User talk:Laberkiste/2016/May

IIY
An article that is only a few short paragraphs long does not need three entire lines devoted to trivia concerning an unrelated artist. Even the article devoted to Sheik Yerbouti barely mentions it, and the Hammersmith Odeon article doesn't mention it at all, and these are where it should be mentioned, if at all. How many minutes Zappa to a song has little to do with Peter Frampton. 63.143.228.110 (talk) 00:26, 20 April 2016 (UTC)
 * Since you got reverted many times by different users, why not discuss that on the article talk page first? --Laber□T 01:32, 20 April 2016 (UTC)
 * Different users? They're different open proxy servers, not different users. That in itself is a good reason to undo the edits.  Many of these addresses have been blocked and yet the edits continue.  63.143.228.110 (talk) 01:49, 20 April 2016 (UTC)
 * You didn't notice that, did you? That's the reason open proxies aren't allowed to edit.  It makes it easy to feign consensus when none exists.  I suspect the editor likes the fact that, temporarily at least, a veteran editor was fooled.  My point has been made so I won't leave further messages here.  — Preceding unsigned comment added by 63.143.226.52 (talk) 15:35, 20 April 2016 (UTC)
 * Laberkiste, I should point out to you that the above IP addresses belong to a banned (ab)user User:IHeardFromBob. They have been repeatedly been removing cited content from articles that mention Frank Zappa. 189.3.237.162 (talk) 05:41, 1 May 2016 (UTC)

Uploading Photo
Hello Laber,

I hope you are well. Can you help me uploading a photo? (Hebrew Mountain Man (talk) 21:25, 29 April 2016 (UTC))
 * Yes--Laber□T
 * This is the link - http://scwra.gov.az/upload/Images/Dini%20qurumlar%20ucun%20sekiller/Quba-Gileki%20sinaqoqu%20(3).jpg Upload it with the description: Synagogue at Qırmızı Qəsəbə. Thank you.(Hebrew Mountain Man (talk) 21:31, 29 April 2016 (UTC))
 * What is the license? You can only upload photos here with permission from the person who created it, or if the copyright has expired. --Laber□T 21:33, 29 April 2016 (UTC)
 * This photo is located on the site of Azeri government. This photo and others were taken especially for the Jewish community. I don't know how to check the license criteria. http://scwra.gov.az/structure/20/?Q%C4%B1rm%C4%B1z%C4%B1%20q%C9%99s%C9%99b%C9%99%20%E2%80%9CGil%C9%99ki%E2%80%9D%20sinaqoqu (Hebrew Mountain Man (talk) 21:42, 29 April 2016 (UTC))
 * I cannot process this. Please ask WP:RI for determining if it can be uploaded, they can also ask the government for releasing the picture under a compatible license if needed. --Laber□T 21:49, 29 April 2016 (UTC)
 * Regarding this photo - Can it be uploaded under fair use or something similar? (Hebrew Mountain Man (talk) 21:54, 29 April 2016 (UTC))
 * That is possible, but only if certain criteria are met. --Laber□T 21:58, 29 April 2016 (UTC)
 * So, will you be able to do it using this specific option? (Hebrew Mountain Man (talk) 22:02, 29 April 2016 (UTC))
 * I will upload it for now. It seems that there is the possibility of it being ineligible for copyright. --Laber□T 22:04, 29 April 2016 (UTC)
 * Ok, thanks. Please use the description that I have provided earlier on this conversation. (Hebrew Mountain Man (talk) 22:06, 29 April 2016 (UTC))
 * Uploaded as File:Synagogue AZ.jpg --Laber□T 22:08, 29 April 2016 (UTC)
 * One more thing - I have read the criteria in the link that you have provided. Under Azerbaijan it says: The following are not subjects of copyright: 1) works of folklore; 2) communications concerning events and facts that have informational character. Can the synagogue photo be classified as folklore, or facts that have informational character, or both. This way we can minimize the possibility of it's deletion. (Hebrew Mountain Man (talk) 22:16, 29 April 2016 (UTC))

A synagogue is definitely folklore. Regarding the informational criteria, Wikipedia should only use informational pictures per definitionem, so that should apply too. However, there has been no case so far where this license was "tested", so one cannot be completely sure. Laber□T 22:28, 29 April 2016 (UTC)
 * Ok, excellent! Now I will add it to the article. (Hebrew Mountain Man (talk) 22:32, 29 April 2016 (UTC))
 * Can the template "part of a series" be removed? It's located under the first template in the mountain jews article. (Hebrew Mountain Man (talk) 22:57, 29 April 2016 (UTC))
 * Per WP:BOLD you can do that, but people may find it useful for navigation. I think there will be a version that one can put at the bottom of the article somewhere... --Laber□T 23:02, 29 April 2016 (UTC)
 * You see, The first template provides information of the distribution and population figures of mountain jews, while the second template do not add any information. For example, you won't find it under Ashkenazi jews article. (Hebrew Mountain Man (talk) 23:04, 29 April 2016 (UTC))
 * No, I have checked it again. it's there but on the lower section of their article. Can I remove it completely from ours? (Hebrew Mountain Man (talk) 23:10, 29 April 2016 (UTC))
 * I'll replace it with one or two at the bottom. Generally, these templates are needed for navigation, even if they do not add information. --Laber□T 23:13, 29 April 2016 (UTC)
 * Ok. Regarding the photo - for some reason I don't see the description. You can see it on "edit source", but not on the article itself. (Hebrew Mountain Man (talk) 23:29, 29 April 2016 (UTC))
 * WP:MOS/IMAGES --Laber□T 23:31, 29 April 2016 (UTC)
 * I want to add this description: Synagogue at Qırmızı Qəsəbə (purely jewish town),Azerbaijan. It was done the same on other pictures, so what am I missing here? (Hebrew Mountain Man (talk) 23:42, 29 April 2016 (UTC))

Maybe try the visual editor? Just click on the pencil at the upper right of the editing window. --Laber□T 23:46, 29 April 2016 (UTC)
 * I solved the problem. I added |thumb|. (Hebrew Mountain Man (talk) 23:55, 29 April 2016 (UTC))
 * Can we add the photo of the great synagogue? (Hebrew Mountain Man (talk) 23:56, 29 April 2016 (UTC))
 * Which one do you mean? --Laber□T 18:55, 30 April 2016 (UTC)
 * Hello Laber, can you review my last edits that were reverted and say how to restore them. (Hebrew Mountain Man (talk) 22:08, 30 April 2016 (UTC))
 * You removed content even though it had a source, you need to discuss this on the talk page of the article first before removing it, stating why it should be removed (e.g. because the source is dubious) and look what other editors think about that. --Laber□T 07:32, 1 May 2016 (UTC)
 * Hello Laber and thanks for your advice. Changes that were made in my first edit: 1) I excluded the paragraph about the Ashkenazi rabbi Schneerson. Because this paragraph is Ashkenazi biased as it provides false information by saying that our community lacked spiritual leaders - This statement is simply not true. We had a lot of rabbi's and schools for children, long before this specific rabbi had been born. 2) I excluded the paragraph that provided false info about hiding identity. It really seems that somebody from Ashkenazi origin wrote it, because it's obvious that he brought something from the world and experiences of Ashkenazi jews and poured this on mountain jews. It's a known fact that specifically Ashkenazi jews always tried to assimilate and hid their identity in every country that they have ever lived in and especially in soviet union, but mountain jews never hid their identity. In the contrary, we were proud of our jewish origin and religion and we emphasized it in various forms: One example is that many of our people wore the star of david, made of gold, man and women, and it stemmed from our proudness in our origin and religion. We always married inside our communities and always chose to live in our own communities, even in the big cities like Baku. We always used Hebrew names and surnames. Special names from the bible, names like: Isaiah, Gad, Zerach, Naphtali, Ephraim, Abram, Jeremiah, Saul etc. Surnames like: Nisanov, Davidov, Abramov, Isakov, Michaelov, Zechariahov, Solomonov etc. About the star of david you can see it even on the picture of the delegates (it's on their clothes) with Herzl. 3) I excluded paragraph about anti-Semitism, because it's again not true, the person that wrote this paragraph tries to do an artificial correlation with Ashkenazi experience and history. The fact is that mountain jews never experienced anti-Semitism in the Caucasus. You yourself helped me in changing info about holocaust, you could see on the article that you have provided, that circassians from Kabardino-Balkaria defended mountain jews and opposed the Nazi policy. Another example of tolerance and coexistence is Qırmızı Qəsəbə in Azerbaijan. ****Now I want to save my changes, but problem is that it is difficult to back every word with academic sources - sometimes they simply do not exist.****(Hebrew Mountain Man (talk) 16:02, 1 May 2016 (UTC))
 * I would write that on the talk page of the article, then wait for other people to comment on it, and if they agree edit the article accordingly. You might also want to go to the WP:WikiProject Judaism and WP:WikiProject Jewish History to meet other editors who work on articles in the scope of their project, and can help you edit this one as well. You always find links to WikiProjects on the talk page of any article or other page within their scope. Currently, almost all WikiProjects that include this article rate it as "Start" class, which is the worst one can have, even though its importance is rated "Medium" to "High", depending on the project. This means there is surely lots of room for improvement and expansion. --Laber□T 18:37, 1 May 2016 (UTC)
 * I don't like correspondence with to many users because it's a waste of time, I prefer writing and correct mistakes instead of never ending correspondence with people who have predefined mindset (like in the case of Ashkenazi Jews). I don't know what's their problem but they always try to find parallels to their own history in other Jewish communities, or to distort history so it be suitable to their world view. In Israel they totally "killed" the community by writing "it was a big community until world war 2" (=meaning Germans killed most of the community, which is absolutely a lie). Anyway, I have another suggestion, If I will find information that contradicts the current paragraphs that I want to delete. Will you be able to help me change the article the way I wanted to?(Hebrew Mountain Man (talk) 19:16, 1 May 2016 (UTC))
 * As long as your changes are verifiable, sure. But I still think you should also consider these WikiProjects, maybe they are more useful than you think. --Laber□T 19:22, 1 May 2016 (UTC)
 * I like to do it short and effective as I wrote before. Therefore, it's enough (for me at least) to talk with one person. For the beginning I think I can find info that proves that mountain jews had rabbis and jewish schools, long before schneerson or in the times when he was a child. So we can delete the paragraph which mentions him as a key figure.(Hebrew Mountain Man (talk) 19:40, 1 May 2016 (UTC))
 * Source for tolerance which contradicts anti-Semitism claim - "In Azerbaijan Muslims, Christians and Jews live together in an atmosphere of mutual respect, harmony and unity. I came across that in different regions of Azerbaijan, not only in the capital but also in the cities of Quba and Ganja. We should learn from this experience in France as well." http://www.visions.az/en/news/483/75eb2f55/ I will bring more sources about the subjects that we have been talking about. (Hebrew Mountain Man (talk) 20:03, 1 May 2016 (UTC))
 * I have an excellent article which shows mountain jews rabbis http://stmegi.com/posts/32308/rabbi-gershon-mizrakhi-pravednyy-ravvin-obshchiny-gorskikh-evreev/ In the picture is Rabbi Gershon the son of Rabbi Reuben. Years of life 1815-1891. He was a descendant of rabbi Josef of the 15th century. His father was the supreme rabbi until 1853. In this article you also can see a monument which depicts many rabbis. Now, can the changes be done? (Hebrew Mountain Man (talk) 20:16, 1 May 2016 (UTC))

Yes, but don't forget to add your sources to the article and always write in the edit summary why you removed larger portions of the article if you did so. --Laber□T 20:20, 1 May 2016 (UTC)
 * I have already done my changes can you undo the user:blanter, so my edits will come back? and than I will add sources(Hebrew Mountain Man (talk) 20:27, 1 May 2016 (UTC))
 * OK, please add them now. --Laber□T 20:29, 1 May 2016 (UTC)
 * Ok, thanks.(Hebrew Mountain Man (talk) 20:31, 1 May 2016 (UTC))
 * Now it's fine? I would also want to write the history of Kulgat, a very ancient settlement which was located a few kilometers upstream the river kudialchai, approximately in a height of 1000m in the mountains near Qırmızı Qəsəbə. It's mountain jews founded Qırmızı Qəsəbə. They lived there 1000 years before Qırmızı Qəsəbə was founded. This was always the center of religion and jews of the Caucasus, long before the jewish vally which is mentiond on the article. (Hebrew Mountain Man (talk) 21:01, 1 May 2016 (UTC))
 * Do you want to create a seperate article for that settlement? --Laber□T 21:10, 1 May 2016 (UTC)
 * No, I prefer to write it on the same article. Wikipedia problem - What you can advice me to do with sources? In our community we pass the knowledge from generation to generation and there are things that are not documented academically.(Hebrew Mountain Man (talk) 21:23, 1 May 2016 (UTC))
 * This is difficult, then. Of course, academic sources are preferred, but websites, blogs and so on may also be used, depending on the nature of them (for example, the website of an official authority would of course be able to gather more acceptance than a personal blog by an largely unknown person with little knowledge of the topic s/he writes about). Also don't forget books. If there exists no written record in any form, it will be difficult to verify, and any editor may remove those edits. --Laber□T 21:35, 1 May 2016 (UTC)
 * I have a lot of personal info on the subject and As you saw no information was provided from blogs. All the information which was provided his reliable, even with old pictures. Moreover, Publications of a Caucasian country is more reliable than the publication of people who were living in the USA beyond the ocean or from UK, Both weren't familiar with the subject and they even didn't have access to the Caucasus during soviet times. The fact that a publication comes from prominent university don't necessarily say it has more quality. Many American and English publications also say that UK and US defeated Germany, though we know that it was mainly Soviet Union. For everything that I will write, I will try to provide a source. Thank you. (Hebrew Mountain Man (talk) 21:52, 1 May 2016 (UTC))
 * Again, virtually no long article only contains strictly academic sources. If there exists no written record at all, this is of course a much bigger problem. You should also note that facts that may be controversial are more likely to be challenged, and thus need more and better sources than undisputed facts, and vice versa. --Laber□T 21:57, 1 May 2016 (UTC)
 * Ok, all sources will be provided when I will decide to do a change or add substantial information.(Hebrew Mountain Man (talk) 22:08, 1 May 2016 (UTC))
 * Maybe you'll find some useful information here: http://www.gbjd.org/%D0%B3%D0%BB%D0%B0%D0%B2%D0%BD%D0%B0%D1%8F/ --Laber□T 08:22, 2 May 2016 (UTC)

Invalid AIV report
I declined your AIV report regarding, as the editor has edited only once, the edit was not clearly vandalistic, and the editor received no talk-page warnings. The account cannot be considered a VOA at this point. Deor (talk) 20:38, 2 May 2016 (UTC)

Demographic transition
Can you please put back my changes on Demographic Transition. As I explained in my edits https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Demographic_transition&diff=prev&oldid=718163756 is because I am using latest data from wikipedia article https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_sovereign_states_and_dependent_territories_by_fertility_rate

As for this https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Demographic_transition&diff=next&oldid=718163756 edit The section heading has been wrong since it was created. The explanation for why it was wrong (done by somebody else) has been sitting in wikipedia for 6 years now. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Talk:Demographic_transition#.22Non-applicability_to_less-developed_countries.22

Please put back my changes. They are correct. Krishna Pagadala (talk) 02:19, 2 May 2016 (UTC)
 * I still don't get why you choose to remove the source from the University of Pennsylvania? --Laber□T


 * I just checked it is not accessible anymore, so removing it is ok. The fact that demographic data is unavailable is not important, the heading about DTM not being applicable to Less Developed Countries needed to go, along with the supporting statement sourced from University of Pennsylvania. DTM is valid in India, China etc.. also Krishna Pagadala (talk) 08:09, 2 May 2016 (UTC)


 * If a source is no longer accessible we mark it as having a dead link. We do not remove it. If you think additional sources are needed, discuss on the talk page of the article.  DGG ( talk ) 18:14, 5 May 2016 (UTC)


 * OK. Got it. The link was also not relevant. Given that it only supported the fact that demographic was unavailable. If you think that I removed something valuable please let me know, and we can add it back. My intent was to make corrections, I think the article is better after my corrections. Krishna Pagadala (talk) 18:39, 5 May 2016 (UTC)

Josefina Molina
Hello Laberkiste. Thank you for your feedback. I am writing you because you reverted my edition of Josefina Molina article due to unsourced content. I am very sorry for not including this information, but this is the first time I edit an article in Wikipedia. I have the missing information, how do we do it? Do I send it to you and you complete the article or shall I undo your reversion and complete it myself? I do not want to cause any trouble. Thank you very much in advance. Cmorchi (talk) 21:24, 8 May 2016 (UTC)
 * You just edit the article again, this time including all information you want to insert before saving. --Laber□T 21:25, 8 May 2016 (UTC)

May 2016
Greetings. At least one of your recent edits, such as the edit you made to Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Halal snack pack, did not appear to be constructive and has been or will be reverted or removed. Although everyone is welcome to contribute to Wikipedia, please take some time to familiarise yourself with our policies and guidelines. You can find information about these at our welcome page which also provides further information about contributing constructively to this encyclopedia. If you only meant to make some test edits, please use the sandbox for that. If you think I made a mistake, or if you have any questions, you may leave a message on my talk page. Thank you. – Davey 2010 Talk 00:12, 10 May 2016 (UTC)
 * Consensus is to keep the article, If you have a problem with it then go to WP:DRV, Edit warring over the closure will only result in you being blocked, Thanks, – Davey 2010 Talk 00:14, 10 May 2016 (UTC)

I have unreviewed a page you curated
Hi, I'm SwisterTwister. I wanted to let you know that I saw the page you reviewed, Nam phrik aarne, and have un-reviewed it again. If you have any questions, please ask them on my talk page. Thank you. SwisterTwister  talk  19:11, 16 May 2016 (UTC)

List of Presidents of the United States by education
I am unsure from what time I have this IP but never read fore-mentioned article and rather edited by 172.56.41.247 (talk) 16:42, 12 May 2016 (UTC) Talk:Jan Łukasiewicz. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 172.56.40.113 (talk) 06:41, 20 May 2016 (UTC)

Can we talk about Huggle?
I’m reaching out to you because our logs tell us you’re a highly active Huggle user (top 20, actually). The Wikimedia Collaboration Team is researching a project that we hope will be useful to people who use Huggle and others engaged in edit-review and anti-vandalism. Using artificial intelligence programming (in ORES) and other means, we believe we can create feeds of Recent Changes that are better tailored to the type of work you do, helping you to be more effective and efficient. (The technology will have other benefits as well, which we can talk about.)

We're in the early stages of planning this and want to speak with people like yourself to better understand your work, goals and issues. If you’re interested in helping, I’d like to set up a time to meet by video conference, so that you can explain and demonstrate (via screensharing) some of your workflows, and we can ask and answer any questions.

To participate, please email the following information to me, jmatazzoni@undefinedwikimedia.org, or send it to designresearch@undefinedwikimedia.org:


 * Username
 * city/time zone
 * Best time to talk to you?
 * Email where we can reach you
 * Please use the subject line: Huggle User Conversations

Thanks! JMatazzoni (WMF) (talk) 19:42, 20 May 2016 (UTC)

WP:BLUE ??
Perhaps you should also read WP:NOTBLUE. Specifically: "citations are required for … … statements that are challenged or likely to be challenged". I think you knew when you made your edit on Black Supremacy, that some serious, experienced editors HAD challenged the claim in the RfC.

NOTBLUE goes on "If it really is common knowledge, it really isn't that difficult to source." ie the underlying reason we don't bother to source 'Paris is a City', is not because it is self-evident, but because we COULD find innumerable RS to support the claim if need be. So, ask yourself, why cannot editors find a broad sweep of RS describing THESE organisations as inherently 'racist', or indeed in many cases as 'Black Supremacist' at all? Pincrete (talk) 22:09, 20 May 2016 (UTC)
 * Well, you can find a source for that in every dictionary under 'racism'. --Laber□T 22:47, 20 May 2016 (UTC)
 * Read my question again why cannot editors find a broad sweep of RS describing THESE organisations as inherently 'racist'.  My dictionary doesn't mention 'The Israelite Church of God in Jesus Christ', does yours? I don't need to be told what racism is, I just ask for some evidence about THESE groups. The article cites no sources describing many of them as 'supremacist', nor do their own wp articles, or is that obvious too? Since the lead says they are supremacist, it must be true, NO? … … … A house built on sand (and blue skies?).
 * Some of these groups, possibly and some of the individuals certainly are reliably described as 'racist', but cannot you see the diference between accurately recording that degree of racism (and degree of supremacism, if it is real) and a blanket label in a lead which appears to be simply an intentional 'mirror image' of the equiv. 'white' article? Pincrete (talk) 23:35, 20 May 2016 (UTC)

Sockpuppet investigations/90.203.20.230
If you persist in filing reports with no evidence and/or duplicate reports, you risk being blocked for disruption.--Bbb23 (talk) 14:09, 25 May 2016 (UTC)