User talk:Karmafist/Archive7

ArbCom elections
I answered your question regarding my Candidate statement. I also made comments you my be interested in @ Wikipedia_talk:Arbitration_Committee_Elections_December_2005/Straw_poll. Cheers, Sam Spade 22:54, 4 December 2005 (UTC)

Keetoowah’s 60 day ban
I think your action against Keetoowah is outside your authority and exceeds the recommendations of the arbitration committee. I mean, 60 days, that’s a bit harsh especially considering your apparent personal relationship with LuLu. I hope you reconsider. TDC 22:25, 5 December 2005 (UTC)

Phoenix Park
Hi,

I noticed you reverting this page several times to remove a particular disputed paragraph, could I ask you to join the discussion on the talk page Talk:Phoenix Park please?

Thanks,

Demiurge 23:11, 5 December 2005 (UTC)

Falling off the wagon
As if in subconscious rebellion for the excellent advice I gave, I suffered a relapse at Wikipedia:Deletion policy yesterday. 0_ο I know it's difficult, but really try to just do nothing. Think of it as a Zen version of extreme sports, where they shove wasabi up your nose and you have to sit perfectly still and smile. brenneman (t) (c) 23:28, 5 December 2005 (UTC)

Personal attack injunction
In my opinion This edit in which you describe Pigsonthewing's conduct as bullying, violates the personal attack injunction placed on you by the arbitration committee for the duration of the case, as does this in which you characterize his conduct as trolling. I don't think a block is yet merited in your case, but I am warning you not to engage in this kind of characterization again. --Tony Sidaway|Talk 05:53, 6 December 2005 (UTC)


 * This one, too. --Tony Sidaway|Talk 12:25, 6 December 2005 (UTC)

If you can think of a better word to describe Leonig Mig having to have a secret account due to his constant harrassment other than "bullying", please let me know, Tony. karmafist 14:10, 6 December 2005 (UTC)

WP:NH
Thanks for the welcome. I'm not sure how much I can help, but I'll do what I can. Jokermage Timor Mentum Occidit 19:59, 6 December 2005 (UTC)

Message from EddieSegoura
Hello, Karmafist! Just wanna say everyhthing been fine for the past few days. Looks like it's shaping to be My first successful week on this site. I haven't heard from You, though. How have You been? -- Eddie 21:58, 6 December 2005 (UTC)

Small Question
Is there a way to view currently online Administrators? You're the only Administrator I know at the moment, so if you're not here when I see a spammer, I don't know what to do. Any suggestions? I searched for a relevant manual page on Wikipedia, but I failed to see anything. Meepster 00:13, 7 December 2005 (UTC)

To answer your question, I removed my previous entry on your talk page for cleanliness. I figured you didn't want a moot entry.

Thank you for being so helpful and responsive!

Meepster 00:15, 7 December 2005 (UTC)

Tim Tolkien comment on Pigsonthewings Talk page
I'm not sure what's up with this edit...it reads to me that you're implying that you added the section on Tim Tolkien to Pigsonthewing's Talk page to help him save time, which is not supported by the edit history, so I'm not sure exactly what you're referring to. However, your comment "awaiting impending "desist personal attack" comment" was, in my opinion, sarcastic, provocative, and out of line. As such, per the temporary injuction in the Arbitration case between you and Pigsonthewing, I am blocking you for 24 hours for violation of your personal attack parole. Best regards, &Euml;vilphoenix Burn! 03:28, 7 December 2005 (UTC)


 * I could give you diffs if you want, but that's what he does(claim anything and everything is a personal attack). You know it as well as I do, heck, if you knew him as long as I have, you'd be in my shoes right now. A few people on IRC saw the diff (Mindspillage, Titoxd, Fuddlemark, Phroziac, etc.), and it was pretty much consensus that it was borderline at best in being construed as an WP:NPA vio. If you'd like a 6 hour block from now to appear fairly neutral, that's fine. But 24 hours is unfair, and you know it. Please help avoid me doing something i'll regret later here. karmafist 04:25, 7 December 2005 (UTC)
 * I'm not actually sure what diff(s) you'd like to give me. I'm still unclear as to what you were referring to adding, so if that is what you're referencing a diff to, then yes, I would be interested in seeing what you would like to discuss. I'm also unclear if the diff you refer to being discussed on IRC is the one that I listed above, or a different one (presumably the one you are offering to point out to me). Pigsonthewing does frequently claim to be under attack, but he is not claiming the diff I blocked you for as a personal attack (not that I've yet seen anyway), I am the one making that assertion, he had not made a comment on the post in question when I responded and placed a block. I don't feel comfortable lowering the time on your block, considering that I recently blocked Pigsonthewing for 36 hours for something I consider to be about the same level as what I blocked you for. I feel your post was provocative, and that is wholly unneeded from you towards him, which is why I enacted the block. I posted about blocking you to WP:AN/I, and I welcome review of it from other administrators there, but I stand by the block. To respond to your last sentence, I do hope that you will not do "something you'll regret later". You're a good editor, and I have a lot of faith in you, but any words from you towards Pigsonthewing must be absolutely civil...not crossing over or even bordering on personal attack. I won't abide by that from either of you. I'll be checking back in within a few minutes, but I'm preparing for bed soon, just to let you know. Best regards, &Euml;vilphoenix Burn! 05:20, 7 December 2005 (UTC)


 * I'd just like to note that, unless I'm missing something, there is no PAP against Karmafist currently enacted. Whoever marked it as "Enacted" miscounted as there's only four arbcom support votes and a majority of five is required for a proposal to pass. Further, no announcement that such a PAP had been enacted appears to have been given to Karmafist, and finally, no temporary injunction appears here. —Locke Cole 05:05, 7 December 2005 (UTC)
 * Locke Cole, thank you for pointing that out. I linked to the injunction I used on my original post to Karmafist. I am not familiar enough with ArbCom procedure to know what the current majority is, but when I reviewed the page I linked to, the injuction against Karmafist was listed as Enacted, and I based my decision on it, though the "Enacted" listing may have been an error. I believe Mindspillage is reviewing this discussion, as she recently posted to my Talk page about it, and I would welcome input from her or any other Arbitrator as to whether that injuction is in fact in order. However, I do not feel obligated to require the existence of an Arbitration Committee injuction in order to enact a block on another user for an NPA violation. As an Administrator, it is within my purview to block another user for an alleged NPA violation, or any other violation of policy, just as it is within the purview of any other Administrator to review and alter that block. Best regards, &Euml;vilphoenix Burn! 05:34, 7 December 2005 (UTC)
 * The diffs were in regards to the running gag that he calls everything a personal attack, even assistance such as mine there. karmafist 05:43, 7 December 2005 (UTC)
 * I'm going to sleep on it, but I assume i'll feel the same in the morning(you and me are in the same time zone, phoenix). And what I was saying before is that this might lead to a wheel war, which is something I absolutely want to avoid, but the entire thing that got any problem with me and POTW was my insistence for justice. POTW has gamed the system time and time again, I step in to stop it, yet i'm the criminal apparently. That's unacceptable. I could do without a day of Wikipedia, I nearly had one the other day, but i'm not going to stand idly by and be percieved down on the same level as POTW, particularly after I assist him for what must have been the 20th or 30th time now. karmafist 05:48, 7 December 2005 (UTC)
 * I'm unclear as to what specifically you did you assist him that you were referring to in the post. What I object to though was your reference to the "running gag" that he calls everything a personal attack. That struck me as mocking, which I found to be innappropriate. I believe your intentions are good, and that you don't want the system to be abused, but you must, must, must keep your actions above the level of those who do abuse the system. You have had difficulty doing that with Pigsonthewing, and as such, you must make sure that your actions and words are above reproach. You have no control over what he does, but you do have control over what you do, and I encourage you to keep to the high road. There are a lot of people watching Pigsonthewing right now, and if he steps even slightly over the line, it will no longer be tolerated. However, you as well must be careful in your approach. Best regards, and I hope you have some good rest (I sure need some). &Euml;vilphoenix Burn! 05:57, 7 December 2005 (UTC)
 * What is with this inability to explain things directly? Evilphoenix... Pigsonthewing had put information about Tim Tolkien on his talk page so that he would be able to copy it over to the Tim Tolkien article once his block was lifted. Karmafist copied that information into the Tim Tolkien article. That's the "assistance" in question and what Karmafist was referring to in his post to Pigsonthewing's talk page. Karmafist, as your comments to Andy go this one was very mild... but if you are really incapable of interacting with him without being snide you shouldn't be doing it at all. If you're so convinced that he's a monster... it's all his fault... you bear no responsibility in this matter... then just leave it alone. If you aren't in there insulting him and he behaves badly then nobody can claim you egged him into it. --CBD ✉ 11:47, 7 December 2005 (UTC)
 * Ahh, I see, I hadn't understood that Karmafist had copied that material into the Tim Tolkien article, which is what I was trying to figure out in my original post to Karmafist. Thanks for explaining that. Karmafist, while I know you were doing that trying to be helpful, given the tensions between you and Pigsonthewing, it might be better just to leave well enough alone...I'm sure he'll get a chance to get the information in once his block expires, and it's not worth risking another conflict. &Euml;vilphoenix Burn! 16:51, 7 December 2005 (UTC)

I guess that explains the tens of thousands of edits before I met him, huh CBD? karmafist 13:10, 7 December 2005 (UTC)
 * Alrighty then. --CBD ✉ 13:34, 7 December 2005 (UTC)
 * Yep. You can take care of him from here on, CBD. I give him until March before he's blocked 'til the end of time for the arbcom rulings. He might have claimed another victim in me today from the looks of things. Sorry for the hassle, CBD. karmafist 13:39, 7 December 2005 (UTC)
 * Stop.
 * Doesn't any of this seem familiar to you? Refusing to accept the findings of admins? Defying consensus? Complaining of unjust treatment and using that as a reason to bend/break the rules? Blaming your actions on someone else?
 * Just stop. If you are determined to self-destruct there is nothing I can do to prevent it, but don't tell me you didn't have a choice. You can choose to be someone who does go along with the process... even when they feel it is unfair. Because that is the only way it can possibly work. If you buck the process it will stomp you into paste and you know it (per recent edit summaries). You can be a martyr to your own self-righteousness if you want - or you can show an ounce of humility and say, 'yeah I messed up too'. Back away from the edge. Please. --CBD ✉ 14:48, 7 December 2005 (UTC)

I didn't mess up, and I still don't think I had a choice(Potw had gone on with this for years now, and nothing had even slowed him down before, apparently) but you're right, I'm going to back away from the edge. Listening and respecting others, like you, is the only thing separating me from Andy right now, and I have to hold on to that as hard as I can here. karmafist 17:00, 7 December 2005 (UTC)
 * Please assume that I have beaten you about the head mercilessly... with a nerf bat. :]
 * I wish I could convince you to cut PotW some slack, but I'll settle for 'everyone goes off and edits merrily on their own'. We'll sort it all out eventually. Thanks for listening. --CBD ✉ 18:00, 7 December 2005 (UTC)

Not a problem. I wish I could too, but he would need to listen first, and I just don't think that's his style considering the line of people who seem to have issues with him in one sort of another (me, LockeCole, LeonigMig, Nick Boulevard, Linuxbeak, Phroziac, Scottfisher, Evilphoenix, Bishonen, etc.) seems to extend around the block. I'm sure one way or another, things will be settled, i'm just glad the rfar is concluded so I don't have to feel like it's my problem anymore. karmafist 19:06, 7 December 2005 (UTC)

AMA
I'm not sure if the project is still live, but before/if you nominate it for deletion could you let me no so that the Wikipediology project will have time to preserve some of the materials for users who can't see deleted items and provide a historical perspective. Also, since you haven't figured out where to put permanently put your Political Perspectives of Wikipedians project, IW would be happy to host your project. Thanks. -JCarriker 03:57, 7 December 2005 (UTC)

Enough with the drama
Karmafist,

First, you're not going to quit Wikipedia because of Pigsonthewing. If you do, I'll be annoyed at you. So stop saying you will, because an annoyed Nandesuka is not something you want to have to see.

Secondly, just sit out the block and then stop picking at the scab. Engage in right thought, right speech, and right action, and satisfy yourself that things will turn out OK. Turning a molehill of a 24 hour block into a mountain of a tearful farewell is just what would make certain people happy. Take a deep breath, have a beer or a cup of coffee (I recommend decaf) or whatever your favorite drink is, and relax. OK? Nandesuka 14:38, 7 December 2005 (UTC)


 * I think you and CBD might have done it. I've sunken too far because of all this shit, and I can't let Andy win because of this. The rfar's will close momentarily, so admins can now use that instead of me having to go rogue, people seem to care whether or not i'm still going to be here, and it's been made clear that the block was ultimately for my own good apparently.karmafist 16:26, 7 December 2005 (UTC)


 * Karmafist, the last thing on Earth I would want is for you to leave the project. Nandesuka's advice is excellent, and I too feel you are a valued contributor to the project. Please don't think that I think anything other that highly of you. Best regards, &Euml;vilphoenix Burn! 16:55, 7 December 2005 (UTC)


 * Karmafist, take a week or two to rediscover life away from the screen (I read a wiki page that said it was interesting), but don't be driven off indefinitely by querulous users who have troubles working in a civil manner, do come back - David Gerard 22:20, 7 December 2005 (UTC)

Come have a chat
Hi Karmafist. I hear you're under a bit of stress. Come on IRC and have a chat with me. We don't want to lose you! [[Sam Korn ]] 22:17, 7 December 2005 (UTC)

Wiki-love
Don't give in to the trolls. They want you to leave, but your friends and all real Wikipedians want you to stay. Take some time to relax and clear your mind. Then, when you come back, you can put all the controversy behind you. --TantalumT e lluride 23:07, 7 December 2005 (UTC)
 * I heard. You're not leaving are you? The House of Gryffindor  won't allow you to.


 * Have a muffin with your coffee. Bishonen | talk 00:11, 8 December 2005 (UTC)

BD2412's RFA
Thank you, Karmafist, for bringing the fist of your karma down in support of my RfA - I was going to tell you all about how I'll do my best as an admin to make the reality of Wikipedia rise to the level of the dream, but instead, I'm going to talk about Chewbacca. Why would a Wookie, an eight-foot tall Wookie, want to live on Endor, with a bunch of two-foot tall Ewoks? That does NOT MAKE SENSE! But more important, you have to ask yourself: What does this have to do with this RfA? Nothing. Karmafist, it has nothing to do with this RfA! It does NOT MAKE SENSE! Look at me. I'm a lawyer thanking people for passing an RfA, and I'm talkin' about Chewbacca! Does that make sense? Karmafist, I am not making any sense! None of this makes sense! BD2412 T 02:23, 8 December 2005 (UTC) <--note new "admin gold" sig :-D
 * Would this be known as the "Chewbacca acceptance"? =) —Locke Cole 04:36, 8 December 2005 (UTC)

Howdy
Just what the heck do you think you're doing by thinking about leaving Wikipedia? I strongly recommend you pick some random articles and just do some regular ole editing for awhile. Stay away from the stressful situations and don't try to be super admin. We are all but human you know and if you leave entirely it will be the lose of us all. Some users are just worthless and have no interest in writing an encyclopedia or comtributing in a constructive manner, so don't let trolls like that win. Pick a project of interest to you and deal with that instead for awhile, or add balance to you life by simply stepping back from Wikipedia some. Whatever I can do to help, let me know...and if you prefer, I have email. Cheer up and look at all the good you've done!--MONGO 03:36, 8 December 2005 (UTC)
 * Sigh... I don't know if I can say it better myself. You know you can ask me for anything, old pal. Just don't go. Tito xd (?!? - did you read this?) 05:45, 8 December 2005 (UTC)


 * Hear hear! Please stick around.  Ban e  s  09:55, 8 December 2005 (UTC)


 * No problem man, I owe you. You gotta know that if you deal with a lot of people here, someone is going to end up getting mad at you...and that's just the law of averages. I didn't know you made any mistakes, but everyone does...the one beaucrat accused me of having a sockpuppet account when I didn't, etc....we all make mistakes and none of us are perfect, so smile, it's no big deal...imagine what my next foot in mouth thing might be!!! I seem to have been at the head of a lot of contenious issues in the last year, so it is probably only a matter of time before half of Wikipedia is out to get me!--MONGO 05:05, 9 December 2005 (UTC)


 * Yeah, but it looks like all you were trying to do was spell the stubs correctly...I mean, New Hampshire is two words afterall, so what's their beef? I confess, I find the whole stub thing very confusing. I've added some, but it seems that everytime I do, someone else comes and disambiguates it and makes it more specific...but it's a wiki, so no biggie. I'm heading out and won't be back on for about 4 hours so just remember to "not sweat the small stuff"...and almost everything here is pretty f*cking small in the scheme of things.--MONGO 05:23, 9 December 2005 (UTC)


 * Same here. Anytime. You would have to do an aweful lot to lose my respect. I am very glad to hear you are staying. All the best  Ban e  s  06:46, 9 December 2005 (UTC)

Early RFA thanks
Hi , Thank you very much for your support on my RfA. It has done very well and is currently at 67/0/2. As such, I am posting this in advance of its closure. If I can ever help with anything or if you have any comments about my actions as an admin, please let me know. Thank you once again! – NSLE  ( T + C + CVU ) 06:45, 8 December 2005 (UTC)

Re:Ahoy hoy
Oh dear oh dear... you missed a few things, most importantly that new stub types are proposed before creation, and we've been busy deleting general stub templates for individual states where there is no state-specific wikiproject! You really should propose these things first at WP:WSS/P! As for red-linked categories, all you need to do is follow the link and create the category. They don't automatically get created when a template is created. See the instructions at Stub. Grutness...wha?  23:33, 8 December 2005 (UTC)
 * Is that a requirement? You guys do great work over there at Stub sorting, but I dislike the seeming tone of needing "approval" to create a new type of stub...whatever happened to being Bold and IAR? :-) &Euml;vilphoenix Burn! 06:14, 9 December 2005 (UTC)
 * I'm actually not familiar with the specifics of the issue you're having with the stub sorting team, if you'd care to help fill me in that would be awesome. As far as Andy goes, I'd suggest to you that you just not make further comments about it. Let the other administrators deal with it, and if you find a problem, feel free to bring it to my or another administrator's attention, but otherwise I'd suggest not making any comments about it. Just a thought. &Euml;vilphoenix Burn! 17:09, 9 December 2005 (UTC)

Grr...
Don't scare us again like that! Or I shall have to beat you with a cluestick. :P Hehehe... it's good to hear you're ok, though. Tito xd (?!? - did you read this?) 04:57, 9 December 2005 (UTC)

no way...
ahoy there,

i can't believe this, you actually gave me a barnstar wow I am so touched (and surprised), thanks alot. don't let trolls or disputes get you down, I know how it feels like and it can be very frustrating, but don't let it drive you away. thanks alot again, if you ever need anything feel free to contact me as well obviously :-) cheers mate Gryffindor  08:55, 9 December 2005 (UTC)
 * Voted to keep and I added the stub-tag to my watchlist if it helps anything. Why would anyone want to delete this? ridiculous... Gryffindor  16:15, 9 December 2005 (UTC)
 * Weird.... yes, it's very tedious i think sometimes to find the correct stub, because i type something where i think it would be the right one. however i spelled it wrong because it has be written differently, and then i have to manually search for the correct spelling. well in any case, good luck with it, i'm sure logic will persevere (or at least i hope so) Gryffindor  17:29, 9 December 2005 (UTC)

Me too
Thanks for the barnstar. =) And yeah, I was under the impression ArbCom cases closed 24 hours after they got enough votes to close. So either this is the longest 24 hours in history, or it's all a lie. :P Anyways, take heart, it's over now, and maybe some of the remedies will help him. —Locke Cole 09:07, 9 December 2005 (UTC)
 * I talked with Mindspillage yesterday, and apparently they had been holding it open to discuss some things that had come up, and she was going to discuss with them whether to close it or not, but I haven't heard any more. I don't know if they're discussing it on-wiki or not. &Euml;vilphoenix Burn! 17:15, 9 December 2005 (UTC)

Thanks! It's nice to see you perky again. [[Sam Korn ]] 12:32, 9 December 2005 (UTC)

stub template
Man, you've gone deeper into the wikipedia workings that I ever did ... stubs and templates and all that is just the kind of software debate that what made me flee the copy desk and return to reporting! I don't really understand what the debate is about, and I'm afraid I'm too lazy to figure it out. I voted keep because you know what you're talking about, but if somebody demands justification for my vote, I will run and hide. - DavidWBrooks 14:25, 9 December 2005 (UTC)

Final decision
The arbitration commitee has reached a final decision in the Requests for arbitration/Pigsonthewing case. Raul654 18:17, 9 December 2005 (UTC)

Jesus
See my response to your Object, Thanks. Scifiintel 20:27, 9 December 2005 (UTC)

Yet Another RFA Thank You Note to clutter up your talk page...
karmafist:

Just wanted to drop you a note to say thanks for supporting me in my recent RFA. As you may have seen, my RFA succeeded and I am now an admin. My table creation powers are beyond compare now, thanks to the s33kr1t admin table editing tools. Moohahaha and all that.

All the best. → Ξxtreme Unction {yak ł blah } 20:34, 9 December 2005 (UTC)