User talk:Nposs/Music 250/Hmong music EDIT

Suggested reading
Here are some articles to get you started. The Catlin articles will be most helpful. Your task is complicated by the diasporic nature of the Hmong community. Catlin has done most of her research in the US, although she infers her findings to the Hmong of Southeast Asia. Kohl has done work in Thailand and China, and Hong has done work in Vietnam (although the quality is not very good). You may also use my masters thesis (from which the in class reading on Hmong music was taken). It's available online here.

Thao, Hồng (Author), and Phong Thuyết (Trans.) Nguyễn. 1995. "Hmong music in Vietnam." NhẤc Việt: The journal of Vietnamese music 4, no. 2: 5.

Catlin, Amy (Author). 1992. "Homo cantens: Why Hmong sing during interactive courtship rituals." Selected reports in ethnomusicology 9, 43.

Schwörer-Kohl, Gretel (Author). 1991. "Mouth organ and drum: The symbols of death among the Hmong in northern Thailand."

Catlin, Amy (Author). 1997. "Puzzling the text: Thought-songs, secret languages, and archaic tones in Hmong music." The world of music: Journal of the Department of Ethnomusicology, Otto-Friedrich University of Bamberg 39, no. 2: 69.

Schwörer-Kohl, Gretel (Author). 1995. "The functions of the music in a shamanistic session among Miao from Yunnan."

Koskoff, Ellen (Ed.). 2001. The Garland encyclopedia of world music. III: The United States and Canada. New York: General Music Publishing Co. (NY) New York, NY, 2001.

Catlin, Amy (Author). 1986. "The Hmong and their music: A critique of pure speech." 1986. --Nposs (talk) 19:01, 7 October 2009 (UTC)

History

 * The Hmongs are still unclear of their past and lack informational links to find them. History was passed orally from Grandfather to son, father to son, etc.  There have been many claims, and stories trying to resolve this matter.  In the Hmong folktales which were orally passed down from generation to generation, there were talks of Hmong having their own emperor of China.  It was believed that the Hmongs first lived in China before the Chinese.  At the time, it was not called China, but was called after the Hmong emperor's name.  Then one day, the Chinese started to appear.  They traveled to the Hmong kingdom from the direction of the Pacific Ocean.  The Chinese migrated in, and started to work in the fields, and intermarried with he Hmongs.  When the population of the Chinese surpassed the Hmong, the Chinese began to take over.  Centuries of wars between the Hmong and Chinese to take over the kingdom.  With no fortune, a Hmong man was bribed to killed the Hmong Emperor, and he was successful at doing so too.  Since then, the Hmongs were persecuted, and forced out by the new emperor, a Chinese emperor. During this persecution, the Hmongs lost all their written records, and written languages.  If was said that the Chinese burned all the records and books.  Anyone who had knowledge of writing or reading, was killed.  It was believed that the last person to have a record book, swallowed his copy, right before the Imperial Chinese soldier killed him.  Hmongs have learned to preserve their writings in the "paj ntaub" or the "Pha Dau".  The Pha Dau were symbols and writings which was stitched into embroideries.  Today, the Pha Dau's are just a mere design for costumes, and decoration of for the New Year celebrations.  The Hmong elders who could actually read the embroideries have all passed away.

Reference: http://www.geocities.com/tokyo/dojo/3610/hmong_history.htm Ppb13 (talk) 02:36, 14 October 2009 (UTC)

Instruments part of the project?

 * Kahle, i was talking to the teacher at class yesterday and he was saying that one of us should do the qeej(geng) and the other person do the fipple flute and the jews harp since theres more on the qeej. I was thinking since you already worked on the qeej, i should do the other ones? we can also figure out something else to write about too so we can make more contributions ?  —Preceding unsigned comment added by S.gilly (talk • contribs) 17:33, 15 October 2009 (UTC)

Splitting up all the Instruments

 * I was thinking about how we should split up the instruments and i wanted to see what you thought about me doing the (Raj)'s, (jaw harp, ncas), (leaves (nplooj)), AND You You(Kahle) doing the (qeej) and the  (xim xaus, a two-stringed spike). Also, I was wondering if you had any ideas about what else we could write about or any other instruments you found.?

S.gilly (talk) 22:22, 6 November 2009 (UTC)

Kahle
I guess this is the only way to get ahold of you.lol, i dont know your email. Hopefully you see this by monday but how do you want to do this? If you send me yours in microsoft word in an email and i send you mine we can possibly go from there and figure out how we can split this stuff up. My email is Gilliland.100@buckeyemail.osu.edu —Preceding unsigned comment added by S.gilly (talk • contribs) 16:27, 16 November 2009 (UTC)

Draft reivew
There is a lot of good information in the article, but it is very disorganized. First of all, this article does not need much detail about Hmong history. That belongs on the Hmong people page. You may discuss details of culture and history when it is relevant to your points about music, but there is also a Hmong customs and culture article that contains most of that detail. I think it is not clear what Ashah3 and Ppb13 have divided up to do, so please take some time to figure it out.

In regards to the instrument section, I think Kahle32 and S.gilly need to discuss the overall structure of the section. Who is responsible for what instruments? The section should begin with a general overview of Hmong instruments and then have subsections about each one.

It appears that Dodley.8 is doing vocal music and that section needs to be better organized and more fully detailed. Is anyone doing Hmong music in America?

So, your priority as a group is to come up with a clear outline of the article. (At the bottom of the Music 250 wikipedia page there are links to some good articles to use as examples.) Then reorganize your content within that. The following also need to be done.
 * Remove your signatures from the article itself. (You only need to sign your comments on talk pages).
 * Wikify the text (that is, put in appropriate links to other wikipedia articles. See WP:LINK for details)
 * Put in references. WP:CITE has general information about how to do it. Here http://toolserver.org/~magnus/makeref.php is a link to an online reference template generator. Enter the details of the reference and it will output the correct wikicode to paste into the article.
 * External links? Images? See WP:FIT.

You can add your comments to this section to discuss how to improve the article. Nposs (talk) 15:31, 13 November 2009 (UTC)

INTRODUCTION TO ARTICLE
I just added a small introduction to the article. Let me know if it's okay or if you guys want it removed or if you want to add to it. I just thought it would be a good addition to our article so just let me know. Thanks guys!--Dodley.8 (talk) 01:43, 16 November 2009 (UTC)