User talk:Plumcouch/Archive 2

Lara Dutta

 * 1) The "role information" looks like the result of a direct cut and paste from IMDb (which raises copy-right issues), including their (non-Wikipedia style) of a row of dots, and tells the reader very little unless she knows the film (so the information would be best put in articles on the individual films).
 * 2) There's nothing that I can see at WikiProject Indian cinema that specifies or even mentions this style; it seems rather to be the result of editors rather lazily doing the cut-and-paste from IMDb.
 * 3) In any case, is it really a good idea to have a separate style for Indian actors? Shouldn't we just have a style for actors?
 * 4) You also replaced the incorrect capitalisation, and the serious over-linking of years.
 * 5) I've raised this at Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Indian cinema. --Mel Etitis ( Μελ Ετητης ) 09:14, 9 April 2006 (UTC)

Template:Cite web
Try using this template while providing sources for your edits. This was in reference to this edit of yours on the Rani Mukerji page. Regards, -- Andy123  (talk) 18:45, 21 April 2006 (UTC)

Dev
Hi Plumcouch. I went on the page for the film Dev, and there is the poster of the Coronation Street guy who is also called Dev. I downloaded the movie poster but some user changed the file. Since you are very good with the pictures could you please switch it back to the movie poster i downloaded. The thing is, i don't know how to do it!!! If you feel the page needs more details then please add. I really wanna reduce the number of film stubs so by your contribution that's one down at least...Thanx a lot. Pa7 01:06, 22 April 2006 (UTC)

Rani
19:22, 23 April 2006 (UTC)Sorry I didn't know about writing at the bottom. Look my only purpose on wikipedia was to give more information and make indian cinema known here with many articles. i chose to work on rani mukerji's page was only because you guys didn't put much there and i thought whatever you wrote was not good enough. that is why i attempted to write. i told you before i'm not a professional. i respect you people. edit my writing if you may. don't revert my work. i know i need to make it more neutral but u can help me with that. i just collected all the useful information yesterday. i couldn't make everything perfect just in one day. it will take time. you can help. all i want to say is that you cannot cut the length of the page. whatever is on there is true. read the saathiya interview at the bottom where it says press coverage. the whole interview correstponds to the breakout role. i even watched the koffee with karan show where karan johar confirms that saathiya was a milestone in her career and from then onwards she became Yash Chopra's muse working in: hum tum, veer-zaara, bunty aur babli, saif n rani new film. although they first started with mujhse dosti karoge but the film was a flop. thats what i wrote in the breakout role. the film was a flop. so there u go. we have something negative against her. if you see all the award shows on tv, yash chopra and rani sit together all the time. although preity zinta is also another yash chopra film worker, rani is more partial to him. i'll try to neutralize the page. but it's tagged vandalism so im scared to touch it. you should help me. lastly, i wasnt trying to flatter u. simply encourage u to help me. i need u guys! thanks! 12:15, 23 April 2006 (UTC) —Preceding unsigned comment added by Shez 15 (talk • contribs)

Rani's page dispute over
19:22, 23 April 2006 (UTC) Yeah the dispute is over and thanks for your advice. I just needed to tell you that the format is proper and feasible on the page now. Just make it a bit more neutral. Read her interview about Saathiya in the press coverage and you'll see that is the information i have put in her breakout role so you can make it more neutral but i think about the vivek oberoi part, it is true because he did get offered hum tum later but he didn't do it because rani mukerji was in the lead and yash chopra chose rani. this is trivia but i didn't put it on the page. i guess just the fact that vivek is the only actor rani has a dispute with is ok to put more negative side on rani's character as you said we don't want to praise her. About the veer-zaara, i just put lawyer because i thought it was a good way to show the variety of roles she is playing as in a doctor in saathiya, a college student in kuch kuch hota hai and a low-class citizen in yuva but if you want to put supporting role there it's okay. just make it alright. i asked zora this too. you put your input while i work on john abraham's case. thanks! 12:15, 23 April 2006 (UTC) —Preceding unsigned comment added by Shez 15 (talk • contribs)

Rani's new page
12:15, 23 April 2006 (UTC) Hey thanks! You toned down Rani's page. I wouldn't able to achieve that by myself. Thanks a lot! It makes the page more concise and clear. Keep up the good work! 12:15, 23 April 2006 (UTC) —Preceding unsigned comment added by Shez 15 (talk • contribs)

A tiny edit on Rani's page
00:58, 29 April 2006 (UTC) —Preceding unsigned comment added by Shez 15 (talk • contribs) Hey! I just made one tiny edit on her page where I decided to talk about her filmfare award history. Just check it out on this website! The speech is the longest in Filmfare history as mentionned on NDTV last night when they were going through Filmfare history. I watched it. You should view it. It's in this link and by the way, Will Smith awarded her the trophy. Thanks!  00:58, 29 April 2006 (UTC) —Preceding unsigned comment added by Shez 15 (talk • contribs)

Image copyright problem with Image:RaniMukerji.jpg
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Rani Mukerji discussion
Hey, im trying to make sure that the Rani Mukerji page is discussed so everyone has a say. User:Shez 15 really wants the article to be longer but i did feel there was a little fancruft there. Anyhow please come to discuss this. We do not want to have a edit war, especially if we have got better things to do such as improve the Madhubala article. Have your say on the discussion page within the Rani Mukerji article and maybe we can all reach a comprimise. Thanx. Pa7 14:27, 6 May 2006 (UTC)

Rani Mukerji edit
Hey! Plumcouch! I respect your edits. But try to understand, Rani was famous for Chalte Chalte because of her solo film opposite Shah Rukh Khan and it was a semi-hit. You do need to realize that. Another fact: After Saathiya, she became extremely popular and then Chalte Chalte came next where she was nominated as a best actress again after Saathiya. Kuch Kuch Hota Hai was also a supporting role but she is famous fot that movie too since it was her biggest hit in her debut years. Again, Veer-Zaara she may be the supporting but the role was very strong and she was appreciated for her performance after Hum Tum. It's another trademark in her career. And her name appeared before Preity Zinta also in Veer-Zaara when the movie starts. You should watch the movie. It's great. I have the original DVD and it also has an interview with Yash Chopra who considers Rani her muse. Rani wasn't given the lead merely because no one else could do the tough lawyer job as good as her. Preity only had to dance around trees and wear lots of make-up. That's it. Thanks for your understanding. Now, i have a question. Do you know how to ban or ask Zora to stay away from the page? i think she has an attitude problem towards me. Doesn't she have anything else to do besides reverting. I mean there are a lot of people to look after Rani's page. She thinks she is the pioneer or something. Anyway, thanks for your understanding. I'll revert your edit. 11:20, 8 May 2006 (UTC) —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Shez 15 (talk • contribs).

Thanks for bringing the issue to my notice. I've posted a message on Shez's page and requested him to tow our established policies. If he continues in this fashion, we'll have to block him sooner or later. Please keep me informed. Regards, =Nichalp   «Talk»=  16:35, 9 May 2006 (UTC)

Thanks!
I get it! We can cut them down to four. As she created more blockbusters, we'll see which ones will be the most popular ones. For now, I'll cut them to four. And thanks for toning down the page. Although i made minor changes, i hope it stays this way. Shez 15 (talk

Re: Rani
The length is not an issue, we have a lot of space in wikipedia and we can easily move the awards to a dedicated article such as Awards received by Rani Mukherji. No need to jump the gun yet. I'll take a look at Ajith. Regards, =Nichalp   «Talk»=  10:54, 10 May 2006 (UTC)

Order of Names
I am not obsessed or trying to put Rani before anyone else. It's only credit I'm giving importance to. Just so you know, she was senior to Vivek Oberoi in Saathiya and if you see the movie, her name appears before him. Vivek was a newcomer then. When Hum Tum happened, she was much more popular than flop actor Saif Ali Khan who gained accolades only after the movie. As far is Paheli concerned, Amitabh Bachchan and Juhi Chawla had a cameo so you can't put them before Rani and also because the story was only about Rani's life. And for Veer-Zaara, go ahead look at the official website and the movie, credits name her before Preity. The intro has her appearance before Shah Rukh because she is telling the story of Veer-Zaara at present time after 22 years. Therefore, it doesn't allow her to be put before Shah Rukh. It's the credits that are important. Lastly, I look at all criterias before putting Rani where she is put. You have to look at the length of the role, seniority and stardom status while putting people in order. Thanks! Do not change anything. It was like this until Zora came. She hates Rani Mukerji. Can't you see what she recently did to her page. She doesn't care or put any importance to it. She just simply wants to give no importance to Rani which is unfair. She has an extreme biased opinion. If you look at statistics today, Rani is the most successful actress after Kajol's leave. Let me teach you history, it was Sridevi then Madhuri Dixit. Then came Juhi Chawla and Karisma Kapoor but faded soon. Kajol was the reigning queen of bollywood until she took a break. Aishwarya Rai gained popularity after her leave but now, she's been giving flops post Devdas. Preity Zinta came for a while. She had one great year: 2003. That's it. When Veer-Zaara happened, she gave a flop: Dil Ne Jise Apna Kaha. She had only Salaam Namaste in 2005. In fear of failure, she only signed one good movie. But if you look at Rani's career. Each year has been a hit for her after Saathiya. The last two years has been extremely favorable. This year is going to be another success. She is at the top. You should read Filmfare Magazine more often, Bollywood's most prestigious and most trustworthy magazine. You'll know then. Anyway thanks! You were great help! Thank God! We clarified that. By the way, talk to Zora. Tell her not to vandalize Rani's page.shez15Ü 19:35, 11 May 2006 (UTC)

What happened to you?
Come on. Just edit personal life. Don't get under Zora's influence. The page looks much professional now. Thanks. shez15Ü 19:35, 11 May 2006 (UTC)

Rani Mukerji
Hey. This is getting very frustrating. I have noticed that you have seeked administrative help for the Rani page. It's a TOTAL MESS. Shez loves Rani too much. Were looking at a edit war between Shez and everyone else. For some reason he seems to have a personal grudge against Preity Zinta or any other actress. Do you see a solution here? Pa7 01:17, 12 May 2006 (UTC)


 * Could you provide me diffs of his actions? I don't have much time to investigate :( =Nichalp   «Talk»=  10:48, 12 May 2006 (UTC)
 * I've blocked Shez for 24 hrs. =Nichalp   «Talk»=  15:11, 12 May 2006 (UTC)


 * If this continues, I'd suggest getting consensus at WP:ANI for a longer block. Johnleemk | Talk 18:24, 12 May 2006 (UTC)

Yes, diffs are necessary as proof of his actions. We would be needing it in the future if he continues with his actions. You can make a list and store it in a subpage. =Nichalp  «Talk»=  05:53, 13 May 2006 (UTC)
 * That should be enough for now. =Nichalp   «Talk»=  11:55, 13 May 2006 (UTC)

Ajith
The wikilinks were the main reason for my revert. Like you said, User:212.32.85.221 has reverted. I will not continue with the reverts. Thought would inform you. - Ganeshk  ( talk ) 20:36, 15 May 2006 (UTC)

Box office
Hey, don't come to me for advice on resolving matters with problem editors! I'm notoriously BAD at it. I'm blunt, I'm direct, I'm fearless, I'm sometimes hated and feared. I rely on folks like you who are BETTER at diplomacy to handle all that messy emotional stuff. Zora 21:12, 15 May 2006 (UTC)


 * If you think that's a good method, and you're willing to put time and effort into it, I'll follow your lead. I think the anon is our blocked user, and I don't think we'll convince him, but we have to make the effort. (And I could be wrong -- I often am.) If we're reasonable and he isn't, he will eventually get banned. Zora 21:26, 15 May 2006 (UTC)

Thanks for your support!
Hey Plumcouch! I apologized to Zora even though I think the page should remain as my version. It's just my opinion and we will resolve our issues. Although, you may want to tone it down together. Just keep the sections as they are. See, pa7 even copied my sections on Madhubhala's page. As in, she put early work and breakthrough categories which implies, i was doing great until zora revised everything. Just don't make it seem like fancruft. I'm not a professional as i say, but i have every right to contribute. By the way, I'm letting you keep the Veer-Zaara page as it is. Although, I totally disagree because Rani was named before Preity in the movie as well as on the official website due to many factors which are more known to the producer himself. The best example would be Devdas and there are many others. It's like Aishwarya Rai had the lead role in Devdas, Madhuri Dixit had the supporting role. Still, Madhuri was credited before her due to seniority, name, and many other factors. Here, Madhuri even had a shorted role. Despite, it's credited like that. But no points in arguing, it's going to be a messy fight if we keep going on in the case of Veer-Zaara. I need to compromise here. It doesn't really matter who is listed before. It's a minor thing. Yet, it would have done justice to the movie and the official website if it was otherwise. Thank you for your time! shez_15 20:09, 15 May 2006 (UTC)

Dia Mirza
You seem to be aware of the necessary policies and guidelines and there is a dialogue going on now, so I'm only keeping a tangential eye on things. Let me know if things start going downhill again. --GraemeL (talk) 22:21, 18 May 2006 (UTC)

Rani Mukerji's page
Hey! No problem! You really worked hard! So did pa7, both improved my additions on the page. I've said many times I'm not a professional writer. So, therefore, I need editors like you to assist me. As a concern, could you please add a site to Rani Mukerji's page since it gives current news and wikipedia doesn't contain all the information. It's good means to access a useful site. I know she has no official website yet but for the meanwhile, a fansite can work. However, I need you to do me a favor. Could you please add something about Chalte Chalte because the year 2003 is missing from the mainstream cinema section. It was afterall her first solo-movie with ShahRukh Khan and also a hit. Please do that for me because if I edit, Zora might revert my additions. So thanks and god bless! shez_15 18:17, 18 May 2006 (UTC)

Thanks though!
Fine! No problem! I actually used the site and it was easy to access for me from wikipedia. hehehe! But it's ok. Just add Chalte Chalte information. shez_15 18:37, 18 May 2006 (UTC)

Kiss
Does she kiss? I never noticed! I just heard in an interview that she disagreed to kiss when offered the role. Maybe she agreed later on. Or maybe it's so technical that it's not a real kiss. I don't know. I think she maybe didn't want to kiss so she just did it close-mouthed. Anyway, it's too complicated. Just do whatever you want. By the way, you haven't put anything on Chalte Chalte. shez_15 01:17, 18 May 2006 (UTC)

Dia Mirza
Hey Plumcouch. I got your message, i skimmed through the discussion page and from what i see the problem is Mirza's endorsements and imdb?? I don't know if i am correct? I think there is one particular user who wants the endorsements?? I will have a look again and maybe contibute somehow. Pa7 23:53, 20 May 2006 (UTC)

Look at this
Please contribute here to take a user out of wiki who vandalizes

Chalte Chalte
I think you put Saathiya a film released in 2001 but it was 2002 and then you put chalte chalte before saathiya. anyway, i corrected that and added a bit more to career section with prior popular movies. I hope it doesn't change anymore. Thanks though!

Plagiarism
Re the plagiarism accusation in the Sushmita Sen article -- I don't think the actress's article is the place to make the accusation. Someone might disagree, and that article is not the place to argue it out. Nobleeagle and I came to a compromise on the project talk page, which is that we would have a Bollywood and plagiarism article, that it would just be a list of films that have been accused of plagiarism, that the charges should be backed by at least one published cite and should be discussed in the film's article.

Of course people are disregarding all of this and just putting up accusations right and left. This bothers me, and I think it does put Wikipedia at risk. We should not be slander or rumour central. Any accusation of plagiarism that doesn't come with published cites is just personal opinion, which we're not supposed to do. I do get the impression that for some Indian film buffs, making the accusations is seen as being knowledgeable and smart -- too smart to be fooled, familiar with foreign films, etc. This is an incentive for wild accusations, IMHO. I think you have to distinguish between frame by frame, or scene by scene, copies, and just taking a general idea and reworking it for India. That's something Hollywood does all the time. If one fantasy movie succeeds, then they make a few more ... which sink, if they're bad, and then the industry chases after a new trend.

Hope I didn't hurt your feelings. You have done so much good work on movie articles that I don't want to do anything that would discourage you. Zora 22:47, 26 May 2006 (UTC)

Shez again
He's back at the Rani article. I removed some of his bad prose and Rani worship, and he reverted. You seem to have some influence with him -- see what you can do. Zora 23:32, 26 May 2006 (UTC)

Salaries, adminship
I don't think we should give salaries for Indian actors. Everyone who knows anything about ANY movie business, East or West, knows that film accounting is a tricky business. The producers have to give out public figures that make the film look good, while avoiding claims that would have tax collectors and investors demanding to look at the books. Nothing, nothing that they say can be trusted.

As for you being an admin -- I'd support you. I keep turning down people who want me to be an admin, because I don't think I have the right character. I'm too blunt and controversial. However, you're just the sort to be a good admin. You are reliable and quiet and you can jolly difficult users into behaving. If you'd like, I'll propose you for adminship. I think we could use more Indian admins. Zora 00:06, 28 May 2006 (UTC)

question about writing comments next to changes
Plumcouch,

I wanted to know how I can write comments against the changes I make to an article? I would be grateful if you could let me know.

Thanks