User talk:Master Thief Garrett/Archive01

This archive page covers approximately the dates between 22 Apr 2005 and 29 Apr 2005.

Post replies to the main talk page, copying the section you are replying to if necessary. (See How to archive a talk page.)

Your merge of OoT info into Link
Do you really think merging all that info about Oot into the Link article was a good idea; the previous summary was much better written and shorter, plus we already have a thorough plot summary in the OoT article. Now the summary of OoT in the Link article is much longer than that of Link's other adventures, giving the feeling that OoT was actually more important tan other titles... Phils 10:25, 22 Apr 2005 (UTC)
 * Well, a large number of Zelda fans would say it was I guess! I did it based on the advice of another user, and, really, should there be duplication? I'm not saying it was the greatest idea ever, and you can revert bits of it if you wish, but should the two articles really be saying the same thing in two different ways?
 * Alternately, it could be divided up into "Adult Link" and "Young Link" pages, but this also has problems. I really don't know. Hmmm, maybe someone should start one of those "QuickPoll" things? Master Thief Garrett 10:47, 22 Apr 2005 (UTC)
 * I'm not quite sure you understand my point. I suggested on Link (Legend of Zelda)'s that you merge the missing bits (ex.: slingshot) about Link's younger "version" from Young Link into the article, which was largely done. After the merge is done the "Young Link" article should be made a redirect to the "Link" article. However, the "Link" article was not missing information about OoT! It purposefully included only a strongly condensed plot summary of the game, because the "Ocarina of Time" article already has a large plot summary. So I asked if it was really good idea to expand the OoT plot summary by adding more redundant info about the games, as we already link to the main "OoT" article. I'm not sure what you mean by dividing "it" into "Adult Link" and "Young Link"... are you talking about the "Link (Legend of Zelda)" article? If so, I'm strongly opposed to that (you may do a poll about it however, if you think it's a good idea). "Adult Link" and "Young Link" are the same character, and "Link (Legend of Zelda)" covers both nicely, and has reached featured status. Phils 13:10, 24 Apr 2005 (UTC)
 * UPDATE: I just added a few sentences at the beginning of the first section of Link (Legend of Zelda), mentionning that Link is usually a child when he begins his quest, and the (very correct) statement about his sexual awareness from the "Young Link" article. Do you think we now have all the necessary information in Link (Legend of Zelda) to redirect Young Link there? Phils 16:23, 24 Apr 2005 (UTC)


 * Ah, I see now. No, I wasn't meaning dividing but rather... um... gee, I don't know WHAT I was thinking! Anyway, yes that's certainly a good redirect possibility now. While I'm all for being bold, you should maybe make a comment on the Link talk page before you redirect it just so anyone who disagrees can say so ahead of time. Or just go ahead anyway. Whichever you fell like. Master Thief Garrett 21:31, 24 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Welcome!
Hi MTG (do you mind if I just call you that? ;-) ) and welcome to Wikipedia! It's great to see you're taking some steps towards helping out here.

I think I need to point something out before it gets you in trouble. I noticed that you posted some things on the Votes for Deletion page. Now, the occasional sly comment is acceptable (even encouraged; it helps to keep things fun), but I think you're going a little bit too far with some of the remarks you're making (specifically, Votes_for_deletion/Magel). You might want to tone things down just a little bit so no one gets offended.

Hope I was helpful. Have fun on Wikipedia and again, welcome! Linuxbeak 23:47, Apr 22, 2005 (UTC)
 * Um, yeah, I was *trying* to word that in a fun way, but, as we all know, humour doesn't always come across quite right. I will try to be more careful as you say... anyway, thanks for the welcome! Master Thief Garrett 23:50, 22 Apr 2005 (UTC)

68.32.177.137
This user has been reported on WP:VIP for vandalism. LevelCheck 01:45, 23 Apr 2005 (UTC)
 * Thank you!!! Master Thief Garrett 02:10, 23 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Re: John Edwards
Hello, Master Thief Garrett, I just received your message. As it is sometimes difficult to convey nuance and emotion online, I am a little unsure: is your message intended to affirm to the anonymous user that personal opinions do not belong in articles, or is it intended to convey to me that I am being overzealous in my opinion of edits? I ask because I notice you posted it to my talk page only, and not the anonymous user's (and because I welcome constructive criticism). Thanks! &mdash; Knowledge Seeker &#2470; 08:23, 23 Apr 2005 (UTC)
 * I'm glad you understand how vague plain-text can be, it causes so many arguments here!
 * Yes I was aiming it at the anonymous user, but I put it there in reply to what he said to you, whereas putting it on the other page is both out of context and potentially shared by other same-IP users, so less suitable. Plus it wouldn't do to potentially scare off anonymous visitors if they found accusatory warnings seemingly directed at them on "their" talk page--dated before their first visit! Spooky!
 * But, overall, reverting his replacement of the "John Howards" caption with "LOSER!" could not be seen as overzealous by even the most conservative Wikipedian! Master Thief Garrett 08:32, 23 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Speedy deletion
I'm finding a lot of articles that you've marked for speedy deletion because their subjects aren't notable (often expressed in rather excitable language). Non-notability isn't a reason for speedy deletion; if you want, you can open VfDs on them though. When you do find something that nees to be speedily deleted, just give the reason in plain, neutral language. Mel Etitis ( &Mu;&epsilon;&lambda; &Epsilon;&tau;&eta;&tau;&eta;&sigmaf; ) 11:35, 23 Apr 2005 (UTC)
 * oh, well, um, I often wasn't sure, but some of them are just like invented people and self biographies and such. Do those really need votes? Well, maybe they do... and, as always, it's not meant to sound angry or anything, but a speedy deletion description often comes across as less NPOV than a carefully-edited article would...
 * The main problem is it's hard to guess the difference between the two categories... Master Thief Garrett 11:40, 23 Apr 2005 (UTC)
 * I'd recommend reading Deletion policy and Criteria for speedy deletion to get a better idea of what's a speedy and what isn't. As you become more familiar with the normal operations of VfD and related procedures you'll generally know straight away whether something is speedyable or needs to be voted on. &mdash; Trilobite (Talk) 14:59, 23 Apr 2005 (UTC)
 * Ah! Thank you, thank you. Most of them I was interpreting as falling under Articles rule 1, but maybe not! I guess I'll mainly use Vfd from now on if I'm unsure, and if someone more knowledgeable decides it should be speedy'd they can put it there themselves... Master Thief Garrett 22:26, 23 Apr 2005 (UTC)

RE: Vfd: G-Java link does not work
Sorry: struggling to get to grips with the deletions procedure. Should be sorted now... quiffhanger
 * That's fine, you certainly did better than MY first attempt. I missed out all the steps but the first! Master Thief Garrett 23:55, 23 Apr 2005 (UTC)

VfD Merge Candidates
Howdy. I appreciate your ability to sniff out articles that belong on VfD, but if you find an article that ought to be merged, you might consider performing the merger yourself or listing it at Articles to be merged rather than nominating it for VfD. Generally, you should only nominate an article for deletion if you actually believe it ought to be deleted. Exceptions to this rule are if you suspect an article ought to be deleted, but can't figure out what the heck it is and want other opinions on it, or if you find an article that someone attempted to nominate but the process wasn't completed correctly. Keep up the good work. android&harr;talk 03:57, Apr 24, 2005 (UTC)


 * Well, I usually do merge away happily, but some, like Battery explosion and Overcharging, should be instant merges, but I don't want to do that and then have people cry "no, blablbabla deserves its own article you know nothing about the topic blablabla!". I'm fairly certain they're basically rewordings of existing data, but for all I know people might think they are worthy of their own pages. It's a grey area. But I guess I should try to Be bold more often...
 * Or would a Peer Review tag be a better way, so someone with knowledge in the field can pick it up? Or is that really only intended for tagging rewrites? Master Thief Garrett 04:04, 24 Apr 2005 (UTC)

My advice is to just be bold and do it. I usually leave a note on the relevant articles' talk pages a short time before I do anything, but if people they don't like it, they can discuss it with you and/or revert your changes. If you're unfamiliar with the subject matter, try to get the attention of someone who is. For example, with the battery articles, identify the main contributors to the battery article and leave messages on their talk pages, explaining what you have found. If they're still active, they'll probably thank you for your discovery. I'm not too familiar with the more formal ways of doing this (peer review, etc.) but I'm sure they're worth looking into as well. android&harr;talk 04:14, Apr 24, 2005 (UTC)


 * ...ah, OK, that way make sense! Master Thief Garrett 04:15, 24 Apr 2005 (UTC)

You'll find that Klonimus votes to keep just about everything. Besides, if you follow the approach I described above, someone who is knowledgable on the subject will be able to tell if, say, the battery explosion article should be merged or kept as its own article. android&harr;talk 04:30, Apr 24, 2005 (UTC)


 * Oh, yes, I didn't realise it was Klonimus! Not to say this particular article didn't have potential... but yes I think your approach is the safest. Master Thief Garrett 04:31, 24 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Comment about VfD for DOOM cheats
I thought it was funny that you casted your vote to delete as IDDELETE! Despite that, I would rather keep the DOOM cheats article since it has encyclopedic information. --SuperDude 04:41, 24 Apr 2005 (UTC)
 * LOL! Actually the person before me invented IDDELETE so I just followed suit... Master Thief Garrett 04:45, 24 Apr 2005 (UTC)

My user page, your question
Yes, America will only be secure until every opponent of democracy and capitalism is taken out. Some of our enemies are so implacable and evil (such as the Axis of Evil, the Outpost of Tyranny, and Communist China) that freedom can only be defended through armed force. Others are just corrupt, degenerate, cowardly sleaze (such as Old Europe and Canada). Because they are so cowardly, they will bend under the sligest pressure, and we will thus be able to secure our liberty through economic and diplomatic pressure alone. Moral Clarity 09:09, 24 Apr 2005 (UTC)
 * Ah. That makes sense now. You may in part be right, but I wouldn't have said so in such unambiguous words, it certainly could make you look like a Redneck/extremist/conservative/fascist or something like that... hmmm... all very interesting... Master Thief Garrett 09:13, 24 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Back Off
First off i didn't ask for your comment, nor do i want it, i dont put my nose into your business on here, and i would like it if you do the same. Second if they want to leave expelative laden mags onm my talk page by all means i hope they do, it just proves what they are. Third your soft-handed aproach to these extreme pov vandals is why wikipedia will never be a usless source of information on subjects that produce conversiy or in the spotlight, this is an encylopedia not a debat forum, or an form to express ones views on subjects. You should aslo know that the person in morethen likely a puppet of a user that have previoulsy banned several times for similar edits, he didn;t get the idea then he hasn't got it now. --Boothy443 | comhrÚ 09:22, 24 Apr 2005 (UTC)


 * ...okaaayyyyy.... I don't actually have a soft-handed approach at all, I'd personally like to see these "people" instantly burn in "Wiki Hell", but that's not the goal of the Vandalism alerts system, and we must try to respect the systems already in place here, even if they are obviously quite flawed... ...but... but I was only trying to help you alleviate your stress over this... but... but apparently I didn't... sorry... Master Thief Garrett 09:28, 24 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Horsie Defacer!
It seems the sicko who had earlier made those anti-StickHorsie sites I mentioned, has now defaced my article. Can you kill her please? *begging puppy eyes*

DarkSkywise 10:49, 24 Apr 2005 (UTC)


 * Um, I don't have any powers you know! I can't do anything! ...just ask them on their Talk page to kindly not deface the article. If all else fails you may need to get a third-party mediator to help. Master Thief Garrett 10:52, 24 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Not?? I thought youze guys all had them there X-ray eyes or sumptin'!

(We're talking about somebody who has relentlessly stalked Horsie for the last three years and had mediators jumping off high cliffs and bridges) :oS

DarkSkywise 11:15, 24 Apr 2005 (UTC)


 * um, yeah... mmm-hmmm... Master Thief Garrett 11:18, 24 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Okay, maybe it was just a high sidewalk :oP

DarkSkywise 11:29, 24 Apr 2005 (UTC)


 * LOL! Master Thief Garrett 11:31, 24 Apr 2005 (UTC)

btw, since we got to know each other so well during the last 37 hours :D (and both turned out do be quite decent fellows, I might add) here's two hardly Horsie-related questions...

- googling "DarkSkywise" = 1,350 hits... does that make me Wikiworthy or do I still need some more? ;-P

- "Partyflock" (704,000 Google hits) - largest techno music internet community worldwide, 120,000 active members, 150,000 photographs, 6th largest forum worldwide according to BigBoards.com (actually it's the 5th but they still haven't replaced the old URL, so their counter is not counting anymore)... and the main language isn't even English! Does *that* sound Wikiworthy enough? (just wondering)

DarkSkywise 23:06, 24 Apr 2005 (UTC)


 * Nope, you gotta get that postcount of yours a little higher first--LOL! Sorry sugar-lips, all the compliments in the world won't help you, I don't think you make the cut... nor does any other web handle for that matter... Master Thief Garrett 23:13, 24 Apr 2005 (UTC)


 * Um, I'm not really sure about that one... in the music category there's a "worthiness" test. Now while it's intended for bands and artists, not web communities, you could maybe contact the author(s) of that test, or maybe one of the music category editors, and see what they think. I'm sure they'd know best. Actually, I don't know that a non-English website should be on the English Wikipedia, but I don't really know. So try there. Hope that helps! Master Thief Garrett 23:13, 24 Apr 2005 (UTC)

okay, I'll check it out!

I did however notice the second largest Dutch Internet community FOK! was on the english Wiki too (claiming to be the largest, which I corrected of course ;-[ ) so I assume it won't be much of a problem anyway (DarkSkywise 14:35, 25 Apr 2005 (UTC))

as for your question about sock puppets... I *did* tell people on my personal site (with has lotsa Horsie fans) they could vote too, AND taught them the proper procedure, but I also explicitly stated "But you can vote on it too! Yes Wiki-Horsie or No Wiki-Horsie! Takes about three minutes!"

and since the majority will still be a "no", what would be the USE of sock puppets? besides, I'm sure you can trace the IPs ;-)

also, would I really go through the trouble of imitating established members of the MSN Groups help site? :oP

DarkSkywise 12:44, 25 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Okay, back to you again, because at least from you I'm getting honest answers... apparently I'm now being accused of something called "blatant google bombing" which I had to look up on Wiki because I had no idea what it was... apparently I did this with the link at the bottom of the StickHorsie page which is a link to a completely ordinary MSN Groups page which has been unchanged for maybe 2 years or so

I absolutely don't get it... can you explain please?

DarkSkywise 16:10, 26 Apr 2005 (UTC)

hmmmz... apparently Korath mistook the url for the Horsie graphics I showed you for some kind of code, but these are completely NORMAL urls for pics stored within MSN Groups (yes, they're very long, but they're always like that)... you know, I REALLY resent being accused of "blatant Google bombing" (no, not by you) while all I did was give you links to two Horsie graphics

Is there some higher-up person I can send a formal complaint to? I know I've been a bit of a PITA these days but does this warrant these kind of false accusations?

DarkSkywise 17:08, 26 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Taffer
Hi! Cool nick -- I'm a big fan. &mdash; Matt Crypto 00:33, 25 Apr 2005 (UTC)
 * LOL! FINALLY, someone recognises the nickname!!! I've used this or just plain Garrett everywhere and no-one's clicked. Heck, one guy even asked if I liked Baldur's Gate since there's a Garrett in that... LOL! Master Thief Garrett 00:35, 25 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Yes, you sneaksy thiefsy, there are others who know about the Thief series, mwahaha. --AshyRaccoon 08:38, May 1, 2005 (UTC)

Revotes on Vfd
I'm sorry that you misunderstood my statements. Rereading them, I can see that it was an understandable mistake and that I could have worded them in a clearer way. You are a reasonable, intelligent person and if you misunderstood the statements then anybody could have. Thank you for going though all the effort that you did. We are both a victim of miscommunication. - Pioneer-12 03:37, 25 Apr 2005 (UTC)


 * nah, that's OK, but how do we clear this mess up? You'll have a harder job convincing the others... Master Thief Garrett 03:59, 25 Apr 2005 (UTC)

By the way, what is your opinion on the article now? If you still want to delete after all of this, then I respect your right to disagree.

- Pioneer-12 23:55, 25 Apr 2005 (UTC)


 * Oh, um, er, well, so much has happened, and the article is so different... I really don't know what I think any more! I'll have another look and maybe change my vote, although of course the Deletes are probably still winning... Master Thief Garrett 00:08, 26 Apr 2005 (UTC)

VfD and Copyvio overlap
Hi MTG, I noticed your new VfD/Copyvio notice on your User page. While it's a good thought, I'm not sure that it's necessary. Buried deep in the Guide to VfD, there's Guide_to_Votes_for_deletion:
 * "Copyvio" is a shorthand for "Delete this article through the copyright violation deletion process rather than through VFD". A voter who votes "Copyvio" has listed the article at Wikipedia:Copyright problems and applied the copyright violation notice to the article. Copyright violation supercedes VFD for article content, and usually VFD discussion ceases at this point. However, in rare cases the discussion may continue as to whether an article by this title is merited, which will affect the status of any rewrite article resulting from the copyright problems process.

So the copyvio process takes precedence over VfD, and the page should be blanked. It makes sense&mdash;blanking the page helps keep Wikipedia out of legal trouble for the potential copyright violation. Mayhaps there should be a formal policy note that a page that survives Copyright problems should go back to VfD if that's where it originally came from, but that's a pretty rare happening. --TenOfAllTrades (talk/contrib) 03:49, 25 Apr 2005 (UTC)
 * Oh? I just thought that was the best way to do it. But you're obviously right. I never spotted that line somehow...Master Thief Garrett 03:56, 25 Apr 2005 (UTC)
 * No worries. The Guide is pretty dense stuff, and I don't think anybody claims to know all of it without at least a little peeking.  By the way, I see you got blistered by a few editors on your VfD of Kria vrissi. If an article looks like it's non-notable, or advertising, or vanity, I'll throw the title into Google.  Saves me a lot of grief, and helps to rapidly distinguish most hoaxes and vanity from the straight goods.  Happy editing, --TenOfAllTrades (talk/contrib) 04:12, 25 Apr 2005 (UTC)
 * "blistered"? LOL! Yes that's my policy, but that one time I overlooked it. I identified it as a potential weakness but I must have forgotten to research it before nomination. I guess I shouldn't cull stuff that late at night without some coffee... mmm... coffee... Master Thief Garrett 04:17, 25 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Hi
Hi - just wanted to say that I'm impressed by the amount of work you've done here in... what? Two weeks? You seem to have jumped into Wikipedia with both feet and be swimming well (if that's not mixing metaphors too much). One piece of advice... it's better to archive any of your talk rather than simply deleting it. I suspect that in a few months time someone might suggest you stand for admin, and if so that might count against you. Some people already won't be impressed by your fairly clear preference to put so many things up for vfd, but there's a whole range of opinion on WP as to what needs deeleting and what doesn't. Anyway, I basically just wanted to say "welcome" and "keep up the good work!" PS - don't know where you got your user name, but every time I see it I think of the "Lord Darcy" stories! Grutness|hello? 04:42, 25 Apr 2005 (UTC)


 * LOL! Thanks! Yes it's amazing how quickly I've become addicted. I think it's chronic, so I'm hoping I qualify for the new Wikivaccine...
 * Wow, me, admin material? Wow... um... while no ambitious person would say no, and I'm definitely one of those, I'd have expeced such an idea to take years, not months, to form... but things do move rather quickly around here... but don't you have to be a sysop for a while before you become an admin? Well, anyway, I'll certainly look into archiving as you say.
 * Well I nominate things I honestly think should be deleted, but then I find that people vehemently oppose it--look at Votes for deletion/Main Street, Dallas, Texas for example. After backlashes like that, I'm inclined to be much more careful indeed... so much for trying to be bold...
 * LOL! Garrett is the protagonist from the Thief videogames, and he's referred to as a "master thief". Simple, no?
 * Anyway, thanks for the feedback! Master Thief Garrett 08:17, 25 Apr 2005 (UTC)
 * :) That explains the name! In case you don't know the stories, BTW, Lord Darcy is sort of an alternative timeline Sherlock Holmes - the stories were written by Randall Garrett. As to the admin stuff, it takes several months minimum, a year more likely, but the start you've made is a good one. I probably spoke too early, but I'd say it is on the cards at some point. And sysop and admin are identical here.   Grutness|hello? [[Image:Grutness.jpg|25px|]] 04:27, 26 Apr 2005 (UTC)

the inspired person VfD Family traditions
Hi and thanks for calling me "the inspired person". I got the ispiration from you only to try to do something with the above article. So, you get the full credit.--Bhadani 05:00, 25 Apr 2005 (UTC)


 * hehehe... well someone had to do it, and it's certainly swung the voting... sure I may have triggered you off, but you were the one with the fingers typing it!


 * You should maybe strikeout your old vote so people can clearly see the change. Master Thief Garrett 05:48, 25 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Strange actions in Mormon topic
Quoting: "I noticed you altered another's vandalism, but if you look at the changes both you and the vandaliser have the same IP. Now IPs are mostly randomly generated and often dynamically changing, so the calculations required for such a coincidental crossover are astronomical! So is it someone else using your family computer, or is this a PC at a cybercafe/school/college/library/university/etc.? It just seems very curious to me... Master Thief Garrett 07:12, 25 Apr 2005 (UTC)"

The first one was me before I logged in. The first post was hardly vandalism; I added a little bit to a sentence. Then I logged in, and fixed some more stuff. Hope that explains things. I don't know how to send a message so that you get the "You have new messages" thing, but this seems to be the way, so hopefully you get this somehow. Feel free to delete once you get it.209.193.69.203 07:45, 25 Apr 2005 (UTC)

LinuxQuestions.org on peer review
Hi, Master Thief! Thanks for enlisting help with LinuxQuestions.org. Could you move your request to Requests for expansion, though? That's the perfect place for a five-line article. (Though it might be as well to wait till it's actually off VfD.) The peer review page isn't so suitable: it's intended "for nearly Featured-standard articles that need the final checking by peers before being nominated as Featured article candidates." I've archived the peer review request, since it's unlikely to get anybody working on the article anyway, that's not what peer reviewers are looking to do. I don't actually know how lively Requests for expansion is, but I'm hoping for the best, and it's at least a lot more likely to do the article some good than sitting on peer review. Best of luck with it! --Bishonen | talk 13:18, 25 Apr 2005 (UTC)


 * Well, actually I didn't write the article at all, it was put it up for Vfd but the main vote was Keep; in previous Vfds people had suggested peer reviewing some fairly short articles, so I dutifully added the tag to this one since it's going to be kept anyway. But upon closer inspection I can see it doesn't fit after all! I'll put it up there instead, thanks. Master Thief Garrett 05:04, 26 Apr 2005 (UTC)
 * People have been suggesting that, have they? Innaresting. Thanks. I know (from the results I see on the page) that there has to be some well-meaning advice to that effect circulating around the site. If you see a notorious case, I'd really appreciate it if you'd drop a line on my page--maybe I could have a word with them. --Bishonen | talk 07:07, 26 Apr 2005 (UTC)
 * Ah, OK then. Master Thief Garrett 07:09, 26 Apr 2005 (UTC)
 * You're FAST!--Bishonen | talk 07:10, 26 Apr 2005 (UTC)
 * But you're faster! :) Master Thief Garrett 07:11, 26 Apr 2005 (UTC)
 * Who needs IRC, eh? :-)--Bishonen | talk 07:16, 26 Apr 2005 (UTC)
 * /me does. Darn. Doesn't work. Looks like we won't force IRC outta business just yet. Master Thief Garrett 12:30, 26 Apr 2005 (UTC)

puppetteer
As with most criminals, I can be traced. But I don't want you to trace me. Currently sober, but I'll give u a clue as to my pupetteer: facetious will lead you in the write [sick] [sic] direction. And its User:Jimbo Wales who is my puppetteer. But shhh, its a secret. I'm from Quebec too. Mas tarde, senorita.

Just a question: there was that Tom Jones song about a puppetteer, that was cool, what was the song cool. --Newnoise 14:29, 25 Apr 2005 (UTC)

(answered here)

VfD Vote Justifications
Hey, it's me again. I noticed your "paste-ins" on your user page, and given Aaronescott's recent reaction to your use of one of them, it might be a good idea to make them a bit less harsh, or to forego paste-ins altogether. I know we see a lot of the same kinds of deletion-worthy articles, and it's tempting to rubberstamp them with something amusing (and believe me, I appreciate humor on VfD as much as anybody) but we are supposed to consider each article on its own merits, and usage of the paste-ins gives the appearance that you aren't. There was quite a mess a little while ago with people using templates to cast cookie-cutter votes, and that wasn't received well at all. In any case, keep up the good work, and feel free to tell me to stuff it if you think I'm being too intrusive. :-) android&harr;talk 00:39, Apr 26, 2005 (UTC)
 * nono, I see your point, and a very valid one at that. I actually haven't used any of those as yet, but so many times I find myself typing virtually the same ones out ten times in a day, so I've started storing them for later.
 * I still honestly consider each and every page, no matter how ridiculous it is, don't get the wrong impression about that!
 * Templates? Templates?!? That sounds so laughably flawed... I can imagine some types of people making mass votes on anything and everything they saw on Vfd. No wonder it got the cut, but even so I wonder how it got to be a valid idea in the first place? Couldn't people see that anarchy would reign?
 * Anyway, as for that *particular* line, I wasn't intending it to offend anyone, it's actually quite serious and in a way complimentary. Some of the people entries we've had added here would make absolutely first-class yearbook entries, better than some real yearbooks I've seen! I guess if I add "sorry" to it like to the band-van ones, that would lessen the "blow".
 * But thanks for your concern, and you are probably quite right. I'll have to think about it... Master Thief Garrett 00:51, 26 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Wikipedia is Communism Vandal
I tried to create a special template for him, but it was impossible. So what is going on now is that I am tagging every page with the sockpuppet template and keeping a list of this vandal's puppets. Zscout370 (talk) 01:44, 27 Apr 2005 (UTC)
 * what, what, what, what? I can't understand what you're on about, sorry. Um, um, could you explain, please? Why does a vandal need a template? I'm not an admin, just in case you thought I was... Master Thief Garrett 01:48, 27 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Well: I wanted to do something to spot this vandal easily. I am sorry if I confused you, but I saw on the vandalism page that you wanted me to tell you what I had in mind. However, I do have a "wanted poster" on the Long Term Alerts page that you might get a kick out of. Zscout370 (talk) 01:50, 27 Apr 2005 (UTC)
 * Ahhhhh now I understand! Yes that makes sense now. I'd forgotten that.
 * LOL! Yes I saw that. Very much his state of mind. A similar thing could be drawn up for Moral Clarity, our (ex)-resident redneck. LOL!
 * Well now he's dealt with I can take him off my watchlist. I add any and all suspicious Users' Talk pages to my watchlist, and then monitor both that and their "Contributions" (loose use of the word I am sure) for anything worth reporting.
 * A lot of people seem to merely revert vandalism without actually checking on that person's record. My way may be more time-consuming, but no-one can possibly escape if they've "sinned" sufficiently enough in the past.
 * heheheh... I really get a kick outta that pic you drew... heheheh... doubtless he'll return someday so we can recycle it... Master Thief Garrett 03:05, 27 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Who's taffing about then?
Glad to see another fan of the series. Keep on serving the Builder by building him a great Encyclopedia! ;) silsor 09:58, Apr 27, 2005 (UTC)


 * LOL! Yes, The Builder's Hand guides all! LOL! *guard to dead/ko'ed buddy* "Uh, are you all right? No, of course you're not all right. Sorry." Master Thief Garrett 10:01, 27 Apr 2005 (UTC)

re:tagging war
No i welcome them opening their mouths, i love to tell move of them how much they are hippocrits, and what a deplorable job many of them do at adminstraion of this site. --Boothy443 | comhrÚ 10:39, 27 Apr 2005 (UTC) But instead i figure they will just argue with each other, like they have been doing, continue to be lax, and just let the vandals and the pov pushers contiune to get a bigger hold then they already have. --Boothy443 | comhrÚ 10:42, 27 Apr 2005 (UTC)


 * I am not doing anything worse then what has been alowed to happen already. --Boothy443 | comhrÚ 10:45, 27 Apr 2005 (UTC)

I am curious though, why critise me, if your going to some what support me anyway. --Boothy443 | comhrÚ 10:50, 27 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Sorry about the confusion then, and apoligies if i have come off wrong to you about anything, i can be a bit short tempered when i get worked up at times, it's a family trait or something. It just godes me to some nerve, to see what has happedn here over really the past 2 months, though it's been working up, i have seen a lot of good admins and users fall by the way side, and i chalk most of it up to frustration, and a lot of the new crop of users that have come in are just terible, it seems most are pov pushers or just, to put it simply, moronic. As for policy, just look at the notice board and you can see what the probls is with the admins, all they do is bicker, and stab each other in the back, and their is praticlay no enforcment on them, no one keeps them in check, it it's come to be very clear that they cant do it them selves. I would not expect anything to come from the confrence, i would guess that it going to be more technobabble and how to better promote the site then how to deal with the problems, and if their is anything that does come from it, i doubt that either one of us will be reltavity happy with the results, just based on the experience on how policy seems to go on here. Aand as for the VP, what a waste of time and space, i have yet to see any use come out it, for the most part things their are DOA. The problem isn't the simple vandalism, like pelican shit or Mr Commie, it's the unsimple type, the POV pushing, the bias that is being wirrten into this thing, which is maiking wikipedia less of an information source, what an encylopedia is supposed to be, and more of a blog for people to push the agendas, and very few people seem to be willing to do much about it. I dont know what else to tell you i could go on for ever about it, but if you want to fight it, i have no problem with backing you up, and i could problely get some others to follow, but i am not sure. --Boothy443 | comhrÚ 11:26, 27 Apr 2005 (UTC)

(all answered on User's talk page)

Zoltarak
Hi Master Thief Garret. Recently you were in contact with --Zoltarak. He's been blocked for "intent to start vandalism." He's contacted me (we share a computer at school) and asked me to come here and try to get you guys to reverse the block. For one, it appears there's been a misunderstanding. Someone on his "talk" page claims he's vandalized the "vfd" which he never did. He was also reverted for stuff he did at the sandbox, which is supposed to not happen, as I understand it. By the way, this is an awesome site! Do you need a valid email address to make an account? I'm at school now and don't have access to my email. Thanks, and please reconsider the block on Zoltarak.


 * I'm not actually a person of power, I did not do the banning personally, I merely warned him about his vandalising. Any user is allowed to do that, if their charges are valid of course.


 * The sandbox is intended for tests, but there is a certain level of trust of what you can or cannot say there. It is supposed to be a testing ground, not a message board, and so his "help me defeat the wikiopressors" sort of comments were quickly and repeatedly removed.


 * As for the actual reasons for his banning, by looking at the Vfd page history he has replaced the entirety of the Vfd with his own personal propaganda. This event caused much grief for the many users (including myself) who dutifully tried to undo the damage, as the server was so bogged down at the time that the many attempts made by each to restore the page kept timing out.


 * This erasure he made is considered vandalism here, and has severe consequences. Moreover, vandalising the Vandalism in progress page itself has even MORE severe consequences. The page itself warns that you may be "banned without warning" for vandalising it. But in fact he *was* warned, by myself and others, before this banning went through.


 * I'd say "You bastards deleted my page about Joseph D. Gibson, violating my free speech rights. ... THIS MEANS WAR, YOU FILTHY RATS!" statement is rather unambiguous as to his intentions. This certainly makes it sound like he is going to launch a vendetta of vandalism and trolling, and that, coupled with his vandalism of the Vfd page, led to his banning.


 * I am fairly confident you only need a valid email address if you wish to make alterations to your account or retrieve/change your password, but there is no email verification so you can sign up and use an account straight away even if the address isn't valid.


 * But anyway, tomorrow morning I will find someone more official and put you in touch with them. I severely doubt you will succeed, but at the very least you can try if indeed your friend's actions have been misrepresented. Master Thief Garrett 13:00, 27 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Ok, thanks. Apparently, he got pissed off when he did that vfd thing because he felt he was being "wikipressed." Between you and me, the guy's kind of an idiot. As you can see, I now have an account at my house, so my personal reason's for wanting him unblocked are now at an end. Thanks. (unsigned, by Karatloz)


 * Well, you said it first, so yes he is an idiot! Anyway, after this strange and unplanned beginning, I hope you choose to stay with us and enjoy our little community. Welcome, and enjoy! Master Thief Garrett 23:35, 27 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Sigh
We both should have kept our mouths shut. Look what your favourite sockpuppet, Newnoise did here... (I moved it to BJAODN). Grutness|hello? 05:08, 28 Apr 2005 (UTC)


 * Oh dear... well, maybe the sockcheck check will get somewhere... or maybe not... ah well... *makes mental note to never join in a WP joke again* Master Thief Garrett 06:30, 28 Apr 2005 (UTC)

VfD
True but its more than obvious? --Cool Cat My Talk 00:45, 29 Apr 2005 (UTC)

(don't know how to reply to this comment but yes I read it)