User talk:Kscimecca

Welcome!
Hello, Kscimecca, and welcome to Wikipedia! Thank you for your contributions. I hope you like the place and decide to stay. Unfortunately, one or more of the pages you created, such as The Gentlemen of the Hall, may not conform to some of Wikipedia's guidelines, and may not be retained.

There's a page about creating articles you may want to read called Your first article. If you are stuck, and looking for help, please come to the Teahouse, where experienced Wikipedians can answer any queries you have! Or, you can just type help me on this page, followed by your question, and someone will show up shortly to answer your questions. Here are a few other good links for newcomers: I hope you enjoy editing here and being a Wikipedian! Please sign your name on talk pages using four tildes ( ~ ); this will automatically produce your name and the date. If you have any questions, check out Questions or ask me on my talk page. Again, welcome! WikiDan61 ChatMe!ReadMe!! 18:18, 15 September 2014 (UTC)
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Proposed deletion of The Gentlemen of the Hall


The article The Gentlemen of the Hall has been proposed for deletion&#32; because of the following concern:
 * Non-notable campus club. In the absence of any substantial coverage in independent media, this two-year old club at Seton Hall University does not meet the criteria for inclusion at Wikipedia.

While all constructive contributions to Wikipedia are appreciated, content or articles may be deleted for any of several reasons.

You may prevent the proposed deletion by removing the notice, but please explain why in your edit summary or on the article's talk page.

Please consider improving the article to address the issues raised. Removing will stop the proposed deletion process, but other deletion processes exist. In particular, the speedy deletion process can result in deletion without discussion, and articles for deletion allows discussion to reach consensus for deletion. WikiDan61 ChatMe!ReadMe!! 18:18, 15 September 2014 (UTC)

Conflict of interest
Hello, Kscimecca. We welcome your contributions to Wikipedia, but if you are affiliated with some of the people, places or things you have written about in the article The Gentlemen of the Hall, you may have a conflict of interest or close connection to the subject.

All editors are required to comply with Wikipedia's neutral point of view content policy. People who are very close to a subject often have a distorted view of it, which may cause them to inadvertently edit in ways that make the article either too flattering or too disparaging. People with a close connection to a subject are not absolutely prohibited from editing about that subject, but they need to be especially careful about ensuring their edits are verified by reliable sources and writing with as little bias as possible.

If you are very close to a subject, here are some ways you can reduce the risk of problems:


 * Avoid or exercise great caution when editing or creating articles related to you, your organization, or its competitors, as well as projects and products they are involved with.
 * Be cautious about deletion discussions. Everyone is welcome to provide information about independent sources in deletion discussions, but avoid advocating for deletion of articles about your competitors.
 * Avoid linking to the Wikipedia article or website of your organization in other articles (see Spam).
 * Exercise great caution so that you do not accidentally breach Wikipedia's content policies.

Please familiarize yourself with relevant content policies and guidelines, especially those pertaining to neutral point of view, verifiability of information, and autobiographies.

For information on how to contribute to Wikipedia when you have a conflict of interest, please see our frequently asked questions for organizations. Thank you.  My assumption of a conflict of interest arises from the similarity of your user name to the name of the founder of this club. WikiDan61 ChatMe!ReadMe!! 18:50, 15 September 2014 (UTC)

Nomination of The Gentlemen of the Hall for deletion
A discussion is taking place as to whether the article The Gentlemen of the Hall is suitable for inclusion in Wikipedia according to Wikipedia's policies and guidelines or whether it should be deleted.

The article will be discussed at Articles for deletion/The Gentlemen of the Hall until a consensus is reached, and anyone is welcome to contribute to the discussion. The nomination will explain the policies and guidelines which are of concern. The discussion focuses on high-quality evidence and our policies and guidelines.

Users may edit the article during the discussion, including to improve the article to address concerns raised in the discussion. However, do not remove the article-for-deletion notice from the top of the article. WikiDan61 ChatMe!ReadMe!! 19:08, 15 September 2014 (UTC)

The Gentlemen of the Hall
You removed the proposed deletion from The Gentlemen of the Hall saying, in part, that "I am not promoting this group in any way". Perhaps you have misunderstood my concern: the article was not proposed for deletion for being promotional, but rather for being about a group that does not merit inclusion at Wikipedia. Wikipedia is not an indiscriminate list of everything that exists. Rather, topics must have been the subject of substantial coverage in independent reliable sources. This serves two purposes: it demonstrates that this is a topic of interest beyond the walls of its own universe (in this case, beyond the scope of Seton Hall University), and it provides the reliable sources needed to verify the content of the article. In the absence of such significant coverge, articles are generally deleted. I pointed out your conflict of interest above not to warn you about trying to promote the organization (althought that is a very real concern where conflicts of interest exist), but rather to point out to that you might not have the detachment required to recognize whether or not this organization is notable. To you (its founder, if I surmise correctly) the organization looms larger than life and may well be the most important thing in the world. To the rest of the world, it's just another campus club. Should the organization grow to the point where it is appearing and competing at a national level, and receiving the national attention that comes from that growth, then it will merit an article. But now, in only its third year of existence, it does not appear to have reached that point yet. WikiDan61 ChatMe!ReadMe!! 19:16, 15 September 2014 (UTC)

RE: The Gentlemen of the Hall
You're right, thank you for the clarification. I have two questions: First, will the page be permanantly deleted or will it go "inactive," meaning the text and files can be recovered, but it would not be live on the web. Second, what would you consider "national attention?" Attention like local television and media coverage, or something broader? I've read other a cappella group pages on wikipedia, and some perform for prominent figures, politicians, sports teams, etc. but not source broad national sources. I'm just curious, thank you for your help.

Kscimecca (talk) 20:54, 15 September 2014 (UTC)
 * I would be willing to bet that 80% of the articles about college a capella groups at Wikipedia would fail to meet inclusion criteria, for the same reasons as your own article. If I had the time, I'd go look at them all and possibly start nominating large numbers of them for deletion. But I don't have that time. I did happen across your article, so here we are. Generally, attention from local media is not sufficient. Evidence of broader interest is required. The fact that a group in Northern New Jersey happened to perform the National Anthem at a sports venue in nearby New York City is also not that significant: a different person or group performs that honor every night with little or no fanfare. If your group begins to perform on a more national scale: winning national competitions, executing a wide ranging tour with significant press coverage, etc., then you'll start to garner the kind of coverage that is required. As for the fate of your article, if it is deleted, it is deleted. But, this being the internet, nothing is ever truly gone. If the article gets deleted, you'll be able to request a copy of the text for your own purposes. However, to avoid the problem, I'd just copy the article now to your local storage so that, if it does get deleted, you can recreae it if the group improves its notability.  WikiDan61 ChatMe!ReadMe!! 13:26, 16 September 2014 (UTC)