User talk:Killing Vector/Archives/2006/July

Itbox
Hi, I'm just wondering why you think the Itbox article reads like an advertisement. It was contributed to by users of fruitchat.co.uk and we are far from being lovers of the industry. I would edit it myself but I can't really work out which parts you consider to be non-neutral. 86.10.102.39 14:35, 5 July 2006 (UTC)

Consensus
When you're making a huge change to a collaborative project — as you just did to WikiProject:Beer's goals and then before that in trying to eliminate Category:Microbreweries — you've got, got, got to seek Consensus. That means at least some discussion beforehand, somewhere where people interested in the subject will know to look for it.

Yes, I know, WP:BOLD. See the "Note also..." section in that guideline. --Stlemur 12:41, 12 July 2006 (UTC)

I'm not sure of your objection. I understand that you are not happy with my rewording of the goals. The Goals section was written a while ago and needed adjusting. "Getting stewed to the brim" is amusing frat talk, but is not suitable for a serious encyclopedia project. Wikipedia is a collaborative editing process. If you are not happy with my exact wording, then please make adjustments. That's what this open policy is about. A total revert is not the most delicate way of editing and tends to lead to hostility. Which wording would you be happier with? SilkTork 12:55, 12 July 2006 (UTC)


 * You didn't "reword" the goals, you substantively changed them without discussion. What I would be happy with is discussion. --Stlemur 13:01, 12 July 2006 (UTC)


 * I've done a little more rewording. I've done it in stages to make it easier to undo sections. Have a look and let me know what you think. SilkTork 13:04, 12 July 2006 (UTC)

Beer & brewery notability criteria discusion document
A discussion document has been opened up. WikiProject Beer/Notability Criteria. Please put in your views either on the main page or on the attached talk page. SilkTork 17:59, 12 July 2006 (UTC)

Let's talk
Hi Stlemur. I am concerned at what people are saying, and I do wish to get to the heart of the problem. Clearly there must be an aspect or aspects of my editing and/or attitude that is annoying and frustrating people like yourself. The incidents that are mentioned are small in themselves, and - to my eye - are part of the collaborative editing of Wikipedia, moving it forward. I make very many beer edits, much of which is stub sorting which either entails a merge, a redirect, or an expansion of the article. It is not, to my understanding, in the nature of Wiki that consensus is sought for what are essentially everyday edits. But I can feel from your frustration, that there must be a pattern in my editing that you are uncomfortable with. I totally apologise for any aspect of my behaviour in the past that has annoyed you, and promise to do better in the future. I am hoping that with your help I can learn from this experience and move forward. Please talk to me and let me know your underlying concerns which the recent edits have highlighted. SilkTork 13:39, 19 July 2006 (UTC)


 * Following goethean's and your response I am going through my past talk pages and starting to list the conflicts so I can see where I am going wrong. As I responded to goethean, I had a rough ride from the start, especially from Mais oui! Looking around at other talk pages, it seemed that rudeness and conflict was not unusual on the Wiki project. Added to which, I have noted that people tend to be ruder when talking on the internet than when using other means of communication, so the hostility seemed to stem from general internet rudeness and "Wiki stress". I am still analysing the information, but as I indicated to goethean, it is possible I started to adopt a defensive arrogance as those who were challenging me admitted they had little beer knowledge, while those who did have some beer knowledge were congratulating me. I'm not using any of this as a defensive, but as the start of an attempt to understand the problem, and perhaps an admission of arrogance on my part is the beginnings of solving the problem. I really appreciate the efforts you are going through in helping me to come to terms with this issue, and if - as it is starting to appear - I have been guilty of arrogant rudeness to you in the past I feel somewhat ashamed and hope you will accept my apology and the hand of friendship. I do not wish to make enemies. I would rather make friends. SilkTork 19:15, 19 July 2006 (UTC)