything to streamline would be great! SkierRMH 15:53, 22 July 2007 (UTC)


 * I've been tracking three groups with disputed fair use:
 * Film poster images
 * DVD covers
 * Book covers


 * After that the "no rationale" for them, in the same priority, would be the next task. SkierRMH 19:49, 22 July 2007 (UTC)

album cover fur
FYI: the template has been brought up for discussion both at WP:AN (here) and WT:FAIR (here). As you're probably the one who has now used the template the most times, your input would probably be valuable.

Also you should be aware that there have been attempts to modify or even outright delete the template, even while discussions are going on. I have asked at WP:AN for full protection of it, pending the discussions, but I don't know that anyone's done anything. Jheald 12:17, 16 July 2007 (UTC)

A couple suggestions for User:Jogers/List7, where you talk about albums needing rationale. First, you ought to mention that Template:album cover fur is only appropriate for specific types of uses, e.g. album covers in the infobox about the album. You should say that people can use it "if appropriate" or something like that. Second, people don't have to skip over images that are bigger than 300 X 300. I'm not exactly sure where that limit comes from, or why 400 X 400 or 500 X 500 is too big. It might just be a rule of thumb that comes from nowhere. But anyway, if people want to reduce the size of an image they can just do that by editing the image and re-uploading it. That's best if they have some software. But that can also be done easily by finding a 300 X 300 pix reduction on the article page, saving that, then re-uploading that one into the image page. Wikidemo 10:24, 19 July 2007 (UTC)

User:Jogers/List7
Perhaps some sympathetic admins could be rounded up to undelete the redlink images on that list/add rationales to them? (or just undelete if quicker and leave the rationales to non-admins). I'll do a few if I know that other folks are doing some too i.e. that I'm not fighting a losing battle when I could be doing something more useful :) --kingboyk 23:14, 19 July 2007 (UTC)

Peer review for Street Fighting Man
Would you mind contributing to the peer review for "Street Fighting Man"? Thanks in advance. Stan weller 04:24, 23 July 2007 (UTC)

User:Jogers/List4
Finished off the rest of these - left a couple that could use a confirmation on the lack of need to move. SkierRMH 06:03, 23 July 2007 (UTC)
 * FYI, the album Horse & Elephant Eatery (No Elephants Allowed): The Singles and Songles Album was placed on List4 although it's on the list of exceptions. Thanks for the updates! --Fisherjs 21:16, 31 July 2007 (UTC)
 * That's very strange. It may be a bug in DotNetWikiBot Framework. Thanks for the note. Jogers 21:33, 31 July 2007 (UTC)

A question for you
Just a note that there is a question that I hope you can answer in this topic. Thanks in advance. --PEJL 10:16, 24 July 2007 (UTC)

Planet Earth
Hi. The article Planet Earth refers to a TV series, not an album. I know that it contains details of the soundtrack album, but this is very much a subsidiary part of the article and not its main subject. I've reverted the Talk page several times now because the WikiProjectAlbum tag keeps getting added. Obviously not your fault as the Bot is only following instructions, but is it Wiki policy that the tag should be added to all articles that feature albums, regardless of subject? :-) Chris 42 16:38, 5 August 2007 (UTC)

That's fine. Thanks! :-) Chris 42 17:14, 5 August 2007 (UTC)

AntiSpamBot
AntiSpamBot runs continuously, except when it crashes. It also does not revert when his main 'feeder' (a bot that actually observes the link-additions) crashes. At this very moment, both are dead. If you want to learn more, you can join us on IRC (link to talkchannel & link to bot-channel; you need e.g. MIRC or the Firefox plugin 'chatzilla' for that), that is where we control the bots. Hope this explains. --Dirk Beetstra T C 18:05, 6 August 2007 (UTC)

Re: Using regexes when manually editing articles
Copy-paste from textarea into my text editor, run an action which performs a batch of regex replacements, make manual edits, copy-paste back to textarea. It could probably be done more easily with AWB, but that doesn't run natively on my primary operating system. --PEJL 13:20, 15 August 2007 (UTC)


 * I see. Thanks. Jogers 13:22, 15 August 2007 (UTC)

List of improperly capitalized album articles
Sure, I've actually run the old regex that you had on list 5 on books (pretty good - less than 50), songs (what an absolute mess - I think between the two of us we kept a couple admins busy with requested moves for a couple of days!), and films (pretty good). I see that you've updated User:Jogers/List5 and I'll start working on that in the next couple of days. Thanks also for putting up the new regex on that list -makes it easier to cut and paste it into AWB.

On a similar issue, is there a way with AWB to cull out the ALL CAPS titles - or titles that have words that may have all capped words (the first would be preferable, as the second would probably give way too many false positives)? I've been fixing them as I see them, but with the tendency of some language groups to use all caps (really bad with the "Anime" articles), it's getting harder to keep up with them! SkierRMH 17:10, 15 August 2007 (UTC)


 * Should be quite simple. Something like: . --PEJL 17:18, 15 August 2007 (UTC)
 * PEJL - Thanks for that, I'll try it when I get home (can't run that on my work computer!). I did a similar code and the results were quite "unusual" (either didn't cull anything or culled everything :)SkierRMH 18:39, 15 August 2007 (UTC)


 * There are quite a few of them. Would you like me to make another maintenance list? Jogers 17:47, 15 August 2007 (UTC)
 * Just for curiosity's sake, an initial run would be interesting! SkierRMH 18:39, 15 August 2007 (UTC)
 * Here it is. Jogers 18:45, 15 August 2007 (UTC)


 * SkierRMH, would you like me to regularly update the list of improperly capitalized books, films etc. like I do for list5? We could even start WikiProject Capitalization or something :-) Jogers 17:47, 15 August 2007 (UTC)
 * If it's not too much of a problem, you could attach them to the lists that I've got going right now. I don't think they're going to be too big at all, as both books and films projects are pretty good at catching them when they pop up! SkierRMH 18:39, 15 August 2007 (UTC)
 * OK, I'll set it up soon. Jogers 18:45, 15 August 2007 (UTC)

List 5
I've added a section on the bottom of this page for "second opinions" - hopefully the concerns are explained well enough. SkierRMH 07:26, 16 August 2007 (UTC)

Capitalization lists for books and films
The film list looks good, although theoretically "A" and "B" would have been resolved to have gotten that far long - theoretically! I don't know of an overarching category that includes all of them. The books and novels categories are the ones that I ran the minimized version on, so there hopefully wouldn't be too many in them. SkierRMH 23:50, 16 August 2007 (UTC)

AWB Developer
Hi, Your now listed on SF, and have SVN access

Enjoy, and welcome aboard!

Reedy Boy 15:57, 20 August 2007 (UTC)


 * No Problem. AFAIK, you should have all the required rights to help us break AWB like we do ;)! Reedy Boy 15:59, 20 August 2007 (UTC)

List 5 User talk:Jogers/List5
Jogers - There's a group of titles of which I was uncertain on the correct caps at the bottom of the talk page. The last bot was almost entirely this list. Would you take a look at them and see what you think - either retitle or move. Thanks. SkierRMH 19:00, 24 August 2007 (UTC)

Welcome back & hope you enjoyed your well-deserved vacation! I ran abbreviated versions of the lists when I saw they weren't being generated.

I've also gotten into the "bot" racket SkiersBot that's doing some of the other work that I was doing manually... tedium beyond belief! It's tagging articles that (first runs) have "stub" category templates on the articles but are not tagged as such on the talk pages. After the stub categories, I'm going to run various categories that belong to different projects. Only a couple of little glitches so far - and it's been interesting going through the process! SkierRMH 06:57, 3 September 2007 (UTC)

Fair Use request.
Hey there, I saw you did the fair use rationale for a House Of Pain CD Cover... Could you help me out and give me the fair use on a image I uploaded from a screenshot? Image:Everlast1.JPG - This is the image I need help with.

Thanks! Erryday I'm 05:38, 12 September 2007 (UTC)
 * Thanks for the quick reply.. Do you know a way I could get a free image for his article? Perhaps a screenshot from a live show? CD Cover? I would just like an actual image there instead of nothing. Oh, and can I upload a self-made picture to display on my user page? Because I feel its kind of bland. Erryday I'm 20:52, 12 September 2007 (UTC)
 * Solved all my problems, thanks again! Erryday I'm 02:55, 14 September 2007 (UTC)

Re:GetDiff Exception
Hi Jogers, Seen as you are someone who should be able to provide some more information easily, what caused this error for you?

Or what were you doing at the time?

Cheers

Reedy Boy 15:42, 12 September 2007 (UTC)


 * What was the cause then? As presumably, the other 2 reports of it will be the same - ie something at their end. Cheers Reedy Boy 13:07, 13 September 2007 (UTC)

Ahhh, ok. That makes sense. If these other people had done some form of manual install and not moved the DLL, that would cause it i presume. I think it may be worth getting AWB to check if the Wikidiff2.dll dll exists on loadup - Then let the user know if it doesnt. Reedy Boy 13:32, 13 September 2007 (UTC)


 * User:Pixi's problem is most certainly the same as yours - being exactly the same exception message. The Other, in english - "Exception: NullReferenceException Message: The reference of object is not defined in an authority of an object" Reedy Boy 13:33, 13 September 2007 (UTC)
 * Just realised, AWB updater didnt do Wikidiff2.dll... Reedy Boy 13:36, 13 September 2007 (UTC)
 * Hi, I am Pixi, see the details of my problems here: Re: GetDiff Exception. Bye --Pixi 18:17, 13 September 2007 (UTC)

AWB Bug fix Release
Im thinking we should put out 4.1.1.0 this weekend...

Reedy Boy 12:48, 15 September 2007 (UTC)

Your RfA was successful
Congratulations, I have closed your RfA as successful and you are now a sysop! If you have any questions about adminship, feel free to ask me. Please consider messaging me on IRC for access to the #wikipedia-en-admins channel. Good luck! --Deskana (talky) 23:02, 16 September 2007 (UTC)
 * Yay! Now you can roguely allow people AWB access like the rest of us ;) Reedy Boy 09:58, 17 September 2007 (UTC)
 * Congratulations. You should make a great 'rouge' admin ;) Pursey  Talk 10:02, 17 September 2007 (UTC)
 * No problems! I'm sure you will be a fantastic admin. Have fun! Phgao 11:45, 17 September 2007 (UTC)


 * Congratulations and you are certainly welcome. Cheers, :) Dloh cierekim'''  12:36, 17 September 2007 (UTC)


 * Congratulations! I hadn't realized what a dangerous question I asked :-O You should continue to use common sense rather than strict procedure: to speedy delete a band but not its album? or a person's bio but not their pet's? or a real person, but not a made up person? as the proceduralists would have one do makes WP into a process rather than an encyclopedia - and by the way would any of them be happy were someone to close down a DRV debate if the editor requesting the deletion review failed to notify the deleting admin as required? Ah, process is interpreted by some as only working to keep crap rather than to get us somewhere without it. My $0.02. Your mileage may vary. :-) Carlossuarez46 20:37, 17 September 2007 (UTC)

AWB
Ah thanks for allowing me, I plan on having a look, but I'm really not familiar with it at all. Hopefully I can configure it to do some menial tasks. Phgao 11:54, 17 September 2007 (UTC)
 * Wow I just saw you as a AWB Developer! You must have surely contributed a lot. Phgao 11:56, 17 September 2007 (UTC)
 * Will do, I just downloaded it, and I don't think I will be using it. I'll stick to reverting vandalism, welcoming users, reporting as well as checking the new pages. Phgao 12:07, 17 September 2007 (UTC)

RFA
My sincerest congratulations. I wish you good luck in your admin work. - Mtmelendez (Talk 00:21, 18 September 2007 (UTC)
 * Yeah, good work, Jogers. You'll go far. Flowerparty ☀ 08:27, 18 September 2007 (UTC)

TLA - "Professional" opinion requested ...
Hi there! There's a bit of a debate going on at Talk:Three-letter abbreviation about TLA. (If you have no idea what a TLA is, could you read this first please?)

I figured you would be a good person to ask: "What is the 'best' name for the 'main' page?" (And why is that the "best" name?)

Could you post your reply on Talk:Three-letter abbreviation please? (My personal preference is for "TLA" or "Three Letter Acronym", but ... ). Regards, Pdfpdf 09:40, 18 September 2007 (UTC)

Thanks. Pdfpdf 11:50, 18 September 2007 (UTC)

Re:AWB user count update automation
Yup :)

I noticed the new talk page for it

Reedy Boy 16:26, 18 September 2007 (UTC)
 * Didnt alphasort, but i removed the rest of the administrators from the list! Reedy Boy 20:23, 18 September 2007 (UTC)

AWB
Hi, I was and I had a username change; I'm no longer able to use AWB. Could you help?--Porcupine (prickle me!) 20:07, 18 September 2007 (UTC)
 * Thanks very much!--Porcupine (prickle me!) 07:02, 19 September 2007 (UTC)

Congrats
Congrats on getting adminship. Good luck!:)--SJP 01:18, 19 September 2007 (UTC)

TypoBot
Thanks for once again adding TypoBot to the list of approved AWB users. However, shouldn't the bot be listed under the Bots section instead of Approved users section? -- Saaga 03:16, 19 September 2007 (UTC)
 * Thanks for clearing that up. -- Saaga 15:25, 19 September 2007 (UTC)

Barnstars say too little, so...



 * Haha, Thats Ace!! Reedy Boy 18:42, 19 September 2007 (UTC)

Userpage
Hey Jogers. I was curious if you wanted my to redesign your userpage, if so leave me a message on my talk page with a series of colors, themes, and maybe a picture or two you like. -- Тhε Rαnδom Eδιτor 19:28, 19 September 2007 (UTC)
 * Great. It will hopefully be done by 8pm EST. -- Тhε Rαnδom Eδιτor 19:47, 19 September 2007 (UTC)
 * Done. -- Тhε Rαnδom Eδιτor 20:52, 19 September 2007 (UTC)

Deletion Request
I have closed the deletion debate Articles for deletion/Calita (Driv3r Character) as delete. Is it possible if you delete it because I do not have the admin tools, thanks. (If this was an inappropiate request, please tell me, I have only spent six months here and don't know that much.) Marlith  T / C  01:42, 20 September 2007 (UTC)
 * And while your at it, can you consider this Articles for deletion/Jay Smilkstein, thanks! Marlith  T / C  01:50, 20 September 2007 (UTC)

My AWB Request

 * I've approved your request but please do not change links to redirects that are not broken.

Ah, I didn't know about that particular rule, because that's what I wanted to do in the first place! Yesterday I already fixed the links that pointed to "Yankovich" instead of "Yankovic" which falls under the acceptable usage of changing the redirects. I'll probably use the AWB for things like typo fixes and so forth instead. Thanks a lot!  Gromreaper (Talk) /(Cont) 01:22, 21 September 2007 (UTC)

AWB updater failure
When I decline the attempt to update my 4.1.0.0 (you know that I'm still using it =) ) to later version, the updater encounters the following problem: Value cannot be null. Parameter name: address

AWB encountered an exception.

Thank you for making the AWB better.

Mashiah 21:50, 21 September 2007 (UTC)


 * Its because its still trying to download from a blank link. should prevent it trying to download if the optional upgrade is declined. Also, there as a check for the string being "", but not being null. So they were intialised, but nothing entered for them, meaning they didnt get caught.  Reedy Boy 22:03, 21 September 2007 (UTC)
 * More improvements - Reedy Boy 22:09, 21 September 2007 (UTC)
 * Great! Jogers 22:11, 21 September 2007 (UTC)
 * Just thinking. I really need to go over the updater code in detail, and possibly overhaul some bits. Check things are assigned as needed and such Will try and get it done for the next release. The IsNullOrEmpty will make a bit of difference. Reedy Boy 22:14, 21 September 2007 (UTC)

Replacement next to ref
Just tested User:Rich Farmbrough/another user page and the replacement (of check}} works if I uncheck the first box "Ignore external/interwiki...", not otherwise.  Probably the &lt;ref/&gt; tag is seen as part of the URL.  So this may specifically apply to refs endig with URLS and similar.  Rich Farmbrough, 11:30 22 September 2007 (GMT).

Jogersbot false positive
What's up with this? --PEJL 19:47, 22 September 2007 (UTC)


 * OK. It seems to me that such a situation alone should not cause the bot to assume the target page is an album article. --PEJL 09:18, 23 September 2007 (UTC)


 * I don't know if the bot operates on song articles, but I assume it's much more common for such articles, as song articles are regularly converted to redirects to the album. --PEJL 09:34, 23 September 2007 (UTC)


 * Ahh, I see. (I assumed they both redirected.) Never mind then. --PEJL 09:43, 23 September 2007 (UTC)

Use X newline characters
Hello, Jogers. I've successfully installed the new version of AWB and now using the parameter X from the subject. It seems to me this parameter is not saved to any setting files and it has to be changed again and again each time I restart AWB. Maybe it is not a good idea to put this parameter into an xml settings file, because one user may not probably have different values for different setting files. So, I suppose it depends only on a user, not on the task he solves. Thus, do you think it is possible to put the value into a general settings file for AWB? Mashiah 20:30, 25 September 2007 (UTC)
 * Its doable, and a fairly easy thing to add :) Stick it on the AWB feature request page, and it most certainly will be dealt with! Reedy Boy 20:34, 25 September 2007 (UTC)

AWB
I've applied for this twice now. I know the first time i didn't have over 500 edits but the second time? Do you know why i haven't been approved? --Savre 23:18, 26 September 2007 (UTC)
 * Oh cool. I get it, "mainspace edits". Cheers. --Savre 08:20, 27 September 2007 (UTC)

AWB
Hi, noticed your observation on my 3RR blocks. The first blocks in February and March 2006 were in relation to the controversial American System page and my newness to Wikipedia. I had not yet understood the policy. The middle block of the same year was over the WP:NOR page in which an intense discussion over policy changes being made without discussion was underway. I tried to protect the page in its original form with the reverts; until discussion was concluded. This was obviously wrong and didn't help the situation. Eventually through the intervention and guidance of a few longterm admins I was unblocked and gave my word to stay away from the debate - which I kept. The latest block (Sept. 2007) was over Anchor Baby and here I fully disputed it - as I had not actually violated the policy in my opinion - however I did agree with the admin who blocked me in the end as the best move and it further enlightened me about the policy's changed wording and gave me a different perspective on reverting overall. Eventually this block was lifted the same day as well. I fully understand if this is off-putting and you wish not to approve on the block log's themselves. Just wanted to let you know the reasons therein. Regards - --Northmeister 13:47, 27 September 2007 (UTC)

Re: My userpage
No problem. I assumed you wouldn't mind. --PEJL 16:55, 2 October 2007 (UTC)

Returned
Thanks for the welcome back! I'm going to be sporadic in the next couple of weeks, as I'm going to three mandatory (and boring) continuing education workshops, but the hotels have free internet hookups, and there's no homework involved, so hopefully I'll get through the backlog of stuff! SkierRMH 21:28, 5 October 2007 (UTC)

Can you approve my bot for AWB use?
Hi Jogers. My bot was recently approved (Bots/Requests for approval/CapitalBot) and flagged as a bot, so could you approve it for use with AWB for me? I posted a request here already: Wikipedia talk:AutoWikiBrowser/CheckPage. I just want to get started while it's still the weekend which is why I'm asking you directly. Thanks, and let me know if there's a problem. --CapitalR 19:43, 7 October 2007 (UTC)

AWB
I know that this will seem really stupid to ask, but, is there a way that I can get the, for want of a better word, power to approve users for use of it? Thanks in advance for your answer. Your Grace Lord Sir Dreamy of Buckland  tm  02:45, 14 October 2007 (UTC)


 * Ah, than I thank you, as it appears that I will have to wait for a couple months, at least, to get that trust, and finish my familarization of the policies. Again thank you. Your Grace Lord Sir Dreamy of Buckland   tm  11:52, 14 October 2007 (UTC)

Re: High Culture
Thanks! --PEJL 11:40, 19 October 2007 (UTC)

AWB Feature Requests
Couple for you to look at
 * Wikipedia_talk:AutoWikiBrowser/Feature_requests
 * Wikipedia_talk:AutoWikiBrowser/Feature_requests

I'm pointing at them as i've commented/implemented one of them =)

Reedy Boy 20:52, 19 October 2007 (UTC)
 * Both now sorted =) Reedy Boy 12:24, 20 October 2007 (UTC)


 * Changed the watch thing over.. But a few issues have come up.. See the page. Reedy Boy 14:30, 20 October 2007 (UTC)
 * The other way, is to create a url to feed into the web browser - or ... Reedy Boy 14:37, 20 October 2007 (UTC)

Improper title bots
Greetings again! What's the possibility of adding special characters to the 'no no' article title lists? I just ran across a Beautiful Reel. B'z Live-Gym 2002 Green ~Go★Fight★Win~ which violates about 3 of the naming conventions rules! I'd add all the punctuation characters except. , : ! ( and ). I know there'd probably be a slew of false positives for the first list, but I'm willing to look through a list (maybe trying the non-language characters first) to see how bad it would be. SkierRMH 07:13, 27 October 2007 (UTC)

AWB
I don't understand why. I try to make edits on it that aren't just spacing, but if it came up, I'd just press save. Many of my edits were other things, anyway... ✗iℎi✗ (talk) 11:38, 2 November 2007 (UTC)
 * I'm sorry, but it was just a habit to press save the times it wasn't more than spacing. Is there anyway I can get back on the AWB list?   ✗iℎi✗  (talk) 12:06, 2 November 2007 (UTC)
 * Although I'm not an official member of WP:ALBUMS, I want to go through a mass amount of album pages and correct any mistakes or formatting to follow the WP:ALBUM's guidelines. AWB was the only way to do this fast and efficiently, though.   ✗iℎi✗  (talk) 16:18, 3 November 2007 (UTC)
 * Well, as I mentioned, if I saw something that didn't follow one of the guidelines, I'd fix it. I remember fixing a large amount, too.   ✗iℎi✗  (talk) 16:18, 3 November 2007 (UTC)
 * Alright, thank you. I'll look through some other methods of trying to do what I do.   ✗iℎi✗  (talk) 16:45, 3 November 2007 (UTC)

List suggestions
Hey Jogers. Would you consider adding lists for  (possibly to User:Jogers/List4) and   (should be   per WP:SONG)? I suspect there are large number of articles using "single" dabs. --PEJL 15:18, 4 November 2007 (UTC)


 * Oh, and album articles with  might also be useful (see WT:ALBUM). --PEJL 15:22, 4 November 2007 (UTC)


 * Sure, thanks for your suggestions. How about including "VHS", "DVD" and "film" in User:Jogers/List4 and creating a separate list for "Song" and "single"? Jogers 15:26, 4 November 2007 (UTC)


 * Sounds good. --PEJL 15:50, 4 November 2007 (UTC)


 * Actually, the second one will produce a lot of false positives. Many films are tagged as album articles because they have an album infobox in soundtrack section. Jogers 15:33, 4 November 2007 (UTC)


 * Would it be possible to exclude articles which transclude Infobox Film to avoid this problem? --PEJL 15:50, 4 November 2007 (UTC)


 * Yes, I think so. I'll update the bot code soon. Jogers 15:55, 4 November 2007 (UTC)


 * Try setting your sig to  to avoid having to clean it up manually. --PEJL 21:19, 4 November 2007 (UTC)


 * Thanks for the tip! :-) Jogers 21:26, 4 November 2007 (UTC)

Fair use rationale lists automatic updates
You actually beat me to the 'punch' on this one! I was trying to come up with a way for the bot to tag the image itself in some way so that it could be transcluded to another page by the date.

The benefit of the current system is that it does list by dates, so that whomever is working on it knows the oldest, thus the most 'stale' and immediate images and can work on those first. With the other system(s) it would be nice to have that feature - at least know what day it was added, for the same reasons.

A further thought - to create a daily list (images that 'pop up' for the first time on day X. Then have the bot simply check that list, remove ones that have been deleted or fair use added, and when the list disappears, delete the section.  Subsequent sections would then not include anything listed in the previous sections.  Don't know if I explained that well, hope so :) SkierRMH 17:27, 4 November 2007 (UTC)


 * As long as the list is sorted by date (oldest on top), that would be great. As long as this happens, then there's really no need to tag the image or to go through all of the other work.  (I was trying to think of a way to make an 'intuitive' transclusion to a page that would list those that met the intersection of the two categories, but couldn't come up with a way to do that, and thought that tagging the image would be the answer, but that doesn't seem to be a good resolution either, as you point out).


 * If you can simply change the bot code to keep the lists' content updated on a daily basis, putting them in chronological order, that would mean a lot less work on culling the daily lists. SkierRMH 19:50, 4 November 2007 (UTC)

Just worked through User:SkierRMH/List4 - This Template messages/Image namespace was included in the "not dated" list! I added fair use where appropriate and just ignored the others. Let's see what happens after the next run! THANKS!! SkierRMH 23:47, 4 November 2007 (UTC)
 * Ditto on my list3 with Template messages/Image namespace SkierRMH 00:01, 5 November 2007 (UTC)

User:SkierRMH/List
I've been adding the exemptions for both the books and films on the talk page, could you double-check that the bot is catching the books - the same ones keep popping up each week! Thanks. SkierRMH 14:32, 5 November 2007 (UTC)
 * Muchas Gracias! SkierRMH 15:07, 5 November 2007 (UTC)

User:Jogers/Template:Album
Hi again. I've been cleaning up Category:WikiProject Albums, moving the templates to a new sub-category Category:WikiProject Albums templates and doing other clean up. Other than the two editprotected requests pending for Album and Needsinfobox which need admin assistance (hint, hint), all that's left is User:Jogers/Template:Album. Is that a test page that serves a purpose anymore? If so, can it be moved to Template:Album/sandbox? If not, can it be deleted? --PEJL 17:05, 5 November 2007 (UTC)


 * Thanks, and thanks for the offer! I doubt I'd pass the admin gauntlet though (and I don't really need more duties to neglect). --PEJL 18:37, 5 November 2007 (UTC)

Re:TypeInitializationException in AWB
Yup, I do

And i also got it on a version i pulled from the SVN of the last release

So yeah..

Its

Its where it goes out to the C++ Wikidiff2 module.. It just throws an exception

As for debugging it... *shrugs*

Works fine for MaxSem - It doest like it on my 2003 box, which hasnt been updated either (worked on that last time i tried)... Im now on 64bit vista...

Notice that Max has presumably accidentally released a debug version...

Reedy Boy 19:32, 5 November 2007 (UTC)


 * And get the same with the 4.1.3.0 release! Reedy Boy 19:39, 5 November 2007 (UTC)


 * I've had a full pc upgrade, and gone from XP SP2 to Vista Ultimate 64bit.. And hadn't tried AWB after reinstalling till i put visual studio on again! The cause is related to the wikidiff2, i presume, but nothing changed with that or the file that interfaces with it :/.


 * From googling, i think its security related.. Maybe. Just tried 4.0.0.1 i had saved, and that doesnt work either... Tried running as administrator... Running in XP SP2 compatability... Its just weird, the last release was fine, but now loads of people get the error... Reedy Boy 20:13, 5 November 2007 (UTC)


 * Have now tried both methods with the same effect... Reedy Boy 20:37, 5 November 2007 (UTC)


 * Might be worth trying a release... One, it has some more bug fixes, and it may sort the issue out for the other users...Just a note, make sure its a "release" build, and make sure the IFD and CFD plugins go in the correct directories, ie Plugin\CFD - I just take the last ok release, and copy and replace/update ALL files! Reedy Boy 10:26, 6 November 2007 (UTC)


 * Just tried it on this uni machine im sat at. Debug release, builds and diff's fine on these XP SP2 boxes... :/ But i do agree, my machine not working, is maybe not relatedReedy Boy 10:44, 6 November 2007 (UTC)


 * How are we going to proceed. We know we can fix the updater bug easily... Should we just try throwing out a proper release build (i'll do it tonight if needs be), mark as 4.1.4.2 (ie over the SVN, move svn to .3) and see if that fixes anything for anyone...? Reedy Boy 17:53, 7 November 2007 (UTC)


 * Done. That will at least fix 2 of the bugs (the profiler and the updater bug) Lets hope with the WikiDiff it sorts it... Reedy Boy 10:56, 8 November 2007 (UTC)


 * Yay.. Thank god!! I did disable 4.1.4.0 purely with how painful it had generally been. Yes, someone has complained, but i'd rather one was complaining as they had a forced optional update, rather than many being unable to use the software!! Reedy Boy 16:20, 8 November 2007 (UTC)

Re:"Watch" button
Buggar...

I'll put it on the message.

Reedy Boy 19:19, 8 November 2007 (UTC)
 * Or maybe not the best idea... Hmm... What to do.. As another release is pointless Reedy Boy 19:20, 8 November 2007 (UTC)
 * Agreed...! Reedy Boy 19:36, 8 November 2007 (UTC)

Update on "new" bots
Just wanted to let you know that the "new" image bots seems to be working well. My only question is, for example, on User:SkierRMH/List4, November 11, Image:Constitutionalchaos.jpg is listed but doesn't qualify for non-free use. If I remove that (and other's that don't qualify) will the bot just replace it the next time? The reason I ask is that, let's say that two people are working on a list, to remove (& not have replaced) non-qualifying images would keep both from doing duplicate evaluation work.

Otherwise, seems to be working quite well! SkierRMH (talk) 18:44, 17 November 2007 (UTC)
 * As it's me just doing them right now, it's not a big deal... maybe something to think of for the future (if one could get various project cooperation), but it's working just fine as it is. SkierRMH (talk) 23:35, 17 November 2007 (UTC)

WP:AWB
Can you please approve the users and the bot? Thanks, as I would like to run the bot. &lt; DREAMAFTER &gt;&lt; TALK &gt; 02:47, 20 November 2007 (UTC)
 * Dealt with... —<font face="Trebuchet MS"> Reedy  Boy  10:36, 20 November 2007 (UTC)

Category:Album articles without cover art
Would you really call this a rough consensus? Jogers 10:40, 24 November 2007 (UTC)
 * What's your concern? - jc37 10:49, 24 November 2007 (UTC)
 * 5 opinions to delete and 5 to keep don't seem like a consensus to me. There's no other way to keep this category up to date and I know that there are several people working on it trying to clear the backlog. Jogers 11:06, 24 November 2007 (UTC)
 * "Vote" counting has nothing to do with consensus. And the technical concern appears to be absolutely incorrect. There is no reason to have the category as part of the infobox, as shown by other similar talk page templates. Read the closure again, and check out the templates to see what I mean. - jc37 11:17, 24 November 2007 (UTC)

Category restoration
I am restoring the categories to certain redirects to Geraint Watkins, The Balham Alligators, Down to Earth and High Cumberland Jubilee compilations, Jimmy Buffett greatest hits compilations, Jimmy Buffett sound board live albums, Would You Believe? (Hollies album), and Hollies (1965 album) that you deleted. Categories are appropriate for these articles per WP:CAT-RD "Categorization of list entries – Some well-organized lists have redirects pointing at their subsections. In such cases, categorization of the redirects can be an alternative way of browsing entries in a long list. It can also provide an alphabetical listing for lists that are not organised alphabetically, for example, lists organised in a chronological order. " —   AjaxSmack   03:58, 3 January 2008 (UTC)
 * Sorry about removing the categories. I didn't know it is acceptable and it caused problems with automatic tagging of album articles with my bot. Seems that I have to find another workaround. Regards, Jogers (talk) 12:50, 3 January 2008 (UTC)
 * And sorry here too if I sounded harsh. I didn't know it was bot related.  I think that categorization of redirects, even for albums, should be used sparingly but is appropriate in cases where albums are dealt with in some detail in the context of a list article or in cases of significant alternate titles (e.g., US vs UK editions).  Some music infoboxes link directly to category pages for discography information so it serves the reader well to allow for albums without full articles to be included.


 * I'm curious, what is the "automatic tagging of album articles" of which you speak and how do the redirects interfere with it? It was not apparent to me at User:Jogersbot. —   AjaxSmack    17:45, 3 January 2008 (UTC)

List of disputed non-free album covers
Hi Jogers. A Wikiproject has been set up to help deal with backlogs, including Category:Disputed non-free images. Would you mind if I put a link to the list of disputed album covers in your userspace on the project's talk page? They would be very useful for editors who want to work on a specific image type. Regards, Bláthnaid  14:01, 5 January 2008 (UTC)
 * Fantastic, thank you. Bláthnaid  14:48, 5 January 2008 (UTC)

Non-free use disputed for Image:Captain_Beefheart_-_Shiny_Beast_(Bat_Chain_Puller).jpg
Thanks for uploading Image:Captain_Beefheart_-_Shiny_Beast_(Bat_Chain_Puller).jpg. Unfortunately, I think that you have not provided a proper rationale for using this image under "fair use". Please read the instructions at Non-free content carefully, then go to the image description page and clarify why you think the image qualifies for fair use. Using one of the templates at Fair use rationale guideline is an easy way to ensure that your image is in compliance with Wikipedia policy, but remember that you must complete the template. Do not simply insert a blank template on an image page. Note that the image description page must include the exact name or a link to each article the image is used in and a separate rationale for each one. (If a link is used, automated processes may improperly add the related tag to the image.  Please change the fair use template to refer to the exact name, if you see this warning.)

If it is determined that the image does not qualify under fair use, it will be deleted after seven days according to our Criteria for speedy deletion. If you have any questions please ask them at the Media copyright questions page. Thank you. Rockfang (talk) 20:34, 17 January 2008 (UTC)

Image:Captain_Beefheart_-_Ice_Cream_for_Crow.jpg
I have tagged Image:Captain_Beefheart_-_Ice_Cream_for_Crow.jpg as a disputed use of non-free media, because there is a concern that the rationale you have provided for using this image under "fair use" may be invalid. Please clarify your fair use rationale on the image description page. Thank you. Rockfang (talk) 20:36, 17 January 2008 (UTC)

Ravel (clothing company)
Another editor has added the " " template to the article Ravel (clothing company), suggesting that it be deleted according to the proposed deletion process. All contributions are appreciated, but the editor doesn't believe it satisfies Wikipedia's criteria for inclusion, and has explained why in the article (see also What Wikipedia is not and Notability). Please either work to improve the article if the topic is worthy of inclusion in Wikipedia or discuss the relevant issues at its talk page. If you remove the  template, the article will not be deleted, but note that it may still be sent to Articles for deletion, where it may be deleted if consensus to delete is reached. BJBot (talk) 18:44, 30 January 2008 (UTC)