User talk:Mike Eder

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The First Edition
I haven't had a chance to read through the whole article, but what I looked at was a definite improvement. Sorry if it seemed like I was coming down hard on you. I screwed up by not checking the edit history of the IP address. I didn't realize you'd only been around a couple days. The article still needs sources though, so I'm going to add that tag again. Adding a note saying that the info is verified in his book isn't good enough for citing sources. --Onorem 13:03, 20 October 2006 (UTC)

This editor probably hasn't only been here a few days. Very similar edits to the article have been made for many months. It would be a major conisdence to find two Kenny Rogers fans who edit articles from the view point that the first editions records are far superior to his solo efforts and seems adimant that he "aged quickly" and also leave the same edit summaries that say "I worked hard on this, no one else touch it" or words to that effect.

Rogers looks went up and down all the time (at one time he even dyed his hair grey). This is more than evident from album covers and other photos in the 70s and 80s that show Rogers black hair comes back through at some points. 64.12.116.12 23:56, 20 October 2006 (UTC)

He died his hair grey? Please! Look at pictures from 71-79 and you see it changing. My point is that it accelerated right after the group broke up. He was in debt, his dad died, his careeer wasn't happening it simply aged him quickly. I also belong to a First Edition fan club and we all have been on here. Yes he did dye it back at times but by 1980 it was almost all grey. I also explain why the change in appearence is important. BTW if you had bothered to read it, I took out my POV yesterday once I learned more about the policies here. Someone on here has been nice enough to help me. I Now I already said I was sorry for my anger but revearting it back to a peice full of misinformation instead of helping me make mine more complient isn't the way to do it Many music critics and fans enjoy his First Edition stuff why would that shock you. Sales don't always equate to quality.

Stop assuming. The First Edition are actually my favorite group along with The Beatles, however, I also enjoy Rogers solo efforts as much. Unless you can prove he dyed his hair back to black then you can not add it, as I read articles at that time he was dying it grey, but I can find no source for this, therefore I am not saying that and just leaving both claims out. I have seen plenty of pictures of Kenny from 71-79 (that's you assuming again that I hadn't). The first slight sign Kenny had grey hair at all he about 40 and it is certainly not unusal for men in their 40s to have a little grey hair, I know many men in their late 30s with some grey hair and they are all doing fine in their work. So far all you have show is speculation about Rogers ageing with no sources. If you can find a reliable source then you can add it, otherwise the claim stays out.

Furthermore, when did I even mention record sales, I didn't, you're the one that mentioned them just now. You say you belong to a fan club, then that shouldn't be too hard to prove then if need be (though I doubt it will even come to that). For your information, many crictics and fans also enjoy Rogers solo efforts, it's all personal opnion and that has no place in Wikipedia articles, hence I haven't put my own views in and just deleted yours. 205.188.117.68 14:40, 21 October 2006 (UTC)

Also, reverting opnions is the way to do it here. You don't leave them in, they get taken out. 205.188.117.68 14:41, 21 October 2006 (UTC)

UTC Again please reread I took out all opinion when I said I did. Never talked about hair dye ever in the article. I am just speaking of how his retooled image helped him get across to fans that may have been put off by his long hair earing etc. I feel his middle aged look was appealing to his new fans and it perhaps would not have gone done as well within the groups fan base. I don't know if you were the one who said something about liking later thing

I never said you didn't take it out but you were (rather wrongly) making assumptions about my own opnions (which i never ever placed in the article). Futhermore the point about him looking aged may have helped him get across to older fans is speculation and isn't really needed to be mentioned. It could be argued the biggest asset was the music and the production. Younger fans also bought his records and went to his concerts and were not put off by his aged looks, so i have my doubts if he had looked a little younger older fans would have been put off (It could easily be argued had he been younger he may have done better at RCA when he was making more pop/soul albums, but again this would be mere speculation and not really needed) Rogers himself was growing older and I have seen nothing too out of the oridinary about him ageing.

I am sorry if I assumed anything. Music is important but so is marketing. I am a media writer and I have reasearched on image and success. Kenny himself has said that when he stopped trying to be younger then his age he found his career back on track. In other words he reinvented himself to appeal to a different audience. Sure he still had fans of all ages but in 1977 being a middle aged rock star wasn't as accepted as today. The loyality of country fans was what made him decide to try it out. I think this is in the A&E doc on him or the CMT one. Have you read Kenny's "Making It With Music" its a great book on the industry where he goes into the importance of changing his image in quite a bit of detail. Though there it is about how he grew his beard to become a part of the First Edition. You mentioned liking the Beatles and needless to say how they looked was a large part of their appeal. Does an aging image mean as much to someone like Neil Diamond? No but Kenny's grey beard became a trademark so I feel it is important nnough to comment on it. One last thing I think that Kenny's solo career on RCA declined because of the music more then the image. I know it has it merits but after the first album I think most people would find there to be less originality then his work in the 60's, 70's or early 80's. I hope there are no hard feelings, I tend to get a little sensitive about what I write so again I hope you forgive any assumptions I made. Take care and I am enjoying debating this with you I like to challenge myself and you are helping me do that.

No hard feelings at all. Yes, I agree with what you say about marketing, however I still think that the looks of Kenny Rogers or the Beatles played a lesser role in their careers than the music itself. I have to say I do not agree with what you said about his RCA material. I actually preferred 1984's "What About Me?" to "Eyes That See In The Dark" (a great album anyway) and really enjoyed all the other albums Kenny made for the label and always felt they should have done better. I also think that "They Don't Make Them Like They Used Too" was one of his better efforts and will always regard that as one of my favorite albums. I enjoy debating with you too, I hold no hard feelings towards anyone with a differing opnion to mine on music. 205.188.117.68 14:56, 24 October 2006 (UTC)

I will have to listen closer to the RCA ones again. I do like the I Perfer The Moonlight song. I also like the Rest Of Last Night which was the B side of What About Me. I do like some of his solo stuff quite a bit but I am admittedly more of a fan of 60's music in general then 80's. What are some of your favorites and least favorites of Kenny's LP's and or the First Edition. My favorite First Edition is Monumental because I like the hard edge of it, and my favorite Kenny solo is Gideon because it tells a good story. Least favorite First Edition is Rollin soundtrack because I have heard so many better songs from the show and least favorite Kenny solo Somehing Inside So Strong because only a few of the songs really stand up (I like Planet Texas a lot) to Kenny's past.

Well, to answer your questions above my favorite first edition albums are Monumental and Something's Burning. I also think their debut album and "ruby" are classics too. My fave solo albums by Kenny are "Daytime Friends," "The Gambler," "Kenny," "Love Will Turn You Around" and "They Don't Make Them Like They Used Too." I also love his new one, "Water and Bridges" and think it ties with "I Prefer The Moonlight" as his best album since "They Don't Make Them...".The songs on that album (Water and Bridges) are great, Kenny said Country music has to do one or all of three things - make you think, cry or laugh and he sure succeeds with that on Water & Bridges. I'm suprised the new single "The Last Ten Years (Superman) hasn't raced up the charts like "IO can't Unlove You" did. I find that strange. I actually liked the "Something Inside So Strong" album myself, i remember when it came out (it made the top 10 of the country music charts in Britain) and I listened to it over and over again (on cassette). My least fave album by Kenny? that would be tough, as I wouldn't ever say he's made what I call a terrible album. I guess tho, out of his whole carrer, it would be "Rollin", even though most of the songs work, but you're right, it could have been so much better! 74.65.39.59 00:26, 27 October 2006 (UTC)

Some very good choices there. I am a big vinyl collector and have been able to find all of his albums up to Timepiece on record. The new one is good but a lot of Country vinyl 45's are still made. Maybe if Capitol had put them out they could have gotten about another 50,000 in sales. You know what I did find recently was his rap version of the Gambler on a 12 inch club single. It's with Coolio and titled "The Hustler" It's actually good and the intro uses a techno re-recording of the Calico Silver theme. I like that (Calico) album a lot, I also really enjoy Kenny's first two solo albums, and Share Your Love. One last question did you ever hear the Bobby Doyle album? Track it down if you haven't because it's really good.

Citing Reliable Sources
I'm by no means an expert on citing sources, so I'll refer you to Citing sources and Reliable sources. I guess it would be better if each section had its own reference with page numbers from the book if possible, and then the book should be added at the bottom similar to this: Books
 * Lincoln, Abraham; Grant, U. S.; & Davis, Jefferson (1861). Resolving Family Differences Peacefully (3rd ed.). Gettysburg: Printing Press. ISBN 0-12-345678-9.

I can tell you that your personal experiences in knowing some of the band won't qualify as a reliable source. Those experiences would fall under primary sources, which can only be used if they have been published by a reliable publisher.

I'll try to see if I can find some more specific examples. --Onorem 13:32, 20 October 2006 (UTC)

Thanks I will try to add my soruces though much does come from personal coraspondance video docmentaries etc.

Jimi hendrix article
I think adding Ike & Tina to the list of associated acts is not a good idea as there is only an dubious (though frequently repeated) reference to this by Hendrix who was playing behind Little Richard who shared some concerts with Ike & Tina at the time, if he did actually play as part of their group it was very short lived as he was still with Richard shortly after this supposed defection, which has incidentaly been denied by Tina Turner. Hendrix usually talked in an ambiguous style as if he had played in backing groups for stars when he was only part of a support act for the tour, not actually playing in the particular headliners group.Jameselmo (talk) 23:31, 23 February 2008 (UTC)

Ike said he fired Jimi after a short time in his book.