User talk:Liz/Archive 34

Administrators' newsletter – November 2020
News and updates for administrators from the past month (October 2020).

Administrator changes
 * Gnome-colors-list-add.svg John M Wolfson
 * Gnome-colors-list-remove.svg Bduke • Nilfanion • Philosopher • Rspeer • Yunshui

Interface administrator changes
 * Gnome-colors-view-refresh.svg Ragesoss
 * Gnome-colors-list-remove.svg TonyBallioni

CheckUser changes
 * Gnome-colors-list-add.svg EdJohnston • Oshwah • Yamla
 * Gnome-colors-list-remove.svg Yunshui

Oversight changes
 * Gnome-colors-list-add.svg Anarchyte
 * Gnome-colors-list-remove.svg Yunshui

Guideline and policy news
 * Community sanctions now authorize administrators to place under indefinite semiprotection any article on a beauty pageant, or biography of a person known as a beauty pageant contestant, which has been edited by a sockpuppet account or logged-out sockpuppet, to be logged at WP:GS/PAGEANT.

Technical news
 * Sysops will once again be able to view the deleted history of JS/CSS pages; this was restricted to interface administrators when that group was introduced.
 * Twinkle's block module now includes the ability to note the specific case when applying a discretionary sanctions block and/or template.
 * Sysops will be able to use Special:CreateLocalAccount to create a local account for a global user that is prevented from auto-creation locally (such as by a filter or range block). Administrators that are not sure if such a creation is appropriate should contact a checkuser.

Arbitration
 * The 2020 Arbitration Committee Elections process has begun. Eligible editors will be able to nominate themselves as candidates from November 8 through November 17. The voting period will run from November 23 through December 6.
 * The Anti-harassment RfC has concluded with a summary of the feedback provided.

Miscellaneous
 * A reminder that standard discretionary sanctions are authorized for all edits about, and all pages related to post-1932 politics of the United States and closely related people. (American Politics 2 Arbitration case).

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Archive Sent by MediaWiki message delivery (talk) 11:52, 1 November 2020 (UTC)

Romanie Schotte
Hi Liz, I see you've just deleted Romanie Schotte, which was apparently prodded as BLP1E. My understanding was that winners of national-level beauty pageants were taken to be notable, but this particular individual made national news in her country not only for winning the pageant but also for being sued for some sort of racial discrimination (making 2 events). Would it be possible to restore it? --Andreas Philopater (talk) 14:53, 1 November 2020 (UTC)


 * Hello, Andreas Philopater,
 * PRODs are for uncontroversial or uncontested article deletion. So, since you are contesting this, I have restored this page and it can not be PROD'd again. If an editor thinks the page should be deleted, they will have have to use Articles for Deletion.
 * I should mention that several Miss Belgium beauty queens were tagged with PRODs and deleted today. You might check my deletion log and see if there are any others you wish to see restored. Liz Read! Talk! 15:05, 1 November 2020 (UTC)
 * Thanks for letting me know (Schotte was the only one on my watchlist). I'll have to check whether (and how) notability guidelines for beauty pageant winners have changed. --Andreas Philopater (talk) 15:11, 1 November 2020 (UTC)


 * Hello, Andreas Philopater,
 * For PRODs (or G13 stale drafts), you don't really need to justify article restoration, like you would have to do in an AfD discussion. They are restored upon request as long as it's a good faith request. There is the hope that you could address the PROD rationale for deletion but it's not a requirement. Liz Read! Talk! 15:19, 1 November 2020 (UTC)
 * Thanks. I don't want to go about disputing a bunch of prods on a false understanding of what consensus about beauty queens actually is, though. --Andreas Philopater (talk) 15:23, 1 November 2020 (UTC)
 * The "Miss Belgium" pageant winners deleted seem to be Stephanie Geldhof, Annelies Törös and Noémie Happart. The last (Happart) was in the national news in 2017 and again this year (after winning the title in 2013), so I think the "BLP1E" claim fails there, and please could you restore the article. I'll wait to see what the consensus about national title winners actually is for the other two (the prodder was acting on the assumption that 18 articles about regional winners being deleted in a single group AfD gave a basis to prod national winners). --Andreas Philopater (talk) 19:09, 1 November 2020 (UTC)


 * Given how busy your page has been the past couple of days, I can well understand that you missed this request, but could you please restore the page Noémie Happart, deleted after expired prod? --Andreas Philopater (talk) 20:28, 3 November 2020 (UTC)
 * ✅ Sorry, Andreas Philopater, when I see I have a new talk page message, I go directly to the bottom of the page and I missed your earlier message. Liz Read! Talk! 20:35, 3 November 2020 (UTC)
 * I quite understand! --Andreas Philopater (talk) 23:26, 3 November 2020 (UTC)

The Signpost: 1 November 2020
 * Read this Signpost in full * Single-page * Unsubscribe * MediaWiki message delivery (talk) 19:51, 1 November 2020 (UTC)

Go away! But first here's this!
For someone who doesn't want anyone watching or commenting on their talk, they sure do keep adding more and more shit that would make someone want to watchlist it and comment on it.  I don't know if this person came here in good faith or as some sort of plan to infiltrate the deep state on Wikipedia. They're actually a good and thoughtful writer. But clearly they think they're waging some sort of lost-cause war against liberal bias here. They seem to be using their talk as a webhost, at this point. —valereee (talk) 12:42, 2 November 2020 (UTC)
 * NF is a good editor who deals with a lot of vandalism and who's gotten a lot of heat lately both on- and off-wiki on the Sushant Singh Rajput cause of death issue from hordes of SSR fans. I don't know if the bitterness NF's expressing on their talk page recently is a new development or the way they've felt all along, but their edits are good and compliant and they do a lot of work to improve Wikipedia. Maybe just give them some space and the benefit of the doubt? Schazjmd   (talk)  15:51, 2 November 2020 (UTC)
 * I'm wondering if this is a stress reaction. I think to begin with it's difficult for conservatives on WP, which I think can cause a siege mentality even in normal times. That plus the whole mess the world is in right now and of course the US election tomorrow...I'm willing to overlook it for now, as long as it doesn't get worse in the near future and eventually gets better. I can't speak for others, but I'm sort of just crossing my fingers. —valereee (talk) 17:11, 2 November 2020 (UTC)
 * I appreciate your comments but I don't really want to talk about other editors unless they are problematic. I don't agree with Ned that there is discrimination on Wikipedia but he is entitled to his opinion as long as he is not being disruptive. And I think asking other editors to take his talk page off their Watchlist is not being disruptive. Liz Read! Talk! 23:08, 2 November 2020 (UTC)
 * My apologies. I'm feeling a bit stressed, too. :) —valereee (talk) 23:58, 2 November 2020 (UTC)
 * You inspired me to cull a couple days ago, under the blue hunter's moon at Cullen's. So I arbitrarily mowed down four once-cherished tales of mine without even blinking. I mean, they weren't great articles, but they used to seem OK, probably still were. But hey, I'm down to a slim, trim 500c to distract me while Biden makes political heat boring again. Thanks, Valbama! I don't mean that sarcastically, either, this is just the way I talk. As America's greatest figurehead Homer Simpson once opined, "I have serious mental problems!" And you helped me appreciate the value of cullin'! Why dwell in the past when we could stare into the light at the end of this crazy rainbow-flavoured tunnel of dystopian tension that was this bullshit spring, summer and fall? To wintry slumber, the universal dream, the great equalizer, the real relation, the underlying theme. Long story short, I consent to you two drawing conclusions from this partially "conservative" or kookily "conversative" editor's documented descent into madness and apologize if anything I've said or am saying could be taken as a veiled personal attack, protest song or white supremacist echo. Donald Trump has never been my president. I don't have a president. I have a queen. I have a degree in journalism. I swore an oath to uphold certain standards of integrity and decency in reporting. I have a love for Southern' wrasslin' shenanigans and black champions in and out of the squared circle. Sometimes I come off as "the other side", but trust me, I've seen things, there is no other side in the greatest battle humanity has ever eternally and collectively feared losing. The Babylonians, Scorpions and Kansas were right all along. When the dust settles, we settle our differences. When the winds of change blow straight again, all we are is agitated dust. Relax, and keep on cutting the thousands of topics you used to find worth staying in touch with out of your daily bread, Valbama. Yes, you can! (And yes, I can stop calling you that or leaving rambling messages on your co-workers' desks, just remember how liberating a mass cull can feel, Cull, cull, cull..) InedibleHulk (talk) 07:57, 3 November 2020 (UTC)
 * For cripe's sake, if you are going to allude to my username several times, shouldn't you ping me at least once, ? Like I just did? Cullen328  Let's discuss it  08:28, 3 November 2020 (UTC)
 * It worked just as fast. Sorry though, you're right. How've you been? InedibleHulk (talk) 08:38, 3 November 2020 (UTC)
 * u|Cullen328, that is. InedibleHulk (talk) 08:44, 3 November 2020 (UTC)
 * , I almost used cullin' in that message to Cullen but decided it was a little too on the nose. That's quite the...um...I'm not sure what to call that, but it reminds me of an old boyfriend. Is that you, Kevin? :D —valereee (talk) 12:50, 3 November 2020 (UTC)
 * , I almost used paragraph spacin' on the chunk above, but figured it would take away from the whole "meltdown" vibe. Anyway, don't worry, I'm not Kevin. Haven't even known a Kevin since around '95. And I'm not stalking you, either, I just notice you at a lot of Talk I skim lately. Those three E's are attractive, but in a platonic way, like Liz's big bold hyperlink which drew me here like a harmless royalist moth. You write well, too, and have more good ideas than bad. I think the climate has just had us on edge and concentrating on our differences at polarizing topics lately, good riddance to the last four years! Trump had to happen for the continent to hit rock bottom, as did the rioting, pandemic and ism-related reckoning. Like you with K-Dog, I presume, I did have some fun under T-Rex, but as the great Vince McMahon once asked that white devil Jake Roberts, what do you do with a really good book when you've read it? So yeah, put your past away and decimate your watchlist! I meant to write 5c earlier, not 500c, not sure how anyone can chill with a thousand of any number. I'm narrowing mine to a Top 25 before the next moon, and insist on paying that mere suggestion back to you, that's all. Look away to look ahead, and always listen to Blue Oyster Cult's Secret Treaties when you're unsure of what to do! Peace. InedibleHulk (talk) 23:22, 3 November 2020 (UTC)
 * Peace to you, too, . I appreciate your kind words, and your contributions, even when we disagree. Maybe especially when. :) I agree that Trump probably had to happen, but as a survey developer, survey methodologist, and research analyst, I question the polls and am not at all sure it's over yet. :) At this point I'm just crossing my fingers for no violence, and I'm not at all confident about that, either. Best to you, my colleague. —valereee (talk) 23:36, 3 November 2020 (UTC)
 * I think this is the first time my talk page has become a watering hole. Discussion tends to be pretty utilitarian here. But you're all welcome to chat! Liz Read! Talk! 23:52, 3 November 2020 (UTC)
 * On the bright side, it did serve a purpose. I just pressed a big red button and culled every person, place and thing I ever cared about here. At least I think they're gone forever, the system warned me it might take a while. Hadn't realized there was an easy button. So many memories, bam, done! Some were deleted redlinks that only existed in that watchlist, some were windows into real people's minds, some were almost 15 years old. But now they're all the same, lost together in that vast shadowy mirror world of deleted online stuff. I FEEL AWESOME! Thanks for everything, good watering holefolk. If anyone wants to help repopulate the newer, better watchlist, just drop me a line sometime, maybe recommend a favourite album. InedibleHulk (talk) 05:51, 4 November 2020 (UTC)

User:Ituafmq/sandbox
I have removed the block message - but I was only using it to experiment with wikitext, I wasn't using it for blocked users. I will try not to put notices like that on my sandbox anymore. --Ituafmq (talk) 15:35, 2 November 2020 (UTC)
 * Okay, Ituafmq, that sounds like a good move. It was just a curious thing for a editor who's only been active for one day to do. I'd stick to improving articles for now. Liz Read! Talk! 16:26, 2 November 2020 (UTC)
 * Thank you for the advice. I will find ways to improve articles. --Ituafmq (talk) 16:29, 2 November 2020 (UTC)

My Mistake
Hello Liz, So sorry about the mixup. I was trying to create Igbo category for Igbo Language articles, I did that on the wrong page.Oby Ezeilo (talk) 18:58, 2 November 2020 (UTC)
 * No problem. They are just empty categories, tagged for deletion. Liz Read! Talk! 23:04, 2 November 2020 (UTC)

Talkback
WesternAtlanticCentral (talk) 20:53, 2 November 2020 (UTC)

Deletion request
Hey here, thanks for deleting my talk archive by my request. Could you please delete my talk page User talk:Eurofan88 as well, requested it for deletion 2 hours ago, nothing important there just i'd like to clean up the history. Thank you. Eurofan88 (talk) 18:48, 3 November 2020 (UTC)


 * Hello, Eurofan88,
 * We don't delete user talk pages except in extraordinary conditions. You can blank the page or I can. Liz Read! Talk! 18:50, 3 November 2020 (UTC)

WP:Teahouse
Is the teahouse the right place to share riddles/jokes with others? --Oscar012723487 (talk) 20:45, 3 November 2020 (UTC)


 * Hello, Oscar012723487,
 * There is no place on Wikipedia that is an appropriate place for sharing jokes. Wikipedia is an encyclopedia, not a social network. The Teahouse is a place for new editors to ask questions about editing articles. Discussions here involve how to improve articles or debating Wikipedia policy, not for general conversation. There are many other platforms, like Facebook, Twitter, Instagram or blogs, for sharing jokes or just casual conversation. Liz Read! Talk! 20:52, 3 November 2020 (UTC)


 * What does it mean when someone reverts my edits? Does it mean that I did something unconstructive? Because DexDor reverted my edits on WP:Subpages and I wasn't able to find a reason in the page history. --Oscar012723487 (talk) 21:16, 3 November 2020 (UTC)
 * Hello, Oscar012723487,
 * Ideally, an editor should leave a brief explanation for an edit in the edit summary which appears in the page history. I think "unconstructive" is a good word for why some edits are reverted. I also think that brand new editors like yourself are scrutinized more than experienced editors because you might not know all of Wikipedia's policies and practices. That's understandable. You can always go to the talk page of an editor who reverted you and ask them why. Hopefully, they will be courteous and provide you with an explanation.
 * Also, I know it can be jarring when you have an edit reverted but even editors who have been editing Wikipedia for decades sometimes have their edits reverted if there is a dispute over the content that has been added to an article or deleted from it. Try not to take it personally. All of us are, at times, reverted. It means that you start a discussion over why. Liz Read! Talk! 21:27, 3 November 2020 (UTC)

Renamed user page deletion

 * Deletion log Liz talk contribs deleted page User:Staszek Lem

Please also delete all redirects which are subpages, per request in User:Staszek Lem/init‎‎. Lembit Staan (talk) 17:22, 4 November 2020 (UTC)
 * Especially https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=User:Staszek_Lem/EditCounterOptIn.js&redirect=no ;I cannot place "db" tag on it because it is read-only for me now. Lembit Staan (talk) 17:28, 4 November 2020 (UTC)


 * Okay, Lembit Staan, I think I got them all. Thanks for tagging them. Liz Read! Talk! 17:31, 4 November 2020 (UTC)

Hello
Hi Liz. I created this category Category:December 2020 peer reviews to store peer reviews from December. This is part of 160 other similarly named categories. It even says so on the category page. I don't understand how mere hours after creation you have placed a speedy review tag on it, just as you have been doing for other peer review categories, some that are still in use as maintenance categories.

How did you even identify that category? I have been wiki stalked before and it's not a comfortable experience.

I would request you spend a modicum of time before proposing these categories for deletion or, if you are confused about their purpose, feel free to ask me. Slapping these deletion tags is aggressive, not collegiate, and not constructive. Additionally I do not always have time to attend Wikipedia and you risk deleting categories that are actually useful and will need repairing in the process. Happy to discuss further below. --Tom (LT) (talk) 22:25, 4 November 2020 (UTC)


 * Hello, Tom (LT),
 * You are not being wiki-stalked, the category appeared on Database reports/Empty categories. Tagging empty categories is a daily activity, it is not "aggressive". Empty categories are tagged in accordance with Criteria for speedy deletion, unless they fall into a small number of exceptions. Categories are placed in Category:Empty categories awaiting deletion and, after 7 days, if the category is still empty, it is deleted. If a category has at least one appropriate page assigned to it over that 7 day period, the tag is removed and it is not deleted. If a category is deleted because it was empty for 7 days and it turns out that it is later needed, it can be recreated.
 * I guess my question for you is why you would create a December 2020 peer review category on November 3rd? Monthly categories are typically created when needed or at the end of the month. You shouldn't be creating categories before they need to be utilized. Liz Read! Talk! 22:39, 4 November 2020 (UTC)
 * I create it a month in advance because aside from myself often the process is unmaintained. Therefore occasionally as we have done we have peer reviews linking to a category that is not created yet. Additionally, because I also have a life aside from Wikipedia, I am not always present at the end of the month to create these categories, and, because we have no active bots, a bot cannot do this. You are welcome to take on this responsibility. I feel the documentation on the category page is quite clear, so was disappointed that you nominated it in the way that you did. It will clearly be used next month. If in the future this continues to happen I will put a placeholder article to avoid the empty category nomination. I do not believe your action here was constructive. --Tom (LT) (talk) 22:50, 4 November 2020 (UTC)
 * Hi, reflecting on the above message I think I was somewhat frustrated and have cooled down a bit. I'm sure like me you're trying your best to help out around here. Apologies for being a bit direct above. I guess my main hope is that with regard to peer review you could troubleshoot some pages before proposing them for speedy deletion or, if you have any questions about their purpose (I refer to the pages that were labelled with maintenance tags before), feel free to ask. --Tom (LT) (talk) 23:27, 4 November 2020 (UTC)
 * ALways put emptycat on maintenance cats you create if you anticipate them being empty for some time. That would prevent exclude it from the database reports for anyone to tag or delete. – SD0001  (talk) 07:55, 10 November 2020 (UTC)
 * Thanks, noted. --Tom (LT) (talk) 08:16, 10 November 2020 (UTC)

Trilla venus
Hello, you recently deleted and salted Trilla Venus with a db-g5 pointing to User:Lil855. But this odd edit to the talk page of new article Trilla venus suggests a possible connection with WP:Sockpuppet investigations/Nana222222. Thanks, Captain Calm (talk) 11:19, 5 November 2020 (UTC)


 * Hello, Captain Calm,
 * Sorry for the delay in responding. I looked into this and Trilla Venus was created by Realperth85 and then Lil855, both of whom were blocked. The page was deleted three times, mostly for G11 promotional reasons so I protected the page to prevent it from being recreated. I didn't think about Trilla venus, which just existed as a broken redirect which I deleted. But it looks like Discospinster has now protected this page from being recreated.


 * Affinnitysuccess looks a bit suspicious but I do not possess a good sockpuppet detector and Nana222222 doesn't ring any bells. I looked over Sockpuppet_investigations/Nana222222/Archive and don't see any connection to Realperth85 and Lil855. But you can always reopen the SPI case or ask a checkuser to look into it. Liz <sup style="font-family: Times New Roman; color: #006400;">Read! Talk! 23:49, 5 November 2020 (UTC)

Backlinks
Thanks for deleting the prodded Kahit Minsan Lang article. However, when the topic has been found unfitting for Wikipedia I believe that backlinks should also be removed entirely. See backlinks. I think it can be done with the same script. (Coincidence that you left a talk page message for me earlier; these two things are unrelated.) Geschichte (talk) 09:00, 6 November 2020 (UTC)
 * Okay, thanks for letting me know. Liz <sup style="font-family: Times New Roman; color: #006400;">Read! Talk! 19:21, 6 November 2020 (UTC)

Dmytro Nimenko
Hello! Thank you for deleting my page about hockey player Dmytro Nimenko. I'm sure this was great decision. I should know that pages about international hockey players are useless for Wikipedia. Now I can don't waste my time creating and editing pages about Ukrainian hockey. Have a nice day, bro :) — Preceding unsigned comment added by Serhii79 (talk • contribs) 19:02, 6 November 2020 (UTC)


 * Hello, Serhii79,
 * You're welcome, glad I could help.
 * By the way, this page was deleted because it was an uncontested PROD. Should you wish to restore it, just ask. Then you could address the problems an editor found with it. Liz <sup style="font-family: Times New Roman; color: #006400;">Read! Talk! 19:25, 6 November 2020 (UTC)

92.119.17.67
user: 92.119.17.67 is attempting to post lewd images if you see the filter. CLCStudent (talk) 18:42, 7 November 2020 (UTC)
 * ✅ Liz <sup style="font-family: Times New Roman; color: #006400;">Read! Talk! 18:48, 7 November 2020 (UTC)

2001:818:E828:F500:304F:19B0:2DA9:F423
Can user: 2001:818:E828:F500:304F:19B0:2DA9:F423 please be blocked asap. CLCStudent (talk) 19:05, 7 November 2020 (UTC)
 * ✅ Liz <sup style="font-family: Times New Roman; color: #006400;">Read! Talk! 19:13, 7 November 2020 (UTC)

Thank you
For deleting List of British Army Regiments (2008). BlueD954 (talk) 02:37, 8 November 2020 (UTC)
 * Hello, BlueD954,
 * It was an uncontested PROD so it was deleted. Glad you found it useful. Liz <sup style="font-family: Times New Roman; color: #006400;">Read! Talk! 02:38, 8 November 2020 (UTC)

Non-free
Why did you speedily delete Non-free and Nonfree when they were being discussed at RfD, where there was no clear consensus for any single action and two people have explicitly objected to speedy deletion? Thryduulf (talk) 16:00, 8 November 2020 (UTC)
 * Hello, Thryduulf,
 * They were broken redirects. The page that was their redirect target, Proprietary. had been deleted. If you have an alternative redirect target, I'll restore them. Liz <sup style="font-family: Times New Roman; color: #006400;">Read! Talk! 16:09, 8 November 2020 (UTC)
 * Please restore them as alternative targets are being actively discussed (as linked above) which means they were not eligible for speedy deletion (doubly so as explicit good-faith objections also mean the page is not eligible). That the target was deleted is therefore irrelevant in this case. Thryduulf (talk) 16:14, 8 November 2020 (UTC)
 * Okay. Liz <sup style="font-family: Times New Roman; color: #006400;">Read! Talk! 02:07, 9 November 2020 (UTC)
 * Thank you. Thryduulf (talk) 12:44, 9 November 2020 (UTC)

Please do not delete restored drafts
Hi Liz, I note that you are still deleting drafts that after not tagged with a g13 tag. Please also check if the draft has been undeleted in the last 6 months, as what is happening is that drafts are restored, and then deleted within a few days by you without any chance for improvements. People should get 6 months grace against g13 after a draft undeletion. In particular this happened today for Draft:Joel P. Corin. Can twinkle be a bit smarter about this? If you pull up the delete screen, it shows the previous deletes and restores, so it is possible to see recent activity. Graeme Bartlett (talk) 00:30, 9 November 2020 (UTC)
 * Hello, Graeme Bartlett,
 * I check the edit history of every single G13 eligible draft I come across. Without fail. Every one. In, I'd say, 95% of the cases where you've restored a draft at WP:REFUND, you make an edit to the draft to indicate that it's been restored. And I see that edit and I skip that draft because I can see it is restored. Every time I restore a draft, I also make a minor edit to the page to indicate it's a restored draft. But occasionally, I don't know why, you don't make an edit to an draft you restore which is what I guess happened with Draft:Joel P. Corin.
 * And since these days I delete hundreds of stale drafts a day and you probably restore 10-15 drafts, could you please just make a minor edit to all of your restored drafts? Then I can see that they are restored and these problems probably won't happen. Liz <sup style="font-family: Times New Roman; color: #006400;">Read! Talk! 02:05, 9 November 2020 (UTC)
 * And it isn't just me, Graeme Bartlett. You restored Draft:Radical Liberals, Draft:EUDEMONIZAM, Draft:Derek Ekhoe and Draft:5th Direction, all without making a minor edit to the page, and another editor tagged them all for G13 deletion. If you don't make an edit upon restoration, the drafts will appear in Category:AfC G13 eligible soon submissions and they will be tagged for deletion by one of our editors who patrol this category for aging drafts. Liz <sup style="font-family: Times New Roman; color: #006400;">Read! Talk! 02:45, 9 November 2020 (UTC)
 * More people need to be educated, as g13 taggers need to check that too! Graeme Bartlett (talk) 04:13, 9 November 2020 (UTC)
 * Thanks for the list, I have also issued a notice to Nathan2055 to check before tag. Graeme Bartlett (talk) 04:21, 9 November 2020 (UTC)
 * how do you restore these drafts? If you're using WP:RFUDHELPER it will automatically be making dummy edits while restoring drafts which weren't tagged. – SD0001  (talk) 07:58, 10 November 2020 (UTC)
 * Considering that any editor can tag a draft for deletion, it sounds like WP:RFUDHELPER might be a more manageable solution, SD0001. Thanks for the suggestion. Liz <sup style="font-family: Times New Roman; color: #006400;">Read! Talk! 20:19, 10 November 2020 (UTC)

List of vice presidents of the United States
I checked over your reversion at List of vice presidents of the United States & external sources. Can't see where Biden has already become US president. All sources say, not until January 20, 2021. GoodDay (talk) 22:32, 9 November 2020 (UTC)
 * Hello, GoodDay,
 * I see we have different perspectives on this election and whether it has been determined who the winner is. I am stepping back right now, this arguing is exhaustive and not productive. Liz <sup style="font-family: Times New Roman; color: #006400;">Read! Talk! 02:22, 10 November 2020 (UTC)
 * You're correct. Biden has been elected president of the United States. He just hasn't taken office yet. GoodDay (talk) 02:28, 10 November 2020 (UTC)

Jordan Chatman
User:Innosport99 continues to request deletion of Jordan Chatman despite being warned. Perhaps a longer block is in order? ~ EDDY  ( talk / contribs )~ 16:39, 10 November 2020 (UTC)
 * Thanks for letting me know, Editorofthewiki. I've suggested on their talk page that they propose it at AFD so let's see if they choose to take that route. Liz <sup style="font-family: Times New Roman; color: #006400;">Read! Talk! 20:17, 10 November 2020 (UTC)

I don't get it
What did you mean? I'm totally taken back by it. <span style="text-shadow:#F8F8FF 0.2em 0.2em 0.2em,#F4BBFF -0.2em -0.2em 0.2em,#BFFF00 0.4em 0.4em 0.5em;color:#A2006D"> Atsme 💬 📧 13:26, 11 November 2020 (UTC)
 * Hello, Atsme,
 * I assume that you are referring to my statement at AE but I'm not sure what is confusing about it. I meant that if your topic ban were lifted, your edits to Antifa would be under scrutiny because of your previous topic ban. Liz <sup style="font-family: Times New Roman; color: #006400;">Read! Talk! 18:19, 11 November 2020 (UTC)
 * I have no intention of editing those 2 TPs again - it's too hostile. What I've learned about WP, is that it's important to know when to stop arguing with editors and simply let them be wrong. Calling an RfC is not an offense; however, disrupting or trying to prevent one is - but I'm not guilty of the latter. Also, you're talking about years ago, Liz - how long does that noose hang around an editor's neck? For a lifetime? <span style="text-shadow:#F8F8FF 0.2em 0.2em 0.2em,#F4BBFF -0.2em -0.2em 0.2em,#BFFF00 0.4em 0.4em 0.5em;color:#A2006D"> Atsme  💬 📧 18:28, 11 November 2020 (UTC)

Deleted drafts
It would be night if notification of deleted drafts came BEFORE the deletions. People get busy and #2020 and it would be nice to get notice BEFORE work was disappeared. You have more say in these things than I do, would you be so kind as to pass this along?

I can't help but notice that you have a big warning sign which assumes people come to your talk page angry at you. Perhaps, if the people coming here are always angry, they have a point? Thmazing (talk) 01:51, 12 November 2020 (UTC)


 * Hello, Thmazing,
 * First, people who come here angry are not angry about the deletion of their old drafts. They seem to have other issues with me. But frankly, I should remove that notice because those editors have since retired or been blocked and maybe it sends a bad message.
 * Second, there used to be a bot, Hasteurbot, that posted notices when drafts had been dormant for five months, a month before they became eligible for G13 status. If you look at this discussion at AFC, you'll see me raise the issue of why this bot wasn't working. It turns out that the bot operator passed away in the spring and in cases like that, the bot is deactivated and blocked. You'll see in the discussion that admin Primefac states that Mdaniels5757 is working on a new bot, MDanielsBot 7 which will start up this task again of notifying page creators when their drafts were approaching the 6 month period. Unfortunately, Mdaniels5757 has been absent from Wikipedia for the past four weeks so this project has not moved forward. I hope the bot does become active because it would reduce the number of stale drafts reaching G13 status.
 * Finally, you do know that in cases of CSD G13 drafts, you can go to WP:REFUND and get your draft restored, right? Or just tell me which one it is and I'll restore it now. Liz <sup style="font-family: Times New Roman; color: #006400;">Read! Talk! 02:08, 12 November 2020 (UTC)


 * I hadn't heard about the death. That's humbling.


 * I tend to take a loooong time finishing some draft and this isn't the first time I've had one erased. I just hate that then I have to hassle someone (in this case, you) to get it restored. It seems like a waste of other people's time.


 * Thank you for your kind response! If you could restore Draft:Elizabeth Sandford I would be much obliged! Thmazing (talk) 19:57, 12 November 2020 (UTC)
 * Your draft is restored, Thmazing. Good luck with it! Liz <sup style="font-family: Times New Roman; color: #006400;">Read! Talk! 00:44, 13 November 2020 (UTC)
 * Thank you! Thmazing (talk) 21:45, 14 November 2020 (UTC)

A barnstar for you!

 * Thank you, Techamin. Liz <sup style="font-family: Times New Roman; color: #006400;">Read! Talk! 00:42, 13 November 2020 (UTC)

GS RichCopy 360
Hi Liz, First, thank you all admins for your hard work. I hope all is well. I see you deleted GS RichCopy 360, which I think had text that can be preceived as promotional in some way. If you are ok with restoring it, I would love to go in and fix it. I will also add more notable sources. I will work on it (remove anything that could lead it to be perceived as promotional and add sources) within a day Thank you very much. -- Techamin (talk) 12:43, 12 November 2020 (UTC)


 * Hello, Techamin,
 * This article was tagged as a PROD which is used for an uncontroversial deletion. Articles deleted as PRODs can be restored upon request. But there are problems with the article so to avoid it being tagged for deletion, I have moved it to your user space at User:Techamin/Sandbox.


 * Should you have questions about editing and working on articles, I encourage you to visit the Teahouse where experienced editors can address your questions. Liz <sup style="font-family: Times New Roman; color: #006400;">Read! Talk! 00:41, 13 November 2020 (UTC)


 * Thank you Liz. Completely understand and I appreciate it. I will go ahead and make all the necessary changes and so forth. May I notify once done so that perhaps we can restore it? it may be a month or so.  Thank you once again

(talk) 00:59, 13 November 2020 (UTC)

sock puppet hellp
5 accounts were banned 3 days ago on fa.wikipedia including my two accounts for having same behavior, ip, browser. there are two checkusers in farsi wikipedia and the four of us have failed to prove we are not the same user. im real i have a fb, ig and yt account. can you offer a pathBaratiiman (talk) 14:43, 12 November 2020 (UTC)
 * four of us have been adviced to identify ourselves to a wikimeta steward by fa wiki admins or go to arbitation comite https://meta.wikimedia.org/w/index.php?title=User_talk:Martin_Urbanec&oldid=20641803 Baratiiman (talk) 14:57, 12 November 2020 (UTC)
 * English Wikipedia isn't the place to appeal or discuss this. Follow the instructions on FA wiki. Praxidicae (talk) 15:01, 12 November 2020 (UTC)
 * {That's the instruction by the admin in here.https://fa.wikipedia.org/wiki/%D8%A8%D8%AD%D8%AB_%D9%88%DB%8C%DA%A9%DB%8C%E2%80%8C%D9%BE%D8%AF%DB%8C%D8%A7:%D8%AA%D8%A7%D8%A8%D9%84%D9%88%DB%8C_%D8%A7%D8%B9%D9%84%D8%A7%D9%86%D8%A7%D8%AA_%D9%87%DB%8C%D8%A6%D8%AA_%D9%86%D8%B8%D8%A7%D8%B1%D8%AA/%D8%AF%D9%88%D8%B1%D9%87_%D8%AF%D9%87%D9%85/Behzad39_2#%D9%86%D8%B8%D8%B1_%D9%85%D8%B1%D8%AF%D8%AA%D9%86%D9%87%D8%A7 Baratiiman (talk) 15:03, 12 November 2020 (UTC)
 * I don't know how have you ended up here, but I think if you have anything it should be directed to here Mardetanha (talk) 15:16, 12 November 2020 (UTC)
 * Yes, Baratiiman, administrators on the English Wikipedia have no influence over projects in other languages. And I'm not a checkuser so I have no ability to help you. I encourage you to follow the advice of Praxidicae and Mardetanha and visit WikiMedia and ask a steward for help. Liz <sup style="font-family: Times New Roman; color: #006400;">Read! Talk! 00:34, 13 November 2020 (UTC)

88.145.17.172
Can you please block user:88.145.17.172 CLCStudent (talk) 00:19, 13 November 2020 (UTC)
 * ✅ and I've protected the article under attack. Liz <sup style="font-family: Times New Roman; color: #006400;">Read! Talk! 00:30, 13 November 2020 (UTC)

Responding to Liz
Hi, Liz. I've responded to your last two messages on my Talk page. Did you see them? Am I supposed to respond to you here? Bruce Kluger (talk) 01:10, 13 November 2020 (UTC)
 * Hi, Bruce,
 * I saw your response and responded on your talk page. Let's keep the discussion there right now. Liz <sup style="font-family: Times New Roman; color: #006400;">Read! Talk! 01:32, 13 November 2020 (UTC)

Page Review
Hi! Thank you for your outstanding contribution to the Wikipedia community. Can you review that article, if you will be able to? It just stalled all my work. I would highly appreciate this. Thanks! MarcusTraianus (talk) 21:32, 13 November 2020 (UTC)
 * Hello, MarcusTraianus,
 * Looks like the draft was accepted and moved into the main article space of Wikipedia. Congratulations! Liz <sup style="font-family: Times New Roman; color: #006400;">Read! Talk! 15:18, 14 November 2020 (UTC)

Bignibber69
Could you do me a favor and take a look at that hidden attempted edit that user:Bignibber69 was making on her talkpage and take whatever action you deem appropriate? CLCStudent (talk) 15:10, 14 November 2020 (UTC)
 * Hi, CLCStudent,
 * They tripped the edit filter because it looks like they were writing something nasty about a real-life or online friend and they used a few bad words. I'm not sure why they reported it as a false positive. I'll keep an eye on them. Liz <sup style="font-family: Times New Roman; color: #006400;">Read! Talk! 15:16, 14 November 2020 (UTC)

Template:Ds/extended-confirmed-editnotice
You deleted the above template but it is still linked from Template:Ds. Since you deleted it under G6 I have no idea how the link should be dealt with. You might consider amending the one page as appropriate. --Izno (talk) 19:41, 14 November 2020 (UTC)


 * Hello, Izno,
 * Are you sure you didn't mean Template:Ds/30-500-editnotice? ProcrastinatingReader tagged Template:Ds/extended-confirmed-editnotice as a uncontroversial deletion and I trust their judgment with templates. Liz <sup style="font-family: Times New Roman; color: #006400;">Read! Talk! 19:48, 14 November 2020 (UTC)
 * Either template. :) 30-500 was a redirect to EC editnotice. --Izno (talk) 19:50, 14 November 2020 (UTC)
 * This one is a result of this TfD (which you closed, and Liz deleted as G6 after I finished the orphaning). In practice iirc & afaik people stopped stopped tagging pages with EC-protected editnotices after it became enforced by the software with WP:ECP. I've removed the wording from Ds. ProcrastinatingReader (talk) 19:59, 14 November 2020 (UTC)
 * Ah, ok. One or both of you, try to remember that a link to the XFD should appear in the log. --Izno (talk) 20:30, 14 November 2020 (UTC)
 * Okay, that makes sense. Thanks for the alert, Izno. Liz <sup style="font-family: Times New Roman; color: #006400;">Read! Talk! 21:46, 14 November 2020 (UTC)

Discussion about First Lady and Second Gentleman-designate titles in infoboxes of Jill Biden and Doug Emhoff
Please join a discussion here regarding whether the terms "First Lady of the United States Designate" and "Second Gentleman of the United States Designate" should be in the infoboxes of Jill Biden and Doug Emhoff, spouses of the president-elect and vice president-elect, respectively. We need to come to a consensus. Thank you for your participation. cookie monster (2020)  755  21:28, 15 November 2020 (UTC)
 * Hello, CookieMonster755,
 * Are there now strong opinions about the designations of spouses of soon-to-be-installed politicians? Regardless of my opinions about the 2020 election, those are unwieldy titles. My typical opinion about these matters is stick with precedence. I'm in the midst of a project right now but will pop over to that page sometime this afternoon. Thanks for letting me know. Liz <sup style="font-family: Times New Roman; color: #006400;">Read! Talk! 21:33, 15 November 2020 (UTC)

Template:NSW Country lines stations/testcases
Thank you for deleting the various templates in during the past week. This is part of converting over 400 templates and template redirects to Template:Adjacent stations in Sydney, Brisbane and Melbourne, Australia which is quite a big job. The conversion of Brisbane is complete with Sydney finished by the end of this week and Melbourne still some work to be done.I submitted another lot for deletion at last Saturday with another 7 lots planned for weekly submission by early January 2021. My question relates to the the template in the heading which does not appear to be used now - I last made some changes in 2018. But I was surprised to see its talk page deleted this morning as G8 as the template itself still exists. Deletion log 02:36 Liz talk contribs deleted page Template talk:NSW Country lines stations/testcases ‎(G8: Redirect to a deleted or nonexistent page) I wonder why? Perhaps the template itself should also be deleted??? Fleet Lists (talk) 03:16, 16 November 2020 (UTC)


 * Hello, Fleet Lists,
 * Looking into the page history, here's what I can tell you:
 * AnomieBot created Template talk:NSW Country lines stations/testcases as a redirect to Template talk:NSW Country lines stations on Oct. 4, 2018. Why a redirect? You'd have to ask the bot operator...the explanation the bot provided was "Redirecting to Template talk:NSW Country lines stations to avoid decentralized discussion".
 * Template talk:NSW Country lines stations was deleted yesterday by Fastily. Don't know how I missed that talk page.
 * I deleted Template:NSW Country lines stations on Friday and it was a redirect to Template:NSW TrainLink stations.
 * I deleted Template:NSW TrainLink stations on Friday as part of Templates for discussion/Log/2020 November 7.


 * Are you asking whether to delete Template:NSW Country lines stations/testcases? When I checked, the only page that linked to it was Template:NSW Country lines stations/testcases/row. You are probably immersed in this enough to know whether either of these pages is necessary so you can choose whether to tag them for deletion.


 * Frankly, what you've taken on sounds daunting to me. Changing these public transit template arrangements sound enormous to me. Liz <sup style="font-family: Times New Roman; color: #006400;">Read! Talk! 03:48, 16 November 2020 (UTC)


 * Thank you Liz for your prompt answer. The action by Anomiebot on Oct 4, 2018 seems to have started the problem and I guess we will never know why. The other actions all make sense and I had already checked those out and were OK. I will investigate the template in question and also the associated "row" template which I suspect can also be removed. If so, I will include them both in one of the future delete submissions. I will probably drive admins crazy with them over the next few weeks. I hope I am not causing any trouble.
 * As far as missing the talk page is concerned, there were a number of talk pages missed as the non admin who closed the submission did not tag the redirect talk pages but instead tagged the talk pages to which they redirected twice. I reported the non deletion of the talk pages concerned in the deletion page holding cell from where I assume Fastily deleted them. see but this did not include Template talk:NSW Country lines stations I dont know why.  Fleet Lists (talk) 05:08, 16 November 2020 (UTC)
 * Yes, the bot action is puzzling. I never saw a bot provide such a specific and unusual message as an edit summary. Any way, I'm sure as soon as you do all of the tagging (which is a chore in itself), some admin will do the deletion. There are always admins patrolling the CSD categories, it's one of the few places on Wikipedia where you can be sure to find an admin or two. Liz <sup style="font-family: Times New Roman; color: #006400;">Read! Talk! 05:49, 16 November 2020 (UTC)
 * Hi Liz. Two points - the template in the heading for which the talk page was deleted earlier this week, was deleted itself earlier today again by Fastily just as I was about to nominate it for deletion in the lot I have just uploaded. And the ones I uploaded last Saturday  again have a number of redirect templates for which the talk pages have not been deleted.Fleet Lists (talk) 03:45, 21 November 2020 (UTC)
 * Looks like I got to some of them. Liz <sup style="font-family: Times New Roman; color: #006400;">Read! Talk! 03:49, 21 November 2020 (UTC)
 * Hi Liz. Not you this week but this time shows four talk pages which have not been deleted. Could you attend to that please.Fleet Lists (talk) 11:38, 28 November 2020 (UTC)

Category deletion
Back in June, you deleted Category:South Australia articles missing geocoordinate data as an empty category. This is just a courtesy notification that I've restored it, since it's a hidden tracking category populated by any articles to which the template has been added and, as such, will occasionally be empty whenever geographic coordinates are added to articles containing that template. If you have any questions or comments, don't hesitate to post on my talk page. Deor (talk) 22:50, 16 November 2020 (UTC)
 * Hello, Deor,
 * Thanks for letting me know, of course I have no objections, empty categories can be restored whenever they are needed. I'm surprised it was a tracking category, I should have placed an tag on it. Liz <sup style="font-family: Times New Roman; color: #006400;">Read! Talk! 23:11, 16 November 2020 (UTC)

Edit-warring user
Hi Liz, I just saw your comments on user Konli17 Talk page, and since this user has captured your attention with the multiple edit wars they are involved in, I thought I would draw your attention to two cases against them that have not attracted admin attention yet here and here. The second one was just archived without decision although it involved a violation of the Syrian Civil War community sanctions (1RR). The lack/delay of admin action has encouraged this user to go on with their disruptive editing, personal attacks and edit warring. Here they have reverted to remove the same information five times since 12 November. This user edits with a very aggressive POV-pushing agenda, and resort to personal attacks (I provided links to six in the noticeboard, and there is more) when their arguments fails. Thank you for your attention, Amr ibn Kulthoumعمرو بن كلثوم (talk) 03:33, 17 November 2020 (UTC)


 * Hello, Amr ibn Kulthoumعمرو بن كلثوم,
 * I'm sorry your case at WP:ANEW got archived without a resolution. I don't close cases on that noticeboard so I'm reluctant to take action on the most recent complaint. I'm not up-to-date on the analysis of evidence there and typical sanctions. The case seems valid so if it gets archived, I would "unarchive" it. I wasn't aware of the Syrian Civil War sanctions and will have to look into those. I have given Konli17 warnings for edit warring so if I see him do this again, I will issue a block. Liz <sup style="font-family: Times New Roman; color: #006400;">Read! Talk! 03:48, 17 November 2020 (UTC)
 * Just found the relevant information at General sanctions/Syrian Civil War and Islamic State of Iraq and the Levant. Liz <sup style="font-family: Times New Roman; color: #006400;">Read! Talk! 04:22, 17 November 2020 (UTC)

I just restored my complaint into the noticeboard. Hopefully somebody will look into it. Thank you very much and stay safe, Amr ibn Kulthoumعمرو بن كلثوم (talk) 04:33, 17 November 2020 (UTC)
 * I have to admit that I wasn't aware of the Syrian sanctions because they do not appear on the General Sanctions or Discretionary Sanctions list. Liz <sup style="font-family: Times New Roman; color: #006400;">Read! Talk! 04:35, 17 November 2020 (UTC)


 * Hi Liz, please see this latest revert by the same user (7th in 4 days) and look at their deceiving edit summary, while the edit is going against the advice of the moderator and against all other editors (including Paradise chronicle) who is on their same side of the story. Kind regards, Amr ibn Kulthoumعمرو بن كلثوم (talk) 18:55, 17 November 2020 (UTC)


 * Sorry for continuing to bother you with this, but yet another problematic mass removal of sourced, relevant content by the same user under a false summary edit (clean up). Amr ibn Kulthoumعمرو بن كلثوم (talk) 21:43, 17 November 2020 (UTC)


 * Hi Liz, there are now 4 cases open against user Konli17 WP:ANEW and none of them has seen admin action. Would you mind looking into those? Thanks, Amr ibn Kulthoumعمرو بن كلثوم (talk) 08:35, 19 November 2020 (UTC)


 * Hello, Amr ibn Kulthoumعمرو بن كلثوم,
 * I'm sorry to miss your recent messages but I found myself involved in other activities and didn't scan up my talk page. I'll leave WP:ANEW to those admins who patrol there but I'll keep an eye on the disputed pages today. I've found the editor mainly editing Turkey- and Kurd-related pages as well as Syrian subjects. Liz <sup style="font-family: Times New Roman; color: #006400;">Read! Talk! 19:43, 19 November 2020 (UTC)

reverted because"
That edit at Nazi Party was reverted because. . . .? Carptrash (talk) 04:50, 17 November 2020 (UTC)
 * Because the standard references is to "Jews" not "Jewish people" which seems to be your own invention. Liz <sup style="font-family: Times New Roman; color: #006400;">Read! Talk! 04:52, 17 November 2020 (UTC)
 * Okay. Carptrash (talk) 05:01, 17 November 2020 (UTC)

Further problem deleting drafts
Hi Liz, Good afternoon from Australia.

Really you should not be deleting drafts with reason g13, unless they have been tagged with a g13 tag. This will avoid you deleting pages that are not eligible such as Draft:Mint Mobile, which was edited about 50 minutes before you deleted it. Anyway I have restored this one so the editor should now be satisfied. Graeme Bartlett (talk) 06:15, 17 November 2020 (UTC)


 * Hello, Graeme Bartlett,
 * I rely on User:SDZeroBot/G13 soon and User:SDZeroBot/G13 eligible which are pages created by an approved bot that determines G13 eligibility. The bot operator is SD0001. I don't see the point of me tagging each stale draft and then immediately deleting it, sending two notices to the page creator. Or are you asking me to wait until a different editor notices a stale draft and tags it before I then delete it instead of just determining the G13 status myself? That's just causing work for two editors instead of one and implying that another editor is better at determining G13 status than SDZeroBot. SDZeroBot has proven to be an invaluable tool for folks at AFC with the reports it issues.
 * Last night, I had a tab open with Draft:Mint Mobile and an editor edited the page 46 minutes before it became eligible for a G13. I should have refreshed the screen to see if there were any last minute edits but I didn't anticipate that, after 6 months of inactivity, an editor would suddenly edit a stale draft less than an hour before it entered G13 status. I delete hundreds of drafts a week and this was a rare mistake. But I'll ensure it doesn't happen again. Liz <sup style="font-family: Times New Roman; color: #006400;">Read! Talk! 21:44, 17 November 2020 (UTC)
 * I'm the editor that made the last-minute edit. I am also an active G13 tagger (which you have admonished me for despite engaging in similar behavior yourself.) Anyway, I'm just popping in here to tell you why a random G13 draft was edited at the last minute. -- Squeeps10 Talk to meMy edits 23:51, 17 November 2020 (UTC)
 * It was a real fluke that it happened with Mint Mobile. I would think it inappropriate for you to tag g13 and then immediately delete, and wasting your time. Instead I am suggesting to wait until a different editor tags it. Even if it is more work, it gets more eyes on the drafts. And I see no shortage of willing taggers. Graeme Bartlett (talk) 21:52, 17 November 2020 (UTC)
 * Replying to Liz: Just FYI, I've been known to look at the "tail end" of nearly-6-month-old drafts and make edits to them. Same with looking at nearly-90-day-old items in the new-page-patrol log. I would be very surprised if other AFC reviewers and NPP patrollers don't do the same, at least occasionally. davidwr/  (talk)/(contribs)  21:58, 17 November 2020 (UTC)
 * Sigh. No, Squeeps10, you know that statement is not true. I admonished you for tagging G13 stale drafts EARLY, before they were eligible. On the day I posted that talk page message, you were tagging old drafts HOURS before they were eligible. I just asked you to check the edit history and not tag them before they were eligible, I have no problem with you tagging them at all, as long as it is not early.
 * As for your proposal, I think it's nuts. Here I go to User:SDZeroBot/G13 eligible at 00:00 UTC and see a list of 29 drafts that are now eligible for deletion. Eligible right now. Are you saying I should wait for a different editor to stumble upon this list and tag each one before I can delete them? What rational reason can there be for eligible drafts to be tagged by one editor, saying they are ready for deletion, before I, an admin, can delete the page? I need Squeebs10's "okay" tagging before I can delete a page?
 * Should this be a rule for all admins, that they need to wait for all speedy deletion eligible pages to be tagged by regular editors before they can delete a page? If this is going to be a new policy, this should go to the Village Pump because I see admins delete pages all day long that are not tagged by other editors. Or are G13 a special case? If so, why?
 * We are really going to be creating new rules for all admins to follow because I make an occasional mistake? Liz <sup style="font-family: Times New Roman; color: #006400;">Read! Talk! 00:59, 18 November 2020 (UTC)
 * Apologies, perhaps my wording was not clear. I did not intend to imply that you admonished me for G13 tagging drafts, I was simply saying that you left a message on my talk page about tagging drafts early while you have also deleted drafts 2+ hours early on rare occasions. -- Squeeps10 Talk to meMy edits 01:11, 18 November 2020 (UTC)
 * As for Graeme's proposal, I do think it's a good idea, and to be honest I was under the impression it was already the custom. Even when such a deletion is clearly mandated by policy such as G13, I don't think it's a good idea for admins to unilaterally delete pages without a CSD, PROD, or AFD tag. It leads to situations like the one that this thread was originally about. I'd support such an idea were it proposed at the village pump.-- Squeeps10 Talk to meMy edits 01:16, 18 November 2020 (UTC)

Talk:Murder of Samuel Paty has an RFC
Talk:Murder of Samuel Paty has an RFC for possible consensus. A discussion is taking place. If you would like to participate in the discussion, you are invited to add your comments on the discussion page. Thank you. Assem Khidhr (talk) 03:34, 18 November 2020 (UTC)

Myles Turner
Hi Liz, urgent page protection needed on Myles Turner. Thanks.-KH-1 (talk) 05:20, 18 November 2020 (UTC)
 * It's been protected. Liz <sup style="font-family: Times New Roman; color: #006400;">Read! Talk! 05:26, 18 November 2020 (UTC)

Books & Bytes – Issue 41
<div style = "color: #936c29; font-size: 4em; font-family: Copperplate, 'Copperplate Gothic Light', serif"> The Wikipedia Library <span style="font-size: 2em; font-family: Copperplate, 'Copperplate Gothic Light', serif">Books & Bytes

Issue 41, September – October 2020 <div style = "margin-top: 1.5em; border: 3px solid #ae8c55; border-radius: .5em; padding: 1em 1.5em; font-size: 1.2em">
 * New partnership: Taxmann
 * WikiCite
 * 1Lib1Ref 2021

Read the full newsletter Sent by MediaWiki message delivery on behalf of The Wikipedia Library team --10:47, 18 November 2020 (UTC)

Revdel request
This revision is page-hijacking spam, please nuke under WP:CRD5/WP:G11. Editor name is "Briindustry" trying to hijack page and make it about a company called "BRI Groups Inc." See editor's talk page. davidwr/ (talk)/(contribs)  18:29, 20 November 2020 (UTC)
 * Thanks, DavidWR. I just gave them a username block as it was the name of an organization. Liz <sup style="font-family: Times New Roman; color: #006400;">Read! Talk! 18:34, 20 November 2020 (UTC)
 * So, is revdel overkill here? I'm asking because I run into things like this from time to time and if it is overkill, I'll stop asking for it in these circumstances.  davidwr/  (talk)/(contribs)  18:52, 20 November 2020 (UTC)

Recoverying deleted draft?
Hi there! My draft was deleted after six months. I manually readded it to Wiki but my draft text is gone. Can you help me get it back? I had written the skeleton outline for https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Draft:Joseph_Raymond_Lucero&action=edit&redlink=1 but I couldn't find the article so I couldn't edit it. If the first draft I wrote is not recoverable, I will not be rewritting it and in that case, this stub can be deleted (although I would like it to be considered for adoption at this is an actor of color who is doing good work and deserve recognition)
 * Hello, KatProducedThat,
 * I have restored the draft at Draft:Joseph_Raymond_Lucero upon your request. Happy editing! Liz <sup style="font-family: Times New Roman; color: #006400;">Read! Talk! 19:19, 23 November 2020 (UTC)

Question about deleted page
You deleted the page Category:Wikipedia sockpuppets of Agsfdet almost a week ago, but why? I created it because the sockpuppet investigation casepage had been created. But Oshwah changed the sockpuppeteer from Agsfdet to Tt789eryu. Can you just explain why you deleted it? – Cupper 52 Talk to me! 20:42, 23 November 2020 (UTC)
 * Hello, Cupper52,
 * I don't see that Category:Wikipedia sockpuppets of Agsfde was ever a category. Liz <sup style="font-family: Times New Roman; color: #006400;">Read! Talk! 20:49, 23 November 2020 (UTC)


 * I see you've edited your query (which you shouldn't do after I responded to it) to Category:Wikipedia sockpuppets of Agsfdet. That category was an uncontroversial deletion on Nov. 17. This often happens with sockpuppet categories when their original sockpuppeteer account is identified. For example, it could initially be thought that User:Example was a sockpuppet of User:Cupper52 but ultimately it's discovered that it's a sockpuppet of User:Liz. In this case, Category:Wikipedia sockpuppets of Cupper52 would be deleted.
 * This category deletion can also be understood by the fact that Category:Wikipedia sockpuppets of Agsfdet was an empty category with no identified sockpuppets. Should that change, the category can be recreated. Liz <sup style="font-family: Times New Roman; color: #006400;">Read! Talk! 12:11, 24 November 2020 (UTC)

Cluebot
At the risk of being given a deserved RTFM response [though I believe I did], have you a moment to tell me what I did wrong when setting up automatic archiving at talk:Milton Keynes? It had accumulated years of detritus and did need a good clear-out, which it cluebot did admirably. Did I actually set two boys running?

I suspect I won't ever do another one so feel free to ignore with a clear conscience. --John Maynard Friedman (talk) 20:44, 23 November 2020 (UTC)
 * Hello, John Maynard Friedman,
 * I'd ask at the Teahouse or ClueBot Commons as the bot operator Cobi hasn't edited since September. I just saw all of the extra talk page archive pages over the past three days and deleted them. I removed the code that was causing the errors as I didn't know how to fix it. But I'm sure an editor patrolling the Teahouse would know. Liz <sup style="font-family: Times New Roman; color: #006400;">Read! Talk! 20:55, 23 November 2020 (UTC)

Can you restore this page
Can you restore Vanessa Peh? Why is it even deleted? Vaxxcat36 (talk) 13:12, 24 November 2020 (UTC)
 * Hello,Vaxxcat36
 * Vanessa Peh was tagged with a PROD which is an uncontroversial deletion. In these situations, an article can be deleted unless an editor objects to it. It also means that the article can be restored upon request which isn't the case with other kinds of deletion on Wikipedia. Since you requested it, I have restored the article. If you look at the edit history, you will see the reasons why it was tagged with a PROD tag.
 * Let me know if you have other questions or you can visit the Teahouse for help with your editing. Liz <sup style="font-family: Times New Roman; color: #006400;">Read! Talk! 13:19, 24 November 2020 (UTC)

You've got mail!
 D ÅRTH B ØTTØ ( T • C ) 20:17, 25 November 2020 (UTC)
 * Replied. Liz <sup style="font-family: Times New Roman; color: #006400;">Read! Talk! 22:51, 25 November 2020 (UTC)

Draft:Chrysochus auratus (Dogbane Beetle) histmerge
Hi Liz, a little before you G13'd that draft, I incorporated most of the good material in it into the existing article (Chrysochus auratus) and requested a histmerge. Could you still do that, if appropriate? Cheers -- Elmidae (talk · contribs) 22:48, 25 November 2020 (UTC)
 * Hello, Elmidae,
 * I've restored the draft upon your request...that's the easy part! However, I request you ask another admin to do the histmerg. I've never done one and it's an irreversible procedure. I'd hate to screw up your article! I think I'll go write some mock drafts and practice histmergs on them so I can help out in the future. I'm sorry not to be able to help with this. Liz <sup style="font-family: Times New Roman; color: #006400;">Read! Talk! 22:56, 25 November 2020 (UTC)
 * Thank you! I assume someone who likes them will pick it up from the log :) -- Elmidae (talk · contribs) 22:58, 25 November 2020 (UTC)

Hey
Hey, thanks for the note, I opened a new section to resolve dispute on article talk page (see here). but the user refused to respond to the previous messages.Eliko007 (talk) 20:29, 26 November 2020 (UTC)
 * Hello, Eliko007,
 * Considering that he was just unblocked, I'm hoping that he becomes more responsive now. Thanks for starting the discussion. Liz <sup style="font-family: Times New Roman; color: #006400;">Read! Talk! 20:32, 26 November 2020 (UTC)

Hello, Liz, The new section in talk page which Eliko007 create is not new, this section returns to its establishment ten days ago and discusses another topic that differs from the current topic. The good man 232 (talk) 20:55, 26 November 2020 (UTC)

Question
Hey, I want to ask about a source, ,World Christian Encyclopedia which is published by Oxford University Press, and the author is professor at Columbia University, , the source passes WP: RELIABILITY.?. Eliko007 (talk) 00:22, 27 November 2020 (UTC)

Barnstar

 * Thank you, Eliko007! Liz <sup style="font-family: Times New Roman; color: #006400;">Read! Talk! 18:59, 28 November 2020 (UTC)

Humble request for advice on how to react to low quality articles
Hey, Liz! Sorry to bother you but I came across a article which had a lota facts but zero citations to back the claims. My consciousness told me that those articles could contain falsified information and could lead regular users to manipulated conclusions. I personally don't think those kind of articles should exist. I used Twinkle for doing a CSD but couldn't decide what reason to choose. I hope I am not doing something wrong. Once I nominated the article for a CSD, you have rejected it stating the following "Removing CSD tag. Doesn't seem to be a made-up school." which I 100% agree with but I don't know what other criteria I can nominate similar articles on. I am a simple man who's trying to make the encyclopedia a bit more accurate. Please do keep in mind that I am not an experienced Wikipedian, I obviously make mistakes and if you find them then please do correct it. I really appreciate your advice. Thank you so much and once again sorry to bother you on these presumed silly questions - Call me Karthik 😉🤞 (talk • contribs) — Preceding undated comment added 18:47, 28 November 2020 (UTC)
 * Hello, Call me Karthik 😉🤞,
 * Don't worry about asking questions, that is how you learn. If you want to be tagging articles, please review Criteria for Speedy Deletion carefully. If a page doesn't fit any of the criteria, then it probably shouldn't be deleted. The criteria are very specific and meant to only apply to pages that clearly fit them. And just because you haven't heard of something, doesn't mean that it doesn't exist.
 * A good place to go if you have questions is the Teahouse, it was very helpful to me when I was starting out. Also, you might be interested in Counter-Vandalism Unit or New pages patrol if you are interested in doing anti-vandalism work. Liz <sup style="font-family: Times New Roman; color: #006400;">Read! Talk! 18:58, 28 November 2020 (UTC)
 * Thank you so much for your valuable time and advice, Liz! I will surely check out TeaHouse. - Call me Karthik 😉🤞 (talk • contribs)

A barnstar for you!

 * Thank you, Scorpions13256, but I DO check each one prior to deletion. Thanks again! Liz <sup style="font-family: Times New Roman; color: #006400;">Read! Talk! 02:58, 29 November 2020 (UTC)

Ping retraction
Sorry Liz for the last ping, as I made a mistake on seeing what was deleted/recreated. Please ignore. Graeme Bartlett (talk) 05:20, 29 November 2020 (UTC)
 * No problem. I'm not very regular at checking my notifications so I was unaware of this. Liz <sup style="font-family: Times New Roman; color: #006400;">Read! Talk! 05:30, 29 November 2020 (UTC)

AfD for deaths due to COVID-19 and related RfC
Hi. Thanks for commenting at the recent AfD for the above list. There is now an ongoing discussion around the best way to split the list, if any, if you wish to comment further.  Lugnuts  Fire Walk with Me 17:35, 29 November 2020 (UTC)
 * Thanks for letting me know, Lugnuts. Liz <sup style="font-family: Times New Roman; color: #006400;">Read! Talk! 18:27, 29 November 2020 (UTC)

The Signpost: 29 November 2020
<div class="hlist" style="margin-top:10px; font-size:90%; padding-left:5px; font-family:Georgia, Palatino, Palatino Linotype, Times, Times New Roman, serif;"> * Read this Signpost in full * Single-page * Unsubscribe * MediaWiki message delivery (talk) 17:46, 29 November 2020 (UTC)

2601:245:C480:F1E0:C86B:8214:95D9:565F
user:2601:245:C480:F1E0:C86B:8214:95D9:565F is abusing her talkpage. CLCStudent (talk) 18:08, 29 November 2020 (UTC)
 * ✅ Liz <sup style="font-family: Times New Roman; color: #006400;">Read! Talk! 18:26, 29 November 2020 (UTC)

213.205.198.190
Can user:213.205.198.190 please be blocked asap. CLCStudent (talk) 18:40, 29 November 2020 (UTC)
 * ✅ Liz <sup style="font-family: Times New Roman; color: #006400;">Read! Talk! 18:43, 29 November 2020 (UTC)

Draft:Henry Oakes Kent
Hello! Could you please restore the deleted talk page? Best, Vermont (talk) 00:26, 30 November 2020 (UTC)
 * ✅. L235 should have made a minor edit to the page after restoration so the draft was not listed for deletion again at User:SDZeroBot/G13 eligible. But this is not uncommon. Sorry for the double deletion. Liz <sup style="font-family: Times New Roman; color: #006400;">Read! Talk! 00:30, 30 November 2020 (UTC)

Moving User Page
Hi! Could you move User:Illusion705/Templates/Navigation1 to User:Illusion705/Template/Navigation1? My account isn't old enough to move pages. Thanks! 00:50, 30 November 2020 (UTC)
 * ✅. Happy editing, Illusion705! Liz <sup style="font-family: Times New Roman; color: #006400;">Read! Talk! 01:04, 30 November 2020 (UTC)
 * Thanks! You too! 01:08, 30 November 2020 (UTC)

Administrators' newsletter – December 2020
News and updates for administrators from the past month (November 2020). Administrator changes
 * Gnome-colors-list-remove.svg Andrwsc • Anetode • GoldenRing • JzG • LinguistAtLarge • Nehrams2020

Interface administrator changes
 * Gnome-colors-list-add.svg Izno

Guideline and policy news
 * There is a request for comment in progress to either remove T3 (duplicated and hardcoded instances) as a speedy deletion criterion or eliminate its seven-day waiting period.

Technical news
 * Voting for proposals in the 2021 Community Wishlist Survey, which determines what software the Wikimedia Foundation's Community Tech team will work on next year, will take place from 8 December through 21 December. In particular, there are sections regarding administrators and anti-harassment.

Arbitration
 * Voting in the 2020 Arbitration Committee Elections is open to eligible editors until Monday 23:59, 7 December 2020 UTC. Please review the candidates and, if you wish to do so, submit your choices on the voting page.

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Archive Sent by MediaWiki message delivery (talk) 02:37, 1 December 2020 (UTC)

Draft:W. J. Watt & Co. undelete
Could you undelete Draft:W. J. Watt & Co., as WP:G13 does not apply? Techie3 (talk) 04:21, 1 December 2020 (UTC)
 * Hello, Techie3,
 * I've restored the draft. G13 did apply, the last edit to the page was May 29, 2020 which is over 6 months ago. However, the draft had been restored but the restoring admin didn't indicate this with an edit to the draft and so it appeared to be eligible for G13 again. This was an oversight. Liz <sup style="font-family: Times New Roman; color: #006400;">Read! Talk! 04:38, 1 December 2020 (UTC)

Dear Liz, please check out this page and see talk. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Articles_for_deletion/Tom_Theo_Klemesrud#Tom_Theo_Klemesrud Tomklem (talk) 07:56, 2 January 2021 (UTC)

92.29.111.12
Can user:92.29.111.12 please be blocked asap. See their filter log and contribs. CLCStudent (talk) 20:36, 1 December 2020 (UTC)
 * ✅ It's strange how they pick these obscure articles to damage. It must be random. Liz <sup style="font-family: Times New Roman; color: #006400;">Read! Talk! 20:38, 1 December 2020 (UTC)

CSD of Template:John Washington
Hello! I see that you removed my speedy-deletion nomination on Template:John Washington. I am letting you know that John M. Washington (Slave and Author) — a page with the exact same content — was deleted under CSD G12. As such, I am adding a CSD template again (under G12 this time) instead of proposing a move to the Draft: namespace. I am just letting you know so that you don't see it as edit-warring! — Twassman &#91;Talk·Contribs&#93; 23:46, 2 December 2020 (UTC)
 * Hello, Twassman,
 * The page was initially tagged for deletion as a test and it didn't look like a test edit to me, it looked like an article draft. Now it's tagged for copyright reasons which is quite a different matter. But thanks for letting me know.
 * When admins remove a CSD tag, it doesn't always mean we think that the article should exist, it just means that it doesn't meet the criteria that the tagger selected. Liz <sup style="font-family: Times New Roman; color: #006400;">Read! Talk! 01:14, 3 December 2020 (UTC)


 * Alright, thank you for the response! I was just making sure so that there would be no conflict. — Twassman &#91;Talk·Contribs&#93; 01:18, 3 December 2020 (UTC)

RE:Speedy
Okay, I thought I had created that myself. My bad. ToThAc (talk) 04:08, 3 December 2020 (UTC)
 * No problem at all, ToThAc. You go back into anyone's talk page edit history, you'll find all of us have received plenty of warning notices. I still receive them. Liz <sup style="font-family: Times New Roman; color: #006400;">Read! Talk! 04:11, 3 December 2020 (UTC)

Ninth Generation Video Game Consoles
Hello! I've seen the english Wikipedia, the new Ninth Generation Video Game Consoles is released in November, 2020. The Xbox Series S and X, and the PlayStation 5 Ninth generation video game consoles. The Category is deleted, but these new Ninth Generation Video Game Consoles is released, The Xbox Series X and the Xbox Series S is released in November 11, 2020, while the PlayStation 5 is released on November 12, 2020, and in Europe November 19, 2020, and also in Hungary released in November 19, 2020. The category is can be re-create, like i said before, these consoles are is released already. I perfectly speak English and Hungarian language, so i understand everyone, that people can speak English language, and Hungarian language. I just saying that, so, i can understand you, like everyone else. Have nice day, and good day! Bye! --TomFZ67 (talk) 16:54, 4 December 2020 (UTC)
 * Hello, TomFZ67,
 * I don't know what you are talking about. Liz <sup style="font-family: Times New Roman; color: #006400;">Read! Talk! 19:44, 5 December 2020 (UTC)


 * Hello, i'm talking about this page: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Category:Ninth_generation_of_video_game_consoles That's a page, that i am talking about it, it was deleted, for one month ago. --TomFZ67 (talk) 20:04, 5 December 2020 (UTC)
 * Hi, TomFZ67,
 * Thanks for the link, that really helps me understand. Unlike other forms of deletion (like AFD, CFD or TFD), if a category is deleted simply for being empty, it can be recreated whenever there is a true need for it. So, should articles on Ninth generation of video game consoles start appearing, I assume the category would exist again. Liz <sup style="font-family: Times New Roman; color: #006400;">Read! Talk! 21:02, 5 December 2020 (UTC)

92.40.168.224
user:92.40.168.224 is abusing her talkpage. CLCStudent (talk) 19:27, 5 December 2020 (UTC)
 * ✅ Talk page deleted, too. Liz <sup style="font-family: Times New Roman; color: #006400;">Read! Talk! 19:31, 5 December 2020 (UTC)
 * Liz, might want to look at this too. davidwr/  (talk)/(contribs)  20:53, 5 December 2020 (UTC)
 * Thank you, davidwr. I didn't think to check the page creation log. Liz <sup style="font-family: Times New Roman; color: #006400;">Read! Talk! 21:07, 5 December 2020 (UTC)

Anti-Turkism template
I have nominated the template with no clear name (either Anti Turkism or Anti Turkish sentiment) for deletion. The template is wrongly formatted and needs a fix or a deletion. Turkism isn't really a good name as Turkism doesn't even exist as a wikipedia page. Pan Turkism would be the name but check the Pan Turkism article first, it is closely associated with racists. Like real ones, even competing with the NAZIs. Anti Turkish sentiment, ok, but the template needs a fix. I tried to fix this, but I can't, I tried.Paradise Chronicle (talk) 19:12, 6 December 2020 (UTC)
 * Hello, Paradise Chronicle,
 * Can you provide a link to the page you are concerned about? Thanks. Liz <sup style="font-family: Times New Roman; color: #006400;">Read! Talk! 22:28, 7 December 2020 (UTC)


 * Of course. Template:Anti-Turkism I nominated it for speedy deletion for a test page but then you removed something which I thought would be the speedy deletion tag. So I came to you. Now the template is used with the double name (Anti Turkism and Anti Turkish Sentiments) in a large number of articles which do not even mention Anti-Turkish sentiments let alone anti-Turkism, and many of the articles are within the scope of the Turkish denial of the Armenian Genocide or the Turkish invasion of Cyprus.So I nominated the template for a normal deletion.Paradise Chronicle (talk) 23:11, 7 December 2020 (UTC)

Deletion of Category:Buildings listed on the Record of Protected Structures of Ireland Comment
Hi there, you deleted Category:Buildings listed on the Record of Protected Structures of Ireland because it was blank. It had been blanked without discussion and I had raised an objection on the talk page. No-one had replied on the talk page. Can you revert the deletion so it can be discussed please? --GeneralBelly (talk) 21:43, 7 December 2020 (UTC)
 * Hello, GeneralBelly,
 * The category was not deleted because it was blank but because it was empty. Empty categories are deleted on Wikipedia if they sit empty for 7 days. Should there be a need for it in the future, feel free to recreate it. A discussion is not necessary unless the category is nominated for deletion at CFD which it was not. If there is a page that you think fits this category, recreate the category. Liz <sup style="font-family: Times New Roman; color: #006400;">Read! Talk! 22:26, 7 December 2020 (UTC)
 * That makes sense, thanks a million, will do. --GeneralBelly (talk) 22:36, 7 December 2020 (UTC)

Deletion of Draft: Inca Pisac
Dear Liz,

I have received your message about the decision to delete the draft of Inca Pisac.

Above the small town of Pisac in Peru is a massive Inca complex consisting of a fortress, residential housing and religious structres which is similar in size to Machu Picchu. The government of Peru has protected it by establishing an archeological park around it. At the time I created the draft there was no dedicated article on it and only a couple of paragraphs about it in the article on the town of Pisac. My draft had 21 pages.

Editor Robert McCleanon rejected it, saying it should be incorporated into the article on the town. I replied to him that this was equivalent to the standalone article on the Alhambra (which is its equivalent in Spain) being merged into the article on the city of Granada or Edinburgh Castle being merged into the article on the city of Edinburgh. I even suggested where he could see images so that he could see how big it is.

He never replied to me, when all I wanted for all the research I had done on this important place to be recorded.

I have since then entertained thoughts of sneaking around his opinion by coping the information to a new article with a title such as "Pisac National Archeological Park or "Inca Complex at Pisac" but I suspected he would most likely block these as well, so I gave up and have put my energies into other articles. His lack of courtesy put my back up and so I haven't done anything.

Since I was blown way from a visit to Pisac I really want to ensure that there is an article on it for people who visit it and want to know more, so there is very little online about it. Is there any way forward?

The point I want to make is that editors need to work with contributors to progress articles instead of refusing into enter into any discussions. I have found over the 1,000 articles I have edited or created to date that some editors can really destroy contributors enthusiasm.

John
 * Hello, John
 * I have restored Draft:Inca Písac. It was only deleted because no one had been working on it for 6 months. Drafts that are deleted for these reasons (being "stale") can be restored upon request. If you are seeking help with your draft, I'd suggest going to WikiProject Articles for creation/Help desk or Wikipedia_talk:WikiProject_Peru (although this WikiProject does not seem to be very active). The Teahouse can also offer assistance. But since you have been around for quite a while, you might already know about these resources. Liz <sup style="font-family: Times New Roman; color: #006400;">Read! Talk! 00:00, 8 December 2020 (UTC)

Article on Morgz
Hi, I've recently begun work on creating a page for the YouTuber Morgz, which you can view at the top of my Sandbox. I noticed that the page is protected from being created, with you being the protecting administrator. The deletion log shows that the article was deleted in early 2019, and I feel that since then, the topic has grown notable enough to merit its own Wikipedia article. In the next few days I hope to have a complete draft written up in my sandbox with sufficient reliable sources on the topic. That being the case, I was wondering what the proper steps would be to get the page created. Thank you, and I await your response. -JJonahJackalope (talk) 01:11, 8 December 2020 (UTC)
 * Hello, JJonahJackalope,
 * That article was not just deleted. It was deleted SIX times. It was deleted through an AfD deletion discussion. Typically, articles that are recreated after an AfD deletion discussion must be substantially different from the version that was deleted. That makes it difficult for you because deleted content is only visible to administrators. So, you must ensure that your content has solid reliable sources.
 * My recommendation is, when you are finished, submit your draft to Articles for Creation for review. If a reviewer approves your draft, I, or any administrator, can lift the protection and the article can be moved from draft space to main space. At this point, after so many article deletions, any version of this article should be reviewed by an experienced editor. The folks at AfC are the experts here and they have a Help page that can address any questions that come up about your review. Liz <sup style="font-family: Times New Roman; color: #006400;">Read! Talk! 01:25, 8 December 2020 (UTC)
 * It would also be helpful for you to review WikiProject YouTube/Notability and you can ask people at WikiProject YouTube for assistance and advice. Liz <sup style="font-family: Times New Roman; color: #006400;">Read! Talk! 01:26, 8 December 2020 (UTC)
 * Thanks for the quick reply, I think I'll work on the draft a great deal more, talk to members of that WikiProject, and pursue the article through AfC. -JJonahJackalope (talk) 01:33, 8 December 2020 (UTC)

December 2020 Guild of Copy Editors Newsletter
MediaWiki message delivery (talk) 03:46, 8 December 2020 (UTC)

Haris Stamboulidis restored page
Hi Liz, the page was restored, but name is incorrect. It should read Haris Stamboulidis not " Stampoulidis" can you fix this for me? Thank you Akarnikos (talk) 23:33, 8 December 2020 (UTC)

Article Haris Stamboulidis ready for publication
Hi Liz, Haris Stamboulidis is already playing professional in Spain and has a wiki page. He has met the notibility requirements. I want to appeal and review this decision. Can you review this? Akarnikos (talk) 23:37, 8 December 2020 (UTC)
 * Hello, Akarnikos,
 * Please submit it to Articles for Creation for review. I am not a part of AfC and do not review drafts. If you have additional questions, the Teahouse is very helpful. Liz <sup style="font-family: Times New Roman; color: #006400;">Read! Talk! 23:39, 8 December 2020 (UTC)

Ok, when the page was restored, it was restored with the wrong surname. It should be "Stamboulidis" is this something you can rectify or do I speak to this group to speak about? Thank you again for your quick response Akarnikos (talk) 23:44, 8 December 2020 (UTC)

It was restored to Haris Stampoulidis which is incorrect Akarnikos (talk) 23:45, 8 December 2020 (UTC)
 * Can you provide me with a link to the page you are talking about? Liz <sup style="font-family: Times New Roman; color: #006400;">Read! Talk! 23:49, 8 December 2020 (UTC)
 * Never mind, I found it and moved the draft. Liz <sup style="font-family: Times New Roman; color: #006400;">Read! Talk! 23:58, 8 December 2020 (UTC)

Can you please clear the G3 Category? It is flooded.
4thfile4thrank (talk) 04:40, 9 December 2020 (UTC)
 * Hello, 4thfile4thrank,
 * I got to some of them but there were only 12 pages, that's not really flooded. There are 33 pages tagged as spam. There are quite a few admins that patrol CSD categories so someone will get to them all. Liz <sup style="font-family: Times New Roman; color: #006400;">Read! Talk! 05:14, 9 December 2020 (UTC)

Thank You for the Welcome - and Help
Hi Liz! I appreciate your welcome! I've been a Wikipedia reader for over a decade, a member for about 4 years, and have started writing more.

FYI, I responded to your note on my talk page, but I'm not sure if I did it right, so I'm reaching out here. Apologies if you get this twice - I'm still learning.

Since you suggested, I would welcome your help. I have been happy to write about topics in my area of expertise, which include logistics, technology, and history. I have been blindsided by a mean-spirited person who has decided to attack me. I am the subject of a page: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Benjamin_Gordon_(businessman). Someone going by the name "Krutapidla2" formed a single-purpose account, for the sole purpose of posting defamatory content on my site. He must have some sort of vendetta, although I have no idea why. Since I am not a Wikipedia editor, and do this in my spare time, I decided to seek help, and posted a request on a site, in order to take down the defamatory content. "Krutapidla2" then reposted the defamatory content, deleted other positive content, and went on a rampage. He also marked the page for deletion, and added a notation that my page may have been edited for undisclosed payments. This is, of course, the height of irony. The only reason a paid editor offered to help me was to take down the defamatory content in the first place!

This person has continued his destructive behavior. I undid his changes. Then he put them back up. Another person undid his changes. Then he put them back up. And he had the temerity to accuse me of being a paid editor (which I clearly am not, as reflected among many things by my poor knowledge of Wikipedia systems)! Pot, meet kettle.

I am not a Wikipedia expert, but isn't this kind of destructive conduct exactly what the Wikipedia code of conduct is intended to prevent? Can you close down this slanderous "Krutapidla2"? Can you unmask him so he is prevented from continuing his harmful conduct? And can you remove the "undisclosed payments" mark and the "considered for deletion" mark? FYI, after this whole Krutapidla2 fiasco, the editor posted details on the talk page, so he provided full disclosure. And more importantly, none of this would have happened if not for the slanderous postings in violation of neutrality.

Thank you. I appreciate it! Bengee123 (talk) 04:43, 9 December 2020 (UTC)
 * Hello, Bengee123,
 * Since you have an article on Wikipedia on yourself, please do not edit. This is a clear cut case of Conflict of Interest. You might want to also look at Wikipedia policy on Biography of Living Person that has influence over content on biographies of living people. Should you ever wish to file a complaint, you'd best go to BLP Noticeboard. As for Krutapidla2, he was the subject of a complaint on Edit Warring Noticeboard and received a 3 day block. We do not do "unmasking" as that is a violation of Outing policy. Liz <sup style="font-family: Times New Roman; color: #006400;">Read! Talk! 04:58, 9 December 2020 (UTC)

Hi Liz, thank you. Yes, that's clear. I'm not sure if you know, but I haven't edited the article at all. All I did was read the Wikipedia rules, note the policies for biographies of which you are a subject (exactly as you noted), and request a rollback of Krutapidla2's defamatory postings (which he continues to repost, and continues to take other harmful actions). Isn't that the correct thing to do? What else is possible? How can you prevent this person, who obviously has some sort of personal vendetta, from continuing to cause me harm? And how can you undo the other negative marks he has put on the article? Thank you in advance for your help! Bengee123 (talk) 05:08, 9 December 2020 (UTC)

Speedy advice
Hey Liz, since you seem to be a speedy deletion whiz, I'd like to run this by you: Kalakar Awards was deleted after an AFD took place at Articles for deletion/Kalakar Awards. I discovered two content forks at Kalakar Award for Best Actress and Kalakar Award for Best Actor both created years before the AFD. 1) Should they be deleted? 2) Under what speedy criteria? I'm leaning toward G8: Pages dependent on a non-existent or deleted page, since as content forks they do sort of rely on us first having an article about the award. The examples listed in the guidelines don't exactly fit, but I'm not sure what other rationale I could/should use. If you have a better suggestion, my ears are wide open. Thank you! Cyphoidbomb (talk) 13:10, 9 December 2020 (UTC)


 * Hello, Cyphoidbomb,
 * Not sure I'm a whiz but let's see what you have here. Although I delete a lot of pages, I'm generally an inclusionist so if I came upon these pages on my own, I'd probably just PROD them and see if anyone comes to work on improving them. There is also an existing Category:Kalakar Awards winners despite the deleted Kalakar Awards article. And there is also Draft:Kalakar Awards that exists.
 * But there could be legitimate grounds for speedy deleting them since the parent article was deleted...the Best Actress article, however, is in better shape than the Kalakar Awards was or the Draft version is. Also, the article creator has since been blocked as a sockpuppeteer but these articles weren't created by a sockpuppet but by the master before he was blocked so G5 doesn't apply. I guess you were thinking of G8 as Subpages with no parent page but these aren't really subpages. You might find it easier to argue for A7 if you consider the Kalakar Awards a nonimportant organized event. It's really a judgment call and comes down to not only what is appropriate but what can you defend should your deletion decision be challenged.
 * But I think I would just PROD them and offer the explanation you gave me when you tag the pages. I hope this helps. Liz <sup style="font-family: Times New Roman; color: #006400;">Read! Talk! 15:00, 9 December 2020 (UTC)
 * Alrighty, PROD it is. Thanks Liz! Cyphoidbomb (talk) 15:18, 9 December 2020 (UTC)

Sorry if this is annoying but I needed to talk to you about something
I'm sorry about that email. I sometimes overreact to things. You can just ignore what I said. Toad62 14:21, 9 December 2020 (UTC)
 * Okay, Toad62. Haven't seen it yet, I only check email once or twice a day. Liz <sup style="font-family: Times New Roman; color: #006400;">Read! Talk! 14:28, 9 December 2020 (UTC)

Speedy deletion nomination of Category:Municipal Boroughs of Nottinghamshire
Yes please delete it. I did raise a speedy request, the capitalization is incorrect. Red Jay (talk) 16:08, 9 December 2020 (UTC)

SelavkaS2020
user:SelavkaS2020 is abusing her talkpage. CLCStudent (talk) 22:29, 9 December 2020 (UTC)
 * ✅. Liz <sup style="font-family: Times New Roman; color: #006400;">Read! Talk! 22:33, 9 December 2020 (UTC)

A kitten for you!
Thanks for contributing the world with Wikipedia. Please if u have time check my answer for talk on my page, trying to contribute to Wikipedia. Best regards,

Marko Crncevic (talk) 11:08, 11 December 2020 (UTC) <br style="clear: both;"/>

Some help
Hi Liz, we could use some help with. Thank you, JNW (talk) 05:44, 12 December 2020 (UTC)
 * Hello, JNW,
 * I'm sorry that I didn't see your message last night. I'm usually pretty good at responding on my talk page. It looks like Tony took care of it. Thanks for drawing our attention to the situation. Liz <sup style="font-family: Times New Roman; color: #006400;">Read! Talk! 20:26, 12 December 2020 (UTC)
 * Of course, Liz. They were ripe for a block back in July, with bilge like this, but seem to have felt like having a final fling late last night. JNW (talk) 21:23, 12 December 2020 (UTC)
 * It's interesting to see accounts that were created years ago come back to Wikipedia and find that standards have changed over the years. And they are oblivious to how their efforts to "depoliticize" articles are actually very political. Liz <sup style="font-family: Times New Roman; color: #006400;">Read! Talk! 21:27, 12 December 2020 (UTC)
 * I never thought of that; my take was that the account's standards have changed, and is merely using the encyclopedia as a place to vent prejudices. From there it's a short leap to rationalize one's objectivity. JNW (talk) 03:27, 13 December 2020 (UTC)
 * Your take is probably more on the mark, JNW. Since November, we have had quite a few older, long dormant accounts be revived and return to try to correct what they judge to be liberal bias on the project. Of course, they are only concerned with about a dozen articles out of the 6+ million articles here. Liz <sup style="font-family: Times New Roman; color: #006400;">Read! Talk! 03:34, 13 December 2020 (UTC)
 * That is interesting, Liz. It suggests to me that they're upset by what the perceive as a terrifying slide toward, oh, I don't know....civil and human rights. Wiki is just a last ditch effort to set things straight, for the record, to 1902. Before they return to the gun shop. JNW (talk) 03:41, 13 December 2020 (UTC)
 * It reminds me of when the Men's Rights advocates come by to delete most of the Feminism articles. Pretty easy to spot. Of course, there are some very smart conservative editors who challenge bias when they see it but they know Wikipedia policy and spend their time debating the slant of particular statements on article talk pages, not cutting articles to shreds with a machete. Liz <sup style="font-family: Times New Roman; color: #006400;">Read! Talk! 03:58, 13 December 2020 (UTC)
 * The machete-wielders are easy enough to stop. It's their pervasiveness, not just on Wiki, that's discouraging. JNW (talk) 01:57, 14 December 2020 (UTC)

Please do not delete my draft
Hello Liz, It took more than 3 months for anyone to respond to my draft of https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Draft:Aggelos_Kiayias and now you're trying to delete it! Please don't. I've asked the reviewer to explain their comments. I simply don't understand how they can dismiss 12 references, including to the FT, patent applications from Airbus and peer-reviewed papers, as primary sources. I tried tto use the form on the page but it did not seem to work. — Preceding unsigned comment added by GreyStar456 (talk • contribs) 01:43, 13 December 2020 (UTC)


 * Hello, GreyStar456,
 * Why do you think I want to delete Draft:Aggelos Kiayias? I deleted your sandbox because it hadn't been edited in six months. But, if you read the notice I posted on your talk page, you'll see that you can get it restored at WP:REFUND or by asking me. We delete abandoned drafts after inactivity for six months but if you want to work on them, they can be restored, easily. Liz <sup style="font-family: Times New Roman; color: #006400;">Read! Talk! 01:51, 13 December 2020 (UTC)

Talkback
Looking forward to your reply! Boudewijn (talk) 16:40, 13 December 2020 (UTC)

Ion pair/ion association
Dear Liz, I am puzzled by your comment on my reversion - I gave what I thought was a clear reason - You say I driected to a blank page - I thought I had directed to the page "ion association" which as I said, talks about ion pairs, while the linked page "ionic bonding" does not talk about ion pairs. I see lots of stuff about ion pairs, on the not blank page "ion association". Any ideas what might be going wrong, and why you see a blank page and I saw a page with info about the phrase I had redirected there?

Skihatboatbike (talk) 10:57, 14 December 2020 (UTC)
 * Hello, Skihatboatbike,
 * If you look at your edit here, you'll see a red link which shows you changed the redirect to a blank page. Liz <sup style="font-family: Times New Roman; color: #006400;">Read! Talk! 19:57, 15 December 2020 (UTC)

Yes, I see it now, neither of us had seen my typo in the word association. I will try again with better spelling. More comupter friendly glasses may be in order. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Skihatboatbike (talk • contribs) 11:17, 16 December 2020 (UTC)

Since you asked...
On my RfA, you asked if I would expect my log to include admin duties. I did start it, as a separate page; User:Hammersoft/adminlog. --Hammersoft (talk) 19:43, 15 December 2020 (UTC)


 * Hello, Hammersoft,
 * First, congratulations! Second, you might also use Template:Adminstats, as you can see on User:Liz/Admin which also appears on my user page. It isn't as detailed as your manually maintained list of course, but many admins have this template on their user page. Also, if you get behind in keeping up your list (which can easily happen if you do a lot of admin work), you can always look at your logs which you can find on your Contributions page. They keep track of all page creations, page deletions, editors blocked etc. Liz <sup style="font-family: Times New Roman; color: #006400;">Read! Talk! 19:55, 15 December 2020 (UTC)
 * Thanks! I've added those to that log page. I'll have to wait for 24 hours to see it populate of course. --Hammersoft (talk) 20:04, 15 December 2020 (UTC)

Re: "warning"
So I've been repeatedly hit with personal attacks for trying to follow process including If a couple of you want to jerk yourselves off  and accused falsely of "wasting time" and of course, and then I get the personal attack calling me "a waste of time". Just fucking lovely. IHateAccounts (talk) 15:02, 16 December 2020 (UTC)
 * I'll look into this. If you get involved in controversial articles, a little bit of push back is expected but I'll see if this veers into personal attack. Liz <sup style="font-family: Times New Roman; color: #006400;">Read! Talk! 17:17, 16 December 2020 (UTC)
 * Looking over the diffs, the most egregious words were posted by Johnsmith2116 and they have since been indefinitely blocked for that personal attack. Please report anything that bad. Liz <sup style="font-family: Times New Roman; color: #006400;">Read! Talk! 18:59, 17 December 2020 (UTC)

Article deletions
Can you please not alert me of any form of prod or deletion again. Thankyou.† Encyclopædius  16:58, 16 December 2020 (UTC)
 * Okay, that's no problem. Liz <sup style="font-family: Times New Roman; color: #006400;">Read! Talk! 17:14, 16 December 2020 (UTC)

Draft:Draft:MasterChef Thailand Celebrity 2
Hi. You recently deleted Draft:Draft:MasterChef Thailand Celebrity 2 due to the bad name. Was it a duplicate of Draft:MasterChef Thailand Celebrity? It seems to have been created by a different user, but I don't know if it was a copy-paste of the older page. --Paul_012 (talk) 08:18, 17 December 2020 (UTC)


 * Hello, Paul_012,
 * Looking at the deleted page, at first, this page just mentioned that this show was a spin-off of MasterChef Thailand. It was a one sentence stub. Then, it was turned into a redirect to Draft:MasterChef Thailand Celebrity. Then it was tagged for deletion. It was originally created by Prussia97. Liz <sup style="font-family: Times New Roman; color: #006400;">Read! Talk! 18:44, 17 December 2020 (UTC)


 * Okay, thanks for the info. --Paul_012 (talk) 18:53, 17 December 2020 (UTC)

G13 Deletions
Hey, do you unilaterally delete articles that are G13 worthy or do you wait till an editor tags them before you delete them or do admins have leeway to delete articles that are G13 worthy without editors tagging them first? Because it seems as though some admins, e.g  waits till it’s G13 tagged before they delete the article but it seems you just unilaterally delete them or am I missing something or could you be so kind as to explain your modus operandi? Celestina007 (talk) 20:28, 17 December 2020 (UTC)


 * Hello, Celestina007,
 * I would wait until the drafts are tagged but there are hundreds of stale articles each day and the editors who tag them don't seem to tag very many. If you want to evaluate and tag 200+ stale drafts each day, I'll wait for them all to be tagged. But honestly, most editors patrolling G13 drafts end up tagging 10 or 20 drafts and then stop instead of doing the entire lot. So, go for it, I'll wait and you can look over 200+ drafts and I'll wait for you to tag them all.
 * I'm up-to-date right now but you should check throughout the day and evening for expiring drafts. There are also several locations where G13's are listed so you should check the Category:AfC G13 eligible soon submissions as well as SDZeroBot's G13 pages like User:SDZeroBot/G13 soon for last Thursday and User:SDZeroBot/G13 eligible. And do this every day, including weekends. Because there are 200+ drafts expiring every single day that need to be taken care of. Good luck with the tagging! Liz <sup style="font-family: Times New Roman; color: #006400;">Read! Talk! 20:41, 17 December 2020 (UTC)
 * There's no rule requiring an editor to have placed a speedy tag before a page can be speedy deleted. Personally, I prefer having another editor review and tag G13-eligible drafts before conducting my own review.  If multiple editors have had an opportunity to review a given draft, then it's less likely we'll be deleting anything of value.  That's just a theory though, YMMV.  -  F ASTILY   00:40, 18 December 2020 (UTC)
 * Celestina007, it's been six hours now and there are 58 drafts that are eligible for G13 status. Not only have you (or any other editor) not reviewed and tagged them but you haven't edited since you posted this on my talk page. This is why I don't wait for stale drafts to be tagged...we'd be waiting all day and you all would have 200+ drafts to go through whenever you decided to take on this task from all of the other editing tasks you want to spend time on. I'm going back to reviewing them. And I'd be happy if, when time allows, you help review and tag them to. Liz <sup style="font-family: Times New Roman; color: #006400;">Read! Talk! 02:59, 18 December 2020 (UTC)
 * Okay, as long as there’s no policy mandating you to wait until a page is G13 tagged before you delete it then that’s okay. Celestina007 (talk) 10:11, 18 December 2020 (UTC)

Scripts++ Newsletter – Issue 19
<div style="border-style:solid; border-color:#606060; background-color:#f8f8f8; border-width:2px; text-align:left; padding:7px; border-radius:1em; box-shadow: 0.1em 0.1em 0.5em rgba(0,0,0,0.75);" class="plainlinks"> News and updates associated with user scripts from the past month (December 2020).

Hello everyone and welcome to the 19th issue of the Wikipedia Scripts++ Newsletter:

Scripts Submit your new/improved script here
 * Cscr-featured.svg Enterprisey's script-installer, a gadget that makes it easier to install scripts, is this month's featured script


 * Gnome-colors-list-add.svg Enterprisey's copy-section-link adds popups to section headers which has an appropriate wikilink and external link to the section.
 * DannyS712's FindBlacklistEntry can be used to figure out which line(s) in either the local or global spamblacklist prevent a particular url from being added.
 * Nardog's CodeEditorAssist allows customizing the code editor, including changing the color theme and enabling live autocompletion.
 * Cobaltcigs's IllWill allows searches wikidata.org for foreign-language sitelinks, to populate ill and replace plain red links.


 * Gnome-colors-view-refresh.svg Twinkle has made a number of improvements, most notably full support for expiring watchlist items.
 * Evad37's Signpost Publishing Script is now at version 2.4.2, with changes including a fix for calculating the size of pages with files.
 * Evad37's MoveToDraft is now at version 2.5.1, with changes including:
 * checks for move conflicts and better options if move fails
 * the addition of Drafts moved from mainspace after moves
 * updating the default move log and notification texts to be more in line with WP:DRAFTIFY
 * Enterprisey's cv-revdel now handles failures more cleanly, including reporting failures caused by the spam blacklist.
 * Bradv's Notepad.js script has been updated with new styles and a new launch button.
 * A beta version of XFDcloser is available for testing, and brings a new user interface for dialogs and some preferences for customization.



Open tasks
 * Voting in the m:Community Wishlist Survey 2021 is ongoing until December 21, 2020. There are 15 proposals in the "bots and gadgets" category that may be of interest.

Pending requests
 * A script to help list discussions at WP:ANRFC (request)
 * A script to allow undoing edits despite conflicting intermediary edits (request)
 * ...and many more, all available at User scripts/Requests

Miscellaneous
 * The Watchlist Expiry feature worked on by the Community Tech team has been enabled on Wikipedia. For scripts that include watching or unwatching pages, developers may want to update their code to take advantage of the new functionality. See the documentation on mediawiki.org.
 * As noted in the prior issue, Enterprisey's links-in-logs script has now been implemented as part of MediaWiki core. By my count, this is his third script that was replaced by implementing the code in MediaWiki core or an extension, along with link-section-edits and abusefilter-hide-search. Additionally, his reply-link script is being converted in part to mw:Extension:DiscussionTools. Are there any other scripts that might be worth integrating directly in MediaWiki? Thoughts would be welcome at Wikipedia talk:Scripts++.

As always, if anyone else would like to contribute, help is appreciated. Stay safe, and happy holidays! --DannyS712 (talk) 00:19, 18 December 2020 (UTC)

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Discuss this issue

RE: A spasso nel tempo
Thank you very much for your gentle reply! That was the kind of explanation I was asking for. Have a nice day--Alienautic (talk) 18:47, 18 December 2020 (UTC)

Mentioned you at Wikipedia talk:Wikipedia Signpost/Newsroom
Hi, I certainly did! If you can do it, please, please do. always turns me down, but I'll send him an email. The Signpost - and Wikipedia in general - could really use this story. Smallbones( smalltalk ) 19:51, 18 December 2020 (UTC)

Speedy deletion of my talk
Dear Liz, I have seen that you have prompted my talk Bhupender Dhawan for speedy deletion. I actually want to understand more about the issue you saw on it. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:Khanna_Sudershan. I also created a draft with minimal data, https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Draft:Bhupender_Dhawan_(Dronacharya). Please let me know if this suffice to the policies of wikipedia. Thanks in advance. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Khanna Sudershan (talk • contribs) 15:23, 19 December 2020 (UTC)

A "few" more U2 pages
Hi, I saw that you deleted my U2 nominations. I have a few more of those pages here, they don't have an associated user either. I think at least the pages with the extremely offensive titles should be deleted (certainly more than half). By the way, I made this list with this. And can accounts here really be deleted like that, because many of these users obviously used to exist, do you know that? (Oh, and, I don't really want to tag all of them for deletion by myself, because ... well, 1500 more or less useless edits I don't need now either.) --TheImaCow (talk) 20:59, 19 December 2020 (UTC)
 * Hello, TheImaCow,
 * I was wondering how on Earth you found these old accounts. They are puzzling to me because they are clearly not user accounts but editors and admins posted on their talk page as if they were existing accounts. And they aren't just accounts with bad names that have 0 edits, they are not active nor inactive accounts. They are just user talk pages with no associated account. Liz <sup style="font-family: Times New Roman; color: #006400;">Read! Talk! 21:09, 19 December 2020 (UTC)
 * I'm going to confer with another admin about what to do with all of these. Liz <sup style="font-family: Times New Roman; color: #006400;">Read! Talk! 21:53, 19 December 2020 (UTC)
 * Probably needs a manual review. Some of these were created by mistake and/or are vandalism, but redirects resulting from account renames should be kept imo.  -  F ASTILY   05:34, 20 December 2020 (UTC)
 * Yes, Fastily, there was a good discussion about these pages today at User talk:ST47. It's kind of a puzzle figuring out why there are so many, it turns out it's a lot of different factors, global blocks, old software from a decade ago, oversight actions & misplaced drafts on to User pages, to name a few. Liz <sup style="font-family: Times New Roman; color: #006400;">Read! Talk! 05:38, 20 December 2020 (UTC)

Article Edit
Hello! I noticed the removal of a name on the list Han-Bin! I have since found the article for the individual and added it to the page, so hopefully it has been fixed and can remain! Let me know if any more info is needed, thank you! Jayb.rd98 (talk) 03:12, 21 December 2020 (UTC)
 * Hello, Jayb.rd98,
 * Can you provide a link to the article? Liz <sup style="font-family: Times New Roman; color: #006400;">Read! Talk! 03:13, 21 December 2020 (UTC)


 * Hey, user:Liz
 * The article in question is Han-bin! The last name added (of a former contestent and current idol trainee) did not have an article to his name before, but I located it and added it to his section of the name page, as he is a notable figure! Let me know if you need anything more! — Preceding unsigned comment added by Jayb.rd98 (talk • contribs) 03:18, 21 December 2020 (UTC)
 * Liz, as I just said on User talk:Jayb.rd98, Hanbin Ngô (Ngô Ngọc Hưng) is a brand new article, newly translated from Vietnamese (which I do not speak), and I'm not convinced the person meets WP:N or any related criteria. I've asked for assistance on WT:WikiProject Vietnam.   He does have an article, and it's not at WP:AFD, at least not yet.  davidwr/  (talk)/(contribs) 🎄  03:24, 21 December 2020 (UTC)
 * (edit conflict) Jayb.rd98
 * First, always sign your talk page posts. Second, I was looking for Hanbin Ngô as the article that refers to the person you wanted to add to the list. Finally, you were a participant in an edit war. You could have been blocked for this as you went WAY beyond 3 reverts. Also, the editors who were reverting your edits were not doing vandalism although they were edit warring, too. Vandalism refers to malicious editing, intended to inflict damage on the project. This was a content dispute, a disagreement. These happen all of the time. What you should have done was stop edit warring and get other editors involved to help resolve the dispute or move to dispute resolution.
 * Thanks for finding the article so that the name could be added to the page. I think you were able to make your point. Liz <sup style="font-family: Times New Roman; color: #006400;">Read! Talk! 03:29, 21 December 2020 (UTC)
 * Thanks for the explanation, davidwr. Liz <sup style="font-family: Times New Roman; color: #006400;">Read! Talk! 03:30, 21 December 2020 (UTC)
 * User:Liz
 * Apologies for not signing, I’m still getting the hang of wikipedia. I was told by my advisor for my class project that removal of encylopedia infromation qualified as vandalism- and the accounts that had edit warred were subsequently banned as sockpuppets of another account (Who repeatedly ignored my requests on their talk page and the article talk page to reach a consensus). I’ll avoid such actions in the future, I appreiate the warning and leniancy. Under advice of user:davidwr Ill begin bulking up the new article for Hanbin.
 * I worry for the page, however. Fandom politics are unfortunately involved, and the fans of another fandom (who also has an artist named hanbin) have been discussing off-site about intentionally removing Hanbin whenever possible, as theyre upset that there are now two idols in South Korea named Hanbin. I’m not sure what the correct order of operations is in this case, and would greatly appreciate any advice you may have for me.
 * Jayb.rd98 (talk) 03:42, 21 December 2020 (UTC)

Reply from Tom Klemesrud concerning Abuse by Administrator Muboshgu
@Liz @Muboshgu: Tom Klemesrud responds: Thank you Liz, I do apologize for calling User talk:Muboshgu#Brad Raffensperger a fool. I have learned he is much more imbedded in the Byzantine power structure of Wikipedia, to be called that. However, after researching "Muboshgu" I will say -- with his self-proclaimed 211,000 contributions. (Personal attack removed) Take for example of blocking Iowa US Senate Candidate Theresa Greenfield by locking in a redirect so a page could not be created based on non-notoriety; then, creating a page for another Iowan from Senator Chuck Grassley's small town, Kim Olson, a failed 2018 candidate for Texas Secretary of Agriculture. I note this reliable source, if not elite, Wired Article-- https://www.wired.com/story/the-senate-race-that-could-be-pivotal-for-america-and-wikipedia/ that concentrates on the abuses of Muboshgu to Mr. Wales creation. There should be sanctions. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Tomklem (talk • contribs) 10:31, 21 December 2020 (UTC)
 * This is identical to a comment on Tom's page. Look there. -- Valjean (talk) 04:38, 22 December 2020 (UTC)
 * Tomklem, this is a personal attack that can warrant a block. You shouldn't be making accusations without evidence of your claim. Liz <sup style="font-family: Times New Roman; color: #006400;">Read! Talk! 04:39, 22 December 2020 (UTC)

Dispute resolution?
Sorry to bother you again, but the page has continued to be edited, and the editor (who have been sockpuppets or a brand new account) have repeatedly ignored my attempts to reach out to reach a consensus. What should I do, when they clearly are uninterested in going through the process wikipedia has? I don’t want to give up and just allow info to be removed from the page because of a fanwar on twitter, but I don’t know what I could possibly do about it. I’m asking you because you had mentioned dispute resolution in our previous convo. Thank you very much. Jayb.rd98 (talk) 19:24, 22 December 2020 (UTC)
 * Hello, Jayb.rd98
 * Sorry for delay in responding to you. Davidwr is a very experienced editor and I think you should consider his suggestion that Hanbin Ngô be listed at Hanbin rather than Han-bin. Accuracy is important but 7 different editors have contested your addition of this name to the Han-bin list. We can't do a full protection on an article indefinitely and so it is likely that any time you add the name, an editor could come by later and remove it. We can't prevent this from happening and you don't want to get involved in another edit war. If this is less likely to happen at the Hanbin list, I'd include the name there instead. I've added a link to Hanbin on the Han-bin page. Liz <sup style="font-family: Times New Roman; color: #006400;"Read! Talk! 22:28, 22 December 2020 (UTC)
 * user:liz
 * The delay is no issue! Upon discussion with them, their edit was made due to a confusion in the way Korean names are romanized (Which I brought up in the correct area!) Since there is no difference between Hanbin, Han-Bin, Hanbeen, and Han-been. It all depends on what romanization system is used, but the names in the source language are all completely identical (한빈), and its mentioned in the page han-bin that Hanbin is an alternative romanization!
 * If you look, 3 of the people involved in editing the page were sockpuppets of a 4th editor on that page (And the sockpuppets have since been banned).
 * In regards to the Hanbin page, Davidwr is helping me direct the proper question line to the proper area for what would be included on that page, as he isnt sure if names should be included.
 * Thank you for the constant help! Jayb.rd98 (talk) 23:01, 22 December 2020 (UTC)

Yo Ho Ho
<div style="border-style:solid; border-color:blue; background-color:AliceBlue; border-width:1px; text-align:left; padding:8px;" class="plainlinks">

 Ϣere Spiel  Chequers  is wishing a foaming mug of Seasons Greetings! Whether you celebrate your hemisphere's Solstice or Christmas, Diwali, Hogmanay, Hanukkah, Lenaia, Festivus or even the Saturnalia, this is a special time of year for almost everyone!

Spread the holiday cheer by adding to your friends' talk pages.


 * Thank you, WereSpielChequers. Happy holidays to you! Liz <sup style="font-family: Times New Roman; color: #006400;">Read! Talk! 22:16, 22 December 2020 (UTC)

Moving Category Talk pages
Hi, just a quick note that I'm a very experienced (now occasional) editor. I'm the guy who made Categories for Discussion and Templates for Discussion, developed the backend code, and the original parser function templates. And wrote a great deal of the instructions for closing at the time.

No, I didn't hand move a Category page. I merged or moved and redirected those specific Category Talk pages as part of the close. This was a complicated close, and needed to be done by hand. Then, somebody else ran a bot, and accidentally wiped out my work.

So thanks for helping fix part of the bot wipe. Sadly, it will take far more effort to restore than it took to do the work in the first place. William Allen Simpson (talk) 23:08, 22 December 2020 (UTC)
 * Hello, William Allen Simpson,
 * Well, when I looked at the category talk pages, there were edits that indicated the pages had been moved. But my apologies if I misinterpreted the information. Liz <sup style="font-family: Times New Roman; color: #006400;">Read! Talk! 23:11, 22 December 2020 (UTC)

William Allen Simpson (talk) 23:14, 22 December 2020 (UTC)
 * That's probably another administrator undoing some of his "fat-finger-syndrome" mistakes. Thanks for the help.

Merry Christmas

 * Thanks, Davey2010! Happy holidays to you and yours. Liz <sup style="font-family: Times New Roman; color: #006400;">Read! Talk! 20:15, 23 December 2020 (UTC)

Yo Ho Ho
<div style="border-style:solid; border-color:blue; background-color:AliceBlue; border-width:1px; text-align:left; padding:8px;" class="plainlinks">

Donner60 (talk) is wishing a foaming mug of Seasons Greetings! Whether you celebrate your hemisphere's Solstice or Christmas, Diwali, Hogmanay, Hanukkah, Lenaia, Festivus or even the Saturnalia, this is a special time of year for almost everyone!

Spread the holiday cheer by adding to your friends' talk pages.


 * Happy Festivus, Donner60! Enjoy the holiday season! Liz <sup style="font-family: Times New Roman; color: #006400;">Read! Talk! 15:07, 24 December 2020 (UTC)

Merry Christmas

 * Happy holidays to you and yours, onel5969!

happy holidays
Hello User:Liz Can you review it, please https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User:Kareem_fahim/sandbox. Thanks a lot Stay Safe --Kareem fahim (talk) 09:36, 25 December 2020 (UTC)
 * Hello, Kareem fahim,
 * I don't review drafts but I submitted yours for review with Articles for Creation. Hopefully, this will get the ball rolling. Liz <sup style="font-family: Times New Roman; color: #006400;">Read! Talk! 00:31, 27 December 2020 (UTC)

Merry Christmas!
<div style="border-style:solid; border-color:#01902a; background-color:darkred; border-width:3px; text-align:center; padding:3px; height:262px; width:800px;" class="plainlinks"> Merry Christmas! Joyeux Noël! ~ Buon Natale! ~ Vrolijk Kerstfeest! ~ Frohe Weihnachten! ¡Feliz Navidad! ~ Feliz Natal! ~ Καλά Χριστούγεννα! ~ Hyvää Joulua! God Jul! ~ Glædelig Jul! ~ Linksmų Kalėdų! ~ Priecīgus Ziemassvētkus! Häid Jõule! ~ Wesołych Świąt! ~ Boldog Karácsonyt! ~ Veselé Vánoce! Veselé Vianoce! ~ Crăciun Fericit! ~ Sretan Božić! ~ С Рождеством! শুভ বড়দিন! ~ 圣诞节快乐！~ メリークリスマス！~ 메리 크리스마스! สุขสันต์วันคริสต์มาส! ~ Selamat Hari Natal! ~ Giáng sinh an lành! Hello, Liz! Thank you for your work to maintain and improve Wikipedia! Wishing you a Merry Christmas and a Happy New Year! CAPTAIN RAJU (T) 04:55, 26 December 2020 (UTC)
 * Spread the WikiLove and leave other users this message by adding {{subst:Multi-language Season's Greetings}}
 * Thank you, CAPTAIN RAJU. I hope you have a good holiday and New Year! Liz <sup style="font-family: Times New Roman; color: #006400;">Read! Talk! 00:25, 27 December 2020 (UTC)

Article deletions
Hello Liz. Please tell me why did you delete Tohid Hajibabaei's page? (Tohid Hajibabaei). It was a biography of a famous person and had credible sources. It's very important and I want that article restored,plz. Msh1991 (talk) 07:17, 27 December 2020 (UTC)
 * Can you give me a link to the page? And also, please sign your messages with four tildes ( ~ ). Liz <sup style="font-family: Times New Roman; color: #006400;">Read! Talk! 00:07, 27 December 2020 (UTC)


 * here you are https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tohid_Hajibabaei  Msh1991 (talk) 07:17, 27 December 2020 (UTC)
 * Hello, Msh1991,
 * MrsSnoozyTurtle changed your article into a redirect to Aylan Azerbaijani Dance Group. The page Tohid Hajibabaei was just a link to another page which has been moved to Draft:Aylan Azerbaijani Dance Group. When the article was moved to a draft, the redirect became broken and I deleted the broken redirect. Liz <sup style="font-family: Times New Roman; color: #006400;">Read! Talk! 21:39, 27 December 2020 (UTC)

Draft page Cinque Vette Park
Hi Liz, I'm a member of the university group working on the project of Draft:Cinque Vette Park, Lombardy. We submitted our page for review on the 29th of November, and it hasn't been accepted yet. We would like to ask you if you may give a look at our draft page and give us your feedback, so that we can improve our project page and hope it gets accepted by the 31st of December, the deadline. Thank you in advance. Dervareser (talk) 18:00, 26 December 2020 (UTC)
 * Hello, Dervareser,
 * I don't review drafts but I posted a note about this on WT:AFC, the talk page for the AfC project, and hopefully someone can review it in the next few days. Liz <sup style="font-family: Times New Roman; color: #006400;">Read! Talk! 00:19, 27 December 2020 (UTC)

Hi, Liz, thank you for your advice! Fortunately it got accepted one hour after you answered me! Thank you again! Dervareser (talk) 09:40, 27 December 2020 (UTC)
 * I'm glad I could help, Dervareser. Liz <sup style="font-family: Times New Roman; color: #006400;">Read! Talk! 21:34, 27 December 2020 (UTC)

Issue of Gugark Pogrom
Hi Liz, I am writing you regarding Gugark Pogrom. The article is nonsense and is reduntand. While Azeri have committed countless of pogroms against Armenians, we just list a few major ones and disregard the rest, while Azeri propagandist wikipedians loves to post each atrocity towards them as a totally separate Azeri pogroms or genocide when it has been all under one unfortunate event. I am not denying these may have happened, but Azeri wikipedians are clearly exaggerating their claims and blowing out of proportions when they are the victims. I have seen many acts of vandalism toward Armenian articles and categories when it is the other way around. Don't let Wikipedia become a propaganda tool for them or anyone. It should remain a unbiased, neutral platform for the truth regardless of what we like and don't like. I respectfully request you to undo your edit regarding the article.Hovhannesk (talk) 16:50, 27 December 2020 (UTC)
 * Hello, Hovhannesk,
 * I don't remember editing this article but I'll check my contributions. If you think this article is blatant misrepresentation or is inappropriate for Wikipedia, please nominate it for deletion at AfD. I've seen other politically divisive articles be reviewed and subsequently deleted should that be the consensus. Liz <sup style="font-family: Times New Roman; color: #006400;">Read! Talk! 01:55, 30 December 2020 (UTC)

You didn't edit it yourself, but you rejected the deletion request. I know this article is blatant and used mainly for propaganda purposes and this is article is clearly political as it is created by Azeri wikipedians which are spamming and rewriting history to their way (especially in the Azeri language Wikipedia, but that's another topic for another day). I don't know how to nominate it for deletion at AfD as I just know how to do basic editing and creating pages. Also, on a separate topic, could you please assist in a dilemma regarding Armenian categories in the diaspora? For example, there are two categories of Armenians in the respective such as Category:Syrian Armenians and Syrian people of Armenian descent, Category:Lebanese Armenians and Category:Lebanese people of Armenian descent, Category:Azerbaijani Armenians and Category:Azerbaijani people of Armenian descent and so on of the respective countries which were over 50 of them which were "merged" together as one category when they were clearly stated as two things and two different categories. And many of them have been deliberately removed instead of "merged" when I tried to undo them. I contacted the user JJMC89 (talk) who did this requesting an explaination for his reason and action and that he undo all of the "merging" and deletion of some of the categories. However, he never replied nor gave an appropriate response to my request and simply revert my undo action on him. I strongly believe him committing vandalism and spam in the sense that he is deliberately misleading the categories with his action of "merging" when they are clearly stated and explained as two separate categories for two different things. I am not good with these things and just try to contribute to Wikipedia in my free time when I can with basic editing, adding or proofreading, and creating pages. I would appreciate if you can look into the matter or recommend someone to investigate him and his history regarding the categories. Thanks. Hovhannesk (talk) 12:38, 04 January 2021 (UTC)

The Signpost: 28 December 2020
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Jared Kushner page
Hey, Liz, I did a page on Alleged Corruption of Jared Kushner and I've seen you've gone in favor of removing it instead of keeping it, or instead move on to Draft page. I'd appreciate it if you could let me know how to make the article more neutral so that my work on it doesn't go wasted. I've gone through the trouble of putting very verifiable sources on all of the statements made in it and I wouldn't want it to be 100% wasted. Thank you very much for any help you could give me.


 * If I thought the page should be deleted, I would've deleted it. I delete a lot of pages that are marked as attack pages. That's why I suggested you move the page into Draft space, which is our work space, or move it to a more neutral title. The text itself needs a little shaping up but we just don't have articles that are titled, "The Corruption (or Alleged Corruption) of Person X"". That's stating that the person is corrupt in Wikipedia's voice which is not the role of Wikipedia. Liz <sup style="font-family: Times New Roman; color: #006400;">Read! Talk! 01:52, 30 December 2020 (UTC)

Ok, I'm gonna do some work on it and change the title. I'm gonna remove some stuff about it and leave it more up to the other editors to decide (although all of my sources are backed and I am being as neutral as possible!) To be quite honest some of it might seem on the attack-y side of it but there is simply unanimous consent out there that the son-in-law being in the inside of the White House with the president's ear on his side is not something that should go unreported. Even by any encyclopedia standards out there, the consensus is just so strong that there is blatant mishandling by the person in question that talking about it should honestly not even be an issue. Especially when there is a widespread knowledge just about everyone that said person has mishandlings and about every news station out there has alread reported on it. The first person who flagged me as supposedly an "attack" has been regulating Trump's articles for a good while, so for me it's not even a surprise that it is tried to be taken down to be quite honest. The thing is that I'm 100% against any personal attacks out there and especially on an encyclopedia, but there is just so much unanimous knowledge on Kushner's controversial role and he's just such a public figure there should not even be question about creating articles on him. It would be like saying "Nero's evil shouldn't be criticized cause it's controversial to him!". I mean, he's a public official for Lord's sake and everyone knows how corrupt he is. It's like stating a widely-known fact by now and I can (and did) refer a dozen different verifiable sources that say that. Anyway, Thank you very much for informing on everything. I'll change it as much as possible and leave it to the editors to decide. Just wanted to inform you that there is probably going to be a lot of people claiming it's "an attack" even though I'm just stating the facts and bringing up factual sources from reputable news outlets. Thanks. Have a great night and a great New Year's Eve.
 * Well, I chose not to delete the page because I think it has some well-sourced content and I think there is an article in there. You just can't write in Wikipedia's voice that anyone is corrupt or is criminal. That is considered an attack. The sources might indicate criminality but you need to change the title before this page gets immediately deleted. It might be an appropriate title if you were writing a book but not for a Wikipedia article.
 * And please sign all of your talk page post with four tildes ( ~ ) so that your signature shows up. Liz <sup style="font-family: Times New Roman; color: #006400;">Read! Talk! 02:19, 30 December 2020 (UTC)
 * Public Perception of Jared Kushner might not be the most accurate title for the article you wrote but it is a big improvement. Liz <sup style="font-family: Times New Roman; color: #006400;">Read! Talk! 02:23, 30 December 2020 (UTC)

OK, I changed the title to Public Perception of Jared Kushner. Hopefully it stays up and there can be civil discussion on the Talk page on it and editors will pick it up from here and add as it's appropriate. Really thanks for your help and informing me on the matter; it really does help. Glad we got this figured out in a civil manner - just didn't want my time on writing to go to waste. I'm gonna remove the things that seem more "contentious" and leave it to the editors. Thanks. Marcosoldfox (talk) 02:36, 30 December 2020 (UTC)

As expected, they're trying to remove it; and this user KidAd is unashamedly trying to delete it without giving any reason to do so, and he is clearly attempting to one-sidedly remove anything that doesn't go along with his narrative. All the president's men, I'd guess... Marcosoldfox (talk) 03:29, 30 December 2020 (UTC)
 * Hello, Marcosoldfox,
 * An AfD is not unexpected. It's still a controversial article although it is no longer an attack page. Now, it'll be discussed over the next week where you can make an argument which is much better than immediate deletion. Liz <sup style="font-family: Times New Roman; color: #006400;">Read! Talk! 03:51, 30 December 2020 (UTC)

Thanks!
Thanks for tagging Category:Superman arcade games for speedy deletion. I meant for it to be a redirect to Category:Superman arcade and video games, but I got sidetracked and it didn't get finished. Thanks again for the heads up! Americanfreedom (talk) 17:57, 30 December 2020 (UTC)
 * Hello, Americanfreedom,
 * Well, I'm glad it worked out. Liz <sup style="font-family: Times New Roman; color: #006400;">Read! Talk! 19:08, 30 December 2020 (UTC)

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Happy New Year!
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Empire AS  Talk ! — is wishing you a Happy New Year! It's the last day of 2024 and tomorrow will be . Hope the coming year brings pleasures for you. Have a prosperous, enjoyable and a productive . This greeting (and season) promotes WikiLove and hopefully this note has made your day a little better. Spread the WikiLove by wishing another user a Happy New Year, whether it be someone you have had disagreements with in the past, a good friend, or just some random person. Happy New Year!

Spread the New Year cheer by adding {{subst:New Year 2}} to their talk page with a friendly message.

Empire AS  Talk ! 13:13, 31 December 2020 (UTC)


 * Thank you, Empire AS! I wish you a healthy & prosperous 2021! Liz <sup style="font-family: Times New Roman; color: #006400;">Read! Talk! 01:21, 1 January 2021 (UTC)


 * Thanks :) Empire AS   Talk !

Happy New Year!

 * Spread the WikiLove; use {{subst:Happy New Year elves}} to send this message


 * Thank you, UnitedStatesian! I wish you a healthy & prosperous 2021! Liz <sup style="font-family: Times New Roman; color: #006400;">Read! Talk! 01:22, 1 January 2021 (UTC)

Thank you for the merging!

 * Thank you, Missvain! I wish you a healthy & prosperous 2021! Liz <sup style="font-family: Times New Roman; color: #006400;">Read! Talk! 01:23, 1 January 2021 (UTC)