User talk:Petergstrom

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Welcome!
Hello, Petergstrom, and welcome to Wikipedia. We appreciate encyclopedic contributions, but some of your recent contributions, such as your edit to the page Milo (drink), have removed content without an explanation. If you'd like to experiment with the wiki's syntax, please do so in the sandbox rather than in articles.

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Warning
You do not have a right to revert well-sourced content. If you do not agree with something, you're welcome to bring fresher references to make the content more neutral, but you cannot remove it altogether. --Hyperforin (talk) 21:00, 15 November 2016 (UTC)

Well sourced my ass. You cited fringes work WP:OR There is plenty of work done on "Multiple chemical sensitivity" and on "psychopathy". Regardless, they are not accepted by major medical organizations or in the scientific community, so they are fringe works.


 * Huh. They are peer-reviewed review articles, and have also been well cited in turn. You claim of WP:OR is unfounded. I recommend familiarizing yourself with the research. At minimum, an adaptogenic PED refers to a class of stimulatory herbs that work by nontraditional stimulatory mechanisms. The bottomline is that they do work in practice. At what point does something go from being fringe to being accepted? How is this demarcation defined? --Hyperforin (talk) 21:36, 15 November 2016 (UTC)

Your articles are citing studies from the USSR, what are you doing? The term Adaptogen is not recognized in the scientific community.
 * It's not my job to study the chain of citations. For the most part, it is sufficient that I find PubMed indexed review references. The references I added are Swedish. There is no geographic prohibition on Wikipedia. If your scientific community is blind, that is your problem. --Hyperforin (talk) 21:59, 15 November 2016 (UTC)


 * Additionally, WP:3RR is a bright-line rule. There are only a limited number of exceptions to it, and this edit does not qualify. If you have concerns about the material, take it to the article's talk page, but do not revert again. —C.Fred (talk) 22:03, 15 November 2016 (UTC)

Just because it is on pubmed that does NOT make something credible. It is your job to study the chain of citations. The fact is wether or not the study was published swedish, it was a meta-analysis that used studies from back in the USSR...that was 30 years ago in a totally different culture with different scientific standards. The study is not of good enough quality, and does not belong on wikipedia, and neither does the pseudoscientific term "adaptogen". It is something you find in three places 1. Homeopathic/naturopathic supplement websites along with methods to combat "adrenal fatigue" 2. Fringe research 3. "Health bloggers". The term does not belong on wikipedia

Petergstrom (talk) 22:07, 15 November 2016 (UTC)


 * FWIW, have you personally tried these so called adaptogenic herbs? I have tried ginseng, and it very clearly does work. Millions of Chinese use ginseng regularly, similar to how Americans use tea and coffee. My friends have tried stronger ginseng extracts and other adaptogenic herbs, and found positive results. I am not sure why are not a bit more open minded. Granted, they don't quite work the same as amphetamine. Finally, I never referred to "adrenal fatigue" or health blogs or anything like that -- you're confusing things. --Hyperforin (talk) 22:10, 15 November 2016 (UTC)

Obviously biased by personal experiences. The point of the statement was that the term adaptogen is not accepted in the scientific community, it is a joke. Really, get rid of that section. Petergstrom (talk) 22:13, 15 November 2016 (UTC)
 * Is it bias that led me to it too in the first place? No, it's the research. Anyway, ginseng is not even one of the noted herbs in the section. The point that something is accepted or not is irrelevant for the dissemination of scholarly ideas. For example, entropic gravity is not accepted as a theory for dark matter, but it is still a theory in its own right, deserving of an article. I understand your concern about the quality of the reference and I will examine it. --Hyperforin (talk) 22:20, 15 November 2016 (UTC)


 * For the record, both multiple chemical sensitivity and psychopathy have sound articles on Wikipedia. Your belief that they are fringe works is inconsequential. --Hyperforin (talk) 22:29, 15 November 2016 (UTC)

Really? Did you just support the diagnosis of multiple chemical sensitivity and psychopathy? Do you also believe vaccines cause autism, because wikipedia has an article on it? This is some real fringe stuff. Adaptogens, MCS, psychopathy, all of them are researched, however they are not accepted in the general community. You cant add them to wikipedia WP:OR and WP:NPOV Petergstrom (talk) 22:38, 15 November 2016 (UTC)


 * I have no opinion on MCS; it's not something I have studied. As for psychopaths (sociopaths), I have known some - they are real. Consider yourself lucky if you haven't known any. It is evident that your definition of "general community" is a closed inbreeding group that only sees and hears what fits its prior beliefs. --Hyperforin (talk) 22:45, 15 November 2016 (UTC)

November 2016
Your recent editing history at Performance-enhancing substance shows that you are currently engaged in an edit war. To resolve the content dispute, please do not revert or change the edits of others when you are reverted. Instead of reverting, please use the talk page to work toward making a version that represents consensus among editors. The best practice at this stage is to discuss, not edit-war. See BRD for how this is done. If discussions reach an impasse, you can then post a request for help at a relevant noticeboard or seek dispute resolution. In some cases, you may wish to request temporary page protection.

Being involved in an edit war can result in your being blocked from editing&mdash;especially if you violate the three-revert rule, which states that an editor must not perform more than three reverts on a single page within a 24-hour period. Undoing another editor's work—whether in whole or in part, whether involving the same or different material each time—counts as a revert. Also keep in mind that while violating the three-revert rule often leads to a block, you can still be blocked for edit warring&mdash;even if you don't violate the three-revert rule&mdash;should your behavior indicate that you intend to continue reverting repeatedly. --Cameron11598 (Talk) 01:50, 16 November 2016 (UTC)

You have been blocked from editing for a period of 24 hours for edit warring, as you did at Performance-enhancing substance. Once the block has expired, you are welcome to make useful contributions. If you think there are good reasons why you should be unblocked, you may request an unblock by first reading the guide to appealing blocks, then adding the following text to the bottom of your talk page:. During a dispute, you should first try to discuss controversial changes and seek consensus. If that proves unsuccessful, you are encouraged to seek dispute resolution, and in some cases it may be appropriate to request page protection.  ~Oshwah~  (talk) (contribs)   01:51, 16 November 2016 (UTC) -->

formatting refs
Quick note, that there is a very easy and fast way to do citations, which often also provides a link that allows readers to more easily find the source being cited.

You will notice that when you are in an edit window, that up at the top there is a toolbar. On the right, it says "Cite" and there is a little triangle next to it. If you click the triangle, another menu appears below. On the left side of the new menu bar, you will see "Templates". If you select (for example) "Cite journal", you can fill in the "doi" or the "PMID" field, and then if you click the little magnifying glass next to the field, the whole thing will auto-fill. Then you click the "insert" button at the bottom, and it will insert a ref like this (I changed the ref tags so it shows):
 * (ref) (/ref)

That takes about 10 seconds. As you can see there are templates for books, news, and websites, as well as journal articles, and each template has at least one field that you can use to autofill the rest. The autofill isn't perfect and I usually have to manually fix some things before I click "insert" but it generally works great and saves a bunch of time.

The PMID parameter is the one we care about the most. It is how we can tell quickly if a ref is a primary or secondary source. When you are editing health content, please always use the PMID.

One thing the autofill doesn't do, is add the PMC field if it is there (PMC is a link to a free fulltext version of the article). you can add that after you insert the citation, or -- while you have the "cite journal" template open --  you can click the "show/hide extra fields" button at the bottom,  and you will see the PMC field on the right, near the bottom. If you add the PMC number there that will be included, like this (again I have changed the ref tags):
 * (ref) (/ref)

The autofill also doesn't add the URL if there is a free fulltext that is not in PMC. You can add that manually too, after you autofill with PMID.

It would be great if you could do this when editing about health at least. Thanks! Jytdog (talk) 09:18, 19 November 2016 (UTC)
 * You persist in adding content about health cited to refs without citing the PMID. Please include the PMID in citations. Please. Jytdog (talk) 23:42, 20 November 2016 (UTC)

Jytdog (talk) 19:32, 22 November 2016 (UTC)

The content was sourced!! What are you talking about?

what about adding this source https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2939140/
 * have you read WP:MEDRS? at least read WP:MEDDEF.  Please let me know if you have read and are engaging with this essential guideline. Thanks.  Jytdog (talk) 20:25, 22 November 2016 (UTC)

-->

Jytdog (talk) 19:32, 22 November 2016 (UTC) -->

Editing Wikipedia
Every time you edit Wikipedia and click "save", you have already agreed to follow the Terms of Use. (if you reply, while you have the edit window open, look down, below "Watch this page" and above the "save changes" button. It says: "By saving changes, you agree to the Terms of Use, and you irrevocably agree to release your contribution under the CC BY-SA 3.0 License and the GFDL. You agree that a hyperlink or URL is sufficient attribution under the Creative Commons license."

If you read the Terms of Use, they say: ":The Wikimedia community and its members may also take action when so allowed by the community or Foundation policies applicable to the specific Project edition, including but not limited to warning, investigating, blocking, or banning users who violate those policies. You agree to comply with the final decisions of dispute resolution bodies that are established by the community for the specific Project editions (such as arbitration committees); these decisions may include sanctions as set out by the policy of the specific Project edition."

If you read the WP policy on policies and guidelines, it explains the role that policies and guidelines play in the Wikipedia community.

WP:MEDRS is a crucial guideline.

You cannot just keep ignoring it. Please read and follow it. If you don't understand it, please ask, and I will be happy to explain it.

Thanks Jytdog (talk) 04:47, 23 November 2016 (UTC)


 * I did read it. I am not ignoring it, the sources are totally valid, stop reverting the edits.
 * The refs are not valid per MEDRS. This is just not some "rule" somebody pulled out of their butt.  The community developed it for very good reasons and we apply it consistently for very good reasons. If you don't understand why the community developed MEDRS please ask.  Please. Jytdog (talk) 05:29, 23 November 2016 (UTC)
 * Yes we need secondary sources such as review articles not primary sources. Doc James  (talk · contribs · email) 04:08, 24 November 2016 (UTC)

WP:MEDRS doesn't say that secondary or tertiary sources are necessary, there is a section on wording primary sources. It says that they generally should not be used. Generally.

Reference errors on 25 November
Hello, I'm ReferenceBot. I have automatically detected that an edit performed by you may have introduced errors in referencing. as follows: Please check this page and fix the errors highlighted. If you think this is a false positive, you can [//en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?action=edit&preload=User:A930913/RBpreload&editintro=User:A930913/RBeditintro&minor=&title=User_talk:A930913&preloadtitle=ReferenceBot%20–%20&section=new report it to my operator]. Thanks, ReferenceBot (talk) 00:19, 26 November 2016 (UTC)
 * On the Antidepressant page, [//en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?diff=751445944 your edit] caused a PMID error (help) . ([ Fix] | [//en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Wikipedia:Help_desk&action=edit&section=new&preload=User:ReferenceBot/helpform&preloadtitle=Referencing%20errors%20on%20%5B%5BSpecial%3ADiff%2F751445944%7CAntidepressant%5D%5D Ask for help])

Reference errors on 29 November
ReferenceBot (talk) 00:17, 30 November 2016 (UTC) --> Jytdog (talk) 20:22, 30 November 2016 (UTC)

MEDRS doesn't specific that primary sources have to be avoided. I have justification for the use of the primary sources, it is not my POV that is being forced onto the page.Petergstrom (talk) 20:30, 30 November 2016 (UTC)
 * Consensus is that we use secondary sources for medical content. Doc James  (talk · contribs · email) 20:52, 30 November 2016 (UTC)

So...follow MEDRS religiously until you don't agree with it? Petergstrom (talk) 20:56, 30 November 2016 (UTC)


 * pasting content here that was left on my talk page in this dif, to keep discussion in one place Jytdog (talk) 21:08, 30 November 2016 (UTC)
 * MEDRS doesn't specific that primary sources have to be avoided. I have justification for the use of the primary sources, it is not my POV that is being forced onto the page.Petergstrom (talk) 20:30, 30 November 2016 (UTC) — Preceding unsigned comment added by Petergstrom (talk • contribs)
 * MEDRS says what we should do; when policies and guidelines say "should" they mean "should" - you need a good reason to do something different, and you have refused to justify your blowing off the guideline. It actually is OK to use primary sources from time to time (rarely) and you do need to justify when you do it. Jytdog (talk) 21:08, 30 November 2016 (UTC)


 * And more importantly, if the community allows you to pick some random primary sources and add content based on them, we have to let everyone do that. We have to let the autism advocate and the salesperson from Pfizer and the person who believes in Powerful Herbs do it too - in other words, all kinds of garbage content comes streaming into WP.   That is what you are arguing for.  Why would you do that?  That is a real question. Jytdog (talk) 21:22, 30 November 2016 (UTC)
 * Please do answer the question above. Thanks. Jytdog (talk) 21:56, 30 November 2016 (UTC)

Just because primary sources are used, doesn't mean low quality alternative medicine ideas can be brought inPetergstrom (talk) 22:01, 30 November 2016 (UTC)
 * You are not getting it. Everything in WP starts with sources.  Not my opinion or yours about what is good science or not. There are so, so many arguments we avoid by excluding content due to the sources it was based on.  We would waste an incredible amount of dealing with shitty content if we allowed people to use primary sources freely.  Again, this was the reason MEDRS was developed.   It saves us from so many horrible arguments with advocates of all kinds.   When you have been around a while this will become more clear to you.  Jytdog (talk)

Sounds good dad.Petergstrom (talk) 00:00, 1 December 2016 (UTC)
 * That's exactly what it means, because "low quality alternative medicine ideas" show up in lots of primary sources, but don't appear in the high quality secondary sources that MEDRS requires (other than to be debunked). Here are the ideas you want inserted into CFS:
 * "altered cytokines early in the course of the disease compared to those with longer term disease" - sourced to a single 2015 study;
 * "altered cytokine levels that differed between severe and moderate CFS patients" - sourced to a a single 2015 study;
 * Why should those specific ideas override the present article text? "Elevated levels of cytokines involved in generating sickness behavior have been found in those with CFS, however the results have not been consistent." - sourced to a 2008 systematic review, and affirming that results have been found to vary from one study to another. Once you accept what the secondary source is saying about inconsistent results, you can see that there's no point in trying to cite individual studies because you have no basis to assume that these are not outliers. Now do you understand? --RexxS (talk) 00:06, 1 December 2016 (UTC)
 * Why should those specific ideas override the present article text? "Elevated levels of cytokines involved in generating sickness behavior have been found in those with CFS, however the results have not been consistent." - sourced to a 2008 systematic review, and affirming that results have been found to vary from one study to another. Once you accept what the secondary source is saying about inconsistent results, you can see that there's no point in trying to cite individual studies because you have no basis to assume that these are not outliers. Now do you understand? --RexxS (talk) 00:06, 1 December 2016 (UTC)

yeeeee. I actually think that I put that sentence in there. https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Chronic_fatigue_syndrome&type=revision&diff=750134833&oldid=749952834


 * so we have this discussion, and then you do this. Please consider this a last warning.  Either start following MEDRS of I will seek to have you topic banned from editing about health.  There is way too much work to be done here for us to constantly clean up after you.  Your editing is becoming a time sink for the rest of us. Jytdog (talk) 18:59, 3 December 2016 (UTC)

Fine dad. Here is a secondary source that mentions trauma:


 * You can take what I am saying lightly if you want. You shouldn't.  It seems that you could be a good contributor but I mean it; we have too few committed editors and you are wasting their time cleaning up after you.  I will seek a topic ban the next time you add content about health based on a primary source without getting consensus on the associated talk page first. Jytdog (talk) 23:29, 3 December 2016 (UTC)

Yea I got how this place works, I will stop using primary sources unless justified and run through other editors. Petergstrom (talk) 23:45, 3 December 2016 (UTC)

-->

hyperforin
don't know if you noticed this. That editor finally lost it. Was difficult to work with them, but that is unhappy. Jytdog (talk) 22:17, 30 November 2016 (UTC)


 * Fantastic Petergstrom (talk) 23:45, 30 November 2016 (UTC)

November 2016
You currently appear to be engaged in an edit war&#32; according to the reverts you have made on Chronic fatigue syndrome. Users are expected to collaborate with others, to avoid editing disruptively, and to try to reach a consensus rather than repeatedly undoing other users' edits once it is known that there is a disagreement. Please be particularly aware that Wikipedia's policy on edit warring states: If you find yourself in an editing dispute, use the article's talk page to discuss controversial changes; work towards a version that represents consensus among editors. You can post a request for help at an appropriate noticeboard or seek dispute resolution. In some cases it may be appropriate to request temporary page protection. If you engage in an edit war, you may be blocked from editing. RexxS (talk) 22:33, 30 November 2016 (UTC)
 * 1) Edit warring is disruptive regardless of how many reverts you have made.
 * 2) Do not edit war even if you believe you are right.

Reference errors on 5 December
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 * On the Bipolar disorder page, [//en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?diff=753222080 your edit] caused a DOI error (help) . ([ Fix] | [//en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Wikipedia:Help_desk&action=edit&section=new&preload=User:ReferenceBot/helpform&preloadtitle=Referencing%20errors%20on%20%5B%5BSpecial%3ADiff%2F753222080%7CBipolar disorder%5D%5D Ask for help])

Beta-glucans in Pleurotus ostreatus mushrooms
PMID 23075555 is not a WP:MEDRS-quality source. It has an impact factor of only 2. Studies of supplements in exercise performance are prone to uncountable variables and errors. Nothing about this journal or the study design described is consistent with MEDRS. --Zefr (talk) 19:19, 9 December 2016 (UTC)

Really happy you are contributing so much
Really I am! And thank you for using reviews. But you are adding so much, so fast, that it is really important that you take time - you - and make sure everything is OK before you click "save". Please. Thanks. Jytdog (talk) 00:40, 10 December 2016 (UTC

Its the autofill with URL function. Sometimes it gets the date, sometimes it fills it with todays date Petergstrom (talk) 01:19, 10 December 2016 (UTC)

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Which past account are you?
I'm going to ask you this once: Which Wikipedia account (and I mean your past main account) did you edit under before this one? Flyer22 Reborn (talk) 20:40, 2 January 2017 (UTC)

Uhh, none this is my first and only wikipedia account. I may have had some conflict with editors in the past, such as on the adaptogen page, but I have only been temp banned once for that conflict, while the other dude got an indefinite ban. I don't know what gives you such conviction and audacity to be rude, but I can assure you that this is my sole account big boy. I haver never been reborn either, I wonder what thats like... Petergstrom (talk) 20:56, 2 January 2017 (UTC)


 * If that's the story you are going to stick with, so be it. And, remember, WP:BAN is not the same as WP:BLOCK. Flyer22 Reborn (talk) 21:02, 2 January 2017 (UTC)

I'm serious, what gives you the idea that I have been banned and created a new account? Firstly, bans or blocks or whatever from wikipedia are totally justified, the policy makes sense to me(Edit warring, POV pushing, vandalism etc etc). Although I have participated in edit warring in the past, I have been reprimanded and get how it works here. WP:NPOV, WP:OR, etc etc. So I wouldn't be petty and find a way to create a new account to continue to participate in stupid shenanigans. Secondly, I think I have been doing a decent job obeying the wikipedia policies, as I have gotten in fewer and fewer conflicts over time. Third, if you check my edit and message history, you can see areas of misunderstanding policies associated with being a new user. I don't know why you think I've been banned but whatever bro.Petergstrom (talk) 21:07, 2 January 2017 (UTC)


 * I'll say this: The vast majority of newbies do not sign their first talk page post, which contrasts yours. The more and more I look at your edits, the more and more you remind me of one editor in particular. The more you edit, the more your interests intersect with his interests. If it were not for your interest in religious topics, then I would be less inclined to tie you to this editor. Your understanding of the WP:NPOV policy is just as flawed as his, and there are other similarities. Your usual edit summary and citation style is not like his usual edit summary and citation style, but one can evolve. I can't do anything about my suspicions at this time anyway, since I don't yet have convincing behavioral evidence. Furthermore, any WP:CheckUser data will be stale. So, for now, you can simply categorize my posts in this section as inquiries. Flyer22 Reborn (talk) 00:01, 10 January 2017 (UTC)

Uhh there are instructions at the top of talk pages instructing user to sign posts...and in the edit box, the sign button is right there. Its not complicated, and in the beginning, I actually had some posts signed for me, as I forgot to sign them. I have no conflict of interests, and I have no stance on religion. My POV in that area I think is quite neutral. I have no idea who you think I am, but I am totally new to wikipedia. I have never edited before...Petergstrom (talk) 00:06, 10 January 2017 (UTC)

Oh damn I get it. You have a thing about sock puppetry, https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Special:Log/block&page=User%3AFlyer22+Reborn. RIP, you should be able to understand what false accusations are like(if.....you were telling the truth....if). So back off. I have never abused multiple accounts. Furthermore, I would be less hostile towards you if you hadn't taken such an arrogant tone. "Convincing behavioral evidence".Lmao Petergstrom (talk) 01:38, 10 January 2017 (UTC)


 * Commenting on my supposed sockpuppetry won't work. Deflecting won't work. Flyer22 Reborn (talk) 02:22, 14 January 2017 (UTC)

Deflection wasn't the point, and if you don't get that, there is no point with you. You can continue acting like an honor bound martyr, valiantly defending your holy grail wikipedia from the throngs of editors far inferior to you, go ahead and act like that, but with all due respect, just stay away from my talk page. Thank you.Petergstrom (talk) 02:53, 14 January 2017 (UTC) -->

Talk: Emotion
I would like to further discuss the idea that you, and others, are postulating on emotion being a conscious experience, since I thought you are not following the changes in the talk page I thought I would give you a notice here as I would like you to comment in there to further elaborate, and feel free to remove this section in your talk page (and no, I'm not even logging in, just prefering to use IPs). thanks 186.144.41.175 (talk) 07:03, 5 January 2017 (UTC).

Things seemed to be going well...
And now this mess at MDMA. The recent history is a disaster.

I was just thinking how nice it is has been since you have learned better how the community that works on medical/health article operates.

What the heck is going on now? Please please use high quality, recent sources. if you cannot find any about X that is a good sign that we should not discuss X in WP. And please use the talk page to reach consensus.

We do end up taking action to bar disruption from people who refuse to learn and I do not want to go there with you. Jytdog (talk) 01:51, 9 January 2017 (UTC)

Reference errors on 10 January
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 * On the Dopaminergic pathways page, [//en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?diff=759233660 your edit] caused a URL error (help) . ([ Fix] | [//en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Wikipedia:Help_desk&action=edit&section=new&preload=User:ReferenceBot/helpform&preloadtitle=Referencing%20errors%20on%20%5B%5BSpecial%3ADiff%2F759233660%7CDopaminergic pathways%5D%5D Ask for help])

Reference errors on 20 January
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 * On the Fibromyalgia page, [//en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?diff=761059378 your edit] caused a broken reference name (help) . ([ Fix] | [//en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Wikipedia:Help_desk&action=edit&section=new&preload=User:ReferenceBot/helpform&preloadtitle=Referencing%20errors%20on%20%5B%5BSpecial%3ADiff%2F761059378%7CFibromyalgia%5D%5D Ask for help])

DSM5
The APA sent us a take down notice in the paste regarding our use of their criteria. If we are to use them we must paraphrase. Best Doc James  (talk · contribs · email) 02:25, 3 February 2017 (UTC)

<--

Threading
Hello! Your ANI thread would be significantly easier to follow—and more likely to gain serious attention—if you would thread your posts correctly by indenting each paragraph of your replies exactly one level deeper than the comment to which you are replying. Please review WP:THREAD for examples. Note that threading is required by our guidelines, although compliance is rarely enforced. See WP:TPYES ("Keep the layout clear: Keep the talk page attractively and clearly laid out, using standard formatting and threading." (emphasis added)). Thank you for your time. Rebb ing  03:24, 7 February 2017 (UTC)

Stuff
Here on your userpage you noted what happened at MDMA and you wrote "I learned about the importance of rhetoric". Please go deeper. Things like blowing off community norms about indenting noted above, ignoring WP:MED's emphasis on high quality sourcing and careful summarizing, and the general ethos here about authentically talking through disagreements, are all deep in the guts of this place in big and small ways. You need to take other people (especially established editors) more seriously as people and engage with them. Doing things like indenting correctly is a sign that you respect other people and their need to be able follow discussions. (small thing that signals deeper things)  But instead you are establishing a pattern of not taking other people and community norms seriously, and it is hurting you. I noted this at the ANI here. I am not hopeless about you but my hope is dimming. fwiw. I hope you can turn things around. Jytdog (talk) 06:19, 7 February 2017 (UTC)


 * User:Jytdog Pretty much, I argued my case poorly(which I still do). In the end, the addictiveness was changed to low moderate, from moderate, because of all the sources pulled out, not a single one but my old crappy sources actually explicitly stated anything about addiction.  Pretty much in my "flurry" of editing, and arguing I was not able to effectively communicate my point, and when I finally did, the conflict was resolved with a low to moderate instead of moderate rating.Petergstrom (talk) 06:24, 7 February 2017 (UTC)


 * nice header change. :)  but your response pretty much missed the point of what i was trying to communicate to you.  In any case I wish you well. Jytdog (talk) 06:29, 7 February 2017 (UTC)


 * I'm confused. Essentially you were trying to communicate for me to clean up my interactions with other editors, as well as to edit better in general.  How did that response miss that?Petergstrom (talk) 06:33, 7 February 2017 (UTC)
 * I was concerned that your remarks were focused on the fact that you were right about the content and the content finally moved toward your position. Which is not the point. But my apologies, if you got it, you got it. That's great. Jytdog (talk) 06:40, 7 February 2017 (UTC)
 * Here are two suggestions: Never ever ever ever refer to another editor as "his/hers/its" again. That is appalling. And leave Flyer 22 Reborn 100% alone. Thank you. Cullen328  Let's discuss it  08:49, 7 February 2017 (UTC)
 * Pro tip: the standard Navigation Popups plugin easily lets you view a user's gender (and other details) when you hover over a linked username. If you don't want to install that, there's also the gender template, which you can use in preview to find out a user's preferred gender pronouns. (You can set yours here.) Rebb  ing  09:53, 7 February 2017 (UTC)

ANI closed
Hi,

This is to let you know that I have closed the ANI thread that you opened against Flyer22 Reborn. You have been topic banned from medicine and religion for 6 months and that ban will be swiftly re-applied if the pattern of editing continues. I have also found your harassment allegations of Flyer22 Reborn completely unsubstantiated. I would also remind you not to give the appearance of harassing someone, if anyone finds your interaction with them problematic, stop it or change it. You are also encouraged not to make aspersions or assumptions about someone's mental status.--5 albert square (talk) 23:01, 27 February 2017 (UTC)
 * Petergstrom, please self revert these edits. They fall within the topic ban imposed above.  Thanks. Jytdog (talk) 17:57, 3 March 2017 (UTC)
 * I believe these additional edits also fall within the topic ban imposed above. - Mistercontributer (talk) 23:52, 7 April 2017 (UTC)

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About Stimulant and abused stimulant data
Hello, Petergstrom,

You add " It is estimated that the percent of the population that has abused amphetamines cocaine and MDMA combined is between .8% and 2.1%." in the leading paragraph of Stimulant. The reference is. However, I can't find the data in World Drug Report 2015 document. Could you help me to find out what page the data is in? Thanks--Wolfch (talk) 10:56, 15 April 2017 (UTC)

Thank you for being one of Wikipedia's top medical contributors!

 * please help translate this message into your local language via meta

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A page you started (Occipital epilepsy) has been reviewed!
Thanks for creating Occipital epilepsy, Petergstrom!

Wikipedia editor Winged Blades of Godric just reviewed your page, and wrote this note for you:

"V.Good!"

To reply, leave a comment on Winged Blades of Godric's talk page.

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Winged Blades Godric 15:57, 26 June 2017 (UTC)

WP:ANI
I've started a thread on you at WP:ANI. Flyer22 Reborn (talk) 01:58, 6 July 2017 (UTC)

Formatting references, again
So you are back to high speed editing of medical content.

And again you are not providing pmids and pmc it is available.

Wny do we have to go through all of this again?? Again, if you fill out the autocomplete form with the pmid, it will do everything else for you. If there is a pmc you need to add that manually but that is the only thing... . This is not even a little bit hard to understand or to do.

You really could be a great contributor, or you could be a huge time suck on the rest of us. Which will it be? Jytdog (talk) 23:35, 27 August 2017 (UTC)


 * So I am missing the PMC/PMID. Will do.Petergstrom (talk) 23:40, 27 August 2017 (UTC)
 * SLOW DOWN.


 * here is what you did: cite journal|last1=Bloch|first1=Michael H.|last2=Landeros-Weisenberger|first2=Angeli|last3=Rosario|first3=Maria C.|last4=Pittenger|first4=Christopher|last5=Leckman|first5=James F.|title=Meta-Analysis of the Symptom Structure of Obsessive-Compulsive Disorder|journal=The American journal of psychiatry|date=December 2008|volume=165|issue=12|pages=1532–1542|doi=10.1176/appi.ajp.2008.08020320|pmid=PMC3972003 | url= https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3972003/ |issn=0002-953X


 * You put the pmc in the pmid parameter.
 * You don't need url=https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3972003/
 * all that is needed is pmc=3972003


 * really, if you put in the pmid field (in this case 19432385) the tool will autofill a perfect ref; all you need to do is click the "show additional fields" and fill in the pmc manually and click "insert ref" and there will be no problems.


 * At the rate that you edit when you get going, you create a pile of work for people to clean up behind you. This is senseless. Please just slow down and do it right the first time. Please! Jytdog (talk) 23:53, 27 August 2017 (UTC)
 * you nailed it here. thank you! Jytdog (talk) 00:14, 28 August 2017 (UTC)
 * If you review the history of this page you will see that we had this exact discussion in November 2016 here.
 * Anyway, it is now fresh for you again, and hopefully we will not need to have it again, ever. I hope! Jytdog (talk) 00:17, 28 August 2017 (UTC)

What is your standard for deleting "primary sources"?
I have noticed that your article on Hyperreligiosity relies on widely spectulative primary sources, yet you deleted a whole chunk of the relationship between genetics and psychopathy from numerous authors and sources without even going to the talk page. I would like to know if you have an actual standard for deleting "widely spectulative primary sources" or if it is more of a "I have decided I don't agree with this so I will delete it" thing. Also please do notice that WP:PRIMARY makes it clear that primary sources are allowed if they are a straightforward quote of what is being discusssed. -Penorhaxs (talk) 14:02, 13 September 2017 (UTC)

So, before I restore that chunk of text, all I need from you is a definition of "reliable source" that we can agree upon, so that we avoid a pointless edit-war. Once I am provided with that, I will review each link and filter those that we can agree are reliable sources. Thank you, - Penorhaxs (talk) 14:12, 13 September 2017 (UTC)

I think that we can agree that PubMed is a good starting point? Wikipedia guidelines seem to think so: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Identifying_reliable_sources_(medicine)#Searching_for_sources -Penorhaxs (talk) 14:35, 13 September 2017 (UTC)


 * The very fact that you characterize the sources on the hyperreligiosity page as "primary" leads me to the conclusion that you completely fail to understand the concept-A primary source is one that reports its own experiment, while a secondary source reviews the current literature.


 * From discussions from other users above, it seems like you actually don't know what a primary source is or what is primary research, so this is not a first time. Case in point is your article quoting: http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1046/j.1440-1819.1998.00397.x/full IT is CLEARLY a primary source: it is a research paper which slowly describes the method used and the raw data captured, and then expand into its immediate conclusions without further review. It is not a summary by a third party, neither a meta-analysis, in any sort of way, it is LITERALLY original research that you are linking, and the same happens with numerous other links that you have posted.


 * So unless you provide me with a clear definition of what is actually a primary source that is compatible with your random tastes, I will proceed to clear the text that you randomly deleted from Psychopathy from possible original research links, and replace them with actual links from meta-analysis from PubWeb, which should take me one day or two. If you desire, before I put the text back in, I can provide you with links to the third-party reviews from Pubmed that we can discuss so that we can agree on their validity, like mature men do. Does that sound good to you, or shall I expect childish random deletions? I mean really, what I want is to avoid the random "undo / rollback" that sadly dominates this kind of arguments. -Penorhaxs (talk) 16:42, 13 September 2017 (UTC)


 * There is generally no reason to use a primary source. However, in WP:Primary exceptions are discussed.  When quality secondary sources can be used in place of primary sources, they should be, however in the hyperreligiosity article, there are few secondary sources.  A primary source reinforcing a secondary source is justifiable.  The psychopathy article is not the same.Petergstrom (talk) 16:52, 13 September 2017 (UTC)


 * There are few secondary sources because Hyper-Religiousity is not an actual "psychiatric disturbance" recognized by any medical bureau. The entire article seems to be your own original research combined with other people's original research. "Hyperreligiosity is a psychiatric disturbance in which a person experiences intense religious beliefs or experiences that interfere with normal functioning." is a case of According to Whom?. Where did you take that definition of hyperreligiousity from? The origin of it seems to be yourself entirely, there are zero links to its definition because it is not recognized as such, and it is instead seen as a symptom of far more complex manias. If I review more of your articles I am sure I will find even more widespread original research.


 * Anyhow. I am going to write the improved version of the genetics section of Psychopathy, and I just wanna know, can we review it together before I submit it, or will it be a back and forth until arbitration? Can we work like that, in a peaceful manner, so that we won't be reverting each other randomly and waste everyone's time? I mean really, you are a hedonist, surely you have more enjoyable things than going into the endless waste of time of arbitration because you wanna remove the text that had been part of the article for years before Vrie0006 decided to delete it last year without awaiting for discussion? -Penorhaxs (talk) 17:07, 13 September 2017 (UTC)


 * Hyperreligiosity is a symptom in psychiatry, not a disorder. It is not original research, perhaps you should review that term as well :WP:OR.


 * Again, According to whom. Who says that "Hyperreligiosity is a psychiatric disturbance in which a person experiences intense religious beliefs or experiences that interfere with normal functioning"? You? Someone else? Can you provide with a link? The article even includes obvious spelling errors (Hyperrelgiosity, really?) it is quite evident it is made largely of original research. WP:OR could not be even clearer: all material added to articles must be attributable to a reliable, published source. The very first phrase of the articles has no such scientific attribution whatsoever. The rest of it is research papers describing experiments and conclusions, not actual encyclopedic material.


 * Again, Can we review an improved version of Psychopathy together, or do I have to expect childish, mindless undos? -Penorhaxs (talk) 17:23, 13 September 2017 (UTC)


 * Again ACCORDING TO THE 10 SOURCES CITED, only a minority of which are primary source that support the wealth of secondary sources.

The psychopathy article does not need a genetics section, made up of entirely primary sources. If you can find a review, go ahead and make the section.Petergstrom (talk) 17:27, 13 September 2017 (UTC)


 * Good enough. I will be making the required chances so that the article can have a proper genetics sections. You shall see it up in a few days, according to my work schedule. Peace. -Penorhaxs (talk) 17:32, 13 September 2017 (UTC)

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Welcome
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 * Specifically refs go right after the punctuation and we use very few caps. Best Doc James  (talk · contribs · email) 20:25, 10 December 2017 (UTC)

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Deletion discussion about Biology of bipolar disorder
Hello, Petergstrom,

I wanted to let you know that there's a discussion about whether Biology of bipolar disorder should be deleted. Your comments are welcome at Articles for deletion/Biology of bipolar disorder.

If you're new to the process, articles for deletion is a group discussion (not a vote!) that usually lasts seven days. If you need it, there is a guide on how to contribute. Last but not least, you are highly encouraged to continue improving the article; just be sure not to remove the tag about the deletion nomination from the top.

Thanks,

Dschslava  Δx parlez moi 19:09, 9 January 2018 (UTC)


 * I have not had a lot of experience with the AFD process, and am wondering why the article was put up for deletion in the first place. There has been no activity on the AFD for the page since I last posted there, and am curious to know when the deletion proposal will be rejected.Petergstrom (talk) 15:55, 10 January 2018 (UTC)

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Funny
Your userpage is pretty funny. Please consider writing something for the Humour section in the Signpost. I'm the humour editor but any one can initiate a coup. See my latest example and draft Wikipedia Signpost/Next issue/Humour
 * Best Regards, Barbara (WVS) ✐ ✉  07:47, 10 February 2018 (UTC)

Thank you for being one of Wikipedia's top medical contributors!

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When you undo an edit, you are supposed to explain why, either in the SUMMARY or on the TALK page
Hi there! I am glad to see that you have knowledge of neurochemistry.

I noticed that you undid my addition to the article on Parkinson's Disease about the current hypothesis that PD may originate in the gut. But you did not explain why you undid my edit--neither in the Edit Summary nor on the article's TALK page. That's not how we do things at Wikipedia. For every edit you make, you are ALWAYS supposed to put something in the Summary Line to explain what you have done and why (unless the "why" is manifestly obvious from the edit itself, in which case you still should enter what you have done). A summary can be very short but you are never supposed to leave it blank. I have been gently rebuked in the distant past by a Wikipedia moderator for having failed to understand this.

Accordingly, I have replaced my addition. If you think it should be removed, the way we handle a situation like that is you add a new section to the article's TALK page, describe your opinion about the edit in question, and your reason for your opinion. Then, you wait for other users to chime in and eventually, when consensus emerges, you go with the consensus.

Best wishes, HandsomeMrToad (talk) 01:12, 1 August 2018 (UTC)

Links in your sandbox
Just a heads-up...sci-hub.tw is now blacklisted here on en.wp, so you might have problems when you next try to edit User:Petergstrom/sandbox unless you remove the links to that site. DMacks (talk) 22:11, 13 October 2018 (UTC)

Inquiry from a Public Relations Representative for electroCore on Updating Wikipedia Articles
Hello Petergstrom,

My name is Matt Nemet and I am a Public Relations professional at GCI Health, a firm specializing in healthcare. One of our clients, electroCore (a commercial-stage bioelectronic medicine company), has expressed interest in increasing patient awareness on vagus nerve stimulation as a treatment for headaches, and views Wikipedia as a valuable outlet to focus on as they market gammaCore Sapphire (a non-invasive vagus nerve stimulator). The company’s current focus is in multiple conditions, including cluster headache and migraine.

In 2017, the U.S. Food and Drug Administration (FDA) released gammaCore for the acute treatment of pain associated with episodic cluster headache in adult patients, and this year, the FDA cleared gammaCore for the acute treatment of pain associated with migraine headache in adult patients. However, we would also like to bring to your attention a recent review of cervical vagus nerve stimulation for the treatment of primary headache disorders, published in the Journal of Pain Research on August 27th.

We know that Wikipedia users depend on active and reputable editors for reliable content. We also felt that given your previous efforts editing Wikipedia pages such as migraine, you might be interested in considering this review to include up-to-date information on vagus nerve stimulation and/or gammaCore on relevant Wikipedia pages, such as vagus nerve stimulation for example.

We want to be upfront in our awareness that, per Wikipedia guidelines, neither the company nor those directly associated with the company can make such edits. It is an important set of rules and guidelines that we respect, as our priority is ensuring Wikipedia has the most current and relevant information possible. Therefore, we are reaching out, if you are willing to assess the value of the proposed information to make accurate and appropriate updates.

Please let us know if you have any questions.

Best regards, MSN2017 (talk) 14:45, 24 October 2018 (UTC)

I thought you might be interested in this
Talk:Reward system. Also, if you've really run a 4 minute mile, you're a monster. >.> My most notable running feat is a 3:16:42 marathon time, which isn't that big of a deal.  Seppi  333  (Insert 2¢) 08:22, 27 January 2019 (UTC)

Thanks for bringing that to my attention, will definetly give it a closer look later. A marathon is something by itself, I dont think Ive ever run farther than 15 miles.Petergstrom (talk)

Thank you for being one of Wikipedia's top medical contributors!
Thanks again :-) --  Doc James  along with the rest of the team at Wiki Project Med Foundation 17:41, 28 January 2019 (UTC)

Are you willing to share with me the section on genetics of depression of a particular book you used
Hi Fellow student, I tried to look for Neurobiology of mental illness the 5th ed. Can you please share :) Thanks in advance here is my email adress: laasmiwalid@hotmail.com Walidou47 (talk) 09:52, 21 January 2020 (UTC)

Bipolar Disorder
Hi Peter, I'm working on getting bipolar disorder to GA. It's basically there but I'm just wondering if you might be able to help me out on the mechanism section. I'm not sure if you wrote that section or Triangular did or Casliber. Was it you by chance? There's a bit of clarification needed about the vPFC section per the GA review. If you have any insights into this, please let me know. Thanks! TylerDurden8823 (talk) 19:51, 27 February 2020 (UTC)

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