User talk:Patar knight/Archive 4

CSD tagging of The Portland Trust
I have changed the db-g11 tag that you placed on The Portland Trust to db-g12. This is because I performed a Google search of some of the article text, and I noticed that the text was almost identical to that at http://www.portlandtrust.org/. -- IRP ☎ 02:18, 2 April 2009 (UTC)

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The March 2009 issue of the Military history WikiProject newsletter has been published. You may read the newsletter, change the format in which future issues will be delivered to you, or unsubscribe from this notification by following the link. Thank you. This has been an automated delivery by BrownBot (talk) 03:26, 3 April 2009 (UTC)

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Outline of knowledge project summary, and future direction
In response to a friend on Wikipedia who was wondering about how I've been and what I've been up to, I got to spewing about our little endeavor, and well, I got so carried away I pretty much told him everything. :) The message turned out to be a pretty good summary of what we've accomplished so far and the overall plan.

See User talk:The Rambling Man

 Th e Tr ans hu man ist   23:10, 11 April 2009 (UTC)

Re: MikaeyTest
Done. There's so few pages that qualify under the criteria that I'm searching for that I really didn't have a chance to test whether or not the code would actually work. Matt (talk) 22:20, 12 April 2009 (UTC)
 * Basically, it was suggested to me that my bot do a few additional things to pages that have the WPBiography templates on them -- one of those being "try to fill in the 'living' parameter". The suggested method was to set 'living' to 'yes' if the page was a member of Category:Living people or Category:Possibly living people.  The best way I could think to do this was to look at the final HTML-rendered version of the page to see if it mentioned either of those categories, so the code I wrote looks at both the talk page and the mainspace page.  The test was basically to see if the code would handle a situation where the mainspace page was tagged with Category:Living people, but the talk page wasn't, correctly.  Which, after I fixed a minor screwup in my code, it did.  Matt (talk) 00:06, 13 April 2009 (UTC)
 * Teeheehee, whoops, I suppose I should have mentioned that earlier. :-P Matt (talk) 00:21, 13 April 2009 (UTC)

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Update on the Outline of knowledge WikiProject & Geography WikiProject (Country outlines workgroup) - 04/16/2009
Momentum in the development of the outlines is continuing to build, even though we haven't added any new outlines lately. Plenty of work is being done on the outlines we already have.

Keep up the good work everyone!

Inspiration!
Kudos go to Buaidh, who has dived head first into outline development, continuing improvement of the country outlines, and doing so vigorously. Take a look at his contribs. He has taken the initiative and has been expanding those outlines' design and coverage. Be sure to let him know what you think of his work!

Coming soon: the Super Huge Expansion (it will be really really big)
Excitement (mine at least) is building as we approach the Super Huge Expansion, during which notices will be placed on thousands of subject talk pages and their corresponding WikiProjects (see below concerning which ones). Though not all on the same day! - this will take place over a period of weeks or months, because it's best not to open the flood gates all at once.

The existing outlines should serve as strong examples for editors who wish to develop new outlines, and so we need to complete them as much as we can before we start to take this to the next level (in about 3 months). The rewrite of the outline article (the draft, which explains outlines in detail), and the guideline on outlines and outline development, also need to be completed before the transcendence begins. These will help guide the decisions and actions of editors, and reduce confusion.

Projected outline, at the OOK WikiProject page
What's next? Where is the Outline of knowledge headed?

Well, it will grow, to encompass all of human knowledge.

But, is there a plan?

YES!!!

Currently under construction on the Outline of knowledge WikiProject page is a version of the outline that will display links to all the outline pages currently in the encyclopedia proper, links to all outline drafts, and redlinks to all planned outline drafts.

You can help. Please place links to the remaining drafts in there (with complete pagenames so we can easily tell they are drafts). Once all the draft pages are placed, please look over the overall outline for gaps in coverage, and add missing subjects. I expect there are thousands of missing subjects extensive enough to benefit from being outlined. New subjects should be included as red draft links. Thank you.

But it's not just an editing task list...

During the upcoming "Super Huge Expansion" (mentioned above), the article talk page and WikiProject for each of the subjects listed on the projected outline will receive a notice requesting the creation and development of the outline page for that subject. Each notice will also explain how a subject's outline will integrate into the Outline of knowledge and into Wikipedia's navigation system as a whole.

See WikiProject Outline of knowledge.

Topic lists
The nice thing about a reverse outline is that it turns up problems that exist in the publication being outlined, which provides opportunities to fix them. Since we get very little or no opposition to fixing problems even on sets of hundreds of pages, we've been plowing through them.

One of the biggest problems in Wikipedia that our work on the Outline of knowledge has uncovered so far is with the set of topics lists. Their titles, in the forms "List of x topics" and "List of x-related topics" are ambiguous, and they are not the most common terms for describing their content. See WP:COMMONNAME. To make matters worse, the set is divided between 2 competing types/sets of pages: alphabetical indexes, and outlines.

In an effort to sort out this mess, the indexes are being renamed, and the outlines are being reformatted and moved, or merged, into the Outline of knowledge.

So far, almost 300 topic lists have been renamed to indexes. Nobody has objected to the names chosen, but one editor has expressed reservation on the approach - he was concerned it would cause confusion by having 2 title standards in place at the same time for these. Though he himself was not confused, nor did he object to the titles. And nobody else has expressed confusion or dissatisfaction with the new titles either. It has been over 2 weeks since the renaming has begun, and since no confusion seems to have been caused, and since there is no opposition to the new names, I plan to continue with the renaming.

Also, one topic list has been merged into its corresponding outline so far: List of transport topics was merged into Outline of transport. It turned out very good. List of cell biology topics is currently being merged into Outline of cell biology (see the link dump in hidden comments at the end of the outline).

I'm not sure how many lists have "topics" in their titles, but Google turned up 788, and these appear to include the ones that have already been renamed to indexes. Subtracting those renamed so far, there are about 500 more to go.

Watching tips
I thought you might want to compare notes on the methods we use to watch over the outlines. Here's how I keep an eye on things...

My watchlist had so many thousands of articles in it that I finally just deleted them all. Now I have it set so that I have to manually add pages to be watched, and I use it only to watch trouble spots and collaborations I'm participating in.

Because I like to watch specific sets of pages at a time, I use "Related changes" on list pages. That way the results are not watered down with edits from pages I'm not immediately concerned with.

I always use WP:POP and Related changes together. With POP installed, you go to a link list, like User:Buaidh/Country outlines of the Americas, then click on "Related changes" in the toolbox menu, and then hover the mouse cursor over the diff and hist links so you can look at those without clicking on them.

It's pretty fast.

The technique turns Wikipedia's list system into a crystal ball.

Update Scanner
Penubag recommends Update Scanner, which is a Firefox add-on that periodically scans pages and pings you when a change is detected. You can even set its level of sensitivity for each scanned page (e.g., "ignore changes of 100 words or less").

I'd use it, but I don't have a computer. :(

See also WP:OTS for more power tools and techniques, and User:Penubag/optimum toolsets for some more nice addons, that do a variety of things.

I'm always looking for new power tools and power skills, so if you know of any, please share (let me know)!

 Th e Tr ans hu man ist   04:42, 16 April 2009 (UTC)

Do not read this one - The Hunt - Outline of knowledge WikiProject - 04/17/2009
Here's a trivia question for you...

While surveying libraries, their outline-related resources, and our coverage of them, I came across something funny...

What subclass is the Bible in the Library of Congress Classification?

Do you think they'd like this one at WP:DYK? (Nope. They didn't.)     :)

Libraries
For months, I've been sitting at a terminal in one of the largest libraries in the country, and I haven't even looked around at the available resources.

Until a few days ago.

I'm overwhelmed.

When compared to libraries, Wikipedia is small. (See Digest of Education Statistics 2008, Chapter 7:Libraries and Educational Technology Libraries, and turn to page 617).

But is that a fair comparison?

Yes.

Why?

Because we have growth potential. :)

And we cover everything, including libraries!

Guess what else I found?

Hunting for outlines
I began to study libraries and librarians, since they are experts in organizing knowledge. And of course I turned to Wikipedia to see what we had on the things I came across...

And while doing so I kept running into outlines on Wikipedia that are not (yet) part of the Outline of knowledge.

When I come across non-OOK outlines, generally I rename them, and reformat them to our standard outline format. But there is the occasional exception.

Here are some outlines I just added:


 * 1) List of energy topics --> Outline of energy (it converted great)
 * 2) List of Dewey Decimal classes --> Outline of Dewey Decimal classes (no conversion)
 * 3) Library of Congress Classification --> ??? (no rename, no conversion)

The last 2 are outlines by their very nature, and so our standard outline subheadings didn't seem to fit. So I left them as is.

I renamed the first 2, but the last one is the name of the outline, that is, the topic itself is an outline, and that outline is presented as the article's content, so I left the name as is. For now. This needs more thought.

Of course, that's not all. Concerning those last 2 outlines above...

Alternate outlines of knowledge
...not only are they outlines, but they are outlines of knowledge! Well, the top few levels, at least.

Uh, so?

What happens if we linkify them? :)

That is, what happens if we linkify their classifications to Wikipedia's outlines? :)  :)   :)

They become alternate top ends to the OOK
Yep.

What can you find?
I challenge you to find some "hidden" outlines.

I dare you to take a look around Wikipedia for hidden outlines (that is, outlines not yet hooked into the OOK), and add your kills to WP:WPOOK.

My trophies are already there.

May the hunt begin!
 Th e Tr ans hu man ist   20:33, 17 April 2009 (UTC)

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Battle of Yevenes
May you take a look once again? belissarius (talk) 02:43, 25 April 2009 (UTC)

I hate to bug you, but
You sent me a basically complete evidence weeks ago, and you haven't posted it. I am sorry times 100 the leverage of SKF for bugging you, but when's that evidence coming?Teeninvestor (talk) 00:21, 28 April 2009 (UTC)

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Bullets with numbers or letters
At Requests for arbitration/Tang Dynasty/Evidence, the specificity of your contribution demonstrates an investment of time and thoughtful attention which is welcome.

Please consider modifying the bullets by adding numbers or letters so that I am able to respond more effectively? --Tenmei (talk) 02:02, 5 May 2009 (UTC)

Re:5000 Years
Oh ya, I do own the book. But how to scan it, I will have to receive instructions on how to scan it as my printer is connected to a 98.Teeninvestor (talk) 12:19, 5 May 2009 (UTC)
 * Oh ya, by the way, thank you for posting your evidence and sorry for bugging(which I don't have to do now!).Teeninvestor (talk) 12:23, 5 May 2009 (UTC)

The Military history WikiProject Newsletter : Issue XXXVIII (April 2009)
The April 2009 issue of the Military history WikiProject newsletter has been published. You may read the newsletter, change the format in which future issues will be delivered to you, or unsubscribe from this notification by following the link. Thank you. This has been an automated delivery by BrownBot (talk) 23:57, 5 May 2009 (UTC)

Albanian is English now?
Happy to help. Regards, Mr Stephen (talk) 22:32, 7 May 2009 (UTC)

Translation Izet Mexhiti
I want to translate the page of Izet Mexhiti from Albanian into English, how do I do that? —Preceding unsigned comment added by Dini89 (talk • contribs) 11:22, 8 May 2009 (UTC)

Tenmei disses you
diff Calls your evidence meritless.Teeninvestor (talk) 19:20, 8 May 2009 (UTC)

Just gets better and better. He removed large amounts of info and sources from the article just because he didn't agree with it. It is vandalism, I tell you. diff diff diff diff. You know what's funny? He provided me with these links. This guy's a gem.Teeninvestor (talk) 21:07, 8 May 2009 (UTC)


 * I posted what I think should be Tenmei's punishment. Please have a look at workshop.Teeninvestor (talk) 23:45, 9 May 2009 (UTC)


 * He just posted a 19kb "response" to your evidence. lol. He justifies calling editors toxic because it's a way to identify them and say "it is truly a PRC sponsered shril". Gem.Teeninvestor (talk) 11:28, 12 May 2009 (UTC)

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What are the benefits of a tree structure?
The article doesn't say.

I'm interested, because I need to explain the benefits in the guideline on outlines I'm writing. (Outlines are a type of tree structure).

I've also asked the question at various reference desks, and these threads may help to jump start your brain on this question. :)


 * Reference desk/Science
 * Reference desk/Mathematics
 * Reference desk/Humanities
 * Reference desk/Language
 * Reference desk/Miscellaneous

What are the benefits of outlines, over and above regular articles?
What benefits have you noticed?

How are Wikipedia's outlines useful to you?

I look forward to your answers on my talk page.

 Th e Tr ans hu man ist   04:39, 14 May 2009 (UTC)

Discussion at Talk:United States Army Installation Management Command
Hello,

I removed some comments from the talk page of United States Army Installation Management Command that to me did not appear relevant to the topic and looked like forum discussions. I'm asking for a second opinion as to whether that was the case or if the original posters are correct in posting their comments there. I'm also wondering if Gamblindude's comments in Talk:Stars and Stripes (newspaper) are also legitimate or should be removed. Thanks. -- Broken Sphere Msg me 05:58, 17 May 2009 (UTC)

WPOOK Update - 05/17/2009 - Blockbusting!
This project needs another shot in the arm.

So here it goes...

Countries WikiProject Collaboration - Contests!
I've contacted all 59 members of the Countries WikiProject to help in designing and conducting contests for the further development of the country outlines.

You are invited too.

Houston, we have a problem
The guidelines and outline article still aren't complete.

Which means you will be needed to help explain to the newcomers mentioned above what outlines are and how to develop them.

Please participate in the discussion at Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Countries.

 Th e Tr ans hu man ist   22:25, 17 May 2009 (UTC)

Bank of China Centre
Yes, I typed it wrong. Thanks for your correction! Ricky@36 (talk) 15:14, 18 May 2009 (UTC)

North Staffordshire Regiment
Thanks for your offer to conduct a copy-edit review. I think that aspect of the article is as good as its going to get with my grammatical standards. NtheP (talk) 17:27, 18 May 2009 (UTC)
 * nice job. Thanks NtheP (talk) 13:33, 23 May 2009 (UTC)

A question for you, concerning a possible contest...
To promote work on the country outlines, maybe a contest between country WikiProjects could be run, to see which WikiProject could develop the best country outline.

What do you think?

(I look forward to your reply on my talk page).

 Th e Tr ans hu man ist   23:53, 18 May 2009 (UTC)

Re:A question for you, concerning a possible contest...
I haven't been active on the outlines for a while now, but I understand that certain country outlines are significantly better than others? So wouldn't that mean an unfair advantage for certain country WikiProjects? --Patar knight - chat/contributions 01:03, 19 May 2009 (UTC)


 * Good point. The same can be said for different schools in a league.  Like those schools with more students, better funding, etc.  But yes, some of the outlines are WAY better.  So how about this... When we send out the invites, if that's the approach we decide to take, we can skip inviting those WikiProjects for which the outline is already completed.  What do you think?   Th e Tr ans hu man ist    01:12, 19 May 2009 (UTC)
 * Then we'll need to have a criteria for each league? Or for inclusion in the "near-complete" league, which would be left out? Are outlines eligible for FL status? Then we could still have a league for the best outlines. --Patar knight - chat/contributions 01:28, 19 May 2009 (UTC)


 * Technically they are eligible for FL, but I wouldn't want to see a link dropped just because they couldn't find a citation for it. And that's really what FL's are all about: citations.  The FL people also frown on redlinks, and those are an integral part of outlines (the topic of a link is as important to include as the link itself).  So that pretty much nixes FL as a viable option.


 * The outlines that are most developed include Outline of the United States and Outline of the United Kingdom (extensive links), and those with lots of picture support include Outline of France, Outline of Japan, Outline of Vatican City, Outline of Taiwan, Outline of Thailand, Outline of Japan, and Outline of Iceland.  Th e Tr ans hu man ist    01:40, 19 May 2009 (UTC)


 * Come to think of it, the ones with pictures, I did each of those in about a day. So if the contest lasts 2 months, that's not that big of a deal.  We could give the almost completeds less time?   Th e Tr ans hu man ist    01:47, 19 May 2009 (UTC)
 * Well for the more complete ones, the challenge could be to get those redlinks into well-sourced articles, and to get citations for the outline? It's not impossible, and it would give the average content contributor something they're used to doing. The outlines you linked to are looking good, much better since I stopped working on them a while ago. Heh, makes me feel proud to have done a bit. Well anyways, two months sounds a bit long, and enthusiasm and activity tends to wane. The MILHIST B-class assessment drive, and Tag & Assess 2008 drive both lasted about 1.5 months. --Patar knight - chat/contributions 01:57, 19 May 2009 (UTC)
 * I've copied this thread to Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Countries. I suggest we continue the discussion there.  ;)   Th e Tr ans hu man ist    02:04, 19 May 2009 (UTC)
 * I've replied to your latest reply, there.  Th e Tr ans hu man ist    02:09, 19 May 2009 (UTC)

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Battle of Bologna assess
What's wrong with "Referencing and citation"? Please explain on that article's talk. Thanks, --Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus 23:17, 20 May 2009 (UTC)
 * Thanks. What about "coverage and accuracy"? --Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus 12:37, 24 May 2009 (UTC)

ArbCom update
A proposal for the solution of the Tang Dynasty case on ArbCom has been developed, in which several sanctions have been suggested for Tenmei. You may be interested in the ongoing discussion herediff.Teeninvestor (talk) 01:31, 22 May 2009 (UTC)

Has the shit hit the fan? - WPOOK update, 05/25/2009
Maybe...

We've started the next phase
I was experiencing mental block on the article draft for "outline" and on the outline guideline draft. And this was holding the whole project back. Without these (which are intended to explain the type of lists known as outlines in detail), the danger is higher that a controversy could go the wrong way.

I requested help on them, but there was none forthcoming.

So I went ahead and started us on the next phase of operations without those 2 pages...

Our AWB'ers and I have placed about '''1600 notices all over Wikipedia. And the plan is to place several thousand more'''.

This generated only one complaint, but it was a very vocal one, and attracted a few other detractors who seemed unfamiliar with the concept of hierarchical outlines and their benefits. However, just as many or more editors came to the defense of the OOK, and there was no consensus formed. But, dab is still trying to rally opposition to outlines at the Village Pump. See below...

Administrator noticeboard incident and Village Pump policy discussion
It appears that the banner placed on the talk page of the Outline of Switzerland caught the attention of an editor named Dbachmann who posted a rather forceful message on my talk page, another on WT:WPOOK, another at WP:VPP, and still another at WP:AN!

He went well out of his way to use negative hype to cause a stir.

It appears that Mr. Bachmann doesn't understand the nature of hierarchical outlines and their applications. And though he implied that he has never seen an OOK outline before, he was involved with a discussion on these when they were called "lists of basic topics".

His primary argument is that outlines are content forks of articles, and violate WP:CFORK.

But "topic lists", of which outlines are a type, have been around for almost as long as Wikipedia, and fall under the WP:LISTS and WP:STAND guidelines. They aren't intended as forks, as they are lists, bringing the benefits of lists to the corresponding subjects, such as grouping and navigation.

Someone suggested an MfD, but lists are articles, and are within the jurisdiction of AfD. Only the portal page, which merely lists the outline articles, falls within the scope of the MfD department.

The administrator's noticeboard was considered the wrong venue for the discussion, and the discussion was closed.

But Dab's discussion at the Village Pump is still active. Hopefully level heads will prevail there too.

Now what?
Am I disheartened or deterred? Hell no. I say "full steam ahead!"

But we really need to finish the article draft and the guideline. Otherwise there will continue to be confusion.

Over the next week or two, we'll be posting another 1600 or so notices. It's a good thing we didn't send out 10,000 of them all at once. :)

 Th e Tr ans hu man ist   23:37, 24 May 2009 (UTC)

P.S.: Another related thread has popped up at WP:VPR. --TT  04:30, 25 May 2009 (UTC)

Kennen
Hey, Patar

As you know I am new, but I'm not sure where to upload photos to put onto topics like the General Atomics Avenger and the PDW I made earlier. If you could give me a link that would be much appriciated. I'm a serious military person and I'm tryin' really hard not to screw anythin' up.

P.S. I wasn't sure where to put the tildes and it would help if I knew where, as well.

Thank you, Sir.

Kennen —Preceding unsigned comment added by Brody Kennen (talk • contribs) 02:00, 25 May 2009 (UTC)

email
ping.

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WPOOK update - 05/27/2009
Input on the OOK threads at the Village Pump has died down (at both WP:VPP and WP:VPR), and there is currently no consensus on either.

Negative feedback
For the number of notices we posted (over a thousand) the number of complaints we received (the two VP threads mentioned above) was quite low.

Silent majority
Considering most of the outlines are orphans, they get pretty good use.

Note that people who are happy with articles on Wikipedia generally don't say anything, so I simply interpret it as positive feedback.

Traffic, traffic comparison, and increasing traffic
Using Traffic, I compare the traffic of articles, their corresponding outlines, and their corresponding portals from time to time.

Outlines are starting to catch up to portals. Though the main portals, which are included in a navbar menu at the top of most portals are still way ahead of their outline counterparts.

Both outlines and portals are way behind the articles on the same subjects. Articles usually have 20 to 30 times the traffic.

Keep in mind that most outlines are orphans, with the primary link to them being Portal:Contents/Outline of knowledge.

Traffic should improve once we include links on the corresponding subject pages, including the main subject as well as subjects that correspond to subheadings (e.g., History of x, and in the case of countries: Geography of x, Demographics of x, Culture of x, etc.)

I'm convinced the traffic of outlines will overtake portals once we've link-integrated them into the encyclopedia. And since outlines serve as tables of contents for each subject, it seems most fitting to place links to them in the form of hatnotes at the top of each subject's main articles (and the sub-subjects mentioned in the paragraph directly above).

By the way, there's another traffic counter called Wikirank, but I haven't tested it out much yet, but will do so in the coming weeks.

Going for the Main Page
Once the traffic of outlines has overtaken portals, it will be time to replace portals on the Main Page, even if we need to spearhead a new main page redesign! This isn't a far-fetched idea. I was the one who jumpstarted and led the project responsible for the current main page design (until it hit critical mass and attracted other leaders), and I was also the most active editor on that project. I even created the WP:CBB on the Community Portal to promote the main page election. The second time around should be easier.

Back to the here and now
Targetting the Main Page is a few months off.

Right now, we need to continue posting notices and start link-integrating the OOK into the encyclopedia.

I have a whole slew of AWB tasks to assign. I hope you are ready. :)

Spread the word
WP:WPOOK needs members. Tell all your friends about the OOK, and get them to join.

 Th e Tr ans hu man ist   02:48, 27 May 2009 (UTC)

Molly walsh
Hey, Patar Knight The CSD tag you placed on Molly Walsh was incorrect it would not be under CSD A7 it would constitute vandalism as it only contained Molly Walsh has huge tits. Please read this it may help you. Happy Editing, Otis  Jimmy  One  23:36, 27 May 2009 (UTC)

Speedy deletion nomination of SaketAgarwal
A tag has been placed on SaketAgarwal requesting that it be speedily deleted from Wikipedia. This has been done under section A7 of the criteria for speedy deletion, because the article appears to be about a person or group of people, but it does not indicate how or why the subject is important or significant: that is, why an article about that subject should be included in an encyclopedia. Under the criteria for speedy deletion, such articles may be deleted at any time. Please see the guidelines for what is generally accepted as notable, as well as our subject-specific notability guideline for biographies.

If you think that this notice was placed here in error, you may contest the deletion by adding  to the top of the page that has been nominated for deletion (just below the existing speedy deletion or "db" tag), coupled with adding a note on the talk page explaining your position, but be aware that once tagged for speedy deletion, if the page meets the criterion it may be deleted without delay. Please do not remove the speedy deletion tag yourself, but don't hesitate to add information to the page that would render it more in conformance with Wikipedia's policies and guidelines. Lastly, please note that if the page does get deleted, you can contact one of these admins to request that they userfy the page or have a copy emailed to you. rannṗáirtí anaiṫnid (coṁrá) 22:04, 28 May 2009 (UTC)


 * OK. Thanks. --rannṗáirtí anaiṫnid (coṁrá) 22:19, 28 May 2009 (UTC)

Removing Speedy at SaketAgarwal
Please do not remove speedy deletion tags from articles you created. If you do not believe the article deserves to be deleted, then please do the following: Administrators will look at your reasoning before deciding what to do with the article. Thank you. - SDPatrolBot (talk) 22:09, 28 May 2009 (UTC)
 * 1) Place   on the page. Please do not remove any existing speedy deletion tag(s).
 * 2) Make your case on the article's .
 * Methinks the bot needs to understand the difference between creating and renaming an article:) Good luck in your RFA.  Ϣere Spiel  Chequers  13:18, 21 June 2009 (UTC)

Tenmei 2
NYB has finished posting at proposed decision. You may want to comment.Teeninvestor (talk) 20:21, 29 May 2009 (UTC)

Why do we have outlines in addition to...?
Outlines was growing so large that I split this section off as a separate page.

I look forward to your feedback and improvements.

 Th e Tr ans hu man ist   22:43, 29 May 2009 (UTC)

Economic history of China(Pre-1911)
What would be needed to bring it up to GA standards???? Once summer starts my goal is to bring that article up to GA status. Teeninvestor (talk) 02:07, 30 May 2009 (UTC)


 * Do you know a good copyeditor that could help bring this article up to standard?Teeninvestor (talk) 22:45, 1 June 2009 (UTC)