User talk:Malsharns

Please do not add inappropriate external links to Wikipedia. Wikipedia is not a collection of links, nor should it be used for advertising or promotion. Inappropriate links include, but are not limited to, links to personal websites, links to websites with which you are affiliated (whether as a link in article text, or a citation in an article), and links that attract visitors to a website or promote a product. See the external links guideline and spam guideline for further explanations. Because Wikipedia uses the nofollow attribute value, its external links are disregarded by most search engines. If you feel the link should be added to the page, please discuss it on the associated talk page rather than re-adding it. Thank you. --Bcp67 (talk) 05:37, 10 December 2018 (UTC)

Racingandsports.com
Hello. The link you're adding to articles doesn't seem to be reliable or appropriate for use on Wikipedia, especially when your mass adding looks like an attempt of promoting the website. Are you associated with the website? Flooded  with them hundreds 11:44, 10 December 2018 (UTC)

December 2018
You may be blocked from editing without further warning the next time you insert a spam link, as you did at Finale Juvenile Hurdle. Persistent spammers may have their websites blacklisted, preventing anyone from linking to them from all Wikimedia sites as well as potentially being penalized by search engines. -- Luk  talk 13:08, 10 December 2018 (UTC)

Adding reference links to group races (Horse Racing)
Hi Bcp67, Thank you for your feedback on adding reference links for past results. I need your help on add those valuable links to group race pages.Those are high quality data including history ,past race results and horse details such as breed information comparing other reference. But those are really high quality and as horse racing fan, I like add these information to group races pages. Can you help me to do this ? (ex: https://www.racingandsports.com/thoroughbred/feature-race/australia/blue-diamond-stakes/475)  Malsharns (talk) 06:28, 11 December 2018 (UTC)
 * Are you linked to the website racingandsports.com? I can see that there have been various attempts to link the website to race articles, by different new users, which seems a bit strange. The races already have links to Racing Post results and sometimes other websites, what are you able to add? --Bcp67 (talk) 13:35, 11 December 2018 (UTC)

To Wikipedia,

I am writing on behalf of our Content Manager (Malsharns) and Racing and Sports (www.racingandsports.com). I understand that you have asked us to provide some background and substantiation on why Racing and Sports links should be allowed on Wikipedia. Racing and Sports ABN (40 093 360 108) has been active from 01 Jul 2000. We are a major online publisher and media partner for the racing industry and have a strong global brand and reputation for integrity and quality.

The R&S website is one of the largest and most respected dedicated thoroughbred racing platforms in the world (including results going back to origin (pre 1900) for many feature races). We boast the largest privately owned and most extensive thoroughbred, harness and Greyhound data base in the world – all available for free to users, as well as a catalogue of over 40,000 racing images. In online publishing, the Racing and Sports website is internationally recognised as one of the leaders in our space and has worldwide brand recognition through various relationships with jurisdictions such as the rapidly expanding Asian region, United Kingdom, Ireland, Europe and the Americas. Racing and Sports as a global media accredited organisation is invited to attend, report on and promote major racing carnivals in the online space for the Royal Ascot Carnival, Irish Derby, Epsom Derby, The Arc, Singapore International Cup, the Hong Kong International meeting, The Durban July in South Africa and the CECF in Mainland China. Just this week Gary Crispe attended the Hong Kong International meeting. Online publishing is just one area of the business – the public face of Racing and Sports - but the digital platform is much more than just news. Every day it carries free form and race cards and ratings for up to twelve countries around the globe, complete with interactive form interrogation capability and ratings profiles – all unique to Racing and Sports.

Racing and Sports partners with these multination partners:


 * Tabcorp – Supply of English/Chinese form for 3 codes of racing for Asian market and to other Tabcorp wagering partners in Europe.
 * SKY US – Supply of Australian and New Zealand thoroughbred form and punting tools into the Americas each day
 * SKY US – develop and maintain the Australianracing.com website with news and form.
 * SKY International – Supply the SKY racing international website with International news.
 * Betfair– Supply form and written content for Australian and New Zealand meetings
 * Singapore Turf Club – provide form and content for inbound meetings
 * Singapore Turf Club – Promote Singapore racing to R&S Online audience
 * Australian Associated Press – Supply ratings for the Australian newspaper network and for AAP form products
 * Crownbet – Supply data feeds for Thoroughbreds, harness and greyhounds for Australia/NZ/Hong Kong and Europe.
 * Bet365 – Develop and maintain external form site plus supply form data and content on Australian and New Zealand racing.
 * Racing NSW – Provide run value ratings for International horses
 * Hong Kong Jockey Club – Provide online promotion and marketing of HK racing for 2016-17 and 2017 -18 seasons.
 * Sportsbet – Supply form and data for Thoroughbred and Harness racing
 * Darley – Provide Timeform ratings for Australia and New Zealand
 * Australian Turf Club – provide online marketing support, transcription services and Chinese translated form guides.

We have just launched our new website and our content manager has tried to put links to information we believe would be of benefit to Wikipedia users.

Horse Racing Information

https://www.racingandsports.com/thoroughbred/horse/written-by/1205148#form

If you compare our form with others you will find that we have additional information others don’t have - for example race tempo and video comments

Tempo Suited front runners Video Comments: Jumped on terms, pressed forward, led by 1L on settling, led by 1L at the 400m, fought hard to stay ahead to the 100m, headed and relegated to 4th place on the line. Vet- superficial lacerations. As well as detailed stewards information Stewards Advice Post Race A post race veterinary examination revealed the colt had sustained superficial lacerations to its near hock and off side stifle. We also have jockey notes Jockey Note : “He ran super. He jumped out of the gates well. He wanted to race a little bit fresh through the early and middle stages. He has done a great job this campaign. Bring on the spring.” We also have OHR – official handicap ratings and sectional time analysis where available (https://www.racingandsports.com/thoroughbred/horse/mr-stunning/1038486#form) Race/Horse Sectionals: L800m (44.78) (44.62 - 3rd:1.5L) | L400m (22.32) (22.04 - 3rd:2.25L) Video Comments Away well, tracked leader, bumped 800M and wide no cover thereon, dug deep under strong determination over final 200M, came closest to winner at the line under 5lb penalty. Along with standard information for results that is already available we also provide Ratings (RSSR), colour silks of the runners and a review of the race, as well as links back to the horse information that no other sites carry. For example – Blue Diamond Stakes https://www.racingandsports.com/horse-racing-results/australia/caulfield/2018-02-24/R7 We have never put links into Wikipedia before and if we have breached some rules then we apologize and are trying to resolve this now. The R&S team feature on numerous radio segments, our website (Gary Crispe CEO) is the most quoted website in Australia media and print, here are some examples…

https://www.foxsports.com.au/horse-racing/melbourne-cup/melbourne-cup-2018-who-the-experts-and-celebrities-are-tipping-to-win/news-story/16ca1ae3bfecb31ba2a93a5e210bb9ec?nk=d4e0392a30b3d1aa8a37a9817dff5d62-1544590847 https://www.news.com.au/sport/superracing/racing-editor-ray-thomas-runs-the-rule-over-the-golden-rose/news-story/b2de625cce533567b3585283bfce8403 https://www.news.com.au/sport/superracing/racing-editor-ray-thomas-runs-the-rule-over-the-epsom-handicap/news-story/8a651e1fd0996ec0ef4040f93a982d1b https://www.abc.net.au/newsradio/content/s4763298.htm (National newspaper, circulation 500,000 million) - https://www.dailytelegraph.com.au/sport/superracing/form-guru-gary-crispe-says-super-winx-can-get-even-better/news-story/feba5b63a52b794c72c47eff71a2294f https://www.dailytelegraph.com.au/sport/superracing/winx-records-her-secondbest-cox-plate-rating-in-historic-fourth-win/news-story/0dad5efa309785ed5c3bd0e8896b7ece https://www.heraldsun.com.au/sport/superracing/freedman-in-a-quandary-regarding-ambitious-in-australian-cup-debut/news-story/33b79308dff1b84dee42c6a4c564391e https://www.smh.com.au/sport/racing/mighty-in-the-power-yucatan-can-do-it-again-in-cup-20181106-p50ebn.html https://www.racingnsw.com.au/news/feature-articles/gary-crispe-profiles-the-championships-internationals/ http://cwallerracing.com/wp/wp-content/uploads/2018/04/CWR-Newsletter-13.04.2018.pdf
 * Fox Sports
 * News.com.au
 * ABC radio
 * Daily Telegraph
 * Herald Sun (National Newspaper)
 * Sydney Morning Herald (National Newspaper)
 * Racing NSW
 * Chris Waller – Leading trainer

…more can be found on google searches (or we can provide additional information if required). I hope this is enough information to show we are legitimately interested in promoting racing of all types hence why we provide this information for free. Many other sites charge for much of the information we have for free. We are new to Wikipedia and know other sites already have many links on Wikipedia. Being late to the party does not mean the information we are providing is not the best. If we have incorrectly added links – I apologise for that and am happy to work with you to make sure we do everything we need to ensure our links are correct. I hope you look upon our request to be included on Wikipedia positively and can work together to provide the best free information to internet users.

Regards Robert Vilkaitis Malsharns (talk) 05:42, 12 December 2018 (UTC)


 * Thanks for coming back on the talk page and I can see that your website has a lot of good horse racing data which I'd find interesting and useful away from Wikipedia editing. The problem here is links which are being added by the organisation which owns the website being linked. Information on Wikipedia should be cited to a reliable source, which is often a website. So if someone updates an article, they should provide a link to a third-party source for that information, although its fair to say that there is a lot of uncited information! Usually for UK horse racing results the source is a link to the Racing Post's result, but it's not that website who are putting the link there, it is a Wikipedia user who is updating the race article. The key policy for this subject is contained in WP:ADV from which this is a quote - "It is obvious that a link from Wikipedia to an external site may drive Web traffic to that site. But in line with Wikipedia policies, you should avoid linking to a site that you own, maintain, or represent—even if Wikipedia guidelines seem to imply that it may otherwise be linked. When in doubt, you may go to the talk page and let another editor decide. This suggestion is in line with Wikipedia's conflict-of-interest guidelines." WP:COI sets out those guidelines. Please also be aware that no user in any way "represents" Wikipedia so there is no possibility of anyone giving you permission to edit anything. Anyone is free to edit, and likewise anyone is free to remove or change those edits if they think they go against Wikipedia policy and guidelines. I can't really help any further beyond that, sorry, but hopefully this helps you understand the issue --Bcp67 (talk) 11:28, 14 December 2018 (UTC)

Following on from your comments - we understand your comments, but there are plenty of examples where the username is or represents the domain name.

I have reviewed the Links to be avoided list and the only thing that I see if 4. Links mainly intended to promote a website; I would argue that we are providing a level of information above what would normally be free and there in the interests of readers.

It states - you should avoid linking to a site that you own, maintain, or represent—even if Wikipedia guidelines seem to imply that it may otherwise be linked. When in doubt, you may go to the talk page and let another editor decide.

We are asking you to approve placing of relevant information on these racing pages.

Thank you Malsharns (talk) 04:59, 17 December 2018 (UTC)