User talk:NupurPathak

Welcome!

Hello, NupurPathak, and welcome to Wikipedia! Thank you for your contributions. I hope you like the place and decide to stay. Here are some pages that you might find helpful: I hope you enjoy editing here and being a Wikipedian! Please sign your messages on discussion pages using four tildes ( ~ ); this will automatically insert your username and the date. If you need help, check out Questions, ask me on my talk page, or ask your question on this page and then place  before the question. Again, welcome! --Edcolins (talk) 18:42, 20 April 2010 (UTC)
 * The five pillars of Wikipedia
 * Tutorial
 * How to edit a page and How to develop articles
 * How to create your first article (using the Article Wizard if you wish)
 * Manual of Style

Naming
We generally redirect brand names to generic names. Best Doc James  (talk · contribs · email) 10:01, 5 February 2015 (UTC)

COI warning
Hello, NupurPathak. We welcome your contributions to Wikipedia, but if you are affiliated with some of the people, places or things you have written about on Wikipedia, you may have a conflict of interest or close connection to the subject.

All editors are required to comply with Wikipedia's neutral point of view content policy. People who are very close to a subject often have a distorted view of it, which may cause them to inadvertently edit in ways that make the article either too flattering or too disparaging. People with a close connection to a subject are not absolutely prohibited from editing about that subject, but they need to be especially careful about ensuring their edits are verified by reliable sources and writing with as little bias as possible.

If you are very close to a subject, here are some ways you can reduce the risk of problems:


 * Avoid or exercise great caution when editing or creating articles related to you, your organization, or its competitors, as well as projects and products they are involved with.
 * Avoid linking to the Wikipedia article or website of your organization in other articles (see Spam).
 * Exercise great caution so that you do not accidentally breach Wikipedia's content policies.

Please familiarize yourself with relevant content policies and guidelines, especially those pertaining to neutral point of view, verifiability of information, and autobiographies. Note that Wikipedia's terms of use require disclosure of your employer, client, and affiliation with respect to any contribution for which you receive, or expect to receive, compensation.

For information on how to contribute to Wikipedia when you have a conflict of interest, please see our frequently asked questions for organizations. Thank you.

Based on this edit note, it appears that you have a relationship with Dr Reddy. That, along with your pattern of editing, and the nature of your edits and talk discussions, make it appear likely that you are a paid editor. Please disclose whether or not you are being paid to edit Wikipedia, especially with regard to Mintop Solution. Please see the instructions above, about the obligation to disclose paid editing. Thanks. Jytdog (talk)
 * And do carefully read WP:COI, and see especially the bottom two links there, which are here and here. Jytdog (talk) 11:33, 5 February 2015 (UTC)

Hi Jytdog (talk)

I have added the COI note on my user page.

Please allow me to publish my Wiki article on Mintop Solution. NupurPathak (talk) 09:04, 23 February 2015 (UTC)
 * well done on the paid editing disclosure. Thanks for that. Jytdog (talk) 09:31, 23 February 2015 (UTC)

Thank you Jytdog (talk)

Can I please take my page live now?


 * oy. so first, what i had written to you on Doc James' talk page, was that you should deal with the paid editing disclosure before doing anything else.  glad you have done that.  second, it is not "your" page; that is a weird thing to write.   finally, i looked at the article in its last form and i don't think it should exist either.  It almost entirely duplicates the content of the already-existing Minoxidil article. we don't allow duplicate articles that way, see here.  if you want a separate article on Mintop it needs to be about that brand (not the medicine), and it will have to pass the WP:NOTABILITY requirements, or it will be speedy deleted for being unambiguous promotion - see here.  That would be your challenge - can you write an article about Mintop, the brand, not the drug, using enough independent, reliable sources to show it is NOTABLE? Jytdog (talk) 09:52, 23 February 2015 (UTC)

Hi Jytdog (talk)

Thanks for responding. As I said, I am new to Wiki so not sure of the accepted language. I apologize if I offended you by calling it my article. Since I am a writer I tend to refer to all my work like that.

I think I understand what you're saying here. But it would be great if you could point me towards Wiki pages that are about drugs and adhere to the guidelines you've mentioned here. That will really help me.

regards, NupurPathak (talk) 04:33, 24 February 2015 (UTC)


 * i wasn't offended. calling it "my article" is just the wrong assumption to have, and carrying it around will lead to problems with WP:OWN down the road.  About brands, :there are very few.  look at the wikilinks off this page: List of paracetamol brand names.  There is only one of those that should have a wikipedia article, and that is Tylenol, and that is for reasons I am sure that its manufacturer doesn't like.  But those events are why it is notable enough for its own article. Jytdog (talk) 11:24, 24 February 2015 (UTC)


 * To find examples, you can look through articles linked under pharma companies here: Category:Brands_by_company. You will find that for almost every drug brand listed there, the article is actually titled under the generic drug name, and is about the active ingredient, not the brand.  i will be interested to see any branded-article-name articles that you find!  Please do link them here.  Thanks. Jytdog (talk) 11:42, 24 February 2015 (UTC)

Thanks Jytdog (talk)......some names I found were Tylenol, Benadryl, Saridon. The content is quite promotional here if you see. NupurPathak (talk) 17:57, 24 February 2015 (UTC)
 * yep. tylenol would survive a deletion effort because the tainted tylenol incidents were definitely notable.  not especially happy for J&J. i am confident that the other two would not survive a deletion discussion and am going to nominate them for deletion.   So as I mentioned, your challenge is, can you write an article about Mintop, the brand, not the drug, using enough independent, reliable sources to show it is WP:NOTABLE? Jytdog (talk) 18:54, 24 February 2015 (UTC)

Ok Jytdog (talk) I get you now. The re-write is not a problem. I just need to look for notable references about the drug specifically. NupurPathak (talk) 04:24, 25 February 2015 (UTC)


 * This is the notability guidance for products: Notability (organizations and companies) (inaptly named I know). Recommend you read it to see what the bar is that you need to cross. Jytdog (talk) 13:06, 25 February 2015 (UTC)

Hi Jytdog (talk) Hope you remember me! I now have a revised version of this page. The company has redone the page to make it about the drug specifically without promoting it. There are also several notable references. Where can I upload the new content so that you can look at it and approve it for going live? NupurPathak (talk) 05:47, 17 April 2015 (UTC)


 * i just created a sandox in your "user space" - here: User:NupurPathak/Sandbox. you can paste it there for review.  btw, a link to this ~should~ appear in the menu items of the upper right corner of every page you are on, for me, it appears between Talk and Preferences. Jytdog (talk) 05:51, 17 April 2015 (UTC)

Thanks Hi Jytdog (talk)! I just submitted the draft for review. Please let me know your comments. Also, I have an image of the product, for which I mailed the copyright approval to Wiki months ago. Can I use that image without fear of deletion? NupurPathak (talk) 10:49, 25 April 2015 (UTC)
 * where is the draft article? Jytdog (talk) 12:23, 25 April 2015 (UTC)

Your submission at Articles for creation: Sandbox (April 25)
 Your recent article submission to Articles for Creation has been reviewed! Unfortunately, it has not been accepted at this time. The reason left by Joseph2302 was:

Please check the submission for any additional comments left by the reviewer. You are encouraged to edit the submission to address the issues raised and resubmit when they have been resolved.


 * If you would like to continue working on the submission, go to User:NupurPathak/Sandbox and click on the "Edit" tab at the top of the window.
 * If you need any assistance, you can ask for help at the [//en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Wikipedia:WikiProject_Articles_for_creation/Help_desk&action=edit&section=new&nosummary=1&preload=Template:Afc_decline/HD_preload&preloadparams%5B%5D=User:NupurPathak/Sandbox Articles for creation help desk] or on the [//en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=User_talk:Joseph2302&action=edit&section=new&nosummary=1&preload=Template:Afc_decline/HD_preload&preloadparams%5B%5D=User:NupurPathak/Sandbox reviewer's talk page].
 * You can also get real-time chat help from experienced editors.

Joseph2302 (talk) 14:08, 25 April 2015 (UTC)

Hi Jytdog (talk)! I posted the content on the same link you shared. Do I need to submit it again? NupurPathak (talk) 17:46, 25 April 2015 (UTC)
 * there is nothing there. Jytdog (talk) 17:54, 25 April 2015 (UTC)
 * now it is there. it is basically a copy of the Minoxidil article with some bits about your product.  please see my note to you above about what an article about a specific brand needs to have - it needs to be about the brand not the drug. the drug is already covered.  if you try to submit this it will be rejected, and if you move it to mainspace it will be speedy deleted for being a duplicate of an existing article. Jytdog (talk) 17:57, 25 April 2015 (UTC)

Hi Jytdog (talk)........ The main compound in the drug is Minoxidil. It is just Minoxidil mixed with alcohol. It is not possible to talk about the drug without talking about its main compound(s). I have ensured that the content is different from the Minoxidil page, but basic facts cannot be changed. I can't say the Sun is cold in one article if another article says it's hot. Minoxidil is the ONLY compound in Mintop, so the side effects and other features will overlap. Otherwise the content is different.

How else can I talk about the drug without talking about the specifics of its compound? Any drugs with the only/main compound as Acetaminophen will have some overlap.

I can understand some level of policing of content by Wiki, but this is closer to bullying. NupurPathak (talk) 18:09, 25 April 2015 (UTC)
 * and with that, i am done trying to help you. you are free to do whatever you want - i am telling you what will happen if you try to take that article live.   if you want the article to stick, it needs to be about the brand, not the drug. really -  see our discussion above. Jytdog (talk) 18:18, 25 April 2015 (UTC)

Hi Jytdog (talk).....And now you're threatening me. So how is this not bullying by Wiki admins? It seems that Wiki has different rules for different contributors. I have not seen anything fair about this whole dealing. It could be that it's an Indian company.

I have asked for samples repeatedly but have not recd any clear direction their either. I requested a sample of pages where a particular drug and related compound both have pages, but I was only given generic answers. I have searched Wiki repeatedly but found no such pages. Some US based brands have been allowed even though they violate guidelines. How is this fair? I have read the content again and again, and all I can see is the drug being talked about. It follows the same format as all other drug pages on Wiki, and talks about the main compounds as well as specific details about the drug. I can make it more about the drug but then I know Wiki will pull it out for being promotional and biased. So I'm stuck either way.

I have repeatedy informed you that I am not getting paid for this and am doing this as a favor for a friend who works with the manufacturer. But to be able to declare COI they had to empanel me. So I cannot explain more on how I don't have any vested interests here. I will not take the page live because I don't want the manufacturer's name getting maligned. But this whole experience has been tormenting and frustrating.
 * i am not an admin, and i never said i was. i am sorry you thought i was.  i am not bullying you.  telling you that you are driving off a cliff, does not mean i put the cliff there nor that i am driving the car.  i gave you examples above.  i explained that articles that duplicate other articles get deleted.  i don't know what more to say.  if you cannot make an article about the brand because there are not enough sources about it, that means the article cannot exist in WP.  that is not my fault either.  i understand that this may be frustrating for you, but that is not my fault either.   Jytdog (talk) 00:43, 28 April 2015 (UTC)

Your email
Sorry, I had no time to reply to your email yet. Can you summarize the issue, maybe? Thanks. --Edcolins (talk) 19:31, 27 April 2015 (UTC)


 * HI Edcolins (talk)
 * I have been temporarily assigned to creating a page for a pharma manufacturer. The page is currently in my sandbox - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User:NupurPathak/sandbox. This page has been under review for several months and was pulled down for multiple reasons. The first reason was that the images I'd used came under the copyright scanner, but that was resolved. The next time it was pulled down for possible COI, for which I made the declaration on my User page. It was then pulled down again because the content is similar to another page on Wiki - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Minoxidil. My talk page has the complete interaction between a Wiki editor and myself.


 * Please note that this is not a complaint against the Wiki editor. I have no issues with him/her. I just have been trying to make a simple point that the drug I want to write about has only one compound/chemical in an alcoholic base. There's no way I can talk about side effects etc. without there being at least some overlap with the existing page about the generic compound. I've spoken directly about the drug and its manufacturer, but when it gets into the specific medical lingo, the overlap happens.


 * Please advise as to how I can handle this. I understand Wiki has its guidelines and I do want to abide by them. But I also want to publish a page about this drug. Please guide me.


 * NupurPathak (talk) 01:51, 3 May 2015 (UTC)
 * Why not improving the article Minoxidil, instead of creating a new one about a specific brand? There is a section called "Trade names" in the article, where the individual brands could be discussed, including their geographical availabilities, owners, and any differences between them (if any). I doubt that the brand "Mintop" is notable on its own. See also WP:PRODUCT and Requests for comment. --Edcolins (talk) 13:23, 3 May 2015 (UTC)

HI Edcolins (talk)

I checked with the company and they are not keen on that option. So I've proceeded with the alternative suggested by the other Wiki editor. I've made the page purely and directly about the product itself and inserted only product specific references.

Pls see my sandbox -https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User:NupurPathak/sandbox and give me your comments. Let me know please if it can now be published. NupurPathak (talk) 14:43, 8 June 2015 (UTC)
 * that article is about the drug, not the brand. It will be speedy-delete-able per A10. You may want to see this AfD about a similar article that we just got rid of. Jytdog (talk) 15:21, 8 June 2015 (UTC)

Hi Jytdog (talk) Mintop Solution is the brand. The latest page in my sandbox is only about the branded drug, and the brand is "Mintop Solution". The drug is Minoxidil........the brand is Mintop. Not sure how I can make this clearer. NupurPathak (talk) 15:24, 8 June 2015 (UTC)
 * Crystal clear, but I see no chance to have an article on the branded drug in addition to one on the drug itself, I am afraid. Moreover, you wrote: "I checked with the company and they are not keen on that option". Your conflict of interest seems to run very deep. See WP:COI: "Do not edit Wikipedia in your own interests or in the interests of your external relationships." You should exercise your own judgement rather than following the directions of the company for which you are editing. --Edcolins (talk) 18:26, 8 June 2015 (UTC)
 * I just trimmed content about the drug in this dif. There is not much left. Jytdog (talk) 20:09, 8 June 2015 (UTC)

HI Edcolins (talk)

I understand what you're saying. When I said they are not keen, the reason is because inserting a small paragraph into the existing Minoxidil page won't give enough information about the drug itself. Not sure if it is possible to insert any more than a 50 words in the existing article. Please advise on a workaround.

Hi Jytdog (talk)

Thanks for looking at the content again. I can see that a sizable chunk of the content is gone. Could you help me publish/take live your current version of the article? This way I can show the company what Wiki will allow.

NupurPathak (talk) 04:22, 9 June 2015 (UTC)
 * the stub would immediately be deleted for lacking WP:NOTABILITY. Wikipedia doesn't exist so your employer can be pleased.  I am not responding to this anymore. Jytdog (talk) 04:50, 9 June 2015 (UTC)