User talk:McGuire at Snyderlab

Your username
Welcome to Wikipedia. I saw that you edited or created Michael P. Snyder, and I noticed that your username, "Snyderlab", may not comply with our username policy. Please note that you may not use a username that represents the name of a company, group, organization, product, service, or website. Examples of usernames that are not allowed include "XYZ Company", "MyWidgetsUSA.com", and "Foobar Museum of Art". However, you are permitted to use a username that contains such a name if it identifies you individually, such as "Sara Smith at XYZ Company", "Mark at WidgetsUSA", or "FoobarFan87".

Please also note that Wikipedia does not allow accounts to be shared by multiple people and that you may not advocate for or promote any company, group, organization, product, service, or website, regardless of your username. Please also read our paid editing policy and our conflict of interest guideline. If you are a single individual and are willing to contribute to Wikipedia in an unbiased manner, please request a change of username by completing the form at Special:GlobalRenameRequest, choosing a username that complies with our username policy. If you believe that your username does not violate our policy, please leave a note here explaining why. Thank you. Blablubbs | talk 22:08, 5 February 2021 (UTC)

Thank you Blablubbs! I definitely want to follow the wikipedia rules. Please change my name to 'mcguire at Snyderlab'. I am also looking at the link you sent 'request to change username' and following the instructions there.

FYI: I'm now slightly obsessed with figuring out how to do this all correctly. I hope to remove the flags on Mike's page by changing the language people previously wrote to make it more neutral. Looking into this next. let me know if you have suggetions.

I am also currently fixing all the errors you kindly shared regarding references on our page. Thanks for your time and attention!. I appreciate your assistance and will ask questions if I need help ensuring all the references, etc, are there and formatted correctly.

Adding in all the references now.
 * Hi Snyderlab, thanks for replying and understanding. I do need to point out (as I have in my edit summary), that you should not be editing the page directly. Instead, please use edit requests, we have a handy wizard at WP:ERW. You also must disclose any financial stake you have in promoting a topic; this includes editing as part of your job – whether directly instructed to do so or not. Not doing so is a violation of our terms of use, and in some cases of applicable law. Please note that Wikipedia is not a vehicle for publicising or promoting anyone or anything; please see our guide for COI editors at WP:PSCOI. IN any case, please do not edit further until you have disclosed your status as a COI editor. Please feel free to ask me any questions you may have; Wikipedia can be a confusing place – I trust you will try to meet our community best practices for editors with close connections to the subjects you're writing about. Thanks and best. Blablubbs | talk 23:39, 5 February 2021 (UTC)

Thank you Blablubbs! I will put my edit requests through the handy wizard you mentioned. We are here at Stanford University School of Medicine trying to improve healthcare related to COVID-19. I am making updates directly for Mike Snyder and I'm doing my best to follow your directions and also keep our page updated - though this is the first time I'm doing this. I have one question. Can you at least return the page to how it was immediately before my edits? I think the deletions you made returned it to how it looked last year. I promise that I will take the time tonight to use the edit request wizard and ensure my credentials as a COI (not sure what that means) editor is transparent and verified. Basically, if you send me a list of what I should do, I will do it tonight! Thank you so much, LM

Blablubbs, thank you for all your helpful and clear directions. I took the time to read them carefully and I think I checked all the boxes, but let me know if I missed anything.

I followed your instructions and requested the new username: 'McGuire at Snyderlab' to replace 'Snyderlab' so my name is more transparent and shows my affiliation. I did not realize that using a research group was not allowed and I apologize for the error as this is my first edit on Wikipedia. I declared on one of the forms that I am not interested promoting anything or anyone and I do not have a financial stake in anything I'm putting on Wikipedia. However, I value your advice and since I know Mike Snyder, I will be making edits on his page from now on using, since this is true and accurate and I have nothing to hide. The only reason I am making the edits to Mike's page is to keep it factual, up-to-date and accurate - since Wikipedia strives to be factual. Currently without my edits, the Mike Snyder page is inaccurate and out of date, so if there is any way you can assist me with restoring the facts on his page, I greatly appreciate it.

Following all of your requests, I requested a new username, I filled out the form stating that I am paid by Stanford University and I will now redo my previous edits using from now on! Let me know if there is anything else you recommend so I can better follow Wikipedia regulations.

Huge thanks for all your help, Cheers, McGuire

Hi Blablubbs | talk, I have posted my edit request in the talk page for Michael P Snyder. Please let me know how it looks to you & if it's okay to publish. I'll put a note on your page. I'm new, but I'd like to get this right sooner rather than later. Thanks for the clear directions, I hope you have seen an improvement! -Mcg

Snyderlab | talk McGuire at Stanford Snyderlab (talk) 06:04, 6 February 2021 (UTC)

referencing
Please read WP:REFB for help with correctly formatting sources, your suggested changes are more likely to be considered if they are well referenced, though huge changes as you are proposing are unlikely. Theroadislong (talk) 12:20, 7 February 2021 (UTC)


 * Thanks Theroadislong, It should be noted that I only attempted to add three words to the article (I have not written any references on Wikipedia in my life), then soon after I add the three words to Stephen P. Snyder's page,  half the article was deleted. If you look at the history of the page, this is very clear. Also, those three words are the only words I have ever tried to post on Wikipedia in my life.  I did not have a username as of last week. Half of the page I was attempting to add three words to has been deleted, including the three words I attempted to add.

Whoever put up the text for this article before, put up extensive references, in fact, the references were longer than the article text above it. Since all the references have been recently deleted, you can only see them if you look at the history of the page. McGuire at Stanford Snyderlab (talk) 22:50, 7 February 2021 (UTC)

Examples of academic biographical articles
See [] for examples of valid articles about Stanford faculty. David notMD (talk) 16:03, 7 February 2021 (UTC)


 * Thank you David notMD,

I looked at the examples of references you shared. The extensive list of references (which I did not write) but were on Michael P. Snyder's article page for the past year until deleted this week are the same type of references I saw in the example you gave and formatted in the same way. I will paste below the extensive references which were deleted as there is no way to look at them now they were deleted.

The Nobel Prize winners you gave me as an example (one of which is sitting right next to me) have similar references to peer-reviewed journals. Let me know if any of the references below are not formatted correctly, and I will then fix the references you specify and post the remaining references which meet your approval.

Sincere Regards, McGuire McGuire at Stanford Snyderlab (talk) 22:58, 7 February 2021 (UTC)


 * Draft:Michael P. Snyder still shows all the journal articles (as Selected publications, not references), so I do not understand why you wrote those were deleted. Anyway, Deleted material can always be recovered. View history (top menu) goes to chronological list of edit changes. "prev" to the left side of any entry shows what was added or deleted. All of the reverences listed below are formated incorrectly, and none of them contribute to Snyder's notability. His name should not be bold anywhere except for the very first mention of it in the Lead. David notMD (talk) 02:30, 8 February 2021 (UTC)
 * If you intend to use any of the journal articles as references, then use https://tools.wmflabs.org/citation-template-filling/cgi-bin/index.cgi Once there, enter the PMID number for an article. That generates a properly formated reference. Insert that into the body of the article bracketed by ref and /ref (each inside <  >). If you are not sure what this looks like, go to any science article that has references, click on edit mode, and see how the reference content is embedded in the text, generating automatically numbered refs in the References section. David notMD (talk) 02:40, 8 February 2021 (UTC)
 * Useful example may be Joshua Lederberg. Some of the refs are to his work, but there are enough about him to confirm notability.


 * Thank you David notMD, I am familiar with references using PMID. This is very helpful!  I will go ahead and use Joshua Lederberg as an example & do my best!  If it's okay, in a couple days I will check back with you (or anyone else available) to get a review.  In the meantime I'll work hard to get the page as improved as possible using the examples you shared with me.

Thanks, McGuire McGuire at Stanford Snyderlab (talk) 19:03, 8 February 2021 (UTC)
 * Note that it is possible to use a ref more than once (as I did with the Beadle ref). First use is given a name, as in ref name=Beadle2019>. Subsequent uses have the ref name=Beadle2019/> with a backslash between the name and the closing bracket. David notMD (talk) 22:54, 8 February 2021 (UTC)

Science background
While I do not currently share a workspace with a Nobel Laurate, I did study under a few at MIT while achieving a PhD, and met more notable scientists while doing a post-doc at Sloan-Kettering and doing research/teaching at what was then named the Cornell University Medical College. My industry career included being first named inventor on more than a dozen patents while working the field of medical nutrition. Started a company, authored three books.... Presently retired. Major hobby is raising every vitamin article at Wikipedia to Good Article status. Six done, seven to go. Collectively, those articles and others I've significantly improved garner more than five million views a year. Trying to help new editors at Teahouse is a minor calling. David notMD (talk) 03:03, 8 February 2021 (UTC).

Honored to have your help. McGuire at Stanford Snyderlab (talk) 19:34, 8 February 2021 (UTC)

Draft review process
Be aware that once a draft is submitted to Articles for Creation, it goes to a backlog of thousands of drafts. The system is not a queue. Reviews can take place within days, weeks, but sadly, several months. After an article is accepted it can be found via a search within Wikipedia, but there is a lag of up to 90 days before it can be found via a search at Google or other search engines. David notMD (talk) 10:19, 8 February 2021 (UTC)
 * I added one ref to document the Beadle award in 2019, and used the same ref for several career accomplishments. David notMD (talk) 10:30, 8 February 2021 (UTC)


 * This is extremely unfortunate as I'm sure that Micheal P. Snyder's Wikipedia page most likely helps facilitate millions of $ in funding to save people's lives, & every day this page is down, many lives will be lost. This lab is funded (just like Wikipedia) through donations - from people who hope to cure horrible diseases. Formatting the language of a page is important, but a small amount of formatting - which is easily and quickly accomplished - is not more important than saving lives.  Since you say you are in the medical field, I'm sure you agree 100%.

If there is anyway for the people who control Wikipedia to undo what they have done - so it doesn't take months to put back, then this would not prevent us from continuing to work on the page and add correctly formatted content - especially since there is quite a lot of content that has not been deleted & even having the minimal amount of information - like even his name - I think should be permitted to be seen on Wikipedia. Putting his name back up on Wikipedia doesn't hurt anyone. Do you agree? McGuire at Stanford Snyderlab (talk) 19:49, 8 February 2021 (UTC)
 * The draft Draft:Michael P. Snyder is in an appalling state, written in a promotional manner with zero reliable independent sources, Wikipedia is not a platform for promoting or helping to fund your organisation/good cause. The draft can be accepted very quickly, once the suitable sources have been provided and the promotional tone removed. Theroadislong (talk) 20:14, 8 February 2021 (UTC)


 * Thank you Theroadislong, I'm very happy to hear that a draft meeting Wikipedia editors' approval could be accepted very quickly. Even though I did not write this article, I will take the time to rewrite it focusing on the two things you & other Wikipedia editors have recommended: 1. Removing the promotional tone 2. giving reliable independent sources.  I'll reach out to you when I think I have something worth reviewing. I may need assistance with what Wikipedia thinks is a reliable source since I see peer-reviewed journal articles being used extensively in the examples given to me as articles with 'reliable sources', which in academia is the most recognized method of verifying someone's work and reputation. I realize now that Wikipedia does not see peer-reviewed references as credible, so I'm trying to determine what kind of sources are credible according to Wikipedia.  I'll read up on this and try to figure it out.

Thanks, McGuire McGuire at Stanford Snyderlab (talk) 21:00, 8 February 2021 (UTC)


 * You stated This is extremely unfortunate as I'm sure that Micheal P. Snyder's Wikipedia page most likely helps facilitate millions of $ in funding to save people's lives, & every day this page is down, many lives will be lost. This lab is funded (just like Wikipedia) through donations - from people who hope to cure horrible diseases. Formatting the language of a page is important, but a small amount of formatting - which is easily and quickly accomplished - is not more important than saving lives. Since you say you are in the medical field, I'm sure you agree 100%.
 * Harsh as this may be to hear, Wikipedia is unconcerned about any benefit to Snyder, the laboratory, or the population from this or any other article. Wikipedia, by which I mean the community of editors who look after it, is concerned solely with the quality of articles. Any human, humanitarian or other world issues aren't its concern, nor in its remit.
 * The draft is highly likely to be accepted because Snyder has inherent notability, but it cannot be accepted in the current state. It requires solid work, coupled with a full understanding if what is and is not acceptable in referencing, in large lists of bibliography (this one is seriously long, and might be condensed with ease, using (eg) WorldCat as a reference for the remainder). Fiddle Timtrent  Faddle Talk to me 09:45, 18 December 2021 (UTC)
 * It also seems that the gap between February and December this year with lack of work on the draft is suggestive of the fact that the extremely unfortunate matter of the article not being present is not a true priority.
 * You say, above, realize now that Wikipedia does not see peer-reviewed references as credible, so I'm trying to determine what kind of sources are credible according to Wikipedia. I'll read up on this and try to figure it out. which is not entirely correct. Reading WP:ACADEME will show you major differences between academe and encyclopaedia. Academic papers form part of an academic's work, so they are a difficult area.
 * Let me try to explain. If they manufactured vacuum cleaners, the cleaners would be their work. A vacuum cleaner could not be a reference for them, simply because it is the product they make. So it is with research, writings, etc. However, a review of their work by others tends to be a review of them and their methods, so is a reference, as is a peer reviewed paper a reference for their work. This is only an area of concern when ity might appear that an article promotes an academic because it appears to be promoting their work rather than reporting in it. You have a tightrope to walk  Fiddle Timtrent  Faddle Talk to me 09:54, 18 December 2021 (UTC)

AfC notification: Draft:Michael P. Snyder has a new comment
 I've left a comment on your Articles for Creation submission, which can be viewed at Draft:Michael P. Snyder. Thanks! Rusalkii (talk) 15:48, 17 December 2021 (UTC)

== Thank you Rusalkii  and Theroadislong for reviewing Michael P. Snyder's page so quickly! ==

I very much appreciate the feedback regarding links to Wikipedia/Amazon & I am going through the document now to remove these links, replace as many as possible with non-Wikipedia/Amazon links!

Cheers, McGuire  Snyderlab | talk McGuire at Stanford Snyderlab (talk)  Dec 17th 1:05PM Pacific Time

Your submission at Articles for creation: Michael P. Snyder (December 17)
 Your recent article submission to Articles for Creation has been reviewed! Unfortunately, it has not been accepted at this time. The reason left by Theroadislong was:

The comment the reviewer left was:

Please check the submission for any additional comments left by the reviewer. You are encouraged to edit the submission to address the issues raised and resubmit when they have been resolved.


 * If you would like to continue working on the submission, go to Draft:Michael P. Snyder and click on the "Edit" tab at the top of the window.
 * If you now believe the draft cannot meet Wikipedia's standards or do not wish to progress it further, you may request deletion. Please go to Draft:Michael P. Snyder, click on the "Edit" tab at the top of the window, add "Db-g7" at the top of the draft text and click the blue "publish changes" button to save this edit.
 * If you do not make any further changes to your draft, in 6 months, it will be considered abandoned and may be deleted.
 * If you need any assistance, or have experienced any untoward behavior associated with this submission, you can ask for help at the [//en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Wikipedia:WikiProject_Articles_for_creation/Help_desk&action=edit&section=new&nosummary=1&preload=Template:AfC_decline/HD_preload&preloadparams%5B%5D=Draft:Michael_P._Snyder Articles for creation help desk], on the [//en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=User_talk:Theroadislong&action=edit&section=new&nosummary=1&preload=Template:AfC_decline/HD_preload&preloadparams%5B%5D=Draft:Michael_P._Snyder reviewer's talk page] or use Wikipedia's real-time chat help from experienced editors.

Theroadislong (talk) 20:07, 17 December 2021 (UTC)

AfC notification: Draft:Michael P. Snyder has a new comment
 I've left a comment on your Articles for Creation submission, which can be viewed at Draft:Michael P. Snyder. Thanks! Fiddle Timtrent Faddle Talk to me 23:36, 17 December 2021 (UTC)

AfC notification: Draft:Michael P. Snyder has a new comment
 I've left a comment on your Articles for Creation submission, which can be viewed at Draft:Michael P. Snyder. Thanks! Fiddle Timtrent Faddle Talk to me 09:36, 18 December 2021 (UTC)

December 2021
Hi McGuire at Snyderlab! I noticed that you recently marked an edit as minor that may not have been. "Minor edit" has a very specific definition on Wikipedia – it refers only to superficial edits that could never be the subject of a dispute, such as typo corrections or reverting obvious vandalism. Any edit that changes the meaning of an article is not a minor edit, even if it only concerns a single word. Please see Help:Minor edit for more information. I know this was in a recent comment, but we try very hard to maintain the same minor flagging standards throughout all our work.  Fiddle Timtrent  Faddle Talk to me 23:45, 24 December 2021 (UTC)

Thank you Fiddle Timtrent  Faddle Talk to me I just read the minor edit information and will remember to follow these directions for all future edits. McGuire at Stanford Snyderlab (talk) Dec 24th 11:06PM Pacific Time (UTC)}}

Snyder
Cut Selected publications to six. Wikipedia is not a CV. David notMD (talk) 12:22, 3 February 2022 (UTC)

If accepted
Be aware that if accepted, you - as a paid editor - will no longer be allowed to edit the article directly. Rather, you will be required to propose changes on the Talk page of the article, so that non-connected editors can decide to implement or not. David notMD (talk) 01:36, 4 February 2022 (UTC)

That's the best news I've heard all year - sounds like a dream come true. SO much looking forward to that day when it's published and I can't make any changes. After this is done, I hope to never have to login to Wikipedia ever again. There are no kind words for me in this realm & it is frustrating to know that the editors 'commenting/talking' to me think I actually wrote the page. I took almost a year break because I'm just perplexed at all the pointed insinuations - whilst realizing that I am the only one here who is 100% transparent and using my real name. I didn't write even one word of the page - as it was already published & new parts given to me. I'm now just trying to figure out how to eliminate the bloat of what was written without deleting facts that experienced Wikipedia editors would want to keep. I hope to make extensive edits & in mid/late February when I'm pulling slightly less multiple all-nighters a week for my job. McGuire at Stanford Snyderlab (talk) 22:55, 5 February 2022 (UTC)McGuire at Snyderlabs

Ref fix, as in fix all refs
I did a lot of ref fixing, but falls on you to do more. In Libraries/Arrays, there are superscripted numbers which I am guessing are intended to be use of existing references. That is wrong. Fix it. Here is a tool: Go to https://citation-template-filling.toolforge.org/cgi-bin/index.cgi?ddb=&type=pubmed_id&id= Once there, enter a PMID number and it generates a reference. For refs with many coauthors, setting display-authors= to 1 is not proper. Use 5 or 6. David notMD (talk) 11:06, 4 February 2022 (UTC)
 * In places, the text identifies the Snyder group as being first for certain scientific achievements. Do the refs specify first, or just that the lab used the method? All claims for first need to be verified.
 * Keep in mind that referencing journal articles for which Snyder was a co-author helps describe his areas of research, but does nothing toward establishing his notability.
 * Proper ref formating for websites includes date of the content (if provided) and the date the website was accessed David notMD (talk) 11:06, 4 February 2022 (UTC)

AfC notification: Draft:Michael P. Snyder has a new comment
 I've left a comment on your Articles for Creation submission, which can be viewed at Draft:Michael P. Snyder. Thanks! Theroadislong (talk) 19:04, 4 February 2022 (UTC)
 * Theroad is an experienced reviewer. Comments valid. Remove all laudatory content. Goal is neutral point of view. There is an extra-high standard for biographies of living people, meaning all content must be verified by references, or else removed. David notMD (talk) 22:38, 4 February 2022 (UTC)

Communicating with other editors
AfC comments are written so that the next reviewer becomes aware of draft shortfalls. Your comments to individuals would have been better placed on those editors' Talk pages. Not a big issue - when a reviewer approves a draft, all of that is removed by the reviewer. Be aware that Theroad thanked me for my comment about the draft being bloated, and would be improved by cutting length by 1/3. David notMD (talk) 11:42, 5 February 2022 (UTC)

Thanks, I did not know that & will remember for future. I also thank you for saying it was bloated and I try to thank every editor here for helping me find any bloat - & especially for them removing any bloat. Grateful to you all. McGuire at Stanford Snyderlab (talk) 23:10, 5 February 2022 (UTC)McGuire at Snyderlab

Time to resubmit
Some ref repair needed, including converting URLs into proper refs, and I again recommend reducing Selected publications to at most ten, but in general, worth resubmitting. Either will be accepted, or a new reviewer will describe what is seen as shortfall(s). Reviewing could happen in days, weeks or months (there is a draft backlog, the system is not a queue). While awaiting review, you can continue to improve the draft. Snyder clearly meets Wikipedia's criteria for academic notability, so I charge you with scanning your draft for promotional, laudatory, 'peacock' wording that might offend a reviewer. David notMD (talk) 10:22, 19 April 2022 (UTC)
 * In the research section, there are superscripted numbers in parens rather than brackets [ ] that are not functional references. Fix before submitting. David notMD (talk) 14:20, 19 April 2022 (UTC)
 * Thanks much! I agree.  I still see some language that can be removed before submitting, so I'm focused on carefully identifying as much as possible this week.  I appreciate any feedback or help removing or replacing badly scripted references throughout as it can sometimes be confusing sorting out a variety of editor reference styles.  I'm doing my best. I have been editing a short, selected list of publications to replace the long list there now. Thank you, McGuire at Stanford Snyderlab (talk) 03:39, 20 April 2022 (UTC)
 * For science journal articles I use https://tools.wmflabs.org/citation-template-filling/cgi-bin/index.cgi All one has to do is enter the PMID number and it generates a ref. David notMD (talk) 12:14, 20 April 2022 (UTC)
 * Thank you! McGuire at Stanford Snyderlab (talk) 21:58, 20 April 2022 (UTC)
 * Thanks for all your helpful edits. I have removed substantial content from this page & not very confident right now about what else to remove or add to make it better.  I will follow your advice and go ahead and submit it now, hoping you're right in that we can continue to improve upon the draft while it is being reviewed.  I hope those reviewing it will let us know specifically what needs to be changed -  instead of just immediately rejecting -  if they have any more issues with the page. McGuire at Stanford Snyderlab (talk) 00:43, 15 May 2022 (UTC)

Your submission at Articles for creation: Michael P. Snyder has been accepted
 Michael P. Snyder, which you submitted to Articles for creation, has been created.

Congratulations, and thank you for helping expand the scope of Wikipedia! We hope you will continue making quality contributions.

The article has been assessed as Start-Class, which is recorded on its talk page. Most new articles start out as Stub-Class or Start-Class and then attain higher grades as they develop over time. You may like to take a look at the grading scheme to see how you can improve the article.

Since you have made at least 10 edits over more than four days, you can now create articles yourself without posting a request. However, you may continue submitting work to Articles for creation if you prefer.

If you have any questions, you are welcome to ask at the  [//en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Wikipedia:WikiProject_Articles_for_creation/Help_desk&action=edit&section=new&nosummary=1&preload=Template:AfC_talk/HD_preload&preloadparams%5B%5D=Michael_P._Snyder help desk] . Once you have made at least 10 edits and had an account for at least four days, you will have the option to create articles yourself without posting a request to Articles for creation.

If you would like to help us improve this process, please consider.

Thanks again, and happy editing! S0091 (talk) 01:29, 15 May 2022 (UTC)