User talk:PBS/Archive 16

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Battle of Berlin
My intend was simply to use the correct dash. I have no strong opinion regarding the name of the article. MisterBee1966 (talk) 18:43, 11 January 2013 (UTC)
 * Okay, understood MisterBee1966 (talk) 18:45, 11 January 2013 (UTC)

ArbCom request
Hello PBS, Happy New Year. I've mentioned you in an ArbCom case request submission. While you are not a party, your comments would be appreciated. LittleBen (talk) 12:37, 13 January 2013 (UTC)


 * I'm thinking that the community has not been able to settle the two issues here, so it surely would be appropriate to take them to Arbcom. May I coordinate a submission with you off Wiki (my email is open)? The submission could be in my name (though I'd certainly appreciate if you would kindly look my ideas over), or it could be a joint submission (two or more people). Also please see this. LittleBen (talk) 13:50, 2 March 2013 (UTC)

Your comment
See my reply Phillip. I am suspicious of your sudden interest in this dispute. You must realise it will have no bearing on the outcome of the consus of the title change. I am entitled to state my opinion on your attiutde on this article if I choose to do so. I have not received an adequate response to your resistance to the the operational commanders being added, other than, I presume, it was me that added it. I have only edited this article several times over the past few years, but you - and you alone - have contested every single change to the content. Why? It is quite acceptable to complain that these unreasonable complaints slow down its progression. Editors like me like to get on with things. Under the circumstances I'm justified in saying what I said - which is an observation, not an attack. Dapi89 (talk) 10:25, 17 January 2013 (UTC)

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Clan Gregor mercat cross image
I see you restored the original pic of the mercat cross on this page after I'd replaced it with a pic of the post-1617 location. Thanks for spotting that error. Kim Traynor (talk) 15:37, 22 January 2013 (UTC)

response to warning
PBS, I've responded to your "tagging redirects as orphans" message on my own talk page, FYI. Cheers. --Lockley (talk) 18:40, 22 January 2013 (UTC)
 * PBS, you probably should take a look at this . I hope I'm wrong, but it looks like someone's up to no good. EEng (talk) 20:13, 24 January 2013 (UTC)
 * Hi PBS. You'll find I've responded to you on my own talk page.  Please have a look when you can.  Now that I'm here, I find that EEng has accused Binko71100 of being a sockpuppet, and cites Binko's conversations with me.  I have a desire to stay out of that dispute & I expect Binko can speak for himself.  Thanks for your attention.  --Lockley (talk) 21:22, 24 January 2013 (UTC)

Reichstag (building) RM
You previously participated in a RM discussion regarding the Reichstag (building) article. I have proposed another move of the article at Talk:Reichstag (building) if you care to participate in the new discussion. —  AjaxSmack  19:40, 26 January 2013 (UTC)

Stop gaming the system
Please revert yourself on the naming conventions.

You're an admin, really? And you don't know any better than to game the system during a discussion? — kwami (talk) 10:02, 31 January 2013 (UTC)

WP:AN3
Hi, I'm on my phone and for some reason it won't let me edit AN3. I was actually saying the request should've been at RFPP - not 3RR or EW - because it was a page protection request. And I know that you know there's no right version, but your request did happen to coincide with the aeticle being in your preferred state ;-) As I say, I didn't even see the AN3 request before I protected so that's moot. FWIW, having now read the "discussion" you were in the right, so for once an admin might've actually protected a page in The Right Version! Black Kite (talk) 13:59, 31 January 2013 (UTC)

Talkback
Frungi (talk) 23:43, 31 January 2013 (UTC)

Disambiguation link notification for February 10
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DNB page numbers with wstitle?
Hi. The page number is absolutely necessary when linking to a source that contains the entire document in a single file. However, It is not generally needed when linking to a transcribed article at Wikisource, since the articles are generally quite short. I think that it's a judgement call. The WS article has the page number for the original article together with a link to the correct page of the scanned source, so there is no loss of provenance. I'm interested in your thought on this, and I will preserve the page numbers if you still think they add value in this context. -Arch dude (talk) 00:40, 11 February 2013 (UTC)

As a separate issue, the DNBIE template is broken. It appends "(DNB00)" to the wstitle, but the DNBIE articles at WS (if any) use a different suffix. Therefore, you should not use the "wstitle=" to reference articles in the Epitiome. continue to use the "title=" instead. In the mean time I will go do some research on the status of the Epitome at WS. -Arch dude (talk) 00:59, 11 February 2013 (UTC)

If you wish to add the DNBIE to WS, then great, but the template is still broken. The pattern is: so DNBIE should append (DNBIE). This assumes you intend to implement a seperate article for each epitome entry. I haven't thought about that project so I have no opinion. The problem in in Cite DNBIE.-Arch dude (talk) 01:34, 11 February 2013 (UTC)
 * DNB appends (DNB00)
 * DNBSupp appends (DNB01)
 * DNB12 appends (DNB12)

More unrelated-item mass-move RMs
RM LittleBen (talk) 16:10, 12 February 2013 (UTC)

Proposed appeal of topic ban
Mentioned here and here. LittleBen (talk) 09:07, 15 February 2013 (UTC)

Where's SAWme?
It has gotten busy in computerland. I'll help when I can. Charge ahead!SAWme (talk) 10:46, 17 February 2013 (UTC)
 * Please go aheadSAWme (talk) 10:52, 21 February 2013 (UTC)

John Le Marchant
I have modified "general" to "commander" and supplied a reference. I have added a reference for "chopping wood". Many of Le Marchant's military writings were published anonymously, as is mentioned in the text, purely because they became official army regulations, but it is known that he wrote them. All new arms, of necessity, are first produced as prototypes. Le Marchant's sabre was merely lengthened by an inch at the behest of the generals overseeing the re-arming the cavalry, but it remained his design - it was adopted as the 1796 pattern light cavalry sword, of which I own two examples. Urselius (talk) 19:51, 22 February 2013 (UTC)

User talk:Märt Põder
I think the user might have a point -- editing as an IP and then creating an account and using that to continue an edit war isn't sockpuppetry. We encourage people to create accounts; we do not say "create accounts unless you're in the middle of an argument". Perhaps an edit warring 24-hr block would be more appropriate? --jpgordon:==( o ) 19:30, 23 February 2013 (UTC)

Hi
In what Wikipedia talk page can I report your maddening witch-hunt against me? I have been contributing dozens of times almost daily since 2005 and am a registered user since 2007, never did I vandalize a page nor tried to negatively affect Wikipedia, so I demand respect from you. I hope you'll be as fast replying to my question as you were fast blocking me for some obscure reason. Answer in my talk page. Good day.  T i b u l l u s  call me |undefined 14:59, 25 February 2013 (UTC)


 * You can take it to WP:ANI if you wish, but consider, if having read the guidance about cut and past moves if your complaint is warranted. -- PBS (talk) 15:06, 25 February 2013 (UTC)


 * Stop behaving like a cyberbully, and go block anonymous and registered users who keep vandalizing pages. You don't seem to be doing a very good job at that, since I keep reverting their editings. You don't respect who believes in this project and is trying to do their best to keep Wikipedia update, clean, unbiased and safe.  T i b u l l u s  call me |undefined 15:23, 25 February 2013 (UTC)

Disambiguation link notification for February 28
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Spelling: Theatre District, New York
The move discussion at Talk:Theater District, New York was closed without alerting editors at the relevant Wikiprojects to join in. It has long been the consensus at WP:THEATRE and WP:MUSICALS to spell the word "theatre", in part because theatre professionals prefer this spelling throughout the English-speaking world, and because this spelling is not wrong anywhere, while "theater" is wrong in many places,such as the UK. BTW, I am an American from New York City. Note that nearly all of the Broadway theatres are called "X Theatre". I have re-opened the discussion on the talk page to see if we can get a wider consensus on this issue. Thanks! -- Ssilvers (talk) 04:18, 5 March 2013 (UTC)

Bangladeshi war/genocide/atrocities/war crimes/deaths?
Pbs, A user just mentioned in a talk page discussion that the original title of a current article was 1971 Bangladesh genocide, which he had recently reverted back to the 2005 name. As I was looking through history, you seemed to pop up at the point the name changed and I further noticed you went through several versions. I don't know about how you feel about this now or even if you remember that article, but we're having a convo there about this name. Since you're behind this diff and several others afterwards where the name came up as an issue, I was wondering if you could give us some insight. I don't mean to canvas here -- even if you just want to comment is fine. My intention is merely to get the thinking from an earlier point of time. Crtew (talk) 17:22, 7 March 2013 (UTC)

Attempt to bully out Fyunck
here. LittleBen (talk) 05:42, 9 March 2013 (UTC)

Talk page etiquette
I'm not going to engage in an edit war over this, but I had already replied directly to DS's response to my original post. Your insertion of your subsequent response between those two comments, as noted, interrupts the flow and sense. Elbowing aside someone else's comment in that fashion, so that your later comment in effect gains priority over the first chronological response to anyone reading down the page comes across as somewhat arrogant and rude. You may not have been responding directly to me, but we are all discussing common ground there, and I happened to be the first to respond. Can anyone else – myself included even – now insert their own comment in between yours & DS's, and hence above yours in turn, if they happen to think their response to DS is more important that both mine and yours and if they simply say, "But I'm responding to DS, not to PBS"? That's a recipe for totally chaotic and unreadable discussion, and talk page guidelines and custom are pretty clear on it. I'm also assuming you'd rather someone didn't bump down your response in a similar fashion.  N-HH   talk / edits  14:39, 9 March 2013 (UTC)

WP:CITE
Please stop reverting. There are lots of objections on talk, and your proposed changes would introduce mistakes. SlimVirgin (talk) 18:04, 9 March 2013 (UTC)
 * I am not making changes. I am reverting to the last stable version 06:06, 10 February 2013‎ by Themeparkgc. But reverting my revert you are reintroducing changes made by WhatamIdoing at 05:24, 15 February 2013‎ diff, while change is being discussed on the talk page. -- PBS (talk) 18:09, 9 March 2013 (UTC)


 * No one on the talk page supports your edit, whether you call it an old one or a new one. The problem at that page is that you seem unfamiliar with standard ways of referencing. I'm sorry to say this to you. It is causing you to mix up several different concepts, but rather than listen to what others have to say, you revert (sometimes for weeks or months) and keep on arguing. For example, you don't add page numbers to a bibliography or references section, for obvious reasons, namely that one book might have been cited many times, with different page numbers each time; page numbers therefore belong in the text, in the form of a footnote or Harvard ref. And short cites are not used together with general references; that's not what is meant by a "general reference" on Wikipedia. A general reference is one that is, by definition, not connected to a citation in the text.


 * I wish you would take a step back. SlimVirgin (talk) 18:30, 9 March 2013 (UTC)


 * Please keep the discussion here. Are you seriously saying that the References section should contain a list of full citations that read like the following? Smith, John. Name of Book. CUP, 2013, pp. 1, 2, 3, 5, 8, 9, 13, 16, 22, 25, 40, 43, 56, 64, 78, 79, 89, 91, 110, 150, 170, 180–182, etc?


 * If you look at the discussion about the general references, that started on 30 December 2012 because you objected to a basic copy edit to remove a contradiction. It is now March 9, 2013, and there's no let up, when the only issue is that you haven't understood one point, namely that a section containing "general references" is not the same as one containing full citations linked to (or in some other associated with) short cites in the text. That is, a "general reference" is not the same thing as a "full citation." They might be listed under the same title ("References"), but they are different concepts, with different uses. A general reference is what you use when you copy the old Encyclopaedia Britannica articles, and at the end there is a general reference that says something like "this article incorporates text from X." We call it a general reference, because it is not linked to or associated with any specific point in the article, and doesn't accompany a separate Notes or Footnotes section. Really, no article on WP should be using general references, unless it's a stub. Ideally (in my view), WP:CITE wouldn't even mention them, because all they do is cause confusion.


 * At least three editors have objected to your version, but still you revert, and expect people to continue discussing. That's the kind of thing the RfC addressed. SlimVirgin (talk) 20:02, 9 March 2013 (UTC)

London Millennium Funicular
I got intrigued by this while stub-sorting yesterday - not least by the lack of any really reliable-looking sources! Wondered at first if it was a hoax. Found a couple of refs, and today the City Surveyor's report where it's called "Millennium Inclinator". What would you think about moving it to that title? Could have just done so, but it seemed better to check first as you created it so recently (and there's obviously been some sort of a tiff about it already, from deleted edits). Still seems strange not to have found much in the way of reliable sources - I'd have thought there'd be something in wheelchair guides to London, etc, but not yet found. Nor anything about the grand reopening - perhaps it was done rather quietly out of embarrassment at the waste of money? Pam D  11:04, 7 April 2013 (UTC)

Refactoring
Would you be interested in a clean start at improving the refactoring page? Things got regretfully sidetracked and I'd be willing to work with you to find a comprobable solution. Mkdw talk 01:36, 12 April 2013 (UTC)

Disambiguation link notification for April 20
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 * Principality of Samos (check to confirm | fix with Dab solver)
 * added links pointing to Mithradates, Cyrene, Aegean, Theodorus, Aristonicus and Peloponnesians

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More bullying by the ultra-nationalists
here. LittleBen (talk) 08:31, 21 April 2013 (UTC)
 * Arbcom has concluded that the claim of outing was bogus. Obviously it was just to keep me blocked and prevent me from defending myself at ANI. Konjakupoet has outed himself with links to his own previous user identity in the ANI discussion.
 * As you can see from the cautions on his talk page: since returning to Wikipedia, Konjakupoet has continued the same pattern of repeated vicious attacks on other users that he showed under his previous user ID.
 * It's pretty obvious that the attacks on my repeated advocating of following Wikipedia rules on properly researching and neutrally sourcing BLP names and place names here and here were the result of off-wiki canvassing and mob organizing that is acknowledged here.
 * I have lots of other facts organized into a case, and would be glad to get your off-wiki input on how to proceed (but my sending of email from WP seems to be disabled at this end). LittleBen (talk) 21:54, 23 April 2013 (UTC)
 * I work very hard to be nice, and to give other people the benefit of the doubt. But, at some point, circumstances sometimes force me to come out of my geek hole and document the lunacy. It doesn't matter how talented a person may be if they cannot learn to play fairly: if they will not stop trying to control and manipulate—or stop their relentless score keeping, score settling, and organizing of private armies. WP should not be like that, WP should be a friendly community.
 * I'm a professional (tech.) writer, but no human being is perfectly objective. I always welcome constructive feedback, particularly from somebody like you. Sincere and very best wishes. LittleBen (talk) 03:08, 24 April 2013 (UTC)

Disambiguation link notification for May 3
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Good Arguments
The quality of your arguments has improved,, regardless of my thoughts on the subject, I think you are doing a much better job of presenting your thoughts and arguing your position, then in years past. Jeepday (talk) 22:51, 3 May 2013 (UTC)

Westwood House
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Americana Encyclopedia
Great work on the Americana links! (I think they are much better than Appleton) Rjensen (talk) 18:48, 12 May 2013 (UTC)

Protection Policy
You took part in a previous discussion on the protection policy talk page about the reference to "uncontroversial" edits. A survey is now in progress on that page in response to a request for comments. You may want to visit that talk page again and provide your input to try to obtain consensus. Robert McClenon (talk) 01:59, 14 May 2013 (UTC)

May 2013
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Portadown massacre
Hi Phillip, can you help mediate here Portadown Massacre? No wish to get into an edit but an editor is being difficult, reverting sourced content - re the well documented mutual massacres in Ulster in 161-42. I'd appreciate your input. Jdorney (talk) 17:54, 15 May 2013 (UTC)

Edinburgh Mercat Cross again
I've just met a young neighbour who happens to be a Classics student. He's not too confident about having a go at the tympanum inscription himself, but he says he knows a lecturer who he thinks will be willing. Fingers crossed. Kim Traynor | Talk 21:03, 15 May 2013 (UTC)

Wikipedia:Pending changes/Request for Comment 2013
I [//en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Wikipedia%3APending_changes%2FRequest_for_Comment_2013&diff=555669994&oldid=555669850 put a *] before your comment so my comment wouldn't look like a reply to yours. davidwr/ (talk)/(contribs)/(e-mail)  16:54, 18 May 2013 (UTC)

Disambiguation link notification for May 20
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Move review of Rotterdam Blitz
Please see User talk:TomStar81. This move review has been sitting around for a long time, and the original discussion was in January. You are the only experienced editor who showed up in the original move discussion supporting Rotterdam Blitz. Would you be against my idea for closing the move review? I know that these articles could be organized differently, but as of now I'd support any reasonable idea for getting the move review closed. My own preference would be just to do the move, and leave any reorganizing of the bombing topic for the future. Thanks, EdJohnston (talk) 12:52, 22 May 2013 (UTC)

Talkback
 Eastlaw  talk ⁄ contribs 21:28, 23 May 2013 (UTC)

Gypsy horse
Hey PBS, thanks for autoarchiving the talk at Gypsy horse, but can you tweak the parameters so that it archives every 60 days or so and doesn't necessarily archive at any particular length (though I like the preserving of 2-3 threads)? I ask because this article is prone to get a bunch of massive editing, followed by a long lull, so I don't want it too fast to archive, and I don't want long discussions accidentally split. Is that doable? Thanks. Montanabw (talk) 05:28, 27 May 2013 (UTC)

Disambiguation link notification for May 27
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Talkback Notice
jcc (tea and biscuits) 15:15, 30 May 2013 (UTC)

Talkback Notice
jcc (tea and biscuits) 15:55, 30 May 2013 (UTC)

Talkback Notice 3
jcc (tea and biscuits) 17:10, 30 May 2013 (UTC)

Nathaniel Fiennes (disambiguation)
Hello, just letting you know I've proposed this for deletion per Template:db-disambig and WP:2DABS. Please remove ther template if you disagree. Best wishes, Boleyn (talk) 18:01, 6 June 2013 (UTC)

Reverted your good idea
You are absolutely right the commands did not spring from nowhere; however, your addition was in error, specifically in MacArthur being in command of ABDA. That was under British command (Wavell) with ANZAC hurriedly put together on the other side of Mac's dissolving Philippine command to organize defense of Australia/New Zealand and the line of supply. The origin of SWPA & POA lies in the Arcadia Conference decision that the Pacific, excluding India and the IO, was a U.S. responsibility and U.S. JCS was working the division:

Creation of SWPA and POA While the President and the Prime Minister were reaching agreement on the worldwide division of strategic responsibility, the JCS were considering the subdivision of the Pacific theater, which they assumed would become a responsibility of the United States. (p. 168 Matloff, United States Army In World War II—The War Department: Strategic Planning For Coalition Warfare 1941-1942)

So, essentially those three commands, including the South East Asia Command (which U.S. writers tend to ignore and even officially call the China Burma India Theater) stretching from Africa to California did come into being at the stroke of a decision just as did the dissolution of ABDA/ANZAC—but not out of nowhere. This is the part you probably want to work with in clearing up that origin. Palmeira (talk) 14:55, 8 June 2013 (UTC)

PS: All those WW II theater command pieces need lots of work for accuracy and I'd include harmonizing the apparently almost completely separate categories of Allied commands and U.S. commands such as we see in that SEA/CBI thing. Palmeira (talk) 15:05, 8 June 2013 (UTC)

Talk page revert
Was this an error? Omnedon (talk) 11:11, 17 June 2013 (UTC)

Discussion at Wikipedia:Move_review/Log/2013_June#Hillary_Clinton
You are invited to join the discussion at Move_review/Log/2013_June. Obi-Wan Kenobi (talk) 16:39, 21 June 2013 (UTC)

"London Millennium Inclined Lift"
I looked at the hits line without looking at the content. In there was the line that said there were no exact matches. So the query was entered correctly and I did miss the important line buried in the results. So if you want to take it to Move review over this, that would seem to be a reasonable option. However, you would also need to mention this result for the old name. If you do this, I would change my position from support to a comment due to this error which was my plan before doing the query. Don't know what effect that would have. Sorry. Vegaswikian (talk) 20:58, 28 June 2013 (UTC)

RfC re WP:LQ
Greetings, PBS. In answer to the objections you raised on the MOS talk page, I have revised the RfC question to address them. Hopefully, you will find the revised RfC question is sufficiently neutral and unbiased that you will feel comfortable enough to express your opinion and !vote on the merits. Thanks. Dirtlawyer1 (talk) 17:32, 30 June 2013 (UTC)

July 2013
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 * Proportionality is a principle under international humanitarian law governing the legal use of force in an armed conflict, whereby belligerents must make sure

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 * ridge between the regiments of Kempt and Pack around 12:00 (vol. 3)
 * infantry, and fell back with losses from musketry fire. Uxbridge recorded that he tried to lead the Dutch Carabiniers, under Major-General [[Albert

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 * He received an excellent education at the grammar school of Perth and the [University of Edinburgh], where he was in the summer of 1593, about the time when his mother, and his sister the Countess

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 * |last=Taylor |first=Frederick |year=2005 |title=Dresden: Tuesday, 13 February 1945 |location=London |publisher=Bloomsbury  |isbn=0-7475-7084-1}}
 * www.archive.org/details/BombingVindicated"Bombing Vindicated"] G. Bles, 1944.  Spaight was Principal Assistant Secretary of the Air Ministry (U.K)

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 * Angela was born in 1248 into a wealthy family at Foligno, in [Umbria]. She married at an early age, she loved the world and its pleasures and, worse still,

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 * the-Catholic-Church-in-England-16th-19th-Century |title=History of the Catholic Church in England 16th – 19th Century |publisher=www.thepapalvisit.org.uk |accessdate=July 2013}} Elizabeth's

Dieppe, Seine-Maritime
Hi. In my opinion this page should be at Dieppe and the others moved to Dieppe (disambiguation). As far as I'm concerned the Dieppe is the one in northern France. Any objections to me requesting a page move? If you could let me know on my talk page I'd be grateful. Thanks!♦ Dr. ☠ Blofeld  14:33, 9 July 2013 (UTC)

WP:EN Madrid dispute
Hello PBS. You posted at ANI for an admin to close [//en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia_talk:Naming_conventions_%28use_English%29#Madrid this discussion]. If I had to do so, it would probably be 'No Consensus', with some suggestion of further negotiations. It looks to me that you could remove some of the objections to 'Madrid' if you would consider the suggestion by User:Jonesey95, to replace the sentence containing Madrid:
 * "The title of an article should generally use the version of the name of the subject which is most common in the English language, as you would find it in reliable sources (for example other encyclopedias and reference works, scholarly journals and major news sources). This makes it easy to find, and easy to compare information with other sources. Often this will be the local version, as with Madrid."

WOULD BECOME:
 * "The title of an article should generally use the version of the name of the subject which is most common in the English language, as you would find it in reliable sources (for example other encyclopedias and reference works, scholarly journals and major news sources). This makes it easy to find, and easy to compare information with other sources. Often the English version and the local version will be the same, as with Madrid."

Though there isn't agreement that Madrid needs to be replaced, and there isn't consensus for any new single name, there is some discomfort with the current wording, and the above change would reduce (in my opinion) the motivation for future challenges. Let me know if you would object to the above change. Thanks, EdJohnston (talk) 16:55, 10 July 2013 (UTC)

Request for closure
I took the liberty of moving your request for closure from WP:AN/I to WP:Administrators' noticeboard/Requests for closure. It is transcluded onto WP:AN. Apteva (talk) 17:00, 10 July 2013 (UTC)
 * Thanks for moving the NCUE Rfc request for closure to the correct place. -- PBS (talk) 20:21, 10 July 2013 (UTC)

Market/mercat cross discussion
Hi there. You might be interested to know that a discussion is developing again on whether to merge the Markt Cross and Mercat Cross pages. The current discussion is here [] Kim Traynor | Talk 19:27, 14 July 2013 (UTC)

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Templates Catholic and EB1911
Copied from Talk:User:Eastlaw  I have used a nifty tool "CatScan" to create a list of articles that contain a template and  template. I have then imported that list (about 300 articles) and written an AWB script to populate an empty Catholic template from the template and then delete the  template if it is not used as an inline citation.

Your user name came up several times in the first few articles that I examined, some from which I deleted the Catholic template because I could not see any text currently in the Wikipedia article that could be seen as plagiarised text from the Catholic Encyclopaedia without the attribution template.

I have just restarted going thorough my list in AWB (after a short R&R break) and the first article I looked at is Ambrose Shea. Looking at the text of the Wikipedia article I could not see any text that was copied from the Catholic Encyclopaedia.

Using another useful tool "wikiblame", I can see that you added the template to the article (20:52, 19 January 2009). I then looked further into the article's history:
 * Revision as of 23:42, 11 Dec. 2006: First big expansion and the source used was presumably the given source "Biography at the Dictionary of Canadian Biography Online"
 * Revision as of 08:37, 13 Oct. 2007: template CathEncy added to the external links section by JASpencer, but no text added.
 * Revision as of 20:52, 19 Jan. 2009: template Catholic added to the external links section by you, but AFAICT there was no need for it.

In the minute that you added the Catholic to Ambrose Shea you also added the same template to 6 other articles, and in the minute before and after you added the same template to another 7 and 12 articles.

I also notice that later in the month of January 2009 you did something similar to articles with the EB1911.

What were the criteria that you used for adding these templates and did they include checking to see if any text had been copied, or closely paraphrased, from a PD source before adding the template?

-- PBS (talk) 10:57, 22 May 2013 (UTC)


 * I don't know. You're asking me about stuff that happened years ago that I don't even remember.  -- Eastlaw  talk ⁄ contribs 21:27, 23 May 2013 (UTC)

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August 2013
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 * Charles Williams |publisher=The Grand Lodge of British Columbia and Yukon |accessdate=August 2013}} quotes:

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 * action, the will of the people as a whole is the only right standard of political action"  Peters, Jr. 1978,  p. 1}};

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 * Thomas Finlayson |wstitle=Montgomerie, Alexander (1588-1661) |volume=38 |pages=298–300}}  6th Earl

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 * Battle of Largs (1263) – Inconclusive 'battle' fought between the Scots and Norwegians  Scottish–Norwegian War
 * * Battle of Prestonpans 1745

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 * !--<[[File:Battle-poitiers(1356).jpg|thumb|right|200px|The English army defeats the French at the [[
 * Tudor and Stuart monarchs maintained a personal bodyguard of Yeomen of the Guard created by Henry VII and the Honourable Corps of Gentlemen at Arms or "gentlemen pensioners" (

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 * pg=PA343#v=onepage&q&f=false Memoirs of the Duke of York: First of the Civil Wars in France]
 * and Hall, Ltd. |location=London |url=http://archive.org/details/houseofcromwel00wayl |pages=198 }}

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 * |last=Carlyle |first=Edward Irving |year=1899a|wstitle=Urry, John (1666-1715) |volume=58 |page=52 }}

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Short citations
It was very considerate of you to leave me that message, and those links. I do use short citations, particularly on longer or denser articled that make multiple references to the same work. But I do have a serious deficit when it comes to templates, or indeed anything that looks like a mathematical or statistical formula; I slow, then freeze over, and cease to function. It's an ancient, pathological panic; an old trick... and I'm getting to be one of Wikipedia's elder dogs, set in his ways, with only a few active neurones to spare for new things. Or old ones, come to that. But I will give it a go. Best, Haploidavey (talk) 19:50, 19 August 2013 (UTC) Aha. Just discovered the buttons you mentioned....

Category:World War II British electronics
Category:World War II British electronics, which you created, has been nominated for possible deletion, merging, or renaming. If you would like to participate in the discussion, you are invited to add your comments at the category's entry on the Categories for discussion page. Thank you. DexDor (talk) 04:57, 20 August 2013 (UTC)

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September 2013
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 * On 23 October 1615, at the City of London church of St Ann Blackfriars, Apsley married Lucy a daughter of Sir John St John of Lydiard Tregoze, Wiltshire, and his wife Lucy (daughter

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 * St. Catherine Press|location=London |volume=VI|pages= pp.706–708|ref=sfnRef|Cokayne|1926}}

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 * {harvnb|Firth|1898|p=204}} cites Dugdale, Visitation of Yorkshire, 1665, Surtees Soc. xxxvi. 66.

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 * * Cite DNB|Neville, Alexander

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 * in effecting an orderly retreat, and marched off the field intact. The Duke of York's troop of guards, which

Mercat Cross, Edinburgh inscription
Good news. I've finally come across in print a translation of the Latin inscription on the Cross. I've given it exactly as it appears in the 1885 publication, even though it does not seem to be precise (where is that first date of destruction in the original and isn't it astonishing that the writer should make a mistake in the date of the inscription itself?). I assume the book was commissioned to accompany completion of the reconstruction, as it is dedicated to the City Magistrates. Kim Traynor | Talk 21:40, 9 September 2013 (UTC)

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List of genocide prosecutions
Is there a particular reason why you had reverted edits I made in the article "The List of Bosnian Genocide Prosecutions?" --Accursius (talk) 09:58, 17 September 2013 (UTC)

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Œuvre de Belle-Belle
Thank you for your message. I agree it could be an archaic spelling. Perhaps an acceptable compromise would be to use both spellings?

Œvre de Belle-Belle [Œuvre de Belle-Belle in modern spelling]

something like that?

The French wiki article about him: https://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/S%C3%A9bastien_Pontault_de_Beaulieu

doesn't cite the work but does use the word in its modern spelling.--FeanorStar7 08:27, 4 October 2013 (UTC)

--FeanorStar7 08:27, 4 October 2013 (UTC)

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Logging of discretionary sanctions
Hi. Just a gentle reminder that warnings (as well as blocks/bans) issued as part of discretionary sanctions should be logged. I added a log entry on your behalf, at WP:ARBMAC, recording the fact that you warned about edit-warring at Ethnic cleansing in the Bosnian War. — Rich wales (no relation to Jimbo) 06:57, 5 October 2013 (UTC)

October 2013
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 * seven thousand useless mouths could only have been to use them for propaganda on arrival in India".

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 * |first=Robert L. |date=October 2007 |origyear=2004 |id=29587 |title=Willis, Thomas (1621–1675) }} Willis, Thomas.

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 * term]] 1736 to Michaelmas term 1754, and he published condensed reports of them in three volumes 1765, 1667, 1668  ; a second edition appeared 1781/2, and a third, edited by Francis William Sanders, in 1794 (

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 * 60]]). }} Under its terms all members of the Long Parliament who were also officers in the Parliamentary army or navy were to either resign their Parliamentary

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 * the Parliamentary forces in Warwickshire during Booth's Insurrection.

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 * the Bedchamber]] and Master of the Great Wardrobe to King James I }.} with whom he had 6 sons and 4 daughters:

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 * S. (reviwer) |date=January 2008 |origyear=2004 |id=4803 |title=Carteret, Sir George, first baronet 1610?–1680}}

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DYK nomination of Esquire of the Body
Hello! Your submission of Esquire of the Body at the Did You Know nominations page has been reviewed, and some issues with it may need to be clarified. Please review the comment(s) underneath your nomination's entry and respond there as soon as possible. Thank you for contributing to Did You Know! Manxruler (talk) 00:40, 12 October 2013 (UTC)

Your change is unacceptable.
You said that there were several theorists but what you're describing is more like a group or place rather than a person. Here is this sentence: Some leading theorists of strategic air warfare, during this period were the Italian Giulio Douhet, the Trenchard school in Great Britain, and General Billy Mitchell in the United States. Every rational person could see it doesn't make any sense whatsoever and you're still not giving me explicit explanation why you wanted to keep the Trenchard school. The keyword here is "theorists" and the definition of a theorists are "persons concerned with the theoretical aspects of a subject; theoreticians." You said that there were several theorists that proposed the same idea then why can you name them instead of naming something like a place of group. I need some source to this information. So far, all i see is Sir Huge Trenchard, not the Trechard School. That's not grammatically sense and doesn't fit with the sentence structure.XXzoonamiXX (talk) 16:52, 12 October 2013 (UTC)

Gilbert Gerard of Crewood
Hi! I noticed you have performed assessment of the Gilbert Gerard of Crewood article, rating it B-class for the WP:MILHIST project. While individual editors are more than welcome to perform such assessments, the Military History project bars major contributors to an article to identify the articles they developed significantly as B-class alone. The project has set up an assessment page for the purpose at WP:MHAR. For that reason, I have provisionally removed B-class checklist entries at the article talk page and I would like to direct you to the WP:MHAR to seek a B-class assessment there. Reviewers there are quite responsive and are likely to process a request within a day or two. Regards.--Tomobe03 (talk) 12:29, 16 October 2013 (UTC)


 * Indeed, there's no problem if a brand new article meets the B-class criteria in full and it would be ok to classify a brand new article as "B" provided that it meets all the WP:BCLASS criteria and, in case of Military History project ratings, that the B-class rating is awarded by an editor who has not been a major contributor to the specific article per WP:MHA.
 * The template works as follows: if all five checklist fields are set to "yes", the set class= parameter value will be overridden with "B". If one of the five criteria is set to "no" (or left blank) the parameter value will default to "C", and if two or more criteria are set to "no" the value will default to "Start" - unless of course a classification greater than B is entered there (GA, A, or FL/FA). Personally, I think the article fails at least the B5 criterion (supporting materials), and possibly B2 criterion as well (coverage and accuracy) because no supporting materials (image, infobox and the like) are provided and the article says nothing on his life prior to 1630s and appears to be very sketchy in terms of the last decade or two or so of his life. I may have gotten a wrong impression in that department, but if a reviewer at the WP:MHAR were to hold a similar view they will tell you so and normally offer you pointers on meeting the B-class criteria. Cheers --Tomobe03 (talk) 13:29, 16 October 2013 (UTC)
 * As I already said, I may be wrong on the B2, that's why you could take that up with a reviewer at WP:MHAR. As far as the infobox is concerned, MILHIST considers them supporting material per WP:MHA (just expand collapsed explanation of B-class criteria there). The MILHIST banner template handles the criteria checklist in this way and while other projects might use the criteria as guideline, MILHIST applies them quite strictly in terms of full compliance. For instance, an article with a single missing reference is treated the same as if half of article contents were unreferenced. If you feel there should be a change in the behaviour of the template, please comment at WT:MILHIST.--Tomobe03 (talk) 14:39, 16 October 2013 (UTC)

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Richard Morgan
The term "sixteenth century" is actually used by historians even in cultures where it wasn't: it's agreed and generally presupposed that we mean CE. Not surprisingly, there are many, probably hundreds, of articles that use the term in their title and many more that refer to different centuries. There are certainly plenty on 16th century MPs. "Tudor" is the name of a royal dynasty and its power was confined to England, Wales, parts of Ireland and the Pale of Calais. Not Scotland. Not France. Not anywhere else. So the idea that it's somehow more "recognisable" than the name of the century is plainly ethnocentric. It also presupposes that the royalty define their century, which wasn't true even then, and is now clearly an ideological preference not shared by the vast majority of English speakers. It is far less common for anyone to use even the word "Stuart" in the same way and "Hanoverian" is pretty well always reserved just for the dynasty. No-one would refer to a French jurist of the same period as a "Valois judge". The Tudor's have acquired this unique privilege mainly because of the way that a particular way of doing history claimed a hegemonic place in English academia - a long time ago. That and a bit of help from Horrible Histories. Sjwells53 (talk) 16:56, 18 October 2013 (UTC)

Um...
You know about this new account right? Stalwart 111  12:11, 21 October 2013 (UTC)


 * Nicely done. Stalwart 111  13:21, 21 October 2013 (UTC)


 * No problem - I'll keep an eye out. Stalwart 111  13:54, 21 October 2013 (UTC)

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Sources for ancestry trees
I noticed that you flagged the ancestry tree on Charles II for lack of sources. Perhaps there is less need for specific citation for this sort of tree as: A) It is unlikely that there would be any single source, or even a reasonably small number of sources, that would be available to cover such a tree, and B) As all the persons in the tree have links to their own article, the reader could easily verify any particular relationship they found interesting by refering to such a linked page.

Even a useful biography of the scion of such a tree is unlikely to mention all the ancestors to 4 generations - but the presence of such trees is useful to the reader. Urselius (talk) 14:26, 27 October 2013 (UTC)


 * Possibly desirable, but the level of citation would be unworkable. You could easily end up with an article with more references for the family tree than for the text itself. Urselius (talk) 17:34, 27 October 2013 (UTC)

Lawful image
I learned a great deal here. Not just about our policy on this, but on those specific set of images. After a lengthy look into the full copyright issue, I have concluded that you are fully correct and that an apology is deserved. Sorry for my lack of understanding of this issue. You made a good call and...you pushed me enough to find all the relevant policies and legal information myself and that is even better in my book. Thank you and my sincere apologies once again. I will update the GA review.--Mark Miller (talk) 20:47, 29 October 2013 (UTC)

sfnp -> sfnb
Hi, PBS. Your move of has been contested (template talk:sfnb). Of course it would have been better if we'd chirped up before, but could you reverse the move? Kanguole 18:14, 30 October 2013 (UTC)
 * Thanks very much. Kanguole 12:49, 1 November 2013 (UTC)

Moving pictures
Thankyou! I'll do it Amandajm (talk) 10:32, 31 October 2013 (UTC)

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Pat Sheahan (publican)
Hi PBS. Please would you tell me why this editor believes Pat Sheahan (publican) is notable? I cannot see it. I realise there is a system that reviews this factor in new articles, what might the system have found that I cannot see? Regards, Eddaido (talk) 12:05, 3 November 2013 (UTC)

November 2013
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 * ] on 28 June 1707. He died on 4 November 1724, and was buried at Wycombe.

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 * led to his expulsion from the dominions of the Church. }}
 * } cites Cust, p. 9. He took a prominent part in hhe proceedings of the [Dilettanti Society] ,

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 * sfn|A.P.|=

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 * |url=http://www.2005lions.net/tour_1974_article_01.shtml |title=Rampant Lions - South Africa 1974 |archiveurl=https://web.archive.org/web/20071027204433/http://www.2005lions.net/tour_1974_article_

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 * 1653 Julian calendar
 * naval Battle of Portland, or Three Days' Battle took place during 18-20 February 1653 28 February – 2 March 1653 (Gregorian calendar),

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 * Great Britain and the United Kingdom, Extant, Extinct or Dormant |edition=new reprint in 6 volumes |location=Gloucester, U.K. |publisher=Alan Sutton Publishing |volume=I |pages=45–46}}
 * Great Britain and the United Kingdom, Extant, Extinct or Dormant |edition=new reprint in 6 volumes |location=Gloucester, U.K. |publisher=Alan Sutton Publishing |volume=II |pages=65, 142}}

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 * 28–29}}

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 * was elder brother of the well known John Williams, sometime 1621–1625  when Bishop of Lincoln, Lord Keeper of the Great Seal, and afterwards (1641–1650) Archbishop of

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 * *The public commotion which Greatraks caused gave rise to a novel in French0 by M. St. Evremond, entitled, The Irish Prophet, in which he finely plays on the
 * ac.uk/boyle/workdiaries/WD26Clean.html |first=Robert |last=Boyle |year=1666 |title=Work-diary XXVI |chapter=Accounts of cures performed by Valentine Greatrakes |publisher=Birkbeck, University of

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 * ] (1605–1663) of Spargor, Cornwall — the eldest son (by Judith Meredith) of John Godolphin the younger brother of Sir William Godolphin (1567–1613) — and  Ruth (died before 1658),

High Sheriff of Staffordshire- Edit conflict
Thats very unfortunate. Ironically we were both working from the same source. You would have thought that the system could warn you when proposing to make an edit that someone else was already editing. Anyway I'll keep out until the dust has settled.Plucas58 (talk) 17:52, 4 November 2013 (UTC)

DYK for Esquire of the Body
The DYK project (nominate) 08:05, 5 November 2013 (UTC)
 * Hi, congratulations on your DYK! The hook is fantastic and I'm sure it will get a lot of hits. I just have a question about your reference formatting. In all my years on Wikipedia, I have never seen page numbers linked to the URL. In fact, when I was reviewing the article for DYK, I thought all your sources were offline. Every other article I've seen has the name of the book in blue, so readers can easily click on it to see the page in question. Best, Yoninah (talk) 14:14, 5 November 2013 (UTC)
 * Thank you for the explanation about the referencing. As a general rule, I don't use citation, so this is all news to me. Best, Yoninah (talk) 23:29, 5 November 2013 (UTC)

Re Newest articles at Cheshire portal
Thanks for adding the article, and do feel free to add your new Cheshire-related items in future. As I wrote in my edit summary, I reverted the edit because you added the article at the wrong end of the list (oldest items not newest items) and also removed the newest article not the oldest. I restored the Tarvin in the English Civil War article in the correct position in my next edit. Cheers, Espresso Addict (talk) 09:58, 7 November 2013 (UTC)
 * I tend not to use revert very often but was worried the article you incorrectly removed might get lost in the wash if I didn't revert -- and then I noticed that the new articles bot had deposited a whole slew of other new ones that needed adding too, and decided to do a full update while I was at it... I've amended the rather confusing instructions to (hopefully) make the end that new items are meant to be appended to clearer. Espresso Addict (talk) 10:14, 7 November 2013 (UTC)

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Siege of Oxford
Do you really want me to put those two sources after every single line? I was still working on the article, but hey, you have it.--86.6.187.246 (talk) 13:18, 10 November 2013 (UTC)

I know this article very well, I was the one who sat there and copied from the leafy pages those 'quotes' and loosely paraphrased the majority of the text (when tens of irrelevant pages weren't being skipped), maybe sometimes too closely, and I was inspired by your comments about how close to have another go through and reduce further the fatter than necessary wording, even though copyright isn't an issue. At the time of writing it, from two single sources, inline citations weren't my thing and certainly didn't appear necessary. I could say "make your mind up" either I'm paraphrasing too closely or it needs further citing from the source but both cannot be true at the same time, no? If your asking me to go fetch Varley's book back out the stacks and go through and find page numbers, ask nicer.--86.6.187.246 (talk) 13:53, 10 November 2013 (UTC)
 * Thank you, for the Plant background, I was just looking at Samuel Rawson Gardiner after finding nothing online (but I'm at home so no janet/Uni-wide dbs available) to see if Plant got his Privy Council being at Oriel from him. Apologies for being slow on the uptake regarding Plant vs Plant.--86.6.187.246 (talk) 00:59, 12 November 2013 (UTC)
 * Have heard back from the librarian today about Varley's book, which apparently has been in the hands of one of the previous history dons for some years now, so she is looking at getting a second copy. That said, (the first) I know this particular chap and occasionally get to see him, so it may be some weeks or some months before I manage to get hands on a copy. However (another one) having re-read Clyde Grose's summary, he noted that the book is not very readable, with few exact citations, mostly marginal notes which then reference the numbers of the books as listed in the second volume of Falconer Madan's 1912 Oxford books (which our library does not have copy of), — "[t]he scholar will be irked at times by the indefiniteness or complete absence of references for documents mentioned or printed." But (the third) with your excellent additions into the sources of the two diaries (which Varley most certainly used), I had hoped to be assisted by Varley's notes in completing Walker as I had done with Dugdale, but am now reconciled (per Grose) in completing the tracking back from Walker instead. That is likely to leave some few sentences of opinion and note from Varley himself, in amongst the accounts from the two diaries and letters quoted, for which distinct page numbers would likely be no problem (although of no real worth - per Grose). I shall also be continuing in my attempt to improve the text throughout. --I also edit on 86.6.187.246 when not on 163.1.147.64 (talk) 01:32, 25 November 2013 (UTC)
 * I am mostly done, there are a few bits here and there that I am going to look to re-source if possible, and I still have another few hours worth of copy editing the text to do yet. Are there any heinous crimes (excepting apostrophe and mdash abuse) that you feel I need look at?--163.1.147.64 (talk) 23:51, 30 November 2013 (UTC)

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WP Encyclopaedia Britannica
Thanks for the invitation and for restarting the interest. I don't know how much you know of the history. Some years ago, almost the entire content of EB1911 was dumped uncritically into Wikipedia, complete with OCR errors, and then some heroes started to sort out the conflict with existing articles that had more contemporary information. One challenge of note was that EB articles were sometimes much more comprehensive than WP and it was a challenge to decide what was still relevant after 100 years (obscure mythical figures yes, technology not so much). We did the same with Nuttall but that was much easier to complete.

I also joined WikiProject Missing encyclopedic articles/1911 verification. Pretty soon I was the only one; I started on the B's because others were making random attacks on the A's, and gave up 65% of the way through. The idea was to walk through the WP articles in the EB index, where there was a mix of modern and old text, deciding which ones still had EB text, and cleaning it up where necessary. My working notes are at User:DavidBrooks/sandbox.

Work on the citation templates has slowly continued, and the partial Wikisource has come on line since then, and I honestly haven't kept up to date. So I may stave off the occasional boredom and pick it up again. It may even be necessary to re-examine those 782 "B" articles that I already reviewed. David Brooks (talk) 17:13, 18 November 2013 (UTC)


 * Also, I just found another problem with the templates (after all these years). Some articles in wikisource contain a disambiguation descriptor in parentheses, which is absent from the encyclopaedia itself. I just edited George Abbot (author) which links to the Wikisource article "Abbot, George (writer)". However in the printed book according to the online scans the article is just "Abbot, George" (one of two with the same heading). It's not strictly accurate to describe the EB1911 article as "Abbot, George (writer)"; that's not what the original book says. I don't think either the EB1911 or the Wikisource1911Enc template has the capacity to effectively pipe the text to the differently-named article. I left that page in an inconsistent state so you can see what I mean. Thoughts? David Brooks (talk) 22:01, 18 November 2013 (UTC)


 * While looking at your resolution example in George Abbot (author), I noticed in the change[//en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=George_Abbot_(author)&diff=prev&oldid=582517638] you also added Endnotes. I forget the latest section ordering and attribution conventions, but shouldn't that be either on a new line or its own section? David Brooks (talk) 17:41, 20 November 2013 (UTC)

Thanks for the message
I was away at a funeral this past weekend, so was away from a computer a bit longer than usual. Thanks for the note, I've responded and hope it helps. Please let me know if I can continue helping in any way - I'll be watching the page just in case. GRUcrule (talk) 15:04, 20 November 2013 (UTC)

Lord Mayor of York
I certainly can have a look at the site you suggest. I seem to have used it in the past for the York MPs. I assume you feel we can use their list of city sheriffs. I have recently completed the list of the Canterbury sheriffs, so why not York.Plucas58 (talk) 19:42, 21 November 2013 (UTC)

Question
Hi. Was there genocide in early 19th century British Ceylon? See here. I'm no expert, but it looks like very heavy POV pushing. -- 20:50, 21 November 2013 (UTC)Tobby72 (talk)

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Much obliged
Although I expect to keep to a very low level. The people who I left annoyed with are still around.

But if there is something on which you want my opinion, feel free to ask. E-mail may reach me faster. Septentrionalis PMAnderson 16:43, 1 December 2013 (UTC)

December 2013
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 * in power, and applied himself particularly to the Speaker of the Rump Parliament [William Lenthall], who, in expectation of gaining him in marriage for his daughter, espoused his interest with great
 * resistance was left with a moping up operation, after his death his successor [Edmund Ludlow] was faced with even less effective military opposition, and after Charles Fleetwood arrived in

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 * (England)|Restoration]].) like, , state that Maurice Fenton was made a baronet by the Lord

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 * |editor=107th, 3 volumes |location=Wilmington, Delaware, U.S.A. |publisher=Burke's Peerage Genealogical Books|volume=3 |page=3133}}

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 * |page=https://archive.org/stream/agenealogicalan02burkgoog#page/n481/mode/1up 461 }}

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 * confirmation as a commander".

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Your revert
Your revert on Template:Medieval Lands by Charles Cawley was not justified. There are examples in the documentation. Adding includeonly tags is completely normal on templates. Debresser (talk) 23:44, 14 December 2013 (UTC)

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BattyBot's citation edits regarding Staff authors
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