User talk:PresN/Archive 30

Administrators' newsletter – July 2023
News and updates for administrators from the past month (June 2023).



Administrator changes
 * Gnome-colors-list-add.svg Novem Linguae
 * Gnome-colors-list-remove.svg Deckiller · Electionworld · MBisanz · Penwhale · Raul654 · Roadrunner · Viridae · Yannismarou

Bureaucrat changes
 * Gnome-colors-list-remove.svg MBisanz

Guideline and policy news
 * Contributions to the English Wikipedia are now released under the Creative Commons Attribution-ShareAlike 4.0 International License (CC BY-SA 4.0) license instead of CC BY-SA 3.0. Contributions are still also released under the GFDL license.

Technical news
 * Discussion is open regarding a proposed global policy regarding third-party resources. Third-party resources are computer resources that reside outside of Wikimedia production websites.

Arbitration
 * Two arbitration cases are currently open. Proposed decisions are expected 5 July 2023 for the Scottywong case and 9 July 2023 for the AlisonW case.

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Archive Sent by MediaWiki message delivery (talk) 12:58, 1 July 2023 (UTC)

Your GA nomination of Doom (1993 video game)
Hi there, I'm pleased to inform you that I've begun reviewing the article Doom (1993 video game) you nominated for GA-status according to the criteria. This process may take up to 7 days. Feel free to contact me with any questions or comments you might have during this period. Message delivered by ChristieBot, on behalf of Shooterwalker -- Shooterwalker (talk) 23:42, 2 July 2023 (UTC)

WikiCup 2023 July newsletter
The third round of the 2023 WikiCup has come to an end. The 16 users who made it to the fourth round had at least 175 points. Our top scorers in round 3 were:


 * Thebiguglyalien, with 919 points from a featured article on Frances Cleveland as well as five good articles and many reviews,
 * Unlimitedlead, with 862 points from a high-scoring featured articles on Henry II of England and numerous reviews,
 * Iazyges, with 560 points from a high-scoring featured article on Tiberius III.

Contestants achieved 11 featured articles, 2 featured lists, 47 good articles, 72 featured or good article reviews, over 100 DYKs and 40 ITN appearances. As always, any content promoted after the end of round 3 but before the start of round 4 can be claimed in round 4. Please also remember that you must claim your points within 14 days of "earning" them. When doing GARs, please make sure that you check that all the GA criteria are fully met. Please also remember that all submissions must meet core Wikipedia policies, regardless of the review process.

If you are concerned that your nomination—whether it is at good article nominations, a featured process, or anywhere else—will not receive the necessary reviews, please list it on WikiCup/Reviews Needed (remember to remove your listing when no longer required). Questions are welcome on Wikipedia talk:WikiCup, and the judges are reachable on their talk pages or by email. Good luck! If you wish to start or stop receiving this newsletter, please feel free to add or remove your name from WikiCup/Newsletter/Send. Sturmvogel 66 (talk) and Cwmhiraeth (talk). MediaWiki message delivery (talk) 15:18, 8 July 2023 (UTC)

Multiple FLCs
Hello PresN. I'm having a tough time finding it, but I thought I read something about not being able to have multiple FL nominations open at the same time. Are you able to point me towards anything where this is mentioned? I'm listed as a co nom on a current nomination and I wanted to see whether I could nominate a different article I have ready. Hey man im josh (talk) 22:42, 13 July 2023 (UTC)
 * It's on the main FLC page, 2nd paragraph: "Nominators should not add a second featured list nomination until the first has gained substantial support and reviewers' concerns have been substantially addressed." That said, all rules are up to coordinator discretion, and since your first is a co-nom I'm fine with you nominating a second list. The point is to avoid having nominators have too much open at once that they get overwhelmed, especially if they're new to FLC (or the reviewers get overwhelmed with too many similar nominations), but you have 2 FLs already and it's a co-nom anyway, so I'm not worried. -- Pres N  00:54, 14 July 2023 (UTC)
 * I appreciate you getting back to me, I feel blind having missed that. That's awesome to hear, I'll be putting the finishing touches and putting up a nomination tomorrow then. Thanks for the work you do and for helping me out! Hey man im josh (talk) 01:17, 14 July 2023 (UTC)

Your GA nomination of Doom (1993 video game)
The article Doom (1993 video game) you nominated as a good article has passed ; see Talk:Doom (1993 video game) for comments about the article, and Talk:Doom (1993 video game)/GA2 for the nomination. Well done! If the article has not already appeared on the main page as a "Did you know" item, or as a bold link under "In the News" or in the "On This Day" prose section, you can nominate it within the next seven days to appear in DYK. Bolded names with dates listed at the bottom of the "On This Day" column do not affect DYK eligibility. Message delivered by ChristieBot, on behalf of Shooterwalker -- Shooterwalker (talk) 00:44, 31 July 2023 (UTC)

List advise, revert or not?
Howdy. Earlier this year, List of British armies in World War II was promoted to FLC. Yesterday, this edit was made. Can you advise if this is okay, or if it should be reverted back to the format the list was in when it was promoted.EnigmaMcmxc (talk) 15:29, 4 August 2023 (UTC)
 * The change is fine in terms of FL status- revert or not as you choose. The FL project's opinion on post-promotion changes is just "if it's egregious, then revert it or take it to FLR", but overall we don't have the resources or inclination to demand that FLs stay unchanged post-promotion.
 * That said, I'm in favor of the change not for the "readers can jump to subsections" reason the IP editor gave (the list isn't so long that the reader can't just scroll down another inch or two), but because there enough text and columns in the table that on narrower screens the text gets squished horizontally pretty far, so moving it below the table makes it easier to read that way. If you'd rather that the text be next to the other details of the army in question, that's fine though; there's a limit to how much we can do for small screens when if comes to tabular data. -- Pres N  15:48, 4 August 2023 (UTC)
 * My lack of experience in the "list" side of things made me wonder if it would even be acceptable. So, I really appreciate the follow-up. I shall leave the edit in place, based on your reasoning.EnigmaMcmxc (talk) 18:00, 4 August 2023 (UTC)

WikiProject Video games
Hello PresN, I was surprised at being notified at the topic you added at WT:WikiProject Video games. My name was listed against MUSHclient as having un-redirected it, which I have not done. I had reverted some changes earlier though, and now that it came to my notice, I have just turned it back to a redirect. If the updates you added were generated by a script, then the script is wrong. Jay 💬 16:16, 7 August 2023 (UTC)
 * Sorry, the script tagged you as the "last creator" because your edit on June 18 had the "Removed redirect" tag, e.g. changing the article from a redirect to an actual article, probably because your edit restored the RfD tag thereby making the page no longer redirect. -- Pres N  16:30, 7 August 2023 (UTC)
 * Got it! I guess Twinkle needs to be tweaked to understand that adding a RfD notice while technically is removing a redirect, it should be tagged as something else, perhaps with a new tagname. Jay  💬 16:42, 7 August 2023 (UTC)

Administrators' newsletter – August 2023
News and updates for administrators from the past month (July 2023).



Administrator changes
 * Gnome-colors-list-add.svg Firefangledfeathers
 * Gnome-colors-list-remove.svg AlisonW · Amberrock · Closedmouth · Scottywong

Interface administrator changes
 * Gnome-colors-list-add.svg Novem Linguae

Technical news
 * The tag filter on Special:NewPages and revision history pages can now be inverted. This allows hiding edits made by automated tools.
 * Special:BlockedExternalDomains is a new tool that allows easier blocking of plain domains (and their subdomains). This is more easily searchable and is faster for the software to use than the existing MediaWiki:Spam-blacklist. It does not support regex (for complex cases), URL path-matching, or the MediaWiki:Spam-whitelist.

Arbitration
 * The arbitration cases named Scottywong and AlisonW closed 10 July and 16 July respectively.
 * The SmallCat dispute arbitration case is in the workshop phase.

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Archive Sent by MediaWiki message delivery (talk) 08:54, 8 August 2023 (UTC)

A goat for you!
Cos you are the G.O.A.T. for making the various primate lists into tables (which I'm now working to copy to the genus articles).

UtherSRG (talk) 14:42, 11 August 2023 (UTC) 
 * Thanks! Happy to see them propagate, and thanks for adding the images to the lorisoids list. -- Pres N  14:57, 11 August 2023 (UTC)

Chrono Cross under Featured Article Review
I have nominated Chrono Cross for a featured article review here. Please join the discussion on whether this article meets the featured article criteria. Articles are typically reviewed for two weeks. If substantial concerns are not addressed during the review period, the article will be moved to the Featured Article Removal Candidates list for a further period, where editors may declare "Keep" or "Delist" in regards to the article's featured status. The instructions for the review process are here. George Ho (talk) 09:56, 13 August 2023 (UTC)

Pygmy slow loris
ASM MDD has already moved even further to split this into two species in Xanthonycticebus. The species article was updated over a year ago, as was the former genus article. MSW3 is super out of date. We generally move forward if either the IUCN or ASM's MDD move forward, though we certainly prefer when IUCN and ASM agree. - UtherSRG (talk) 14:10, 15 August 2023 (UTC)


 * Also, while I originally created the Primates wikiproject as a child of the mammals project, it stands alone and is independent. - UtherSRG (talk) 14:22, 15 August 2023 (UTC)
 * Further, a quick search for Xanthonycticebus shows a variety of well respected secondary sources using it, including some that already accept the species split. The notion of waiting for both the IUCN and ASM to accept a taxonomic change is a benchmark used in absence of any other secondary sources supporting the change. - UtherSRG (talk) 15:04, 15 August 2023 (UTC)
 * I'll revert my reversion, but to be completely honest, the real issue is that I need a hard line to follow for these species lists, because there's 5700+ mammal species and I can't manually evaluate all of them. Primates may be internally consistent on-wiki, but in other orders I've found species articles that are years out of date, that contradict their own genus/family articles, or which even contradict themselves. And never mind when ASM decides to follow a single 6-month-old research paper to split a species into 5 because nothing contradicts it yet, like they did multiple times in Lagomorpha. "What is the general consensus among scholars" isn't a useful metric when the accepted consensus recorders disagree- I'm not a subject matter expert and can't decide better then they can, so I need a straightforward rule to follow. MAMMAL's "iucn+asm" works well for that. If WP:PRIMATE has its own rule for that subdomain I can follow that instead, though I note that no such rule is listed on the wikiproject page. -- Pres N  15:36, 15 August 2023 (UTC)
 * I totally understand your perspective. Taxonomy is a slippery eel! I work hard to keep the primates in line and help out where I can with a lot of mammals and some others. Cheers! - UtherSRG (talk) 15:44, 15 August 2023 (UTC)

TFL notification for September 2023
Hi, PresN. I'm just posting to let you know that List of dasyuromorphs – a list that you have been heavily involved with – has been chosen to appear on the Main Page as Today's featured list for September 4. The TFL blurb can be seen here. If you have any thoughts on the selection, please post them on my talk page or at TFL talk. Regards, Giants2008  ( Talk ) 22:34, 19 August 2023 (UTC)

Multiple FLCs
Hello! I currently have one FLC up for review, and I've resolved all the comments from the reviewers. I understand that there's a rule against having multiple FLCs up for review. However, I've seen some users with multiple FLCs open and wanted to ask if there are any exceptions to this rule, like do you need to review a couple of others for each extra you nominate? I'm asking because I have another list that I'm planning to nominate soon. Thanks :)  ULPS ( talk •  contribs ) 23:03, 19 August 2023 (UTC)
 * Yep, the rule is "Nominators should not add a second featured list nomination until the first has gained substantial support and reviewers' concerns have been substantially addressed.", and it's up to coordinator discretion. Your list has multiple supports and no outstanding reviewer comments to resolve, and it's not your first FLC, so you're good to go ahead and add another one. There's no review requirement, though obviously it's polite (and a good idea to help your own nominations get reviews) to do so. -- Pres N  00:29, 20 August 2023 (UTC)
 * Alright great! I'll keep that in mind when its ready and I'll knock out some reviews in the meantine. Appreciate the quick response.  ULPS ( talk •  contribs ) 00:33, 20 August 2023 (UTC)

False title
Hey, thanks for reading the essay. I won't restore the changes, but I just have to ask about this in your edit summary:

"noun as adjective" isn't the same thing as "false title"

What are you talking about here? Can you give me an example? Popcornfud (talk) 15:38, 20 August 2023 (UTC)
 * Sure, you seem to be arguing that any time you use a noun as an adjective without a "the" in front of it, that you're making a "false title". So, taking as an example your version:
 * "Additionally, the other co-founders, the designer John Romero and the lead artist, Adrian Carmack, wanted to create something in a darker style than the Keen games."
 * You're saying that ", designer John Romero" is a false title, while ", the designer John Romero" is not. I have three disagreements with this kind of change: 1, "designer John Romero", where the noun "designer" is acting as an adjective describing John Romero, is perfectly grammatically correct, so the change is just your own stylistic opinion that it denotes a "title". 2, "the designer" is just as much of a "title" as "designer", only now its two words instead of one, and to my ear reads as an emphasized title rather than a descriptor. "The President Joe Biden" is a title with or without the "the", and sounds like even more of a title to me. And 3, slapping "the" in front of these words often implies a singularity that isn't true: Romero wasn't, "the designer", in either sense—Tom Hall was the lead designer for half of the game's development, so Romero wasn't "the only" designer, and Romero was also one of the programmers, meaning he wasn't just the "designer". And it's not just that sentence- "the id co-founder and lead programmer, John Carmack" - Carmack definitionally cannot be "the" co-founder as there were several, and in fact a few sentences later you had "The co-founder and lead designer, Tom Hall, proposed a new game", but Tom Hall is again not "the" co-founder, and is not even "the other" co-founder, as there were four. -- Pres N  16:59, 20 August 2023 (UTC)
 * Thanks for the reply. This is indeed a stylistic matter so that's why I won't press the issue. I'm always interested in hearing how persuasive (or not) people find the argument I make for this one.
 * To respond to the issue of "implying a singularity that isn't true" — that's a completely unrelated matter, which is determined by commas:
 * the designer, John Romero = Romero was the only designer
 * the designer John Romero = Romero was one of several designers
 * Garner's Modern English Usage covers this (in the context of false titles) if you're interested. If you're not interested, feel free to ignore and carry on with your life! Popcornfud (talk) 17:13, 20 August 2023 (UTC)

Spacewar!
Hi PresN, I want a video game for the October TFAs ... how about this one? Is this a good time to run it? - Dank (push to talk) 16:00, 22 August 2023 (UTC)
 * Sounds good to me! -- Pres N  16:15, 22 August 2023 (UTC)
 * Looks like it will be October 19. - Dank (push to talk) 03:33, 3 September 2023 (UTC)

Identification of AI generated article content
I note you recently redirected the article The Tearoom on the basis that its content was unsourced and relied on AI-generated content. I agree this was a sound move as the article had numerous problems, but I was curious how you identified the content was AI-generated as opposed to the work of an enthusiastic if inexperienced contributor? ＶＲＸＣＥＳ (talk) 01:37, 25 August 2023 (UTC)
 * See Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Video games - the editor in question has been around for a long time, has admitted it, and has been recently blocked for it. Asides from that, I had been going through a bunch of their articles in a row, and some of the other ones were more blatent in "AI-speak" where it uses odd, corporate turns of phrase that don't really say anything or else way overstate things, cited to a citation that says nothing of the sort. -- Pres N  02:01, 25 August 2023 (UTC)
 * Wonderful, thanks for providing some background. I didn't realise it was systemic on the part of this user. Looking through them now, the biggest issues seemed to have been fairly blatant POV statements and non-existent sourcing. I plan to redo Robert Yang game articles with proper content in due course. Thanks again! ＶＲＸＣＥＳ (talk) 02:31, 25 August 2023 (UTC)

id Software in lowercase
"id Software" is not just a stylization used exclusively in their logo, lettering or something, but simply the only correct spelling of their proper name. It's also constantly written in lowercase in the article about the company, even if it's a sentence start, see id Software.

It's comparable to "iPhone", which can also only be written in lowercase, even if it's the first word in a sentence; "iPhone" is not a stylization, but the only correct use of the brand name, just like "id Software" is the correct name of the company. Maxeto0910 (talk) 16:25, 30 August 2023 (UTC)
 * MOS:TMLOWER - iPhone and eBay get an exception because you uppercase the second letter and pronounce the first, but for id, technically all uses of it should be capitalized, even in the middle of sentences. I'm not going to bother to enforce that, or touch id Software at all, but for the start of sentences it needs to follow English grammar rules. -- Pres N  16:57, 30 August 2023 (UTC)
 * Your linked guideline page states:
 * "[...] if the title of the article is the stylized version of the name [...], it should be [...] used throughout the text (and, in most cases, in other articles that mention it)."
 * So it seems like Wikipedia adopted the spelling of "id Software" by using it as the lemma of the company's article, which is why this spelling should be used throughout Wikipedia. Maxeto0910 (talk) 17:05, 30 August 2023 (UTC)
 * So it seems like Wikipedia adopted the spelling of "id Software" by using it as the lemma of the company's article, which is why this spelling should be used throughout Wikipedia. Maxeto0910 (talk) 17:05, 30 August 2023 (UTC)
 * So it seems like Wikipedia adopted the spelling of "id Software" by using it as the lemma of the company's article, which is why this spelling should be used throughout Wikipedia. Maxeto0910 (talk) 17:05, 30 August 2023 (UTC)

Administrators' newsletter – September 2023
News and updates for administrators from the past month (August 2023).

Administrator changes
 * Gnome-colors-list-add.svg Pppery · Theleekycauldron
 * Gnome-colors-list-remove.svg Dwheeler · G.A.S · Royalbroil · Ssd



CheckUser changes
 * Gnome-colors-view-refresh.svg Bradv

Oversighter changes
 * Gnome-colors-view-refresh.svg Bradv

Guideline and policy news
 * Following an RfC, TFAs will be automatically semi-protected the day before it is on the main page and through the day after.
 * A discussion at WP:VPP about revision deletion and oversight for dead names found that [s]ysops can choose to use revdel if, in their view, it's the right tool for this situation, and they need not default to oversight. But oversight could well be right where there's a particularly high risk to the person. Use your judgment.

Technical news
 * Special:Contributions now shows the user's local edit count and the account's creation date.

Arbitration
 * The SmallCat dispute case has closed. As part of the final decision, editors participating in XfD have been reminded to be careful about forming local consensus which may or may not reflect the broader community consensus. Regular closers of XfD forums were also encouraged to note when broader community discussion, or changes to policies and guidelines, would be helpful.

Miscellaneous
 * Tech tip: The "Browse history interactively" banner shown at the top of Special:Diff can be used to easily look through a history, assemble composite diffs, or find out what archive something wound up in.

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Archive Sent by MediaWiki message delivery (talk) 09:22, 1 September 2023 (UTC)

List of hornbills
Currently working on list of hornbills in my sandbox, and I was thinking of including species in a slightly unconventional way. The "true" hornbills are all in Bucerotidae, and the sister ground hornbills are in Bucorvidae. I know we usually organize species lists by family, but since both of these form a monophyletic clade and are covered by the term hornbill, I would include both Bucorvidae and Bucerotidae in the same list. Thoughts? AryKun (talk) 14:21, 2 September 2023 (UTC)
 * Looks like those are the only two extant families in the suborder Buceroti? Then yeah, makes sense to me to combine the two families into one list. I think as long as the grouping makes logical sense and is useful to readers then it's fine to vary from "per-family" groupings, and in this case it feels fine to add on the 2 ground hornbill species into a combined "hornbills" list. I've done suborders before in mammals (for the kangaroo+ order), and for primates I'm doing superfamilies, so whatever makes sense for the readers for that clade works. -- Pres N  19:04, 2 September 2023 (UTC)

WikiCup 2023 September newsletter
The fourth round of the competition has finished, with anyone scoring less than 673 points being eliminated. It was a high scoring round with all but one of the contestants who progressed to the final having achieved an FA during the round. The highest scorers were


 * Epicgenius, with 2173 points topping the scores, gained mainly from a featured article, 38 good articles and 9 DYKs. He was followed by
 * Sammi Brie, with 1575 points, gained mainly from a featured article, 28 good articles and 50 good article reviews. Close behind was
 * Thebiguglyalien, with 1535 points mainly gained from a featured article, 15 good articles, 26 good article reviews and lots of bonus points.

Between them during round 4, contestants achieved 12 featured articles, 3 featured lists, 3 featured pictures, 126 good articles, 46 DYK entries, 14 ITN entries, 67 featured article candidate reviews and 147 good article reviews. Congratulations to our eight finalists and all who participated! It was a generally high-scoring and productive round and I think we can expect a highly competitive finish to the competition.

Remember that any content promoted after the end of round 4 but before the start of round 5 can be claimed in round 5. Remember too that you must claim your points within 10 days of "earning" them and within 24 hours of the end of the final. If you are concerned that your nomination will not receive the necessary reviews, please list it on WikiCup/Reviews. It would be helpful if this list could be cleared of any items no longer relevant. If you want to help out with the WikiCup, please do your bit to keep down the review backlogs! Questions are welcome on Wikipedia talk:WikiCup, and the judges are reachable on their talk pages or by email. If you wish to start or stop receiving this newsletter, please feel free to add or remove your name from WikiCup/Newsletter/Send.

I will be standing down as a judge after the end of the contest. I think the Cup encourages productive editors to improve their contributions to Wikipedia and I hope that someone else will step up to take over the running of the Cup. Sturmvogel 66 (talk), and Cwmhiraeth (talk)

Doom RPG
Hi! Was wondering can you help expand Doom RPG? I found a lot more sources than I though, , , (some other aticles from IGN as well) Timur9008 (talk) 18:34, 10 September 2023 (UTC)
 * Sorry, already have a few projects queued up, and it's not a subject I'm that interested in despite working on the original Doom. -- Pres N  01:05, 11 September 2023 (UTC)
 * No worries. Thanks! Timur9008 (talk) 02:35, 11 September 2023 (UTC)
 * Not sure if this ref is useful for the Doom 1993 article (mentions sales for full version of the game for the first five months ~ 65,000 according to Wilbur)
 * Timur9008 (talk) 16:40, 5 October 2023 (UTC)

Animal genera table
Hey, I'm reworking the hummingbird list with genera tables, and I'd appreciate if you could add an option to suppress the ecology column to Template:Animal genera table the way you did for the species table template. AryKun (talk) 13:56, 14 September 2023 (UTC)
 * Alright, done, let me know if you have any problems. -- Pres N  15:15, 14 September 2023 (UTC)

Using a gif
After expanding more Mega Man X games, I wondered if I should give an extra image to the protagonist X. The problem I am having is that the article which I expanded some months ago to make it GA has several discussions about the idea of X wearing armors. I couldn't find any concept image that might stand out except this gif from Marvel vs Capcom Infinite which might be extra helpful since Capcom explained that they added X to the fighting game since he is popular to Western audiences. Still I can't save this image as a gif and wanted to know your opinion regarding it. Maybe I should get rid of the concept art image from creation and add the gif to avoid having too many nonfree images? Cheers.Tintor2 (talk) 00:14, 24 September 2023 (UTC)
 * I don't really think that clip adds much that's not already in the article; the image in "Development and designs" basically covers the concept of "wears armor", and showing another style would be overkill. I'd rather keep the image in "Original concept". -- Pres N  00:32, 24 September 2023 (UTC)

Thanks. By the way another question about Mega Man. I've sourced most of Mega Man X: Command Mission's gameplay and plot through the official guide that was archived by google books. Is it okay to use it like this? Maybe I should add it to a "bibliography" subsection and cut it to pages to save weight? Cheers.Tintor2 (talk) 18:29, 26 September 2023 (UTC)
 * Yeah, you can cite that. Making a section for the full book is also fine, with only one book source it's not too bad either way, but for e.g. Doom (1993 video game) I have a "Sources" section at the bottom for books and then just do like "Kushner, pp. 113–117" in the references to reduce the duplication. -- Pres N  18:36, 26 September 2023 (UTC)

I managed to cut 2 kylobites through it but there is an issue with citing the author apparently.Tintor2 (talk) 18:57, 26 September 2023 (UTC)

Tunic (video game) scheduled for TFA
This is to let you know that the above article has been scheduled as today's featured article for 12 November 2023. Please check that the article needs no amendments. Feel free to amend the draft blurb, which can be found at Today's featured article/November 12, 2023, or to make comments on other matters concerning the scheduling of this article at Wikipedia talk:Today's featured article/November 2023. I suggest that you watchlist Main Page/Errors from the day before this appears on Main Page. Thanks and congratulations on your work. Gog the Mild (talk) 13:42, 30 September 2023 (UTC)

Administrators' newsletter – September 2023
News and updates for administrators from the past month (September 2023).

Administrator changes
 * Gnome-colors-list-add.svg Hey man im josh
 * Gnome-colors-list-remove.svg Alex Bakharev · CorbieVreccan · Cyphoidbomb · Davodd · Hog Farm · JamesR · KnightLago · Mark Ironie · Nosebagbear (deceased) · Rschen7754 · Tamzin · TonyBallioni



CheckUser changes
 * Gnome-colors-list-add.svg DatGuy
 * Gnome-colors-view-refresh.svg Ferret · RickinBaltimore
 * Gnome-colors-list-remove.svg TonyBallioni · Worm That Turned

Oversighter changes
 * Gnome-colors-view-refresh.svg RickinBaltimore
 * Gnome-colors-list-remove.svg TonyBallioni · Worm That Turned

Guideline and policy news
 * An RfC is open regarding amending the paid-contribution disclosure policy to add the following text: Any administrator soliciting clients for paid Wikipedia-related consulting or advising services not covered by other paid-contribution rules must disclose all clients on their userpage.

Technical news
 * Administrators can now choose to add the user's user page to their watchlist when changing the usergroups for a user. This works both via Special:UserRights and via the API.

Arbitration
 * Remedy 9 ("MarioProtIV topic ban") of the WikiProject Tropical Cyclones case has been rescinded.

Miscellaneous
 * The 2023 CheckUser and Oversight appointments process has concluded with the appointment of one new CheckUser.
 * Self-nominations for the electoral commission for the 2023 Arbitration Committee elections opens on 2 October and closes on 8 October.

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Archive Sent by MediaWiki message delivery (talk) 14:41, 4 October 2023 (UTC)

Editor of the Week
User:Panini! submitted the following nomination for Editor of the Week:
 * I would like to nominate PresN to be the editor of the week! An administrator and WP:FLC delegate, PresN has made over 70,000 edits over his 15 active years on Wikipedia. I'm not sure where FLC would be without them. He has contributed to over 120 good articles, 24 featured articles, and next to 100 featured lists, mainly about animals, science fiction, and the early years of video games. I know him from the latter. A consistent and reliable editor, who simultaneously maintains administrative and content-creations sides of Wikipedia with ease and excellence. He is active in Wikiproject video games, maintaining scripts for quick-glance stats. His well-mannered cooperation and continuously friendly reputation is on display everywhere. User:Aza24, User:Kavyansh.Singh, User:Hey man im josh and User:AryKun have all seconded this nomination.

You can copy the following text to your user page to display a user box proclaiming your selection as Editor of the Week:

Thanks again for your efforts! &#8213; Buster7  &#9742;   05:00, 7 October 2023 (UTC)
 * Thank you, and thank you, , , , ! -- Pres N  14:16, 7 October 2023 (UTC)
 * Well deserved! – Kavyansh.Singh (talk) 14:18, 7 October 2023 (UTC)
 * You definitely deserve this one! AryKun (talk) 14:31, 7 October 2023 (UTC)
 * Long overdue! Hey man im josh (talk) 17:57, 7 October 2023 (UTC)
 * Congratulations, you earned it! Happy editing, SilverTiger12 (talk) 19:30, 7 October 2023 (UTC)

Promotion of Doom (1993 video game)
Congrats PresN.Tintor2 (talk) 00:40, 8 October 2023 (UTC)


 * A huge accomplishment! Panini!  • 🥪 21:26, 8 October 2023 (UTC)

TFL notification for November 2023
Hi, PresN. I'm just posting to let you know that Ray Bradbury Award – a list that you have been heavily involved with – has been chosen to appear on the Main Page as Today's featured list for November 3. The TFL blurb can be seen here. If you have any thoughts on the selection, please post them on my talk page or at TFL talk. Regards, Giants2008  ( Talk ) 21:34, 9 October 2023 (UTC)

Accessibility for tables
Hello, since you were the one to review/help with the accessibility part of the 2012 NBA draft FLC, I was hoping I could get your help with another list before I eventually nominate it for FLC.

The article is Portland Trail Blazers draft history. I'm looking for help with adding !scope=col just because of how the table is coded, so I'm not sure how to fit it in without breaking it.

I'm also not sure where to put !scope=row since since none of the columns are really unique to each row. --  ZooBlazer talk 15:55, 11 October 2023 (UTC)
 * Made a couple edits with explanations in the comments; feel free to revert any/all of it. --18:34, 11 October 2023 (UTC)
 * Thank you for your help! --  ZooBlazer talk 19:07, 11 October 2023 (UTC)
 * Hate to bother you again, but I realized how bad I am with adding these types of things when it isn't just a basic table. Could you help me out with Portland Trail Blazers all-time roster if you have a chance? This should be the last time I bother you about a list. --  ZooBlazer talk 05:59, 16 October 2023 (UTC)
 * Done. -- Pres N  15:33, 16 October 2023 (UTC)
 * Thank you! --  ZooBlazer talk 15:45, 16 October 2023 (UTC)
 * Hello Pres I was wondering if you had suggestions of what to do about adding !scope=row in the table under selections at 1970 NBA expansion draft. It's supposed to be a column of unique entries in each row, correct? The only column like that in this case is the players, but the problem is it overrides the accomplishment colors for the four players that have them. -- Zoo  Blazer  21:35, 27 January 2024 (UTC)
 * Fixed it for you- there's probably another way to do it, but as far as I could tell, even though it shouldn't make a difference, "bgcolor=whatever" was being overridden by the row header styling, but replacing it with the actual styling that's a shorthand for, style="background-color:whatever", doesn't get overridden. So, swapping that out let the player column be the row headers while still having the coloring. -- Pres N  01:01, 28 January 2024 (UTC)
 * Thanks again for your help! -- Zoo  Blazer  01:05, 28 January 2024 (UTC)

Sorry to bother you yet again... you're just the only editor that I know of who helps with accessibility for FLC. Although this question is a little different as it involves colors in tables. It may not be accessibility, but more readability this time. It involves players at Portland Trail Blazers draft history with multiple accomplishments, meaning multiple background colors are needed.

The current conversation is at the FLC with me and SounderBruce. The idea was originally suggested by EN-Jungwon in one of my previous FLCs. I bring that up because this color situation affects three lists I've worked on/am working on, so any changes will have to be made to them too. Any suggestions of how to make it obvious there are multiple accomplishments beyond just the symbols that denote them? -- Zoo  Blazer  19:14, 30 January 2024 (UTC)

List of songs recorded by Basshunter
Hello. Archived versions are incorrect. Eurohunter (talk) 16:54, 13 October 2023 (UTC)
 * Alright, guess IABot doesn't archive spotify links correctly; feel free to just revert me. -- Pres N  20:22, 15 October 2023 (UTC)

List of platyrrhines
Do you have this list on your task list to convert to use those beautiful tables? - UtherSRG (talk) 12:20, 16 October 2023 (UTC)
 * Yep, that's next. I've been very busy the last few weeks, but I'm slowing working through it at User:PresN/plats. -- Pres N  12:59, 16 October 2023 (UTC)
 * Fantastic! :) - UtherSRG (talk) 13:16, 16 October 2023 (UTC)

List of Crystal Dynamics video games
Heya. I'm currently having Crystal Dynamics reviewed for GA. Meanwhile, List of Crystal Dynamics video games has been a FL since early 2013. Given the knowledge from the rewritten article, a glance over the listicle reveals a dire state: Factual errors (in both the text and the table), a missing game (Blood Omen: Legacy of Kain), incorrect entries (Toys for Bob games published by Eidos Interactive instead of Crystal Dynamics), missing platforms, unsourced data, and unreliable sources. Additionally, the heavily efn-based information system is convoluted and inherently reader-unfriendly. Since I currently do not have the resources to overhaul the listicle, I quickly whipped up a condensed, in-article games table (as I usually do). As our resident games list expert, what do you think is best course of action here? Is the listicle worth a complete rework or should it be redirected to the main article? Regards, IceWelder  &#91; &#9993; &#93; 09:42, 18 October 2023 (UTC)
 * Hmm. I don't think it should be redirected, but it does need an overhaul. Let me see if I can get it mostly cleaned up this weekend- most of the sources are fine, just not sufficient (though I have no idea what Spong is), and these mostly aren't small titles so it shouldn't be too hard to source. -- Pres N  11:59, 18 October 2023 (UTC)

Contest?
Hello, I noticed that you've been getting around two species lists to FL every month; maybe you'd like to note your contributions at the TOL contest? AryKun (talk) 08:54, 19 October 2023 (UTC)

TFA
Thank you today for Spacewar!, introduced (in 2020): "The history of video games in many references begins with the first commercial products in 1972, but they're predated by a much more robust game a decade prior: Spacewar!. Appearing out of almost whole cloth, it leapt past prior "tic-tac-toe" or "20 questions" games played by a handful of people as a multiplayer real-time space combat game that led to the first detached controllers and first game tournament. It was the first game known to be played at more than one computer installation, and in fact spread to nearly every possible mainframe installation as the most popular game of the 60s. It directly inspired both of the first two arcade video games, as well as games for years after, and was included as one of the first 10 games of the game canon at the Library of Congress in 2007."! -- Gerda Arendt (talk) 09:38, 19 October 2023 (UTC)

WikiCup 2023 November newsletter
The WikiCup is a marathon rather than a sprint and all those reaching the final round have been involved in the competition for the last ten months, improving Wikipedia vastly during the process. After all this hard work, BeanieFan11 has emerged as the 2023 winner and the WikiCup Champion. The finalists this year were:-


 * BeanieFan11 with 2582 points
 * Thebiguglyalien with 1615 points
 * Epicgenius with 1518 points
 * MyCatIsAChonk with 1012 points
 * BennyOnTheLoose with 974 points
 * AirshipJungleman29 with 673 points
 * Sammi Brie with 520 points
 * Unlimitedlead with 5 points

Congratulations to everyone who participated in this year's WikiCup, whether they made it to the final round or not, and particular congratulations to the newcomers to the competition, some of whom did very well. Wikipedia has benefitted greatly from the quality creations, expansions and improvements made, and the numerous reviews performed. All those who reached the final round will win awards. The following special awards will be made based on high performance in particular areas of content creation and review. Awards will be handed out in the next few days.


 * Unlimitedlead wins the featured article prize, for 7 FAs in total including 3 in round 2.
 * MyCatIsAChonk wins the featured list prize, for 5 FLs in total.
 * 🏴󠁧󠁢󠁥󠁮󠁧󠁿 Lee Vilenski wins the featured topic prize, for a 6-article featured topic in round 4.
 * MyCatIsAChonk wins the featured picture prize, for 6 FPs in total.
 * BeanieFan11 wins the good article prize, for 75 GAs in total, including 61 in the final round.
 * Epicgenius wins the good topic prize, for a 41-article good topic in the final round.
 * LunaEatsTuna wins the GA reviewer prize, for 70 GA reviews in round 1.
 * MyCatIsAChonk wins the FA reviewer prize, for 66 FA reviews in the final round.
 * Epicgenius wins the DYK prize, for 49 did you know articles in total.
 * 🇺🇦 Muboshgu wins the ITN prize, for 46 in the news articles in total.

The WikiCup has run every year since 2007. With the 2023 contest now concluded, I will be standing down as a judge due to real life commitments, so I hope that another editor will take over running the competition. Please get in touch if you are interested. Next year's competition will hopefully begin on 1 January 2024. You are invited to sign up to participate in the contest; the WikiCup is open to all Wikipedians, both novices and experienced editors. It only remains to congratulate our worthy winners once again and thank all participants for their involvement! (If you wish to start or stop receiving this newsletter, please feel free to add or remove your name from WikiCup/Newsletter/Send.) Sturmvogel 66 and Cwmhiraeth. MediaWiki message delivery (talk) 16:52, 5 November 2023 (UTC)

Administrators' newsletter – November 2023
News and updates for administrators from the past month (October 2023).



Administrator changes
 * Gnome-colors-list-add.svg 0xDeadbeef
 * Gnome-colors-view-refresh.svg Tamzin
 * Gnome-colors-list-remove.svg Dennis Brown

Interface administrator changes
 * Gnome-colors-list-add.svg Pppery
 * Gnome-colors-list-remove.svg Ragesoss · TheresNoTime

Guideline and policy news

Technical news
 * The WMF is working on making it possible for administrators to edit MediaWiki configuration directly. This is similar to previous work on Special:EditGrowthConfig. A technical RfC is running until November 08, where you can provide feedback.
 * There is a proposed plan for re-enabling the Graph Extension. Feedback on this proposal is requested.

Arbitration
 * Eligible editors are invited to self-nominate themselves from 12 November 2023 until 21 November 2023 to stand in the 2023 Arbitration Committee elections.
 * , and  have been appointed to the Electoral Commission for the 2023 Arbitration Committee Elections.  is the reserve commissioner.
 * Following a motion, the contentious topic designation of Prem Rawat has been struck. Actions previously taken using this contentious topic designation are still in force.
 * Following several motions, multiple topic areas are no longer designated as a contentious topic. These contentious topic designations were from the Editor conduct in e-cigs articles, Liancourt Rocks, Longevity, Medicine, September 11 conspiracy theories, and Shakespeare authorship question cases.
 * Following a motion, remedies 3.1 (All related articles under 1RR whenever the dispute over naming is concerned), 6 (Stalemate resolution) and 30 (Administrative supervision) of the Macedonia 2 case have been rescinded.
 * Following a motion, remedy 6 (One-revert rule) of the The Troubles case has been amended.
 * An arbitration case named Industrial agriculture has been opened. Evidence submissions in this case close 8 November.

Miscellaneous
 * The Articles for Creation backlog drive is happening in November 2023, with 700+ drafts pending reviews for in the last 4 months or so. In addition to the AfC participants, all administrators and New Page Patrollers can conduct reviews using the helper script, Yet Another AFC Helper Script, which can be enabled in the Gadgets settings. Sign up here to participate!

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Archive Sent by MediaWiki message delivery (talk) 17:23, 7 November 2023 (UTC)

TFL notification for December 2023
Hi, PresN. I'm just posting to let you know that World Video Game Hall of Fame – a list that you have been heavily involved with – has been chosen to appear on the Main Page as Today's featured list for December 4. The TFL blurb can be seen here. If you have any thoughts on the selection, please post them on my talk page or at TFL talk. Regards, Giants2008  ( Talk ) 22:29, 10 November 2023 (UTC)

TFA again
Thank you today for Tunic (video game), introduced: "It is apparent to any video game player with experience or context that we have entered an era where an "indie video game" can match or exceed the depth and design quality of titles constructed by hundreds of developers. No longer small little art projects or games that aren't judged against those made by "real companies", we're seeing games like 2022's Tunic: a game made primarily by one person, where the design was done after 6 months but he then spent 6 more years refining and revising. And the result? The article will tell you that it won 2 BAFTAs and was in the top 30-scored games of the year for most platforms, and top-10 for the Switch, but I'll tell you that it was one of my top-5 gaming experiences ever. Andrew Shouldice wanted players to not just feel the sense that the world around the character was bigger than them, but to be hit with the revelation that it was bigger than they realized an hour ago, over and over, and that there was always just a little bit more that they didn't have the context for yet, and he succeeded. The result is a game that looks like "what if Zelda but with a fox" at first glance but then finds you hours later scrawling notes about puzzles in between hitting monsters with a sword while trying to figure out the backstory through nothing but context clues and a dogged refusal to check Reddit for the answers. So, I played the game, and then I turned around and wrote the article (pretty much scrapping whatever was there in the process) ..."! -- Gerda Arendt (talk) 10:00, 12 November 2023 (UTC)

Space Invaders
Do you have a quick opinion on this? I'm looking for a video game rerun at TFA in January, and this one is jumping out at me. If not this one ... do you have a suggestion? I'm looking for a Vital Article. (Yes, I'll be running Doom (1993 video game) as well, unless you'd rather put that off.) - Dank (push to talk) 21:48, 25 November 2023 (UTC)
 * Quick opinion is that it's probably fine for a re-run; there's some formatting oddities, but it looks like every so often someone has gone through and cleaned up poorly-sourced bits and its much more solid than I'd have expected from it being a 2008 nomination. And yes, January is fine for Doom, it's still close to its 30-year anniversary on December 10. -- Pres N  22:02, 25 November 2023 (UTC)
 * I ran the "highlight unreferenced passages" tool and some others, and I got the same impression. Any objection to moving Doom to December 10? Wehwalt is fine with that. - Dank (push to talk) 00:07, 26 November 2023 (UTC)
 * No objection at all! -- Pres N  00:26, 26 November 2023 (UTC)
 * Okay, I'll be finished with the blurb in a minute, feel free to edit. - Dank (push to talk) 00:28, 26 November 2023 (UTC)

While I'm here, a spot opened up in January; any objections to running Homeworld on the 28th 19th? We talked about it before but it never actually ran. - Dank (push to talk) 18:50, 29 November 2023 (UTC)
 * No objection! -- Pres N  19:31, 29 November 2023 (UTC)

ArbCom 2023 Elections voter message
 Hello! Voting in the 2023 Arbitration Committee elections is now open until 23:59 (UTC) on. All eligible users are allowed to vote. Users with alternate accounts may only vote once.

The Arbitration Committee is the panel of editors responsible for conducting the Wikipedia arbitration process. It has the authority to impose binding solutions to disputes between editors, primarily for serious conduct disputes the community has been unable to resolve. This includes the authority to impose site bans, topic bans, editing restrictions, and other measures needed to maintain our editing environment. The arbitration policy describes the Committee's roles and responsibilities in greater detail.

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Administrators' newsletter – December 2023
News and updates for administrators from the past month (November 2023).

Administrator changes
 * Gnome-colors-list-add.svg Ganesha811 · JPxG
 * Gnome-colors-list-remove.svg Ajpolino · Lourdes · Mairi · RockMFR · Somno · WilyD
 * Pictogram voting rename.png →



CheckUser changes
 * Gnome-colors-list-remove.svg Beeblebrox · Opabinia regalis

Oversight changes
 * Gnome-colors-list-remove.svg Beeblebrox · Opabinia regalis

Guideline and policy news
 * Following a talk page discussion, the Administrators' accountability policy has been updated to note that while it is considered best practice for administrators to have notifications (pings) enabled, this is not mandatory. Administrators who do not use notifications are now strongly encouraged to indicate this on their user page.

Arbitration
 * Following a motion, the Extended Confirmed Restriction has been amended, removing the allowance for non-extended-confirmed editors to post constructive comments on the "Talk:" namespace. Now, non-extended-confirmed editors may use the "Talk:" namespace solely to make edit requests related to articles within the topic area, provided that their actions are not disruptive.
 * The Arbitration Committee has announced a call for Checkusers and Oversighters, stating that it will currently be accepting applications for CheckUser and/or Oversight permissions at any point in the year.
 * Eligible users are invited to vote on candidates for the Arbitration Committee until 23:59 December 11, 2023 (UTC). Candidate statements can be seen here.

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Archive Sent by MediaWiki message delivery (talk) 15:54, 8 December 2023 (UTC)

The reason for the redlinked criterion
Hi, the list master. :-P I have a question about the featured list criteria.

WIAFL says:
 * 5. Style...
 * (a) Visual appeal... a minimal proportion of items are redlinked.

Is the presence of red links purely an aesthetic matter? Would the list comply with the latter part of 5a if I replaced all red links with black text, even though these items have potential to be developed into articles? Are there any implicit factors (e.g. the functionality of navigation) to consider?

Thanks.-- Lopullinen 09:19, 9 December 2023 (UTC)
 * That one's just aesthetic, and isn't strongly enforced. The recent Vietnamese politics lists, for example, have been mostly redlinks and no one has raised an issue. -- Pres N  15:08, 9 December 2023 (UTC)
 * Thanks. Sorry, I had a Wikibreak and answer using an alternative account for some reason. --For Each element In group Next (talk) 11:23, 18 February 2024 (UTC)

TFA again and again
Thank you today for Doom (1993 video game), introduced: "Doom is many things: the father of first-person shooter video games, one of the most influential games in any genre, the game that made id Software a household name and its developers millionaire stars, and possibly what single-handedly changed the cultural perception at large of a "video game" from bleeps and bloops in an arcade into shooter games. It's nearly 30 years old now, and yet I bet there are people scrolling through FAC today who don't play video games but saw the title and still immediately recognized the name. It's a big deal in video games, is what I'm saying, so like a fool I'm bringing it here for review."! - Interesting article history ;) -- Gerda Arendt (talk) 08:35, 10 December 2023 (UTC)

My story today is about Michael Robinson, - it's an honour to have known him. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 15:14, 13 December 2023 (UTC)

Today, I have a special story to tell, of the works of a musician born 300 years ago. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 09:53, 22 December 2023 (UTC)

Technical question on the first column of a list
I'm pretty sure this is just a technical question of presentation (and thus right up your alley), but you be the judge. I'm doing a list of tree genera that uses two rows for pine, because pine has more species so I want to divide it into its two subgenera. I usually use a zoom of 133%, and for that reason and just general accessibility concerns, I'm against adding columns that strike me as completely unnecessary just because "people usually do it that way". When I've already got a column of "fir, Callitropsis, juniper, larch, spruce, Pinus subgenus Pinus and Pinus subgenus Strobus", creating an additional column of "fir, Callitropsis, juniper, larch, spruce and Pinus" (just to meet the technical requirement of "one row per item", where the items are genera) seems redundant. Does that work for you? - Dank (push to talk) 18:01, 10 December 2023 (UTC)
 * You're talking about User:Dank/Sandbox/11? Yeah, I don't think there's a problem with splitting Pinus into two rows like that instead of having a separate "subgenus" column. It's still clear to the reader what you're doing, which is what matters, and I don't think it matters that sometimes the grouping is the full genus but when available is a subgenus, especially when the distinction between genus and subgenus is pretty arbitrary anyway. -- Pres N  19:53, 10 December 2023 (UTC)
 * Yes Sandbox/11, and that was my thinking. Thx. - Dank (push to talk) 20:06, 10 December 2023 (UTC)

Your ping
Well this is cool. I don't usually see wikiprojects doing stuff like this :) While it's true that Pokémon Bank was originally a draft... said draft is one I started. I tend to use draftspace when I'm not able to write a decent article in one sitting. I'd say it's a start class article if you want to update the list, but feel free to decide otherwise. Clovermoss 🍀  (talk) 21:31, 18 December 2023 (UTC)
 * Yep, it's a custom script I wrote and run just for WPVG; glad you liked it! It adds a notice for articles moved out of draft space just as a minor notice of "this existed elsewhere first", though maybe adding that the creator was the one to move it would be useful. I get the ratings from the Version_1.0_Editorial_Team/Video_game_articles_by_quality_log, not the actual talk page; not sure why it missed that you tagged it a Start but it's on my list of bugs to eventually fix. -- Pres N  21:41, 18 December 2023 (UTC)

TFL notification for January 2024
Hi, PresN. I'm just posting to let you know that List of ochotonids – a list that you have been heavily involved with – has been chosen to appear on the Main Page as Today's featured list for January 19, 2024. The TFL blurb can be seen here. If you have any thoughts on the selection, please post them on my talk page or at TFL talk. Regards, Giants2008  ( Talk ) 02:38, 23 December 2023 (UTC)

Yo Ho Ho!


Lord Sjones23 (talk - contributions) is wishing you Seasons Greetings! Whether you celebrate your hemisphere's Solstice or Christmas, Diwali, Hogmanay, Hanukkah, Lenaia, Festivus or even the Saturnalia, this is a special time of year for almost everyone!

Spread the holiday cheer by adding to your friends' talk pages.

Lord Sjones23 (talk - contributions) 04:31, 27 December 2023 (UTC)

Re FF Music, plus greetings
Hi. Just letting you know, I've GAN'd the article for the Music of Final Fantasy XVI. Going through the process of FFXVI getting GAN'd so the FF series topic was retained (XVI's up for an addition nom now by the way), I realised the FF Music GT had slipped through the cracks. Just letting you know, as I think you were the prime mover for that GT.

Also, belated Seasons Greetings and a Happy New Year. Here's to a 2024 that's...enjoyable. ProtoDrake (talk) 20:11, 28 December 2023 (UTC)
 * Happy New Year to you too! Thanks for writing/nominating that- I'm largely disconnected from FF music and the series in general now, but it makes me happy to see the topics still complete. I hope you have a good 2024 as well! -- Pres N  22:47, 28 December 2023 (UTC)