User talk:Onward&Upward

John Laurence
Are you John Laurence? Mztourist (talk) 03:26, 31 January 2018 (UTC)

You need to provide WP:RS for all changes you make. Mztourist (talk) 08:21, 1 February 2018 (UTC)


 * I don't really care what relationship you claim with John Laurence, you need to provide reliable sources (WP:RS) for every change that you make here on Wikipedia. Here on Wikipedia it is called the Battle of A Sau, not the Battle of A Shau. There is no attempt by me to "disparage his work and good character", rather I have taken the time to write this page based on his book, you are the one who is showing "personal bias" in making changes that are not supported by WP:RS or which you otherwise don't like, such as deleting the reference to marijuana use at Frankie's House. Mztourist (talk) 11:25, 21 February 2018 (UTC)

With all due respect, your knowledge of the history of the Vietnam War is seriously limited if you choose to use a revised place name (A Sau) because "Here on Wikipedia it is called the Battle of A Sau..." Frankly, it is not, except as a page heading. Every reputable book on the history of the Vietnam War refers to the place as "A Shau" because that is what it was called during the war. It is also widely referred to as "A Shau" on Wikipedia. To change that place name to A Sau in your post about John Laurence because that is how the Vietnamese spell it is like referring to the World War II evacuation of soldiers of the British and French armies from Dunkirk as "Dunkerque" because the French called it that. Moreover, it would not be accurate, despite your stated reference from Tomlinson's book on the aftermath of the battle, to call the reaction to the report on LTC House's interview as "outrage." That may have been true in some quarters of the Marine Corps in Washington, but not in the general public. As for marijuana use at Frankie's House, the objection is that you use the description "large quantities of marijuana" when that much use of the weed was not the case. So much of the history of the Vietnam War has undergone revision over the past 50 years (much of it questionable), that you would be able to find a book to suit any preconception you had about what actually happened. Onward&#38;Upward (talk) 12:00, 21 February 2018 (UTC)
 * I can assure you that I know more about the Vietnam War than you do as my contributions here on Wikipedia attest. The Wikipedia page is Battle of A Sau and that is what I have used, we prefer to use native place names rather than whatever the Americans called it during the war. In relation to marijuana use I suggest you reread pages 295-314 of The Cat from Hue, particularly page 304 where they describe a rug as having "enough grass ...to get all of MACV stoned for a week" and page 103 of Page after Page where he described Laurence as a "head" and the "sandalwood box...donated by Jack, made a fragrant stash for the best of Delta-grown green herb... There were always ten ready rolls therein and a clean sifted heap of fresh herb..." So stop trying to sanitise the marijuana use ok?! Mztourist (talk) 13:46, 21 February 2018 (UTC)
 * Your most recent edits to John Laurence show that you don't know how properly reference things here on Wikipedia and are approaching vandalism. If you want to improve the page why don't you reference properly (as I have shown in fixing your cites of Perry Deane Young and Tim Page) and try to add other reliably sourced information (such as his birth date) instead or arguing over who lived at Frankie's House? I'm getting tired of reverting your wrong-headed edits and if this continues I will take steps to have you blocked. Mztourist (talk) 12:55, 24 February 2018 (UTC)

Mztourist, an amateur military historian who has been active on Wikipedia since 2010, recently (Jan 2018) created a new page biography on Wikipedia of John Laurence, the former television correspondent for CBS News, ABC News, PBS and several publications including Esquire Magazine, the New York Times, the Columbia Journalism Review and others. Mr. Laurence has long been regarded by most of his colleagues as "the best television correspondent of the Vietnam War."[1] His coverage of the war received every award for broadcast journalism, and also the George Polk Memorial Award (1970) of the Overseas Press Club of America for "best reporting in any medium requiring exceptional courage and enterprise abroad."[2] Mztourist based the bulk of his information on references from Laurence's prize-winning memoir of the Vietnam War, "The Cat from Hue: a Vietnam War Story" (2002) which is 864 pages in length. From that comprehensive history of Mr. Laurence's reporting of the war, Mztourist chose only two anecdotes (out of scores covered in the book) to include on the new page: a report on the killing of allied soldiers by U.S. Marines during a battle in the A Shau Valley (1966) and the recreational use of marijuana by Mr. Laurence and a few of his young colleagues in Saigon (1965-66). Mztourist characterized the report on the killings as having caused "outrage" when it was broadcast without specifying that the only outrage was in hierarchy of the U.S. military, and the Saigon social gatherings as having consumed "large quantities of marijuana" to give the impression that Mr. Laurence was a drug addict, which he was not. Both references seem to me to be an attempt to denigrate the reputation of Mr. Laurence, who is still alive, and, by extention, his book. Every major U.S. newspaper that reviewed the book gave it highly favorable marks.[3] Attempts to edit out those Mztourist references have met with anger and hostility on his talk page, and continued accusations of my alleged attempts to "sanitise" the history. Mztourist uses references whose emphasis on "outrage" and marijuana use are, in my opinion, open to debate. Nowhere in his book does Mr. Laurence use the terms "outrage" to apply to the reaction to the allies being killed story, or "large quantities of marijuana" being consumed in Saigon. In his choice of language and editing, Mztourist appears to be an apologist for the U.S. military--a pro-military writer and interpreter of military events. While I have been reading Wikileaks since 2008, and have been a generous contributor to its funding, I am new to editing at this level. I am trying to learn the intricacies of referencing and editing correctly and in doing so have made many mistakes. It is not easy to learn. To these, Mztourist has responded with impolite criticism, sarcasm and insults. It has become now what might be considered an "edit war." I wish to end it. I have been adding, bit by bit, more relevant information about Mr. Laurence to the new page in an effort to provide a better history of his professional life. But Mztourist has been hostile to much of this. He acts like a tyrant, with no sympathy for a newcomer to editing on Wikipedia or another point of view about Mr. Laurence's reporting of the Vietnam War. Onward&#38;Upward (talk) 11:35, 26 February 2018 (UTC)

AN/I
There is currently a discussion regarding you and the page John Laurence on the Administrators' Noticeboard here:. Mztourist (talk) 08:57, 27 February 2018 (UTC)
 * This is related.— Vchimpanzee  •  talk  •  contributions  •  22:47, 7 March 2018 (UTC)

Managing a conflict of interest
Hello, Onward&#38;Upward. We welcome your contributions, but if you have an external relationship with the people, places or things you have written about in the article John Laurence, you may have a conflict of interest (COI). Editors with a COI may be unduly influenced by their connection to the topic. See the conflict of interest guideline and FAQ for organizations for more information. We ask that you:


 * avoid editing or creating articles about yourself, your family, friends, company, organization or competitors;
 * propose changes on the talk pages of affected articles (see the request edit template);
 * disclose your COI when discussing affected articles (see WP:DISCLOSE);
 * avoid linking to your organization's website in other articles (see WP:SPAM);
 * do your best to comply with Wikipedia's content policies.

In addition, you must disclose your employer, client, and affiliation with respect to any contribution for which you receive, or expect to receive, compensation (see WP:PAID).

Also please note that editing for the purpose of advertising, publicising, or promoting anyone or anything is not permitted. Thank you. S warm  ♠  12:43, 10 March 2018 (UTC)
 * It's clear that your apparent connection to the article's subject makes it impossible for you to constructively contribute to the article. Please feel free to make edit requests, discuss on the talk page, seek dispute resolution, or even report problems to administrators, but you should not be unilaterally deciding what the article should say since you have a personal, non-neutral point of view. This is your final warning: if you edit that article again, you will be blocked from editing. S warm   ♠  12:48, 10 March 2018 (UTC)

SPI
There is currently a discussion regarding you and the page John Laurence on the Sockpuppet investigations board here: Sockpuppet investigations/Onward&Upward Mztourist (talk) 10:32, 21 March 2018 (UTC)