User talk:John from Idegon/Archive 26

Feeder elementary schools
Hi! I saw this edit about feeder elementary schools.

In fact elementary schools do indirectly feed into high schools. The reason why I include elementary schools is because an elementary school may be divided between two middle schools but feed into the same high school, or vice versa. WhisperToMe (talk) 13:21, 31 March 2014 (UTC)
 * It seems like material that would be primarily of local interest and hence out of guidelines, but it isn't that big of a deal. Certainly not worth me contesting you adding it back.  Thanks for letting me know.  Happy editing! John from Idegon (talk) 17:02, 31 March 2014 (UTC)
 * Happy editing too :) WhisperToMe (talk) 11:33, 1 April 2014 (UTC)

Ann Arbor neighborhoods
Why delete additional information on Ann Arbor neighborhoods? They exist, have names that are referred to daily by thousands of people but are also not known to many people. They are important for real estate transactions, political campaigns, socioeconomics, and have historic events separate from the city of Ann Arbor. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.11.169.223 (talk) 22:52, 3 April 2014 (UTC)
 * Major additions to a featured article such as Ann Arbor should be discussed on the article talk page. Articles that have reached the top status in Wikipedia's rating system should really not be the site of WP:BOLD changes.  The info is probably good information, but how it should be presented should be discussed.  That is my only problem.  Please start a discussion on the article talk page.  Sourcing should probably be discussed.  Just because a neighborhood association exists with a certain name doesn't mean that is the historically preferred name for a neighborhood.  The comments on Glacier Way seemed especially iffy.  Like I said, please start a discussion on the article talk page. John from Idegon (talk) 23:00, 3 April 2014 (UTC)
 * Great advice. I will start a discussion. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.11.169.223 (talk) 23:24, 3 April 2014 (UTC)

Disambiguation link notification for April 4
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Friendly reminder regarding talk page messages
Hello. Just wanted to let you know that I undid your revert to User talk:Mseevers, and give a friendly reminder that as per WP:BLANKING, editors may remove messages at will from their own talk page. Regards, — Kralizec! (talk) 20:01, 4 April 2014 (UTC)

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Smile template
I noticed that you added the smile template Template:Smile on a user page improperly. In the future, please substitute it by typing {{subst:smile}} when you wish to add the template. Otherwise, the smile will appear to have been added by the last user to have edited the page rather than by you. Thank you. Safiel (talk) 17:10, 16 April 2014 (UTC)

Individual Honors for School Pages
This page https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:SCH/AG#School_district_and_list_of_schools_articles states that major awards earned by students of a school can be listed:

Awards and recognition – A list of notable awards and recognition received by the school, staff, or students. Such a list should only include awards which are themselves notable, and if the school received the same type of awards in multiple years, they should not be listed separately. If the list becomes too long it should be split into a separate sub-article with a summary left in the main article. Awards and recognition may also be mentioned in other sections of the article at editor's discretion, even if the awards themselves are not notable. For awards/recognition given to school clubs or sport teams, list them in the appropriate section e.g. Sports and traditions. See the guideline under the Extracurricular activities section for details on alternative headings that may be used for information on school clubs and sports. If the school has received only a few academic awards, consider putting them as prose under the Curriculum section.

Thus, can't significant individual honors be listed on school Wikipedia articles? — Preceding unsigned comment added by Dk257 (talk • contribs) 02:23, 17 April 2014 (UTC)
 * No, but notable ones can be. That means that the award itself must have an article on Wikipedia, and the number of awards given annually must be sufficiently small as to show that getting one is actually an accomplishment.  An example:  National Merit Scholarships are notable enough to have an article, but as hundreds of thousands are awarded nationally each year, getting one is not exactly a major accomplishment.  In the same section under "Extracurricular activities", it specifically states that we do not discuss individual achievements, which to me would mean that we don't discuss individual achievements unless they are directly related to academics.  Examples:  A person winning a state championship in 100 yard dash is out; the track team winning state is in.  A person winning an individual competition at a debate tournament, where debate is an extracurricular activity, out.  A person winning the same competition where competing is a course requirement, maybe.  Sorry to say, but this is far from the only place that wikipedia policies and guidelines are contradictory.  General practice among experienced school article editors is that we don't talk about individual achievements at all.  Of course you can try to argue the point you are trying to make here on an article's talk page, but I don't see it going far. John from Idegon (talk) 18:32, 17 April 2014 (UTC)

Confusion
I apologize for my editing of MY school's wikipedia page. I did not see any of your warnings on my page but I am baffled as to why this information I have added is being removed. All information is accurate and everyone who attends the schools knows it. All the links can be verified and they are from major news outlets. The school's motto has been rang through every rival schools ears from the student section. Why can't you leave it alone?

JacksonViking (talk) 02:39, 22 April 2014 (UTC)
 * Please read all the many messages on your talk page. Your questions have been answered.  If you want to see some content added to the page start a discussion at the article's talk page (Talk:Jackson High School (Jackson, Michigan)).  Thanks. John from Idegon (talk) 16:20, 22 April 2014 (UTC)

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ERDI
hello and thank you for your feedback regarding Emergency Response Diving International. Almost all of my original submission was removed when I asked User:RHaworth to help me edit. His condescension was quite impressive, so I am surprised that his version was declined as well. Since I am new to this, I would really appreciate your help in getting this organization's article published. I feel my original submission had a lot of great information and sources. Would you mind taking a look and help me compose this article? This organization is the world's largest when it comes to standards/procedures, quality assurance and training for our rescue divers/heroes. I really feel it is important to have this resource available to these divers. Thank you for your time Jcyahoo (talk) 13:57, 24 April 2014 (UTC)
 * The standard for inclusion for a subject on Wikipedia is called notability. It only has a loose relationship to importance or fame.  What needs to be shown to prove notability is reliable, independent, secondary sources writing about your subject in detail.  Please take a look at the wikilinks preceding this sentence before going any further.  Thanks.


 * OK, now that you have done your homework, I'll talk specifics. You are currently showing 3 references on your article.  Two of those are reliable, independent, secondary sources (the books).  However, neither discuss the subject in detail, so they do nothing to show notability.  The third source, the webpage, is neither reliable nor secondary.


 * The standards for notability are found at WP:GNG. There is a specific standard for organizations and companies found at WP:NCORP.  The difference in the two standards is that companies and organizations are required to show that they are notable over a wide geographic area.  This can be done either by showing appropriate references that have a wide circulation, such as books or magazines, or by showing appropriate references that are locally circulated (such as newspapers or local TV and radio) from widely distributed geographic areas.


 * I have neither the time nor the interest to do research towards your article. I will be happy to help you by reviewing any sources you find and reviewing your writing on the article.  Best of luck on your endeavors.  Please let me know if there is any way I can be of assistance, and feel free to drop me a note here anytime.  I am not online every day, especially not on the weekends, but I will reply as soon as I can.John from Idegon (talk) 15:18, 24 April 2014 (UTC)

Will you take a look at my most recent edits and sources? Again, I thank for your respect, useful suggestions, and for not talking down to me. This is my first article, and I am just trying to learn the proper way of doing things. Jcyahoo (talk) 20:43, 28 April 2014 (UTC)


 * I reviewed the references, but not the writing. I did not take the time to read the article because with the references you have, it is not going to get approved.  Your sources still leave quite a bit to be desired. The Sport Diver article is yet another reliable source, but it appears to be an article written from a press release (no author shown and the organization's email at the end) and hence is not independent. The Divewire article is obviously just a reprinted press release.  The other 3 are primary sources.


 * When doing your research, you need to remember that your goal is not to prove the importance of the organization. Instead it is to show that the organization is being discussed in reliable independent secondary sources.  For notability (and you must have notability), that is all that is important.  The references you have are fine for supporting facts in the article.  But in order for your article to be approved, you must show notability.


 * I wish you luck, but to be totally truthful, it may be difficult for you to find sourcing to create an independent article on the organization. Best of luck, and do not hesitate to stop back here if I can be of further help.  Happy editing! John from Idegon (talk) 22:55, 28 April 2014 (UTC)

Ferndale, Michigan: Notable People
Actually, I think Eminem is a notable person of the city of Ferndale. Using your argument, owning and using a personal studio in the city and previously recording Grammy and Academy Award winning albums at another location in the city does not constitute "notable". Can you please to clarify and/or articulate the discrepancies of "people" versus "residents", then? Also, please expect regular requests for citations regarding the other "notables". Thanks bud! — Preceding unsigned comment added by 50.177.23.91 (talk) 02:02, 26 April 2014 (UTC)
 * Notable has a specific meaning on Wikipedia. I never said Eminem was not notable.  He certainly is.  He has an article.  That says he is notable.  What I said is that the connection with a city of owning a property in that city or working in that city is not enough connection with the city to be listed on that city's notable people section. This is not me saying that, either.  It is what the guidelines for US city articles says.  See WP:USCITIES.  Here is a direct quote:  "'Provide information, preferably in prose form, of any famous or notable individuals that were born, or lived for a significant amount of time, in the city.' (emphasis added)"  As you can see there is nothing there about owning a business in the city.


 * As far as your disrespect (you do not know me and I am not your "bud") and threats go, they will be dealt with accordingly if and when they occur. Happy editing.  You may want to read WP:AGF and WP:CIVIL. John from Idegon (talk) 20:13, 27 April 2014 (UTC)

aloha high school
you are the one that is deleting what i post. im not trying to be in an edit war. i just dont get why you feel the need to erase things that i add. im not hurting anyone. the page is about my high school which you know nothing about. If editors are suppose to compromise then why not talk to me about it instead of erasing what i put and saying i could be blocked?? — Preceding unsigned comment added by Meganknudsen (talk • contribs) 23:23, 28 April 2014 (UTC)
 * . This is not facebook.  There are structures to editing here.  Thank you for listening to the advice you were given about images hen you re-uploaded the logo for the school.


 * Now to address your question. The reason I deleted what you added is because that is how it works.  Please read WP:BRD.  You made a bold edit, which another editor (not me) disagreed with and reverted.  The proper course of action at that point would have been for you to start a discussion at the article's talk page.  Instead, you edit-warred and just put it back.  The material you added was unreferenced, off subject and out of guideline (see WP:SCH/AG), and as such does not belong in the article.  Like I tried to tell you at your talk page, this isn't as simple as it may initially seem.  What you know personally about the school is totally not usable in the article.  Wikipedia is only interested in material that can be sourced to reliable sources such as newspapers, magazines or books.  Hope you get the hang of this soon.  I am willing to help.  All you gotta do is ask. John from Idegon (talk) 23:35, 28 April 2014 (UTC)

aloha has 23 ap classes, not 21. that section doesnt even have a source so why keep putting 21? thats why i am putting 23. i added a source. hopefully it makes a difference --Meganknudsen (talk) 00:37, 29 April 2014 (UTC)Meganknudsen