User talk:Metzenberg

User talk:Metzenberg/archive1

FAC
Hi Metzenberg. I am sorry to see that you are feeling very disillusioned with the FAC process. It is not unusual for an editor's first FAC nomination to be a little rough - the criteria are fairly subjective, and those who have not spent much time at FAC may not realize how best to interpret them. I understand that you are very proud of the work you have done on this article (and you certainly deserve to be!). Please understand as well that at FAC reviewers are supposed to highlight the areas of the article they believe are problematic, and not the areas they believe are excellent. The goal of the process is to reach an article that a larger consensus believes is excellent. I've seen articles be presented at FAC five and six times before they were finally promoted, and the nominators readily admitted at the end that the article was much improved from the initial version that the nominator had thought was perfect. I am going to archive this FAC for you for now; I encourage you to take some time to look at the comments objectively and see if there are any that would improve the article. I hope that you will eventually decide to return to FAC - we can very definitely use more science-oriented editors. Karanacs (talk) 21:24, 30 May 2009 (UTC)


 * Karen, Wikipedia does a terrible job of weeding out trolls among its editors. Eubulides clearly had no intention or interest of approving of this article as a featured article candidate. I'm not going to waste my time with what are not good faith editors. I"m not going to use my time providing entertainment or therapy for some kid. Wikipedia needs to attract more editors with advanced professional and technical skills for articles on subjects such as Tay-Sachs disease. Most editors who can write such articles don't want to waste time dealing with such troll-like behavior. Metzenberg (talk) 09:53, 2 June 2009 (UTC)


 * If I may offer an opinion, it looks like you've taken the right step for now in taking a break. I see that multiple editors have put forward patient advice in good faith, but sometimes the best advice is just to walk away for a bit. I assure you Eubulides is not a troll and I don't think you'll find you get very far in a collaborative community with comments of that nature. -- Laser brain  (talk)  15:12, 2 June 2009 (UTC)

Some thoughts, as a Karanacs talk page stalker: I haven't read your article, but I recognize your frustration. Wikipedia has its trade-offs where the completely awesome is countered with the completely frustrating. For instance, if you published a paper in a journal or textbook chapter summarizing the same information as a Wikipedia article, you get paid, your name on it, and something to put on your resume. But your readership is limited. Whereas here, your readership can be in the hundreds of thousands or millions, but you remain anonymous and broke.

The collaborative nature of Wikipedia is one of these awesome/frustrating things. There will be articles that may never stop being battlegrounds for people to try to insert information to match an agenda. Kind of like economics is the ultimate feedback on the usefulness of a widget, articles are constantly checked by readers and people on the talk page. The element of awesome here is that folks who aren't recognized as experts get a hand in helping to shape what information is in the article, but that's also the element of frustration. I may have read everything there has ever been published on a topic, making me an armchair expert on it, but I will never be able to use my name alone as the final word on any matter on Wikipedia. No matter how many FAs I write, or how many times I say I wrote this article and read all the sources and have this degree, if I can't provide evidence in the writing, it does me or the article no good. (See also Essjay controversy on why trusting people who declare themselves experts is not a tactic widely used anymore on Wikipedia.) The beauty of that is that sources are expected to do the job of someone's reputation. But for professional academics, that's a jarring disparity.

FACs are inherently stressful for nominators who have spent weeks or months writing an article. When I nominate an article for FA, I clear my schedule for the next 2 weeks at least, and make sure nothing is going to be needed of me for long periods of time, because I may be spending the time answering someone on the FAC nomination, re-reading or re-writing portions of the article I've nominated. One of those trade-offs at FAC is being able to reconcile people's objections. It is very difficult to separate my self from my article, and I don't think I was able to do so until after the 5th or 6th article I wrote was promoted to FA. It's still hard to do. I think I saw somewhere Karanacs or someone else also note another trade-off: you don't have to meet all the objections in a nomination, but the article may not be promoted. Very few readers know what featured articles are. They just read whatever they click on, so only in the back room of the Wikipedia community do people recognize the FA star.

Although Eubulides is a well-known member of the community, that gives him a little bit more leeway than an unknown neophyte making comments in an FAC, but you are more than welcome to explain on the FAC page why you think someone's suggestions are ill-advised. Base it on your knowledge of the article content and sourcing, and do not include any commentary on the motivations of other editors, however. From this, several things could happen: it may be promoted if other editors support the article and your arguments seem to make sense. It may be archived and you leave it alone. It may be archived and what has happened to me, after I have cycled through my righteous indignation of being challenged in such a sophomoric manner, I end up making a few of the challenger's changes anyway after I let the article sit for a spell and I calm down. I can't say what's most appropriate for this article and per your wishes, I have no science background and would muck things up anyway.

Wikipedia is a very different forum from academia, and some of the things academics gets used to are absent here, although both have the same issues at heart. Going about them in separate ways makes those who work in both venues like straddling two different cultures. --Moni3 (talk) 14:19, 4 June 2009 (UTC)

TSD
You seem to have reverted without discussion all of the changes to Tay-Sachs disease. This page contains many images that added little or nothing to the page. It is also not organized per wiki Manuel of Style. As such will nominate for a reassessment.-- Doc James (talk · contribs · email) 23:42, 5 July 2009 (UTC)

File permission problem with File:Decorative foil.jpg
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Unreferenced BLPs
Hello Metzenberg! Thank you for your contributions. I am a bot alerting you that 2 of the articles that you created  are tagged as Unreferenced Biographies of Living Persons. The biographies of living persons policy requires that all personal or potentially controversial information be sourced. In addition, to ensure verifiability, all biographies should be based on reliable sources. If you were to bring these articles up to standards, it would greatly help us with the current Category:All_unreferenced_BLPs article backlog. Once the articles are adequately referenced, please remove the unreferencedBLP tag. Here is the list:

Thanks!--DASHBot (talk) 10:41, 25 January 2010 (UTC)
 * 1) Tom Rosenstiel -
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Nomination of Larry Yudelson for deletion
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ArbCom elections are now open!
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Nomination of Avi Shafran for deletion
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Nomination of Ashkenazi Jewish intelligence for deletion
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Nomination of Hazon for deletion
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Nomination of Ashkenazi Jewish intelligence for deletion
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Proposed deletion of File:Ashk sephard couple.jpg


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