User talk:PantheonRadiance/Archive 1

Your submission at Articles for creation: Alpharad (YouTuber) has been accepted
 Alpharad (YouTuber), which you submitted to Articles for creation, has been created.

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Thanks again, and happy editing! Devonian Wombat (talk) 09:49, 25 April 2021 (UTC)

Chuggaaconroy
I had a look through the Chuggaaconroy draft, and I must say you've done an excellent job with it. I thought the sentences flowed well, its wording is not promotional, and the sourcing is good, the ones you identified on my talk page definitely showcase notability. With regard to your concerns about the reception section, I do think that the changes you're planning to make would improve it, and I would also recommend removing Gamepur as a source, though Mashable and Softonic are fine. All in all, great work. Devonian Wombat (talk) 06:41, 16 July 2021 (UTC)
 * @Devonian Wombat Thank you so much for reading through it, I really appreciate it. I'll try to take your advice and fix up the Reception section, and then I'll try to finish it up and hopefully submit it by next week. I hope it does get accepted and finally restored. PantheonRadiance (talk) 21:54, 17 July 2021 (UTC)

Gave the draft a follow up review as you asked, and I can't find anything wrong with it. Nothing more to say really, the recent changes you made to the draft fixed the few problems it had. Devonian Wombat (talk) 11:20, 27 July 2021 (UTC)


 * Okay, thanks. Just went ahead and submitted it, once again I really appreciated your feedback. PantheonRadiance (talk) 20:07, 27 July 2021 (UTC)
 * I reviewed your draft and rejected it. Here are the problems with it. First, I could not find a reference where somebody is providing in-depth information that wasn't simply echoing whatever Chuggaaconroy said himself. Getting profiled in Wired and NYT is good (for promotion) but not-so-good for establishing notability unless the journalist adds some independent content with their own opinion/research/etc. There are also far too many references and not all of them relevant. For example, you don't really need so many links on the sentence that starts with "On his primary YouTube channel, Rosales-Birou has produced ...." and you don't need two references to support an factoid is one will do just the same. The language is also still unencyclopedic in places if not a little fanboyesque. For example, why describe him as a "prominent" Let's Player in the lede? Also, who decided that he was "best known" for his "comprehensive" (?) videos? This language is not encyclopedic nor neutral. There are other statements that don't appear to be supported (although I'd question if they are even needed at all) such as "He was initially inspired to make Let's Plays by personalities such as .." Hope that helps. It needs to be shorter, less referencing, more to the point, remove the fluff, keep the tone factual and encyclopedia, if in doubt remove the adjective.  HighKing++ 15:59, 29 July 2021 (UTC)
 * As a good faith response, I have to disagree with some of the criticism you made, mainly because I already addressed a lot of the concerns you talked about.


 * First off, you should have read the notes I placed on the Talk page. I forgot to write a comment telling the person who reviews the article to check that first, my apologies.


 * Second off, I take it that "echoing whatever Chuggaaconroy said himself" refers to primary vs. secondary sourcing, and I have to object to you not finding a single source with in-depth information. Wired and the NYT are already considered as reliable sources independent of Chuggaaconroy; those articles weren't written to state that one should "subscribe" to his channel but to report information about his content, and the Wired source especially counts as in-depth information on Chuggaaconroy's videos (he is the main focus of the article after all).
 * For the Wired article, it counts as a secondary source as it mostly consists of synthesized information from both him and his videos, along with other primary sources; it isn't a mere Q/A article where most of the text consists only of statements made directly from Chuggaaconroy. While the article does contain SOME quotes from him, the writer clearly interpreted the quotes such that it stands as a secondary source with the author's own analysis.
 * While it could have been longer, the New York Times source had two paragraphs which discussed his channel along with how his channel grew in popularity, and while quotes are used, the section doesn't entirely consist of it and for the most part is independent and secondary (for clarification, I judge an article on whether or not the amount of primary info on the subject outweighs the secondary analysis of such info).


 * And third, "also, who decided that he was "best known" for his "comprehensive" (?) videos? This language is not encyclopedic nor neutral."
 * He is best known for his comprehensive walkthrough videos because that's exactly what multiple secondary sources have described his video content as, which is already addressed in the body of the article under the "Commentary and Video Style" section. The "comprehensive" adjective is used as a synonym for "informative" and to describe his video style; as aforementioned, his gaming videos consist of him showcasing every aspect of whatever game he plays to 100% completion (as in, every quest, boss battle, Easter egg and whatnot), which different sources in the article already touched upon. I merely synthesized that information into that sentence, establishing a claim of importance. (although if you really wanna split hairs, the aforementioned Wired article considers him best-known for that; I quoted a sentence from that article and put it in the section). It isn't fanboyism in the slightest and it's completely neutral - if I were to say "he is best known for his amazing or critically acclaimed videos" or "he's one of the most well-known YouTubers in the Let's Play community" without finding any exceptional source for that claim, then maybe your argument would have some ground to stand on. However, I based the diction of that sentence solely off of the sources I found which discuss his content, and I made extra sure to remove the puffery in the article itself. I also find it funny that a generally formal word such as "comprehensive" is apparently not "encyclopedic."


 * As for other miscellaneous notes:


 * How was the article not straight to the point? The article clearly states that he's a Let's Player who makes detailed, informative video walkthroughs on Nintendo games.
 * "There are other statements that don't appear to be supported (although I'd question if they are even needed at all) such as 'He was initially inspired to make Let's Plays by personalities such as ..'" - That information is relevant because Proton Jon not only inspired Chuggaaconroy to pursue Let's Plays, but he along with Chugga created the collab channel The Runaway Guys, which is explained in the sub-section later on and is confirmed in the Wired article and the Girls on Games interview. Omitting that information would make his history as a YouTuber incomplete as it would remove Proton Jon's influence on Chuggaaconroy, and would leave a hole in the information for TRG. Also, I put the references at the end of the short paragraph because I didn't want to add a citation on every sentence; that would break up the flow of the paragraph (think "The sky is blue[1] and consists of clouds[2][3]"). The only exception is the paragraph listing the games he's made videos on, which I used for verifiable proof and examples of his tendency to make Let's Plays based on Nintendo games. Of course, some of them can be deleted.


 * Finally, I wanted to establish this point, since you brought up the idea on fanboyism.


 * My intentions to restore the article weren't to promote his channel, which of course is contrary to Wikipedia's purpose. Rather, in a good faith rationale, my purpose was to improve the coverage of Let's Play channels on this site along with the Let's Play genre as a whole, specifically to distinguish between Let's Play channels who typically play games in a humorous manner (think Markiplier and Jacksepticeye) and LP channels who aim to make their videos informative akin to walkthroughs, like TheRadBrad and of course Chuggaaconroy. If Chuggaaconroy's coverage solely consisted of references with trivial 1-2 sentence mentions or name drops, I wouldn't have even bothered to restore this article in the first place. But the Wired article alone significantly covers him, and other sources which mention him in at least 100 words or more prove otherwise. While he hasn't received as much coverage as the likes of PewDiePie, the coverage he has received is relevant and significant enough to warrant him having a Wikipedia article.


 * Anyway, thanks for reviewing the draft regardless, and I apologize in advance if I sound a bit hostile in this response; I had a long week finishing up schoolwork and I'm not in the most upbeat mood.
 * PantheonRadiance (talk) 01:30, 1 August 2021 (UTC)

Your submission at Articles for creation: Chuggaaconroy (July 29)
 Your recent article submission to Articles for Creation has been reviewed! Unfortunately, it has not been accepted at this time. The reason left by HighKing was:

The comment the reviewer left was:

Please check the submission for any additional comments left by the reviewer. You are encouraged to edit the submission to address the issues raised and resubmit when they have been resolved.


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 HighKing++ 15:44, 29 July 2021 (UTC)

Your submission at Articles for creation: TeamFourStar has been accepted
 TeamFourStar, which you submitted to Articles for creation, has been created.

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Thanks again, and happy editing! Bkissin (talk) 15:42, 10 August 2021 (UTC)

A bowl of strawberries for you!

 * LOL, thanks so much! Sorry for the late reply, I took a little Wikibreak to enjoy the rest of my summer vacation and prepare for my upcoming school year. 😊 PantheonRadiance (talk) 18:31, 27 August 2021 (UTC)
 * No worries, hope you enjoyed your time off. — Bilorv ( talk ) 18:44, 27 August 2021 (UTC)

Draft:Vinesauce
I skipped it because it's not a straightforward case. I'll let another admin look at it. The draft has been deleted 5 times before this one, and for different reasons. I believe the restoration will have to be selective. Jay (talk) 06:56, 3 November 2021 (UTC)


 * Oh okay. The reason why I wanted it to be restored was because I found 20 secondary sources from reliable outlets which talked about the streaming group's videos and gaming content. Sites such as Kotaku ([1 ], [2 ], [3 ] [4 ]), VG247 ([1 ]), PCGamer ([1 ]), Vice ([1 ]), The Daily Dot ([1 ], [2 ]) and Nintendo Life ([1 ]) have covered their videos in significant enough detail which should satisfy WP:WEB and WP:BASIC. However, the draft had been rejected multiple times because most of the sources used came from either the group themselves or unreliable blogs, and it perplexed me how the draft editors failed to even acknowledge these sources, let alone use them. If you could find another admin, that would be great. I'll post the full list to the original editors of the article once the draft gets restored. PantheonRadiance (talk) 21:56, 3 November 2021 (UTC)
 * Done. Jay (talk) 05:20, 6 November 2021 (UTC)
 * Thank you, Jay. PantheonRadiance (talk) 20:15, 8 November 2021 (UTC)

A Barnstar for you!
Sometimes, people do things that they'd rather not do, maybe someday there'll be a "sewer cleaning" barnstar for those who do the really erm, "stinky", jobs. But for now there's this one. Good work on Keemstar.


 * Oh wow, thank you so much! Personally Keemstar is one of my least favorite YouTubers, so up until his retirement announcement I never thought that I would edit his article, let alone get a Barnstar for it! Sorry I didn't reply earlier, I had schoolwork I needed to take care of! PantheonRadiance (talk) 20:15, 8 November 2021 (UTC)

New message from Passengerpigeon
 Passenger pigeon  ( talk )  13:59, 13 November 2021 (UTC)

DYK nomination of Maximilian Dood
Hello! Your submission of Maximilian Dood at the Did You Know nominations page has been reviewed, and some issues with it may need to be clarified. Please review the comment(s) at your nomination's entry and respond there as soon as possible. Thank you for contributing to Did You Know! PCN02WPS ( talk  &#124;  contribs ) 03:17, 18 November 2021 (UTC)

"Troom Troom" listed at Redirects for discussion
A discussion is taking place to address the redirect Troom Troom. The discussion will occur at Redirects for discussion/Log/2021 December 3 until a consensus is reached, and anyone, including you, is welcome to contribute to the discussion. 192.76.8.80 (talk) 09:10, 3 December 2021 (UTC)

DYK for Maximilian Dood
Cwmhiraeth (talk) 00:03, 17 December 2021 (UTC)

New message from IAmChaos
Hi, I couldnt get the ping to send, so I'll leave a TB template here. Happy Editing-- IAm Chaos  21:46, 23 February 2022 (UTC)
 * Thanks for the ping. I just sent a request for page protection. As a side question, do you perhaps have the ability to remove salts? PantheonRadiance (talk) 22:25, 23 February 2022 (UTC)
 * I am not an administrator, but that page is pretty well patrolled, so someone will see your request soon. I also put in a comment, so they didn't think I was objecting to your request when I "declined" it. Happy Editing-- IAm Chaos  22:28, 23 February 2022 (UTC)
 * Oh okay, thanks anyways. PantheonRadiance (talk) 22:39, 23 February 2022 (UTC)

Your submission at Articles for creation: Slowbeef has been accepted
 Slowbeef, which you submitted to Articles for creation, has been created.

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Thanks again, and happy editing! Numberguy6 (talk) 18:53, 1 April 2022 (UTC)

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Draft:Northernlion
Hey there,

first of all, thanks for the help on the draft! I aprreciate it :)

Secondly, I kind of left the whole draft alone, since I got a message that "Submission is about a person not yet shown to meet notability guidelines", so I figured no matter how much I'd continue to tinker it wouldn't really matter. Did I get that right or was it also due to a lack of quality that the draft has been rejected? I was hoping you could help me with this since I can't seem to find an answer elsewhere.

Either way, have a nice day! Mika Müller-Popkes (talk) 13:36, 7 December 2022 (UTC)


 * Hello, hope you're having a wonderful day (or night) as you read this, and I should thank you for creating the draft on Northernlion in the first place. I won't say that I'm a hardcore fan of his, but I've watched a couple of his Binding of Isaac videos in the past and I've enjoyed them quite a bit!
 * To answer your question, the main reason why Northernlion's draft got declined wasn't because of a lack of quality per se, but rather the draft didn't fulfill the requirements necessary for a topic or person to have an article on Wikipedia. Wikipedia has tons of guidelines regarding the general content we cover on this website, but arguably the most important guideline we follow is the notability guideline, which is the criteria that the draft didn't meet at that period of time. The notability guidelines itself has a ton of different pages depending on the topic, but simply put, see the general guideline. It says that in order for any topic or person to have a Wikipedia article, they must have received significant coverage in secondary sources (such as news articles, books, and in some cases interviews) that are reliable and independent of the subject. There's no minimum number of sources, but generally two or three good sources are acceptable. To get an idea of acceptable sources on Wikipedia, think about articles from news outlets like The New York Times, The Guardian or even IGN and Polygon.
 * At the time I discovered the draft around April 2022, the Northernlion page mainly consisted of his own YouTube videos, his own tweets or other primary or questionable sources. While in some cases you're allowed to use primary sources directly from him such as his YouTube videos and tweets, articles on Wikipedia should contain information mostly from secondary sources, either from published books or media outlets. That's why declined the draft, because it needed more secondary sources that significantly covered him and/or his video content.
 * Fortunately, you're in luck! These past few months I searched for articles for Northernlion and found several that determine his notability. Sources such as Polygon, TubeFilter, TechRadar, Yahoo! News and PC Games are all considered reliable on Wikipedia, and they have covered Northernlion's career enough for me to base information around. So he's quite close to passing WP:GNG - I haven't submitted it yet however because I want to add a few more edits later on. But it should be mostly fine now.
 * Finally, if you want to continue making articles yourself, here a couple of resources I consult whenever I have an idea for an article, or want to edit a page with reliable sources:
 * WP:RSP - A list of sources deemed reliable or unreliable to use on Wikipedia backed by community consensus. If you ever want to ask if a source is reliable, you can ask on the noticeboard.
 * WP:VG/RS - A list of video game-related news outlets deemed reliable or unreliable. I edit gaming articles often so I always check this page every other day.
 * WP:100W - An essay that states that 100 words or more written about a topic count as significant coverage. Wikipedia doesn't have an official word count on what counts as significant, but if a topic has multiple reliable sources with over 100 words written about it, the topic should count as notable.
 * Also, you can visit the Teahouse to ask questions about editing as well.
 * Anyways, happy editing! If you do find more news outlets that cover Northernlion, feel free to add them to the draft.
 * Thanks, PantheonRadiance (talk) 21:10, 7 December 2022 (UTC)
 * Hey @PantheonRadiance,
 * thank you for your lenghty and very helpful reply! I've never realized the important role of secondary sources for Wikipedia articles, but of course that makes a lot of sense if you need to determine the notability of a person/organization/other thing. So thanks a lot for explaining that to me as well as adding some of those secondary sources to the draft as well. Hopefully I can find some more as well.
 * I'll also keep those links you mentioned in your message pinned somewhere, since they seem to be really convenient for the whole editing process.
 * So yeah, thanks a lot again and I hope you have a wonderful day or night as well! Mika Müller-Popkes (talk) 14:43, 8 December 2022 (UTC)
 * You're very welcome! Also, thank you for adding an extra Polygon source to the draft as well; I really appreciate it. At this point I'm sure Northernlion passes WP:GNG. I can make a few more edits, but if you want, you can go ahead and submit the draft whenever you feel it's ready. :) PantheonRadiance (talk) 19:31, 8 December 2022 (UTC)
 * @PantheonRadiance I'd be down with submitting the draft as it is now! I was just about to upload a non-free picture to Wikipedia Commons, but I guess that won't work until the article is actually featured on the mainpage, so I think submitting it would be the next best step now :) Mika Müller-Popkes (talk) 17:38, 10 December 2022 (UTC)
 * Perfect! I think it's pretty much done too, there aren't many sources I need to add to the article anymore, and anything else I could add, I could save for later. I'm going to leave a comment on the draft however to prove to AfC reviewers that he meets GNG. Thank you so much for your work! PantheonRadiance (talk) 01:10, 11 December 2022 (UTC)

GeorgeNotFound move
Hey, if the AfC reviewers continue to be unreasonable, would you be open to a move of Draft:GeorgeNotFound to mainspace like 331dot suggested? It's true that the AfC process is optional, and I believe I wouldn't be restricted in moving it myself, even with the salting. I do think it could survive an AfD discussion if it had to come to that, though of course that isn't certain; editors sometimes vote without thoroughly looking at the article, as we've seen in the AfC review. I'm willing to do it if you're on board! BappleBusiness[talk] 09:57, 8 January 2023 (UTC)


 * Hey, sorry for the late reply. I'd be down with a page move, but my only concern is that other editors may immediately get trigger happy with reverting or even AfDing the page. If you want to move it yourself, I suggest perhaps posting an explanation on the talk page on why he's notable now first, then leave a comment on the page for any New Page Patrollers explaining to them to read the explanation before suggesting deletion. This way we could pre-emptively prove it's notable, or at the very least perhaps reach a better consensus with other editors. Also if you want, you can even use the source table I made, or make your own. But if it does come down to another AfD, I'll back you up and share my reasoning on why he's notable once more. Thanks, PantheonRadiance (talk) 06:05, 10 January 2023 (UTC)

Your submission at Articles for creation: Vinesauce has been accepted
 Vinesauce, which you submitted to Articles for creation, has been created.

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Thanks again, and happy editing! Mattdaviesfsic (talk) 06:02, 12 January 2023 (UTC)

Your submission at Articles for creation: The Living Tombstone has been accepted
 The Living Tombstone, which you submitted to Articles for creation, has been created.

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Thanks again, and happy editing! — python coder (talk &#124; contribs) 20:33, 1 February 2023 (UTC)

Merger discussion for List of Smosh cast members
An article that you have been involved in editing&mdash;List of Smosh cast members&mdash;has been proposed for merging with another article. If you are interested, please participate in the merger discussion. Thank you. Apache287 (talk) 15:25, 26 June 2023 (UTC)

Your GA nomination of Etika
Hi there, I'm pleased to inform you that I've begun reviewing the article Etika you nominated for GA-status according to the criteria. This process may take up to 7 days. Feel free to contact me with any questions or comments you might have during this period. Message delivered by ChristieBot, on behalf of Vaticidalprophet -- Vaticidalprophet (talk) 17:03, 28 June 2023 (UTC)

You've been mentioned on an RFC
Hello there PantheonRadiance! I hope you are well, my friend. It's been a minute. A while back, we were both involved in a discussion concerning Deji's notability. I've finally found the time to create an RFC, which you've been pinged on. Check it out! Hope you've been well. DrewieStewie (talk) 21:49, 31 May 2023 (UTC)


 * Hey, sorry for the wait, I took an unofficial Wikibreak to finish my finals. Good job taking the initiative in setting up the RfC! I've actually been periodically searching for more sources these past few months about Deji to ensure that he meets the guidelines. Maybe depending on how the RfC goes I'll post a source table of what I've found that contributes to his notability. If you found any new sources, let me know too! Thanks, PantheonRadiance (talk) 21:40, 1 June 2023 (UTC)
 * Wonderful! If I find anything, I’ll let you know. Hopefully we can get access to a previous draft from around the time of the prior deletion review. It would be a great thing to build on so we wouldn’t have to start from scratch. A positive RFC result would certainly help with that. There certainly has been no opposition to a draft at minimum thus far. Glad you enjoyed your brief wikibreak. :) DrewieStewie (talk) 22:50, 1 June 2023 (UTC)

The RFC has now been closed in favor of starting a draft and removing Deji from DEEPER. Is there any avenue to request a copy of a deleted article circa October 2022-January 2023 as a draft blueprint? I recall them being significant and well-sourced. Good work on providing sources that passed a source review in the RFC. We will have to request unsalting for Draft:Deji Olatunji too. DrewieStewie (talk) 03:22, 23 June 2023 (UTC)


 * I would say to post another deletion review to ask to restore the draft, but considering that DRV was what led us here in the first place and we just had the lengthy RfC, I think it would be faster if we just show the admin who deleted the draft the RfC and request them to restore and unsalt it, either in draftspace or one of our sandboxes. If you want to also work on creating a draft from scratch, I can also give you a couple sources as well to help you. PantheonRadiance (talk) 21:30, 23 June 2023 (UTC)
 * The Draft is live again. First thing we will need to handle is replacing fandom content with reliably sourced content. DrewieStewie (talk) 16:05, 7 July 2023 (UTC)
 * Hey, it's great that we finally have access to the draft! I wrote down parts of the career section yesterday so I'll post it to the draft. After that I'll check and edit the draft occasionally to see its progress, but I'll let you work on fixing up the rest. When you’re ready to submit, be my guest! I'll write a message on the talk page explaining Deji's notability and making sure AfC editors understand his notability compared to the multiple times his article was deleted before.
 * Also, if you find any more reliable sources, feel free to add. You should have access to the Wikipedia Library, but there are also places that might also have coverage on Deji - Google Scholar, Newspapers.com, Google Books, etc. PantheonRadiance (talk) 16:45, 7 July 2023 (UTC)
 * Appreciate your help! Now that I’ve gotten all the bureaucratic business handled, I am now finally happy to work on this. Let’s make some WikiMagic! DrewieStewie (talk) 16:48, 7 July 2023 (UTC)
 * Yep :) PantheonRadiance (talk) 17:20, 7 July 2023 (UTC)