User talk:Pogga D

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Hello, Pogga D, and welcome to Wikipedia! Thank you for your contributions. I hope you like the place and decide to stay. Here are a few links to pages you might find helpful:
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License tagging for File:More Stories to Tell.jpg
Thanks for uploading File:More Stories to Tell.jpg. You don't seem to have indicated the license status of the image. Wikipedia uses a set of image copyright tags to indicate this information.

To add a tag to the image, select the appropriate tag from this list, click on this link, then click "Edit this page" and add the tag to the image's description. If there doesn't seem to be a suitable tag, the image is probably not appropriate for use on Wikipedia. For help in choosing the correct tag, or for any other questions, leave a message on Media copyright questions. Thank you for your cooperation. --ImageTaggingBot (talk) 14:31, 20 November 2016 (UTC)

License tagging for File:Stories to Tell.jpg
Thanks for uploading File:Stories to Tell.jpg. You don't seem to have indicated the license status of the image. Wikipedia uses a set of image copyright tags to indicate this information.

To add a tag to the image, select the appropriate tag from this list, click on this link, then click "Edit this page" and add the tag to the image's description. If there doesn't seem to be a suitable tag, the image is probably not appropriate for use on Wikipedia. For help in choosing the correct tag, or for any other questions, leave a message on Media copyright questions. Thank you for your cooperation. --ImageTaggingBot (talk) 14:31, 20 November 2016 (UTC)

Image uploads
Hi, the draft article you are writing on Nettie Clark looks interesting but there is a problem with the book covers you have uploaded. You need to read Image use policy but I'll tell you the most relevant parts now: I have to say that, if as I suspect these images are not out of copyright, then you will need to make out an NFCC for each and these are not all going to comply because multiple non-free images aren't allowed on a single article and articles on the individual books don't exist as yet. If they are out of copyright then it shouldn't be much to add the relevant information and information will help you add the correct information. Don't get discouraged by this, most of it can get remedied but if they are non-free images not just yet. If there is anything you don't understand or need help with, just respond to this message as I have added this page to my watchlist. Nthep (talk) 14:46, 20 November 2016 (UTC)
 * 1) As much as possible images on Wikipedia are either out of copyright or freely licenced by the copyright holder
 * 2) If this isn't possible then there are circumstances under which non-free images can be used (Non-free content criteria NFCC), but
 * 3) in all cases there must be information on the image page showing how the image use policy/NFCC are being complied with and at the moment there is non of this information on the image pages.  You need to add this information fairly quickly or the images are likely to be deleted for lack of licencing information.

File source and copyright licensing problem with File:Tell me a Tale.jpgnd all the others
This is what I thought would happen. I've collapsed all the notifications but they day what I outlined above. The images are all under threat of deletion for lack of licensing information. Nthep (talk) 15:21, 20 November 2016 (UTC)

Thanks for uploading File:Tell me a Tale.jpg. However, it currently is missing information on its copyright status and its source. Wikipedia takes copyright very seriously.

If you did not create this work entirely yourself, you will need to specify the owner of the copyright. If you obtained it from a website, please add a link to the page from which it was taken, together with a brief restatement of the website's terms of use of its content. If the original copyright holder is a party unaffiliated with the website, that author should also be credited. You will also need to state under what licensing terms it was released. Please refer to the image use policy to learn what files you can or cannot upload on Wikipedia. The page on copyright tags may help you to find the correct tag to use for your file.

Please add this information by editing the image description page. If the necessary information is not added within the next seven days, the image will be deleted. If the file is already gone, you can still make a request for undeletion and ask for a chance to fix the problem.

Please also check any other files you may have uploaded to make sure they are correctly tagged. Here is [ a list of your uploads]. If you have any questions please ask them at the Media copyright questions page. Thank you. Sfan00 IMG (talk) 14:58, 20 November 2016 (UTC) Thanks for uploading File:A Little Book of Bible Stories.jpg. However, it currently is missing information on its copyright status and its source. Wikipedia takes copyright very seriously.
 * File source and copyright licensing problem with File:A Little Book of Bible Stories.jpg

If you did not create this work entirely yourself, you will need to specify the owner of the copyright. If you obtained it from a website, please add a link to the page from which it was taken, together with a brief restatement of the website's terms of use of its content. If the original copyright holder is a party unaffiliated with the website, that author should also be credited. You will also need to state under what licensing terms it was released. Please refer to the image use policy to learn what files you can or cannot upload on Wikipedia. The page on copyright tags may help you to find the correct tag to use for your file.

Please add this information by editing the image description page. If the necessary information is not added within the next seven days, the image will be deleted. If the file is already gone, you can still make a request for undeletion and ask for a chance to fix the problem.

Please also check any other files you may have uploaded to make sure they are correctly tagged. Here is [ a list of your uploads]. If you have any questions please ask them at the Media copyright questions page. Thank you. Sfan00 IMG (talk) 14:58, 20 November 2016 (UTC) Thanks for uploading File:Tales for Jack and Jane.jpg. However, it currently is missing information on its copyright status and its source. Wikipedia takes copyright very seriously.
 * File source and copyright licensing problem with File:Tales for Jack and Jane.jpg

If you did not create this work entirely yourself, you will need to specify the owner of the copyright. If you obtained it from a website, please add a link to the page from which it was taken, together with a brief restatement of the website's terms of use of its content. If the original copyright holder is a party unaffiliated with the website, that author should also be credited. You will also need to state under what licensing terms it was released. Please refer to the image use policy to learn what files you can or cannot upload on Wikipedia. The page on copyright tags may help you to find the correct tag to use for your file.

Please add this information by editing the image description page. If the necessary information is not added within the next seven days, the image will be deleted. If the file is already gone, you can still make a request for undeletion and ask for a chance to fix the problem.

Please also check any other files you may have uploaded to make sure they are correctly tagged. Here is [ a list of your uploads]. If you have any questions please ask them at the Media copyright questions page. Thank you. Sfan00 IMG (talk) 14:58, 20 November 2016 (UTC) Thanks for uploading File:Tale that had No Ending.jpg. However, it currently is missing information on its copyright status and its source. Wikipedia takes copyright very seriously.
 * File source and copyright licensing problem with File:Tale that had No Ending.jpg

If you did not create this work entirely yourself, you will need to specify the owner of the copyright. If you obtained it from a website, please add a link to the page from which it was taken, together with a brief restatement of the website's terms of use of its content. If the original copyright holder is a party unaffiliated with the website, that author should also be credited. You will also need to state under what licensing terms it was released. Please refer to the image use policy to learn what files you can or cannot upload on Wikipedia. The page on copyright tags may help you to find the correct tag to use for your file.

Please add this information by editing the image description page. If the necessary information is not added within the next seven days, the image will be deleted. If the file is already gone, you can still make a request for undeletion and ask for a chance to fix the problem.

Please also check any other files you may have uploaded to make sure they are correctly tagged. Here is [ a list of your uploads]. If you have any questions please ask them at the Media copyright questions page. Thank you. Sfan00 IMG (talk) 14:59, 20 November 2016 (UTC) Thanks for uploading File:20 Tales for Telling.jpg. However, it currently is missing information on its copyright status and its source. Wikipedia takes copyright very seriously.
 * File source and copyright licensing problem with File:20 Tales for Telling.jpg

If you did not create this work entirely yourself, you will need to specify the owner of the copyright. If you obtained it from a website, please add a link to the page from which it was taken, together with a brief restatement of the website's terms of use of its content. If the original copyright holder is a party unaffiliated with the website, that author should also be credited. You will also need to state under what licensing terms it was released. Please refer to the image use policy to learn what files you can or cannot upload on Wikipedia. The page on copyright tags may help you to find the correct tag to use for your file.

Please add this information by editing the image description page. If the necessary information is not added within the next seven days, the image will be deleted. If the file is already gone, you can still make a request for undeletion and ask for a chance to fix the problem.

Please also check any other files you may have uploaded to make sure they are correctly tagged. Here is [ a list of your uploads]. If you have any questions please ask them at the Media copyright questions page. Thank you. Sfan00 IMG (talk) 14:59, 20 November 2016 (UTC) Thanks for uploading File:Standard Bearers.jpg. However, it currently is missing information on its copyright status and its source. Wikipedia takes copyright very seriously.
 * File source and copyright licensing problem with File:Standard Bearers.jpg

If you did not create this work entirely yourself, you will need to specify the owner of the copyright. If you obtained it from a website, please add a link to the page from which it was taken, together with a brief restatement of the website's terms of use of its content. If the original copyright holder is a party unaffiliated with the website, that author should also be credited. You will also need to state under what licensing terms it was released. Please refer to the image use policy to learn what files you can or cannot upload on Wikipedia. The page on copyright tags may help you to find the correct tag to use for your file.

Please add this information by editing the image description page. If the necessary information is not added within the next seven days, the image will be deleted. If the file is already gone, you can still make a request for undeletion and ask for a chance to fix the problem.

Please also check any other files you may have uploaded to make sure they are correctly tagged. Here is [ a list of your uploads]. If you have any questions please ask them at the Media copyright questions page. Thank you. Sfan00 IMG (talk) 14:59, 20 November 2016 (UTC) 'File source and copyright licensing problem with File:Twilight and Fireside.jpg Thanks for uploading File:Twilight and Fireside.jpg. However, it currently is missing information on its copyright status and its source. Wikipedia takes copyright very seriously.

If you did not create this work entirely yourself, you will need to specify the owner of the copyright. If you obtained it from a website, please add a link to the page from which it was taken, together with a brief restatement of the website's terms of use of its content. If the original copyright holder is a party unaffiliated with the website, that author should also be credited. You will also need to state under what licensing terms it was released. Please refer to the image use policy to learn what files you can or cannot upload on Wikipedia. The page on copyright tags may help you to find the correct tag to use for your file.

Please add this information by editing the image description page. If the necessary information is not added within the next seven days, the image will be deleted. If the file is already gone, you can still make a request for undeletion and ask for a chance to fix the problem.

Please also check any other files you may have uploaded to make sure they are correctly tagged. Here is [ a list of your uploads]. If you have any questions please ask them at the Media copyright questions page. Thank you. Sfan00 IMG (talk) 14:59, 20 November 2016 (UTC) Thanks for uploading File:Sunshine Tales for Rainy Days.jpg. However, it currently is missing information on its copyright status and its source. Wikipedia takes copyright very seriously.
 * File source and copyright licensing problem with File:Sunshine Tales for Rainy Days.jpg

If you did not create this work entirely yourself, you will need to specify the owner of the copyright. If you obtained it from a website, please add a link to the page from which it was taken, together with a brief restatement of the website's terms of use of its content. If the original copyright holder is a party unaffiliated with the website, that author should also be credited. You will also need to state under what licensing terms it was released. Please refer to the image use policy to learn what files you can or cannot upload on Wikipedia. The page on copyright tags may help you to find the correct tag to use for your file.

Please add this information by editing the image description page. If the necessary information is not added within the next seven days, the image will be deleted. If the file is already gone, you can still make a request for undeletion and ask for a chance to fix the problem.

Please also check any other files you may have uploaded to make sure they are correctly tagged. Here is [ a list of your uploads]. If you have any questions please ask them at the Media copyright questions page. Thank you. Sfan00 IMG (talk) 14:59, 20 November 2016 (UTC)

Help!!
I understand that I have to fix the copyright issue for the images I have uploaded. I am very new to all this and am now very confused need some help with the terminology. Sending me links to information pages is not helping. Could I please have one person with whom I can correspond who can help me understand what I need to do?

I will try and explain the situation. I am the copyright holder for Elizabeth Clark's books. These images by Nina K Brisley used to illustrate her books are probably not out of copyright. But I and another person have made strenuous efforts to locate the heir and estate of the illustrator to no avail. We consulted a copyright lawyer. I can send you a copy of his letter.

BTW I did consult your chat room WIKIMEDIA Commons earlier today and here is part of our conversation  Country is UK. Yes, the Wiki article is about the books and their author, not about the illustrator. I don't need to upload them to Commons, doI? [13:03]  no, if you just want them to illustrate the book, you can do with fair use locally on enwp...https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:File_Upload_Wizard

If Nthep reads this, I too lived in S-o-T for 30 years, or more accurately Newcastle-under-Lyme

Pogga  Pogga D (talk) 15:15, 20 November 2016 (UTC)Sorry I'm not sure what I should do

I'm still not sure what I have to do and where. Is this free and fair use? And if so where do I indicate this?

Please explain to me what these terms mean or tell me what in the light of what I have written above I should do.

I should have thought that common sense would prevail and if I have made effort to find the copyright holder an easy approach would be available to me.

I am not clear how to access and update the File Description page. This is all very off putting indeed. (I am new and currently learning how to use the talk page which is hard enough in itself!)Pogga D (talk) 15:58, 20 November 2016 (UTC)


 * Pogga, even more reason for us to sort this out together. The advice Josve5a gave you is partially correct, as images that are still copyrighted and you can't get a licence from the copyright holder they can't be uploaded to Commons and can only be uploaded locally to Wikipedia.  However as I outlined above they do need to meet the NFCC here on Wikipedia.


 * There are 10 criteria that need to met for every non-free image you want to upload and it's all or nothing, all 10 criteria have to be met or the image fails the policy. The 10 are in the link above so rather than repeat them let me explain how you establish each is met.


 * 1) No free equivalent - not difficult they are book covers so unless any editions have covers designed by Nettie herself or were done and copyright has expired then the images you want to upload are ok because there is no free version.
 * 2) Respect for commercial usage - limited use doesn't affect commercial usage.
 * 3) Minimal usage - 3a (Minimal number of items).  This is the first where we hit problems, multiple non-free uploads used in one article is a non-starter, using one a representative of her (Nettie's) work probably would be ok but they aren't Nettie's work so which one would you use? 3b (Minimal extent of use) - using the whole cover isn't a problem as it's a book cover.
 * 4) Previous publication - not a problem as each book was published (I assume?)
 * 5) Content - It's not like you are trying to upload something irrelevant so not an issue.
 * 6) Media - done properly, the image will be compliant.
 * 7) One article minimum - non-free images must be used in at least one image but must have a separate valid rationale for each article they are used in.  Unused non-free images can be deleted.
 * 8) Contextual significance - this is the difficult one.  Probably more images are deleted for failing this criteria than any other.  What does the image add to the article it is used in?  If the answer is just decoration then it is failing the criteria.  For articles on books, one image of the cover normally passes the criteria as identifying the book but their use in an article on the author normally fails unless each cover illustration has been the subject of critical commentary outside of Wikipedia.  Looking at it the other way round, what do I as a reader lose by not seeing the book covers especially here when they are not Nettie's own work?  By contrast an image on the article on Hugh Lofting probably would meet the criteria as being illustrative of his style of drawing that he used in his own books.
 * 9) Restrictions on location - non-free images can only be used on articles in the main article space.  So while your article on Nettie is still a draft, even if every other criteria were met, the images would currently fail under this criterion.
 * 10) Image description page - done properly, identifying the source of each image, it's copyright status and which article on Wikipedia it is used on is easy.


 * So where do we go from here? Criterion 9 aside as a temporary issue, I think none of the images meet criterion 8 and using them all in one article makes each fail criterion 3a.  On what I've read so far I don't think there is a justification for using any of the images in the article on Nettie.  If you go on from there to write separate articles about each of her books then there is a much better chance of compiling a valid set of criteria for an image on each book.


 * There are two really difficult things to do when you are new to Wikipedia. One is to write an article from scratch and the other is understanding the image use policy.  You're managing the first so to be honest I wouldn't worry about the second.  Write a decent article about Nettie and get the text right, sorting out any images is a nice to have feature not a must have. Nthep (talk) 16:06, 20 November 2016 (UTC)


 * Add, copyright and common sense don't go hand in hand. For one there is both UK and US copyright to consider and the laws are totally different.  Trying to find the copyright holder and get permission from them was absolutely the right thing to do but when that door shuts we are only left with the non-free content option which is deliberate in its aim of minimising non-free use. Nthep (talk) 16:13, 20 November 2016 (UTC)


 * Assuming you cannot get a copyright release, your only option is a non-free image (or none at all!) - assuming you can meet the non-free criteria (shown above). You will need at least two templates for each image
 * Furg - copy and paste the text in the white box, and fill in the fields (to the right of the "=" signs - One "FURG" for every page that the image is used on, as the "FURG" template has to specify the article.
 * Template:Non-free book cover - added thus
 * Reduce every image to comply with WP:Image resolution OR add to the top of the page and a bot will drop the size to as big as possible overnight.
 * BTW, this can only work for true articles. Any article created in userspace or Draft space cannot have non-free images. Ron h jones (Talk) 17:33, 20 November 2016 (UTC)

To Rohnhjones I'm afraid I find your instructions difficult to follow

Where do I put
 * Furg if I put this in when will the white box appear

Do I put both Template:Non-free book cover and and where?

Presumably simply goes at the top of the article.Pogga D (talk) 18:41, 20 November 2016 (UTC)

To Nthep

In response to your message sent 17.33 20/11/16 3. Minimal usage. I could choose the one I like best. What I'm trying to do here is give an idea of what they looked like. I didn't realise till I scanned them how cheerful they are, the old ones you can occasionally buy on eBay etc are very faded. I think this illustration is contextually significant. Illustrations are an extremely important component of children's books. NKB illustrated all (except one) of Nettie's books and provided lots of other illustrations for her articles in periodicals for example, so her relationship with Nettie must have been important. I gather NKB is coming back into fashion. She certainly appears in books on children's illustrators. - no Wiki entry yet though! 4. Yes each book was published. 6. Media. What do you mean by 'done properly'? 7. Unused ones will be deleted. I will delete them from the article. 8. See 3 above 9. I'm not sure what you mean by main article space. I would place it near the list of publications.

I will do what I've said above. Only include one image as well as the two photos and wait to hear from you. Although, if it's OK with you, I will submit the article for review and then make any amendments required about the images when instructed to do so. And if I'm allowed to include it will, when I understand a bit more, include two templates (although I can only see one) as per Ronhjones above. It is much more helpful and less stressful if a novice like me deals with only one respondent.Pogga D (talk) 18:41, 20 November 2016 (UTC)


 * I appreciate what you're trying to achieve and if it's any comfort most of us have been through this steep learning curve about images - not necessarily successfully.
 * 3 & 8 - Contextual significance is about what others have said about the covers, not whether you consider it significant or not. I agree that illustrations are a large part of children's books but why is any one cover significant?  Especially when they are not drawn by Nettie but by NKB.  If this is an important relationship then sources are going to refer to it and comment on it and you can include that commentary in the article on Nettie.
 * 6 - By done properly I mean if we get the image information written down properly then it will be policy compliant.
 * 7 - The unused images will be deleted from Wikipedia. This doesn't stop them being reuploaded at a future date if there is a valid rationale for adding them.
 * 9 - My poor explanation. Wikipedia is made up of a number of namespaces and their associated talk pages.  This is the talk page of a page in the user namespace.  The Image use policy is in the Wikipedia namespace, articles like Hugh Lofting are in the article namespace and your draft article is in the draft namespace.  Non-free images can only be added to pages in the article namespace.
 * Submit the article for review and once it is accepted, choose one of the book covers and we'll see if we can work out a full and valid rationale for it. Don't worry if the image file gets deleted in the meantime, as an admin, I can restore it and I'll go through the rationale creation step by step with you. Nthep (talk) 19:59, 20 November 2016 (UTC)

Your submission at Articles for creation: Annette Elizabeth Clark (November 20)
 Your recent article submission to Articles for Creation has been reviewed! Unfortunately, it has not been accepted at this time. The reason left by Dodger67 was:

The comment the reviewer left was:

Please check the submission for any additional comments left by the reviewer. You are encouraged to edit the submission to address the issues raised and resubmit when they have been resolved.


 * If you would like to continue working on the submission, go to Draft:Annette Elizabeth Clark and click on the "Edit" tab at the top of the window.
 * If you need any assistance, you can ask for help at the or on the.
 * You can also use Wikipedia's real-time chat help from experienced editors.

Roger (Dodger67) (talk) 19:48, 20 November 2016 (UTC)

I understood that one image of an illustration of a book cover by the illustrator in spite of the fact that I cannot find her estate to establish where the copyright resides. It was uploaded but it appears that you have deleted it. Could you explain why? Pogga D (talk) 21:00, 28 November 2016 (UTC)

Sorry that wasn't very clear. I understood that I can include just one of these images and the one I chose has been deleted. Pogga D (talk) 21:02, 28 November 2016 (UTC)

I have submitted my article for re-review on November 29. I cannot find it in any of the relevant articles pending categories Please advise me as to where it isPogga D (talk) 09:11, 4 December 2016 (UTC)


 * I think the disambiguation entry is probably fine. I know nothing about images, so if you were talking with Nthep, it's better to continue doing that.— Vchimpanzee  •  talk  •  contributions  •  19:47, 7 December 2016 (UTC)

Thank you Vchimpanzee. I'm still not quite clear (a) if the article will be accepted as it is nor (b) how to include the disambiguation. And to discuss things with Nthep do I make an entry on his talk page?Pogga D (talk) 20:20, 7 December 2016 (UTC)
 * Yes. I couldn't figure out how to spell his name because I didn't see it in your contributions, but if you know how, then you can find this person.— Vchimpanzee  •  talk  •  contributions  •  20:31, 7 December 2016 (UTC)
 * Found it. I was capitalizing wrong. I must have been remembering the signature.— Vchimpanzee  •  talk  •  contributions  •  20:34, 7 December 2016 (UTC)

Your submission at Articles for creation: Elizabeth Clark (author) has been accepted
 Elizabeth Clark (author), which you submitted to Articles for creation, has been created. The article has been assessed as C-Class, which is recorded on the article's talk page. You may like to take a look at the grading scheme to see how you can improve the article. You are more than welcome to continue making quality contributions to Wikipedia. . Thank you for helping improve Wikipedia! Timothy Joseph Wood 16:18, 15 December 2016 (UTC)
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