User talk:Mattarata/Archive 2006

Welcome!

Hello,, and welcome to Wikipedia! Thank you for your contributions. I hope you like the place and decide to stay. Here are a few good links for newcomers: I hope you enjoy editing here and being a Wikipedian! Please sign your name on talk pages using four tildes (~&#126;); this will automatically produce your name and the date. If you have any questions, check out Ask a question or ask me on my talk page. Again, welcome! Hyacinth 08:11, 18 September 2005 (UTC)
 * The five pillars of Wikipedia
 * How to edit a page
 * Help pages
 * Tutorial
 * How to write a great article
 * Manual of Style

Pop
Hi, Please take care when adding new material that you do not remove old stuff unless this is intentional. I noticed that you had removed the "explosion"-sound meaning of the word "pop" when you added "Prince of Persia" (the latter of which I am not convinced belongs, but left in anyway). I'm guessing this was an oversight rather than deliberate. Fourohfour 12:01, 1 April 2006 (UTC)


 * The "Prince of Persia" reference was removed from the "Point of Presence" page, it seemed out of place when there was already a "Pop may refer to" page. Then I also removed the ""explosion"-sound meaning of the word "pop" because that should be on http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/pop --Mattarata 14:52, 3 April 2006 (UTC)


 * Hmm.... I kind of see what you're getting at; I still think it warrants inclusion (linking to the closest relevant article), but I respect that you also have good reasons for thinking otherwise. Fourohfour 15:53, 3 April 2006 (UTC)


 * Since there is already a fairly long entry on http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/pop i am not going to add it back, if you want to then by all means, but i think that the more the wiktionary is developed, the less simple definations need to be included on wikipedia articles.

Black Concert T-Shirt
Hello,

Sorry I am so late answering. The sentence I removed was: the reason why the T-shirts are usually black "stems from rock band's desire to promote themselves as tough or hardcore". Firstly, "hardcore" is a loaded term, and in my opinion not very encyclopedic (but this is just a detail). Secondly, I think there are many reasons why metalheads wear black clothes and T-shirts, among which :
 * to identify as being part of the movement, and to show other people that the wearer belongs to this movement
 * to feel different from others and build one's identity

These are just a few reasons I can think of off mind, but I'm sure there are plenty of others. In any case, I don't think that "feeling tough and hardcore" is the motivation shared by a majority of black T-shirt wearers. In fact, I think that it is even a minority, but that's just my opinion.

The last, and possibly most important reason why I removed this sentence, is that it is unsourced. In fact it is original research (see No original research). If you have a source, such as a research article or something, then that's fine.

Maybe the best way around this problem is not to include the reasons why fans wear these T-shirts, particularly if they are just speculations. I think that each person has their reasons, and it is too hazardous to try and list what these reasons are; there will always be people who won't fit into any of the reasons you may give. On the other hand if you find an article on the subject, then that would be a great addition. In the mean time, the best thing is to avoid making restrictive hypotheses.

Thanks for your post, keep in touch if you need anything from me. Iron C hris |  (talk) 22:09, 14 August 2006 (UTC)
 * I liked the two reasons you gave, but as you said they are mostly speculation. So i guess we leave it as it. --Mattarata 23:26, 14 August 2006 (UTC)

Image tagging for Image:Hillel.jpg
Thanks for uploading Image:Hillel.jpg. The image has been identified as not specifying the source and creator of the image, which is required by Wikipedia's policy on images. If you don't indicate the source and creator of the image on the image's description page, it may be deleted some time in the next seven days. If you have uploaded other images, please verify that you have provided source information for them as well.

For more information on using images, see the following pages:
 * Image use policy
 * Image copyright tags

This is an automated notice by OrphanBot. For assistance on the image use policy, see Media copyright questions. 10:44, 17 August 2006 (UTC)
 * There is no way you the source is going to be found for this picture. Whoever took it is probably dead from drugs/partying/etc or doesn't even remember taking it. The default for copyright should be include unless ownership is proved, not excluded because copyriht is unknown as you would be effectively excluding hundreds of thousands of pictures that no copyright could be found for. --Mattarata 13:08, 17 August 2006 (UTC)

lightwright
I thought you'd like to know that I saw on your user page that you were planning on creating an article on lightwright, thought it was a good idea, and went ahead and wrote one. Feel free to edit away. Squigish 01:59, 26 August 2006 (UTC)

Concerning your AYB edit
In reference to the edit on your part detailed here, your edit was unjustified, as the fact reported had to do with an google research project, which is usually big enough in terms of scope and impact (present or future) to be in the category "Popular Culture". If you had an objection to user 132.167.34.47's (or whoever initially added the blurb about google's n-gram project) addition, you could have perhaps either edited out the blog link and added it to the reference sources, or found a better source, insteal of just editing the whole thing out. Be a bit more careful with your editing, please. Edward Grefenstette 20:17, 4 September 2006 (UTC)


 * It was the title of a blog posting. It is not the name of a project, it is not a code name for a project, it is nothing significant. Google saying something on their blog does not make it notable. However since Google is a big company, and I assume that many people follow that blog, then I suppose it could be considered a notable media reference, albeit only slightly. I just strongly dislike that everything Google says is automatic news and automatically included on Wikipedia. --Mattarata 15:41, 5 September 2006 (UTC)


 * Perhaps you should discuss these matters on the talk page before editing, then. Edward Grefenstette 21:29, 5 September 2006 (UTC)

Image tagging for Image:Chad Smith.gif
Thanks for uploading Image:Chad Smith.gif. The image has been identified as not specifying the source and creator of the image, which is required by Wikipedia's policy on images. If you don't indicate the source and creator of the image on the image's description page, it may be deleted some time in the next seven days. If you have uploaded other images, please verify that you have provided source information for them as well.

For more information on using images, see the following pages:
 * Image use policy
 * Image copyright tags

This is an automated notice by OrphanBot. For assistance on the image use policy, see Media copyright questions. 20:06, 20 September 2006 (UTC)

Threadless and Cafe Press inclusion in T-Shirt
Re: your readdition of threadless and cafe press... I just find it a bit arbitrary as to what can be added that links to a commercial site and what cannot. It seems to me that the brands that certain people like are allowed to be added, and those that are not are not. Unfortunately it tends toward mainstream popularity, which is sad in my opinion. I have seen links to other websites that happen to sell something removed when they are not the darling of thousands of people. Some people have the mistaken idea that a lot of people are involved in these companies like threadless, and that they are somehow democratic and distribute the companies income in a horizontal fashion. It's simply not true. There's a few people who profit from them, and largely at the expense of individual artists who get a measly comp for their invaluable contributions to the pot of the few. Pretty exploitative in my opinion. So, wikipedia is going to help the big dudes make more money by sending more people to their websites. Not exactly one of wiki's better accomplishments (and I do think wiki is great, don't get me wrong).Misterman8 20:39, 24 September 2006 (UTC)

Retrieved from "http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Talk:T-shirt"


 * I don't think linking to commercial sites is arbitrary at all. It has been demonstrated throughout history and many times in wikipedia that certain companies are trendsetters and innovators in their fields. Cafepress was, I believe, one of the first major outfits on the internet that truely empowered smaller organizations to distribute merchandise bearing their logos via the internet, and make money doing it. As for threadless, they are also an innovator in their field. I don't think that popularity has everything to do with their inclusion. I am not saying that threadless and cagepress aren't making money, they are, at the expense of their users, but this is an aspect of social networking sites. It is also not about helping anyone make money, but if we want to document a fad, phase, period, time, trend, etc... we need to be able to reference people or companies that are a part of that. --Mattarata 23:47, 24 September 2006 (UTC)

Retrieved from "http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Talk:T-shirt"

I don't see Threadless as an innovator at all. They just copies the T-Shirt Hell model of people telling you about a good idea that you then capitalize on and pay the contributor peanuts in return. This isn't new at all. The recording industry has been serving up wack contracts like this to musical artists for decades. Also, lawyering in that the design becomes their property to what they like with is really wack. So, I move that Threadless be stricken since they really aren't doing anything great and definitely nothing new.

I can see what you're talking about with Cafe Press, in that a group can get their shirts produced without any overhead though. But, they still suck for making people pay a lot to them and very little to the designer.Misterman8 09:38, 27 September 2006 (UTC)


 * Their suck status is not for us to discuss WP:NPOV, nor really is it for us to decide which one was more of an innovator WP:OR. If T-shirt Hell was the first to sell user-submitted t-shirt designs over the internet, then they should probably be mentioned. Many people and mainstream news articles would disagree with you regarding the success and popularity of threadless and that in itself probably warrants a small mention on the T-Shirt page. --Mattarata 13:48, 27 September 2006 (UTC)

Native American
I don't think you can get CorHomo to work on Native Americans directly. If it doesn't have an exact match then it won't work. I'm just throwing this out and haven't tried this to see if it actually works, but a test on User talk:Bobblehead/sandbox seems to work. You might try putting the tag on the redirect page below the redirect text and then using HTML comments  to copy the Native Americans page to Native American. As long as you leave the redirect as the first line wikipedia will still think it's a redirect. --Bobblehead 20:35, 28 September 2006 (UTC)


 * Well, this[] didn't appear to work, so i reverted back. I guess I am not sure if I did it the way in which you were referring? Also - I do not know how this idea is suppose to work. The CorHomo tool seems to scan the document for instances of the disambiguation text, adding the hidden html to the Native American page didn't allow it to really do anything at all. I am probably going to just say that the CorHomo tool needs to have functionality to deal with disambiguation pages that come from re-directs, which it appears to not have at this time.--Mattarata 22:25, 28 September 2006 (UTC)
 * You did it to Native american instead of Native American; I've done it for the latter. Just input the singular into CorHomo and fix those first (then revert my change); then you can do the plural without a problem. TimBentley (talk) 03:05, 29 September 2006 (UTC)


 * I haven't tried CorHomo, but the Pywikipediabot "solve_disambiguation.py" script automatically follows redirect links. --Russ Blau (talk) 10:55, 29 September 2006 (UTC)
 * TimBentley's suggestion seems to have worked, and i got a handful done last night. Will probably do more today unless somebody already took care of them. --Mattarata 13:30, 29 September 2006 (UTC)

Heh. I think you, me, and RussBlau were in on Native American at the same time, but hey, as long as it gets done, it's all good. One more dab page done. --Bobblehead 00:30, 30 September 2006 (UTC)

Derrick Lonsdale - link repair
Your edit here refers. I think that you need to look at the effect of the changes your tool makes before accepting them. In particular: HTH TerriersFan 21:59, 28 September 2006 (UTC)
 * Linking to Drug therapy is bad practice since that is a redirect page and consequently wastes sytem resources. Your tool should have linked to Pharmacology. You should ensure that your tool links to the destination page not redirects.
 * Nutrient-based therapy is the opposite to drug-based therapy!


 * Thanks for the fix. I didn't realize that Drug therapy was also a disambiguation page. --Mattarata 22:05, 28 September 2006 (UTC)

Hillel Slovak
I changed the photo because I didn't like the other one, and besides, the new one is only there temporarily until I (or you, since you are apparently doing some work on the article) find a better one that is also usable.
 * Well we have to try, the article needs a pic if we ever want it to be good and comprehensive.
 * He released two albums with the Red Hot Chili Peppers, there must have been promotional photos taken for them.

WikiProject Disambiguation Talk Request
This is a form message being sent to all WikiProject Disambiguation participants. I recently left a proposed banner idea on the WikiProject Disambiguation talk page and I would appreciate any input you could provide. Before it can be approved or denied, I would prefer a lot of feedback from multiple participants in the project. So if you have the time please join in the discussion to help improve the WikiProject. Keep up the good work in link repair and thanks for your time. Nehrams2020 22:21, 9 October 2006 (UTC)

John Hansen
Kazisdaman - Hey I was responding back to your message to me about John Hansen. He is the real first recorded president of the United States under a different consitution actually before George Washington. This was not made up but real: Here is just one of many links, it is just little known:  []

False Vandalism Claims
Bart Simpson is the Chief Justice of the United States in the year 2040 as per Simpsons season 4 episode 6. It was properly posted in the fictional events section of the year 2040. Please do not edit Wikis that you do not have the requisite knowledge to judge on whether or not something is vandalism. The page that you defaced unwittingly will now be repaired. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 149.169.86.122 (talk) 20:59, 25 October, 2006 (UTC).

Flow m
I reported him - as a result he was blocked indefinitely. See User talk:Flow m. John Smith&#39;s 17:04, 3 November 2006 (UTC)

Thanks for eavesdropping
It's always good when cool heads intervene...hopefully without any bounced friction or use of harsh CAPLOCKS :) . But, after 14000 edits...nothing here surprises me anymore when it comes to persistent editing. As I told Spangineer, my AGF is strong that civility and reason will prevail. Cheers, take care and again...thanks! Anger22 (Talk 2 22) 18:49, 3 November 2006 (UTC)

Kankatee Spam on T-shirt Article
Hello. I see there is an edit war going on at the t-shirt article. I'm not familiar with how to proceed with blocking a user for repeated spamming but I'd like to voice my support for taking that action with Kankatee as I believe their actions violate the Three-revert rule. Thanks for taking the time to help keep the T-shirt article clean. GreggHilferding 19:32, 3 November 2006 (UTC)

Your Unwelcome Harassment and Empty Threats
I will not tolerate your rudeness and your using multiple user names on Wikipedia to harass me. I will not tolerate your unwelcome harassment and bossing me around!!!!!...  I can read Wikipedia a lot better than you can... and invite you to READ its terms CAREFULLY and BE courteous to me as to avoid making me angry resulting in my treating you in kind!

With immediate effect, I ask that you cease and desist your harassment and to stay away from me... your harassment is not welcome. Should you engage in a course of conduct that will make me uncomfortable contributing to Wikipedia, I will no longer make contributions or donations to Wikipedia and I will seek legal advice to file cyber harassment charges against you. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Lcnj (talk • contribs) 21:57, 3 November 2006 (UTC)


 * Anger22 and myself are just trying to give advice on the best way to make edits to wikipedia. Ignoring advice from someone like Anger22, who has over 14000 wikipedia edits, is probably not the best thing to do. Wikiepdia is built on consensus and it is the consensus of the group that articles may be written in the style of the place wherein which the subject of the article is located. This is why it is acceptable to write "Black Sabbath 'are' a band" instead of "Black Sabbath 'is' a band". --Mattarata 23:15, 3 November 2006 (UTC)


 * What do you mean? You continue to change user names and continue to engage in a course of conduct that you KNOW is making me ANGRY... and now to add insult to injury you are THREATENING me? WHO do you think you are????? "Ignoring advice from someone like Anger22, who has over 14000 wikipedia edits, is probably not the best thing to do"????? What do you plan on doing to me? Kill me????? STOP harassing me... I do NOT care to hear from you ANYMORE!!!!!... you are a self-described wanker and the promoter of wanker ... Look ate your OWN user page and LEAVE ME ALONE!!!!!!!! —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Lcnj (talk • contribs) 23:35, 3 November 2006  (UTC)


 * Do not re-order my talk page, as it is considered vandalism. Please add your comments at the bottom of an individual section or, when adding a new section, please do so at the bottom of the other sections. Trust me, I will see that you have added a comment no matter where you place it and I will respond in kind. --Mattarata 23:52, 3 November 2006 (UTC)


 * What do you mean by "Trust me, I will see that you have added a comment no matter where you place it"??????... I am keeping accurate record of your course of conduct and, giving you the benefit of the doubt, I just want to make sure this is NOT yet another threat... Lcnj (talk • contribs)


 * I mean that I get a notice when anyone has made a change to my talk page. It pops up in bright yellow headline. This is a built in feature of Wikipedia, it happens for every registered user. So if you or anyone else makes a change of any kind to my talk page, I will be certain to see the change. So again, Trust me. I will see that you have added a comment no matter where you place it on my talk page. Please do not re-order any discussions on my talk page.
 * -Also, there is no need for you to "keep accurate records" of anything. Wikipedia does this for us. Every change, every comment, EVERYTHING is recorded and preserved in the history of the page. I can see exactly what happened on every article going back to the very first article created on Wikipedia and so can you. So please do not think that removing content from your user talk page will wipe out the history of its existence.
 * -And also - I have made no threats against you or anyone. I simply stated that it would be a good idea to listen to the more experienced editors and take their advice rather than blazing your own mis-guided path through Wikipedia.
 * -And also, you are violating 3 revert rule with your edits to Black Sabbath, which is a block able offense. We do not want to have you blocked as you seem to have made some constructive edits are are trying. We just ask that you follow the rules like everyone else. --Mattarata 00:45, 4 November 2006 (UTC)
 * Well... I sincerely thank you for being nice and civil now without the unnecessary overinflated ego that I saw displayed... I am not an unreasonable person.... I just don't take well to any criminal cyber harassment nor antagonistic threats... Everyone's valuable time should be focused on contributing much needed content based om our life expereince not make good contributors feel unwelcome... Peace... and ahve a nice day!... Let us start a new page...

Calling me a nazi...
I find that comment fairly offencive. I'd like to remind you there is a policy against personal attacks.

I'm trying to make sure Wikipedia doesnt get harassed by unnecessary lawsuits here. Enough lawsuits could, in-fact, destroy the project. That's not just speculation, thats a fact. Companies have been destroyed over copyright lawsuits. ---J.S (t|c) 00:26, 12 November 2006 (UTC)
 * "piece of valuable information removed from Wikipedia by the Copyright Nazis"
 * I'm frankly not sure how else I should take that other then you calling me a Nazi. You even linked the words to the article on Nazis.  Whatever.  It doesn't matter. ---J.S (t|c) 07:44, 13 November 2006 (UTC)

For your reading...
 * Fair Use (Copyright Act of 1976, 17 U.S.C. § 107)


 * Notwithstanding the provisions of sections 106 and 106A, the fair use of a copyrighted work, including such use by reproduction in copies or phonorecords or by any other means specified by that section, for purposes such as criticism, comment, news reporting, teaching (including multiple copies for classroom use), scholarship, or research, is not an infringement of copyright. In determining whether the use made of a work in any particular case is a fair use the factors to be considered shall include—


 * 1. the purpose and character of the use, including whether such use is of a commercial nature or is for nonprofit educational purposes;
 * 2. the nature of the copyrighted work;
 * 3. the amount and substantiality of the portion used in relation to the copyrighted work as a whole; and
 * 4. the effect of the use upon the potential market for or value of the copyrighted work.

Citation for Omaha Beach, German Strength
So nothing else needs citation but mine because i did it from my school huh? I learned the damn thing in my Wars class and It pissed me off to know it keeps getting effing deleted. want a damn citation? look here http://www.britannica.com/dday/article-236190 - last effing paragraph ''' "The German 352nd Division lost 20 percent of its strength, with 1,200 casualties, but it had no reserves coming to continue the fight."''' --Thursdae 02:30, 1 December 2006 (UTC)

Citation for Omaha Beach, German Strength 2
Sorry there was no other place I could find it but an official Encyclopedia site. --Thursdae 05:16, 1 December 2006 (UTC)

Black T-Shirts
Yes, I provided a reason in the tag. original research. Unless some reputable source has written about this, it is not encyclopedia material. Jefferson Anderson 17:34, 5 December 2006 (UTC)

Digg
take your own advice, Mattarata, and read Talk:Digg. i present cogent arguments. i defend my actions. why dont u? are your positions so weak, sock puppet? 72.36.251.234 01:06, 19 December 2006 (UTC)


 * do i have to force the issue contenuously to get u to respond to points??? 72.36.251.234 17:50, 20 December 2006 (UTC)


 * Forcing the issue gets you nowhere on wikipedia. Making cohesive arguments and limiting disruption go a long way to getting others to agree with you. Many people have pointed out to you the difference between blogs and other sources.
 * I made some points, you made some points. I am not going to continue to argue when i have nothing new to say. Others will surely take my place.
 * --Mattarata 19:27, 20 December 2006 (UTC)


 * u think u can call my argument uncohesive and that make it so. no need to make argument when u just decree. u good at that - at no make argument - at just decree. u think wikipedia for wikiality dont u? 72.36.251.234 21:34, 20 December 2006 (UTC)


 * I think "u" need to type out the word "you" if you want me to take you seriously. And unfortunately for you, consensus is how wikipedia operates. Until at which time there is community consensus to change :) --Mattarata 22:49, 20 December 2006 (UTC)