User talk:Merchav1

Welcome!
Hello, Merchav1, and welcome to Wikipedia!&#32;Thank you for your contributions.

I noticed that your first edits indicate that you may have a conflict of interest with regard to some topics. In other words, you may find it difficult to write about that topic in a neutral and objective way, because you are, work for, or represent, the subject of that article.

To reduce the chances of your contributions being undone, you might like to draft your revised article before submission, and then ask me or another editor to proofread it. See our help page on userspace drafts for more details. If the page you created has already been deleted from Wikipedia, but you want to save the content from it to use for that draft, don't hesitate to ask anyone from this list and they will copy it to your user page.

One rule we do have in connection with conflicts of interest is that accounts used by more than one person will unfortunately be blocked from editing. Wikipedia generally does not allow editors to have usernames which imply that the account belongs to a company or corporation. If you have a username like this, you should request a change of username or create a new account. (A name that identifies the user as an individual within a given organization may be OK.)

In addition, if you receive, or expect to receive, compensation for any contribution you make, you must disclose your employer, client, and affiliation to comply with our terms of use and our policy on paid editing.

Here are some pages that you might find helpful:
 * Best practices for editors with close associations
 * Plain and simple conflict of interest guide
 * The five pillars of Wikipedia
 * Contributing to Wikipedia
 * Tutorial
 * How to edit a page and How to develop articles
 * How to create your first article (using the Article Wizard if you wish)
 * Simplified Manual of Style

I hope you enjoy editing here and being a Wikipedian! Please sign your messages on talk pages using four tildes ( ~ ); this will automatically insert your username and the date. If you need help, check out Questions, ask me on my talk page, or ask your question on this page and then place  before the question. Again, welcome! bonadea contributions talk 19:40, 5 November 2020 (UTC)

Your submission at Articles for creation: Tuvia Ruebner (November 10)
 Your recent article submission to Articles for Creation has been reviewed! Unfortunately, it has not been accepted at this time. The reasons left by Mcmatter were:

Please check the submission for any additional comments left by the reviewer. You are encouraged to edit the submission to address the issues raised and resubmit when they have been resolved.


 * If you would like to continue working on the submission, go to Draft:Tuvia Ruebner and click on the "Edit" tab at the top of the window.
 * If you now believe the draft cannot meet Wikipedia's standards or do not wish to progress it further, you may request deletion. Please go to Draft:Tuvia Ruebner, click on the "Edit" tab at the top of the window, add "Db-g7" at the top of the draft text and click the blue "publish changes" button to save this edit.
 * If you do not make any further changes to your draft, in 6 months, it will be considered abandoned and may be deleted.
 * If you need any assistance, or have experienced any untoward behavior associated with this submission, you can ask for help at the [//en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Wikipedia:WikiProject_Articles_for_creation/Help_desk&action=edit&section=new&nosummary=1&preload=Template:Afc_decline/HD_preload&preloadparams%5B%5D=Draft:Tuvia_Ruebner Articles for creation help desk], on the [//en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=User_talk:Mcmatter&action=edit&section=new&nosummary=1&preload=Template:Afc_decline/HD_preload&preloadparams%5B%5D=Draft:Tuvia_Ruebner reviewer's talk page] or use Wikipedia's real-time chat help from experienced editors.

McMatter (talk)/(contrib) 05:07, 10 November 2020 (UTC)

Your request for help with the Ruebner article
You asked for my help getting the article accepted for publication. I read the draft article and the reason for rejection - insufficient external documentation.

The English Wikipedia is much more particular about documentation than is the Hebrew one. You have to footnote pretty much everything - not necessarily every sentence, but every block of related information. Also, you cannot cite Wikipedia, in English, Hebrew, German, or in any other language. Wikipedia does not consider Wikipedia to be a reliable source (?!!!).

Fortunately there are plenty of sources you can cite. There is his obituary in Haaretz (https://www.haaretz.co.il/literature/poetry/1.7584149), There is the Hebrew Lexicon archived at Ohio state university (https://library.osu.edu/projects/hebrew-lexicon/00331.php),there is his bio page at the Israel Prize website (https://cms.education.gov.il/EducationCMS/Units/PrasIsrael/Tashsch/TuviaRibner/CvTuviaRibner.htm) and more.

I would do this work for you, but you know this material much better than I. When you are done footnoting, I will gladly help out with the formatting.

Ruebner is certainly worthy of an article in the English Wikipedia. I am glad you have undertaken this.

Ravpapa (talk) 18:52, 20 December 2020 (UTC)

La ter: do you have a source for his biography other than his autobiography? Ravpapa (talk) 05:18, 22 December 2020 (UTC)

Dear Ravpapa, I am guessing that just editing this 'page' is the right way of responding to you. First and foremost: thank you very much for your generous offer. I shall pursue this adventure as far as I can, and hope that I may then come back to you with the rest. In reply to your 'later' question: well yes - I have also relied on the 'chronology' created by R T. Back in her 2014 book: In the Illuminated Dark (see my references list). I know that Ruebner worked with Back on this book when he was still able to do so. Therefore, I consider her Chronology the best source I can have. Other sources I checked seem to be consistent with the one offered by Back (and Ruebner himself). As for the mentioning of two other Wikipedias: can I just check this with you: It seem to me that I have not really based my text on a Wikipedia source. I simply mentioned the other two Wikipedia versions about Ruebner just as evidence of the wide range of interest in his works. Is this not right? Perhaps I should make my intention clearer? It will be good to hear from you, Merchav1 (talk) 14:37, 22 December 2020 (UTC)


 * Don't try to cite other Wikipedias under any circumstances. It sets off all kinds of alarms for Wikipedia editors.


 * I have started editing the article as it is. I took some stuff out that didn't seem intensely important. You can add it back in after the article is accepted if you think it is really important.


 * I found a source that said that Ruebner would compose poems in his head while shepherding at the Kibbutz during the day, then write them down in the evening. Do you have a quote of him telling this from his autobiography? It would be really appropriate, also to include in the citations a reference to his autobiography.

Ravpapa (talk) 16:22, 22 December 2020 (UTC)


 * Okay I have gone through the article, reformated, and taken out anything that other editors might consider editorial. You can resubmit it for publication, I think it will fly now. Ravpapa (talk) 15:15, 25 December 2020 (UTC)
 * Later: article published! see Tuvya Ruebner Ravpapa (talk) 16:04, 25 December 2020 (UTC)

Hello Ravpapa, Thank you for positioning this article in a way that it can be "published". It must have taken quite a lot of work on your part, which is highly appreciated. As noted before, I would not know exactly what that status of being "published" mean in this context (of Wikipedia). For example, I noticed that you took out the whole section of 'Critical Acclaim'. Actually, since we have corresponded last, I prepared a much fuller text for that section. I presented (and of course, cited in detail) the works of highly respected Israeli scholars who have published essays and one additional book about Ruebner's poems. I thought that was needed in order to fully establish Ruebner's "notability", is it not? Also, as so much has been written about Ruebner's poetry, I will not be at all surprised if many in Israel's literary community feel totally puzzled by that omission. So: in principle - what is to happen to that section now? Can it still be added? I have to admit to having other questions too, but these can wait until I hear from you again. Again, thank you very much for your intervention and I am looking forward to hearing your view about the above.

Sincerely Merchav1 (talk) 18:42, 26 December 2020 (UTC)


 * You can certainly add things if you want. As far as notability is concerned, there is no longer any question about that, indeed, there never was, since the stub article was already published. I personally don't think that extensive analyses of his writing is proper for an entry in a general encyclopedia, but it is up to you. Just be careful that you don't appear to be partisan or in any way expressing your own opinion. What would be a valuable addition in my mind was some explanation of the impact Ruebner has had on Israeli poetry, literature and language in general.


 * Remember that the Wikipedia is usually the first source people turn to, not the last. If readers want much deeper insights, they can go to the references, the See Also sections, and the external links.


 * I would suggest you also look at the articles on some of the other Israeli poets to see what an appropriate amount of critical comment would be relevant: Nathan Zach, Yehuda Amichai, Uri Zvi Greenberg.


 * In any case, the article is now yours to edit. Ravpapa (talk) 07:42, 29 December 2020 (UTC)

References at Tuvya Ruebner
Please read Help:Referencing for beginners and correctly format the references you added at Tuvya Ruebner - Thank you - Arjayay (talk) 12:52, 1 January 2021 (UTC)

Dear Ravpapa, Thank you for shaping up the Tuvya Ruebner article. As you can see, I have added the Critical Acclaim section, which includes a few more references. Thank you for beginning to link the citing digit in that text to the references. However, I think there is a little problem with one citing in that section (Critical Acclaim),line 3: Your link suggests to me that the issue cited is based on what appears in Back 2014 book ('Illuminated Dark'), while I think it is based on text in the introduction to Back's 2020 Book ('Now at the Threshold'). If so, should not this citing be number 7 (not 5)? If so, the reference to Bram's book (Ambassadors of Death) should be no. 8? I do not dare trying to make these changes myself as doing so needs technical knowledge I do not have. I may even damage the good work you have done if I try to do that. So - would it be possible for you to complete the linking of the remaining unlinked citings to the references list? I would greatly appreciate this.

Sincerely, Merchav1 (talk) 17:28, 2 January 2021 (UTC)


 * Dear Merchav. I am trying to finish up the cleanup of your article, and am encountering difficulties:


 * "Back’s 2014 translations of Ruebner's poems (5) are introduced by a number of aspects that she considers characteristic of Ruebner’s writing: ‘What Language’, ‘An Evolving Poetics’, ‘Ekphrasis’, ‘The Political’, and ‘Wonder’." This sentence makes no sense to me. What are you trying to say>


 * Your note to change footnote 7 to footnote 8: I don't understand this. Do you mean that the quote is from Back and not from Shahar?


 * Your citation from Katz and Bram adds nothing new (this is an editorial issue, not one of understanding). You have already said that Ruebner's poetry deals with Jewish historical identity and events of Eastern Europe. Why is it necessary to repeat this?

Merchav, we are always happy to help out new writers at Wikipedia, and make them feel welcome. But if you plan to write additional articles here, you must learn the rudiments of editing. In particular, you need to learn to use the "Cite" button to add citations. It isn't complicated, and will make everyone's life a lot easier. Ravpapa (talk) 17:45, 9 January 2021 (UTC)

Concern regarding Draft:Tuvia Ruebner
Hello, Merchav1. This is a bot-delivered message letting you know that Draft:Tuvia Ruebner, a page you created, has not been edited in at least 5 months. Draft space is not an indefinite storage location for content that is not appropriate for article space.

If your submission is not edited soon, it could be nominated for deletion under CSD G13. If you would like to attempt to save it, you will need to improve it. You may request userfication of the content if it meets requirements.

If the deletion has already occured, instructions on how you may be able to retrieve it are available here.

Thank you for your submission to Wikipedia. FireflyBot (talk) 16:01, 27 May 2021 (UTC)