User talk:Papa November/Archive 4

No More Landmines Help
Hi PN

Many thanks for your help with the article on our charity - it looks alot better.

Could you please let me know the answer to a couple of questions.

1) What do I need to do to remove the notability box at the top of my page. I've tried putting on a couple of references to tv appearance and articles but these don't seem to do the trick.

2) Why did you make a notes section for one of the articles (BBC) and not put the other 2 in that section ?

3) Do you work for Wikipedia or are you a user yourself ?

4) Can you give me any advice to make the page look better generally ?

Again huge thanks for your help so far.

Have a great day James —Preceding unsigned comment added by Jameslandmines (talk • contribs) 10:46, 12 March 2008 (UTC)

Hasn't this been beat to death already?
Isn't there already a consensus on this? Some people want to turn Wikipedia into a junior High School book report??? The new editor who missed the first go around seems to be canvassing for opinions but doesn't want to invite any of the previous oppose'ers so I thought I would inform you m'self. Have a nice day! Libs 156.34.142.110 (talk) 17:47, 17 March 2008 (UTC)

About Payola (band)
Hello - thanks for tidying up the article that I created Payola (band). I know some of the band members, so I decided to create this page for them. Apparently they appear on NZ music TV quite often, and get quite a bit of airplay on the radio - so I think they are not 'non notable' (I don't actually know because I actually live in the UK!). Anyway, they have had some trouble with hosting their 'official' website, so for all official business they use MySpace. Their MySpace page is not a 'fansite', but rather a place where the band organizes information about tours / releases / news / etc. etc. For this reason I think that the link to the MySpace page is justified, unless you can find another external link that is better?

I read WP:EL, and I think in this case the use of MySpace is OK. The page says, "[MySpace] links normally to be avoided", however, it goes on to say, "Except for ... official page of the article subject". The MySpace page is an official page of the band... or did I misunderstand that phrase? Similar arguments apply to the YouTube links, as they are official pubic releases of the band.

If you think this is reasonable, I will put the links back on the page - it seems strange to have a page with no external links.

Thanks again, --Dan|(talk) 19:09, 19 March 2008 (UTC)


 * Thanks for the help - I believe the band have been 'quite successful' in NZ, appearing on music TV and on the radio, but I am not sure how to qualify this. I'll send your comments to my friend in the band - hopefully they can add some more details. Cheers --Dan|(talk) 19:18, 20 March 2008 (UTC)

Thanks for your help! (Just checked in... your AfD was a massive stimulus!) --Dan|(talk) 07:20, 4 June 2008 (UTC)

Mikayla Gilbreath deletion
The creating account is too new to edit semiprotected pages and has posted to New contributors' help page PrimeHunter (talk) 16:46, 2 May 2008 (UTC)

Visual Business Intelligence Software
Hi, I've been trying to add details to the handful of Visual BI vendors, that focus on information visualization. Obviously I'm going about this the wrong way in not indicating importance & significance. How should I go about this? Is the following appropriate? One of the handful of players in the Visual Business Intelligence sector including... Thanks,

Peter.a.simpson (talk) 01:17, 17 May 2008 (UTC)

I've now worked more on one entry to include why the technology is notable, where the technology is adopted, how it is used, and more references from business journals to back these statements up. Is this closer to what is required? I'm concerned that it can come across as too much of a sales pitch, so I would welcome your advice. Peter.a.simpson (talk) 08:32, 18 May 2008 (UTC)

Hi again. I've added more detail to the company, and have hopefully now demonstrated it's notability. Unfortunatetely, it's now been marked for deletion. I want to follow the same style with the other main VBI companies (Spotfire, QlikTech), but want to ensure that Panopticon is correct first, and of course not deleted. Can you please let me know what is left for me to do? Peter.a.simpson (talk) 10:50, 20 May 2008 (UTC)

Payola (band)
Hey ya P.N., what was that little trick you just did with the citation tags on the Payola references???? I haven't seen it before, what does it do different to the way I'd done it? . Cheers  Esradekan Gibb   "Talk" 12:26, 22 May 2008 (UTC)

Talk page entry mess up
Dear Admin, I made a terrible mistake on this page. I don't quite know why I was such an ass, I've done over 1,800 edits and this is my only incident of this type, I was actually looking at the page at the request of another editor who was having a conflict on this article. This entry does not represent my outlook on WP, I really like editing and writing articles (so far 7). Can this be deleted? If so please would you do it for me? It really embarrass me to have it there. Thanks.  M i k e P  (WHAT?) 19:44, 26 May 2008 (UTC)

Speedy deletion of Jeti-Ögüz resort
Could you reconsider the deletion of Jeti-Ögüz resort? Since the tag for speedy deletion was added, the article has been expanded some. If you still think it qualifies for speedy deletion, could you suggest the sort of information that should be included to avoid this? I've included information I thought might help, though it still all needs to be cited (which I won't bother with, of course, if it needs to be deleted). Firespeaker (talk) 10:51, 29 May 2008 (UTC)

Re: Your message on my talk page
Hi there Melesse, thanks for adding fair use rationales to the images. I'm a bit concerned by the rate at which you're adding them though - some of the rationales really don't seem to apply to the articles, so you should really consider carefully whether the FURME standard rationales are applicable or not. Take Image:PatrickTopaloff.jpg for example: The fair use rationale you added justifies inclusion of the image in Patrick Topaloff by saying that it is required as an accompaniment to a section of text about the book. In reality, it is being used in the article to show what Topaloff himself looks like - the caption even suggests this! Commentary about the book cover is limited to only one line, and the fair use rationale is really not strong enough to support its inclusion.

I agree that a good number of the nominated images are being used fairly, but I think you're being a bit too liberal with the default FURME rationales at the moment. I'd prefer not to have to do a load of IfDs on these! Papa November (talk) 06:36, 7 June 2008 (UTC)
 * Well as you can likely tell by my speed, I'm not actually checking the articles for their use. From now on I'll check if I suspect anything, thanks for the heads up. The replaceable fair use tag probably remains on all the ones I've done so far though, so if the person who does the actual reviewing is more diligent than I am, they'll still get deleted like they should. Melesse (talk) 06:42, 7 June 2008 (UTC)

you know
Stuff like this (book covers and that) can actually be marked for speedy deletion under the "Invalid Fair Use Claim" criteria. Just put your rationale on the talk page. ViperSnake151 19:12, 7 June 2008 (UTC)

Virginia Capers
Speedy deletion tag was removed from the image because a source was added. Once I remove your message from my talk page, please do not add it again. Thank you. 209.247.22.164 (talk) 14:34, 9 June 2008 (UTC)
 * I notice you have nominated numerous images for deletion because "another image is already being used to identify the subject of the article." Since when is there a limit of one image per article? 209.247.22.164 (talk) 15:48, 9 June 2008 (UTC)

Collage
I have a "shoot first ask questions later" policy which is how Russians/collage got deleted. You should have made it clear in an edit summary and in an HTML comment in the text what the article was about. I have re-instated it at User:Papa November/collage. -- &mdash; RHaworth (Talk | contribs) 17:45, 16 June 2008 (UTC)

Re: User:M.V.E.i.
Hey, I could do with a second opinion on something before I go any further. If you have time, would you mind taking a look at this sockpuppetry case, and this one, then see if you spot a similar pattern here. Cheers, Papa November (talk) 00:31, 17 June 2008 (UTC)
 * Y'know, I got the very same impression when I was glancing over that talk page. But sockpuppeting is pretty far from the realm of image licenses, so I didn't really know what to do, and once that user stopped talking to me I just kinda went "whatevs" and forgot about it. This might be useful, he first approached me as an anonymous user, which is why I didn't take him seriously and probably provoked him further (whoops).
 * BTW good thinking with that collage you made, the convenience easily exchanged pictures while still remembering the inexplicable need to have all the thumbnails focused squarely on the face and of the exact same dimensions. Melesse (talk) 02:37, 17 June 2008 (UTC)

Leonardo da Vinci
With regards to "user preferences" when it comes to the sizing of images-

Experienced Wikipedia editors, and regular Wikipedia users are two different categories of people. And experienced wikipedia editor like yourself knows that you can resize all the illustrations to an article. The hundreds/thousands of schoolkids who use the article on Leonardo to do their school assignments don't know that. That is why all the pictures were very carefully sized, so that the very detailed ones, that are described within the text can be viewed properly while the reader is reading the description and analysis.

This argument keeps coming up about art article. Art articles generally need big pics. We are not being kind to our viewers/readers but giving them a option that most of them will never use. I, for one, have only once tried to change my settings, and it failed, locked me out, and required expert assistance to get back into my account.

I just deleted a comment that I made here which pertained to a change that was made by another editor. Sorry! Amandajm (talk) 14:34, 16 June 2008 (UTC)


 * OK! I have done as you suggested. Cheers! Amandajm (talk) 15:43, 16 June 2008 (UTC)

Mines Advisory Group
Hi Papa November,

New to all this. I work for the Mines Advisory Group, which grants permission to use info from its website on Wikipedia. I understand from the message you sent that I'm not able to copy and paste from www.maginternational.org, but reading the GFDL page has confused me. I'd be really grateful if you could tell me how I convey to Wikipedia that MAG gives permission to use its copyrighted material.

Many thanks,

Maginternational (talk) 12:25, 18 June 2008 (UTC)Maginternational

Hi Papa November, thanks for your quick and very helpful reply, Cheers Maginternational (talk) 13:05, 18 June 2008 (UTC)Maginternational.org

Thanks for the heads up
FYI: Requests for checkuser/Case/M.V.E.i. Just started it. Good day! --Jayron32. talk . contribs 18:33, 19 June 2008 (UTC)

Leonardo
Thanks for all your work on tidying up the citations! Amandajm (talk) 06:54, 22 June 2008 (UTC)

Re FA
The main problem was that I stupidly put up a whole lot of articles simultaneously, not realising that this was both unacceptable, and stupid! I was then sniped at, broadsided and shelled by a number of militants. (That was how it felt). One of the articles went through to FA, with the help of Raoul. I did almost everything that was suggested with the Leonardo article, but it was removed from the list just as it was ready! I found the whole business so excedingly unpleasant that I was discouraged. The nice thing was that several very helpful people suddenly materialised and did the formatting of references, numbers, dates and things which I am not very good at, to a number of the articles. I also found a person who excels at copyeditting.

One of the things that I am not prepared to do is over-reference the stuff, just to get an FA. I find the policing of citations to be it a petty, ignorant and unproffessional business. I discovered a short FA biography the other day that had every phrase in a sentence with a citation. The citations all went to the same page in the same article. It went something like "John Smith was born on Jan 24 1888[1], the eldest son[2] of Mary Smith nee Brown[3] and John Smith of Greenacres[4] formerly of Rooty Hill[5]. When John was 14[6] his father died[7] of pneumonia[8]."

Having professionally written masses of educational material, I'm used to combining info from various sources. I often write fairly lengthy paragraphs that are drawn from a number of agreeing or complementary sources. I then cite the sources at the bottom of the paragraph. The wikipedia guidelines are that info which might be questioned or challenged needs citation. In other words, one doesn't need a textbook to support the fact that an Edam cheese is round and generally covered with red wax. But if one says that eating melted Edam on toast before bedtime can cause erotic dreams, them one needs to back it up with the appropriate study.

Anyway, there are a number of other people who would like to see this go through to FA. I've got a little bit of time in the next few weeks, as I'm on holidays. Amandajm (talk) 12:11, 23 June 2008 (UTC)


 * Re list of Leo's pics, I think that is a good way to go, particularly as the box at the bottom of the page containing the names of the pics has been well revised. It's an effective way to shorten the article. As you are probably aware, there are 3 other Leonardo articles and a host of monographs on particular works. When I decided to improve this page, there was more about his supposed pederast preferences than about his paintings. (It really is only speculation) so I managed to syphon that discussion off into an article about his personal life. Science went into it's own article with just a summary left behind.
 * I'll do some more work on it. But not tonight, as it's nearly mmidnight in the land of Oz. Amandajm (talk) 13:25, 24 June 2008 (UTC)

Your Russians image
I liked the idea, but:
 * 1. Russians would never agree to a Russians image without Gagarin.
 * 2. The page should be semi-protected, or it's a heaven for edit wars and vandals.
 * 3. We need females, but tsvetayeva is not notable enough, and there is no place because whoever you take out it will start a controversy. We need a 3 row image, the little place is the reason the previous one was a three raw. Log in, log out (talk) 16:19, 24 June 2008 (UTC)
 * The third row should be Mendeleyev, female, female, Korolev. Log in, log out (talk) 16:25, 24 June 2008 (UTC)
 * I found good females to be added!!! Anna Pavlova and Roza Shanina. Pavlova - Russian ballet. Shanina - Beautiful, brave. Log in, log out (talk) 16:37, 24 June 2008 (UTC)

I did it, but Mendeleev, Pavlova, and Korolev came in different size from the rest. Could you please fix that? Besides that it's all perfect. Seni-protect it as defence from vandals and everything is fine. Again, great idea to move the image to a seperate page. Log in, log out (talk) 16:52, 24 June 2008 (UTC)
 * Sorry, i have simply noticed alot of time passed, what about Shanina and Korolev? They should also be entered. Log in, log out (talk) 17:52, 24 June 2008 (UTC)
 * On the Russians page i gave some links, whatever i found. It's bad i dont find anything on Shanina!!! She's the perfect female for the image. Beautiful, brave. Log in, log out (talk) 18:24, 24 June 2008 (UTC)

A barnstar
I wanted to put that on your user page, but i cant edit it so i add it here.

WikiProject Physics participation
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On 2008-06-25, the WikiProject Physics participant list was rewritten from scratch as a way to remove all inactive participants, and to facilitate the coordination of WikiProject Physics efforts. The list now contains more information, is easier to browse, is visually more appealing, and will be maintained up to date.

If you still are an active participant of WikiProject Physics, please add yourself to the current list of WikiProject Physics participants. Headbomb {ταλκ – WP Physics: PotW} 14:58, 25 June 2008 (UTC)

Russians image
1. I gave two links on the Talk:Russians, i think they might be PD. 2. Is it possible to move an image which is not one piece? If yes, how do we do it? Because your image is exelent it really should reach more Wikipedias. Log in, log out (talk) 12:06, 27 June 2008 (UTC)
 * Translations:
 * In the first image Moscow, 37-28. Bellow it, RGAND, is the Russian Govermental archive of Scientific-Techological Documentation.
 * In the second image Kazan, August 44', RGAND.
 * No names of photographers. Log in, log out (talk) 14:23, 27 June 2008 (UTC)

Great work!!! Thanks to your work Russians have the best ethnic group image!!! Exelent!!! Thank you! Log in, log out (talk) 15:53, 27 June 2008 (UTC)

Orphaned non-free media (Image:World Without Us - Covers.png)
Thanks for uploading Image:World Without Us - Covers.png. The media description page currently specifies that it is non-free and may only be used on Wikipedia under a claim of fair use. However, it is currently orphaned, meaning that it is not used in any articles on Wikipedia. If the media was previously in an article, please go to the article and see why it was removed. You may add it back if you think that that will be useful. However, please note that media for which a replacement could be created are not acceptable for use on Wikipedia (see our policy for non-free media).

If you have uploaded other unlicensed media, please check whether they're used in any articles or not. You can find a list of 'image' pages you have edited by clicking on the "my contributions" link (it is located at the very top of any Wikipedia page when you are logged in), and then selecting "Image" from the dropdown box. Note that all non-free media not used in any articles will be deleted after seven days, as described on criteria for speedy deletion. Thank you. BJBot (talk) 05:19, 30 June 2008 (UTC)

Leo
Having not been around for a few days, I was delighted to see that you have created the new page. It looks great! Amandajm (talk) 13:13, 1 July 2008 (UTC)

My turn to be a pest
I hope you can see explain reasoning of justice to the abitration committee, and in the meantime reply to my comment on WP:AN/I because I am more than pissed off now. --Kuban Cossack 08:40, 7 July 2008 (UTC)
 * I have already said everything I want to say at ANI. Papa November (talk) 14:37, 7 July 2008 (UTC)

Could you please help me here?
Hello. A nice guy by my recuest made a new design to my user page. The problem is i dont like the American flag on the north-west of the page. Any chance you help me here? Thank you. Log in, log out (talk) 12:33, 7 July 2008 (UTC)

Resolved?
I think this is now as resolved as it will ever be. I've given apologies to the people I felt needed them. You probably deserve one too. This mess is not your fault and you've had quite a bit of grief because of it. So, sorry for all the hassle. If you want to remove all the pointless bickering from your talk page (including my comments of course), then go ahead. Cheers. --Folantin (talk) 12:36, 7 July 2008 (UTC)
 * Nothing is resolved. This user edit wared, spreat lies, insulted people, got down to a persoanl level. Even now he keeps User:Folantin/Userspace Folantin7 page. And after that he tries to show he changed. Suddnely he feels things turned against him and he plays a confessor. Log in, log out (talk) 17:44, 7 July 2008 (UTC)

Russian migration to the United Kingdom
It was here yesterday if i'm not wrong so i thought someone made the image smaller to vandalise. Can i do the edit he did? Because Coates is a nice idea for the image. A very notable man. And how a banned user could do edits? P.S. How do you do your name is written at the end of the sentence?
 * Thank you. I personaly think that three people in the image are to little, Coates contributed to English music so he's nice. So the banned user wouldn't get what he wants, i symbolicaly placed the image in a different place then he did. I hope that won't provocate him. Log in, log out (talk) 11:52, 21 June 2008 (UTC)

Chechen people talk page
You probably need to hide the sections of the debate involving User:Media Sapiens as well, given he turned out to be yet another incarnation of the notorious banned User:M.V.E.i.. Cheers. --Folantin (talk) 13:26, 11 July 2008 (UTC)

✅ Papa November (talk) 13:39, 11 July 2008 (UTC)