User talk:Plateau99

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July 2011
Welcome to Wikipedia! I am glad to see you are interested in discussing a topic. However, as a general rule, talk pages such as Talk:Zoophilia are for discussion related to improving the article, not general discussion about the topic. If you have specific questions about certain topics, consider visiting our reference desk and asking them there instead of on article talk pages. Thank you. Sum mer PhD (talk) 03:34, 13 July 2011 (UTC)

Thank you for your contributions to Wikipedia. Before saving your changes to an article, please provide an edit summary&#32;for your edits. Doing so helps everyone understand the intention of your edit (and prevents legitimate edits from being mistaken for vandalism). It is also helpful to users reading the edit history of the page. Thank you. Sum mer PhD (talk) 03:35, 13 July 2011 (UTC)

Per talk-page agreement, there is a POV concern about the Zoophilia and the law page. Therefore I have replaced the tag that you have removed. You are welcome to discuss on the talk-page to help resolve the concern there. DMacks (talk) 18:00, 14 July 2011 (UTC)

Welcome!

 * }

Zoophilia
Hi. Your participation at Talk:Zoophilia would be very welcome, please do take part. We're trying to reach consensus on the lead, where we've reverted each other a few times.

Also, please do your best to make more use of the WP:Edit summary, as it helps other editors see what changes you've made.

We have the common goal of improving Wikipedia, so let's not have this turn into an editing dispute. Best wishes Puchiko (Talk-email) 07:55, 28 September 2011 (UTC)

December 2011
Your recent editing history at Zoophilia shows that you are in danger of breaking the three-revert rule, or that you may have already broken it. An editor must not perform more than three reverts on a single page within a 24-hour period. Undoing another editor's work—whether in whole or in part, whether involving the same or different material each time—counts as a revert. Breaking the three-revert rule often leads to a block.

If you wish to avoid being blocked, instead of reverting, please use the article's talk page to discuss the changes; work towards a version that represents consensus among editors. You can post a request for help at a relevant noticeboard or seek dispute resolution. In some cases, you may wish to request temporary page protection. You may still be blocked for edit warring even if you do not exceed the technical limit of the three-revert rule if your behavior indicates that you intend to continue to revert repeatedly. Calabe1992 03:30, 1 December 2011 (UTC)


 * I apologize, but other user continues to dominate the zoophilia article and revert every single edit I make to itPlateau99 (talk) 03:35, 1 December 2011 (UTC)
 * Please try making smaller changes, and if that doesn't work, pursue your options per WP:DR.  —  Jeff G. ツ  (talk)   03:37, 1 December 2011 (UTC)
 * If you go to WP:DR you will see that this dispute over the zoophilia article has been going on for weeks and nobody (except for one person) has stepped in to mediate it. And that one person has not done anything. I also want to mention that I started out several hours ago trying to make a smaller edit, but then the bully Someone963852 undid it as always (he seems to own the article now.)Plateau99 (talk) 03:40, 1 December 2011 (UTC)

You have been blocked from editing for a period of 24 hours for your disruption caused by edit warring and violation of the three-revert rule&#32;at Zoophilia. During a dispute, you should first try to discuss controversial changes and seek consensus. If that proves unsuccessful you are encouraged to seek dispute resolution, and in some cases it may be appropriate to request page protection. If you would like to be unblocked, you may appeal this block by adding the text below this notice, but you should read the guide to appealing blocks first. Guerillero &#124; My Talk  03:59, 1 December 2011 (UTC)

Hello. This message is being sent to inform you that there is currently a discussion at Dispute resolution noticeboard regarding an issue with which you may have been involved. The thread is "Zoophilia". Thank you. —  Jeff G. ツ (talk)   04:02, 1 December 2011 (UTC)

Full Protection
I full protected zoophilia due to the resurgence of the ongoing edit war there. I did not block you because you were discussing the issue on the talk page. If you can come to an agreement I will unlock the page. I will hand out blocks again if you edit war after the page lock is lifted or it expires. --Guerillero &#124; My Talk  02:28, 15 December 2011 (UTC)

You have been blocked from editing for a period of 1 week for your disruption caused by edit warring and violation of the three-revert rule. During a dispute, you should first try to discuss controversial changes and seek consensus. If that proves unsuccessful you are encouraged to seek dispute resolution, and in some cases it may be appropriate to request page protection. If you would like to be unblocked, you may appeal this block by adding the text below this notice, but you should read the guide to appealing blocks first. Guerillero &#124;  My Talk  23:37, 11 April 2012 (UTC)
 * Both of you have made about 10 reverts today. The block is to prevent the edit war from continuing. If you would like, I will list this block on WP:ANI for review. I personally don't care what happens to the article and I do not have enough time to broker a compromise between you both. I suggest that after you return from your block you try a robust form of dispute resolution. The local discussion has not moved forward at all since December. -- Guerillero &#124;  My Talk  23:44, 11 April 2012 (UTC)
 * It's not my fault that User:Someone963852 is not willing to compromise. Anything perceived by him as being "pro-zoophilia" even in the slightest bit is reverted by him, no matter what it is. It's not just me; other users (such as user:Nprieve) have also had their edits reverted by Someone963852 just because their edits didn't fit his view. When something doesn't fit his view, he throws around terms like "original research" and "false claims" to justify his views (even when the information in question is clearly verifiable). I tried to reach a compromise with him but he just kept reverting. Plateau99 (talk) 01:26, 12 April 2012 (UTC)

June 2012
You have been blocked temporarily from editing for edit warring, as you did at Zoophilia. Once the block has expired, you are welcome to make useful contributions. If you would like to be unblocked, you may appeal this block by adding the text, but you should read the guide to appealing blocks first. During a dispute, you should first try to discuss controversial changes and seek consensus. If that proves unsuccessful, you are encouraged to seek dispute resolution, and in some cases it may be appropriate to request page protection. Toddst1 (talk) 22:38, 13 June 2012 (UTC)

August 2012
Your recent editing history at Zoophilia and the law shows that you are currently engaged in an edit war. Being involved in an edit war can result in you being blocked from editing&mdash;especially if you violate the three-revert rule, which states that an editor must not perform more than three reverts on a single page within a 24-hour period. Undoing another editor's work—whether in whole or in part, whether involving the same or different material each time—counts as a revert. Also keep in mind that while violating the three-revert rule often leads to a block, you can still be blocked for edit warring&mdash;even if you don't violate the three-revert rule&mdash;should your behavior indicate that you intend to continue reverting repeatedly.

To avoid being blocked, instead of reverting please consider using the article's talk page to work toward making a version that represents consensus among editors. See BRD for how this is done. You can post a request for help at a relevant noticeboard or seek dispute resolution. In some cases, you may wish to request temporary page protection. Mark Arsten (talk) 00:11, 21 August 2012 (UTC)

Hello. There is currently a discussion at Administrators' noticeboard/Incidents regarding an issue with which you may have been involved. Thank you. Mark Arsten (talk) 02:12, 21 August 2012 (UTC)

You have been blocked indefinitely from editing for persistent disruptive agenda editing. If you think there are good reasons why you should be unblocked, you may appeal this block by adding below this notice the text, but you should read the guide to appealing blocks first. Fut.Perf. ☼ 05:02, 21 August 2012 (UTC)
 * I just spent hours explaining why I do not have an "agenda" (at Administrators' noticeboard/Incidents), and I have been personally attacked by various users during that process -- yet I am the one who is blocked, not them. I thought Wikipedia had more integrity than this. Plateau99 (talk) 05:05, 21 August 2012 (UTC)

Comment by uninvolved DRN volunteer
I would like to see this user answer to the requests made at WP:DRN specifically WP:DRN. I'd like to propose that if his block would not otherwise be lifted that it be lifted with a condition that he only be allowed to edit at WP:DRN to solve a content dispute which resulted in the edit war that got the block. If found in violation of this condition, I'd move for reimplementation of the block immediately. I would also expect the user to make a binding comment in regards to this. It may not be a perfect process, but I would like to give this user a voice to respond to the DRN comment and explain the matter, understand the views and be given a chance to make positive improvements in the discussion. ChrisGualtieri (talk) 05:52, 21 August 2012 (UTC)


 * Thank you, I was unable to finish what at I had to say at the Administrator's noticeboard due to the block. Plateau99 (talk) 06:08, 21 August 2012 (UTC)


 * I would suggest agreeing to the condition before the reviewing admin looks at this. You were skating on thin ice, but with a binding agreement to sort this out, respond only to the DRN posting and help fix up these articles, that you can fix up something you care about. With a little work and a step back from your personal beliefs, I bet the article could be much better than it is now. Almost all fetish articles and sexuality pages are of said quality, who knows you might push it to GA status if you work hard and keep it neutral. Would you promise to edit only at DRN until the content matter is resolved if it means being removed from your indefinite block? Indefinite blocks are not eternal, so long as you actively seek improvement or change, this is the chance I want to give you. Provided the admin agrees, of course. ChrisGualtieri (talk) 06:11, 21 August 2012 (UTC)
 * Yes, I would be willing to only go to DRN and abandon the ANI; any conversations at DRN would need to steer clear of the endless back-and-forth, bad faith discussions such as the one at ANI -- however, the users who were against me might PA me again (instead of cooperating). Plateau99 (talk) 06:24, 21 August 2012 (UTC)
 * I'm sorry, but those weren't personal attacks, they were calling a spade a spade. Also, your comments above say you'd "abandon the ANI", but do not address whether or not you would only post at DRN. If you wish to respond to comments at DRN, it might be possible for you to post here and have somebody else copy your comments there to "wrap things up" as it were. - The Bushranger One ping only 08:21, 21 August 2012 (UTC)
 * I would be more than happy to do so, even if the conversation becomes largely between the two of us, assuming the response at DRN is not able to get other parties, I believe I can be an effective guide and present a rational view so that the article is updated and a concrete archive of what transpires, or I could just move the entire thing here if preferred. Plateau99, Wikipedia may not be all daisies and love, sensitive topics and a strong push it likely to anger the community, I'd be more than happy to assist in making changes that improve the content of any such pages. Reliable sources are key, I am of the firm belief that such articles regard extremely heavy sourcing for each and every claim and sentence.
 * Second note, unblocks are not about eating crow, but they must give a reason to believe that further damage will stop, previous blocks were supposed to reinforce this. The matter of an 'agenda' is a sticking point, but I believe you can remove your strong personal opinions and substitute them with reliable sources. If the article is improved and is neutral than people will probably forget about you as pushing an 'agenda' and approve of the matter. Some at ANI relate it to pedophilia which is also a terrible article from a medical POV and a social POV, while definitely not global nor historical in scope, such articles are doomed without special care and a light hand. I'd give examples, but it'd go off topic, so I'm just going to point out that said matters affect this zoophilia article. Afterall, how many myths, legends, customs and such speak of humans and gods doing this exact thing? I see no mention of the Minotaur; or those other mythological offshoots and such stories are ingrained into religion and culture. Step down your personal views and use reliable sources for every piece of content you add or remove. I'll be happy to guide you, but you have to be willing to remain calm and don't point fingers, your contributions should make the argument for you, and if someone is upset, discuss it, but don't edit war. I'm not going to baby you, I'm just willing to give you a fair shot to fix things up and make you a recognized contributor; we need more people to edit such pages, constructively of course. I'll bring a portion of the DRN here, so you can provide input, I'll transfer it over afterwards, if you are not unblocked. Such proof may be required at this point. ChrisGualtieri (talk) 13:32, 21 August 2012 (UTC)

To address the article in question
Here is a very brief section that needs to be expanded, it is not very specific and thus is a good gauge on your ability to address the subject neutrally. I would like you to provide a new text to round this two sentence bit into a better version which addresses the matter using sources. At this time, use external links or parenthesis as your references for internet and for book sources. So 'Text text text.(Book source, author...etc)' or 'text text text.(Site, External link). That way it can be peer-reviewed and if it is good it can be added to the article, and you may be unblocked. I'm open to suggestions on another bit if you want, but I'm trying to be accommodating. ChrisGualtieri (talk) 13:42, 21 August 2012 (UTC)

Legal context
Laws on bestiality tend to be shaped by animal welfare concerns, moral views and cultural beliefs. Animal welfare bodies usually, but not always, view zoophilia as a matter of animal abuse.

Plateau's Changes
Laws on bestiality tend to be shaped by animal welfare concerns, moral views and cultural beliefs. Animal welfare bodies usually, but not always, view zoophilia as a matter of animal abuse. The laws in many jurisdictions originate from sodomy laws. Though many of these laws have been repealed, vestiges of them (the anti-bestiality portions of them) still remain, as is the case in Massachusetts. Laws against bestiality are based on the moral views of current society and do not necessarily reflect the beliefs of other cultures, such as the Hopi Native Americans or the Masaai people of Africa (see cultural relativism). Though some have claimed that such laws are justified for preventing what is perceived to be abuse, others have argued that the reasons for such laws are not compelling. The taboo associated with interspecies sex between humans and other animals, along with reactionary behavior to specific incidents, may be partly responsible for the laws.

Chris's response

 * Sorry, but this might be a dumb question to ask. Do you have access to highbeam research? I found a SINGLE source that COMPLETELY blows everything in the entire article out of the water, with a history of bestiality. Going from the last Ice age through the Egyptians, Greeks, Romans, and Middle Ages right up to the Catholic Church's persecution and some interesting points that show the prevalence of bestiality was so widespread in the 17th century that they tried to outlaw male herdsmen. It goes on to describe bestiality in Asia, the middle east and Indian religious matters, of which sex with sacred animals was a blessing. South America as well. Even Kinsey showed bestiality was a 1 in 13 amongst men and even in the Hunt study it was 1 in 20.
 * Even women are noted to engage in the practice. Now I'm not going into the nitty gritty of the details, but let's just put it this way, there are numerous, nay hundreds of sources which are clearly pro-bestiality, many studies in modern times and many many sources to follow. Clearly, the subject is touchy and rightfully so, but are you going to completely dismiss that for several thousand years such practices were approved and typically religious? Take a look at Miletski, Hani. "Introduction to Bestiality and Zoophilia." Contemporary Sexuality. American Assn of Sex Educators, Counselors & Therapists. 2006. Retrieved August 21, 2012 from HighBeam Research: http://www.highbeam.com/doc/1P3-1186328981.html Its surprising and reliable.ChrisGualtieri (talk) 02:27, 22 August 2012 (UTC)
 * Yes, Highbeam sounds like a good source. I would add it to the article but I'm blocked and my unblock request was denied. I could try to make another unblock request, but it might get denied again. Plateau99 (talk) 02:35, 22 August 2012 (UTC)
 * Can you READ the article, that's what I am asking about. It does no good to have you ref something you cannot read. I ask this, because I want you to redo your section as it is not good enough, not neutral enough and definitely needs better sources.ChrisGualtieri (talk) 02:39, 22 August 2012 (UTC)


 * I should also mention, that medical and psychological analysis yields much of the same results. The deeper I dig into this, it seems that Plateau99's so called bias, while poorly worded and lacking much in the way of proper sourcing, suggests that our articles are NOT NPOV and he may have been making a crude attempt to fix it. With proper sourcing, backing the history and pointing to the circumstances surrounding the laws, I'm certain that more than enough information to fully flesh out the page can be made. Sources regularly put that more than 5% of men and 2-3% of women engage in this practice in modern times making it one of the most common 'fetishes' and having more prevalence than almost all other forms of 'fetishes'. I could write up a section later tonight if you wish to read it, but quite clearly, this subject matter must be done carefully and to counter systematic bias without being 'pro' or 'anti' anything. Let the sources do the talking; more than enough exist to ensure that no original research or personal opinions should ever be present in the article. ChrisGualtieri (talk) 02:37, 22 August 2012 (UTC)

Sockpuppetry case
Your name has been mentioned in connection with a sockpuppetry case. Please refer to Sockpuppet investigations/Plateau99 for evidence. Please make sure you make yourself familiar with the guide to responding to cases before editing the evidence page. Guerillero &#124;  My Talk  04:55, 6 November 2012 (UTC)

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