User talk:Kudpung/ACE2021/Archives

Thryduulf
have attended several UK meetups and more Wikimanias but I do not recall ever meeting him. This is odd; I was at Wikimania in Esino Lario in 2016 and you definitely did meet Thryduulf. Hawkeye7  (discuss)  21:14, 23 November 2021 (UTC)
 * , you and I have been to many Wikimanias but I can't even remember meeting you. At Esino, because of walking up and down the steep slopes (and collapsing in the street on one of them from an asthma attack in the rare alpine air), apart from the presentations (and the Hackethon), I didn't get around much, spending most of the evenings in my hotel or socialising with just a very few good friends from WMUK and the WMF. If I did meet him, he didn't leave a lasting impression... Kudpung กุดผึ้ง (talk) 15:46, 24 November 2021 (UTC)


 * Actually, I have only been to two Wikimanias; in Hong Kong in 2013 and Esino in 2016. I did meet you each day on both occasions; in Esino we were both up early each day due to difficulty adjusting to the time shift. That you don't remember me has been noted before, and I am inclined to think that this is more a failure of memory than any lack of activity on Thryduulf's part. Hawkeye7   (discuss)  22:02, 24 November 2021 (UTC)


 * In London I arrived before the opening and spent my first morning in the WMUK office and helped pack up when it was over. I spent most of my tea breaks downstairs in the coordination room in the Barbican. I helped RexxS deliver his editathon and I attended all the social events (as an experienced wine lover I remember the assault on my palate from the awful cheap tannic wine). Unless I do have a severe lapse of memory, I'm sure I would have noticed who apparently was one of the main organisers.
 * In HK I was extremely upset that the food was never enough; indeed there was only enough for the WMF and their invitees at the official opening in the skyscraper, and the entire wind-up party on the beach was spent in a very Iong queue for the food and drink from the car park to the event and when we got there there was none left. The music at the beach party was a deafening mix of techno and hip-hop as if the only attendees at a Wikimania are teenagers (indeed, this conference was organised by teens). Evening meals were limited to the bland thin soup and egg-based Chinese student food in the cafeteria of the student dorm where we were accommodated, or the 7-Eleven convenience store in the yard.(the rooms were very good though).
 * In Esino, I shared a room with at the top of a steep hill and an equally steep and narrow flight of stairs. I'm a  seasoned traveller between time zones and various continents and rarely suffer from jet lag from a difference of only 6 or 7 hours - the two 7 hour legs of a journey between Bangkok and Milan plus the local transport at each end allow more than enough time to adjust before arriving. I woke without an alarm clock at the normal time every morning and I generally lingered over breakfast, dreading the long walks up and down the steep hills of the valley from one presentation venue to another. I swapped my meal tickets and took most of my meals in the hotel where I was staying. For me, the food was excellent and unlimited, although it might have been a disappointment for anyone expecting a more international menu.
 * I'm really sorry, but while I retain good and vivid memories of all the Wikimanias, I really don't recall meeting you at either of the conferences you attended. Could you possibly be confusing me with someone else? I'm not the kind of person who would stand out in a crowd, and I'm not as noisy when in company as I am here on Wikipedia ;) Kudpung กุดผึ้ง (talk) 02:52, 7 December 2021 (UTC)
 * I definitely met you on at least a couple of occasions at Esino Lario. I think I did at London, I'm pretty sure that @HJ Mitchell introduced us. I was rarely in one place for any length of time during the London Wikimania though as my role was as one person put it "floating midfield general" dealing with issues that came up that nobody else was responsible for/available to deal with at the time (one particular memory is failing to be introduced to @Krakatoa Katie on about three separate occasions as I was called away to deal with something each time). My only other Wikimania apart from those two was Frankfurt way back in 2005, and @morwen is the person I remember most strongly from that event. Thryduulf (talk) 11:45, 7 December 2021 (UTC)
 * I stayed very much in the background at Esino Larion. The only venue where I said anything at all was at the pre-conference hackethon, and that wasn't even enough to be recorded in the live etherpad thing. I don't remember meeting you there and if I did, I obviously did or said something to offend you (which I usually don't) - and if I did, I apologise for it.  I haven't spent a lifetime traveling all over the word to conferences to upset people. Kudpung กุดผึ้ง (talk) 12:00, 7 December 2021 (UTC)
 * If you did say or do something that offended me (which is not likely) then I don't recall it now. I think we are simply different people with different opinions on some matters. Thryduulf (talk) 12:20, 7 December 2021 (UTC)
 * I certainly did introduce you. I think you met Thryduulf in the WMUK office on the day you arrived after I collected you from Paddington while we were gearing up for Wikimania, and I think we all stayed in the Travelodge. I also remember spending a lot of time with you in Esino Lario and I'm sure I would have introduced you to Chris there. I consider you both good friends so it's unlikely you wouldn't have crossed paths. HJ Mitchell &#124; Penny for your thoughts? 12:23, 7 December 2021 (UTC)
 * Thanks, . I really can't remember him, but it's all moot now anyway, and I doubt whether I will ever get back to Europe again or to another Wikimania unless they do ever hold another one and it's in Bangkok, or at least not more than a 2 or 3 hour flight away. Like a well aged wine, I don't travel so well these days... Kudpung กุดผึ้ง (talk) 14:02, 7 December 2021 (UTC)

Minor point of order
My Arbcom is a broken system which fails to do what it's meant to do and quite often sours and embitters those who become a part of it, even if they're decent people who only joined up with the best of intentions quote taken out of context makes it look like an attack on Arbcom as a uniquely problematic institution. The point I was trying to make is that it's unfair to blame Arbcom for its faults, as the way Wikipedia itself is structured is a broken system that can bring out the worst in otherwise-decent people. As such, by striving (rightly) to have processes at both RFA and Arbcom which allow fair community input, our elections are double-distilling to select for game-players (the electoral system rewards those who talk a lot without actually saying anything, since expressing an opinion on a divisive issue increases the opposes at both RFA and ACE), and the RFC-ANI-Arbcom route for cases triple-distills for cases that are likely to have a corrosive effect on participants (since those that won't attract a baying mob trying to hassle the committee members typically get resolved before they have a chance to reach Arbcom). &#8209; Iridescent 07:47, 7 December 2021 (UTC)


 * I couldn't agree more with @Iridescent on the double / triple distillation of our participants.... WormTT(talk) 08:30, 7 December 2021 (UTC)
 * Likewise. If you look at arbitration in isolation from the rest of the dispute resolution system you get a very warped perspective on the whole matter - arbcom only deals with the difficult (people and/or issues) and most people without strong views on the topic have long fallen by the wayside as they lack motivation to see it through. Thryduulf (talk) 11:49, 7 December 2021 (UTC)
 * I never looked at arbitration in isolation from the rest of the dispute resolution system, . As an admin I worked on many noticeboards and dealt with a lot of difficult people (but I never blocked anyone). Ironically, the hair of sword of Damocles broke and got me in the end! Kudpung กุดผึ้ง (talk) 12:18, 7 December 2021 (UTC)


 * I certainly did not intentionally quote you out if context,, I have far too much respect for your opinions. What you explain above though, clarifies it and is indeed accurate. Ironically, I joined Wikipedia (and also became an admin) with the best of intentions too. The rest is history. Kudpung กุดผึ้ง (talk) 11:48, 7 December 2021 (UTC)